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Re: My Pastor Or GOD , Who Should I Listen To ? (Christians ONLY Please ) by EMILO2STAY(m): 12:47pm On Feb 05, 2013 |
Enigma: ^^^ The apocrypha are not of the devil necessarily; it is just that Christians are divided on whether to have them or not. Some other Christian denominations which are not Roman Catholics still have them.i know, it's just that the catholic church made them seem devilish when the church fathers included some delivlish writings to support the use of images, prayer to dead saints,mary worship etc. |
Re: My Pastor Or GOD , Who Should I Listen To ? (Christians ONLY Please ) by italo: 12:56pm On Feb 05, 2013 |
EMILO2STAY: Why should I use a book you think could be partly inspired by satan to defend my stance? EMILO2STAY: did the catholic church author the bible? Yes or no. Yes. EMILO2STAY: Yes ur church added books that were inspired by satan which are now included in the apocrypha. Prove me wrong if u Do you agree with Enigma that the original King James Bible had the Deuterocanonical books which you call "apocrypha?" If you do it would mean that the KJV was done under the inspiration of satan. |
Re: My Pastor Or GOD , Who Should I Listen To ? (Christians ONLY Please ) by italo: 1:28pm On Feb 05, 2013 |
EMILO2STAY: So you are saying The Catholic Bible and the King James Bible were both done under the inspiration of satan, since they both contained the deuterocanonical books. So satan's book is your sole authority on matters of faith and morals?! |
Re: My Pastor Or GOD , Who Should I Listen To ? (Christians ONLY Please ) by truthislight: 1:36pm On Feb 05, 2013 |
italo: The NT scriptures are writings of the apostles of christ for a guide to christians. The apocriphals, who wrote them? Christ apostles? No. So, who wrote them? Why should christians use them? That kingjames or James king or who ever added them to his collections has nothing to do with the words of christ apostles whom we know that he christ had said that the almighty hand picked those apostles for him. Were the apocriphals written by Who? Please, name the writters of the apocriphals, or, can i also write my own books and add them to the bible? You tell me! 1 Like |
Re: My Pastor Or GOD , Who Should I Listen To ? (Christians ONLY Please ) by EMILO2STAY(m): 1:41pm On Feb 05, 2013 |
italo:read my reply to enigma. |
Re: My Pastor Or GOD , Who Should I Listen To ? (Christians ONLY Please ) by EMILO2STAY(m): 1:48pm On Feb 05, 2013 |
italo:no they are not the same,u cant find a verse to support the use of images, purgatory,mary worship in the james bible. |
Re: My Pastor Or GOD , Who Should I Listen To ? (Christians ONLY Please ) by EMILO2STAY(m): 1:49pm On Feb 05, 2013 |
italo: |
Re: My Pastor Or GOD , Who Should I Listen To ? (Christians ONLY Please ) by italo: 4:36pm On Feb 05, 2013 |
EMILO2STAY: But it was you who Said the Deuterocanonical books are of the devil...and the initial King James Bible had the deuterocanonical books...meaning the KJV was done under the inspiration of the devil. |
Re: My Pastor Or GOD , Who Should I Listen To ? (Christians ONLY Please ) by EMILO2STAY(m): 9:46pm On Feb 05, 2013 |
italo: the kjv bible did not contain the doctrine of mary worship, praying to dead saints etc. So the kjv bible was different from the catholic bible. |
Re: My Pastor Or GOD , Who Should I Listen To ? (Christians ONLY Please ) by italo: 8:39am On Feb 06, 2013 |
EMILO2STAY: My clueless friend, why are you deliberately beating around the bush. I thought you were eager to address issues head-on. I guess you didn't think I would take your shameless lies and use them to convict you of stupidity. Let me repeat myself for about the third time, perhaps this time, you will come out in the light and adress the issue I'm raising. The KJV, like the Catholic Bible contained the Deuterocanonical books which you said were from the devil himself. That means that both Bibles are handiworks of satan. How can the word of God be in satan's book? |
Re: My Pastor Or GOD , Who Should I Listen To ? (Christians ONLY Please ) by EMILO2STAY(m): 9:53am On Feb 06, 2013 |
italo:haha...look who's talking, the one who cant defend his catholic doctrine using the bible and u keep showing up here shamelessly. Let me also repeat myself, i said the catholic church added lies to the bible which are contained in the apocrypha. The king james translators also rejected the apocrypha as divine. Stop jumping up and down like a happy frog b/c of what enigma said. |
Re: My Pastor Or GOD , Who Should I Listen To ? (Christians ONLY Please ) by italo: 11:19am On Feb 06, 2013 |
EMILO2STAY: Which "Bible" do you want me to use to defend Catholic doctrine? The same Bible you say is satan's book..? EMILO2STAY: Let me also repeat myself, i said the catholic church added lies to the bible which are contained in the apocrypha. Tell us the lies that were added (book, chapter and verse). Tell us when they were added. Tell us if those lies were inside the deuterocanonical books that the King James Bible originally had. EMILO2STAY: The king james translators also rejected the apocrypha as divine. YOU reject it - saying it is from satan. Why then did the King James people have satan's books in their Bible at all? |
Re: My Pastor Or GOD , Who Should I Listen To ? (Christians ONLY Please ) by EMILO2STAY(m): 6:07pm On Feb 06, 2013 |
italo: The King James translators placed it between the Old and New Testaments for its historical benefit to its readers. They did not integrate it into the Old Testament text as do the corrupt Alexandrian catholic bible. The fact is neither Jesus nor any of the Apostles ever quote the Apocrypha as divine authority. What was considered "scripture" clearly excluded the Apocrypha from both the Jewish community and the Hebrew Christians of the New Testament. |
Re: My Pastor Or GOD , Who Should I Listen To ? (Christians ONLY Please ) by italo: 8:56pm On Feb 06, 2013 |
@ Emilo2stay, These verses in 2Maccabees that you say are lies from satan were also put into the KJV. Why would the people who produced the KJV put satan's word in between God's word. What does it matter, whether they put it between, on top, under, inside etc, the fact is they put it in the Bible. Why put satan's word in the Bible? My early Church fathers say the Bible, as they gave it to us is God's word. It is YOU who say satan's word was put in between God's word. So it is you who has to tell us when satan put his word into God's word. |
Re: My Pastor Or GOD , Who Should I Listen To ? (Christians ONLY Please ) by truthislight: 9:08pm On Feb 06, 2013 |
italo: @ Emilo2stay, Many writters quote the bible or torah. Even satan quote the bible. That the apocriphal quote the bible and Jesus happen to quote a similar statement does not mean that that Jesus quoted the apocriphal. That Jesus talked about Adam and Abraham and the quran talked about Adam and Abraham in same fashion, does that mean that Jesus was quoting from the quoran? Smh. |
Re: My Pastor Or GOD , Who Should I Listen To ? (Christians ONLY Please ) by italo: 9:13pm On Feb 06, 2013 |
EMILO2STAY: Jesus and the Gospel writers referenced the Deuterocanonicals in the following instances: Matthew 6:12, 14-15---"Forgive us our debts, as we forgive our debtors; if you forgive others their transgressions, your heavenly Father will forgive you. But if you do not forgive others, neither will your heavenly father forgive your transgressions." Sirach 28:2---"Forgive your neighbor's injustice; then when you pray, your own sins will be forgiven." Luke 1:17 (describing John the Baptist)---"He will go before him in the spirit and power of Elijah to turn the hearts of fathers towards children and the disobediant to the understanding of the righteous, to prepare a people fit for the Lord." Sirach 48:10---"You are destined, it is written, in time to come, to put an end to wrath before the day of the Lord, to turn back the hearts of fathers towards their sons, and to re-establish the tribes of Jacob." Luke 1:28, 1:42---"And coming to her, he said, 'Hail, favored one! The Lord is with you!'.....Most blessed are you among women, and blessed is the fruit of your womb." Judith 13:18---"Then Uzziah said to her: 'Blessed are you, daughter, by the Most High God, above all the women of the earth; and blessed be the Lord God, the Creator of heaven and earth. Luke 1:52---"He has thrown down the rulers from their thrones, but lifted up the lowly." Sirach 10:14---"The thrones of the arrogant God overturns, and establishes the lowly in their stead." Luke 12:19-20---"I shall say to myself, 'Now as for you, you have so many good things stored up for many years, rest, eat, drink, be merry!' But God said to him, 'You fool, this night your life will be demanded of you; and the things you have prepared, to whom will they belong?'" Sirach 11:19---"When he says: 'I have found rest, now I will feast on my possessions,' he does not know how long it will be till he dies and leaves them to others." Luke 18:22---"When Jesus heard this, he said to him, 'There is still one thing left for you: sell all that you have and distribute it to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven.'" Sirach 29:11---"Dispose of your treasure as the Most High commands, for that will profit you more than the gold." John 3:12---"If I tell you about earthly things and you do not believe, how will you believe if I tell you about heavenly things?" Wisdom 9:16---"Scarce do we guess the things on earth, and what is within our grasp we find with difficulty; but when things are in heaven, who can search them out?" John 5:18---"For this reason the Jews tried all the more to kill him, because he not only broke the Sabbath, but he also called God his own Father, making himself equal to God." Wisdom 2:16---"He judges us debased; he holds aloof from our paths as from things impure. He calls blest the destiny of the just and boasts that God is his Father." John 10:29---"My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all, and no one can take them out of the Father's hand." Wisdom 3:1---"But the souls of the just are in the hand of God, and no torment shall touch them." Paul and James allude to them as well: Romans 2:11---"There is no partiality with God." Sirach 35:12---"For he is a God of justice, who knows no favorites." Romans 9:21---"Or does not the potter have a right over the clay, to make out of the same lump one vessel for a noble purpose andanother fo an ignoble one?" Wisdom 15:7---"For truly the potter, laboriously working the soft earth, molds for our service each several article: both the vessels that serve for clean purposes, and their opposites, all alike; as to what shall be the use of each vessel of eiother class, the worker in clay is the judge." Romans 11:24---"For who has known the mind of the Lord, or who has been his counsellor?" Wisdom 9:13---"For what man knows God's counsel, or who can conceive what the Lord intends?" 1 Thessalonians 2:16---"(The enemies of Christ persecute us), trying to prevent us from speaking to the Gentiles that they may be saved, thus constantly filling up the measure of their sins. But the wrath of God has finally begun to come upon them." 2 Maccabees 6:14---"Thus, in dealing with other nations, the Lord patiently waits until they reach the full measure of their sins before he punishes them; but with us he has decided to deal differently" James 1:13---"No one experiencing temptation should say, 'I am being tempted by God'; for God is not subject to temptation to evil, and he himself tempts no one." Sirach 15:11-12---"Say not: 'It was God's doing that I fell away'; for what he hates he does not do. Say not: 'It was he who set me astray'; for he has no need of wicked man." James 5:2-3---"Your wealth has rotted away, your clothes have become moth-eaten, your gold and silver hav corroded, and that corrosion will be a testimony against you; it will devour your flesh like a fire." Judith 16:17---'The Lord Almighty will requite them; in the day of judgement he will punish them: he will send fire and worms into their flesh, and they shall burn and suffer forever." Now, of course, you may say that these don't sound like exact quotes, and you'd be right; but there are thousands of allusions in the New Testament from the Old, both Deuterocanon and not, which are not exact quotes. Romans 11:34, for example, also has an allusion to Job 15:8, but ironically the allusion to Wisdom 9:13 is closer in actual wording to it than Job is. And, of course, if you want to get into loose allusions, we could expand the above list to ten times the size it is. Then there are also the cases of outright error in some New Testament quotes, such as Matthew 27:9, in which Matthew quotes "the prophet Jeremiah", when the allusion is actually found nowhere in Jeremiah but rather in Zecheriah 11:12-13. There is also the case of some Old Testament books not being quoted by Jesus in the New Testament: He didn't quote from Ezra, Nehemiah, Esther, Ecclesiastes, or the Song of Solomon. And yet they are still considered to be canonical Scripture even though He did not reference them. |
Re: My Pastor Or GOD , Who Should I Listen To ? (Christians ONLY Please ) by EMILO2STAY(m): 10:05pm On Feb 06, 2013 |
^^^stop beating around the bush i have answerd all ur quetions but u havent answered mine. What are considered "scripture" clearly excluded the Apocrypha from both the Jewish community and the Hebrew Christians of the New Testament. |
Re: My Pastor Or GOD , Who Should I Listen To ? (Christians ONLY Please ) by EMILO2STAY(m): 10:11pm On Feb 06, 2013 |
truthislight: seconded |
Re: My Pastor Or GOD , Who Should I Listen To ? (Christians ONLY Please ) by italo: 3:39am On Feb 07, 2013 |
EMILO2STAY: ^^^stop beating around the bush i have answerd all ur quetions but u havent answered mine. You haven't answered several of my questions which will define what the Bible is before I can think of using the Bible to answer you questions. For now, you consider it as inspired by satan, I consider it as inspired by God. We are still miles apart. When did satan include his word into God's word as you say? Why did the producers of the KJV put satan's word in their "bible?" Why do you consider Ezra, Nehemiah, Ecclesiastes, Esther and Song of Solomon as scripture when you think we should only consider books that Jesus quoted from as scripture? EMILO2STAY: What are considered "scripture" What is your proof? |
Re: My Pastor Or GOD , Who Should I Listen To ? (Christians ONLY Please ) by EMILO2STAY(m): 8:04am On Feb 07, 2013 |
. |
Re: My Pastor Or GOD , Who Should I Listen To ? (Christians ONLY Please ) by EMILO2STAY(m): 8:04am On Feb 07, 2013 |
^^^ rubbish keep beating around the bush i have proved to you that the doctrine of your church is not the same with the bible. |
Re: My Pastor Or GOD , Who Should I Listen To ? (Christians ONLY Please ) by italo: 3:54pm On Feb 07, 2013 |
EMILO2STAY: ^^^ rubbish keep beating around the bush i have proved to you that the doctrine of your church is not the same with the bible. You say the Catholic Church is of the devil... You say the Bible is of the devil... ...And you are trying hard to prove that Catholic doctrine is different from Bible doctrine... My dear, the only proof I need is proof that you are mentally sane because judging from what you have been typing, you are demented. |
Re: My Pastor Or GOD , Who Should I Listen To ? (Christians ONLY Please ) by PastorKun(m): 4:06pm On Feb 07, 2013 |
italo: aren't both of you guys tired of this argument @italo all you have to do is to show him scriptures to justify Mary worship, Veneration of saints and use of images, I am sure he would keep shut after that. |
Re: My Pastor Or GOD , Who Should I Listen To ? (Christians ONLY Please ) by italo: 4:59pm On Feb 07, 2013 |
Pastor Kun: I remember asking YOU a question twice...and you ran away without attempting an answer. I was wondering if you were dead but thank God you are still alive. Now do you mind answering? Was the Bible (which you have admitted was compiled by the Catholic Church in the 4th century) compiled under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit or satan? Your answer will go a long way in curing his lunacy, thank you. Let's hope you don't play 'deceased' again. |
Re: My Pastor Or GOD , Who Should I Listen To ? (Christians ONLY Please ) by EMILO2STAY(m): 5:40pm On Feb 07, 2013 |
italo: shameless!!...U've resorted to insults because u could'nt answer any of my questions keep the insults coming, thought u said it was for the kindergarten. |
Re: My Pastor Or GOD , Who Should I Listen To ? (Christians ONLY Please ) by PastorKun(m): 6:19pm On Feb 07, 2013 |
italo: I don't have a precise answer to your question as it doesn't make sense in the first instance. I know all scripture is inspired but I am not ready to go into a theological debate as per the compilation of the bible. All I would say is that the holy spirit is our final authority as christians and not the bible that men twist the way they like. Unfortunately most professing christians don't have the holy spirit in their lives. |
Re: My Pastor Or GOD , Who Should I Listen To ? (Christians ONLY Please ) by princesa(f): 6:43pm On Feb 07, 2013 |
Phew! almost exhausted the little megabytes i have reading tru all this. the only thing that anyone can do to change a catholic is to pray for the Holyspirit to personally, very personally teach them the truth, when they actually get the time to read the bible, 'not the missal' for themselves. he taught me and changed me from the bonds of catholicism...... so that's all they need, because the spirit of religion that hold them bound is not something to be talked out of. @topic, i respect my pastor, but he's not my God, i read my bible, therefore i know the word of God for myself. 8-) |
Re: My Pastor Or GOD , Who Should I Listen To ? (Christians ONLY Please ) by italo: 12:17am On Feb 08, 2013 |
Pastor Kun: This is one of the reasons why people have ZERO respect for "pastors." You call yourself "Pastor Kun" but have the "integrity" of a fraudster. Any normal Christian should be proud to say that the Bible was compiled under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit but simply because you don't want to credit the Catholic Church, you are shamelessly evading the point. Just look at this flimsy response of yours... What is so ambiguous about the question that you cannot give a precise answer to? Was the Bible compiled under the Holy Spirit? It is either YES or NO. There is no need for long dubious stories. |
Re: My Pastor Or GOD , Who Should I Listen To ? (Christians ONLY Please ) by christemmbassey(m): 9:12am On Feb 08, 2013 |
italo:we have not settled the issue of who compiled d bible, because in this thread some guy emphatically disputed d RCC claim, with all due respect, the activities of the RCC has really made believers to question most of their claims. How can the rcc be involved in the writting/compilation of the bible with such a high degree display of canality and idolatory? Bro it doesnt add-up. The canal mind/man can not understand the things of the Spirit. These ppl worship images of wond and stone, by their fruits you shall know them, rcc as it is today is a big disgrace to christianity, no offence intended plz. 2 Likes |
Re: My Pastor Or GOD , Who Should I Listen To ? (Christians ONLY Please ) by italo: 11:21am On Feb 09, 2013 |
christemmbassey: we have not settled the issue of who compiled d bible, The so-called "Pastor Kun" and every truthful person who knows Christian history, including Martin luther who was against the Catholic Church, accept that the Catholic Church compiled the Bible. That's why I'm taking Pastor Kun up on it. You can believe that it is the Nigerian government that compiled the Bible or that the Bible just fell from the sky one Sunday morning. That is your unfortunate business. christemmbassey: because in this thread some guy emphatically disputed d RCC claim, with all due respect, What ACTIVITIES has led "believers" to question what CLAIMS? And when you say "believers", BELIEVERS in what? christemmbassey: How can the rcc be involved in the writting/compilation of the bible with such a high degree display of canality and idolatory? Bro it doesnt add-up. The canal mind/man can not understand the things of the Spirit. These ppl worship images of wond and stone, by their fruits you shall know them, rcc as it is today is a big disgrace to christianity, no offence intended plz. When you say "worship"? What do you mean? Because I am a Catholic and along with 1billion other Catholics, we know nothing of the crime you accuse us of. Catholicism is Christianity so if Catholicism is a disgrace, Christianity is. Maybe you should tell us the "HOLY" people that compiled the Bible and when they did it, if the Catholics didn't do it. Pls answer my questions. 1 Like |
Re: My Pastor Or GOD , Who Should I Listen To ? (Christians ONLY Please ) by perilioustime: 11:42am On Feb 09, 2013 |
frosbel: How do you know that your Pastor is preaching and teaching the Truth ? we are now in the end time, do not follow your pastor teaching, but follow the true word of God. only your bible will lead you to salvation. mattw24, at the end time, false teaching will entrone the church. 1tmty 4:1 1-2 Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the alatter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to cseducing spirits, and ddoctrines of devils; Speaking alies in bhypocrisy; having their cconscience seared with a hot iron; who are the people the bible is refering to? THE PASTORS |
Re: My Pastor Or GOD , Who Should I Listen To ? (Christians ONLY Please ) by Nobody: 2:28pm On Feb 09, 2013 |
perilioustime: I concur ! |
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