FACTS

lessreligous countries are richer than religous countries

religous countries e.g african countries are very very poor


QUESTION

DOES RELIGON PLAY A ROLE IN THE POVERTY LEVEL OF A COUNTRY?

Yes, Dissociative anesthesia

yes

tobechi20: FACTS

lessreligous countries are richer than religous countries

religous countries e.g african countries are very very poor


QUESTION

DOES RELIGON PLAY A ROLE IN THE POVERTY LEVEL OF A COUNTRY?

Good morning Tobe,

The above is a typical example of the fallacy of False Cause for those who answered in the affirmative.

I will be back to explain, got to get somewhere now.

#Howdy ooman!

Yes, from statistical data, poverty(P) is directly proportional to religion(R)
P α R
inversely proportional to prosperity(p)
P α 1/p
Combining the two and introducing a constant(K) which could be any other factor, we get
P = KR/p
As we can see the more religious a nation/group of people get, the less the prosperity and the poorer the people
Although, the equation does not hold true in a every case. also religion isn't the only factor, other factors are neglected in this case.

Heatblast: Yes, from statistical data, poverty(P) is directly proportional to religion(R)
P α R
inversely to proportional to prosperity(p)
P α 1/p
Combining the two and introducing a constant(K) which could be any other factor, we get
P = KR/p
As we can see the more religious a nation/group of people get, the less the prosperity and the poorer the people
Although, the equation does not hold true in a every case. also religion isn't the only factor, other factors are neglected in this case.

I like that

Heatblast: Yes, from statistical data, poverty(P) is directly proportional to religion(R)
P α R
inversely proportional to prosperity(p)
P α 1/p
Combining the two and introducing a constant(K) which could be any other factor, we get
P = KR/p
As we can see the more religious a nation/group of people get, the less the prosperity and the poorer the people
Although, the equation does not hold true in a every case. also religion isn't the only factor, other factors are neglected in this case.

Good afternoon Heatblast,

Sorry to say but the argument above has no merit whatsoever. Though I commend you for attempting to draw a relationship between religion and poverty using mathematics but the bases of your argument is fundamentally flawed.

For starters, when two variables say "x" and "y" are directly proportional to each other, we are saying in lay man's term that there exist a positive and direct relationship between the two variables such that for each x_i, _i=1,2,3... there must exist a corresponding k_iy_i, _i=1,2,3... and the equation x_i = k_iy_i holds true for i=1,2,3,...where k_i is the constant of proportionality.

Note that the equation x_i = k_iy_i must always hold for there to be that direct relationship i.e x_i and y_i must always be directly proportional to each other such that the constant of proportionality k_i is always equal to x_i/y_i for each i = 1,2,3...

Now, in your argument you made us understand that the relationship x_i = k_iy_i is only true for some 'i' and not for every 'i'. Simply put, from your analysis the equation only holds true for some cases which makes it flawed and not in line with the principles of proportionality. Even if you define an interval for which the equation might seem to hold true it is still flawed for two reasons:

1) The reason I gave above.

2) If we assume that your two variables are say x = Religion and y = Morality and we perform the same analysis, it would imply that Religion is directly proportional to morality. This we know to be flawed cause it doesn't hold true for every case. Similarly, the relationship you drew is very incorrect because of it's subjectivity.

Thank you!

OkaaaaAayyyyyYYYyeee :-O

tobechi20: FACTS

lessreligous countries are richer than religous countries

religous countries e.g african countries are very very poor


QUESTION

DOES RELIGON PLAY A ROLE IN THE POVERTY LEVEL OF A COUNTRY?

Good evening Tobe,

Like I mentioned before, the above is a classic example of the fallacy of false cause. This simply means incorrectly attributing a cause and effect relationship where there is none i.e assuming one thing caused another when that relationship does not exist. Let me illustrate with the following examples:

It is known that babies usually cry when they are delivered...

I heard a baby cry...

Hence a delivery has taken place.

The above conclusion does not follow in the least. The fact that a baby cried does not imply child birth. There are other reasons why a child would cry in the first place. So to attribute the cry of the child to child bearing implies this fallacy.

Another example that has a direct impact on the topic is:

A good majority of peoples in third world countries are poor...

A good majority of these peoples are into religion...

Therefore third world countries are poor because a majority of the peoples are into religion.

The above is fallacious for the simple reason that there is no direct cause and effect relationship between religion and poverty. There are some developed countries where a vast majority are into religion too which implies that there are other factors that can make a country either poor or rich apart from religion. As long as these other factors exists, the topic will continue to be fallacious.

Thank you!

^^

Stryktli-brah!!!

Do learned helplessness, culture and morals play a role in determining a society's success?



I'll get back to the other thread btw, when off mobile, tonight I suppose.

wiegraf: ^^

Stryktli-brah!!!

Do learned helplessness, culture and morals play a role in determining a society's success?



I'll get back to the other thread btw, when off mobile, tonight I suppose.

this damn bb keeps crashing on me.. was abt to ask the same question...


let's flip it

What role does religion play if any in the development of a nation?

Can religious beliefs hold a nation back or slow development?

musKeeto:
this damn bb keeps crashing on me.. was abt to ask the same question...


let's flip it

What role does religion play if any in the development of a nation?

Can religious beliefs hold a nation back or slow development?

Remember a nation is a body of people. A religious body is limited to ideas,therefore is sick,lazy and feels inferior.

Imagine a nation that teaches hell fire and the fear of a sky god will always live in fear which will lead to devolution, mental stagnancy,under-achievments, resources mis management ,intolerance of another mans sexuality,degrading of women etc . However and good deed will be out of fear and command of some sky good.

Religion makes a good man do bad things-

@ striktlymi

Although, the equation does not hold true in a every case. also religion isn't the only factor, other factors are neglected in this case.

I guess you didn't see this. maybe I should have put it like this

Although, the equation does not hold true in a every case because religion isn't the only factor, other factors are neglected in this case.[/b]

Good evening wiegraf,

wiegraf: ^^

Stryktli-brah!!!

Do learned helplessness, culture and morals play a role in determining a society's success?

Your Oxymoron is thought provoking...knowledge is indeed power as they say! A good argument for the need to be learned is breaking off the shackles of helplessness. So if one is learned and at the same time unable to help himself then that individual is in a sorry state and Wole Soyinka would be vindicated when he said: 'The man died!!!".

One can't answer the question you asked with a simple 'yes' or 'no'. The variables you have there are highly subjective and each can fall prey to individual opinion. The questions that would come up would be:

a) How can one who is learned and helpless at the same time be productive in the society? What kind of helplessness?...does this helplessness has anything to do with the individual's mentality?...so many questions I tell you.

b) Is there a link between culture and a society's development?...if there is, can this be measured objectively? Do developed countries share a similar culture? can culture be divided into that of the black man and that of the white? Is the culture of say, a Japanese man the same as that of an English man or at best are they similar?

c) You and I know too well how subjective morality is and the challenges it poses so I won't dwell on this.

wiegraf:
I'll get back to the other thread btw, when off mobile, tonight I suppose.

No P bro!


Thanks!

ifeness:

Remember a nation is a body of people. A religious body is limited to ideas,therefore is sick,lazy and feels inferior.

Imagine a nation that teaches hell fire and the fear of a sky god will always live in fear which will lead to devolution, mental stagnancy,under-achievments, resources mis management ,intolerance of another mans sexuality,degrading of women etc . However and good deed will be out of fear and command of some sky good.

Religion makes a good man do bad things-

This is no argument...just sentiments!

Heatblast: @ striktlymi


I guess you didn't see this. maybe I should have put it like this

Good evening Heatblast,

The modification:

Heatblast: Although, the equation does not hold true in a every case because religion isn't the only factor, other factors are neglected in this case.

would be more appropriate in the social sciences, hence the inappropriateness of the analysis.

striktlymi: Good evening wiegraf,



Your Oxymoron is thought provoking...knowledge is indeed power as they say! A good argument for the need to be learned is breaking off the shackles of helplessness. So if one is learned and at the same time unable to help himself then that individual is in a sorry state and Wole Soyinka would be vindicated when he said: 'The man died!!!".

One can't answer the question you asked with a simple 'yes' or 'no'. The variables you have there are highly subjective and each can fall prey to individual opinion. The questions that would come up would be:

a) How can one who is learned and helpless at the same time be productive in the society? What kind of helplessness?...does this helplessness has anything to do with the individual's mentality?...so many questions I tell you.

b) Is there a link between culture and a society's development?...if there is, can this be measured objectively? Do developed countries share a similar culture? can culture be divided into that of the black man and that of the white? Is the culture of say, a Japanese man the same as that of an English man or at best are they similar?

c) You and I know too well how subjective morality is and the challenges it poses so I won't dwell on this.



No P bro!


Thanks!

You maybe mistake the term 'learned helplessness". I'll get back to this later brah. In the meantime, I choose 'wiki'

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Learned_helplessness

wiki:
Learned helplessness is the condition of a human or animal that has learned to behave helplessly, failing to respond even though there are opportunities for it to help itself by avoiding unpleasant circumstances or by gaining positive rewards. Learned helplessness theory is the view that clinical depression and related mental illnesses may result from a perceived absence of control over the outcome of a situation.[1] Organisms which have been ineffective and less sensitive in determining the consequences of their behavior are defined as having acquired learned helplessness.

striktlymi:

Good evening Heatblast,

The modification:

would be more appropriate in the social sciences, hence the inappropriateness of the analysis.

Says who You?

Heatblast:

Says who You?

Mathematics says that your analysis is inappropriate!

wiegraf:

You maybe mistake the term 'learned helplessness". I'll get back to this later brah. In the meantime, I choose 'wiki'

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Learned_helplessness

Good morning wiegraf,

Oh now I get your meaning!

Well I understand that the phrase: "Learned helplessness" is typically attributable to 'animals' rather than humans though this term can be linked to some human behaviour. I quite agree that some animals can be conditioned to believe that they cannot control the outcome of some situations, even when it is so obvious that they can determine the outcome.

As far as humans are concerned, we know that there are situations where the outcome cannot be determined by us. We can only do our best to change the outcome but in the final analysis, we still do not have control over what happens. For example, a medical doctor who did everything humanly possible to save the life of an accident victim...he performs the procedures as he is expected to but the final outcome (life or death) is not left to him to determine. In this scenario, the doctor if having done what he can would be right to have that feeling of helplessness because he is actually helpless.

On the other hand, if the doctor considers a patients chance of survival as slim and decides to shirk his duties because he believes the situation is helpless then the 'good doc' can be said to be suffering from 'learned helplessness' cause he refused to do what he is supposed to do at the time. Given up without trying is typical of this condition.

Now, in a society we have some persons who really are affected by this...I remember vividly the feeling of helplessness some people had when they were told that the world was coming to an end some years back. The reaction of some people was very surprising indeed...selling their properties and all worth not in preparation for the end? Very silly but the point is, such individuals can hardly accomplish anything if they adopt this mindset in all they do.

Humans can be conditioned to believe that they are helpless in certain situations...this has to do with individual psyche and should be looked at on a case by case basis. Some primitive societies have exhibited this trait but it would be difficult if not impossible to attribute this to every member of a modern society.

But if by chance a society collectively exhibit this trait and apply it in areas of economic growth and development then of-course such behaviour will definitely impact on growth, development and the success of the society adversely.


Thank you and sorry for the long post.

tobechi20: FACTS

lessreligous countries are richer than religous countries

religous countries e.g african countries are very very poor


QUESTION

DOES RELIGON PLAY A ROLE IN THE POVERTY LEVEL OF A COUNTRY?

the answer to ur kwestion is no. Though common sense which has never always being common will always tell us no is the answer

Omexonomy: the answer to ur kwestion is no. Though common sense which has never always being common will always tell us no is the answer

Religious doesn't give room to positive thinking,but instead blind faith in a dubious sky god.

When last has yahweh answered by fire? But millions of poor educated Africans are waiting for an impossible miracle from it/she/he

Anything you get in life depends on your state of mind. No christian is determined to march on the street and protest against the wrong doings of the govt,but instead they waste an entire generation praying to a sky god.