[quote author=Alexandro15 post=48374712]

If an angel can honour her by saying " hail, full of grace!" then who am I not to honour her. Am I holier than Angel Gabriel? Note also that "full of grace" was said as a title not greeting.

The angel never said to Mary "full of grace"
Look at his greetings
Luke 1:28 And the angel came in unto her, and said, Hail, thou that art highly favoured, the Lord is with thee: blessed art thou among women.
@ bold, Mary was favoured by God not because of any special qualities she possesses, Mary was just a dirty sinner like any other other person
Romans 3:23 For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;

Romans 5:12 Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:

You also asked if God told you to honour Mary. I wonder if to honour someone is a sin. Didn't God tell you to honour your parents? What more his.

did God told you to honor Mary? I don't know what you mean by honoring someone.
Yes God told me to honor my parent I know what that means, it means taking care of them and showing them due respect but I will never go against God's command because of them.
If truely you want to honor Mary ,do what she said
John 2:5 His mother saith unto the servants, Whatsoever he( Jesus) saith unto you, do it.

God chose Mary and Mary chose God. God sent her a message and she accepted by saying she was God's handmaid. So she made a choice. God respects our wish

Mary did not chose God rather it is God that chose her. Let me ask you, did you chose your parent ? Same way Mary did not choose to God.

How does the hail Mary prayer equate to worshipping Mary.

prayer is directed only to God and it is part of worship.

That's an absurdity. Asking your pastor to pray for you does it mean you are worshipping him?

I can ask my pastor to pray for me because he is alive and besides I don't pray to my pastor to help me pray to God.

Read the prayer again with a liberal mind:"hail Mary full of grace the lord is with you, blessed are you among women and blessed is the fruit of your womb Jesus

first of all Jesus is no longer in the womb of Mary he is risen and alive for ever.

Holy Mary mother of God pray for us sinners now and at the hour of our death, Amen".

secondly, Mary cannot pray for sinners and thirdly,she is not the mother of God but only biological mother to The man Jesus.
Jesus existed before Abraham.

John 8:58 Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am.

Please point out the wrong thing about this prayer.

I have

Worship is a thing of the mind. If I am Worshipping Mary, I'd know. [b]I honour her as the mother of God [/b]and because God himself honored favoured her.

worship is the putter expression of the mind. @ bold God does not have mother.
@ cancelled, God's favour was on her just as God's favour is on every believer.

[quote author=Alexandro15 post=48380967]

How does your quotation in anyway relate to what I said. I said Mary is the fastest way to Jesus. The quotation said "no one comes to the FATHER."

do you even know what you are saying

Mary intercedes for us to the SON. There is only one mediator between God and man and that is Jesus. But there are many mediators between Jesus and Man.

@ cancelled who made Mary an intercessor
God made Jesus mediator
Hebrews 5:4 And no man taketh this honour unto himself, but he that is called of God, as was Aaron.
Jesus does not need any mediator, he is already perfect

Hebrews 5:9 And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;
Perfect means you don't need to add or remove from him, you don't need Mary Jesus is perfect mediator. Mary cannot do that!

The priests and pastors are one of them.

Christians do not need priest and pastors to intercede for them

You say my relationship with God broken. Far from it. I have a close relationship with the Father, Son and Holy Spirit.

if your relationship is not broken with God why do you need a mediator?

.

However,you have to check on yourself. You are attacking Christ body, the church.

the body of Christ need to flee from idolatry don't you think so.

1 John 5:21 Little children, keep yourselves from idols. Amen.
How does this translate to attack

I don't know why you people are so uncomfortable with us saying that we pray to Mary that she may pray for us to her son Jesus. When infact, you ask your pastors, most of whom are sinners and do not really know God, to pray for you

we are concerned because we don't want you in hell
.1 John 5:16 If any man see his brother sin a sin which is not unto death, he shall ask, and he shall give him life for them that sin not unto death. There is a sin unto death: I do not say that he shall pray for it.

[quote author=solite3 post=48382635][/quote]
The angel did say "full of grace" . He said it as a title not greeting. Translations of bible varies. The writer of your version twisted it to suit his argument. The original version of the bible put it in such a way as it was a title.

Point of correction, Mary is not and never was a sinner talk more of a dirty one. If you look at the old testament when God was telling Moses how to build the ark that he will occupy, after going through it, you will then know that God wants to dwell in a perfect place.

Now, Mary is the new ark of the covenant. She was the first tabernacle of Jesus. How can Jesus dwell in someone who was a sinner. How can something clean come out from that which is unclean? Does that makes sense to you? Mary was full of the grace if Christ that made it impossible for her to sin. Hence the greeting by angel Gabriel.

How can God tell you to honour your mother and not honour his? What kind of God is that? You claim to honour Your parents but you disrespect God's. Whats even honour? My dictionary defines honour as: "To think of highly, to respect highly; to show respect for; to recognise the importance or spiritual value of."
That is what I am doing.


God chose Mary and She chose God too. You asked if I chose my parents, am I God? Jesus! If I had a choice and everything was under my control, Yes! I would choose my parents. I would choose the best out of every person in the world . I would choose the perfect human. Exactly what God did.

God made Mary an offer, and she accepted by humbly saying: "let it be done to me according to your will"


You can ask your pastor to pray for you because he is alive. Just Negodu. I rather pray to Mary and the saints to Pray for me to Jesus than a sinner who is "alive". Prayer is a request, a petition.

Yes, Jesus is no longer in the womb of Jesus, but that does not mean She is not his mother. She can pray for sinners that Jesus should forgive them. When your pastors are praying, don't they pray that Jesus should wipe the sins of the congregation? Hypocrites!

You cannot take away the divinity of Jesus from the manhood of Jesus. You make it sound as if there us two Jesuses :Jesus the man and Jesus the God. Wrong. The divinity and the manhood of Jesus are merged. You cannot separate one from the other. Since they are merged, Mary is both the mother of Jesus the man, and Jesus the Son. Hence the reason she is referred to as the Theotokos.

So you have not proved any wrong. You ended up confusing yourself and ensnaring yourself by your words.

I repeat that worship is a thing of the mind. God honoured her, so who am I?

[quote author=solite3 post=48387466][/quote]

Oh yes! I know what I am saying. You asked who made Mary an intercessor? Who made your pastors intercessors?

Please reason for once. I never said Mary intercedes to God the father, but to God the son. If Christians do not need pastors and priests to intercede to them to Jesus, then why do they allow them pray for them?

I need a mediator to Jesus because some people are more favoured and given more grace than others.

Keep your concern to yourself. You need to rather have concern for yourself and your protestants brothers that they don't invite God's wrath by insulting his mother. Good day

[quote author=Alexandro15 post=48389996]

The angel did say "full of grace" . He said it as a title not greeting. Translations of bible varies. The writer of your version twisted it to suit his argument. The original version of the bible put it in such a way as it was a title.

pls point out one translation that has " full of grace"
What prove do you have that the bible is corrupt?
Muslims, Jehovah witnesses and others make this same claim but cannot prove it!

Point of correction, Mary is not and never was a sinner talk more of a dirty one

hahahaha really. So Paul is wrong

Romans 3:23 For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;
Romans 5:12 Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:

If you look at the old testament when God was telling Moses how to build the ark that he will occupy, after going through it, you will then know that God wants to dwell in a perfect place.

Jesus is the ark not mary
Colossians 2:9 For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

Now, Mary is the new ark of the covenant. She was the first tabernacle of Jesus.

Mary an ark of which covenant? The new testament ark is Jesus.

How can Jesus dwell in someone who was a sinner. How can something clean come out from that which is unclean? Does that makes sense to you?

Jesus was a man that is why he could mingle with people so Mary is no exception
Luke 5:30 But their scribes and Pharisees murmured against his disciples, saying, Why do ye eat and drink with publicans and sinners?
Luke 5:32 I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.

Mary was full of the grace if Christ that made it impossible for her to sin. Hence the greeting by angel Gabriel.

impossible for her to sin? If Mary had no sin I why did mary not die for the sins of the world. See my friend. Mary was unqualified to die for human sin because she was just a sinner like everyone

How can God tell you to honour your mother and not honour his? What kind of God is that? You claim to honour Your parents but you disrespect God's. Whats even honour? My dictionary defines honour as: "To think of highly, to respect highly; to show respect for; to recognise the importance or spiritual value of."
That is what I am doing.

you can ask God why he doesn't share his glory with another but it does not change his word.
Mary is not the mother of God.

God chose Mary and She chose God too. You asked if I chose my parents, am I God? Jesus! If I had a choice and everything was under my control, Yes! I would choose my parents. I would choose the best out of every person in the world . I would choose the perfect human. Exactly what God did.

@ bold Mary choose God to do what You are speaking as if Mary conceiving Jesus was by her power look at what the bible says

Luke 1:30 And the angel said unto her, Fear not, Mary: for thou hast found favour with God. @ bold was it God that found favour with Mary or Mary found favour with God

1:34 Then said Mary unto the angel, How shall this be, seeing I know not a man?
Mary did not even understand how it was to happen

1:35 And the angel answered and said unto her, The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee: therefore also that holy thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God.
It was God's power nothing more that made Jesus to come out through mary

God made Mary an offer, and she accepted by humbly saying: "let it be done to me according to your will"

she accepted it because she had faith just like all other saints

You can ask your pastor to pray for you because he is alive. Just Negodu. I rather pray to Mary and the saints to Pray for me to Jesus than a sinner who is "alive". Prayer is a request, a petition.

pray to the dead?
Isaiah 8:19 And when they shall say unto you, Seek unto them that have familiar spirits, and unto wizards that peep, and that mutter[b]: should not a people seek unto their God? for the living to the dead?[/b]
@ bold do you see it?
[]

Yes, Jesus is no longer in the womb of Jesus, but that does not mean [b]She is not his mother. [/b]She can pray for sinners that Jesus should forgive them. When your pastors are praying, don't they pray that Jesus should wipe the sins of the congregation? Hypocrites!

@ bold every everybody is equal in heaven and everyone worship Jesus that includes Mary.
My pastors pray for me not me praying to my pastor to pray for me.
I don't pray to my pastor to pray to Jesus for me as if Jesus will not hear me.
Jesus is perfect already.

You cannot take away the divinity of Jesus from the manhood of Jesus.

really?
Tell me when Jesus says only the father knows the time of his coming was he not speaking as a man?
If Jesus said father why has thou forsaking me was he not speaking as a man?
Jesus is both man and God this two natures are different you hear?

You make it sound as if there us two Jesuses :Jesus the man and Jesus the God. Wrong

Jesus has two natures

The divinity and the manhood of Jesus are merged. You cannot separate one from the other. Since they are merged, Mary is both the mother of Jesus the man, and Jesus the Son

the divinity of Christ and his divity are two different natures, Mary is the mother of Jesus the man but Jesus as son predates Mary
You are talking as if Jesus is under the law
Galatians 4:4 But when the fulness of the time was come, God sent forth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law,.
1 Peter 3:18 For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit:
Jesus is not under the law.

[s]Hence the reason she is referred to as the Theotokos. [/s]

this word does not exist in the bible

So you have not proved any wrong. You ended up confusing yourself and ensnaring yourself by your words.

what are you saying?

I repeat that worship is a thing of the mind. God honoured her, so who am I?

Your mind is draw towards Mary not GOD no man can serve two masters.

[quote author=Alexandro15 post=48390268]

Oh yes! I know what I am saying. You asked who made Mary an intercessor? Who made your pastors intercessors?

I myself intercede for people by praying for them but nobody need to pray to me to help them intercede

Please reason for once. I never said Mary intercedes to God the father, but to God the son. If Christians do not need pastors and priests to intercede to them to Jesus, then why do they allow them pray for them?

did Jesus tell you he need someone to stand for you to him.
Let me use this illustration for you
Do you need a lawyer to help you stand before your lawyer?
God is the judge, Jesus is your lawyer, you don't need another one to stand between you and that lawyer ok

I need a mediator to Jesus because some people are more favoured and given more grace than others.

you need a mediator to Jesus? Jesus does not need any form of holiness from you all he need is for you to come bodly to the throne of grace
Hebrews 4:16 Let us therefore come boldly unto the throne of grace, that we may obtain mercy, and find grace to help in time of need.

Keep your concern to yourself. You need to rather have concern for yourself and your protestants brothers that they don't invite God's wrath by insulting his mother. Good day[

I don't even know the meaning of protestant all I know is Jesus and him crucified.
Let me tell you Jesus is the closest person you can ever have.
You can accept him today ! I don't hate catholics that is why I am telling you the truth

[quote author=solite3 post=48400995][/quote]

Brother, go and sit down. I am tired of arguing with an ignorant person. Do as you wish

Alexandro15:


Brother, go and sit down. I am tired of arguing with an ignorant person. Do as you wish

only the truth can set free.
I LOVE MARY AND I KNOW THAT IF MARY WAS ALIVE SHE WOULD NOT ALLOW ALL THESE RUBBISH PEOPLE ARE DOING TO HER BUT WILL DIRECT ALL TO JESUS AS SHE DIRECTED THE SERVANTS TO JESUS!