aManFromMars: Oh boy, move to Asia... that's the only way most of your questions will be answered.

Reyginus: Lol. With this line we can all claim anything.
....
- If buddhism is embraced and admired because it forcefully separated from religion, why cant I embrace Ifa by separating it from religion too?
...
Some of my brothers will tell you that christainity is a way of life and not a religion.

FOLYKAZE:

lol. Even though I dont agree with most christian doctrines, I still find sense in some jesus teaching like love, charity and respect for authority. Also the book of proverb is the book I love reading most in bible. It not about belief or looking for flaws in bible, it about seeking knowledge.

Atheist on this forum are bend to admiring buddhism as philosophy, still wandering why they bark at me for admiring Ifa philosophy.

Reyginus: That's the problem with some atheists here. They will tell you that China is an atheist nation, irrespective of their deep religious nature. Lol. Then you begin to wonder if buddhism is a way of life too. Lol. Another thing is, some atheist here do not seek for knowledge. They think they've arrived. The reason you see atheists like logicboy always making unfounded claims.

FOLYKAZE:


I dont have problem with anything they attached to their atheism. It personal thing and not anybody's problem.

The problem is when they force their opinion on others....something like turning atheism into a religion. If they can admire buddhism philosophy and kick against it religious aspect. The same measures are expected from Africans who has not willfully submitted himself to oppression by lighting candle into another man's dark room while sleeping in a thick dark room claiming to be intelligent. This is first degree mental slavery. We cant be completely free from oppression if we are not ourselves.....most atheist too oppressed.

Imagine one of them saying his ancestors were dumb? This person went far to praise buddhism and western thought for trashing what belongs to him. This is something I kick against. Tufiakwa

joel lala: Hmmm..11posts and no single NL atheist is giving an answer to folykaze questions.

barack_o_handso: Wow! So you really opened a thread regarding this issue

joel lala: Hmmm..11posts and no single NL atheist is giving an answer to folykaze questions.

FOLYKAZE:

You mean 'nairaland atheist'? Such is there way. Dont ask anything that will stand against them but they are brutal when slot for bashing you comes in.

Even when they appear, they ignore you challenge to attack you or derail thread. AmanFromMars post on this thread said it all.

Anyway, I will still look forward for their answers.

macof: Buddhism doesn't recognize God or any spiritual being, It all about trying to be vindicated from the suffering of this world.

Buddha taught about striving to live a moral life by being mindful of ur actions and thoughts to achieve wisdom and understanding.

Buddhists strive to attain true happiness as the world is Hell itself

Every Buddhist strives to be like The buddha who gained enlightenment after connecting with his inner consciousness through meditations and other mediums.

Buddist do not care about material things, most buddhist are what u would call poor, because they find no use for theses things because it doesnt guarantee happiness and peace of mind

Buddhist are seekers of Knowledge and peace, trying to make the world a better place. that is why u can never hear of forced or compelled conversion, wars or discrimination in areas where Buddhism prevails. (afterall wisdom is not for everybody)

Buddhism is not science, but it deals with the main purpose of science which is knowledge, theories, and above all making the world a better place.

Buddhist believe in the law of karma(not as a spiritual concept but natural law of actions with consequences)

Its no wonder Atheist are fans of Buddhism, it supports their course

Ifa recognize forces that drives nature

Ifa also teaches the importance of good character

Ifa preaches that the most important thing to us is our consciousnesses and subconsciousness

Ifa teaches that connecting with ur subconscious makes life easy and the road to achieving ur destiny is smooth

Ifa to a large degree is science because it is all about gaining knowledge of everything knowledgeable

Ifa tells the truth using symbolism, it is left to u to interpret and understand its use of symbolism

Ifa however isnt into any known/recognised scientific method of discovering knowledge. Ifa is on its own league

FOLYKAZE:

Let me get some things correct here. God or No God is buddhism doesn't make it atheistic. There are Gods in buddhism like in Ifa. Traditionally yes
but according to the Buddha, believe-in is not the right word to use. Buddhism recognizes there are different living beings (life forms) and some of them are gods, divines, deities, etc. In the Buddhist language, they are called differently as they are also many kinds and have different places of their own. These deities in my opinion are best understood metaphorically, basically everything else the Buddha taught was taught using metaphors.
Yama the God of Death, Mara the tempter deity....Deva in sanskrit means a god/demigod (Like an angel or something). Brahmā, Asura, Śakra, Yaksha, Sariputta, Tara, Kwan Yin and many other Gods are found in Buddhism. Asura means Demons, naraka (hell) and nirvana (heaven).

Moreover in Ifa there are Gods but are metaphoric. In yoruba spirituality, the term believe is not really essential. They are there like the sun which you dont need believe in.

- Eledumare means infinite consciousnes, totality of energies and forces that therein in the universe. It doesn't have problem with you or concerned with you. You are microcosm of the whole and God of yourself. Only those who understand their 'me' and 'me-ness' grap this.

Ogun in the scientific worldview is a chemical element called Iron. Relating it oriki and scientific knowledge about it shows this is what it is. Monsters not attached.

Sango is electric energy. The metaphoric poem about it relates to it energetic nature and humanic nature. The human Sango was the vessel for energetic electric force which mastered and manifested the power of electric and forming lightening in his days. A typical lightning bolt contains 1 billion volts and contains between 10,000 to 200,000 amperes of current. Relating science to it metaphor shows it energy and not monsters.

Eshu is intuition. No voodoo included.

Orisa is selected consciousness among the infinite body of consciousness.

Orisha practise is not about worshipping God/Gods but awareness and recognizing those energies (Gods). This pave way to this saying 'ori eni la ba bo, aba fi orisa sile' meaning we are entitled to admire our consciousness and should have ignore orisa.

This and many Gods in Yoruba are not walking, talking and angry monsters. This apply to Devas in Buddhism. Sango is not asking anybody to worship it nor Devas needs your worship. I agree buddhism and Ifa went a step further where it meet religion....thats where temple, shrine, rituals and praying comes in. All the way, both spiritual path are same.

If western atheist can breaks into the metaphoric nature of Devas, whats wrong about African atheist to breaks into metaphoric nature of Orisha? Why cant I hijack Orisa practises from those who are ignorant about it that demonize it or turn it to Anthropomorphical God?

Let me ask you, if buddhism is atheistic in it concept, what happen to Ifa with it concept?

macof: sorry, I was not suppose to use the words "don't recognise". Cause they actually recognise spiritual forces(gods) but buddhists don't worship them.


If anyone can find atheistic reasoning in Buddhism, u can find just as much in Ifa studies.

FOLYKAZE:

Eshu is intuition. No voodoo included.

MamiWata:

Vodun means spirit. Are you asserting that the spirits are not really spirits but just names given to concepts like intuition? If so you are disrespecting the very foundation of vodun.

I believe you have identified yourself as an atheist who believes in the philosophical unerpinnings of Ifa. Why do you feel it is necessary to adhere to any philosophical package. I thought atheists were the ones who put themselves out there and lives their lives without a moral blueprint other than the one that feels right to them. Are you saying that atheists also desire a group identity in the same way other religious do? Why is that necessary? I think that being part of a group is what people really want. The title of the group seems to be secondary.

FOLYKAZE:

My questions are for African Atheist especially those in Nigeria who kick against African spirituality.

Dont bring this evasion of question to cunny attacking me....deal with the quest man

FOLYKAZE:

My questions are for African Atheist especially those in Nigeria who kick against African spirituality.

Dont bring this evasion of question to cunny attacking me....deal with the quest man

FOLYKAZE:

My questions are for African Atheist especially those in Nigeria who kick against African spirituality.

Dont bring this evasion of question to cunny attacking me....deal with the quest man

MamiWata:

Vodun means spirit. Are you asserting that the spirits are not really spirits but just names given to concepts like intuition? If so you are disrespecting the very foundation of vodun.

I believe you have identified yourself as an atheist who believes in the philosophical unerpinnings of Ifa. Why do you feel it is necessary to adhere to any philosophical package. I thought atheists were the ones who put themselves out there and lives their lives without a moral blueprint other than the one that feels right to them. Are you saying that atheists also desire a group identity in the same way other religious do? Why is that necessary? I think that being part of a group is what people really want. The title of the group seems to be secondary.

ninja4life:
i will like u to define spirituality cos most time i come across it d first thing dat comes to mind is d belief in spirits which is spiritualism.i'm sure there are others like dat.spirituality hav different definition and its definition usually changes over time.so i think it will be better if u define ur own idea of spirituality or better start using another term which best describe ur ideas.my opinion.just like pantheist uses god when making a discusion one might think dey believe in a supernatural god like d abrahamic religions cos god is usually used to denote a supernatural being therefore causing some sort of misunderstanding i stand to be corrected though.

The idea of a process or journey of self-discovery and of learning not only who you are, but who you want to be.

The challenge of reaching beyond your current limits. This can include keeping an open mind, questioning current beliefs, or trying to better understand others' beliefs.

A connectedness to yourself and to others. Spirituality is personal, but it is also rooted in being connected with others and with the world around you. This connection can facilitate you finding "your place in the world."

Meaning, purpose, and direction. Spirituality, while it doesn't necessarily solve or reach conclusions, often embraces the concept of searching and moving forward in the direction of meaning, purpose, and direction for your life.

http://swc.osu.edu/about-us/spirituality/