gatiano:
I did not miss Obatala has the king of the cross roads, I know that Obatala is associated with white clothes. I do not see them as in relation to science. Amongst many things, they are supreme scientists.

i just decided to talk a little about Eshu representing ether, and without ether, light can't be seen even when light is present.

Thankyou very much for the corrections.

The obatala part was directed at the thread creator nit you sir, pardon my not making it very obvious.

Explaining Yoruba spiritualism in the context of science will require bending, falsifying and corrupting things and as a result, I see this to be unnecessary.

9jacrip:

As interesting as this thread appears to be, I must say the attempt to explain these gods with science makes no sense. I mean, there are more to these gods which are unrelated to sceience and which it cannot explain and goes beyond the magnetism, atoms, comets etc

A lot as gone missing after te data lose. There was a debate created by Reginus which I and many others participated in. On te tread, we were arguing the scientific essence of Sango been seen from the science angle by me as electrical energy. I made mention on the thread that each pataki contain lot of essence put together in it. I agree with you that there are more to this Gods than science and I will want you to understand that this thread particularly focus on scientifical essence of pataki.

Take a look out the planetary bodies, they were named after roman gods. The stories accounted for these gods have some reflection (if possibly not all) that affect the planetary bodies. So when we talk about Yemoja in the creation story, you will notice the relationship it relay with source of water and others. This is what the thread is about.

9jacrip:

@ OP (FolyKaze): I also see distortion of or bending histories attached to these gods in order to serve your purpose of scientific approach. For example Obatala according to you is 'Oba ita ala' - King of the cross roads of white light (which is very false) while in actual sense it is 'Oba ti ala' - King of White clothes. Whichever way you put it, 'Ala' means white cloth not light! How then does white cloth then relate to your light in creation theory? Please do not arrogate 'ala' white cloth to mean light, it is fraud. Obatala is also known as Orisa Popo (its actual name in another Yoruba town, relate this name to creation?).

Thanks for calling me out. But I will make you understand that I am not in any way distorting or trying to bend any point made above.

Firstly, let me use this opportunity to correct the mistakes you make above. . .Ala is also Ela. It mean white or purity.

White clothe is Aso funfun not ela

So we could have have it as Obaasofunfun and not Obatala. You are right when you refer t Obatala as Oba ti ala (king of white of light). Some other name that he is been called is Oba ti o nla (the king who makes prosperity) and Orisha-nla.

I dont need to say much here, this links would help .

http://ileifa.org/ifa-cosmology-ifa-tells-us-how-the-universe-came-into-being/ http://www.africaspeaks.com/reasoning/index.php?topic=3562.0;wap2 , http://divinemoon.tumblr.com/post/51321796828/obatala-is-the-king-of-the-white-light-usually , http://orishareligion.com/OR/index.php/en/olodumare-emanations/obatala

9jacrip:

Oduduwa/Odu to da Iwa: breaking Odu to O dudu is utter rubbish and driving it to mean black woman is major falsehood.

You could as well read what I wrote there carefully. I acknowledge the name Oduduwa denotes "Odu ti o da Iwa".

As well, Oduduwa when broken is O, owner. Oodu is womb and dudu is black while Iwa is character. Womb is an attribute of woman.

The name Oduduwa means the black one. ‘O’ is ownership;’ dudu’ is black. The word ‘odu’ also means womb. Thus Oduduwa means the owner of the black womb or the black woman.

https://www.facebook.com/OduaRere/posts/734731103235060 http://orishareligion.com/OR/index.php/en/olodumare-emanations/oduduwa

9jacrip:

Orunmila: orun lo mo eni to ma la - 'la' here means succeed/successful or make it not 'saved'

Lol. . . .are you really a Yoruba?

The name Orunmila derives from "Orun-ni-o mo eni-ma-la" (meaning "only heaven knows the secret to salvation and survival".

http://www.princeton.edu/~achaney/tmve/wiki100k/docs/Orunmila.html

http://en.m.wiktionary.org/wiki/Orunmila

9jacrip:

Overral, your thread only shows you have an idea of Isese and your interest in it but attaching it to science is myopic considering you'd only take what you need from the whole to explain each god as a whole scientifically which makes no sense because you're expected to explain them scientifically in completion.

Thanks but Yoruba spirituality encompass science and tradition. Read those links pls

9jacrip:

Lastly, bending interpretation of names to suit your thesis collapses everything and makes it unworthy of being taken serious but at least I admire the fact that you are trying to un-securitize these deities that Nollywood abd Abrahamic religion have almost succeeded in demonizing.

Eeepa Oris!

Read the pataki and comapre it with science account. If they dont tally, pls point it out.

Orisha a gbe wa o.

Ashe

gatiano:
I did not miss Obatala has the king of the cross roads, I know that Obatala is associated with white clothes. I do not see them as in relation to science. Amongst many things, they are supreme scientists.

i just decided to talk a little about Eshu representing ether, and without ether, light can't be seen even when light is present.

Thankyou very much for the corrections.

The Ether cosmological relation to Eshu is every interesting. I will do more research when I am less busy.

These are links you could read something about Obatala and light on :


http://www.africaspeaks.com/reasoning/index.php?topic=3562.0;wap2

http://ileifa.org/ifa-cosmology-ifa-tells-us-how-the-universe-came-into-being/

Thankyou for the links brother. Their so much wonderful things of sciences, mathematics, astronomy, cosmology and history to Africa more to what is being taught to us by either side (outsiders and rep of ancestors).

FOLYKAZE:


The Ether cosmological relation to Eshu is every interesting. I will do more research when I am less busy.

These are links you could read something about Obatala and light on :


http://www.africaspeaks.com/reasoning/index.php?topic=3562.0;wap2

http://ileifa.org/ifa-cosmology-ifa-tells-us-how-the-universe-came-into-being/

FOLYKAZE:


A lot as gone missing after te data lose. There was a debate created by Reginus which I and many others participated in. On te tread, we were arguing the scientific essence of Sango been seen from the science angle by me as electrical energy. I made mention on the thread that each pataki contain lot of essence put together in it. I agree with you that there are more to this Gods than science and I will want you to understand that this thread particularly focus on scientifical essence of pataki.

Pardon me for jumping intrusively into the thread then, I did not realize this thread had already recorded a debate, I am following Macof (I'm a fan of his interest in Yoruba history and belief system) so when I got alerted of his input here, I thought it was an old thread that was just gathering responses.

Take a look out the planetary bodies, they were named after roman gods. The stories accounted for these gods have some reflection (if possibly not all) that affect the planetary bodies. So when we talk about Yemoja in the creation story, you will notice the relationship it relay with source of water and others. This is what the thread is about.


Thanks for calling me out. But I will make you understand that I am not in any way distorting or trying to bend any point made above.

Firstly, let me use this opportunity to correct the mistakes you make above. . .Ala is also Ela. It mean white or purity.

White clothe is Aso funfun not ela

I am nit making a mistake, from where I come and in Yoruba land generally, Ala means white cloth -- ever heard this saying 'wan da epo si ala' which means stain a white cloth with oil or pour oul on a white cloth? Ala does not in anyway represent light sir.

Ela means clarity or revelation or to open something up.

Still, you're bending things or unknowingly mixing things up.

So we could have have it as Obaasofunfun and not Obatala. You are right when you refer t Obatala as Oba ti ala (king of white of light). Some other name that he is been called is Oba ti o nla (the king who makes prosperity) and Orisha-nla.

I dont need to say much here, this links would help .

http://ileifa.org/ifa-cosmology-ifa-tells-us-how-the-universe-came-into-being/ http://www.africaspeaks.com/reasoning/index.php?topic=3562.0;wap2 , http://divinemoon.tumblr.com/post/51321796828/obatala-is-the-king-of-the-white-light-usually , http://orishareligion.com/OR/index.php/en/olodumare-emanations/obatala

Thank you for the links but I, as far as Obatala is concerned do not need them. I speak on Obatala as his descendant and his devotee with access to as much details as can be sourced for from the source.

You could as well read what I wrote there carefully. I acknowledge the name Oduduwa denotes "Odu ti o da Iwa".

As well, Oduduwa when broken is O, owner. Oodu is womb and dudu is black while Iwa is character. Womb is an attribute of woman.

The name Oduduwa means the black one. ‘O’ is ownership;’ dudu’ is black. The word ‘odu’ also means womb. Thus Oduduwa means the owner of the black womb or the black woman.

https://www.facebook.com/OduaRere/posts/734731103235060 http://orishareligion.com/OR/index.php/en/olodumare-emanations/oduduwa

I would like to implore you to take it easy with these links, they are mostly either false or carry mixed up information mostly to appeal to the foreigners or even done by these foreigmers. The confusion and mixture witnessed in Isese recently has been the indiscriminate initiations of African Americans and some whites into Orisa or Ifa and as a result, they have mostly gone to give different renditions to some details.

I do not have a problem with these foreigners being initiated especially the AAmericans but they mostly need to be kept in the background to 'follow', I see how they battle each other on facebook over isese, starting Awo in their countries, giving completely wrong definitions to certain terms etc

Heck, the Islam influenced ones have even gone as far as relating Obatala to a Quranic figure and ascribing an islamic definition to the name.

To show how much these online liks should be avoided for example this web link: http://www.africaspeaks.com/reasoning/index.php?topic=3562.0;wap2 describes Obatala to be the spirit of white cloth in west african religious tradition called 'Ifa'.

Now is Ifa a religion? You see the type of error I am talking about?

If I open each weblink I will point out very many errors that you, a supposed Yoruba should see and never touch those online links with a ten mile spoon.

Lol. . . .are you really a Yoruba?

The name Orunmila derives from "Orun-ni-o mo eni-ma-la" (meaning "only heaven knows the secret to salvation and survival".

http://www.princeton.edu/~achaney/tmve/wiki100k/docs/Orunmila.html

http://en.m.wiktionary.org/wiki/Orunmila

Thanks but Yoruba spirituality encompass science and tradition. Read those links pls

When I first read your thread, I copied some lines randomly and saw sites where the same things were mentioned. Sir, these sites I am not a fan of.

Read the pataki and comapre it with science account. If they dont tally, pls point it out.

Orisha a gbe wa o.

Ashe

Linking Yoruba gods to science is no different from those linking Yoruba figures to Middle East and Egypt; both lacking in reason and existential originality in that tales her formed with details corrupted or bent.

Your position is interesting but let's keep it 100.

Eeeepa orisa.

Truth is the foundation on which development cannot be stalled. it is the ways of our fathers and the fathers before then, what if they have to make some changes to survive due to some catastrophies and new rules and cultures were imposed strictly just for a time period for the catastrophies to pass, but then, due to some unknown circumstances, it all just became the new normal. examples amongst many is polygamy, tribal marks, soul mate system etc.

Truth support development, good for all creating a lasting peace, and of course lies favours a few, I am not sure if i'm to blame them afterall, nobody amongst these few knows what to expect from the truth which in fact as old as time itself. And Time never was when man was not.

@ 9jacrip

Actually larger part of this thread has been lost during the period narialand was attacked. And I still appreciate the fact that you are reviving it.

I accept the fact with you that Ala is white clothe. I think I am not wrong as well calling it Aso funfun. But if you look closely, you will realise that the word is not limited to a meaning. Were you not the one that says Ela is clarity and revelation (more like saying Elawori). Do you as well want to tell me that white clothe is the samething as Clarity or revelation? Do you know that Ela is the name of a person as well. Is the person a white clothe? Ala could also mean purity or boundary. Most important thing is context at which the word is used.

This thread is about pointing out a particular essence from the creation story. As per Obatala, I acknowledged he is the king of white clothes. But what could be the symbolic representation of white clothe? What is the essence of white clothes in the creation story?

On the other round, you dont have interest in reading from those links I put forward. This is to show you that I was not distorting or trying to distort any account.

I beg to disagree on relating Orisha to other culture deities. Is it also wrong to relate Sango with Thor or Amadioha?

On Ifa as a religion, this has also been discussed on a thread created by me. It all depend on the angle you're viewing things from. To me, it is not a religion but to person like pagan9ja, he sees it as a religion.

So much this issue is concern, I have clarified that I have no authority on it. I am not the one that update those sites but we share the same ideas. Also I have strong believe that those that updated it have a vast knowledge about the subject. Note also that this is a multiple site sharing the same opinion with my deduction. If we all could be wrong and you insist that you are right, I will implore you to back up every claim of yours. It could be by providing a reliable link or linking us to a babalawo who have much say off-internet.

Yeeepa 'Mole

gatiano:
In my very limited knowledge of the ancient and ancestral science and history is that Obatala is the head and the most wise of The 7. In the sense that he always knows how to attract friendship (i do not know other words) within the 7 and knows also how to repel tension among the 7, which is one of the characteristics of magnetism.
Without magnetism, we won't have compounds such as the human body, the water, the planets, the solar systems, candles, even love or lust.

So that illuminating light may represent wisdom.

Oshosi is very fast, fast as light. The moon, The sun, the star might all be his brothers and sisters. All the moon,sun and planets and everything within it are binding together by Magnetism, throught out the entire universe.

The relationship between Obatala and Oshosi or Magnetism and Light, is that without ether, there could be light but it would not be seen by nobody. because light can only travel in space which is also Ether. Ether here is Eshu.

We have always heard about a new planet just appearing by the modern scientists, what they do not know infact is that the planet had been there all along from eons of years, only not surrounded by ether.

correct me brother, if i'm wrong, The universal truth is necessary for the blackman's growth and development.

you didn't actually answer my question but thanks anyway

@folykaze, 9jacrip is right to say Orunmila is "the spirit realm knows who will succeed"
In Yoruba there's no concept of soul salvation there's only soul evolution and devolution through ur Iwa on earth

I know of Adimu-la meaning Adimu succeeds

And Oduduwa is the fundamental principle/power that set up creation not character or behaviour
I could go with the popular "character" definition only if it relates to form and structure nt behaviour(as in psychology)...


@9jacrip being an omo Obatala, I respect you but don't you think Ala "white cloth" represents the abstract idea of clarity and purity?

macof:
@folykaze, 9jacrip is right to say Orunmila is "the spirit realm knows who will succeed"
In Yoruba there's no concept of soul salvation there's only soul evolution and devolution through ur Iwa on earth

I know of Adimu-la meaning Adimu succeeds

And Oduduwa is the fundamental principle/power that set up creation not character or behaviour
I could go with the popular "character" definition only if it relates to form and structure nt behaviour(as in psychology)...


@9jacrip being an omo Obatala, I respect you but don't you think Ala "white cloth" represents the abstract idea of clarity and purity?

Have you checked the links I provided? The links said 'save'. . .

I admit 'la' is success/accomplishment.

Adimu la is not correct. Adimu se a se la could only mean success.

Adimu la ja only mean triumph.

Adimu gba mi la only mean salvation.

So you should check the relationship between those la having three meaning. Note, I can still go further.

FOLYKAZE:


Have you checked the links I provided? The links said 'save'. . .

I admit 'la' is success/accomplishment.

Adimu la is not correct. Adimu se a se la could only mean success.

Adimu la ja only mean triumph.

Adimu gba mi la only mean salvation.

So you should check the relationship between those la having three meaning. Note, I can still go further.

I don't need internet links to understand yoruba language especially from questionable sources...the same way you read links to determine Emi?

and with my example of Adimula I was bringing an historical event to light. Adimu being a child of oduduwa's household but chance of him becoming king was slim...when he did, people starting calling him Adimula - because he succeeded


Look at the name Orunmila and tell me how salvation fits over success

macof:


I don't need internet links to understand yoruba language especially from questionable sources...the same way you read links to determine Emi?

and with my example of Adimula I was bringing an historical event to light. Adimu being a child of oduduwa's household but chance of him becoming king was slim...when he did, people starting calling him Adimula - because he succeeded


Look at the name Orunmila and tell me how salvation fits over success

Tell me what 'la' is in Adetola.

FOLYKAZE:
@ 9jacrip

Actually larger part of this thread has been lost during the period narialand was attacked. And I still appreciate the fact that you are reviving it.

I accept the fact with you that Ala is white clothe. I think I am not wrong as well calling it Aso funfun. But if you look closely, you will realise that the word is not limited to a meaning. Were you not the one that says Ela is clarity and revelation (more like saying Elawori). Do you as well want to tell me that white clothe is the samething as Clarity or revelation? Do you know that Ela is the name of a person as well. Is the person a white clothe? Ala could also mean purity or boundary. Most important thing is context at which the word is used.

This thread is about pointing out a particular essence from the creation story. As per Obatala, I acknowledged he is the king of white clothes. But what could be the symbolic representation of white clothe? What is the essence of white clothes in the creation story?

On the other round, you dont have interest in reading from those links I put forward. This is to show you that I was not distorting or trying to distort any account.

I beg to disagree on relating Orisha to other culture deities. Is it also wrong to relate Sango with Thor or Amadioha?

On Ifa as a religion, this has also been discussed on a thread created by me. It all depend on the angle you're viewing things from. To me, it is not a religion but to person like pagan9ja, he sees it as a religio[/b]n.

So much this issue is concern, I have clarified that I have no authority on it. [b]I am not the one that update those sites but we share the same ideas. Also I have strong believe that those that updated it have a vast knowledge about the subject. Note also that this is a multiple site sharing the same opinion with my deduction. If we all could be wrong and you insist that you are right, I will implore you to back up every claim of yours. It could be by providing a reliable link or linking us to a babalawo who have much say off-internet.

Yeeepa 'Mole

1. Ala, generally in Yoruba land and not just with me, means white cloth. That is the actual name for it but could also be called aso funfun which is came up as a result of English influence on Yoruba language construction the same way people speak and write Yoruba influenced English.

2. Ela is far different and renoved from Ala. Ela Oluorogbo was an ancient Ife figure who is credited with bringing a particular writing style to Earth. 'Ela' in his name denotes revelation (of writing). The temple and family that does Ela worship is there in Ife (has been for ages).

------ there are Yoruba words that do not change no matter the context you use tem.

3. This is another spot we differ; I am not a fan of tagging these gods and things about them to creation story of big bang or garden of eden wahala. Most importantly, taking things as far as symbolism will require bending or corrupting things to serve a purpose. As can be seen with Ala in the name Obatala which you said to be light

4. Well, can't fault you for buying the contents of the links but really, they are loaded with errors and objective of linking Yoruba mystery to science after Christianity and Islam have done theirs.

5. You can link gods all you want but if you have to, make sure Yoruba gods are primary and others from other cultures are secondary since it would help cement the primacy of these gods and not seek for useless validation from other cultures as witnessed severally with Egypt abd Mecca BS.

6. Ifa is not a 'West African Religion' under which other gods fall, neither is it a religion at that. If a person like Pagan9ja sees it as a religion, it is your duty (an every Yoruba sons and daughters with knowledge) to correct him and hell broaden his view on it. The content of those websites, their writers and anyone who believes the jargons there in is only helping to drive Yoruba civilization aground; rather than correct the mix ups or outright falsehood, you are posting the links around to support your claims?

7. It is quite interesting to read your post where you said 'the writers are very vast in knowledge of the subjec. What subject? Science or about Yoruba gods? Maybe science but Yoruba belief, they know little. I might decide to begin to point out the many errors in those links but I have a lot of work load at hand.

8. I am not interested in the science of creation, so I have no reason to say they are wrong or right but with the various deliberate or innocent errors done while describing Yoruba properties in order to serve a purpose is where I have a problem.

9. A babalawo, firstly is an Ifa initiate and the 'awo' in the title simply means he can only say little to an 'Ogberi'. Also, the awo of Orisa, is bound by oath to keep details in check. As an awo myself, there is only so much I can share. Asking me to back up my 'claims' about something I breathe, live and eat is quite offensive but my advice is 1. Your idea of weaving gods to creation is smooth but do not bend anything, if a god does not fit in then it should be left alone. 2. Rather than absorb and tout these links, seek to help correct their false informations they carry abd threaten Yoruba civilization with.

Eruadaji o!

macof:
@9jacrip being an omo Obatala, I respect you but don't you think Ala "white cloth" represents the abstract idea of clarity and purity?

Of course it represents those.

macof:


I don't need internet links to understand yoruba language especially from questionable sources...the same way you read links to determine Emi?

and with my example of Adimula I was bringing an historical event to light. Adimu being a child of oduduwa's household but chance of him becoming king was slim...when he did, people starting calling him Adimula - because he succeeded


Look at the name Orunmila and tell me how salvation fits over success

Nice one there bro.
You're mostly always on point.

9jacrip:


1. Ala, generally in Yoruba land and not just with me, means white cloth. That is the actual name for it but could also be called aso funfun which is came up as a result of English influence on Yoruba language construction the same way people speak and write Yoruba influenced English.

Ala also is boundary. 'mase koja ala e' meaning do not cross your boundary.

It is purity. 'oju Orun ala funfun gbo'.

Dismissing these up here for the one you only choose to hold to is. . . .

9jacrip:

2. Ela is far different and renoved from Ala. Ela Oluorogbo was an ancient Ife figure who is credited with bringing a particular writing style to Earth. 'Ela' in his name denotes revelation (of writing). The temple and family that does Ela worship is there in Ife (has been for ages).

my bad, I brought Ikale to ede Yoruba.

9jacrip:

------ there are Yoruba words that do not change no matter the context you use tem.

Not ala of purity and ala of boundary.

9jacrip:

3. This is another spot we differ; I am not a fan of tagging these gods and things about them to creation story of big bang or garden of eden wahala. Most importantly, taking things as far as symbolism will require bending or corrupting things to serve a purpose. As can be seen with Ala in the name Obatala which you said to be light

My point again is, is it wrong to compare Sango to Thor? You have not answer this sir.

9jacrip:

4. Well, can't fault you for buying the contents of the links but really, they are loaded with errors and objective of linking Yoruba mystery to science after Christianity and Islam have done theirs.

The link has been source of most of the things I know since Awos want to keep things to themselves.

9jacrip:

5. You can link gods all you want but if you have to, make sure Yoruba gods are primary and others from other cultures are secondary since it would help cement the primacy of these gods and not seek for useless validation from other cultures as witnessed severally with Egypt abd Mecca BS.

Ok sir

9jacrip:

6. Ifa is not a 'West African Religion' under which other gods fall, neither is it a religion at that. If a person like Pagan9ja sees it as a religion, it is your duty (an every Yoruba sons and daughters with knowledge) to correct him and hell broaden his view on it. The content of those websites, their writers and anyone who believes the jargons there in is only helping to drive Yoruba civilization aground; rather than correct the mix ups or outright falsehood, you are posting the links around to support your claims?

The links and books majorly are the source of my knowledge.

9jacrip:

7. It is quite interesting to read your post where you said 'the writers are very vast in knowledge of the subjec. What subject? Science or about Yoruba gods? Maybe science but Yoruba belief, they know little. I might decide to begin to point out the many errors in those links but I have a lot of work load at hand.

8. I am not interested in the science of creation, so I have no reason to say they are wrong or right but with the various deliberate or innocent errors done while describing Yoruba properties in order to serve a purpose is where I have a problem.

9. A babalawo, firstly is an Ifa initiate and the 'awo' in the title simply means he can only say little to an 'Ogberi'. Also, the awo of Orisa, is bound by oath to keep details in check. As an awo myself, there is only so much I can share. Asking me to back up my 'claims' about something I breathe, live and eat is quite offensive but my advice is 1. Your idea of weaving gods to creation is smooth but do not bend anything, if a god does not fit in then it should be left alone. 2. Rather than absorb and tout these links, seek to help correct their false informations they carry abd threaten Yoruba civilization with.

Eruadaji o!

I am sorry if I offend you by asking for backup. I really thought we were one (Ogberi).

How should I go seeking for the correct information? Can I ask for it here?

Seems you have an authority over this subject, can we pls leave at one side 'ala' and learn something from you?

FOLYKAZE:


Tell me what 'la' is in Adetola.

Wealth

macof:


Wealth

Couldnt you find contextion application here? Why would you be blind to iy?

9jacrip:


Of course it represents those.

then why objecting the connection of Ala and light?
Afterall the base of the word Ala is "la" ="to clear" like in Oyela that which makes clear, or Ilaju to be clear in sight
light also makes things clear

So the logic behind the word "Ala" for white clothes is "that which is clear"

Folykaze actually Ola is wealth... you took out "la" from the name Adetola
but it doesn't change the meaning

FOLYKAZE:


Ala also is boundary. 'mase koja ala e' meaning do not cross your boundary.

It is purity. 'oju Orun ala funfun gbo'.

Dismissing these up here for the one you only choose to hold to is. . . .

Ala as boundary is not used across Yoruba land but a good example regardless.

Ala funfun is also a good example.

And like my response to Macof, I agree to purity not 'light'.

Ala in Oba ti ala references 'white cloth' which in essence means 'purity'.

my bad, I brought Ikale to ede Yoruba.

You're Ikale then?

Not ala of purity and ala of boundary.



My point again is, is it wrong to compare Sango to Thor? You have not answer this sir.

Not wrong but when seeking to validate the place or powers pf Sango from Thor is wrong, at least to me.

The link has been source of most of the things I know since Awos want to keep things to themselves..

Ok sir



The links and books majorly are the source of my knowledge.

Oh well, the little secrecy is to be expected but I tell you sir, be careful of sites and books althpugh some carry honest but surface details

I am sorry if I offend you by asking for backup. I really thought we were one (Ogberi).

How should I go seeking for the correct information? Can I ask for it here?

You do not have to be sorry sir, it happens. I will add as much as possible to details and we can always exchange ideas sir.

Seems you have an authority over this subject, can we pls leave at one side 'ala' and learn something from you?

Authority over what subject sir? gods and science? What could I possiblt add to this?

macof:


then why objecting the connection of Ala and light?
Afterall the base of the word Ala is "la" ="to clear" like in Oyela that which makes clear, or Ilaju to be clear in sight
light also makes things clear

So the logic behind the word "Ala" for white clothes is "that which is clear"

For you sur, Ala represents pure but then morps into 'light'. In Oy'ela', it is still 'Ela' not Ala. La in 'Ala' that which is pure or clear.

Eitherways, I jumped into the thread when I read what seemed like corruption of the name 'Obatala' to 'Oba ita ala' and its derivative meaning. So far the thread has its own orientation tilted achieving the science of creation connotation which I really am not interested in.

9jacrip:


For you sur, Ala represents pure but then morps into 'light'. In Oy'ela', it is still 'Ela' not Ala. La in 'Ala' that which is pure or clear.

Eitherways, I jumped into the thread when I read what seemed like corruption of the name 'Obatala' to 'Oba ita ala' and its derivative meaning. So far the thread has its own orientation tilted achieving the science of creation connotation which I really am not interested in.

Yh it's Ela but the "la" represents the same logic in both words which is clarity

macof:
Folykaze actually Ola is wealth... you took out "la" from the name Adetola
but it doesn't change the meaning

Even though I agree wirh 9jacrip that ala is white clothes and also mean purity and boundary, there is no way you can force me to hold onto one application of a common used Yoruba word.

La like you pointed out is wealth.

What is la in Adetula? Is it success too?

What is the la in Gbamila, is it success too?

9jacrip:


Ala as boundary is not used across Yoruba land but a good example regardless.

Ala funfun is also a good example.

And like my response to Macof, I agree to purity not 'light'.

Ala in Oba ti ala references 'white cloth' which in essence means 'purity'.

I agree that Obatala is the king of white clothe which has essense of purity. So lets leave all that for na. What is the essense of white clothe in science?

Awo falokun fatunmibi in his published article agree that Obatala is white light spectrum. I understand that you are not interested in scientifical aspect of Yoruba spirituality but as you can see this thread is more concern about the scientifical side. . . . .reason you didnt see me highlighting morality of drunkness.

He is an awo and you are. He went through initiation and got exposed to the knowledge of our spirituality. He like every other person have read from their books and internet articule (I mean the one you dismiss completely) agree that Obatala is the king of white clothe but represnt white light.

I will beg for you interest sir, you could pls tell us what Obatala in the creation story represent. Should we romance with the myth as it is or unravel what the myth could be passing as message?

9jacrip:

You're Ikale then?

Yes

9jacrip:

Not wrong but when seeking to validate the place or powers pf Sango from Thor is wrong, at least to me.

ok

9jacrip:

Oh well, the little secrecy is to be expected but I tell you sir, be careful of sites and books althpugh some carry honest but surface details

Ok

9jacrip:

You do not have to be sorry sir, it happens. I will add as much as possible to details and we can always exchange ideas sir.

I will look forward to this sir

9jacrip:

Authority over what subject sir? gods and science? What could I possiblt add to this?

God and science.

You could add representaion of each deity from the Yoruba creation story.

Someone said Eshu is Ether. I am still trying to see if he is right. The account of Yemoja align with the falling icy comet source of water theory. The kick start of light is in track with Obatala. Sango as been argued in my lost thread represent Electrical energy. The common man see Iron as Ogun. You see the drivers swearing with their car or key 'Ogun re' meaning this Ogun; meanwhile, what they hold with them is key and not a man clothed with palm front.

What could each Orisha represent to your own view?

FOLYKAZE:


Even though I agree wirh 9jacrip that ala is white clothes and also mean purity and boundary, there is no way you can force me to hold onto one application of a common used Yoruba word.

La like you pointed out is wealth.

What is la in Adetula? Is it success too?

What is the la in Gbamila, is it success too?

what do you mean by forcing you to take one application? Languages are built on logic and have a set rule
are you the father of Yoruba language? When you get a translation wrong you get it wrong no need to keep being adamant...I also thought "la" in Orunmila meant "Save" but I learnt I was deceived by wrong internet articles...which you hold so dear
Never in conversational Yoruba does "la" mean "to save" NEVER!
It could mean to clear
In another tone it means to succeed/...this verb forms Ola "wealth"
In a different tone it could mean to divide/break/to create a boundary, to mark

Gbamila could be broken to form "gbala"(that's why you have olugbala) as a verb meaning "to save" you don't need to break it just "la" to manipulate your way
People don't even say Gbamila anymore, they simply say "gba mi"

Interesting... So the thread came back to life.

macof:


what do you mean by forcing you to take one application? Languages are built on logic and have a set rule
are you the father of Yoruba language? When you get a translation wrong you get it wrong no need to keep being adamant...I also thought "la" in Orunmila meant "Save" but I learnt I was deceived by wrong internet articles...which you hold so dear
Never in conversational Yoruba does "la" mean "to save" NEVER!
It could mean to clear
In another tone it means to succeed/...this verb forms Ola "wealth"
In a different tone it could mean to divide/break/to create a boundary, to mark

Gbamila could be broken to form "gbala"(that's why you have olugbala) as a verb meaning "to save" you don't need to break it just "la" to manipulate your way
People don't even say Gbamila anymore, they simply say "gba mi"

Oga, I have a colleague at work here that bears Adetula. . .he never for once interprete the la in his name as success but save.

Gbamila is a common name among the Yoruba people. It is mostly called Adegbamila. it also mean save.

La mean lot of thing when applied to different context. What is adamancy here when I agree that la could mean Success as Orunmila is concern? Must you just have to throw insult around or resort to name-calling when we dont agree on things?

Orunmila is also known or called Orunla. What is the la in Orunla? Is it the samething as success or wealth?

These are the question you should ask.


I quickly asked a priest in the hood and he told me something deifferent yesternight. He said Orunmila when splitted is 'Orun-mo-oola' meaning the spiritual realm knows tomorrow. Can you now see that this is entirely different from success or wealth?

Orun-mo-oola gives more insight to Eleri-Ipin. The fulfilment of Ipin lies in tomorrow. Ipin has nothing to do with success or failure. What ever one choose lies in future.

Waow!!! What an interesting topic and intelligent discourse. Thank you all I will continue following the conversation

FOLYKAZE:


Oga, I have a colleague at work here that bears Adetula. . .he never for once interprete the la in his name as success but save.

Gbamila is a common name among the Yoruba people. It is mostly called Adegbamila. it also mean save.

La mean lot of thing when applied to different context. What is adamancy here when I agree that la could mean Success as Orunmila is concern? Must you just have to throw insult around or resort to name-calling when we dont agree on things?

Orunmila is also known or called Orunla. What is the la in Orunla? Is it the samething as success or wealth?

These are the question you should ask.


I quickly asked a priest in the hood and he told me something deifferent yesternight. He said Orunmila when splitted is 'Orun-mo-oola' meaning the spiritual realm knows tomorrow. Can you now see that this is entirely different from success or wealth?

Orun-mo-oola gives more insight to Eleri-Ipin. The fulfilment of Ipin lies in tomorrow. Ipin has nothing to do with success or failure. What ever one choose lies in future.

And what makes you think everyone knows the meaning of their name? I have not always known the meaning of my name either.

name calling? e gba mi ke, which one is name calling? Oga abeg park well

Am done with this Orunmila translation anyway, best u stick to whatever suits you

@ FOLYKAZE: Each man has his own perspective so I will now say my own after studying carefully the discussion here.

My Favored Orishas

My physical form is like Obatala. A magnetic personality sometimes hated, sometimes loved but has good at heart. In truth, Jesus is like Orunmila because King Solomon stated that Wisdom was a witness to (and a messenger in) the process of creation. Olokun is said to have great wealth as the mother of Aje and we know one sometimes must choose between the Devil (personified by Soren) and the deep blue sea. Eshu keeps justice and it is indeed blind and only records your works to judge you, and is manytimes unfair in accusing and punishing as the Prophet SAW is.

A Sad Fact

The end indeed justifies the means and indeed people take good for granted but only respond in the face of great danger. My father worshipped Orunmila and I too preferred Orunmila cuz in the stories I read about him he patiently endures wrongs till the day restitution is made. Likewise, of recent I have communed with the voices to work on my behalf in dealing with people who wronged me and at this point I will tell a true story about how my uncle died.

He disliked how I spent money and tried to struggle with me over the rent while I knew where he stayed in my house costs money. I was annoyed with him for it and let him know and wrote in a book he would die of heart attack. 3 days before his death, a spirit told me my uncle is a good man and I should apologize and when I went, he said to a friend, 'This small boy wants to talk to me.' I apologized over the actions and words I spoke and he accepted it, but he still died to my shock when I touched his corpse.

Relating Orishas To Science

Obatala (Gravity): White clothes reflect heat and yet a stain makes it seem all wrong. White is a combination of all colors and shines the brighter, the darker a place is, yet seems dim the more the distance. Likewise, gravity is the sum of all physical forces and attracts stronger the heavier the objects, and weaker the further the object is. Eccentric people are like this.

Orunmila (Electromagnetism): No one needs to state that all electronic and electrical devices work based on the principle of electromagnetism. We live in an electrical universe where planets have a magnetic shield that protects them from the excessive magnetic field of their nearby stars. Electromagnetism is also the basis of all chemical reactions. Electromagnetism involves an attractive force that fills with electrons where electrons are lacking or with order where there is disorder. Consistent people are like this.

Olokun (Weak nuclear force)

Esu (Strong nuclear force)

. . . to be finished later.

UyiIredia:
@ FOLYKAZE: Each man has his own perspective so I will now say my own after studying carefully the discussion here.

My Favored Orishas

My physical form is like Obatala. A magnetic personality sometimes hated, sometimes loved but has good at heart. In truth, Jesus is like Orunmila because King Solomon stated that Wisdom was a witness to (and a messenger in) the process of creation. Olokun is said to have great wealth as the mother of Aje and we know one sometimes must choose between the Devil (personified by Soren) and the deep blue sea. Eshu keeps justice and it is indeed blind and only records your works to judge you, and is manytimes unfair in accusing and punishing as the Prophet SAW is.

A Sad Fact

The end indeed justifies the means and indeed people take good for granted but only respond in the face of great danger. My father worshipped Orunmila and I too preferred Orunmila cuz in the stories I read about him he patiently endures wrongs till the day restitution is made. Likewise, of recent I have communed with the voices to work on my behalf in dealing with people who wronged me and at this point I will tell a true story about how my uncle died.

He disliked how I spent money and tried to struggle with me over the rent while I knew where he stayed in my house costs money. I was annoyed with him for it and let him know and wrote in a book he would die of heart attack. 3 days before his death, a spirit told me my uncle is a good man and I should apologize and when I went, he said to a friend, 'This small boy wants to talk to me.' I apologized over the actions and words I spoke and he accepted it, but he still died to my shock when I touched his corpse.

Relating Orishas To Science

Obatala (Gravity): White clothes reflect heat and yet a stain makes it seem all wrong. White is a combination of all colors and shines the brighter, the darker a place is, yet seems dim the more the distance. Likewise, gravity is the sum of all physical forces and attracts stronger the heavier the objects, and weaker the further the object is. Eccentric people are like this.

Orunmila (Electromagnetism): No one needs to state that all electronic and electrical devices work based on the principle of electromagnetism. We live in an electrical universe where planets have a magnetic shield that protects them from the excessive magnetic field of their nearby stars. Electromagnetism is also the basis of all chemical reactions. Electromagnetism involves an attractive force that fills with electrons where electrons are lacking or with order where there is disorder. Consistent people are like this.

Olokun (Weak nuclear force)

Esu (Strong nuclear force)

. . . to be finished later.

When are you going to finish this?