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Re: The Possibility Of Natural Intelligence. by Kay17: 9:30pm On Nov 10, 2013 |
Joshthefirst: Don't confuse Consciousness for a Thing, its a sense/channel of self awareness, it is relational to a subject (we). Souls and Spirits are entities/objects for themselves. |
Re: The Possibility Of Natural Intelligence. by Joshthefirst(m): 9:30pm On Nov 10, 2013 |
wiegraf:so machines arise from complex nothingness? Okay. Clarify intent. Do machines have intent? Are machines conscious? |
Re: The Possibility Of Natural Intelligence. by DeepSight(m): 9:31pm On Nov 10, 2013 |
plaetton: Gosh. As predicted. No disappointment whatsoever. Well perhaps it misses you that for emotions to be induced, there must first be a person feeling them. Which will not be the case with your robots. I will indulge you. Once and finally. But for now, chew on pain, sight, emotion, independent and original thought, discomfort, and the like, and distinguish the simulation from the sensation in each of these cases. Your turn out here is the most remarkably fo.oolish and ignorant ever. As I said, I will indulge you. |
Re: The Possibility Of Natural Intelligence. by Joshthefirst(m): 9:36pm On Nov 10, 2013 |
Kay 17:I do not confuse consciousness for "a thing" Consciousness is an attribute. I believe its a given attribute. |
Re: The Possibility Of Natural Intelligence. by DeepSight(m): 9:41pm On Nov 10, 2013 |
Joshthefirst: I do not confuse consciousness for "a thing" Ponder "what am I"...... Sums it all. 1 Like |
Re: The Possibility Of Natural Intelligence. by DeepSight(m): 10:06pm On Nov 10, 2013 |
PhenomenonVFX: There is alot of dogmatic foolishness in the propagation of ill understood quantum concepts. Such as that with the arrantly f.oolish contention that virtual particles in a quantum vacuum are evidence that something may arise from nothing - even when it is proven fact that there is no perfect vacuum anywhere - and as such, no "nothing" in the first place. It is frankly amusing. Start - "what am I". |
Re: The Possibility Of Natural Intelligence. by wiegraf: 10:06pm On Nov 10, 2013 |
Joshthefirst: so machines arise from complex nothingness? Let's say simply, yes. Does not mean they necessarily came to be for a purpose. Joshthefirst: Again, we are machines. |
Re: The Possibility Of Natural Intelligence. by DeepSight(m): 10:15pm On Nov 10, 2013 |
wiegraf:. And this farfer neither knows what a machine is, nor understands the evident fact that if indeed, we are machines, that in itself will clobber his atheistic philosophy into dirt - by the very definition of what a machine is, as something built for function. And an efficient end. My word. These fellas truly ring clinically dumb. Well. As I said, cattle that you both are, you will be indulged. 2 Likes |
Re: The Possibility Of Natural Intelligence. by Joshthefirst(m): 10:18pm On Nov 10, 2013 |
wiegraf:okay, I assume you speak indirectly. A machine has no choice but to fulfill the intents of its maker? Or rather, the intent of a machine is the intent of its maker? What gives machines intent if not the machine makers? Do machines have freewill? Remember: A machine is a tool containing one or more parts that uses energy to perform an intended action. How can humans be machines and still have freewill, having their own intents and taking their own actions? Machines have makers do they not? And you cannot tell me that evolution is our maker, evolution itself does not have intent. Or does it? |
Re: The Possibility Of Natural Intelligence. by Nobody: 10:18pm On Nov 10, 2013 |
Deep Sight: So much stupidity. Later. I fail to see how feeling pain equates consciousness. Thinking, yes. Pain? No. Also nobody has told u computers think. What we have said is that in the future with advances in neuroscience and quantum computational power, it could be possible that computers become thoughtful. Could be. Probability. Somehow u seem to be conveniently omitting that in ur subsequent arguments. Now unless u want to define consciousness in ur own terms or u can prove that it is impossible to create computers capable of thought.......these argument boils down to DeepSight's personal beliefs vs. Science. I will take science anyday. Cheers. 2 Likes |
Re: The Possibility Of Natural Intelligence. by DeepSight(m): 10:25pm On Nov 10, 2013 |
PhenomenonVFX: Nonsense. I have yet to make any argument by the way. When I argue, you will know. That aside, by what ridiculous presumption do you equate the idea of possible conscious robots with science ?? ?? ?? ?? As is obvious, you know nothing of the science of the matter, and have made a most ridiculous leap in aligning science with the psuedo futuristic psuedo intellectual nonsensical notion of self conscious robots. |
Re: The Possibility Of Natural Intelligence. by DeepSight(m): 10:35pm On Nov 10, 2013 |
PhenomenonVFX: HONESTLY SOMEONE TELL ME WHY ANYONE SHOULD TAKE THIS CLOWNISH STATEMENT SERIOUSLY? ? ? |
Re: The Possibility Of Natural Intelligence. by DeepSight(m): 10:46pm On Nov 10, 2013 |
Joshthefirst: okay, The s.illy marijuana addict could not even see how the statement that humans are machines counters his atheism. |
Re: The Possibility Of Natural Intelligence. by Joshthefirst(m): 10:49pm On Nov 10, 2013 |
Deep Sight: Take it easy sir. That's what I asked him first. I'm still waiting for him to reply. |
Re: The Possibility Of Natural Intelligence. by DeepSight(m): 10:54pm On Nov 10, 2013 |
Joshthefirst: I wouldn't wait up, considering the deep and intense obtuseness on offer here. Those conscious robots would probably consider some of the reta.rded posters here, robots. And poorly engineered ones at that, good grief. 2 Likes |
Re: The Possibility Of Natural Intelligence. by Joshthefirst(m): 11:01pm On Nov 10, 2013 |
You sure say wiegraf never run commot? |
Re: The Possibility Of Natural Intelligence. by Kay17: 11:02pm On Nov 10, 2013 |
Joshthefirst: okay, An odd comment from a theist, considering your belief that God preconceived man as a vision prior to creating him for a purpose. Man is likened to a machine in that regard. |
Re: The Possibility Of Natural Intelligence. by DeepSight(m): 11:05pm On Nov 10, 2013 |
Joshthefirst: You sure say wiegraf never run commot? To be fair to him, he has never pretended to be interested in being taken seriously, the reverse of Plaetton, who advertises perverse ignorance and stupidity with endearing confidence. 1 Like |
Re: The Possibility Of Natural Intelligence. by Joshthefirst(m): 11:05pm On Nov 10, 2013 |
Kay 17:my belief is that God preconceived man for a purpose, yes. But God created man with freewill. Man has to choose to cooperate with God. I'm trying to show wiegraf that even from his basis(which even contradicts his atheist beliefs), man cannot be considered as a machine. Man is not a machine. |
Re: The Possibility Of Natural Intelligence. by DeepSight(m): 11:08pm On Nov 10, 2013 |
Kay 17: Which is why an atheist therefore calling man a machine amounts to conceding purpose and intent, snd therefore conceding the existence of God, however described. Whats going on here, are y'all rats, fraggles or something? I must be crazy, having an imaginary conversation with intoxicated rodents. . . |
Re: The Possibility Of Natural Intelligence. by Joshthefirst(m): 11:11pm On Nov 10, 2013 |
Deep Sight: Take it easy sir. Maybe its too much stout and pepper soup. |
Re: The Possibility Of Natural Intelligence. by DeepSight(m): 11:18pm On Nov 10, 2013 |
Joshthefirst: It just might be. Else there is no other explanation for the piffle on offer here. Someone says he cannot see how the experiencee of pain shows consciousness. Another person says that drugs induce emotions in people and as such emotions may be induced in a robot. Ah. I accept. They didn't actually say these blasphemous and scandalously d.aft things. It is rather the case, that I am drunk, and imagining these statements only. |
Re: The Possibility Of Natural Intelligence. by wiegraf: 11:25pm On Nov 10, 2013 |
Joshthefirst: okay, A machine has no choice but to fulfill its programming. I never said we have freewill. We don't. Nature's haphazard programming is responsible for you, evidence everywhere, see evolution. Exactly why should I discard it? btw, following your beliefs the intent is clear; do god's will, no? So exactly how aren't humans machines? |
Re: The Possibility Of Natural Intelligence. by Nobody: 11:27pm On Nov 10, 2013 |
DeepSight go home u are drunk. U are just throwing tantrums around like a child and yet to say anything meaningful. When u sober up, explain how pain is a sign of consciousness. And tell me what happens if a conscious animal loses its ability to feel pain. Does it lose its consciousness thus? And yes transfering consciousness to robots is not pseudo scientific ramble. It has bases in sound science and has been supported by higher humans than u. You are yet to refute any claims made here soundly. Please do so. Note: when u reply me, talk. Dont just ramble with childish petulance. 2 Likes |
Re: The Possibility Of Natural Intelligence. by wiegraf: 11:30pm On Nov 10, 2013 |
Deep Sight: . Wait first, lemme get my umbrella up first...Ok Ah, but there really isn't anything here to reply to. Humans are tools, built to handle a function, I agree (somewhat, though it's simplifying). Problem, where? No one said the programmer had to be conscious, no? And it obviously isn't |
Re: The Possibility Of Natural Intelligence. by wiegraf: 11:31pm On Nov 10, 2013 |
Joshthefirst: You sure say wiegraf never run commot? Are you drunk as well? |
Re: The Possibility Of Natural Intelligence. by Joshthefirst(m): 11:32pm On Nov 10, 2013 |
wiegraf:smh. So does nature(or evolution) have intent or not? So you aren't an atheist then? Since you believe that nature is the creator and God? And, following the bible, Gods intent for creating man is to do His will. But man shows his freewill by either choosing or refusing to do Gods will. |
Re: The Possibility Of Natural Intelligence. by Joshthefirst(m): 11:34pm On Nov 10, 2013 |
wiegraf:who built humans wiegraf. I always thought you were an atheist. I didn't know you were just agnostic. |
Re: The Possibility Of Natural Intelligence. by wiegraf: 11:35pm On Nov 10, 2013 |
PhenomenonVFX: DeepSight go home u are drunk. All those non-sentient species that feel pain don't seem to exist... Or folk born without the ability to feel pain.. He just makes flowery statements like that because they make him appear deep to sheeple, they don't necessarily make sense. 3 Likes |
Re: The Possibility Of Natural Intelligence. by DeepSight(m): 11:36pm On Nov 10, 2013 |
PhenomenonVFX: DeepSight go home u are drunk. Such s.illiness. of course the sensation of pain is a sure component of consciousness even when the loss of the sensation surely does not connote loss of consciousness. This is so elementary, it is the reason new born bsbies are pinched to cry. Drunk, I am, no doubt. We shall see on the morrow, and do present yourself for the duel. Do not shrink, for I shall be there.... waiting. ... conscious.... and even self conscious. ... |
Re: The Possibility Of Natural Intelligence. by wiegraf: 11:38pm On Nov 10, 2013 |
Joshthefirst: smh. Nature does not have a conscious intent. Blindly doing its thing through time. The bolded is correct. Who said anything about god?? So according to your bible man uses energy to attain a goal. Exactly what is a machine again? |
Re: The Possibility Of Natural Intelligence. by wiegraf: 11:41pm On Nov 10, 2013 |
Joshthefirst: who built humans wiegraf. I always thought you were an atheist. I didn't know you were just agnostic. Who says I'm agnostic? Don't use that dirty word to describe me. I've already told you who "built" humans. 1 Like |
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