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Siena's MK5 Toyota Hilux Customisation Project - "Apple Candy". - Car Talk (7) - Nairaland

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Re: Siena's MK5 Toyota Hilux Customisation Project - "Apple Candy". by GAZZUZZ(m): 2:48pm On Jul 20, 2014
Siena: I am considering junking the stock steering box in my 2003 MK5 Single Cabin 4x4, in favour of a steering rack.
And yes, I'm aware this won't be a bolt-in solution, and will most certainly require welding mounting tabs onto the frame, and locating allowing the track rod ends to reach the steering knuckles on the hubs. And still clearing other obstacles.
I would be using a manual steering rack, using an electronically-assisted steering column from a 2013 Toyota Prius (which I already have).
Whilst the steering box works well enough, it lacks the directness of a rack and pinion set-up. I drove a 1999 Tacoma, which is as close to the KDN165 Hilux as you could get, and the difference between the Taco and any MK5 is like night and day.
The MK6 isn't really directly comparable, as it's a much larger and heavier truck.
I think a rack would transform the handling of a MK5.


Wow! I need to see this. Weldone siena
Re: Siena's MK5 Toyota Hilux Customisation Project - "Apple Candy". by Nobody: 4:45pm On Jul 20, 2014
GAZZUZZ: Wow! I need to see this. Weldone siena

Thanks bruh.
Re: Siena's MK5 Toyota Hilux Customisation Project - "Apple Candy". by Nobody: 5:04pm On Jul 20, 2014
There are 2 ways I can run the Toyota Prius EMPS in the Hilux.

1) Directly. So with just an interrupter switch, and ignition feed to the motorised column, which will default to ASSISTED each time the truck is started. The interrupter switch can then be used to turn ASSISTANCE off whilst on the move

2) Automatic (ECU controlled). This will mean using the Toyota Prius EMPS ECU. The ECU receives data from a myriad of sources, and varies steering ASSISTANCE accordingly.

Road speed (via ABS sensors / VSS.
Engine rpm
Engine load.
Brake pedal switch.
Alternator charge rate.
Steering angle.

With the above, the ASSISTANCE is calculated, and pretty much right for whatever conditions the vehicle is driven in. There is also a K-line feed, so the EMPS system can be interrogated via the OBD port.

The system sounds complex, but it really isn't, as long as a basic understanding of how it works exists. I also have the privilege of having access to Techdoc, with it's wealth of information and EWD's (Electric Wiring Diagrams).

With all this in mind, I've decided to go with option 2, so fully ECU-controlled. The assisted column is the most expensive part, the ECU is way cheaper to buy.
Re: Siena's MK5 Toyota Hilux Customisation Project - "Apple Candy". by GAZZUZZ(m): 5:32pm On Jul 20, 2014
The EMPS module is it powered by regular 12-14volts dc?
Re: Siena's MK5 Toyota Hilux Customisation Project - "Apple Candy". by Nobody: 5:48pm On Jul 20, 2014
GAZZUZZ: The EMPS module is it powered by regular 12-14volts dc?

Yes, it is. No HV feed here!
Re: Siena's MK5 Toyota Hilux Customisation Project - "Apple Candy". by uboma(m): 9:07am On Jul 21, 2014
Siena: Thanks, Uboma.

You are welcome Sir

Don't forget the thread of how to wash car engines that you promised us the other day...
Re: Siena's MK5 Toyota Hilux Customisation Project - "Apple Candy". by Nobody: 9:13pm On Jul 21, 2014
uboma:

You are welcome Sir

Don't forget the thread of how to wash car engines that you promised us the other day...

Will do, bro.
Re: Siena's MK5 Toyota Hilux Customisation Project - "Apple Candy". by Nobody: 9:14pm On Jul 21, 2014
Update!

I was able to drop into the bodyshop during a sneaky test drive, to see what progress had been made since lifting the bed on Saturday.

I was pleased to see the bed upside down, being cleaned. Very little surface rust at the rear, just behind the valence (license plate area). It came off easily with a rotary brush, the rest of the bed just had dried mud, especially between the outer skins.

A power wash was all that was needed, and the whole lot dried with compressed air, before going into the oven for 25 minutes. It is essential that no trapped moisture is over looked, as it was being under sealed. Sealing in water droplets, well the Red Terror would make an early comeback.

The chassis was also cleaned, I was pleased to run my hands over the surfaces, and find it smooth. I did say I did NOT want any underseal on the frame and underneath the bed, UNTIL I had inspected the preparation, and was happy with the finish. The frame was actually silver in places, it was that clean.

My second visit was after work. The frame was being under sealed, as was the bed. The bed was completed whilst I was there, the frame needs a bit more, especially the front underside.

I will upload pictures shortly, really pleased with progress.
Re: Siena's MK5 Toyota Hilux Customisation Project - "Apple Candy". by Nobody: 9:46pm On Jul 21, 2014
I set up my camera to take some nice high-resolution pictures, only to realise I'd left the SD card at home, in my PC. Doh! Back-up in the form of my iPhone.

Pictures of the bed, in progress, and completed:


[url="http://s768.photobucket.com/user/NaijaGuy/media/Project%20Toyota%20Hilux/imagejpg1_zps60ac1f89.jpg.html"][/url]

[url="http://s768.photobucket.com/user/NaijaGuy/media/Project%20Toyota%20Hilux/imagejpg4_zpse7d52041.jpg.html"][/url]

[url="http://s768.photobucket.com/user/NaijaGuy/media/Project%20Toyota%20Hilux/imagejpg7_zpsffb4b4d3.jpg.html"][/url]

[url="http://s768.photobucket.com/user/NaijaGuy/media/Project%20Toyota%20Hilux/imagejpg8_zpsc18162e9.jpg.html"][/url]

[url="http://s768.photobucket.com/user/NaijaGuy/media/Project%20Toyota%20Hilux/imagejpg14_zpsa25feb4f.jpg.html"][/url]

[url="http://s768.photobucket.com/user/NaijaGuy/media/Project%20Toyota%20Hilux/imagejpg13_zps97232ea1.jpg.html"][/url]

[url="http://s768.photobucket.com/user/NaijaGuy/media/Project%20Toyota%20Hilux/imagejpg16_zps23a43a86.jpg.html"][/url]

[url="http://s768.photobucket.com/user/NaijaGuy/media/Project%20Toyota%20Hilux/imagejpg15_zpsedfc1662.jpg.html"][/url]

[url="http://s768.photobucket.com/user/NaijaGuy/media/Project%20Toyota%20Hilux/imagejpg18_zps11c52c2e.jpg.html"][/url]

[url="http://s768.photobucket.com/user/NaijaGuy/media/Project%20Toyota%20Hilux/imagejpg24_zpsb1056c0a.jpg.html"][/url]

[url="http://s768.photobucket.com/user/NaijaGuy/media/Project%20Toyota%20Hilux/imagejpg25_zps066b62ba.jpg.html"][/url]

[url="http://s768.photobucket.com/user/NaijaGuy/media/Project%20Toyota%20Hilux/imagejpg26_zps2e138ffd.jpg.html"][/url]
Re: Siena's MK5 Toyota Hilux Customisation Project - "Apple Candy". by Nobody: 9:58pm On Jul 21, 2014
The cab and frame, looking like a mini tractor-unit. The rear section of the frame has been started, though not completed. The front section is also yet to be under sealed. The shop ran out of 3M underseal, more will be delivered tomorrow. The bed and the rear section of the bed has taken 5 large cans!

[url="http://s768.photobucket.com/user/NaijaGuy/media/Project%20Toyota%20Hilux/imagejpg23_zpsf1d445ad.jpg.html"][/url]

[url="http://s768.photobucket.com/user/NaijaGuy/media/Project%20Toyota%20Hilux/imagejpg21_zps60f8b49e.jpg.html"][/url]

[url="http://s768.photobucket.com/user/NaijaGuy/media/Project%20Toyota%20Hilux/imagejpg20_zps8897b26c.jpg.html"][/url]

[url="http://s768.photobucket.com/user/NaijaGuy/media/Project%20Toyota%20Hilux/imagejpg22_zpsf9429ad8.jpg.html"][/url]

[url="http://s768.photobucket.com/user/NaijaGuy/media/Project%20Toyota%20Hilux/imagejpg22_zpsf9429ad8.jpg.html"][/url]

[url="http://s768.photobucket.com/user/NaijaGuy/media/Project%20Toyota%20Hilux/imagejpg22_zpsf9429ad8.jpg.html"][/url]

[url="http://s768.photobucket.com/user/NaijaGuy/media/Project%20Toyota%20Hilux/imagejpg11_zps5be534e4.jpg.html"][/url]

[url="http://s768.photobucket.com/user/NaijaGuy/media/Project%20Toyota%20Hilux/imagejpg12_zps6c17fb6d.jpg.html"][/url]

[url="http://s768.photobucket.com/user/NaijaGuy/media/Project%20Toyota%20Hilux/imagejpg10_zps7cc4dde4.jpg.html"][/url]

[url="http://s768.photobucket.com/user/NaijaGuy/media/Project%20Toyota%20Hilux/imagejpg9_zpsc72a0c39.jpg.html"][/url]
Re: Siena's MK5 Toyota Hilux Customisation Project - "Apple Candy". by Nobody: 10:24pm On Jul 21, 2014
As I posted earlier, my rear differential e-locker wiring harness was all busted. I priced up a replacement at work today. At £63, it wasn't worth attempting to salvage the old one. It can certainly be soldered and heat-shrunk, but I opted for a new one.

I ordered a new harness, and replacement differential breather valve, again at £8, not worth trying to free up the old one. The new parts will be with me by Wednesday.
Re: Siena's MK5 Toyota Hilux Customisation Project - "Apple Candy". by DECOtech(m): 2:10am On Jul 22, 2014
Re: Siena's MK5 Toyota Hilux Customisation Project - "Apple Candy". by Gadgetmobil(m): 11:36am On Jul 22, 2014
Hello Siena,
Pls forgive me.
I need a personal advise.
I have a brother intending to buy some trucks from Europe for bizness but he was told that the ones from Germany would be expensive and it would be preferable for him to buy from the UK.
He really needs an advice as he'd be leaving for the UK soon for the purchase.
I'd really appreciate if we could talk indepthly, please do mail me(am sorry I would have done the mailing but I dont have your mail sir) gadgetmobil@gmail.com.

Keep up your good work.
Peace
Re: Siena's MK5 Toyota Hilux Customisation Project - "Apple Candy". by Nobody: 9:07pm On Jul 22, 2014
Gadgetmobil: Hello Siena,
Pls forgive me.
I need a personal advise.
I have a brother intending to buy some trucks from Europe for bizness but he was told that the ones from Germany would be expensive and it would be preferable for him to buy from the UK.
He really needs an advice as he'd be leaving for the UK soon for the purchase.
I'd really appreciate if we could talk indepthly, please do mail me(am sorry I would have done the mailing but I dont have your mail sir) gadgetmobil@gmail.com.

Keep up your good work.
Peace

No worries, bro. I'll email you details.
Re: Siena's MK5 Toyota Hilux Customisation Project - "Apple Candy". by Nobody: 9:08pm On Jul 22, 2014
Mini update!

I dropped into the bodyshop after work, to see what progress was being made.

The filling and sanding has begun. The roof has been filled, in the areas where steel was welded into to rain channels, and the hole in the middle of the roof, left after I removed the amber beacon. I was impressed with the finish, despite it being pretty much work in progress.

I am fussy when it comes to bodywork, and so I should be - good bodyshops don't come cheap. I brought a flat rule with me from work, and a set of metric feeler gauges. I found a couple of tiny dips, and circled them. They will be attended to, and I will be checking each stage, until I'm satisfied.

I am getting an auto screen outfit to cut out the front screen. There are a couple of tiny chips at the base, nearside. So I might as well get a replacement. I am using the same guys that supplied me with a heated rear screen.

I didn't take any pictures today, as I didn't feel a sanded roof would be of interest.

I did visit the fabricator of the lid though. Due to the length, I feel there will be a bit of movement, even when locked, due to flexing of the bed. I instructed my guy to weld in a couple of tapered locating pegs at the rear, either side of the tailgate, so on the bed section. I will have corresponding holes drilled into the bed, the exposed steel painted with the rest of the bed. Then blind grommets inserted to accept the pegs. The pegs are 15mm long.

Hopefully, more progress tomorrow.
Re: Siena's MK5 Toyota Hilux Customisation Project - "Apple Candy". by tdie: 5:16pm On Jul 23, 2014
Lovely lovely project...! Makes me feel like starting on another project asap. :-). Unfortunately my 1968 Merc 200 restoration plans have fallen through-owners refused to sell at a reasonable price! :-(
Currently considering my other options...
What colour are you going for at the end?
Re: Siena's MK5 Toyota Hilux Customisation Project - "Apple Candy". by Nobody: 11:32pm On Jul 23, 2014
I got a call back from the windscreen outfit just after getting to work this morning. They confirmed they were able to cut the front screen out, and was I happy for them to replace it, once the truck had been painted?

For the sum of £150.

I originally planned to go through my insurance, as I have glass cover. Unfortunately, Autoglass (or who ever my insurance company use) will NOT cut out a screen, and fit a replacement at a different time. They will only cut out, and fit a new replacement at the same time.

I decided to go with the outfit that had gotten back to me. And when I visited the bodyshop after work, I discovered the glass guys had been and gone. The front screen had been neatly removed.

Rewinding to 08:46 at work, my replacement rear differential e-locker harness and axle breather arrived, and at home, my tailgate handle was delivered.

At this point, I'm not sure it I'm retaining an external handle, or having the handle recess welded flush, relying solely on automation to release the tailgate.

With filling and sanding starting, I don't have much time to decide.
Re: Siena's MK5 Toyota Hilux Customisation Project - "Apple Candy". by Nobody: 11:34pm On Jul 23, 2014
tdie: Lovely lovely project...! Makes me feel like starting on another project asap. :-). Unfortunately my 1968 Merc 200 restoration plans have fallen through-owners refused to sell at a reasonable price! :-(
Currently considering my other options...
What colour are you going for at the end?

Thanks, Tdie.

Colour? I'm going with a bold Kawasaki colour. wink
Re: Siena's MK5 Toyota Hilux Customisation Project - "Apple Candy". by Shagati(m): 12:23am On Jul 24, 2014
Siena:
Thanks, Tdie.
Colour? I'm going with a bold Kawasaki colour. wink
Hmmmmm!
You forget I'm following this thread? lipsrsealed

Re: Siena's MK5 Toyota Hilux Customisation Project - "Apple Candy". by Cruisez: 9:54am On Jul 24, 2014
I need to reach you via email Siena to discuss conversion from RHD to LHD in UK. How can i reach you. Lovely project, am following.
Re: Siena's MK5 Toyota Hilux Customisation Project - "Apple Candy". by Nobody: 2:30pm On Jul 24, 2014
Cruisez: I need to reach you via email Siena to discuss conversion from RHD to LHD in UK. How can i reach you. Lovely project, am following.

aqua4172@gmail.com
Re: Siena's MK5 Toyota Hilux Customisation Project - "Apple Candy". by Nobody: 7:57am On Jul 25, 2014
Siena, educate me on two things.

1) Is there some sort of feedback that the ECU will need to see regarding forces acting on the wheels? Example in of road condition (which the Prius would never have seen) would it need to know that you are pushed up against a boulder as an example so that it can continue, increase or decrease the necessary PSI of assistance?

2) Is there a design weight limit inherently designed into these systems? For example a mate has used the system from the MR2 on another kit car of the same weight limit. I am wondering if the system designed for the Prius will be able to take on the level of weight in the truck? I supposed I need to look up the weight difference as the Prius may be a bit of a porky pig with all her electronic doo dahs and batteries.

Good work Bro.
Re: Siena's MK5 Toyota Hilux Customisation Project - "Apple Candy". by Cruisez: 9:58am On Jul 25, 2014
Siena:
aqua4172@gmail.com

Email sent.
Re: Siena's MK5 Toyota Hilux Customisation Project - "Apple Candy". by Nobody: 8:02pm On Jul 25, 2014
CityNG: Siena, educate me on two things.

1) Is there some sort of feedback that the ECU will need to see regarding forces acting on the wheels? Example in of road condition (which the Prius would never have seen) would it need to know that you are pushed up against a boulder as an example so that it can continue, increase or decrease the necessary PSI of assistance?

2) Is there a design weight limit inherently designed into these systems? For example a mate has used the system from the MR2 on another kit car of the same weight limit. I am wondering if the system designed for the Prius will be able to take on the level of weight in the truck? I supposed I need to look up the weight difference as the Prius may be a bit of a porky pig with all her electronic doo dahs and batteries.

Good work Bro.

Thanks bro! smiley

With regards to the EPS from the 3rd gen. Prius, you're right. It's a heavy car - the HV battery weighs a hefty 43 kilos, the inverter 21 kilos, and the CVT transaxle, with both electric motors a massive 117 kilos! The regenerative braking system is an extra 16 kilos.

All adding up to a car that weighs almost as much as the 2013 Toyota Avensis 2.0 D-4D, and more than the 2001 Toyota Camry V6!

I too was concerned about the torque assistance being able to cope with the weight of the Hilux, but looking at the EPS on a 2012 Toyota Outlander, the motors are the same, down to the part numbers. The only difference is the upper column itself. The Outlander is a fair bit heavier than the Hilux, that's for sure.

The torque assistance is active when the system senses rotary forces acting on the column, it won't push a wheel against a boulder or kerb. The only force in such instances will be that exerted by the operator. In this case, there will be a reduction in torque assistance. The steering angle sensor is built into the column too.

1 Like

Re: Siena's MK5 Toyota Hilux Customisation Project - "Apple Candy". by Nobody: 4:37pm On Jul 27, 2014
One thing I have not come to terms with, (and probably never will) is the rear suspension on on the Toyota Hilux.

Like most light pick-up trucks, it runs a live rear axle, suspended and located by leaf springs. Whilst this set-up is great when it comes to load-lugging, it limits the handling capabilities on tarmac. Not an issue with the stock 2.5 D-4D DOHC 16V, with it's 102 hp output. But if the ultimate goal is more power, in my case from a breathed-upon Lexus 4.3 V8 2xDOHC 32V, then the rear suspension will certainly limit my exploiting the extra performance.

I believe leaf springs belong on a cart. And indeed, that's where they originated from. Cart horses (pulled by Donkeys) had their axles suspended on leaf springs.

I have decided to go with a 4-link rear suspension, with adjustable coil overs. This dispenses with the leaf springs. The axle is then located by trailing arms at the front, and anti-wrap bars at the rear. Side to side movement is controlled by a Panhard bar, which is a bar located on one side of the chassis, the other end on the axle beam.

Since I have come to this decision late in the build process, very few, if any fabricators would be willing to do the job. Grinding and welding whilst surrounded by fresh paint is not any fabricator's dream.

So, I will be doing the work myself, while the bed is off the chassis. I will make mock-ups of the locating shackles / brackets on the axle and frame, for the trailing arms, anti-wrap bars and Panhard bar. These will be made out of wood, then all I will have to do is give the wooden models to my guy to make out of 3mm steel.

I will also be showing some love to the front end, losing the torsion spring set-up, and having adjustable coil-overs here too.

I will post pictures of this process, since it is not easy to understand, unless you're versed in suspension set-ups.
Re: Siena's MK5 Toyota Hilux Customisation Project - "Apple Candy". by Nobody: 8:02pm On Jul 27, 2014
The old rear differential e-locker harness. It's actually broken in two ares, and the same wires, all parted company. I don't think it's even worth trying to fix, as it's gotten so stiff and brittle:

[url="http://s768.photobucket.com/user/NaijaGuy/media/Project%20Toyota%20Hilux/imagejpg2_zpsd712f637.jpg.html"][/url]

And the nice, new flexible replacement. Worth every bit of the £63 it cost me:

[url="http://s768.photobucket.com/user/NaijaGuy/media/Project%20Toyota%20Hilux/imagejpg1_zpseb8e4087.jpg.html"][/url]

OEM replacement rear axle breather - I may relocate it with stainless steel braided line, the jury's still out on that one:

[url="http://s768.photobucket.com/user/NaijaGuy/media/Project%20Toyota%20Hilux/imagejpg3_zps21ebeb04.jpg.html"][/url]

I got a replacement tailgate handle, the chrome-look version as fitted to MK5 VX / Invincible. It carries the same part number as that fitted to the MK6, if the chrome package is specified:

[url="http://s768.photobucket.com/user/NaijaGuy/media/Project%20Toyota%20Hilux/imagejpg4_zpseede910d.jpg.html"][/url]
Re: Siena's MK5 Toyota Hilux Customisation Project - "Apple Candy". by proo212(m): 9:16am On Jul 28, 2014
One thing I have not come to terms with, (and probably never will) is the rear suspension on on the Toyota Hilux.

Like most light pick-up trucks, it runs a live rear axle, suspended and located by leaf springs. Whilst this set-up is great when it comes to load-lugging, it limits the handling capabilities on tarmac. Not an issue with the stock 2.5 D-4D DOHC 16V, with it's 102 hp output. But if the ultimate goal is more power, in my case from a breathed-upon Lexus 4.3 V8 2xDOHC 32V, then the rear suspension will certainly limit my exploiting the extra performance.

I believe leaf springs belong on a cart. And indeed, that's where they originated from. Cart horses (pulled by Donkeys) had their axles suspended on leaf springs.

I have decided to go with a 4-link rear suspension, with adjustable coil overs. This dispenses with the leaf springs. The axle is then located by trailing arms at the front, and anti-wrap bars at the rear. Side to side movement is controlled by a Panhard bar, which is a bar located on one side of the chassis, the other end on the axle beam.

Since I have come to this decision late in the build process, very few, if any fabricators would be willing to do the job. Grinding and welding whilst surrounded by fresh paint is not any fabricator's dream.

So, I will be doing the work myself, while the bed is off the chassis. I will make mock-ups of the locating shackles / brackets on the axle and frame, for the trailing arms, anti-wrap bars and Panhard bar. These will be made out of wood, then all I will have to do is give the wooden models to my guy to make out of 3mm steel.

I will also be showing some love to the front end, losing the torsion spring set-up, and having adjustable coil-overs here too.

I will post pictures of this process, since it is not easy to understand, unless you're versed in suspension set-ups.

Wow! I cant wait to see how this will look and handle as its essentially an attachment to a "ladder frame" My first car (isuzu Piazza Turbo) had a live rear axle and apart from the looks (to me back then) it was a terrible car to drive. Got a second one (handling by Lotus) and it wasnt much improved. My 205 GTi 1.6 that I had in-between was much more fun to the 10th power
Re: Siena's MK5 Toyota Hilux Customisation Project - "Apple Candy". by Chizzybenjamin(m): 9:54pm On Jul 29, 2014
Siena:

No worries, bro. I'll email you details.
Thanks a lot Sir.
I still await your mail all the same.
Thanks


apologies am also Gadgetmobil, so the mail is still the same
Re: Siena's MK5 Toyota Hilux Customisation Project - "Apple Candy". by taokhif: 9:58am On Jul 31, 2014
Contact me if u have Toyota Hilux (4 doors). 08130049822 is my number. U can add me on whatsapp

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