ladionline: There is an unrelenting efforts by some of us to redefine Yoruba history by our new found penchant for biology and 'oyinbo-precepts.' Some hunt down every salient point that is at variant with their sense of perception. Advance Biology has left the classroom for nairaland these days. Yoruba precept is valid for Yoruba history, we don't need Darwin. What is Yoruba precept of origin? It is the paspective of Yoruba on their origin in pristin form, not when it has mixed up with any revisionists or 'politico' AGENDA. How do we go? Linguistic records please. Keep your fossils for now. The Yoruba for their earliest time is 'nigba lai-lai': what does this mean? Then, Laye ati-jo, L'aye-igba-ani, and 'Nigba iwa se.' We can make up whatever opinion that cross our mind as history, but the facts embeded in Yoruba language elude the ambitious. Of course, only a fool concorts: he has nothing to lose nor gain, but wise folks will instruct many. The word nigba iwa se is the traditional intro to Yoruba history.

MetaPhysical:

Ladi, I agree with you, you are on point!

Lets start from when IWA was founded or manifested.

Some say Oduduwa was Odu to da IWA. So then what is IWA?

Im open to learn from you Yoruba linguists and scholars out here.

shymexx: Yoruba history will never be complete without archaeological evidence(s) of the migration waves of the people, from their original habitats, to present day Nigeria.

ladionline: If you are to enjoy this thread, learn to live macos alone to keep spreading his confusions. He seems intellectually challenged the way he goes about peddling crazy, mundane and repetitive history. He has a new one on how Yoruba ancestors evolve from ape-like creature. What an aberation in the name of freedom of speech. He has red rag, 'Oduduwa', 'ile-ife', God. Mention any of such or worst 'Yoruba', then he will turn out, to twist you out of tune. He is incapable of his own ideas. Yet he wanted to arrogate 'Yoruba authority' to himself. He left blank comment above because he scan through for his red-rag but there is nothing to twist. I'm avoiding his red rag. His logic often make me sick

macof:

I have my views u have urs

I still haven't seen anything to convince me dat Ife is not Yoruba origin.

And are u saying evolution is false?.or at least not like Darwin stated?

ladionline:



Well macof, my problem is that you need to be patient and not to assume the status of an all knowing sage. If you do that, we would have no peace. You love Darwin and you don't tolerate other views. I don't believe Yoruba ancestors originated at Ile Ife, simple. Yoruba ancestors are not subjective to Ife, Ife is subjective to Yoruba ancestors.

I don't buy into the "me-too" traditions that people parrot about as History, Yoruba land exist before the ancestors came to discover it, yes, they choose Ife to be capital, agreed, but they build many other places even before a choice of capital. We even have Idofe (ife camp) and Olofe, (people that went to Ife) in my community, so why should I make my community compulsorily come from Ife to be in accord with Yoruba?

A lot of places came to be at the same time as Ife, and this places were established by the Yoruba empire builders that establish Ile Ife. Oduduwa visit and dedicated such places, and they may not even be relevant today in Yoruba history. The founders of Yoruba were explorers, okay?

Charles Darwin

I am saying I know more than Charles Darwin. I am living in the christian consciousness of being more than "conquerors of God" for instance. Knowledge is dynamic. Some future scientific discovery still elude us that may stupefy evolution, live in such consciousness and be careful of building your superstructure on contentious theories.

Not only that evolution is wrong, I know more than Charles Darwin as to my ancestors, so i know what he does not know as to the black man and a group of Africans. I am not being inspired by evolution for traditional stories that requires simple traditional approach, or competing for his theory. I am not a paleontologist or Darwinian, i am a traditionalist or creationist like my ancestors before me.

I do not need to depend on Evolution that Darwin used to answer Compte De Gobineau on his own theory of Aryan nation that he became celebrated for, for my own ancestors or for my ancient family roots. I don't see Yoruba history as a mimic for Saxon and Normans or William Norman conquer Saxony, and so, Oduduwa conquered aborigines of Ife. But I don't stop you from that.

My perspectives can be impossible for you to swallow, but for me, knowledge beats knowledge over time, find your own knowledge and take pride in it, why must you stick to the past? Why waste time interpreting Yoruba history from Charles Darwin theory? If you continue on such tempo, you will end up with "the descent of Yoruba", which is similar to Charles Darwin's descent of man. Please be unique.


Meanwhile, I don't go about reading books to sound academical, and come back to be ascetic to traditional, fixed oral data as myth, no, I am to ferret fact from sophisticated Yoruba traditions like these, which can only help me to become sophisticated too. I am talking about Yoruba tradition and sifting valuable precept from their cryptic givings, and not my own ideas, so I can use this to order my steps in view of my ancestry.

I do not expect you to believe me, I am to be believed in the distance future.
Perhaps by our children, but you can be believed now.

macof: ^^^I don't assume I know all, No one can know all.

And Darwin's Theory of Evolution can be flawed but it is definitely the most logical of reasoning.
You think When I talk about Evolution from ape-like ancestors I mean Monkeys or Orangutans?

Humans aka Homo sapiens are primates like Apes

And the human mentality has changed over the centuries. We were more ape than human 10,000yrs ago.

To claim u know more than Darwin is to be hypocritical because u accuse me of claiming I know all.

Wat explanation have you to human existence? And u talk about knowing more than Darwin.

You are the one claiming to know all here and not me.

You debunk everybody's posts but don't have anything to offer.

macof: I am not trying to spread confusion.

I have studied Yoruba origin to an extent that all I see are assumptions and false claims based on sentiments and hidden agenda

I am not atheist, I am a fan of science and practice Yoruba spirituality.

So if u have a problem with evolution you simply say it, you are very controversial individual and you hold no important points in Yoruba history, all u do is post to hail or condemn u have nothing to offer.

I'll keep following the thread and see wat u have, but of course as usually it's jst silliness and Itk mentality u have shown so far

ladionline: Oh my macof, bravo! You have just stated the very obvious about me. That's what Ido, so much like you! However, I don't change my standards quite often: I don't claim atheism today and deny it tomorrow. And i don't have your kind of free spirit, to choose whatever I'm confortable with, it might be stale, but it is what my data provides that I use. Thanks for your time

macof:

Where have I ever claimed atheism? assumptions again like usually.

I do wat ever I am comfortable with but when it comes to uncertain history u don't base on assumptions.

there's no evidence of any outside Ile-Ife origin...

ladionline:

Dear readers, kindly click on 'ladionline' or 'macof', then go through our posts and encounters so far. Thanks.

Hello macof, everyone have an angle. You just said 'uncertain history' up there, how do you become an 'authority on uncertainty'? Can there be anything like that? You said it, "I do whatever I am comfortable with" You have a comfort - zone.

You are restricted to 'material resource' which are often 'processed information' that is not truly free of 'Terms and Conditions' applied. Meanwhile, as there are material resources, there are also 'extra-material' resources too. If you realize this, it would make a difference. Your imaginations definitely becomes fertile as you keep update.

macof: ^^^ Still has nothing to offer

macof:

Where have I ever claimed atheism? assumptions again like usually.

I do wat ever I am comfortable with but when it comes to uncertain history u don't base on assumptions.

there's no evidence of any outside Ile-Ife origin, even the Ijebu who have their latest mass migration from waddai were exposed to Ile-Ife culture on their rest there before joining other aborigines and mixing together in present day Ijebu.

MetaPhysical:

How is Ijebu not part of Ife but yet are sandwiched between people with origins in Ife?.

Can anyone please trace their path between Chad and Ijebuland. If they had no foothold in Imperial Ife then what are they doing in the interior of Yorubaland?