TV01:
A man must be bold –often times that is the only difference between who gets the girl. As they say; “faint heart never won fair lady”. Take charge “C”, act “A”, and take responsibility “R”. Drive the situation, don’t let it drive you. If you see someone who looks right; approach. Directly or indirectly. Act within context, tactically or situationally as required.

For example, if you both serve on the ushering team at church, then theres no rush, keep it personable and polite, but don’t rush in. You have time. If it’s at the airport and you are taking different flights, you need to get your charm – not jazz 0! – on, and work at sprint pace. The aim is to get to know her and make that initial assessment. CAR is particularly important for men. Not least because women respond to decisiviness in men. And it’s something you’ll need to carry with you into marriage.

You may come across the type of women that will try and make things happen by “sheer force of will”. You’ll tick all or most of their boxes – regardless of what they have to offer – they’ll decide they want you, and then expect things to proceed apace. If things don’t, they try and force it, usually by applying subtle or not so subtle pressure. Comments such as “you don’t know what you want”, “my friend/cousin/sister is saying”, or my personal favourite “other guys are asking me out” . Other times they show palpable frustration and may act up. In all, my view is that these are warning signs. Please take heed.

As a Christian, the one firm stance I had was NSBM. It worked wonders. Many women use sex to control a relationship. Once devoid of this tool, many are simply left exposed as lacking any depth or real quality. I seen others where the woman will give sex, then withdraw it to speed things up or otherwise manipulate the man. Beware.

The same with food – I have seen women use food shopping/cooking/provision seal a deal in lieu of other major qualities. One I witnessed, shopped at the weekend, hauled everything back to his, cooked for the week and stored as appropriate. Learn to be self-sufficient. No household task should be beyond you – even if once married you don’t have primary responsibility for it. Don’t be swayed by what is a at best a good quality - which can in any event be learned - over essential characteristics.

So back to CAR. If you have marriage in mind, and feel at any point that she is not the Ankara, lace, damask that you are looking for promptly replace as found. Don’t prolong it, try and force it or turn a blind eye to it. Move on, the quest goes on. It’s best for you and particularly her if she is feeling you. Don’t lead a woman on or let her build up false hopes/expectations. If she’s cunning, giving her time will enable her to get her hooks into you. Potentially belle if you are not practising NSBM.

tbc

TV

Sex and food, two of the very limited things women can use to manipulate men...

Just like you can press attraction buttons, you can press repulse buttons.

Indecisiveness, inarticulacy, too much hesitancy, seeking re-assurance or validation from a woman are all no-no’s. As are anything other than very limited instances of humorous self-depracation. Don’t boast, but don’t talk yourself down.

Don’t allow her to belittle or denigrate you – be emphatic in correcting this. Don’t cede power to her by default or too frequent fumbles. You can show a soft side, but do not mistake it for weakness – they love the on and hate the other. Please don’t confuse the two.

Re-affirm you status without bragging. If you accomplish or achieve something new, don’t be afraid to say or show. Don’t engender a long-term loss in status by promising/proclaiming and then not delivering – especially on your personal progress. This can seriously undermine her respect for you

A guy and girl are talking, it doesn’t flow. He; it wasn’t a great convo, She; he’s dry. End convos if you have nothing to say, don’t let feelings make you linger for no good reason.

So, take a woman out and tell here where you are going. Simple. It may seem “equalist to take her to the strip or ask her to choose a restaurant or negotiate where you will go. But she’s likely thinking indecisive, he’s making me think too much instead of relax and enjoy etc. Not to say you can’t ask at times or give options (limit them to 2 sha!). Whatever thier ideological leanings - they typically respond to the same cues.

Don’t forget, women are constantly revaluing, comparing and re-positioning. If your status should change, it will have an impact, if hers does likewise. It’s easy for men to get comfortable once they have sealed the deal. Women on the other hand are always perusing the terms and conditions.

If she isn’t heavily socialised to value commitment, fidelity etc. negative changes can have serious consequences. Even if she is largely socialised or restrained – she will most likely not be content.

You have heard the “you can change your mind even at the altar – just go with your heart” maxim proclaimed on this forum. Some women can do that at any point – married or not!


TV

TV01:

So, take a woman out and tell here where you are going. Simple. It may seem “equalist to take her to the strip or ask her to choose a restaurant or negotiate where you will go. But she’s likely thinking indecisive, he’s making me think too much instead of relax and enjoy etc. Not to say you can’t ask at times or give options (limit them to 2 sha!). Whatever thier ideological leanings - they typically respond to the same cues.

I agree. Women like men to take charge
The secret is to suggest things that give a sense of inclusion yet your agenda is fulfilled ultimately
The sense of involvement is key to women

Even if the choice is between life and death, they dont want to feel they did not have an input in choosing life

Don’t forget, women are constantly revaluing, comparing and re-positioning. If your status should change, it will have an impact, if hers does likewise. It’s easy for men to get comfortable once they have sealed the deal. Women on the other hand are always perusing the terms and conditions.

This is so true
Morals has helped to curb this innate instincy.. however

If she isn’t heavily socialised to value commitment, fidelity etc. negative changes can have serious consequences. Even if she is largely socialised or restrained – she will most likely not be content.

You have heard the “you can change your mind even at the altar – just go with your heart” maxim proclaimed on this forum. Some women can do that at any point – married or not!


TV

LOL
Thats why some of them dont see anything with multiple suitors

pickabeau1:


I agree 100 percent at the bolded. She does not respect him and i will not be surprised she is preparing for or has a lover

In the old days... you could send them home for retraining

In these days of trying to comply with till death do us part and trying not to rock the boat for peace, one may need to accept some pain.

Now the question is this: what can one do to this woman practically

One is tempted to withdraw all her priviledges and maybe send her home for a while


MrNiceGuy79

It's first and foremost about him and what his lack of pro-activity is engendering in her (although I note she has some not very wifely/selfish behaviour according to him).

The actions and more so the consequences depend heavily on how socialised they both are. As Explained earlier, how much religious, ideological or cultural imperatives shape their responses. That overlays the hypegamy she is clearly demonstrating.

If for example divorce is out of the question for her due to socialisation, she will continue to “run him down”. The flip side is that he has more time to rectify things and she has more motivation to let him.

If it’s not, she may well be making her move as we speak. It’s pertinent that she has 3 thriving businesses for which she does not render account – what is happening to the proceeds?

If he becomes redundant as a provisioner it could trigger her move. With CWS no longer provided by him and SP no longer a big deal – in any event for SP to be in best effect, attraction needs to be working, and his loss of status, and more pertinently her consequent disrespect, means she won’t be feeling him. He doesn’t mention it, but I somehow doubt they are swinging from the chandelier with any kind of regularity.

I won’t go back to pre-marriage or marriage, or even the seed money he provided - what is done is done and I’d advise with the understanding that the idea is first to stabilise things.


TV

I dont totally agree with all your findings

From his own words, he is self disparaging - Maybe a fucntion of the evil words the woman is saying

However i feel it is a temperament - he seems to be a phlegmatic while she seems to have a choleric bent with a dash of nastiness and disrespect

He seems not to be an aggressive fellow but is a good provider and has a measure of financial intelligence not just in the way she wants


Going back to my earlier question

What are the practical unworldly way to stabilise things

TV01:


It's first and foremost about him and what his lack of pro-activity is engendering in her (although I note she has some not very wifely/selfish behaviour according to him).

The actions and more so the consequences depend heavily on how socialised they both are. As Explained earlier, how much religious, ideological or cultural imperatives shape their responses. That overlays the hypegamy she is clearly demonstrating.

If for example divorce is out of the question for her due to socialisation, she will continue to “run him down”. The flip side is that he has more time to rectify things and she has more motivation to let him.

If it’s not, she may well be making her move as we speak. It’s pertinent that she has 3 thriving businesses for which she does not render account – what is happening to the proceeds?

If he becomes redundant as a provisioner it could trigger her move. With CWS no longer provided by him and SP no longer a big deal – in any event for SP to be in best effect, attraction needs to be working, and his loss of status, and more pertinently her consequent disrespect, means she won’t be feeling him. He doesn’t mention it, but I somehow doubt they are swinging from the chandelier with any kind of regularity.

I won’t go back to pre-marriage or marriage, or even the seed money he provided - what is done is done and I’d advise with the understanding that the idea is first to stabilise things.


TV

pickabeau1:
I dont totally agree with all your findings

No qualms - that's just my reading of the situation. But let us know what other insights you have.

pickabeau1:
From his own words, he is self disparaging - Maybe a fucntion of the evil words the woman is saying

No. He's a man CAR - she didn't get there overnight. She stated with hope and expectation (even if he wasn't aware of this). He hasn't delivered. A womans frustrations will manifest one way or another. They are not cut out to happily to the lead in a relationship

pickabeau1:
However i feel it is a temperament - he seems to be a phlegmatic while she seems to have a choleric bent with a dash of nastiness and disrespect

Men control their emotiond's - or are not led by them - and don't fall back on disposition as an excuse. In any event giving leave to feelings or temperament will not resolve this situation will it?

pickabeau1:
He seems not to be an aggressive fellow but is a good provider and has a measure of financial intelligence not just in the way she wants

He's not a good providor if you consider his starting point. He's a trrust fund baby and many of lesser or equivalrent beginnings will be doing more. As I stated earlier. Women are constantly revaluing your status. One of theose with lesser beginnings who is doing more is his wife!

pickabeau1:
oing back to my earlier question

What are the practical unworldly way to stabilise things

Immediately following - 2 mins.


TV

pickabeau1:



Now the question is this: what can one do to this woman practically

One is tempted to withdraw all her priviledges and maybe send her home for a while

This idea shouldn't even be on the table. From his story we can infer that he hasn't accepted responsibility for his life. It's wounded male pride that would look to this idea in this situation, how dare she? her place is to support me etc etc. Going down this route would be a shortcut to ending their marriage.

First thing you do is look inwards, it's all too easy to demand respect as a man, what's not to easy is to live a life worthy of the respect you demand. He has to become less available and more self reliant in the short term. When he achieves a level of success/stability in his ventures then would be the time to begin to woo her again.

I think someone mentioned it previously, marriage will not complete you, if you cant achieve a measure of success on your own, having a wife will not make it much easier IMO. A wife should complement you, not complete you.

I won’t go back to pre-marriage or marriage, or even the seed money he provided - what is done is done and I’ll advise with the understanding that the idea is first to stabilise things.

He needs to start driving - CAR. But in no way should he try and do this by taking control or even trying to engage in the 3 businesses.

He should look for other avenues first. The big and obvious one is to garnish some status for himself, be that in business or even a job. A job sounds like a long shot, so maybe leveraging his family – not necessarily asking for funds – but partnering, doing business with/alongside them.

That should give him so comfort, as it’s clear that he’s probably not up to going it alone. Much in the same way that a job may be a stretch. It sounds like a clear case of 2nd/3rd generation profligacy. I’d happily get me some of that !

He should also be more proactive on the home front – taking an interest in everything from day to day domestics and most especially long-term projects. I think he already has a foot in here.

The long-term projects and family vision is also a way for him to demand her attention/input and ask for accountability about the businesses and her income.

One of these projects, or part of this vision will be his enterprise. First he is seeking support, not permission. Men should never seek validation from their wives, it works the other way round. One cannot be equalist here.

After all, she has not taken responsibility for coming up with something for him, whilst she has established her own – which she has not invited him to be part of. Question what she though of him all along if she was happy to take his seed money, build a business, not repay, not involve and not account?

(And although he cites her lack of support thus far as an inhibitor, I still feel it’s his own lack of oomph that has stopped things taking off – and the authority he has thereby ceded to her, and respect lost is fuelling her discontent )

He needs to think long-term - if he has the luxury - but implement gradual changes - mostly to himself. I speak about the vision and how it's never too late. Hopefully it isn't in this case and she will buy into it. But if she's made her plans and is just biding her time, it will be difficult to dissuade her - "When a womans fed up"

This type may require prayer and fasting as well!


TV

pickabeau1:
Good one guys


Also the bent of the discourse may or may not be religious as not all are of that persuasion but we all see the impact the abdication of male responsibility has on the society

I will like to reiterate the givens on this topic


Headship of the family is not based on roles even if examples abound of families where fathers have messed up as many of our more vocal female posters scream about these boards.

Growing up in a family where a woman controlled all and sundry is dysfunctional


Let's not turn this board to a gender topic
Ignore trollish posters

Anyone who has not gotten this basic truth will not get it

Ignore

hmmm..... I grew up in a single parent household, No dad, and yes i am highly relationship-dysfunctional. Any outline of methods to assuage this psycho-sociological complex?

Good debate guys


For me I still believe he is the one putting himself down

TV
Why do you think he should not demand accountability from the businesses
And saying he should have a comparable platform to show his wife
Is it a competition

Netotse..I see you too

L2CD766:

hmmm..... I grew up in a single parent household, No dad, and yes i am highly relationship-dysfunctional. Any outline of methods to assuage this psycho-sociological complex?

Welcome..are you male or ffemale

Do you have an issue with trust?

Do you believe in male headship

pickabeau1:


Welcome..are you male or ffemale

Do you have an issue with trust?

Do you believe in male headship

i am a male. I have trust issues which I think follows my male self esteem........ I have never really experienced male headship 'cause I grew up with a mom and 6 elder sisters; Never attended church.

L2CD766:
i am a male. I have trust issues which I think follows my male self esteem........ I have never really experienced male headship 'cause I grew up with a mom and 6 elder sisters; Never attended church.

OK..welcome once again


Well for me practically..I would recommend modelling

Uncles or father figures who you respect and show a life you will like to live


Also stick around here and ask questions on any issue

You need to know your capabilities, identify what you want in life and your woman, be futuristically inclined as per legacy
Take time to know thyself
"Self awareness is the key to self mastery'
Recognise you have authority within you
Be confident in yourself

Google this..

1.self mastery
2. Assertive communication

Aspire to know more daily.


Ask questions Here too

Others can answer

TV01
Bellong
Crackhaus
timbuktou
Nonso23

A brother here needs help

pickabeau1:
Good debate guys


For me I still believe he is the one putting himself down

TV
Why do you think he should not demand accountability from the businesses
And saying he should have a comparable platform to show his wife
Is it a competition

Netotse..I see you too

...read again with emphasis on the bold.

I didn't say he shouldn't, I said he shouldn't start with that - she will just see it as an ego driven "land grab", and likely respond with fire.
If other things are being correctly ordered first, she will likely be more receptive.

I also gave him a way to legitimately request an account of her business efforts. Hopefully he's being appreciative, commending and supportive here and not resentful?

TV

TV01:


...read again with emphasis on the bold.
I didn't say he shouldn't, I said he shouldn't start with that - she will just see it as an ego driven "land grab", and likely respond with fire.

TV

Hmmm....I saw it

For me I see a Lady with a mouth like this seeing it as a competition

She has the funds... She will not let it go..she may even leave the household..

Better the battle now than a subtle war of attrition

No problem

goofyone:

Please let's get to issues and forget sentiments. Naturally I wouldn't comment on this thread as it has pretty much become a close knit community of guys who know one another every well already and are probably opposed to outside ideas. But still...

His generalizations were pretty obvious, even from his subsequent posts. But then even if I do agree with you that he meant a family unit irrespective of structure (man-woman-child), how about societies that approve of cohabitation? Aren't these modern societies functioning just alright without the marriage ties and bonds? Or is cohabitation again one of such family units? I bet that was meant too!

Change determines societal relationships between man and woman, and traditional forms often fall out of the way for the need to embrace and support these changes. These traditional forms are what I'm challenging.

What traditional structures did marriage replace? How did societies work before marriage?

ihedinobi2:

What traditional structures did marriage replace? How did societies work before marriage?

It was, basically, a booty grab. The strongest got all the pum he wanted by just going after. Violence over booty was the norm and in the interest of peace and longevity, civility was introduced, marriage was established as a means of possession(because the woman couldn't protect herself) and boundary-marking.

Timbuktou:
It was, basically, a booty grab. The strongest got all the pum he wanted by just going after. Violence over booty was the norm and in the interest of peace and longevity, civility was introduced, marriage was established as a means of possession(because the woman couldn't protect herself) and boundary-marking.

I put it to you that until such a framework or due process was setvup
, such warlike societies died out from too much infighting

Do you agree

TV01, Pickabeau1:

My thoughts on NiceGuy's situation in summary:
1. Daddy was always away, most likely doing business or managing estate.
2. Had an over-sheltered, smothered childhood. His instincts for adventure and space domination have been severely dulled.
3. Has a fanatsy outlook to life which reality doesn't match.
4. His wife is jealous of his lack of need to work for self-preservation.
5. Probably never loved him and only married him for money.
6. He needs to have an office outside the home where he does work. He doesn't have to break rocks to be considered hard-working.
7. Needs to do less at home, not nothing. Needs to leave wifey to perform her home duties.
8. Dude doesn't know what it means to be a man not to talk of being one.

pickabeau1:


I put it to you that until such a framework or due process was setvup
, such warlike societies died out from too much infighting

Do you agree

I agree, though, not all. Also, there'd have been minimal development, a thing the male mind cannot stand. All the originators of marriage had to do was observe their contemporaries having short life spans for silly reasons.

Timbuktou:
TV01, Pickabeau1:

My thoughts on NiceGuy's situation in summary:
1. Daddy was always away, most likely doing business or managing estate.
2. Had an over-sheltered, smothered childhood. His instincts for adventure and space domination have been severely dulled.
3. Has a fanatsy outlook to life which reality doesn't match.
4. His wife is jealous of his lack of need to work for self-preservation.
5. Probably never loved him and only married him for money.
6. He needs to have an office outside the home where he does work. He doesn't have to break rocks to be considered hard-working.
7. Needs to do less at home, not nothing. Needs to leave wifey to perform her home duties.

This just skirts the issue


There is a battle on the horizon

He either faces it now or wait till she's so strong and leaves him

Timbuktou:
TV01, Pickabeau1:

My thoughts on NiceGuy's situation in summary:
1. Daddy was always away, most likely doing business or managing estate.
2. Had an over-sheltered, smothered childhood. His instincts for adventure and space domination have been severely dulled.
3. Has a fanatsy outlook to life which reality doesn't match.
4. His wife is jealous of his lack of need to work for self-preservation.
5. Probably never loved him and only married him for money.
6. He needs to have an office outside the home where he does work. He doesn't have to break rocks to be considered hard-working.
7. Needs to do less at home, not nothing. Needs to leave wifey to perform her home duties.

What home duties belongs to the wife? A wife that runs 3 businesses while he sits at home waiting from a paycheck from daddy and mummy? Is it not their home? Nothing wrong with doing your home duties as a man as well as working. It helps bond with the kids better. There is also no hard and fast rules as to who is supposed to do what. Each couple works out what is best for them.

Timbuktou:
I agree, though, not all. Also, there'd have been minimal development, a thing the male mind cannot stand. All the originators of marriage had to do was observe their contemporaries having short life spans for silly reasons.

Yep..i agree

There were of course other reasons

Imperialist tribes who conquered them
Drought
Famine
Disease

Lol

pickabeau1:


This just skirts the issue


There is a battle on the horizon

He either faces it now or wait till she's so strong and leaves him

Note, I said 'in summary'. He first has to realise what nature demands. Does he know, for example, that familiarity breeds contempt? His case is so extensive that he literally needs a counsellor to steer this ship aright

He needs a year, at least to set things right. I seriously doubt he has the drive or strength to execute the plan required to preserve his home. My brother, that guy needs major work, I no go lie.

pickabeau1:



Hmmm....I saw it

For me I see a Lady with a mouth like this seeing it as a competition

She has the funds... She will not let it go..she may even leave the household..

Better the battle now than a subtle war of attrition

No problem

Was the money a gift or a loan? Did they discusskeeping records or splitting profits before the businesses were set up? I would say he lets her keep the businesses (let it serve as an incentive for him to up his game). Trying to assert control over them now will simply turn into a case of reaping (or trying to reap) where you did not sow.

pickabeau1:


Yep..i agree

There were of course other reasons

Imperialist tribes who conquered them
Drought
Famine
Disease

Lol

Of course, imagine a scenario where the neighbourhood doctor was a thin, powerless fellow who got killed over a virgin he intended to keep. It was in their interest to be civilised.

Timbuktou:
Note, I said 'in summary'. He first has to realise what nature demands. Does he know, for example, that familiarity breeds contempt? His case is so extensive that he literally needs a counsellor to steer this ship aright

He needs a year, at least to set things right. I seriously doubt he has the drive or strength to execute the plan required to preserve his home. My brother, that guy needs major work, I no go lie.

Lol..i agree..major work

netotse:


Was the money a gift or a loan? Did they discusskeeping records or splitting profits before the businesses were set up? I would say he lets her keep the businesses (let it serve as an incentive for him to up his game). Trying to assert control over them now will simply turn into a case of reaping (or trying to reap) where you did not sow.

What if the biz fails
Remember headship is not based on providence

If she cannot submit to his authority even if she is the business brain...the relationship is a no brainer

Not every business succeeds
Not every one is cutout to be an entrepreneur

This woman was given a launchpad to realise her dreams yet envy and strife is causing her to lose focus


Even a bank will collect interest...mind you

Timbuktou:
Of course, imagine a scenario where the neighbourhood doctor was a thin, powerless fellow who got killed over a virgin he intended to keep. It was in their interest to be civilised.

True that

baby124:


1. What home duties belongs to the wife?
2. A wife that runs 3 businesses while he sits at home waiting from a paycheck from daddy and mummy?
3. Is it not their home?
4. Nothing wrong with doing your home duties as a man as well as working.
5. It helps bond with the kids better.
6. There is also no hard and fast rules as to who is supposed to do what.
7. Each couple works out what is best for them.

1. Home keeping. This includes, but is not limited to chores and nurturing.
2. A dime of which never is invested in the home? What is the point of her work? Waiting to amass enough to leave so she can marry an even richer fellow? Don't be funny. A business he financed, by the way. Her money is of no value in that home, take note.
3. It is "his mom's home". She is free to opt out.
4. Duties of the man in the home are more of a physical nature.
5. We all know that and bond with our kids. However, that is not the only way to bond with kids, take note .
6. Erm, there are. The husband provides, the wife manages, basically.
7. I agree. Do your part and all should be well. Say no to androgyny.

Bro..no need arguing with someone who does not believe in male headship
You should know the proponents of fluid family roles by now



Timbuktou