Bidam: Is the word born again not in your bible? Did you see water baptism written there? Are you saying people that were baptised by John need also to be baptized by Jesus? Who baptized Jesus? Was Jesus Not full of the Spirit right from Birth?Even at that Who baptized John? Was John not full of The Spirit from birth? You are the people fooling yourselves here.The order according to scriptures is firstly repentence then baptism not the other way round.We are justified by Faith in Christ Jesus by believing and confessing His Name before baptism..
Even Paul spent three days knowing Him(Jesus) when he was blind before he was baptized by ananias

Verbal proclaimation of faith is done @ every mass in the catholic church but that still does not refer to as been born again.of course one has to believe in Jesus before been baptised in his name but that verbal profession of faith was never what Jesus referred to as "born by water" or "born by the spirit".Pentecostals created a new interpretation of this scriptures in the twentieth century and are now trying to force it all our throats.

If you like do verbal declaration for Jesus from now till the end of the world,without baptism you are not saved.

chukwudi44:

I am not assuming and I have given you scriptures to back my interpretation if you like call it random scriptures because it does not suit your interpretation

U guys are impossible to deal with n I rest my case here, obviously u know nothing about the scriptures n the understanding of the scriptures is so shallow.

My prayer for u guys is to be saved n not lose Heaven, though doctrines saves no man bt when one refuses some basics through pride, ignorance, upholding religion/doctrines of men more than the word of God, then there might be problem.

NB And pls nobody should quote me again after this, if anyone wants to learn read my thread "Be bornagain".

Stay blessed n remain rapturable

Pastor Olu T:

U guys are impossible to deal with n I rest my case here, obviously u know nothing about the scriptures n the understanding of the scriptures is so shallow.

My prayer for u guys is to be saved n not lose Heaven, though doctrines saves no man bt when one refuses some basics through pride, ignorance, upholding religion/doctrines of men more than the word of God, then there might be problem.

NB And pls nobody should quote me again after this, if anyone wants to learn read my thread "Be bornagain".

Stay blessed n remain rapturable

Why should I want to learn from you? Your pentecostal opinion is even a new and minority opinion and is not shared by majority of christendom

chukwudi44:

i Pity folks who say baptism is not necesary.

No one (on this thread) says baptism is not necessary, what the point has been is that baptism is not being born again ie born of spirit and water.

chukwudi44:
Why on earth do you think Jesus was baptised?

do u really think Jesus became born again when He was baptized?

The phrase "of water and the Spirit" (Greek, ek hudatos kai pneumatos) is a single linguistical unit. It refers to being "born of water and the Spirit," not "born of water" on the one hand and "born of the Spirit" on the other.


At Jesus' baptism, the Holy Spirit descends upon him as He comes up out of the water (cf. John 1:25-34; Matt 3:13-17; Mark 1:9-11; Luke 3:21-22). Furthermore, what distinguishes John's baptism of repentance in anticipation of the Messiah from Christian baptism, is that the latter is a baptism with the Holy Spirit (Matt 3:11; Mark 1:8; Luke 3:16; John 1:31; Acts 1:4-5).

Consequently, on Pentecost, Peter calls the Jews to "be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of sins" and promises that they will "receive the gift of the Holy Spirit" (Acts 2:38), thus fulfilling the promise of John. Peter clearly teaches here that the "water baptism," to which he directs the soon-to-be converts, forgives sins and bestows the Holy Spirit. Christian baptism, then, is no mere external, repentance-ritual with water, but entails an inner transformation or regeneration by the Holy Spirit of the New Covenant; it is a "new birth," a being "born again" or "born from above."

What's wrong with 21st century protestants?

[/quote]One gets born again by believing in ones heart that Jesus died in their stead and confessing with ones mouth that he resurrected to justify their salvation. [quote]

Where even in the bible is this described as been born again? Smh for these pentecostal folks!! Every one with his/her interpretations

try69: The phrase "of water and the Spirit" (Greek, ek hudatos kai pneumatos) is a single linguistical unit. It refers to being "born of water and the Spirit," not "born of water" on the one hand and "born of the Spirit" on the other.


At Jesus' baptism, the Holy Spirit descends upon him as He comes up out of the water (cf. John 1:25-34; Matt 3:13-17; Mark 1:9-11; Luke 3:21-22). Furthermore, what distinguishes John's baptism of repentance in anticipation of the Messiah from Christian baptism, is that the latter is a baptism with the Holy Spirit (Matt 3:11; Mark 1:8; Luke 3:16; John 1:31; Acts 1:4-5).

Consequently, on Pentecost, Peter calls the Jews to "be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of sins" and promises that they will "receive the gift of the Holy Spirit" (Acts 2:38), thus fulfilling the promise of John. Peter clearly teaches here that the "water baptism," to which he directs the soon-to-be converts, forgives sins and bestows the Holy Spirit. Christian baptism, then, is no mere external, repentance-ritual with water, but entails an inner transformation or regeneration by the Holy Spirit of the New Covenant; it is a "new birth," a being "born again" or "born from above."

What's wrong with 21st century protestants?

abeg post this again and again and again mayb some will read it.

chukwudi44: One gets born again by believing in ones heart that Jesus died in their stead and confessing with ones mouth that he resurrected to justify their salvation.
Where even in the bible is this described as been born again? Smh for these pentecostal folks!! Every one with his/her interpretations

someone that is born again and someone that is saved are they different?

Was Paul baptized first or did he accept and confess the lordship of Jesus first?

It doesn't matter how long a lie has been in office it will never become the truth.

Answer these questions and I can help part of your religious bondage.

try69: The phrase "of water and the Spirit" (Greek, ek hudatos kai pneumatos) is a single linguistical unit. It refers to being "born of water and the Spirit," not "born of water" on the one hand and "born of the Spirit" on the other.
At Jesus' baptism, the Holy Spirit descends upon him as He comes up out of the water (cf. John 1:25-34; Matt 3:13-17; Mark 1:9-11; Luke 3:21-22). Furthermore, what distinguishes John's baptism of repentance in anticipation of the Messiah from Christian baptism, is that the latter is a baptism with the Holy Spirit (Matt 3:11; Mark 1:8; Luke 3:16; John 1:31; Acts 1:4-5).
Consequently, on Pentecost, Peter calls the Jews to "be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of sins" and promises that they will "receive the gift of the Holy Spirit" (Acts 2:38), thus fulfilling the promise of John. Peter clearly teaches here that the "water baptism," to which he directs the soon-to-be converts, forgives sins and bestows the Holy Spirit. Christian baptism, then, is no mere external, repentance-ritual with water, but entails an inner transformation or regeneration by the Holy Spirit of the New Covenant; it is a "new birth," a being "born again" or "born from above."
What's wrong with 21st century protestants?

You haven't said anything new. But I agree with most of your exegesis. Now proceeding further.

Acts 2 : 21 whoever shall call on the name of Jesus shall be saved. What does it mean?

This statement was made by the same Peter. He preached Jesus to them. He explained how he was killed and how he had resurrected. He implored them to accept the lordship of Jesus christ.

They said what shall we do? Then he told them Repent (change your mind) and be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of sins.

Then they accepted Jesus lordship. Verse 41 nails it. Then everyone that had accepted Jesus and was saved was then baptised. Period.


This is in Peters day. In Philips day. In Pauls day.

Please save that 21st century hocus pocus bogus you are trying to sell. It was the order in bible days.

Ask your priests where they got their own order from. I have accepted the bible ordained way.

mba emeka:

someone that is born again and someone that is saved are they different?

Was Paul baptized first or did he accept and confess the lordship of Jesus first?

It doesn't matter how long a lie has been in office it will never become the truth.

Answer these questions and I can help part of your religious bondage.

So you did not see where it was stated that baptism saves in 1 pet 3:21? Continue to deceive yourself

mba emeka:

You haven't said anything new. But I agree with most of your exegesis. Now proceeding further.

Acts 2 : 21 whoever shall call on the name of Jesus shall be saved. What does it mean?

This statement was made by the same Peter. He preached Jesus to them. He explained how he was killed and how he had resurrected. He implored them to accept the lordship of Jesus christ.

They said what shall we do? Then he told them Repent (change your mind) and be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of sins.

Then they accepted Jesus lordship. Verse 41 nails it. Then everyone that had accepted Jesus and was saved was then baptised. Period.


This is in Peters day. In Philips day. In Pauls day.

Please save that 21st century hocus pocus bogus you are trying to sell. It was the order in bible days.

Ask your priests where they got their own order from. I have accepted the bible ordained way.

Peter time ko adeboye's time ni

just as expected. You can't discuss based on the word. Your lapses will be exposed. Vituperations next I'm sure.

I have passed a message. Many will learn. I give God the glory.

And we give Mary the honors

Jobless haters

mba emeka:

just as expected. You can't discuss based on the word. Your lapses will be exposed. Vituperations next I'm sure.

I have passed a message. Many will learn. I give God the glory.

which stupid message did you pas and who is the slowpoke who will fall for it?

mba emeka:

You haven't said anything new. But I agree with most of your exegesis. Now proceeding further.

Acts 2 : 21 whoever shall call on the name of Jesus shall be saved. What does it mean?

This statement was made by the same Peter. He preached Jesus to them. He explained how he was killed and how he had resurrected. He implored them to accept the lordship of Jesus christ.

They said what shall we do? Then he told them Repent (change your mind) and be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of sins.

Then they accepted Jesus lordship. Verse 41 nails it. Then everyone that had accepted Jesus and was saved was then baptised. Period.


This is in Peters day. In Philips day. In Pauls day.

Please save that 21st century hocus pocus bogus you are trying to sell. It was the order in bible days.

Ask your priests where they got their own order from. I have accepted the bible ordained way.

correction on d bolded, verse 41 didnt say those wu were saved were baptise. It says those wu received his word were baptised, peter earlier said batism was 4 d remission of sins and the reception of d spirit, so those wu received d word were beptised so their sins will b 4given and they will recieve d spirit. In oda word this simply confirms 1 pt, baptism now saves u!
Run away frm 20th century novel heresy

Ubenedictus: correction on d bolded, verse 41 didnt say those wu were saved were baptise. It says those wu received his word were baptised, peter earlier said batism was 4 d remission of sins and the reception of d spirit, so those wu received d word were beptised so their sins will b 4given and they will recieve d spirit. In oda word this simply confirms 1 pt, baptism now saves u!
Run away frm 20th century novel heresy

what does it mean to accept/ receive the word? What was the word to receive? Does it tally with Romans 10 : 9-10?

Religious bondage is the most difficult to break. At this rate you would deny Jesus' words over what you were fed by God knows who.

I think I am done here. Keep playing dice with salvation and living in uncertainty.

I am living in health, full of faith and loaded. Thank God.

I wonder who baptised the criminal at the side of Jesus on the cross?

Ubenedictus: to be born again or born anew is to be "born of water and the holyspirit". Nt exactly d protestant idea of alter call.

Op, wat do u understand by 'born again'?

Bieng born again means receiving the life of christ. I.e believing he is the son of God and confessing that he is the lord.... Romans9

mba emeka: I wonder who baptised the criminal at the side of Jesus on the cross?

Do you wonder also the ones Jesus went to the abode of the blessed to share the gospel with and to open the gates of heaven for?

He Baptised those in hades abi? Kid me.

I'm not even going to discuss purgatory abi na purgative. If simple salvation that is clearly written in the scriptures is generating this amount of controversy I wonder what your conjectural purgatory will.


NEXT!

^^^^^

Confused?


The babies herod killed confessed jesus and are saved?

Pastor Olu T:

lol, now I see where u stand, u chose to believe whatever u want. In fact I am short of words to u n dont know where to start, are u a xtian at all? U said those scriptures I quoted says nothing about bornagain, so u expect to see it verbatim, are u still in kindergarten? U guys are just so funny, u claim the worship of Mary was inferred n not verbatim n this u want it to be verbatim, I weep for u. Dont worry I will give it to u if dont run away anyways.

Ok what about 1Peter 1:23 that was verbatim that we are born again by the uncoruptible word of God? Lets start with that since u seek word for word.

Whatever u choose to believe is ur choice, continue to follow the doctrines of men n see where it leads u.

Stop lying, "pastor." I never said the bold. I said the verses dont say "water=word"...and they never will!

"Born of water and Spirit" is "born of WATER and SPIRIT."

Pastor Olu T:
The first one is Ephesians 5:26, it was a mistake, washing of "water" by the word. The church was gotten by the washing of water by the word.

Neither does the above say "water=word."

Pastor Olu T:

Why are u being sentimental, to call urself a xtian n not even sincere. Did I ever say he answered the question, all I said is u r requesting for answer when urself dodged the one post to u.

Well what should I have expected from one who always defend man's doctrine/organization as against Jesus?

Did I say you said so, Mr 'can't read and understand?'

Why attack me when I'm talking to someone who cannot even answer the fundamental question which I answered?

Answer: because I'm Catholic. Mr Bias.

Pastor Olu T:

Show me just one place where born of water means water baptism n I will show 5 places where it means the word with explanations.

Lol...you mean with manipulations.

Water is water...even if you kill yourself trying to change it to "word."

Pastor Olu T:

My bro I just dont understand o, its not just Catholics bt all forms of religion, its like modern day "zombies" where people are ready to die for their believes no matter what.

I remember speaking to a woman several years ago showing her scriptures which she cant refute, after everything she said no matter what she would die a catholic just as francisTony is doing right now. Also a religion besides me their prayers everyday is that nothing should ever take them out of that religion n God should kill them in that religion They dont care about salvation or where they spend eternity, their own is that they will die Catholics, I just dont understand its like a cult or something?

The devil knows how to quote scriptures...probably better than you. Yet you are both wrong.

adsonstone:


how hard is it for a roman catholic to comprehend the words of Christ.

In the worthless opinion of a deeper lifer.

adsonstone:

says Italo, not Jesus.

Why dont you tell us what Jesus said then?

adsonstone:

is this the rcc's definition of baptism?

State how (water) baptism is that of the Spirit.

Is the above your definition of being born again?...or are you afraid of offering your definition here?

Pastor Olu T:

Why should it always be about individual churches? Christ never came to die for any individual church bt his body (the universal church which is made up of individual xtians). But unfortunately people would rather uphold n fight for their individual church than Christ, whereby most of the church is alien to Christ. My problem has always been about practices against the clear teaches of Christ n never individuals, in fact I relate with people from all walks, bt when it comes to the truth I dont mince word.

We Catholics dont "fight" for "individual Church."

We fight for the one true Church that Christ founded on St. Peter 2000 years ago.

Sorry about that!

adsonstone:


It has been synonymous with being born again because it has something to do with being born again... (Water) Baptism is not being born again in itself......and as you rightly said exactly as Jesus defined: born again = Born of water, Born of spirit.....and not as Italo generalized that born.again=being baptized.

The bone of contention is now
what is 'born of water'?
..and what is 'born of Spirit'?

Being baptized requires the use of WATER and the work of the SPIRIT.

So being born again = beign born of water and Spirit = being baptized.

Bidam: Is the word born again not in your bible? Did you see water baptism written there? Are you saying people that were baptised by John need also to be baptized by Jesus? Who baptized Jesus? Was Jesus Not full of the Spirit right from Birth?Even at that Who baptized John? Was John not full of The Spirit from birth? You are the people fooling yourselves here.The order according to scriptures is firstly repentence then baptism not the other way round.We are justified by Faith in Christ Jesus by believing and confessing His Name before baptism..
Even Paul spent three days knowing Him(Jesus) when he was blind before he was baptized by ananias

Baptism implies and involves repentance.

That makes your submission above irrelevant.