Gombs:

d bible expressly called non tither robbers,hence criminals. pls show me where d bible called tithers "gullible" or pastor who teach tithing "scammers", "thieves on the pulpit" "fraudsters" etc. or you wan deny the use of one all more of the enquoted adjectives?

ayam waitin for an answer

I think you are entitled to your opinion Gombs. We have been discussing tithes for how long? Is it what Candour tells you now that will change your mind?

I think enough has been said on tithing on this forum to make anyone decide what they want to do with their money.

Pls this thread has been derailed enough. Let's remain on topic and that is how we shall get all the folks willing to, for the convention.

Gombs:

d bible expressly called non tither robbers,hence criminals. pls show me where d bible called tithers "gullible" or pastor who teach tithing "scammers", "thieves on the pulpit" "fraudsters" etc. or you wan deny the use of one all more of the enquoted adjectives?

ayam waitin for an answer

Really?? So you're an adherent of Mosaic law? And here was I assuming all along that its because of Abraham's example you tithe. Since God called Jews who were not tithing robbers, what does that make the tithe?? A law or freewill?

Isaac didn't pay tithe, according to u, he must be a robber and a criminal right?

Jesus didn't pay tithe, neither did he collect tithes, what does that make him? A criminal?

Paul and the other apostles didn't pay tithe neither did they collect as apostles of the church, they too must be criminals abi?

You see my friend, your hypocricy will always show at this point. Malachi 3:8 will always trip you up because when you lie that its Abraham's example you follow to tithe, you always run to Malachi to scare yourself into compliance. I'm not against you enjoying your eldorado and joy of calling non tithers criminals but always remember the injunction on tithes below from God almighty himself so you can truly get that windows of heaven to open and not be seen as a profane and lawless person yourself

]Deuteronomy 14:22-29 KJV
Thou shalt truly tithe all the increase of thy seed, that the field bringeth forth year by year. [23] And thou shalt eat before the Lord thy God, in the place which he shall choose to place his name there, the tithe of thy corn, of thy wine, and of thine oil, and the firstlings of thy herds and of thy flocks; that thou mayest learn to fear the Lord thy God always. [24] And if the way be too long for thee, so that thou art not able to carry it; or if the place be too far from thee, which the Lord thy God shall choose to set his name there, when the Lord thy God hath blessed thee: [25] Then shalt thou turn it into money, and bind up the money in thine hand, and shalt go unto the place which the Lord thy God shall choose: [26] And thou shalt bestow that money for whatsoever thy soul lusteth after, for oxen, or for sheep, or for wine, or for strong drink, or for whatsoever thy soul desireth: and thou shalt eat there before the Lord thy God, and thou shalt rejoice, thou, and thine household, [27] And the Levite that is within thy gates; thou shalt not forsake him; for he hath no part nor inheritance with thee. [28] At the end of three years thou shalt bring forth all the tithe of thine increase the same year, and shalt lay it up within thy gates: [29] And the Levite, (because he hath no part nor inheritance with thee,) and the stranger, and the fatherless, and the widow, which are within thy gates, shall come, and shall eat and be satisfied; that the Lord thy God may bless thee in all the work of thine hand which thou doest.

The bible didn't call pastors robbers of tithe because pastors were not assigned the duty to collect tithes in the bible so they had no opportunity to steal from it. It was the exclusive preserve of levites. If pastors now claim the rights and privileges of levites without God's command, i leave u to give them a name that suits them.

Bidam: Was it the guy that called non tithers criminals or was it the bible that says so?

You see Bidam, I didn't join or post on that thread because I expect folks who come to discussions like this to behave like adults even if they might be juveniles. It was a very childish thread to say the least and I'm an adult. I don't have that much time.

If it gives you joy to call Christians who don't tithe, criminals, then by all means pls I beseech you, go right ahead. I won't interfere with your enjoyment.

My post was addressed to alexleo and I believe he understood what I was driving at.

Gombs:

d bible expressly called non tither robbers,hence criminals. pls show me where d bible called tithers "gullible" or pastor who teach tithing "scammers", "thieves on the pulpit" "fraudsters" etc. or you wan deny the use of one all more of the enquoted adjectives?

ayam waitin for an answer

It is tithers who refused to pay their tithes that were actually referred to in the portion you allude to in the Bible. Those nations and peoples who were not required to tithe were not called robbers - only those who were to pay but refused to pay.
Is there instruction for the Christian to pay tithe compulsorily today? No!
Do those who claim to tithe today follow God's exact way of doing it? No!
Is there anywhere in the Bible where the place and those to receive tithes were changed? No!
When a man or an institution today decides to change God's prescribed way for tithing to suit his or their pockets will it be right to refer to such as fraud and scam?
When those same people live "their best lives now" while the rest of their congregations are just scrapping to go through life, should we clap for them? - ... ... Your answer please!

And yet, no scripture in the Bible can be brought out by a select few, a scripture condemning tithing or those who do. But some folks make it a point of duty to fight it day and night, come rain come shine.... and freely insults tithers, pastors, churches and yet claim sainthood!

But for Grace I woud't be saved, but for your Grace I'll go astray, i'm forever gratefull that you av been faithful to me Lord, for your AMAZING GRACE. A very blessed evening to all. @Gombs y are you so bitter? I tot ure a christian bc u claimed to b a CE , for all i know, chris has never preached bitterness or malice! Abi u don change church? Bless u.

christemmbassey: But for Grace I woud't be saved, but for your Grace I'll go astray, i'm forever gratefull that you av been faithful to me Lord, for your AMAZING GRACE. A very blessed evening to all. @Gombs y are you so bitter? I tot ure a christian bc u claimed to b a CE , for all i know, chris has never preached bitterness or malice! Abi u don change church? Bless u.

Haba bros
I can't be bitter na... if I were I'd have trailed the part of insults... but my man, see folks claiming saimts na...grace convention? U want me to put up insults these blokes have put up on here?

[NLT] James 3:11 Does a spring of water bubble out with both fresh water and bitter water?

Gombs:
And yet, no scripture in the Bible can be brought out by a select few, a scripture condemning tithing or those who do. But some folks make it a point of duty to fight it day and night, come rain come shine.... and freely insults tithers, pastors, churches and yet claim sainthood!

So you are only fulfilling a 'God ordained obligation' to insult Christians for refusing to be bound to a Jewish law made specifically for Jewish people under mosaic law for the express benefit of levites, widows, the poor and strangers among them? And you think those who return the favour are causing u harm? You're permitted to insult people but those you insult have no right to give u back in good measure since you're a saint and they're not?

You're a saint for insulting others but see others as not worthy enough to return the favour?

Haba mallam!!?? Haba my friend??

Gombs:

Haba bros
I can't be bitter na... if I were I'd have trailed the part of insults... but my man, see folks claiming saimts na...grace convention? U want me to put up insults these blokes have put up on here?

[NLT] James 3:11 Does a spring of water bubble out with both fresh water and bitter water?

'if u stick to d word, u'll come back with a testimony......' ma Oga, how Gombe? Ope say bh activities never reach der o. Ok bros, ma appeal is, what God has brought 2gether tro Christ, let not tithe FRAUD put assunder o. Love u with d love of da Lord.... Don't u dare miss 2014 E-Grace convocation, Jesus will be there!

christemmbassey: 'if u stick to d word, u'll come back with a testimony......' ma Oga, how Gombe? Ope say bh activities never reach der o. Ok bros, ma appeal is, what God has brought 2gether tro Christ, let not tithe FRAUD put assunder o. Love u with d love of da Lord. ... Don't u dare miss 2014 E-Grace convocation, Jesus will be there!

Bros...I hail u joor...

Gombs:
And yet, no scripture in the Bible can be brought out by a select few, a scripture condemning tithing or those who do. But some folks make it a point of duty to fight it day and night, come rain come shine.... and freely insults tithers, pastors, churches and yet claim sainthood!

Tithing for Israel was in order just as animal sacrifices for them was in order. But when Christ brought in the new order those things changed. They were no longer compulsory for the New Covenant believer. Therefore anyone who INSISTS on them today is being deceitful to say the least and EVIL when one really looks at the dimension of their propaganda.

alexleo:

I don't think we can say that its hatred. A lot of disagreements come up in our discussions here though sometimes we go far in name calling yet I don't see hatred in it. I still advice we change. We can raise issues on doctrines that we think are against the scriptures but we shouldn't let it generate to hatred. In three different catholic occassions that I attended, the priests that preached were wonderful. They preached sound word of God so it doesn't mean that everything about catholic is wrong. No church is perfect.

I agree with you but when we allow our disagreements to cause disunity such that we can't associate freely, then we allow such disagreements to become a profound hatred.

Our theme for the 2014 Grace Convention is:

[size=20pt]Ephphatha - Be opened[/size]

King James Bible
And looking up to heaven, he sighed, and saith unto him, Ephphatha, that is, Be opened.
Mark 7:34

Acts 26:17-18 Amplified Bible (AMP)

17 [a]Choosing you out [selecting you for Myself] and [b]delivering you from among this [Jewish] people and the Gentiles to whom I am sending you—18 To open their eyes that they may turn from darkness to light and from the power of Satan to God, so that they may thus receive forgiveness and release from their sins and a place and portion among those who are consecrated and purified by faith in Me.

God, helping us, this will be the central focus of our topics and teachers.

You're all blessed

Again I want to know why frosbel is among the teachers. He has declared in this forum that he is not a chirstian and that he is serving a different Jesus and a different God yet you people still included him here. To teach us what exactly? Can't you people do without him?. For someone who said he is still evolving from his believe I think it would ve been better to allow him to land, at least to know what his new findings/doctrine is all about, before allowing him to teach whatever but it seems you people tremble and bow before him like a god. Everything he preaches is oksy by you. You dare not oppose or question him(of course none of you have done that to my own knowledge). Does this action from you people show sincerity of purpose?

alexleo: Again I want to know why frosbel is among the teachers. He has declared in this forum that he is not a chirstian and that he is serving a different Jesus and a different God yet you people still included him here. To teach us what exactly? Can't you people do without him?. For someone who said he is still evolving from his believe I think it would ve been better to allow him to land, at least to know what his new findings/doctrine is all about, before allowing him to teach whatever but it seems you people tremble and bow before him like a god. Everything he preaches is oksy by you. You dare not oppose or question him(of course none of you have done that to my own knowledge). Does this action from you people show sincerity of purpose?

Lol.

Let me put your religious mind at rest ! I did not intend to partake of this convention not because I do not believe in Christ but because of time.

Not everyone is dogmatic and brainwashed by American churches.

Gombs:

See bitterness na

But bro he is right in what he said about some of these pastors pls. The only thing I don't agree with him is abusing them. I ll rather blame members of such churches who are supposed to ask questions but have refused to do so in the name of touch not my annointed.

alexleo: Again I want to know why frosbel is among the teachers. He has declared in this forum that he is not a chirstian and that he is serving a different Jesus and a different God yet you people still included him here. To teach us what exactly? Can't you people do without him?. For someone who said he is still evolving from his believe I think it would ve been better to allow him to land, at least to know what his new findings/doctrine is all about, before allowing him to teach whatever but it seems you people tremble and bow before him like a god. Everything he preaches is oksy by you. You dare not oppose or question him(of course none of you have done that to my own knowledge). Does this action from you people show sincerity of purpose?

I'm not sure they've picked anybody yet or picked frosbel for that matter. The list I saw up there should have at least 20 names (I didn't count) so its just a pool from which speakers would emerge.

I wouldn't want a situation where all the same people who presented last year would present again this year. There should be wholesale changes or at least a good mix of new monikers.

For the above reason, I'm excusing myself from being nominated to present anything this year.

frosbel:


Lol.

Let me put your religious mind at rest ! I did not intend to partake of this convention not because I do not believe in Christ but because of time.

Not everyone is dogmatic and brainwashed by American churches.

Even if you had all the time, they shouldn't feature you in the conference. You are serving a different Jesus. We don't. need another Jesus than the one in the scriptures.
Those who are following you are also brainwashed by your doctrine. Don't you know? You are also as "guilty" as the American church.

alexleo:

Even if you had all the time, they shouldn't feature you in the conference. You are serving a different Jesus. We don't. need another Jesus than the one in the scriptures.

Let's have a look at your Jesus ;

1. He is not a real man, more like half god and half man (the stuff of Myth that Apostle Paul warned us about )
2. He did not die fully , only his body died. Hmmm
3. He is also God Almighty.......that's strange
4. He has reserved 99.98% of the human race for eternal roasting ( now that's what I call LOVE )
5. I dare say most of you in this thread serve different Jesuses, for while some believe he will save only those who have been chosen even If they sin rampantly, others believe that to sin means eventual destruction while others are somewhere in the middle. The Jesus of some likes to collect tithe while the Jesus of others thinks it is false doctrine etc. Last time I checked there was 1 Christ and he is not the Apostolic faith Christ ( that one is in Portland Oregon ) , he is not the catholic Christ ( that one is in the Vatican ), he is the saviour and Christ of ALL mankind.

I reject all man made religion and the thousands of self appointed men who lead a thousand churches all contrary to on another . Smh.

alexleo:

[b]But bro he is right in what he said about some of these pastors pls. [/b]The only thing I don't agree with him is abusing them. I ll rather blame members of such churches who are supposed to ask questions but have refused to do so in the name of touch not my annointed.

Remember miriam and Aaron, when they spoke about Moses? When God confronted them, did He ask them why they spoke about Moses the way they did? Or....

Point is, pray for ministers of the gospel, rather than slander them around, whether they be right or wrong. What rights do we have to question another man's servant? Now, look at seasoned ministers all over the world, how many times have u seen them criticising other churches just cos they don't teach what they teach?

I know some pastor's are dubious and act in really unchrist-like, but what then is my job? Go around condemning them? Where then is the love of Christ? I rather fo on my knees for the pastor's sake and the sake of his brethren. That's why we can't blame the brethren either, cos a sheep follow its shepherd, the brethren may not ask questions because they knkw not too, and when they know from the word, they usually don't question the Pastor, they simply move out, for God is not an author of confusion. I never asked questions in the Anglican church, when I got to know the Word and did wha the Bereans did, I simply left the Anglican communion, and didn't criticise them, even when glaringly, evil men are made elders and chairmen of events. I didn't go tell folks to leave there, they watched and saw something different...and God did the rest.

But if folks think they are ordained to rubbish pastors or churches all in the guise of "they preach heresies", God bear me witness...they do so at their peril. Remember David and Saul? I never question Pastors, for I don't know the calling on them. Simple. I use the recipe the bible gave for testing Spirits, and it works perfectly fine for me

Happy Sunday bro

^^^

How do you pray for these ones below ?

"For such men are false apostles, deceitful workers, disguising themselves as apostles of Christ. No wonder, for even Satan disguises himself as an angel of light." - 2 Corinthians 11:13-14

Precious brethren, sincere apologies for derailing, I am watching on the side lines now.

I'm very interested and I may have some ideas.


@Goshen if you've still got my skype id, please buzz me

Gombs:

Remember miriam and Aaron, when they spoke about Moses? When God confronted them, did He ask them why they spoke about Moses the way they did? Or....

Point is, pray for ministers of the gospel, rather than slander them around, whether they be right or wrong. What rights do we have to question another man's servant? Now, look at seasoned ministers all over the world, how many times have u seen them criticising other churches just cos they don't teach what they teach?

I know some pastor's are dubious and act in really unchrist-like, but what then is my job? Go around condemning them? Where then is the love of Christ? I rather fo on my knees for the pastor's sake and the sake of his brethren. That's why we can't blame the brethren either, cos a sheep follow its shepherd, the brethren may not ask questions because they knkw not too, and when they know from the word, they usually don't question the Pastor, they simply move out, for God is not an author of confusion. I never asked questions in the Anglican church, when I got to know the Word and did wha the Bereans did, I simply left the Anglican communion, and didn't criticise them, even when glaringly, evil men are made elders and chairmen of events. I didn't go tell folks to leave there, they watched and saw something different...and God did the rest.

But if folks think they are ordained to rubbish pastors or churches all in the guise of "they preach heresies", God bear me witness...they do so at their peril. Remember David and Saul? I never question Pastors, for I don't know the calling on them. Simple. I use the recipe the bible gave for testing Spirits, and it works perfectly fine for me

Happy Sunday bro

You're right criticism could get very excessive and personal (I'm guilty) but this your write up only serves to cow Christians into unalloyed, unchallengeable obedience and servitude to self proclaimed 'men of God' who use and useless them. I have learnt to caution myself in my choice of words in this matter but that doesn't mean we should close our mouths or hide our keypads and not sound a note of warning when clear evil and deceit is on display.

Aaron, Miriam and Moses episode was unique to that time just like the below scripture was valid then but totally useless to us today

Exodus 31:15 KJV
Six days may work be done; but in the seventh is the sabbath of rest, holy to the Lord : whosoever doeth any work in the sabbath day, he shall surely be put to death.

Then put into practice

Numbers 15:32, 35 KJV
And while the children of Israel were in the wilderness, they found a man that gathered sticks upon the sabbath day. [35] And the Lord said unto Moses, The man shall be surely put to death: all the congregation shall stone him with stones without the camp.

How many people have been ordered killed by God today because of sabbath?

God didn't change but the dispensations are not the same. Show me an example of the Aaron, Miriam and Moses episode in the new covenant so we dissect it together. I doubt you'll find any. Its not a coincidence or mistake that all your examples on this matter were under the law. You my friend should know the difference between law and grace.

42 children were torn apart by bears for insulting Elisha's bald head, do you honestly believe such can happen today? What difference then did the cross make?

I have been very aggressive in the past on these issues but I've learnt to take it easy. However my friend, if you take something that doesn't belong to you or you lie and twist scriptures to get into the pockets of gullible people, whether you wear a collar, cassock or a cape, I don't know what other name you wish to be called by other than a thi...... and a Robb.....

A pastor was arrested by the police in ketu for warehousing guns and receiving tithes from robbers last year, what would you call such?

A pastor was arrested for printing fake naira notes in ikorodu last year, what would his name be?

A pastor was arrested this year after impregnating plenty married women and their daughters claiming holy ghost directives, how would you describe him?

Rev Jim Jones led almost a thousand people in mass suicide in 1978, do you think more shouts and caution from those wiser couldn't have stopped that?

I'm glad that you at least agree there are fake pastors and Christians who don't know but please sound the warning to those gullible sheep. You might be saving a life or someone's eternal destination.

frosbel:

Let's have a look at your Jesus ;

1. He is not a real man, more like half god and half man (the stuff of Myth that Apostle Paul warned us about )
2. He did not die fully , only his body died. Hmmm
3. He is also God Almighty.......that's strange
4. He has reserved 99.98% of the human race for eternal roasting ( now that's what I call LOVE )
5. I dare say most of you in this thread serve different Jesuses, for while some believe he will save only those who have been chosen even If they sin rampantly, others believe that to sin means eventual destruction while others are somewhere in the middle. The Jesus of some likes to collect tithe while the Jesus of others thinks it is false doctrine etc. Last time I checked there was 1 Christ and he is not the Apostolic faith Christ ( that one is in Portland Oregon ) , he is not the catholic Christ ( that one is in the Vatican ), he is the saviour and Christ of ALL mankind.

I reject all man made religion and the thousands of self appointed men who lead a thousand churches all contrary to on another . Smh.

Rantings of a drowning man. I ve told you we don't need your self created Jesus. We are very okay with the Jesus in the scripture. We don't need your words. The bible is very clear for us to read and understand so keep your rants and your discoveries to yourself. We don't need it sir.

Candour:



For the above reason, I'm excusing myself from being nominated to present anything this year.

My dear you don't need to excuse yourself. I think we are the ones that should request for who should be dropped(except if my assumptions are wrong). I only expressed my rejection of frosbel and his heresy. There are some people in that list that I'm looking forward to reading their presentations and you are one of them. Bidam, OLAADEGBU and Tgirl have excussed themselves, Now you too. when you people are excusing yourselves like this it means we are losing people that will say the truth. And if we lose truth speakers then the conference will be filled with liars. Too bad.

alexleo:

.. Now you too. when you people are excusing yourselves like this it means we are losing people that will say the truth. And if we lose truth speakers then the conference will be filled with liars. Too bad.

What is truth exactly, is it Jesus Truth or Portland Oregon Truth ?

If AF preach truth, why are they still preaching the LIE of the Tithe and a Mythical half god and half man.

A word of caution :

"They will turn their ears away from the truth and turn aside to myths." - 2 Timothy 4:4

Thanks.






myth [mith]
noun
1.
a traditional or legendary story, usually concerning some being or hero or event, with or without a determinable basis of fact or a natural explanation, especially one that is concerned with deities or demigods and explains some practice, rite, or phenomenon of nature.

alexleo:

My dear you don't need to excuse yourself. I think we are the ones that should request for who should be dropped(except if my assumptions are wrong). I only expressed my rejection of frosbel and his heresy. There are some people in that list that I'm looking forward to reading their presentations and you are one of them. Bidam, OLAADEGBU and Tgirl have excussed themselves, Now you too. when you people are excusing yourselves like this it means we are losing people that will say the truth. And if we lose truth speakers then the conference will be filled with liars. Too bad.

Thanks for your kind words bro. The reason I want me excused is to allow other view points. Its not like only some people have monopoly of the truth or sound doctrine. I was privileged to present last year, I think we should let some others be used by God to bless us this year.

In fact, I'm nominating you, alexleo to handle a topic this year. No is not an option abeg.

Thanks

@alexleo

Forgive me for omitting your name. Its added now.

frosbel:

What is truth exactly, is it Jesus Truth or Portland Oregon Truth ?

If AF preach truth, why are they still preaching the LIE of the Tithe and a Mythical half god and half man.

A word of caution :

"They will turn their ears away from the truth and turn aside to myths." - 2 Timothy 4:4

Thanks.






myth [mith]
noun
1.
a traditional or legendary story, usually concerning some being or hero or event, with or without a determinable basis of fact or a natural explanation, especially one that is concerned with deities or demigods and explains some practice, rite, or phenomenon of nature.

Same rantings of a drowning beloved brother. May God deliver you. Amen.

DrummaBoy: @alexleo

Forgive me for omitting your name. Its added now.

Sorry bro that's an error. I'm not a pastor, I'm just an ordinary church member. I don't bring out time to do thorough bible study like pastors because of my business. That's bad of me though. Most times you see me ask too much questions here or argue much, its just for me to learn better, not that I know very well. I can only contribute where I think I know. Pls delete my name and save this house of my bad. God bless you.

Candour:

In fact, I'm nominating you, alexleo to handle a topic this year. No is not an option abeg.

Thanks

ERROR.