Empiree: I reason with Mac though. I think he's simply saying "following sunnah" is sufficient. nothing wrong with that. But others do too. I am not going to get involved in whether they truly saw the moon on Saturday or not. My understanding of situation like is reported in famous hadith that such fast has to be repaid if it's found later to be untrue (like Sultan retracted his position).

Mac and others, I think to remove doubt you should just repay one day fast to be at ease. We just be careful next time. My understanding is that this is NOT Kafara. It's not intentional. Kafara is linked with intention. Just repay and done with this argument. Moon sighting has always been questionable for donkey years. So pls get over this back n fourth brouhaha. This is a matter concerning authority. They are responsible not you and I. Do you even know that today (Tuesday) is the eld in some places too like Trinidad and other countries. And also some in Nigeria celebrate Eld on Tuesday. I wish Muslims can just get together and just wait for Makkah to make announcement for Ramadan and Haj yearly. That's easy instead of this or that. Pardon my ignorance though

Anyways pls get over this. It's Fajr in Makkah. Get up and make wudu NOW!!!!
http://www.searchtruth.com/tv.php

This is not a matter of "being on the safe side",it is a matter of "what is the the proper procedure for starting and ending Ramadan that we should all follow?"

No one has to be fasting in secret if the sunnah is followed. The only safe thing here is the sunnah and we should all decide if we want to follow it or not.

It amounts to hypocrisy to say you are following the sunnah and then be fasting in private because of some computer that obviously contradicts the sunnah!

The Sultan has not retracted his position, the report is simply kangaroo journalism from Premium Times.

This is a statement I culled from a brother fb post.It reads..

Despite the cloudy evening, the crescent of 3rd day of Shawwaal appears this Maghrib in Ede, South West Nigeria.
We have never doubted the Sultaan!

He made his assertion by regimenting it with the picture of the said crescent.So,just as it is stated,the Sultan acted on the information of pple across diff states which is not one or two,but atleast eight in this case.This I believe is not at variance with the sunnah of the prophet,so far the modalities for moonsighting in that popular ahadith is observed.And Allah knows best!

maclatunji:
The Sultan has not retracted his position, the report is simply kangaroo journalism from Premium Times.

okay. you have no problem then. After all, Surah Baqora tells us "punish us not if we forget or fall into error". I understand what you saying really but pls can we keep this argument off. We don't need this in this age when muslims are the center of everything.

While I do not fault those who followed the Sultan, or even the Sultan himself, I cannot help but disagree to the veracity of the reports brought to the Sultan.

We are not living in isolation, the world is now a Global village, matters in regards to the deen in any part of the globe concerns all, even with the fact that some issues, such as moon sighting is still based on locality.

Indeed, the Sultan followed the Sunnah, and Muslims followed the Sultan, to the best of my knowledge, no one is going against this. But do we turn blind eyes to facts, evidences and the truth?!
If we do not find a lasting solution to this issue, like other countries have, then we are just deceiving ourselves.

I know there is politics involved in this issue, but that does not interest me in the least, some of us are more informed than others, some of us are just laymen, just tell us what to do...

No one talking about science here is advocating we jettison the Sunnah, we know they both can work together, to give us the most accurate position, to erase all doubt, if you must know, the Sunnatic approach, is also scientific.

Please read the quotes below, I tried to present facts, questions and answers, which should give us all insight to were I and most people advocating science stand...

The Astronomical New Moon is on Saturday July 26, 2014 at 22:42 UT. There is no possibility of moonsighting on that day. On July 27, the moon can be seen with difficulty in South America, but can easily be seen in Polynesian Islands. However, there are not many Muslims reporting moonsighting. On July 28, the moon can easily be seen in almost the whole world, except Northern Asia and Europe (See visibility curves).



Old Crescent Moon (not the new moon to start Shawwal 1435 AH), July 26, 2014: This is decreasing moon that was sighted in the East at Fajr time on Saturday 26 July 2014 at 06:40 to 07:00 AM in Flat Bush suburb in Auckland New Zealand by naked eye. This is not the moon to start Shawwal. It was reported by an MCW member, Mr. Arief Syamsulaksana of Auckland. It is posted here to show the world that the moon seen in the morning before sunrise is actually decreasing moon while the New Moon is not even born yet. So Muslims understand that the sighting of decreasing moon has no significance for starting the Islamic month.

1.10   Question: Some argue that the predictions of astronomers in many astronomical phenomena are not precise. Therefore, how can we take their words regarding the 'hilal'? Are there any differences between these astronomical phenomena?

Answer: Prediction by astronomers are based on each individual study and research and they are different. Do not take their words. Always judge their words by observations. However, new moon birth can be calculated precisely.


2.1   Question: After the Moon Birth, how much time is required for people to sight the New Moon?

Answer: Time passed after New Moon Birth is called the age of the moon. Sighting is possible at different age in different months. So, age cannot be a criterion for sighting. Why is it so? Because, the orbit of the moon is elliptical and in its orbit, the moon moves faster when it is closer to the earth, and slower when it is farther from earth. When it moves faster, the moon becomes visible at smaller age (like 17 hours), and when it moves slower, it becomes visible at larger age (like 23 hours). The main factor that makes the moon visible is the angle between moon-earth-sun. When this angle becomes about 9 degrees, the moon starts to be visible. How much time it takes to get this angle depends upon the speed of the moon in its orbit.

2.2   Question: When has the earliest new moon crescent been seen after new moon was born? (Dec 4,1997)

Answer: Moon sighting does not depend on age. Non-Muslims have treated this question as a sport, "Who can see the youngest moon." In the zeal of their competition, they claim early and early sightings, which are in most cases false, as many claims have been refuted with no sighting at places thousands of miles west. There was an article in Quarterly Journal of Royal Astronomical Society, Q.J.R. Astr. Soc. (1993) 34, p53-56, "Records for young Moon Sightings," by Bradley Schaefer, Imad Ahmad, and LeRoy Doggett. They have refuted some sighting claims. However, they accepted the two following claims:

1. Morning crescent on Sep 14, 1871, Age -15.4h at Athens Greece, seen by Schmidt (Naked eye)
2. Evening crescent on May 5, 1989, Age 13.47h East Lansing, MI, seen by Victor (Binocular only)

Both of these claims are questionable; the first one with naked eye has been a record so old that it has not been met in the recent century, and therefore is doubtful. There is no way it can be justified. The second one is questionable, as I, Khalid Shaukat had talked to Bob Victor who told me that there were two other persons with him and they could not see the moon. Moreover, from Michigan to West coast, no where it was seen. This paper also did not accept May 5, 1989 sighting of Badat in Houston reported by "Mohib Durrani." The article mentions that reported altitude was wrong. I personally talked to Badat and he told me he casually looked over his shoulder as he was standing for Maghrib prayers and he saw the moon quite high. The authentic naked eye sightings are at about 17.2 hours, and 15.5 hours by observatory telescopes. Remember, in some seasons, earliest moonsighting takes about 24 hours. So if the moon has become 17 hours old or more, one can not conclude that it is possible to see that moon.

2.3   Question: What is the record time between a new moon and its first possible sighting, and is this result available for every point on earth? (Jan 15,1998)

Answer: No, this result is certainly not available for every point on earth. According to different individual claims, the record time between new moon and its sighting varies for naked eye, and aided eye (binocular or telescope). Dr. Doggett of U.S. Naval Observatory, Dr. Schaefer of Yale University, and Dr. Ahmad, a Professional astronomer have written a research paper on a collection of most early sighting claims, Q.J.R. Astr. Soc. (1993) 34, p53-56, "Records for young Moon Sightings." For naked eye, claims are with the age 0 to 15.4 hours, but all claims less than 15 hours are not considered credible by professional experts in this field for various reasons. Some were reported a few days or weeks later, some few month later and in some cases, it was found that skies were overcast in that area, so claims were made for wrong dates. For aided eye, claims less than 13.47 hours are not considered credible.

However, one point must be understood, and that is, even if a moon was sighted at the age 15.4 hours by naked eye, or 13.47 hours by aided eye, it does not mean that every time moon age reaches those limits, it could be visible. In some months, moon could not be visible any place on the globe until it becomes 23 hours old. That still does not mean that a 23 hour old moon will always be visible from every place on the globe.

2.4   Question: What is the "scientific" basis for the apparently accepted view that the moon cannot be sighted with naked eye if it younger than 13 hours or so? (Dec 24, 1998)

Answer: Scientific basis is that in 13 hours, the angular separation of the moon from sun is between 7.2° to 8.5°. The angular separation (elongation) is the most important factor in moon's visibility besides several other factors combined. At the angle 7°, no sun light reflected from the moon can come to the earth meaning that the crescent is not formed to see from earth (This is due to the mountains on the surface of the moon that block the sunlight coming to the earth - Danjon effect). Between 7.2 and 8.5° the crescent is invisible to the eyes, because the brightness of this thin crescent is less than the sky brightness on the horizon. At elongation less than about 7.5° even telescopes do not pick the thin crescent. This is the discussion for naked eye versus telescope or binocular sightings.

The published record for moonsighting with bare eyes shows that no one has ever seen the crescent of less than 15.4 hours old [See "Records of Young Moon Sightings, Quarterly Journal of Royal Astronomical Society (1993) 34, 53-56, article by Schaefer, Ahmad, and Doggett]. This sighting was done on Sep 14, 1871 CE. The angular separation was 9.3°. That was in the previous century, when atmospheric pollution, and city light pollution did not exist. Now, it is not possible to see even this kind of crescent. In recent times the crescent that has been seen with naked eye had the angle of 10.5° which corresponds to 17 to 21 hours of age. Remember, even 17 to 21 hours age does not mean that every moon of this age will be visible. There are other factors that must meet the certain minimum for a crescent to be visible.

Perhaps, Allah wants this controversy to help us find a better and lasting solution to this perennial problem of moon sighting in Nigeria.

And Only Allah Knows best.

Ever Wonder Why?
I wonder, why our Ulamaa' (Scholars) issue Fatwas, which seem ridiculous. For example,:
(1) 300 years ago, when clocks and watches were invented; using those devices not allowed per Fatwas of that time for prayer times.
(2) 150 years ago, translating Qur'an in any other language was considered a tabu, and was not allowed per Fatwas by Ulamaa of that time.
(3) 100 years ago, in India, calculated Prayer Times were not acceptable per Fatwas by Ulamaa of that time.
(4) 60 years ago, loud speakers use for Prayers was considered Haraam, per Fatwas by Ulamma' in Indo-Pak.
(5) 50 years ago, taking picture for ID or passports was considered Haraam, per Fatwas by Ulamma' in Indo-Pak.
Now, all the above is considered, not only allowed, but people don't even know that these were not allowed before. Why, it takes decades for Ulamaa' to accept such things.
(6) For the last 30 years, Ulamaa' do not accept moon-sighting by telescope.
Would it take another few decades to accept that??

Quotes were taken from: http://moonsighting.com/faq_ms.html

sino:
Quotes were taken from: http://moonsighting.com/faq_ms.html

Jazakumullahu khair jazal. Thanks for that comprehensive link. There's no way technological advancement would replace sunnah. The two (Quran/sunnah and modern science/science to come) are perfect match. We only need proper interpretation.

If Allah talks about "conquest of heavens and exploration of earth by the granted authority of Him", "rotation of moon and sun and other heavenly bodies on their axis", alternation of days and night" etc etc all these are ours to study for a better life towards the goal of life. How can anybody then reasons technology is Bid'ah?

Our Ulama and "traditional religious muslim leaders" should better step up and study various field of science and technology rather than being rigid in their interpretations of "sunnah".

True talk Baqir

For the record https://www.nairaland.com/1835066/id-controversy-sultans-announcement-stands

Brothers, let us talk about something else. E don do

Maclatunji is very correct on this. The leader has announced the sighting, we are all expected to break our fast. And it doesn't matter if we were the only who broke the fast on Sunday.
If Allah intends good for His slave, He bestow on him the understanding of the deen. Islam is very simple and straight forward.

AbdH: @AlBaqir,
the witness of one person was sufficient during the prophet's (SAW) time, why should less than fifty witnesses be insufficient now?

I'm confused.

jazaakAllahu khayr. 1000likes