JMAN05:


So your conclusions are not based on facts, but on the seeming inconsistencies? Ok. But I want to know the other guy's reasons.

Can i ask you some questions pls?

Do you believe in a being predestined by God?...... Human Destiny or fate?
Is God omniscient?
Is he truly the Alpha and Omega? ... Did he truly knows the end?
Is he a good God or a bad one?
Is he ever perfect?

p.s; I ask this questions in a Christian context...

Thank you.....

macof:


That's hope. Prayer itself is an act of hope

u are seriously missing it bro. Do u think prayer is just asking God for something ?
Prayer is also an act of worship, it a staff to walk wit God(God dat we don't c but we c it mighty work ) in spirit and truth
our faith show forth our work.

micynute94:


Can i ask you some questions pls?

Do you believe in a being predestined by God?...... Human Destiny or fate?

Our life is not predestined. We are given a choice, and our actions are our doing. Deut 30:19

Is God omniscient?

God has the power to foreknow, but He does not use it always. It is like a girl who has a gift to sing. But this does not mean that she will be singing every single second.

Is he truly the Alpha and Omega? ... Did he truly knows the end?

He does know what the end will be, but the bible does not show that He has predestined that end. He has not designated all those who will be destroyed and those who will be saved. Salvation is for those who "wishes". Rev. 22:17

Is he a good God or a bad one?
Is he ever perfect?

He is a good God, and he is perfect in the absolute sense. He is the one who provides the definition of true goodness and perfection. Our definition on that is limited.

JMAN05:


Our life is not predestined. We are given a choice, and our actions are our doing. Deut 30:19

God has the power to foreknow, but He does not use it always. It is like a girl who has a gift to sing. But this does not mean that she will be singing every single second.

What's the essence of having the power to foreknow and not using it always. Your explanation using a girl has a flaw in the sense that we ain't discussing about human here but a super power being whom the rest of the world rely on to be their light and other things.
Lets take a scenario for example, a guardian lighted a candle and instead of placing it somewhere safe beyond the reach of a kid, he placed it on the table telling the kid not to touch it as it might burn him if touched and cause pain. The kid in question nodded to show he understood what he was trying to pass across.

No sooner had he gone out of the door, the kid knowing the consequences still decides to touch the yellow burning flame cos it looks so cool and beautiful to be really dangerous, so out of curiosity, the kid tried touching it and in the process .. (a lot of scenario can occur here)

a. it burned his finger, he wept and cried and on getting back, you had to administer a first aid treatment to him

b. the fire burned his finger and in his response to remove his hand, he mistakenly knocked the candle to floor which started burning the (Lets say ) rug or carpet in the room. This situation can cause some chain reactions such as
I. the baby choking or suffocating because of the smokes and depletion of oxygen.
II. the fire could spread around the house and ignite other flammable or combustible material, spreading it more around the house causing damages and loss of properties. By this time, the kid would have been long dead.
III. quick intervention of the guardian on timely arrival to save the kid, put the fire off and probably take the kid to an hospital for check up or /and treatment. All these still causes the guardian some time and money.

Other scenarios might happened, the candle flame might even die off before touching the ground or as a result of non flammable material on the ground. Even with this scenario, the kid not knowing how lucky he is will try doing it next time since nothing happened to him leading to the scenarios mentioned above.

The question now is why couldn't the guardian place the candle out of reach from the kid knowing fully well what will happen if he made the choice to touch the candle which brings me to a theory or stance.
The guardian having the power to foreknow should know that even with his warnings and advice,the kid will still touch the candle.
Saying the kid had a choice doesn't really work here as the guardian already should know what will happen even with the factor of choice.
Bringing the choice issue as a factor negates the stand he knows what will happen in the future. He can only A will happen if X does this or B will happen if X does otherwise. This in itself is not foreknowing .. i mean the future... , this is more like an experience thing. meaning he (the guardian ) can only say what will happen if the kid does A or B out of experience or knowledge gained but can't categorically say the kid will do this or that. This disprove that the guardian knows the future.

He does know what the end will be, but the bible does not show that He has predestined that end. He has not designated all those who will be destroyed and those who will be saved. Salvation is for those who "wishes". Rev. 22:17

Saying that the Bible does not show.. has a flaw.
Does the Bible says in clear terms that ladies should not wear a trouser or man plait his hair, since trouser ain't invented then ?
Does it say in clear terms that drinking is a sin?
.. What am trying to pass across is that a lot of what we know in the Bible has to do with a lot of deductive reasoning with the help of the Holy Spirit. So you telling me the Bible didn't show is like asking me to start citing a lot of laws Christian uphold which is out of deductive reasoning rather than the Bible saying it directly.
I will say no more here.
p.s: Who then predestined the end he knew if it ain't him?

He is a good God, and he is perfect in the absolute sense. He is the one who provides the definition of true goodness and perfection. Our definition on that is limited.

I agree with you to some extent

The book of revelation talks about the doom of the devil, his servants and followers. right??
It also talks about hell fire.

This revelation is a future thing right?
Now, who revealed this to the author of Revelation....
Are u quite certain this future will happen?
Considering no words comes out of God that won't come to pass.... This revelation is a sure thing? i mean the fire, the brimstone, the anguish etc?
@ JMAN05..
Thanks for your time

micynute94:
The book of revelation talks about the doom of the devil, his servants and followers. right??
It also talks about hell fire.

This revelation is a future thing right?
Now, who revealed this to the author of Revelation....
Are u quite certain this future will happen?
Considering no words comes out of God that won't come to pass.... This revelation is a sure thing? i mean the fire, the brimstone, the anguish etc?
@ JMAN05..
Thanks for your time

Satan and his cohorts will meet doom.

2. It never talked about hell fire.

3. God gave the revelation to Jesus, and Jesus to an Angel, and the Angel to John.

4. The revelation will happen.

5. Rev. 1:1 shows that the vision is revelation is presented in signs/symbolism. The fire, and brimstone or fire and sulfur symbolizes eternal destruction. Not to be taken literally.

micynute94:

What's the essence of having the power to foreknow and not using it always. Your explanation using a girl has a flaw in the sense that we ain't discussing about human here but a super power being whom the rest of the world rely on to be their light and other things.
Lets take a scenario for example, a guardian lighted a candle and instead of placing it somewhere safe beyond the reach of a kid, he placed it on the table telling the kid not to touch it as it might burn him if touched and cause pain. The kid in question nodded to show he understood what he was trying to pass across.

No sooner had he gone out of the door, the kid knowing the consequences still decides to touch the yellow burning flame cos it looks so cool and beautiful to be really dangerous, so out of curiosity, the kid tried touching it and in the process .. (a lot of scenario can occur here)

a. it burned his finger, he wept and cried and on getting back, you had to administer a first aid treatment to him

b. the fire burned his finger and in his response to remove his hand, he mistakenly knocked the candle to floor which started burning the (Lets say ) rug or carpet in the room. This situation can cause some chain reactions such as
I. the baby choking or suffocating because of the smokes and depletion of oxygen.
II. the fire could spread around the house and ignite other flammable or combustible material, spreading it more around the house causing damages and loss of properties. By this time, the kid would have been long dead.
III. quick intervention of the guardian on timely arrival to save the kid, put the fire off and probably take the kid to an hospital for check up or /and treatment. All these still causes the guardian some time and money.

Other scenarios might happened, the candle flame might even die off before touching the ground or as a result of non flammable material on the ground. Even with this scenario, the kid not knowing how lucky he is will try doing it next time since nothing happened to him leading to the scenarios mentioned above.

The question now is why couldn't the guardian place the candle out of reach from the kid knowing fully well what will happen if he made the choice to touch the candle which brings me to a theory or stance.
The guardian having the power to foreknow should know that even with his warnings and advice,the kid will still touch the candle.
Saying the kid had a choice doesn't really work here as the guardian already should know what will happen even with the factor of choice.
Bringing the choice issue as a factor negates the stand he knows what will happen in the future. He can only A will happen if X does this or B will happen if X does otherwise. This in itself is not foreknowing .. i mean the future... , this is more like an experience thing. meaning he (the guardian ) can only say what will happen if the kid does A or B out of experience or knowledge gained but can't categorically say the kid will do this or that. This disprove that the guardian knows the future.

You are still using a human example while saying we are not talking about humans. But I can use a human as an example because the bible uses earthly things to tell us heavenly things at times. In using illustration, you aim is to buttress a point and not to use the exact same thing you want to illustrate.

Your illustration is far from the point I want to make. My point is that God has an ability to foreknow the future, but He doesn't use this ability always as the scriptures indicate. When God do not use this ability, it means that He wouldn't know the outcome. He has lovingly left that free moral agent to decide his fate.

Lets use your illustration, but let a short adult replace the kid in the illustration. lets assume that touching the candle will automatically raze the whole building. Lets also assume that the father of that guy didn't weigh the guy's height before placing the candle. He left, only to come back and see the bad result. Now, the father have the ability to weigh the guy's height correctly, and ascertain the level his hands cant reach, but he chooses not to do it. Rather he gives the guy a warning not to touch the candle. He left him as free moral agent he is, and then having stated the punishment for any step he makes. So the father has the ability to weigh his height, but choses not to do so. Thats the case here.

Saying that the Bible does not show.. has a flaw.
Does the Bible says in clear terms that ladies should not wear a trouser or man plait his hair, since trouser ain't invented then ?
Does it say in clear terms that drinking is a sin?
.. What am trying to pass across is that a lot of what we know in the Bible has to do with a lot of deductive reasoning with the help of the Holy Spirit. So you telling me the Bible didn't show is like asking me to start citing a lot of laws Christian uphold which is out of deductive reasoning rather than the Bible saying it directly.
I will say no more here.
p.s: Who then predestined the end he knew if it ain't him?

The bible clearly leads to that conclusion dear. It is only illogical not reaching that conclusion.

JMAN05:


You are still using a human example while saying we are not talking about humans. But I can use a human as an example because the bible uses earthly things to tell us heavenly things at times. In using illustration, you aim is to buttress a point and not to use the exact same thing you want to illustrate.

Your illustration is far from the point I want to make. My point is that God has an ability to foreknow the future, but He doesn't use this ability always as the scriptures indicate. When God do not use this ability, it means that He wouldn't know the outcome. He has lovingly left that free moral agent to decide his fate.

Lets use your illustration, but let a short adult replace the kid in the illustration. lets assume that touching the candle will automatically raze the whole building. Lets also assume that the father of that guy didn't weigh the guy's height before placing the candle. He left, only to come back and see the bad result. Now, the father have the ability to weigh the guy's height correctly, and ascertain the level his hands cant reach, but he chooses not to do it. Rather he gives the guy a warning not to touch the candle. He left him as free moral agent he is, and then having stated the punishment for any step he makes. So the father has the ability to weigh his height, but choses not to do so. Thats the case here.



The bible clearly leads to that conclusion dear. It is only illogical not reaching that conclusion.

I think i like you. I love ur way of reasoning bro.. would v loved arguing more with better point but using a phone to type is stressful and u have a lovely way of answering a question..
The points i laid out was meant to test you and ur perception, not as a Christian but your acceptance and view of it.
I was expecting you would have done a lot of scrutinizing my reply then looking for a weak pt which i obviously put there to test your extremity level..
well, 4 now.. gotta say Thank u and Bye.
One of these days when am around a system and u have some free time. We d do some enlightenment. what say you?

micynute94:


I think i like you. I love ur way of reasoning bro.. would v loved arguing more with better point but using a phone to type is stressful and u have a lovely way of answering a question..
The points i laid out was meant to test you and ur perception, not as a Christian but your acceptance and view of it.
I was expecting you would have done a lot of scrutinizing my reply then looking for a weak pt which i obviously put there to test your extremity level..
well, 4 now.. gotta say Thank u and Bye.
One of these days when am around a system and u have some free time. We d do some enlightenment. what say you?

No problem.

JMAN05:




Your illustration is far from the point I want to make. My point is that God has an ability to foreknow the future, but He doesn't use this ability always as the scriptures indicate.

If the scriptures don't say that, where did you obtain this information about HOW God uses his superpower abilities?

Weah96:


If the scriptures don't say that, where did you obtain this information about HOW God uses his superpower abilities?

scriptures indicate.