MrPresident:
he didnt fulfil any shiiit, jesus (if he even existed) left this place worse than he met it,

MrPresident:
he didnt fulfil any shiiit, jesus (if he even existed) left this place worse than he met it,

malvisguy212:
This thread is not for atheists.

malvisguy212:
Christians are far more likely than
atheists to be part of groups that work
hard to instill values about being good to
other people, and having good
relationships. The teachings of the Bible
emphasize values such as honesty, love,
forgiveness, patience, and generosity.
Many of these values are not
emphasized in social circles dominated
by atheists.

johnydon22:


Which society is dominated by atheists? this one?
Are you sure this guy is on planet earth or jupiter

[size=20] 2billion christians, 1.8billion muslims, 800million hindus.. mmmmhmmm
with the world now? y'all are doing one hell of a job tho [/size]

malvisguy212:
I did not say society I said social circle
A social circle is a group of socially
interconnected people. The internet can be view as one, atheists dominate the internet,it is the only way to preach atheism and atheists on the internet are arrogance.

johnydon22:


Hhmmmmpf am still wondering which is arrogance..

The one that says This assertions are implausible, i dont believe it unless you give me proof

or the one that says

Either believe me or burn in hell forever

Its clear bro ..

oneda:
Malvisguy thanks for this beautiful explanation. I have nearly received blows trying to explain this same subject to grace only practitioners who say that Jesus cancelled the law therefore it is no longer applicable today.

I'll humbly request that we share ideas and grow more and more in the knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. I have PM you.

MrPresident:
he didnt fulfil any shiiit, jesus (if he even existed) left this place worse than he met it,

johnydon22:
And malvisguy just gave his own meaning

Joyful77:
"Do not think that I [Jesus] have come to abolish the Law (the Old Testament) or the Prophets;  I have not come to abolish them but to fulfil them.  I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law (the Old Testament) until everything is accomplished" (Matthew 5:17-18)

Jesus came to fulfil the brutal laws of the old testament; laws of rape, laws of mass killings, laws of smashing children against the ground, laws of ripping pregnant women open, laws of eating flesh of fellow men!


Op, I will remember this one as YOUR OWN version, as opposed to the ORIGINAL Version that Jesus stated CLEARLY enough!

Joyful77:
"Do not think that I [Jesus] have come to abolish the Law (the Old Testament) or the Prophets;  I have not come to abolish them but to fulfil them.  I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law (the Old Testament) until everything is accomplished" (Matthew 5:17-18)

Jesus came to fulfil the brutal laws of the old testament; laws of rape, laws of mass killings, laws of smashing children against the ground, laws of ripping pregnant women open, laws of eating flesh of fellow men!


Op, I will remember this one as YOUR OWN version, as opposed to the ORIGINAL Version that Jesus stated CLEARLY enough!

malvisguy212:
I thought you are a muslim, from the above post, I believe you are an atheist, this thread is not for atheists. Peace

grandstar:


Jesus did come to fulfil the law and thank God he did! But was does that mean?

Imagine you were given a contract to supply 10,000 bags of rice at 10,000naira and you supply it and get paid? Have you not fulfilled it? Once fulfilled, would the contract not have ended?

That is why the scriptures says Christ is the end of the Law.

The Law was the tutor leading to Christ. Upon his death which fulfilled the Law, the Law came to an end.(Read Galatians Chapter 3)

Joyful77:


Hmm... Thank you for your time.

But I don't agree with you. Laws in scriptures are NOT meant to be a 'one time affair' as you portrayed it here. They're laid down instructions to be followed by men for as long as life exists.

Joyful77:


La ila ila Allah, Muhammad Rasul'Allah (SalAllahu Alaihi Wasalam)..... I'm a Muslim.

But what does it matter if I was an Atheist? The validity of your point should NOT depend on my religious affiliation.

Peace onto you too!

malvisguy212:
Firstly, what is the law, and what is its
purpose?
The law is a manifestation of the perfect
holiness of God, and was given to us
(humanity) to show how utterly unable
we are to meet God's standard by our
own means, strength or works (Romans
7:7).

When the law was introduced, it was
never intended to be the instrument by
which man would save himself, but it
was the instrument through which man
was to be saved. In a very real sense,
man is saved through the fulfilment
(keeping) of the law. When Christ fulfilled the law, he earned the privilege of life.

The law shows us our sinfulness as a
contrast to God's holiness. Old Testament
saints who were called righteous relied
upon the grace of God for their right
standing with God, not their success at
keeping the law.

When Jesus is said to have fulfilled the
law, it means that>>>>
HE PERFECTLY KEPT THE
LAW AND HE IS A PERFECT EXAMPLE TO FOLLOW, AND NEVER SINNED (1 Peter
2:22). This was therefore a manifestation
of and testimony to His deity.

Obviously
something no other man could possibly
do.
He didn't come to abolish the law means
that the law remains the law and is (still)
perfect (Romans 7:12). Even after we
enter the New Pact in Jesus' blood (Mark
14:24), which places believers under
grace not under law (Romans 6:15),
therefore in a sense abolishing the law
for believers, the law remains as a
testament of God's holiness and our
inability to meet His standard.

Something
that remains true even after conversion
(Romans 7:19).


It meant that He never sinned, and
therefore that He is God. As a result of
that, it also means His sacrifice was a full
(infinite) payment for sin, and therefore
that the just punishment for
transgression of the law (of all believers)
was fulfilled too. He fulfilled the law for
us, because we couldn't. He didn't come
to abolish the law, because He didn't just
say "the law no longer applies", He came
to pay the penalty for the breaking of the
law.

When Jesus came to fulfil the law (i.e.
obedience leads to life; disobedience
leads to death) he did just that. Notice
He didn't say, that old law's not good,
don't worry about it (i.e. abolish it); what
he did, instead, was to come saying the
law is good, and he is the fulfulment of
it.

malvisguy212:
your post doesent sound like a muslim, is more like an atheist.

I will like you to answer the above post, what are the law in Islam?

Goshen360:
You can never understand that verse until you dig the connection between "abolish" and "fulfill" the law. It simply means "somethings are written IN THE LAW about him and that's what he came TO FULFILL, NOT TO ABOLISH". [size=14pt] He's not telling you to "continue" to keep the law is he had already fulfill it and it wasn't written about you [/size] and to you in the for place, it was written for you.

truthman2012:


Good writeup bro.

The Law is good because it was given by God but Grace is better as it gives God's children the ability to live by God's laws.

Law was never cancelled but fulfilled by Christ. Under the dispensation of the law, it was on paper. People read or memorize them to observe them. People knew them but could not fulfil them wholly because a break of one of them make a person a sinner. Under the law, forgiveness is not obtainable as break of any one attracts punishment. This is the reason Apostle Paul said ''by practice of the law shall no flesh be justified (Romans 3:20). You cannot be perfect by practicing the law. Anyone who commits fornication/adultery at that time would be stoned to death without forgiveness.It is almost like what exists in the world justice system today. A break of any law is not subject to forgiveness because punishment is always attached to the break. I have not seen a court judge discharging a person who has been proven to break the law.

Then, are we not to observe the laws because Christ had fulfilled them for us and we are now under Grace? Does it mean we can now lie, commit fornication and do anything that pleases us? The answer is no.
''But if, while we seek to be
justified by Christ, we
ourselves also are found
sinners, is therefore Christ
the minister of sin? God
forbid'' (Galatians 2:17).

While the law is on paper in the OT, it is in our heart in the NT, made easy to be fulfilled by the Holy Spirit.
And when he is come, he will
reprove the world of sin, and
of righteousness, and of
judgment (John 16:.

It is for the fulfilment of the Law God promised the NT in the OT:
I will give you a new
heart and put a new spirit
in you; I will remove from
you your heart of stone
and give you a heart of
flesh (Ezekiel 36:26).
''This is the covenant that I
will make with them after
those days, saith the Lord, I
will put my laws into their
hearts, and in their minds
will I write them'' (Heb. 10:16).

The new spirit and the new heart are obtainable after rebirth in Christ i.e after being born again.

Just like it was impossible to fulfil the law in the OT with the old spirit and old heart, so it is even now. Anyone that is not born again, having the new spirit and new heart cannot fulfil the Law of God.

Joyful77:


[size=14pt] In other words, Jesus said "Do what I say, NOT what I do"!!! [/size]

Goshen360:
You can never understand that verse until you dig the connection between "abolish" and "fulfill" the law. It simply means "somethings are written IN THE LAW about him and that's what he came TO FULFILL, NOT TO ABOLISH". He's not telling you to "continue" to keep the law is he had already fulfill it and it wasn't written about you and to you in the for place, it was written for you.

malvisguy212:
I like your explanation, we are all here to learn from each other.

The advantage of the law is to revealed our sinful nature(if the law do not say, you shall not kill.,I wouldn't have known that) but man still find it hard to keep the law, the question is What motivate God to meet our need(grace)? It's love;
Romans 5:8
8 But God demonstrates His own love
toward us, in that while we were yet
sinners, Christ died for us.
John15:13
13 “Greater love has no one than this,
that one lay down his life for his
friends.

Grace is an umarited favour from God, we all are sinner and cannot keep the law. The bible defined salvation as the work of God base on the belief of Jesus christ, if we believe in Jesus christ. We will not sin or break the law .we are not under the law of sin and death.