Barnabaseloka:

'who walk not after the flesh (continue not in sin) but after the spirit (live righteously).' You can take it or leave it.

Bros go online,get original manuscripts ask any true Pastor or preacher.
What Romans 8:1 says,read and compare over 100 translations.

Barnabaseloka:

'who walk not after the flesh (continue not in sin) but after the spirit (live righteously).' You can take it or leave it.

Go online and scour the internet.
Get original manuscripts and texs.
Compare over 100 translations,
ask any true pastor or preacher.
All that is Rom8:1 is
"there is now no condemantion to those who are in Christ."

sportsmaster:

Go online and scour the internet.
Get original manuscripts and texs.
Compare over 100 translations,
ask any true pastor or preacher.
All that is Rom8:1 is
"there is now no condemantion to those who are in Christ."

my brother you get time oo. they will still argue with you from now till whenever. Can't you see i have ignored them? plz stop replying them, he who chooses to wallow in ignorance, let them wallow. It is not their fault but that was their orientation from the get go. It takes knowledge to liberate them..... plz stop wasting your time on them.

sportsmaster:

Go online and scour the internet.
Get original manuscripts and texs.
Compare over 100 translations,
ask any true pastor or preacher.
All that is Rom8:1 is
"there is now no condemantion to those who are in Christ."

Gal.6:7 Do not be deceived God is not mocked, for whatever a man sows, that he will also reap
8. For he who sows to his flesh (sinful nature) will of the flesh reap corruption, but he who sows to the Spirit will of the Spirit reap everlasting life.

To those who believe in 'once saved ever saved', I need answers to these questions:
1. Was Paul writing to unbelievers or to believers in Gal 5:19-21?
21. Envy, murders and drunkenness, revelries, and the like; of which I tell you beforehand, just as I also told you in time past, that those who PRACTICE (do, engage in) such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.
2. Will believers, such as Ananias and Sapphira, Dermas, Judas Iscariot, etc, who do not hold on to their faith and die going to possess the kingdom of God?
3. Was Jesus serious in warning his followers about hellfire, telling them to take away anything that causes them to sin?
4. What disqualification was Paul talking about in 1 Corinth 9:27 But I discipline my body and bring it into subjection, lest, when I have preached to others, I myself should become disqualified?

Scholar8200:
I have read through and if I get you very well, I would summarise your point as Vs 13 below:
Matthew 24:12,13
12 And because iniquity shall abound, the love of many shall wax cold.
13 But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.

and
Revelations 3:11
Behold, I come quickly: hold that fast which thou hast, that no man take thy crown.

If I am right, then no problem.

Regarding those who believed and later backslid, we cannot scripturally write them off as those that never truly believed; there are some that actually believed but turned back. My premise for this is:

2 Peter 2:20,21
20 For if after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, they are again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning.
21 For it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered unto them.

and Hebrews 10:29
29 of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?

Both passages show that the people concerned actually got saved and were sanctified by the blood of Jesus and experienced the ministry of the Holy Spirit of grace.

In case you feel they are interpreted out of context, kindly give your own explanation against the backdrop of the context where they are taken from.

@bolded. Not true dear. The problem some of us have is that we read the doctrine of insecurity into various passages and if we approach most of them without preconceived ideas, we would see that they have nothing to do with "salvation can be lost".

And of course they ones you cited are interpreted out of context.

Firstly, it will be dishonest of us to take the few obscure portions of the scripture to overthrow the plain. It is a fact that the nature of a believer's salvation is eternal as it has been said clearly in the bible. There are just too many scriptures backing this fact.

And when interpreting, we interpret the obscure portions in the light of those that are crystal clear! Doing the opposite makes you a false teacher! Okay, am not calling you a false teacher yet...no not yet or maybe never. But we have to understand the implication of teaching wrongly!

To interpret any of the passages you mentioned as saying that a born again child of God can lose his
salvation flies in the face of hundreds of clear passages of Scripture.

When the context of a Bible passage is plainly directed to the subject of salvation, there is
never a question about the security of the believer.

2 PETER 2:20-22. Though this passage is often used to prove that eternal security is not true, it actually says nothing about losing ones salvation. The context is false teachers who promote damnable heresies and deny the Lord (v. 1). It should be obvious that it is not saved men who are the focus on this passage, but hypocrites and deceivers . Any interpretation which says these are saved men who lose their salvation flies in the face of the context. The fact that “the latter end is worse with them than the beginning” and “it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness” does not imply that they were saved and now are lost. They were dogs and pigs who were unchanged (v. 22) . The fact that they return to their wickedness proves that they were never regenerate. When the context is taken into account, there really is no problem in this passage in regard to the doctrine of eternal security.


[b] HEBREWS 10:26-29. The willful sin in verse 26 refers not to sin in general, but to one particular sin which is described in the rest of the passage . The Bible plainly teaches us that Christians do sin after they are saved (1 John 1:8-10; 2:1-2). There is no sinless perfection in the Christian life. Our perfection and righteousness is in Jesus Christ positionally (1 Cor. 1:30; 2 Cor. 5:21). The sin for which there is no forgiveness is the sin of “counting the blood of the covenant an unholy thing.”

This means to deny that salvation is by Christ’s blood and grace alone. In the immediate context to which the book of Hebrews was addressed, it refers to the
Jews who professed confidence in Christ; but, because of pressure and persecution, returned to their dead religion and thus gave up confidence in Christ. False religion, both then and now, attempts either to replace Christ’s salvation with a manmade system, or to add to Christ’s salvation a manmade system. Catholicism is an example of the latter. It preaches Christ, but it intermingles its own sacraments and priesthood and sainthood with the grace of Christ. This is a false gospel
which robs Christ of His glory as the sole Saviour and Mediator. If Christ is not Saviour wholly and exclusively, He is not Saviour at all. If grace is intermingled in
any sense with works, the Gospel is perverted, and there is no salvation in a perverted gospel (Rom. 11:6; Gal. 1:6-9).[/b]

I hope this helps.

jiggaz:
Excellent Explanation!!! But watch out, they ll still argue it. Stop wasting your time my dear.

I don't mind at all

An2elect2:
I don't mind at all

Ok no wahala.

Barnabaseloka:
To those who believe in 'once saved ever saved', I need answers to these questions:
1. Was Paul writing to unbelievers or to believers in Gal 5:19-21?
21. Envy, murders and drunkenness, revelries, and the like; of which I tell you beforehand, just as I also told you in time past, that those who PRACTICE (do, engage in) such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.
2. Will believers, such as Ananias and Sapphira, Dermas, Judas Iscariot, etc, who do not hold on to their faith and die going to possess the kingdom of God?
3. Was Jesus serious in warning his followers about hellfire, telling them to take away anything that causes them to sin?
4. What disqualification was Paul talking about in 1 Corinth 9:27 But I discipline my body and bring it into subjection, lest, when I have preached to others, I myself should become disqualified?

Thank you bro.
I would at least have expected the op who say these are out-of-context, give us his correct ,within context explanations!

It's unfortunate that op who claims to have 'grace' cannot even manifest something as basic as patience/longsuffering in understanding other's views but a quick resort to name calling!

Even the biological descendants of Abraham were denied the land when they did not continue in the faith, will it be logical to say that that means they were never Abraham's biological descendants?!

An2elect2:


@bolded. Not true dear. The problem some of us have is that we read the doctrine of insecurity into various passages and if we approach most of them without preconceived ideas, we would see that they have nothing to do with "salvation can be lost".

And of course they ones you cited are interpreted out of context.

Firstly, it will be dishonest of us to take the few obscure portions of the scripture to overthrow the plain. It is a fact that the nature of a believer's salvation is eternal as it has been said clearly in the bible. There are just too many scriptures backing this fact.

And when interpreting, we interpret the obscure portions in the light of those that are crystal clear! Doing the opposite makes you a false teacher! Okay, am not calling you a false teacher yet...no not yet or maybe never. But we have to understand the implication of teaching wrongly!

To interpret any of the passages you mentioned as saying that a born again child of God can lose his
salvation flies in the face of hundreds of clear passages of Scripture.

When the context of a Bible passage is plainly directed to the subject of salvation, there is
never a question about the security of the believer.

2 PETER 2:20-22. Though this passage is often used to prove that eternal security is not true, it actually says nothing about losing ones salvation. The context is false teachers who promote damnable heresies and deny the Lord (v. 1). It should be obvious that it is not saved men who are the focus on this passage, but hypocrites and deceivers . Any interpretation which says these are saved men who lose their salvation flies in the face of the context. The fact that “the latter end is worse with them than the beginning” and “it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness” does not imply that they were saved and now are lost. They were dogs and pigs who were unchanged (v. 22) . The fact that they return to their wickedness proves that they were never regenerate. When the context is taken into account, there really is no problem in this passage in regard to the doctrine of eternal security.


[b] HEBREWS 10:26-29. The willful sin in verse 26 refers not to sin in general, but to one particular sin which is described in the rest of the passage . The Bible plainly teaches us that Christians do sin after they are saved (1 John 1:8-10; 2:1-2). There is no sinless perfection in the Christian life. Our perfection and righteousness is in Jesus Christ positionally (1 Cor. 1:30; 2 Cor. 5:21). The sin for which there is no forgiveness is the sin of “counting the blood of the covenant an unholy thing.”

This means to deny that salvation is by Christ’s blood and grace alone. In the immediate context to which the book of Hebrews was addressed, it refers to the
Jews who professed confidence in Christ; but, because of pressure and persecution, returned to their dead religion and thus gave up confidence in Christ. False religion, both then and now, attempts either to replace Christ’s salvation with a manmade system, or to add to Christ’s salvation a manmade system. Catholicism is an example of the latter. It preaches Christ, but it intermingles its own sacraments and priesthood and sainthood with the grace of Christ. This is a false gospel
which robs Christ of His glory as the sole Saviour and Mediator. If Christ is not Saviour wholly and exclusively, He is not Saviour at all. If grace is intermingled in
any sense with works, the Gospel is perverted, and there is no salvation in a perverted gospel (Rom. 11:6; Gal. 1:6-9).[/b]

I hope this helps.

Thanks for your effort and civility. Pls I am not trying to win an argument nor display knowledge;

Salvation is obtained through a Divine-human partnership; Jesus has fulfilled the Divine but we need to repent and believe with the heart before we can be born of the Spirit.
Else we wont need to preach since after God's part, everybody is saved! As to the Divine part, it is Eternal because God cannot change; but the call to watch arises because man can change not because he was not truly saved but because he remains a free moral agent!


I ,however, will still like to draw your attention to 2 Peter 2 that shows the people in question had escaped the pollutions of the world through Christ:they had been saved!

]2 Peter 2:20,21
For if after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, they are again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning.
21 For it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered unto them

Note that Peter uses the same term for the saints he was writing to
2 Peter 1:4
whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.

Besides, Peter rounds up the epistle by saying:

2 Peter 3:17
Ye therefore, beloved, seeing ye know these things before, beware lest ye also, being led away with the error of the wicked, fall from your own stedfastness


Just as it was God's Eternal purpose to give Israel the land (even backed by the promise to Abraham!.) but they did not get it because they did not continue in the faith, all God's promises in the New Covenant are Eternal but we enjoy them on the basis of our faith (this one is not eternal hence the exhortation to HOLD FAST).

Yes the Holy Spirit seals us till the day of redemption however we are warned not to grieve or quench the Spirit.

JOSEPH PRINCE - OWN RIGHTEOUSNESS & RECEIVE ( HYPOCRICY REDEFINED )


Want to always keep the flow of God's grace, power and
supply open to you? Then begin to walk in your identity as
His child, completely righteous in Christ. Learn why seeing
and calling yourself a sinner every time you approach God
stinks of hypocrisy to Him and how and why your heavenly
Father wants you to own the gift of righteousness you have
through Christ. Catch a fresh revelation of His love as you
see His desire for you to live free of pretense in His
presence, and begin to see His grace and supply flow
unhindered to turn all your challenges around!










https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ytKgVjPWPmM&fulldescription=1&hl=en&gl=US&client=mv-google

Scholar8200:

Thanks for your effort and civility. Pls I am not trying to win an argument nor display knowledge;

Salvation is obtained through a Divine-human partnership; Jesus has fulfilled the Divine but we need to repent and believe with the heart before we can be born of the Spirit.
Else we wont need to preach since after God's part, everybody is saved! As to the Divine part, it is Eternal because God cannot change; but the call to watch arises because man can change not because he was not truly saved but because he remains a free moral agent!


I ,however, will still like to draw your attention to 2 Peter 2 that shows the people in question had escaped the pollutions of the world through Christ:they had been saved!

]2 Peter 2:20,21
For if after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, they are again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning.
21 For it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered unto them

Note that Peter uses the same term for the saints he was writing to
2 Peter 1:4
whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.

Besides, Peter rounds up the epistle by saying:

2 Peter 3:17
Ye therefore, beloved, seeing ye know these things before, beware lest ye also, being led away with the error of the wicked, fall from your own stedfastness


Just as it was God's Eternal purpose to give Israel the land (even backed by the promise to Abraham!.) but they did not get it because they did not continue in the faith, all God's promises in the New Covenant are Eternal but we enjoy them on the basis of our faith (this one is not eternal hence the exhortation to HOLD FAST).

Yes the Holy Spirit seals us till the day of redemption however we are warned not to grieve or quench the Spirit.

Thanks bro. for your explanation. A thread like this is not about winning an argument but to protect the weak or gullible christians against this heresy of 'once saved ever saved' message.

Jesus paid for the sins of everyone living on earth once and for all. Anyone who believes is saved i.e God deposits in such a person the power (by the Holy Spirit) to becomre his child in order to live righteously on earth. One believes in Jesus through FAITH (not works). After believing, WORKS are required to keep the faith in Jesus firmly. If one says that he has faith, but no works to prove it, then such faith is dead. Therefore, if there are no works (after believing), then the faith is dead, and hence no salvation.

John the baptist also proved that works follow one's faith in Luke 3:8 Therefore bear fruits worthy of repentance..
9. And even now the ax is laid to the root of the trees. Therefore every tree which does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire.
Jesus also said in John 15:6 If anyone does not abide in Me, he is cast out as a branch and is withered, and they gather them and throw them into the fire and they are burned.

God has done His part by giving man salvation. Man has to do his part in protecting that salvation, otherwise, he loses it.

Barnabaseloka:

Thanks bro. for your explanation. A thread like this is not about winning an argument but to protect the weak or gullible christians against this heresy of 'once saved ever saved' message.

Jesus paid for the sins of everyone living on earth once and for all. Anyone who believes is saved i.e God deposits in such a person the power (by the Holy Spirit) to becomre his child in order to live righteously on earth. One believes in Jesus through FAITH (not works). After believing, WORKS are required to keep the faith in Jesus firmly. If one says that he has faith, but no works to prove it, then such faith is dead. Therefore, if there are no works (after believing), then the faith is dead, and hence no salvation.

John the baptist also proved that works follow one's faith in Luke 3:8 Therefore bear fruits worthy of repentance..
9. And even now the ax is laid to the root of the trees. Therefore every tree which does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire.
Jesus also said in John 15:6 If anyone does not abide in Me, he is cast out as a branch and is withered, and they gather them and throw them into the fire and they are burned.

God has done His part by giving man salvation. Man has to do his part in protecting that salvation, otherwise, he loses it.

that is where you failed it again.
It is God that secures your salvation.
Read 1John 5:18 in Several translations.
It is God that works in Us to do his pleasure and Good will.
God keeps his own,
we are kept by the Power of God.

God relates with you on the basis of his Son.
It is what Christ has done for you that makes you stand before God.
It's neither conduct nor works.

I strongly encourage personal holiness and good Christian living. But none of those will earn you anything in the Sight of God.
Just like the Old testament folks came with the blood of Bulls and Goats,is the same way we come to God with the perfect sacrifice of Christ.which is eternal.

Heb8:6
6But now hath he obtained a more excellent ministry, by how much also he
is the mediator of a better covenant,
which was established upon better
promises.
7 For if that first covenant had been faultless, then should no place have been
sought for the second.
8For finding fault with them, he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord,
when I will make a new covenant with
the house of Israel and with the house of
Judah:
9Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when
I took them by the hand to lead them out
of the land of Egypt; because they
continued not in my covenant, and I
regarded them not, saith the Lord.
10For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those
days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws
into their mind, and write them in their
hearts: and I will be to them a God, and
they shall be to me a people:
11And they shall not teach every man his neighbour, and every man his brother,
saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know
me, from the least to the greatest.
12For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their
iniquities will I remember no more.
13 In that he saith, A new covenant, he hath made the first old. Now that which
decayeth and waxeth old is ready to
vanish away..

The highlighted simply means that God willl not impute,reckon,record,take account of Your Sins ,

What shall we say then that Abraham our father, as pertaining to the flesh, hath
found? For if Abraham were justified by works, he hath whereof to glory; but not
before God. For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto
him for righteousness. Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt. But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the
ungodly, his faith is counted for
righteousness. Even as David also describeth the blessedness of the man, unto whom God
imputeth righteousness without works, Saying, Blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven, and whose sins
are covered. Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sin.

sportsmaster:

that is where you failed it again.
It is God that secures your salvation.
Read 1John 5:18 in Several translations.
It is God that works in Us to do his pleasure and Good will.
God keeps his own,
we are kept by the Power of God.
God relates with you on the basis of his Son.
It is what Christ has done for you that makes you stand before God.
It's neither conduct nor works.
I strongly encourage personal holiness and good Christian living. But none of those will earn you anything in the Sight of God.
Just like the Old testament folks came with the blood of Bulls and Goats,is the same way we come to God with the perfect sacrifice of Christ.which is eternal.

Excellent write up my broda. Dis is what i have been trying to explain to dem. Good Christian living is encouraged when you are saved, that it doesn't mean the licence to sin. Meanwhile, the righteousness we claim is the righteousness of Christ and His finished work on the Cross, dat is what we require in God's presence cos our own self righteousness is nothing before God.

But its a pity they don't want to understand me, so i stopped explaining cos its as if i am repeating myself allover again like a broken record.

jiggaz:
Tell dem my broda oo. They will not see dat one.

They don't know they are the people mocking God by telling Him dat Jesus' death wasn't enough.... If not for Jesus, no man will make Heaven, yet they don't know, thinking its by their so-called self righteousness..

broda pls can an atheist dat was once a xtian get into heaven

JOSEPH PRINCE - THE FULL ASSURANCE OF YOUR SALVATION IN CHRIST

Join Joseph Prince in this compelling message as he
answers questions and criticisms about grace that have left
many confused and insecure in their walk with God. Just
what is the much-feared “willful sin” in Hebrews 10? Should
believers be sin-conscious today? Does the Bible give us
assurance of eternal salvation? Where is the place of
performance and what does the Holy Spirit convict believers
of in the new covenant? Get scriptural answers and more in
this must-hear message, and begin to live life with full
assurance of your forgiveness and salvation, and
unshakable confidence in God’s love toward you!
Get the full message at:




https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=20RnGi35DQw&fulldescription=1&client=mv-google&hl=en&gl=US

Timothy3113:
broda pls can an atheist dat was once a xtian get into heaven

Good afternoon bro... To answer your question, lets define an ATHEIST.... "A person who rejects belief that any deities exist (whether or not that person believes that deities do not exist)."

So you see an Atheist is someone who rejects belief that any deity exist..... So a Christian who once confessed and believed in Jesus Christ must have rejected His belief in Christ to become an Atheist. And we are made to understand in the Bible that APOSTASY which is actually the REJECTION of a belief will expose you to the devil and his allies. So when a Christian, denounces Christ with His mouth and his belief to become an Atheist, then it means you are no longer under the umbrella of God's children because you have rejected the Salvation of Christ.

Our Bible made us to understand in John 3:16 - For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten son that whosoever believeth in Him will not perish but have everlasting life.

So my bro, the criteria for making Heaven is by Believing in your Heart & Confessing with your mouth that Jesus Christ is the son of God and He was raised from the dead after 3 days for our Justification . That is what makes you a Believer & a Child of God.
But the Christian we are talking of here have renounced Christ to become an Atheist.... So he's no longer a Believer.

sportsmaster:

that is where you failed it again.
It is God that secures your salvation.
Read 1John 5:18 in Several translations.
It is God that works in Us to do his pleasure and Good will.
God keeps his own,
we are kept by the Power of God.

God relates with you on the basis of his Son.
It is what Christ has done for you that makes you stand before God.
It's neither conduct nor works.

I strongly encourage personal holiness and good Christian living. But none of those will earn you anything in the Sight of God.
Just like the Old testament folks came with the blood of Bulls and Goats,is the same way we come to God with the perfect sacrifice of Christ.which is eternal.

Work out your salvation with fear and trembling. Saving one from sin is one part of salvation, while living a godly life to sustain this salvation is another part of it. God will not do your part for you. Yes, God helps us through his grace and Spirit for us to do his will. Yet, man has been given a choice whether to live godly or not. It is either you live a life that shows that you are a follower of Christ or you lose this salvation.
Answer me this question: Was Paul writing to unbelievers or to believers in Gal.5:19-21?

Jude 4 For certain men have crept in unnoticed, who long ago were marked out for this condemnation, ungodly men, who turn the grace of God into lewdness and deny the only Lord God and our Lord Jesus Christ.
1 John 3:7 Little children let no one deceive you. He who PRACTICES (does, engages in) righteousness is righteous, just as He is righteous.
8. He who sins (continues to live in sin) is of the devil, for the devil has sinned from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that He might destroy the works of the devil.
9. Whoever has been born of God does not sin (live habitually in sin), for His seed remains in him, and he cannot sin, because he has been born of God.
There is no excuse for any sinful act before God! Believers in Christ have hope of getting eternal life only if they live righteously on earth!

His Resurrection is the only proof of Our Righteousness...... If not for the Death & Salvation of Christ, mankind will be forever doomed........

Brethren, your faith in Christ is your Eternal Security, let no man deceive you dat you need to work for your Salvation. Its an insult to God's Grace..... You didn't work for your Salvation its by God's Grace.

By working out your Salvation, we mean manifesting the fruits of your Salvation which is Holiness & Christian living.... it is very good so dat the unbelievers will see the hand of God in your life.... But the essence of our Salvation is our FAITH in the finished Work of CHRIST.... not by our WORKS. God must take all the GLORY.... Once you are a Believer in Christ, your Salvation is sealed forever and Eternal Life is yours......

JOSEPH PRINCE - HIS RESURRECTION ( PROOF OF YOUR RIGHTEOUSNESS )

You can enjoy boldness and peace every day when you
know you are righteous in God’s sight. In this powerful and
heart-anchoring Resurrection Sunday message, Joseph
Prince shows you why our Lord Jesus’ resurrection is your
divine receipt that you have been made righteous through
His perfect work at the cross. See how this righteousness
you have is freely given to those in Christ and cannot be
forfeited by your failures. Live confident that God is always
for you because of your righteous standing before Him, and
see all your enemies put under your feet!


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qzaAkB3zloE&fulldescription=1&hl=en&gl=US&client=mv-google

Barnabaseloka:

Work out your salvation with fear and trembling.

For it is God that works In us to do his pleasure and his Goodwill

Saving one from sin is one part of salvation, while living a godly life to sustain this salvation is another part of it.

i dont know where you saw this one.

God will not do your part for you.

Yes, God helps us through his grace and Spirit for us to do his will

two contradicting statements.

Yet, man has been given a choice whether to live godly or not. It is either you live a life that shows that you are a follower of Christ or you lose this salvation.

Godly living is good and i strongly encourage it but it does not guarantee your place/stand with God.
Despite Works will be rewarded,Works do not Save at all at all.
It is Christ himself that saves,
the Gospel of Christ is the Power of God Unto salvation.
The preaching of the Cross is the Power of God that saves.

Answer me this question: Was Paul writing to unbelievers or to believers in Gal.5:19-21?

i will review the whole book of Galatians tonight before i answer. This question

Barnabaseloka:
Jude 4 For certain men have crept in unnoticed, who long ago were marked out for this condemnation, ungodly men, who turn the grace of God into lewdness and deny the only Lord God and our Lord Jesus Christ.
1 John 3:7 Little children let no one deceive you. He who PRACTICES (does, engages in) righteousness is righteous, just as He is righteous.
8. He who sins (continues to live in sin) is of the devil, for the devil has sinned from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that He might destroy the works of the devil.
9. Whoever has been born of God does not sin (live habitually in sin), for His seed remains in him, and he cannot sin, because he has been born of God.
There is no excuse for any sinful act before God! Believers in Christ have hope of getting eternal life only if they live righteously on earth!

then Explain 1John2:1-4 with respect to your post here

sportsmaster:

then Explain 1John2:1-4 with respect to your post here

Vs.1 The perfect will of God is that his children should not sin. This is the ultimate plan that made Jesus to pay for the sins of man. But, if anyone sins (but not as a lifestyle), such a person is not condemned outrightly by God, but has hope of coming back to God in repentance. This is why Jesus is there as a mediator. If anyone sins and comes back to Jesus, God forgives such a person.
Vs.3 & 4 show that we must obey God's commands in his word to prove that we know God. If not, such a person is a liar and the truth is not in him/her. When one says that he is a christian and does not obey the instructions that God has given in his word, that person is a liar and there is no truth in him.
Vs.5 But whoever keeps (obeys, does) His word, truly the love of God is perfected in him. By this we know that we are in Him.
6. He who says (professes, claims) he abides in Him ought himself also to walk (act, do, live) just as He walked (acted, did, lived).

sportsmaster:


two contradicting statements.

God has given every of his children his grace and the Holy Spirit for him to live godly. He gives one the urge or desire to do that which is good and acceptable to Him, but will not force such a person to obey Him. This is why He will judge everyone according to the choices they make on earth. God works in us by creating the hunger or urge or desire to obey Him, but leaves us to choose whether to obey or not. Our choices will be seen in the physical when we act, and thus be judged by them.

sportsmaster:



i dont know where you saw this one.

Saving one from sin is a part of salvation in that it is the base on which one becomes a chilld of God. Works (obedience to God's word) are another part to prove that indeed one has become a child of God. If what one believes in does not go together with the way one lives, then such faith has a loop hole. If care is not taken, it will die b/c there are no works to sustain such faith. If there is no work, there is no faith. If there is no faith, there is no salvation.
Faith (believing in Jesus) without works (obeying God's commands) is DEAD.

sportsmaster:

Godly living is good and i strongly encourage it but it does not guarantee your place/stand with God.
Despite Works will be rewarded,Works do not Save at all at all.
It is Christ himself that saves,
the Gospel of Christ is the Power of God Unto salvation.
The preaching of the Cross is the Power of God that saves.

There is a connection holding salvation, faith and works together. We know that salvation is by faith in Jesus. We also attest that faith without work is dead. Salvation is got by faith, sustained by works. If there are no works, the faith becomes dead and salvation is lost.

Barnabaseloka:

Vs.1 The perfect will of God is that his children should not sin. This is the ultimate plan that made Jesus to pay for the sins of man. But, if anyone sins (but not as a lifestyle), such a person is not condemned outrightly by God, but has hope of coming back to God in repentance. This is why Jesus is there as a mediator. If anyone sins and comes back to Jesus, God forgives such a person.
Vs.3 & 4 show that we must obey God's commands in his word to prove that we know God. If not, such a person is a liar and the truth is not in him/her. When one says that he is a christian and does not obey the instructions that God has given in his word, that person is a liar and there is no truth in him.
Vs.5 But whoever keeps (obeys, does) His word, truly the love of God is perfected in him. By this we know that we are in Him.
6. He who says (professes, claims) he abides in Him ought himself also to walk (act, do, live) just as He walked (acted, did, lived).

i can longer continue this arguement,its taking my time.
wait till you find out yourself.

sportsmaster:

i can longer continue this arguement,its taking my time. wait till you find out yourself.

Ok

jiggaz:
my brother you get time oo. they will still argue with you from now till whenever. Can't you see i have ignored them? plz stop replying them, he who chooses to wallow in ignorance, let them wallow. It is not their fault but that was their orientation from the get go. It takes knowledge to liberate them..... plz stop wasting your time on them.

Why are you still arguing over this. This argument never started today. Even in the time of Paul they argued about this.

Just hold on to what you believe, all in all we are still brethren. God Bless.

Barnabaseloka:

1. My dear, are you saying that christians can live in sin b/c they have been eternally saved?
2. Shall we continue in sin (after we have believed) that grace will abound? Read what grace has come to do in Titus 2:11.
3. Will Jesus not reward everyone according to his/her works during judgement? Those who have lived godly will enter the kingdom of God, while those that continue to live in sin will go to hellfire.
4. Why will God punish those who sin if the way christians live does not matter again, b/c they have been saved eternally?
5. Why would Jesus say that he that continued to the end would be saved? What happens to those that do not hold on till the end?
6. Do you also want me to believe that a christian who dies when engaging in sin will go to heaven?
7. Why did Jesus warn the seven churches in the book of revelation if their works would not be used in judging them?

If the death of Christ is only to save souls without giving them the power to live righteously on earth, then such salvation is not complete.

My brother, you don't argue with such people, they seem to be very selective of the passages in the bible, they hold on only to the ones they like . There's absolutely nothing you could say to make them see what's right before their eyes. It's so glaring, faith without works is dead. I want to believe the Op is the type that believes first -hand in any new teaching /interpretation he hears from a preacher, such are easily carried away but if care isn't taken they become confused in the long run.