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Is Java Programming Harder Than Microsoft.net Programming by clementcro: 3:02pm On Apr 24, 2009
yes i need good experience programmers to advice me wish is best and which one will i quickly secure an employment with.
Re: Is Java Programming Harder Than Microsoft.net Programming by linxon(m): 3:18pm On Apr 24, 2009
Well first of all what do you mean by .Net? .net is a framework to put it in plain english its a 'common language' that all MS programming languages speak.  So you could program in VB.net, C#, J# etc and as long as you are using the .net framework all these programs can talk to each other.

VB use to be seen as a joke - the easiest programming language in the world but VB.Net is apparently more object orientated and advanced. C# is basically 90% Java with a few subtle differences. J# forget it who uses that? You will have to look at job ads to see which one will secure employment, but at this point in time my bet would be Java because of the economic downturn, Java is FREE! plus you can also go into J2ME programming for mobile phones.  But a big word of caution Java is owned by Sun Microsystems and has now been bought by the Microsoft of Databases - Oracle.  So will Java be free in the future? its any ones guess.  And finally both c# and Java are hard to learn if you have done no programming before you will need atleast 18 months to get comfortable.  hope that helped.
Re: Is Java Programming Harder Than Microsoft.net Programming by abijawara: 4:41pm On Apr 24, 2009
Linxon, you have a point. Java seems to be the cheapest 'cos it is free.

But choosing a programming language to use for software development is more about the functionalities needed. Java and programming languages on the .NET platform all have their areas of strength. So that is a much more important determining factor rather than the price.
Re: Is Java Programming Harder Than Microsoft.net Programming by blacksta(m): 5:00pm On Apr 24, 2009
just to butress what linxon said

Java  is write once, run anywhere.  Writing Java code pretty much isolates you from the platform dependent aspects of the systems on which you deploy it. you also have to your disposal Massive java communities, the amount of help you can ever nedd , libraries, IDE's, is huge
Re: Is Java Programming Harder Than Microsoft.net Programming by Kobojunkie: 3:05am On Apr 25, 2009
1) Java is free. . . so is .Net.
2) Java is not platform dependent, same applies with .NET. As long as you have .NET installed, you can run .NET code, just in the same way you would need Java installed on the machine you wished to run Java code.
3) Java has a massive community, so does .NET. You can do everything you could with Java in C#, even mobile computing.
4) Java has free IDE, so does .NET
5) C# and Java are not hard to learn. One can learn Java watching only pattern tutorials and it is possible to learn C# in much the same way by watching tutorials online as well
6) Software Engineering is little about the language and more about understanding the core concepts, and developing needed skills. Once you grasp those, you can easily learn the language you need to learn in no time at all for selected projects. 


Coding is not necessarily about language but understanding your architecture well enough to apply code effectively. .NET offers you great flexibility when it comes to interoperability as you can combine Python, VB.NET, Ruby, C++, LISP, SmallTalk, and so on, code in your project files. This allows teams to more effectively apply already available resources in projects.

So @Poster, do not get caught up in JAVA /.NET war but focus instead on the core of being a programmer. That is what separates ordinary programmers from real architects out there. Even JavaScript programmers who position themselves well are able to compete and command respect.
Re: Is Java Programming Harder Than Microsoft.net Programming by dammytosh: 6:29pm On Apr 25, 2009
@Poster, @kobojunkie has done justification 2 ur issue. If i were u, i will read dt post over nd over again.
  No language is difficult nd none is easy. Some people claim dt VB is easy but the truth depends on wat u can do with d language. OOP design on java is d same in vb nd c# it is just d syntax nd some smart ways of doing things dt differ.
I av developed nd deployed apps on both platforms. Without sentiment, both platforms are great but i will in MY OWN OPINION advise u 2 go 4 C# because, u will automatically learn both Java syntax nd feel d power of the dotnet clr.
Re: Is Java Programming Harder Than Microsoft.net Programming by linxon(m): 7:39pm On Apr 25, 2009
abijawara:

Linxon, you have a point. Java seems to be the cheapest 'cos it is free.

But choosing a programming language to use for software development is more about the functionalities needed. Java and programming languages on the .NET platform all have their areas of strength. So that is a much more important determining factor rather than the price.

Now lets review the question asked shall we: Is Java Programming Harder Than Microsoft.net Programming? He is asking about the difficulty of using either language! The question had nothing to do with the capability of each language. To say the price is irrelevant is grin grin grin grin amusing. .Net is not for free, the LIMITED, SCALED DOWN visual studio express is free. Java uses Eclipse or Netbeans and the FULL Eclipse version is Completely free and open source. Lastly, people mistake programming for software engineering the two are not the same. Some think that if they can compile and run a program they are an expert grin grin grin grin so they conclude that its easy; one can draw an analogy with a footballer; if you can kick and control a ball dose that make you a good footballer? Naw!!!!! Its the thinking, fitness, and your natural GOD given attributes such as height, weight, speed,, So do not let any body fool you that to become a top programmer is easy. grin grin grin
Re: Is Java Programming Harder Than Microsoft.net Programming by Ghenghis(m): 1:13pm On Apr 26, 2009
Hello Guys,

I think even without knowing it @clementcro original question of Java and .NET is on the mark,

it requires a comparison of the benefits of the Java platform(which includes Jython, Jruby, Java, javaFX etc.) with those of .NET(C#, VB.NET, Jscript etc.)

Answer: Both platforms are very similar in concept (Virtual machine, Evolutionary compilation , ) , the class libraries are intuitively similar because many of the original developers of the .NET platform are form a Java background. Its noteworthy that Microsoft was an early and very eager member of the JCP before their fall-out with SUN.

Yes Oracle intends to buy SUN, however JAVA is free and would remain free!
The question is how Oracle would influence the JCP which would in turn influence the growth of Java. Its no big secret that IBM and Oracle have overtime, made much more money form Java than SUN. So free/open source does not mean un-commercial.

Whichever platform or language a beginner decides to choose is not so relevant, to be really techno-savvy in software solutions delivery you'd need far more than Java, C# or any other language can offer you, alone.

So to start, the problem is one of an embarrassment of rich tools and choices.

You have eclipse, netbeans, intelliJ etc. for Java
for .NET you have Visual studio .NET

I have to admit that java solutions are the most deployed on the planet(+mobile).
MS are the most deployed across computers.

Also i agree with everything @kobojunkie said,
I you cant decide, simply close your eyes and choose, its like choosing between a BENZ and BMW (both great) grin
Re: Is Java Programming Harder Than Microsoft.net Programming by blacksta(m): 1:54pm On Apr 26, 2009
My Lecturer who was top java lecturer and software engineering expert ( Mr Fintan Culwin) (gave java lectures all over the world) told me that best was to learn java or any programming language is "practice" ( you will need to feel, is possible eat the code) - you will have to iimmerse your self in programming, programming programming - it also like learning french or german. it will require effort on your path. As rightly said programming is completely different from software engineering.


Your mastery of details must be combined with logical thinking and the ability to focus for long periods.
Re: Is Java Programming Harder Than Microsoft.net Programming by Kobojunkie: 2:48pm On Apr 26, 2009
Programming is more than acquiring certificates and writing software that works. It is more than being able to copy code from online that works. So learning how to program so you can make money only makes you a “Cowboy coder”. There are millions of those out there and they cost companies money at the end of the day, than they actually make for these companies.

There are millions of “Cowboy coders” out there, if you want to become one of those, feel free to dwell on language and less on the underlying aspects of being a software engineer. If you however want to build for yourself a solid career, spend time on the main and you will not only get paid more but will enjoy a career that continues to grow, and remain relevant for longest.
Re: Is Java Programming Harder Than Microsoft.net Programming by dammytosh: 5:31pm On Apr 26, 2009
@Poster,

  i will advise that u just take a bold step and start from somewhere but with a very open mind. Understand the concept of being a programmer first b4 u confuse urself with the complexity of the BUZZ behind being a developer.
Learning programming language is like learning other languages like english. U start with the rudiments of alphabet, part of speech b4 u bother ur head with au 2 construct a sentence not 2 talk of au to write an essay. If u start ur learning of d language with au to write an essay u MIGHT BE FRUSTRATED out.
  So in a nut shell, strive to become a very good "CODER" first, u learn au to do things better everyday and with experience. But the good news is that if u learn with an open mind, learning other languages apart frm ur start up language is quite easy. The simple question u ask urself is "I know au to do it in X language, au is it done in Y language"
MY OPINION sha.
Best of Luck.
Re: Is Java Programming Harder Than Microsoft.net Programming by linxon(m): 5:53pm On Apr 26, 2009
Now I can see why Nigeria is Under developed!

dammytosh:

@Poster,

  i will advise that u just make a bold step and start from somewhere but with a very open mind. Understand the concept of being a programmer first b4 u confuse urself with the complexity of the BUZZ behind being a developer.
Learning programming language is like learning other languages like english. U start with the rudiments of alphabet, part of speech b4 u bother ur head with au 2 construct a sentence not 2 talk of au to write an essay. If u start ur learning of d language with au to write an essay u MIGHT BE FRUSTRATED out.
  So in a nut shell, strive to become a very good "CODER" first, u learn au to do things better everyday and with experience. But the good news is that if u learn with an open mind, learning other languages apart frm ur start up language is quite easy. The simple question u ask urself is "I know au to do it in X language, au is it done in Y language"
MY OPINION sha.
Best of Luck.

your not ur
you not u
before not b4

I would not take advice from someone who cannot spell! grin grin

Kobojunkie:

Programming is more than acquiring certificates and writing software that works. It is more than being able to copy code from online that works. So learning how to program so you can make money only makes you a “Cowboy coder”. There are millions of those out there and they cost companies money at the end of the day, than they actually make for these companies.

There are millions of “Cowboy coders” out there, if you want to become one of those, feel free to dwell on language and less on the underlying aspects of being a software engineer. If you however want to build for yourself a solid career, spend time on the main and you will not only get paid more but will enjoy a career that continues to grow, and remain relevant for longest.


like I told you before: YAWN times INFINITY

Ghenghis:

Hello Guys,

I think even without knowing it @clementcro original question of Java and .NET is on the mark,


That makes no sense at all! sad

Ghenghis:


Answer: Both platforms are very similar in concept (Virtual machine, Evolutionary compilation , ) , the class libraries are intuitively similar because many of the original developers of the .NET platform are form a Java background. Its noteworthy that Microsoft was an early and very eager member of the JCP before their fall-out with SUN.

Yes Oracle intends to buy SUN, however JAVA is free and would remain free!
The question is how Oracle would influence the JCP which would in turn influence the growth of Java. Its no big secret that IBM and Oracle have overtime, made much more money form Java than SUN. So free/open source does not mean un-commercial.

Whichever platform or language a beginner decides to choose is not so relevant, to be really techno-savvy in software solutions delivery you'd need far more than Java, C# or any other language can offer you, alone.

So to start, the problem is one of an embarrassment of rich tools and choices.

You have eclipse, netbeans, intelliJ etc. for Java
for .NET you have Visual studio .NET

I have to admit that java solutions are the most deployed on the planet(+mobile).
MS are the most deployed across computers.

Also i agree with everything @kobojunkie said,
I you cant decide, simply close your eyes and choose, its like choosing between a BENZ and BMW (both great) grin

Give advice to the original poster and stop waffling! Is java harder than C#? Thats the question, stop blurting out all you haved read from a leaflet on Java and give some practical advice!

I wanted to join this programming section to help those less fortunate than me and help, I have been there and done it all but it seems that some of you are bent on arguing for arguing sake.
Re: Is Java Programming Harder Than Microsoft.net Programming by dammytosh: 6:18pm On Apr 26, 2009
@Linxon,
i wld av simply ignored ur post but i bliv in Proverbs 26:5.
i am posting from my PDA nd guess u shld nt expect me 2 type evrytin in full cos of d limitation of typing on d PAD.
"Your" not  "ur" , "have" not "av". It is funny dt u pretend 2 ignore d fact that this is not a formal forum nd there shld be liberty 2 express urself any au ur environment permits.
  Please next time, take me up on programming language nd not English language. U can post my latest errors on ur blog 2moro morn 4 all i care.
  I guess u need 2 work on ur i am d best mentality cos u are far frm being the best. No matter au good u feel u are, u av pple better than u nd no matter au poor u think i am, i av people poorer than i am. So we are both in d middle. 

I dnt know y living outside nigeria makes some programmers on nairaland feel they are better than people staying in Nigeria.
I c dt as more of a slavery and racist mentality.
-My Opinion
Re: Is Java Programming Harder Than Microsoft.net Programming by linxon(m): 6:25pm On Apr 26, 2009
dammytosh:

@Linxon,
i wld av simply ignored ur post but i bliv in Proverbs 26:5.
i am posting from my PDA nd guess u shld nt expect me 2 type evrytin in full cos of d limitation of typing on d PAD.
"Your" not  "ur" , "have" not "av". It is funny dt u pretend 2 ignore d fact that this is not a formal forum nd there shld be liberty 2 express urself any au ur environment permits.
  Please next time, take me up on programming language nd not English language. U can post my latest errors on ur blog 2moro morn 4 all i care.
  I guess u need 2 work on ur i am d best mentality cos u are far frm being the best. No matter au good u feel u are, u av pple better than u nd no matter au poor u think i am, i av people poorer than i am. So we are both in d middle. 

I am posting from my laptop whilst playing sonic riders, dude!  tongue Do not mistake confidence for arrogance, where did I mention I was the best? I am a professional software engineer and I run my own company, ,   I could start bragging but I will not, let bygones be bygones. grin
Re: Is Java Programming Harder Than Microsoft.net Programming by candylips(m): 10:17am On Apr 27, 2009
Kobojunkie:

2) Java is not platform dependent, same applies with .NET. As long as you have .NET installed, you can run .NET code, just in the same way you would need Java installed on the machine you wished to run Java code.

Are you sure .Net is platform independent. Last time i checked the .Net VM is not available on Linux/Unix unless you are talking about  Mono .Net

@poster

I think if you want to write windows programs then ofcourse .net is much easier and by far the better choice.
Visual studio is the most advance IDE on the planet.

If you are thinking of writing apps that don't require a Gui front-end (stuff like back-end jobs or Batch programs) I'll natuarally go for Java not neccessaryly because it is simpler but because it is painless when deployed on various OS (and i think most companies actually have some sort of Linux/Unix servers these days)

The very good thing i like about java in this space is that the JVM comes box standard with most Linux distros and the Mac OS this days so your app will run without you having to fiddle with installing the JVM or setting JAVA_HOME and stuff.
Re: Is Java Programming Harder Than Microsoft.net Programming by Kobojunkie: 4:05pm On Apr 27, 2009
hhhmmm. . . . so if Mono framework allows you run .NET on Linux machines, does that not then mean you can run your .NET on Linux? Or does .NET have to come with the Microsoft logo to be considered .NET even now that most of the library code has been made available?
Re: Is Java Programming Harder Than Microsoft.net Programming by candylips(m): 5:18pm On Apr 27, 2009
Yes Mono .net support is there for Linux but i was looking at the Visual Studio stack as well.

Also just to add . Mono is lagging behind the reference implementation (support for .Net 3.0 is just ongoing for example) most players might just prefer the stability of .Net on Win platform instead
Re: Is Java Programming Harder Than Microsoft.net Programming by Kobojunkie: 6:05pm On Apr 27, 2009
May I suggest you read a bit more on Mono .NET.
Re: Is Java Programming Harder Than Microsoft.net Programming by Ghenghis(m): 8:10pm On Apr 27, 2009
linxon:


like I told you before: YAWN times INFINITY

That makes no sense at all! sad
Give advice to the original poster and stop waffling! Is java harder than C#? Thats the question, stop blurting out all you haved read from a leaflet on Java and give some practical advice!

I wanted to join this programming section to help those less fortunate than me and help, I have been there and done it all but it seems that some of you are bent on arguing for arguing sake.

@Linxon
You're such an abrasive character !!!

I was referring to java (the platform) and .NET ,

You should exercise decorum wherever you find yourself, more so in an environment for learning and sharing ideas I'll just leave it at that ,
Re: Is Java Programming Harder Than Microsoft.net Programming by naijafan(m): 10:25pm On Apr 27, 2009
@linxon
If you were truly a professional software engineer, you should know better than to compare java to .net the way you did. And yes, .NET is also very much free. You shouldn't confuse .NET with Visual studio. its like confusing JDK with Eclipse or Netbeans. If you need a robust IDE and feel VS Express ain't good enough, then there are lots of alternative IDEs to pick from. Judging from the fact that you seem comfortable with Eclipse, you may want to grab a .NET plugin. There are numerous ones out there. wink

Besides, the poster clearly stated his problem. it wasn't just a question of which language is harder.

@poster
kobojunkie basically answered your question in her first post which i'll quote below.
Kobojunkie:

1) Java is free. . . so is .Net.
2) Java is not platform dependent, same applies with .NET. As long as you have .NET installed, you can run .NET code, just in the same way you would need Java installed on the machine you wished to run Java code.
3) Java has a massive community, so does .NET. You can do everything you could with Java in C#, even mobile computing.
4) Java has free IDE, so does .NET
5) C# and Java are not hard to learn. One can learn Java watching only pattern tutorials and it is possible to learn C# in much the same way by watching tutorials online as well
6) Software Engineering is little about the language and more about understanding the core concepts, and developing needed skills. Once you grasp those, you can easily learn the language you need to learn in no time at all for selected projects. 


Coding is not necessarily about language but understanding your architecture well enough to apply code effectively. .NET offers you great flexibility when it comes to interoperability as you can combine Python, VB.NET, Ruby, C++, LISP, SmallTalk, and so on, code in your project files. This allows teams to more effectively apply already available resources in projects.

So @Poster, do not get caught up in JAVA /.NET war but focus instead on the core of being a programmer. That is what separates ordinary programmers from real architects out there. Even JavaScript programmers who position themselves well are able to compete and command respect.

Re: Is Java Programming Harder Than Microsoft.net Programming by linxon(m): 12:40pm On Apr 29, 2009
Ghenghis:

@Linxon
You're such an abrasive character !!!

I was referring to java (the platform) and .NET ,

You should exercise decorum wherever you find yourself, more so in an environment for learning and sharing ideas I'll just leave it at that ,

.Net uses Visual studio, and Visual studio is NOT 100% free, I know because I have the receipts. I am not a cheap novice like you I do this for a living. Novices use freebies! You simply lack the depth to fathom who I am; An slowpoke like you must not even dream of giving me advice on my etiquette!
Re: Is Java Programming Harder Than Microsoft.net Programming by clementcro: 12:47pm On Apr 29, 2009
hey guys i asked for your advice ,i didnt ask you to fight ok ,i beliveve everyone is an IT guy and we could call oneanother for some projects in the nearest future.
Re: Is Java Programming Harder Than Microsoft.net Programming by linxon(m): 12:51pm On Apr 29, 2009
naijafan:

@linxon
If you were truly a professional software engineer, you should know better than to compare java to .net the way you did. And yes,  .NET is also very much free.

I am a professional and you are clearly not, .Net uses VS and VS is not 100% free - got that?

naijafan:

You shouldn't confuse .NET with Visual studio. its like confusing JDK with Eclipse or Netbeans.

What on earth are you babbling on about? only a dummy like you would confuse the two.  tongue

naijafan:

f you need a robust IDE and feel VS Express ain't good enough, then there are lots of alternative IDEs to pick from. Judging from the fact that you seem BLAH BLAH BLAH, BLAH, BLAH, BLAH, BLAH, BLAH, 

What a bore!
Re: Is Java Programming Harder Than Microsoft.net Programming by blacksta(m): 12:54pm On Apr 29, 2009
Please guys calm down - it is very important we dont derail the thread. It is helping a lot of people that are new to programming.
Re: Is Java Programming Harder Than Microsoft.net Programming by Ghenghis(m): 2:01pm On Apr 29, 2009
grin grin grin grin

if only @linxon would listen, he might learn a few things

If you need a free copy of VS.NET http://www.microsoft.com/Express/

take it easy o! cheesy
Re: Is Java Programming Harder Than Microsoft.net Programming by linxon(m): 2:09pm On Apr 29, 2009
Ghenghis:

grin grin grin grin

if only @linxon would listen, he might learn a few things

If you need a free copy of VS.NET http://www.microsoft.com/Express/

take it easy o! cheesy

If only this broke, Novice could have some money and use PROFESSIONAL tools instead of freebies: http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-gb/vstudio/products/cc263903.aspx
Now follow this link and educate yourself.  Hey! Heres a cut price version for you:
  http://www.amazon.co.uk/Visual-Studio-Pro-2008-PC/dp/B000WM04HU/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&s=software&qid=1241012658&sr=8-3
You are so broke you don't even know there is a a FULL commercial version.  If you even dream of me learning from you, you should wake up and apologise  grin cheesy grin cheesy tongue
Re: Is Java Programming Harder Than Microsoft.net Programming by Ghenghis(m): 4:54pm On Apr 29, 2009
@linxon are you suggesting that beginners buy the full suite instead of using express ?

and yes I like freebies, I'm always excited for guys that are starting out now, cause there's a lot to choose from ,

linxon:

I If you even dream of me learning from you, you should wake up and apologise  grin cheesy grin cheesy tongue
grin grin grin

maybe we'll meet across a table some day ,
Re: Is Java Programming Harder Than Microsoft.net Programming by linxon(m): 4:58pm On Apr 29, 2009
Ghenghis:

@linxon are you suggesting that beginners buy the full suite instead of using express ?

and yes I like freebies, I'm always excited for guys that are starting out now, cause there's a lot to choose from ,
  grin grin grin


Oh!!!! So you admit you are a broke, newbie now! then what are you arguing for? shocked I came here to teach and help, as a professional.

Ghenghis:

maybe we'll meet across a table some day

Yes, with me interviewing you for a job! I just hope that you are a reformed character by then  grin grin grin grin grin grin
Re: Is Java Programming Harder Than Microsoft.net Programming by naijafan(m): 2:06am On May 03, 2009
@linxon
either you are trying to imply that all FOSS advocates are broke, or you are just being hilarious.

besides. . . you actually said this.
linxon:

.Net is not for free
guess u were in a hurry to blab wink
Re: Is Java Programming Harder Than Microsoft.net Programming by Kobojunkie: 3:15am On May 03, 2009
Microsoft provides free tools to students through dreamspark and the free express tools do most all you are likely to need when developing web or windows applications, so there is really no big need to purchase the full IDE if you do not to. Paying for the standard, professional or team is not wise if you do not need it.
Re: Is Java Programming Harder Than Microsoft.net Programming by linxon(m): 10:30am On May 03, 2009
grin grin grin grin grin Here we go again, you woke up bored and lonely today and decided to make a sneaky comment against the master  grin

Stop trying to argue for the hell of it! Admit you was wrong, was too dumb and broke to realize that Visual studio is not free when you develop COMMERCIAL software and move on.  The truth is that you and that KoboJunkie Dam have never written "commercial software", you are amateurs who have disrespected the master.  Freebies are nothing new, all major corporations give out freebies to kids so they can get hooked and learn; so when they grow up they can develop USEFUL, COMMERCIAL software not crap!  Do you think Bill Gates is the richest man in the world by giving out freebies? If you try to develop Commercial software with his FREE tools he will sue your smelly pants off! Do you know how much it costs to become a Microsoft certified Gold partner? Nope! you don't know jack!

Yes I am against students who write  F&*^%!g Obvious Silly Software

Now I need to go back to making money and you need to go back to learning you little Dam!

NB: To all the other ugly, haters lurking around their keyboard, who only have guts on the internet, LEAVE ME ALONE AND GET A LIFE!!!!!!! or face a masterful, verbal beat down.
Re: Is Java Programming Harder Than Microsoft.net Programming by blacksta(m): 3:07pm On May 03, 2009
@ linxon

just out of curiosity how will microsoft or similar organisation know what free tool one used in developing a commercial software.

Thanks

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