Richirich713:


Difference is jesus never talk about a other moses or other abraham. Muhammad did talk about a other jesus, a jesus who never claim to be the Son of god, a jesus who said God name is Allah nd not Yahweh, a jesus who was never crucified.



" God also said to Moses, “Say to the Israelites, ‘The LORD (YHWH), the God of your fathers—the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac and the God of Jacob—has sent me to you.’

“This is my name forever,the name you shall call me
from generation to generation. (Exodus 3:15)

One who had escaped came and reported this to Abram the Hebrew". (Genesis 14.13

@Red: Jesus son of God or himself God

But Arab Christians believe God's name is Allah



@Green
Yet to prove that he was a Jew. If we are to accept your claim, the following will also be true:

If God of Mose is God of Abraham and Abraham is a Jew as a result of that

Then God of Abraham is God of Noah, Adam, therefore Hoah, Adam were Jews

God of Abraham is also God of Jesus, then Jesus was a Jew

Mind you their is a big difference between been a Jew as a tribe and being a Jew as a religious believe

yazach:


@Red: Jesus son of God or himself God



But Arab Christians believe God's name is Allah

The argument is not about the trinity, the point is muhammad talks about a jesus which according to our earliest sources is not the real jesus.

So my point is still valid, muhammad spoke about a jesus who was not crucified nor claimed to be son of god.

Arab Christians use Allah as a common noun while muslims believe Allah is God name.

Arab Christians don't believe God name is Allah, they believe it is the Tetragrammaton (YHWH).

yazach:


@Green
Yet to prove that he was a Jew. If we are to accept your claim, the following will also be true:

If God of Mose is God of Abraham and Abraham is a Jew as a result of that

Then God of Abraham is God of Noah, Adam, therefore Hoah, Adam were Jews

God of Abraham is also God of Jesus, then Jesus was a Jew

Mind you their is a big difference between been a Jew as a tribe and being a Jew as a religious believe

U misunderstood my argument, I said abraham was a jew to point to his Jewish ethnicity so in then end u basing ur argument on nothing.

For just like I said, my whole point was that abraham was a Ancient hebrew who worship Yahweh.

And that's the whole problem, if islam is true why does it disagree with the earliest information we have on jesus.

Not only do we have Ancient christian documents on jesus, we also have Jewish nd Roman writings which mentions jesus crucifixion

Interesting

Richirich713:


The argument is not about the trinity, the point is muhammad talks about a jesus which according to our earliest sources is not the real jesus.

So my point is still valid, muhammad spoke about a jesus who was not crucified nor claimed to be son of god.

And my argument is about know the true description of Jesus, is he son of God, God himself, Messenger of God?

Richirich713:

Arab Christians use Allah as a common noun while muslims believe Allah is God name.
Arab Christians don't believe God name is Allah, they believe it is the Tetragrammaton (YHWH).

You need to be in Arabian land to have a conclusion, this is where I have lived for years and I have 100% assurance that they did not differentiate between the two

Richirich713:

U misunderstood my argument, I said abraham was a jew to point to his Jewish ethnicity so in then end u basing ur argument on nothing.

For just like I said, my whole point was that abraham was a Ancient hebrew who worship Yahweh.

base on your argument, Jesus was a Jew also. Therefore, it is baseless for someone to say he is a christian

yazach:


And my argument is about know the true description of Jesus, is he son of God, God himself, Messenger of God?

That's not the argument, the argument is who historical jesus is according to the easiest sources

All the earliest sources disagree with islam.

yazach:


You need to be in Arabian land to have a conclusion, this is where I have lived for years and I have 100% assurance that they did not differentiate between the two

I can assure u the bible says YHWH is God name.
And I can assure u a Arabic bible does not translate YHWH to Allah.

yazach:

base on your argument, Jesus was a Jew also. Therefore, it is baseless for someone to say he is a christian

Who said Jesus is a christian? I never heard a christian say that before.

"Christian" is just a term used to describe the original followers of jesus, the followers of Christ.

And Yes jesus was a jew, Peter was also a jew, John was also a jew, matthew was also a jew.

But most of the Jews of jesus time rejected jesus as they believed he was a false messiah.

The Jews wu believed in him began to call themselves christians nd that's wer the word christian comes from.

yazach:
[s]Mary was 12 years old when betrothed to Joseph

Catholic Encyclopaedia says:

“When forty years of age, Joseph married a woman called Melcha or Escha by some, Salome by others; they lived forty-nine years together and had six children, two daughters and four sons, the youngest of whom was James (the Less, “the Lord’s brother”). A year after his wife’s death, as the priests announced through Judea that they wished to find in the tribe of Juda a respectable man to espouse Mary, then twelve to fourteen years of age. Joseph, who was at the time ninety years old, went up to Jerusalem among the candidates; a miracle manifested the choice God had made of Joseph, and two years later the Annunciation took place.” [6]

One thing needs to be remembered, although they say that she was 12 years old when she was betrothed to 90 year old Joseph, most Christians of today reject this story, because Joseph would be labelled a ‘paedophile’.

‘History of Joseph the Carpenter’ also confirms that Mary was 12 years old when betrothed to Joseph. Chapter 3 and 4 states:

3. Now when righteous Joseph became a widower, my mother Mary, blessed, holy, and pure, was already twelve years old. For her parents offered her in the temple when she was three years of age, and she remained in the temple of the Lord nine years. Then when the priests saw that the virgin, holy and God-fearing, was growing up, they spoke to each other, saying: Let us search out a man, righteous and pious, to whom Mary may be entrusted until the time of her marriage; lest, if she remain in the temple, it happen to her as is wont to happen to women, and lest on that account we sin, and God be angry with us.

4. Therefore they immediately sent out, and assembled twelve old men of the tribe of Judah. And they wrote down the names of the twelve tribes of Israel. And the lot fell upon the pious old man, righteous Joseph. Then the priests answered, and said to my blessed mother: Go with Joseph, and be with him till the time of your marriage. Righteous Joseph therefore received my mother, and led her away to his own house. And Mary found James the Less in his father’s house, broken-hearted and sad on account of the loss of his mother, and she brought him up. Hence Mary was called the mother of James. Luke 24:10 Thereafter Joseph left her at home, and went away to the shop where he wrought at his trade of a carpenter. And after the holy virgin had spent two years in his house her age was exactly fourteen years, including the time at which he received her.[/s]

Rubbish!

Next time use the bible properly

yazach:


[s]Mother of your God was married at the age of 12 [/s]

Biblical prove pls?

And my argument is about know the true description of Jesus, is he son of God, God himself, Messenger of God?

Yes! he is the Son of God : John 10:36 "Say ye of him, whom the Father hath sanctified, and sent into the world, Thou blasphemest; because I said, I am the Son of God?"

Yes! In himself is a God : Hebrews 1:8-9 "But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom.
Thou hast loved righteousness, and hated iniquity; therefore God, even thy God, hath anointed thee with the oil of gladness above thy fellows."

John 1:1 "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God."


Yes! He is messenger of God : Jesus came to this earth as a Messenger from God the Father: "Behold, I send My messenger, and he will prepare the way before Me. And the Lord, whom you seek, will suddenly come to His temple, even the Messenger of the covenant, in whom you delight. Behold, He is coming,' says the LORD of hosts" (Malachi 3:1). Two messengers are mentioned in this verse. The first is John the Baptist, who prepared the way for the second Messenger, "the Messenger of the covenant," Jesus Christ.

You need to be in Arabian land to have a conclusion, this is where I have lived for years and I have 100% assurance that they did not differentiate between the two

No! It does not matter if you have lived there for centuries.."Allah" is a common noun in arabic that = "God" in english language. Not really a name.

base on your argument, Jesus was a Jew also. Therefore, it is baseless for someone to say he is a christian

And it is even more Futile and senseless to consider him as a Muslim either.

In fact the gap and difference is like this..