I noticed that a lot of Nigerians are very religious. I know that not all of them are. But it seems to be a big part of Nigerian culture. I am not religious. I do not believe that god even exist. I don't disrespect those who are religious however and I certainly do not try to turn them against religion. I think that religion has a lot of good advice. Things such as saving sex for marriage, and just general morality I follow those same rules because they are sensible. I was wondering if most Nigerians are religious first of all and is so then would most of them look down upon Atheists such as myself?

angelgirl1:

I noticed that a lot of Nigerians are very religious. I know that not all of them are. But it seems to be a big part of Nigerian culture. I am not religious. I do not believe that god even exist. I don't disrespect those who are religious however and I certainly do not try to turn them against religion. I think that religion has a lot of good advice. Things such as saving sex for marriage, and just general morality I follow those same rules because they are sensible. I was wondering if most Nigerians are religious first of all and is so then would most of them look down upon Atheists such as myself?

The fact that atheists don't believe in the existence of God is a religion that they dogmatically adhere to despite the fact that they cannot prove it, this shows that you are religious.  At least if there were no God there will be no atheists.

On a serious note, you will discover that this universe is governed by laws be it the laws of gravity, mathematics, physics etc.  These law may be discovered and formulated by man but God originated such laws.  You will agree with me that for there to be a law there must be a law giver.

Let us focus on the moral law in question.  If you observe closely you will find out that the moral law is what you will find written in the 10 commandments received by Moses.  This reminds us of the laws that our maker has inscribed into our consciences, which has now been silenced by sin and our rebellion against our maker.  God is the source of the moral laws and since we cannot keep these moral laws because of the sin nature Jesus has come to make us free to obey the moral law by shedding His own blood to pay for our eternal penalty and when we receive and believe Him He would then live in us to give us the grace to do His good will.

The fact that you do not know Him does not mean that you cannot see the work of His hands, His creation all around you.  A design is the evidence of a designer, a builing is the evidence of a builder, a painting is the evidence of a painter so it is not rocket science to believe and know that for there to be creation of the universe and human life there must be an Intelligent Creator who is not only the giver of life but also the giver of laws.  And as this is the case we are to be subject to the laws of our maker as we are going to be accountable to Him whether we like it or not.

To know whether you are a good person can you kindly take this test in the link below to see where you stand:

http://www.wayofthemaster.com/goodperson.shtml

I did not want to get into a philosophical debate about god and religion but here goes:

As far as this mythological sky god is concerned, I do not have any proof of her existence. That lack of proof is actually quite simply that for a human being who relates the world through senses touch, smell, hearing, sight god doesn't appear in any of these senses. I refer to god as she because if there were such a deity in my human mind from what I have saw of the world women give the breath of life. Not men.

As far as religion is concerned I think that organized religion in today's world is invalid and irrational. It might have been beneficial at a more primitive time in history. But in today's world it causes much suffering. I do believe in living a healthy moral life. I think that organized religion is not needed to achieve this. Common sense goes a long way.

Still I do not judge others for their beliefs. If someone chooses to be religious then I will not look down upon them or even try to convert them.

Hello Anglegirl

Am curious about how you became an atheist - what was your most pursausive argument to turn you to atheism. And secondly, do you life in an very religious environment? If so, how did you find the independence of thought to break out on your own route? Thirdly, are you "out" as an atheist in your community?

angelgirl1:

I did not want to get into a philosophical debate about god and religion but here goes:

The moment you verred into the religion section to post you subscribed either consciously or subconsciously into a philosophical debate.  It is basically man's philosophical ideas against God's philosophy if we may call it that.

angelgirl1:

As far as this mythological sky god is concerned, I do not have any proof of her existence. That lack of proof is actually quite simply that for a human being who relates the world through senses touch, smell, hearing, sight god doesn't appear in any of these senses.

You do not have any proof of the existence of God because you are looking for proofs in all the wrong directions.  You cannot expect to use empirical methods to prove the existence of a personal God.  How can you scientically prove to me that you passionately kissed your man?  This is a personal experience that can only be proved by personal intimate relationship which has only been experienced by you.  So to prove the existence of the Creator God you have to experience Him personally, as this is by faith in His written word (Bible) which is His specific revelation and through the general revelation of His creation as I mentioned earlier.  You cannot know Him through your five or more senses that is only useful to discern natural things (His Creations) but you can ask Him for faith which you will get when you read His word and He will open the eyes of your heart to see the light of the glorious gospel of Jesus Christ.  Faith comes by the continuous hearing of the word of God.

angelgirl1:

I refer to god as she because if there were such a deity in my human mind from what I have saw of the world women give the breath of life. Not men.

This again is the religious beliefs of the gnostics who believe that God is feminine.  Did you say that you are not religious? tell me again.

angelgirl1:

As far as religion is concerned I think that organized religion in today's world is invalid and irrational. It might have been beneficial at a more primitive time in history. But in today's world it causes much suffering. I do believe in living a healthy moral life. I think that organized religion is not needed to achieve this. Common sense goes a long way.

As much as I agree with you that organised religion has been the cause of a lot of heartaches in the world today I will like to tell you that God does not want you to be religious He did not allow His only begotten Son Jesus to die so that you can become religious but He came so that you can have a personal relationship with the personal God who is the Creator of heaven and earth.  He is the source of the moral life that you tend to live and I believe that organised religion cannot do this for you but getting connected to the source of life and having a daily fellowship with Him will get you there.

angelgirl1:

Still I do not judge others for their beliefs. If someone chooses to be religious then I will not look down upon them or even try to convert them.

Despite your claims that you are not religious the fact shows that you at least cling to two beliefs; your belief in the non - existence of God even though you cannot prove it, and your belief that if such a deity exists that He must be a She, a common religious belief in the early centuries A.D.

huxley2:

Hello Anglegirl

Am curious about how you became an atheist - what was your most pursausive argument to turn you to atheism.  And secondly, do you life in an very religious environment?  If so,  how did you find the independence of thought to break out on your own route?  Thirdly, are you "out" as an atheist in your community?

Well I became I should say an atheist just by thinking about god and seeing reality. I wouldn't necessarily call it an argument but I was led to becoming an atheist because the religious environment I was in was very contradictory as far as what they preached and the actions they took. It turned me off to that particular group of people NOT the religion. However from that I did begin to question religion and god. The point at which I stopped believing in god was when I just realized that there was no solid proof of her existence. None at all. Just books written by humans who claim to have been inspired to write it by god. I did search for proof. In the end all I was left with was nothing. So I had to conclude that due to lack of solid evidence as of present god doesn't exist, and is only a figment of the human mind. I think god is a way for humans to explain what they can't understand. And that is existence. It would be the same as an animal trying to understand humanity. Humans have to have a cause and effect. Why are we here? Mythical sky god? That'll work! No that doesn't work. You can't just make something up and decree it upon everyone. But there again I won't go to far with this because I am not against people practicing religion. If that makes them happy I am happy for them.

As I mentioned I did live in a very religious community and it was somewhat cut off from the world. Such as most children were educated at home so they would not be socialized by the outside world. Well I will say this of that religious community most of the members were Caucasian, and there were only a hand full of Blacks. Anyway I was one of the few blacks. They kind of left the blacks out of a lot of things. Like you could move up levels in the church and you were given greater responsibility. Well the blacks never were even considered for promotion. Also women were not either. So on those two fronts I became angry, rebelled, and began to question first the people in my church, secondly that particular religion but not because of the way they acted because it was a natural train of progression, and then god and organized religion itself. However I realize now that it wasn't so much that they were discriminating against blacks as much as it is human nature to work within a group mentality. I have since noticed that within every race. As far as the women go well I can't think of any religion that looks to women as equals so that was just blatant discrimination.

I have moved to another area away from that church and I wasn't an atheist when I moved away. I even promised the church that I would congregate with another church that serves the same religion. I meant to sincerely. I visited the new church one time and the people barely noticed me so I never returned and that gave me more of an open avenue to explore my already questioning mind of that religion. I have not told my old church that I am an atheist and to be honest I don't think I would feel comfortable telling them. Because it wouldn't do them any good or me. They would be hurt and I would feel bad for hurting them.

OLAADEGBU:

The moment you verred into the religion section to post you subscribed either consciously or subconsciously into a philosophical debate.  It is basically man's philosophical ideas against God's philosophy if we may call it that.

You do not have any proof of the existence of God because you are looking for proofs in all the wrong directions.  You cannot expect to use empirical methods to prove the existence of a personal God.  How can you scientically prove to me that you passionately kissed your man?  This is a personal experience that can only be proved by personal intimate relationship which has only been experienced by you.  So to prove the existence of the Creator God you have to experience Him personally, as this is by faith in His written word (Bible) which is His specific revelation and through the general revelation of His creation as I mentioned earlier.  You cannot know Him through your five or more senses that is only useful to discern natural things (His Creations) but you can ask Him for faith which you will get when you read His word and He will open the eyes of your heart to see the light of the glorious gospel of Jesus Christ.  Faith comes by the continuous hearing of the word of God.

This again is the religious beliefs of the gnostics who believe that God is feminine.  Did you say that you are not religious? tell me again.

As much as I agree with you that organised religion has been the cause of a lot of heartaches in the world today I will like to tell you that God does not want you to be religious He did not allow His only begotten Son Jesus to die so that you can become religious but He came so that you can have a personal relationship with the personal God who is the Creator of heaven and earth.  He is the source of the moral life that you tend to live and I believe that organised religion cannot do this for you but getting connected to the source of life and having a daily fellowship with Him will get you there.

Despite your claims that you are not religious the fact shows that you at least cling to two beliefs; your belief in the non - existence of God even though you cannot prove it, and your belief that if such a deity exists that He must be a She, a common religious belief in the early centuries A.D.

I am not religious. As I do not practice organized religion. I have to run off the belief that god doesn't exist because the only thing that I can prove as far as this mythological sky god goes is that I have never seen her, heard her etc,  so she doesn't exist logically or at least I cannot prove her existence logically. However there may be a great creator but it is not what we have imagined up as far as I am concerned.

I can be non religious which means to not practice organized religion and still have theories. I like mythology. Based on the qualities that humans have given their sky god then it would be a woman if it existed. But god doesn't exist in reality as far as we can prove. God is only a story with plenty of books and different versions told over and over. God is a fantasy. Imagination. I believe that if such a being exist that is the great creator of all things that the human mind cannot begin to fathom it's existence. We would not know that it exist. And it would not have the qualities that we give to the god we created and worship in organized religion. Because those are human qualities. Well that is my theory as for the possibility of a great creator.

OLAADEGBU:


You do not have any proof of the existence of God because you are looking for proofs in all the wrong directions.  You cannot expect to use empirical methods to prove the existence of a personal God.  How can you scientically prove to me that you passionately kissed your man?  This is a personal experience that can only be proved by personal intimate relationship which has only been experienced by you.  So to prove the existence of the Creator God you have to experience Him personally, as this is by faith in His written word (Bible) which is His specific revelation and through the general revelation of His creation as I mentioned earlier.  You cannot know Him through your five or more senses that is only useful to discern natural things (His Creations) but you can ask Him for faith which you will get when you read His word and He will open the eyes of your heart to see the light of the glorious gospel of Jesus Christ.  Faith comes by the continuous hearing of the word of God.

Do you then concede that it is delusional to believe in what you can not use your senses to comprehend? why do you guys always shoot yourselves in the foot each time you are trying to defend your imaginary god? Does having faith in things that do not make sense sound rational to you? Why then are you sometimes on the Islamic thread haranguing them for their own beliefs since you have conceded that your own god can not be discerned through the natural human senses? Is that what the bible tells you or are you just making things up to keep yourself in your world of delusion?

And as for the bible being the word of a divine entity how do you know that? There's plenty of evidence and it points to the bible being written by non-eyewitnesses, internally contradictory, morally repugnant, irrational, scientifically false, and historically inaccurate. So why did your god, presumably omniscient, cause them to write so much that was demonstrably false? Was it your all knowing god who said breeding animals by striped sticks produced striped offspring? What a dumbass god.

OLAADEGBU:

As much as I agree with you that organised religion has been the cause of a lot of heartaches in the world today I will like to tell you that God does not want you to be religious He did not allow His only begotten Son Jesus to die so that you can become religious but He came so that you can have a personal relationship with the personal God who is the Creator of heaven and earth. [b] He is the source of the moral life that you tend to live [/b]and I believe that organised religion cannot do this for you but getting connected to the source of life and having a daily fellowship with Him will get you there.

I Just want to know how the god you believe in constitute or is the source of moral life for humans. Have you ever seen received any moral injunction from the god you believe in or do you have the words of men telling you what is morally right and what is immoral?

angelgirl1:

I am not religious. As I do not practice organized religion. I have to run off the belief that god doesn't exist because the only thing that I can prove as far as this mythological sky god goes is that I have never seen her, heard her etc,  so she doesn't exist logically or at least I cannot prove her existence logically. However there may be a great creator but it is not what we have imagined up as far as I am concerned.

To an extent I do agree and sympathise with you.  You do not have to be religious nor practise organised religion to know that God exists.  It is also partly true that you cannot prove the existence of God logically through your five senses.  It might surprise you that God is willing to live on the inside of you if you will allow Him into your life.  It is not what you imagines that matters it is what He has revealed that is most important

angelgirl1:

I can be non religious which means to not practice organized religion and still have theories. I like mythology. Based on the qualities that humans have given their sky god then it would be a woman if it existed. But god doesn't exist in reality as far as we can prove. God is only a story with plenty of books and different versions told over and over. God is a fantasy. Imagination. I believe that if such a being exist that is the great creator of all things that the human mind cannot begin to fathom it's existence. We would not know that it exist. And it would not have the qualities that we give to the god we created and worship in organized religion. Because those are human qualities. Well that is my theory as for the possibility of a great creator.

Again to an extent you are right if you say that our finite mind is too small to comprehend the infinite Creator God at the same time this Great God has made Himself known to mankind in the person of Jesus Christ who is willing to forgive you of your past sins and impart His righteousness into you and grant you eternal life.  Even though I cannot prove that you exist through my physical senses I have the evidence that you exist by the intelligence that I see you type here, it will be foolish of me to say that because I cannot see you that I don't believe that you exist.  The evidence that you exist is the work of your hands, that is, the words and intelligence that you type on this forum is all the evidence that I need that I am talking to a human being.  The evidence that you need about the existence of God is the work of His creation that you can see all around you.  Why do scientists become so excited when they discover stone tools together with bones in a cave?  The stone tools show signs of intelligence.  The scientists do recognise that these tools could not have designed themselves but that they are a product of an intelligent creature, and this means that even though we do not see eye to eye we can recognise design, which is the evidence of the outworkings of intelligence.  Does that make any sense to you at all?

toneyb:

I Just want to know how the god you believe in constitute or is the source of moral life for humans. Have you ever seen received any moral injunction from the god you believe in or do you have the words of men telling you what is morally right and what is immoral?

The uncreated Creator who created us created us in His own image, even though man has now rebelled and now wishes to create God in his own image the moral law of God still remains in us as a witness.  Do you know that your conscience, that part of you that always alarms you of what is right and wrong even though we silence it with our rebellious thoughts of man's ideologies and because of the sin nature in us, just as the alarm clock rings and because you want to sleep a bit more you silence or muffle it. The thief does not really think that the law enforcements' existence until he or she gets caught red handed.   God's moral law was revealed to us to remind us of how far we have gone and also to show us how we can trace our way back to the source of the moral law.  Even though man has decided to write his own moral ethics which he can always delete according to his selfish motive but you have to be aware that at the end of the day we all have to be accountable to the giver of the moral law and the giver of life.

OLAADEGBU:

[b]The uncreated Creator who created us created us in His own image, even though man has now rebelled and now wishes to create God in his own image the moral law of God still remains in us as a witness.  Do you know that your conscience, that part of you that always alarms you of what is right and wrong even though [/b]we silence it with our rebellious thoughts of man's ideologies and because of the sin nature in us, just as the alarm clock rings and because you want to sleep a bit more you silence or muffle it. The thief does not really think that the law enforcements' existence until he or she gets caught red handed.   God's moral law was revealed to us to remind us of how far we have gone and also to show us how we can trace our way back to the source of the moral law.  Even though man has decided to write his own moral ethics which he can always delete according to his selfish motive but you have to be aware that at the end of the day we all have to be accountable to the giver of the moral law and the giver of life.

Could the creator have foreseen the future rebellion in the man he was creating?

huxley2:

Could the creator have foreseen the future rebellion in the man he was creating?

why do u think He designed hell?

OLAADEGBU:

Again to an extent you are right if you say that our finite mind is too small to comprehend the infinite Creator God at the same time this Great God has made Himself known to mankind in the person of Jesus Christ who is willing to forgive you of your past sins and impart His righteousness into you and grant you eternal life. Even though I cannot prove that you exist through my physical senses I have the evidence that you exist by the intelligence that I see you type here, it will be foolish of me to say that because I cannot see you that I don't believe that you exist.

This is a very false assertion and a very wrong analogy.

The evidence that you exist is the work of your hands, that is, the words and intelligence that you type on this forum is all the evidence that I need that I am talking to a human being. The evidence that you need about the existence of God is the work of His creation that you can see all around you. Why do scientists become so excited when they discover stone tools together with bones in a cave? The stone tools show signs of intelligence. The scientists do recognise that these tools could not have designed themselves but that they are a product of an intelligent creature, and this means that even though we do not see eye to eye we can recognise design, which is the evidence of the outworkings of intelligence. Does that make any sense to you at all?

I think you did not read her post very well, by the way if there is an intelligent designer what makes you think that he is has human personalities? By the way if there is a designer as you claim then that designer is not an intelligent designer. The designer would have designed the human body far better than it is designed. The human body is very poorly designed. What kind of intelligent designer is this that designed the world as we see it? What about the problem of Evil in the world, did the designer designed the world with all the evil that is in it too? is it the same intelligent designer that allows earth quakes, hurricanes, thunder storms, famine and diseases like small pox that killed about five hundred million people in the world, and most of the other natural evils that occur all the time. Why do ten of thousands of little babies drop dead every year in the world for no apparent reason — what we call (but cannot explain) SIDS are all this part of the intelligent design too? What about the animal kingdom? please take some time out to watch animal planet or national goe wild, does the animal kingdom with its prey vs game look like any design that looks intelligent?

I don’t mean to suggest that there are no Christian efforts to answer these sorts of questions, just that I personally find those answers very unpersuasive. When Christians tell us that we have no right to expect God to “create the world for our comfort,” or that we “deserve natural evils as a punishment for sin,” that doesn’t seem to mesh with day-old babies dying for no reason. Nor does the “free will defence” seem to apply to tsunamis, diseases like small pox that killed hundred of millions of people for no reason at all and little babies. Simply put:the world looks indifferent, even hostile, to us. By the way if Christians insists that diseases and natural disaster are all from god then are they also trying to tell us that man can alter the actions of the all powerful god by inventing drugs to cure disease or altering natural disaster by using machines? Over 70% of the earth is covered in salt-water oceans that we cannot stand on, live in, or breathe or drink from. Of the remaining land, half of that is taken up by uninhabitable mountains, glaciers, deserts, or other inhabitable terrain. On the tiny slice of land that is habitable, we are subject to the uncontrollable whims of nature, such as the vicious tsunami, earth quakes, sun burns, diseases and other harmful natural phenomena that I describe above. So God who is an intelligent designer put us into existence on a planet that is constantly trying to kill us with natural disasters, deadly viruses and bacteria, poisonous insects, and so on and so on.

lol this became a war zone quick quick.

threadstarter - i believe you have your answer. Keep shut or be ready to be torn apart.

To answer the original question, I'm sure many Nigerians will not understand or agree with Atheists and a large percentage will probably look down on you. Of course, it will be done In Jesus Name.

Our culture seems to celebrate religious fanaticism, so people tend to get unnecessarily worked-up and emotional.

Personally, I don't look down on anyone, we are all entitled to our beliefs. Besides, that would be so unchristian, which many Nigerians tend to forget, conveniently, In Jesus Name.

Now, would I choose an Atheist as a lover or spouse? No, I wouldn't, because being spiritually grounded is one of the values I look for.

@oladegbu
''moral laws inscribed into our conscience by our creator silenced by sin and rebellion against god''
what the hell is this?
So you saying man is born with a conscience and the so called 'moral' laws in our hearts? This is complete rubbish i must say.
You claim these 'moral' laws coincide with the ten commandments of which include don't kill,steal,covert and others. . . .imagine my dismay when i think your same god ordered the isrealites to violate these laws. Gave them instructions to kill and steal peoples lands,murder women and children and so on. What kind of god is that?

OLAADEGBU:

The uncreated Creator who created us created us in His own image, even though man has now rebelled and now wishes to create God in his own image the moral law of God still remains in us as a witness.  Do you know that your conscience, that part of you that always alarms you of what is right and wrong even though we silence it with our rebellious thoughts of man's ideologies and because of the sin nature in us, just as the alarm clock rings and because you want to sleep a bit more you silence or muffle it. The thief does not really think that the law enforcements' existence until he or she gets caught red handed.    God's moral law was revealed to us to remind us of how far we have gone and also to show us how we can trace our way back to the source of the moral law.  Even though man has decided to write his own moral ethics which he can always delete according to his selfish motive but you have to be aware that at the end of the day we all have to be accountable to the giver of the moral law and the giver of life.

Or the created god who men created in their own image for a lot of reasons. I will like to state that if objective moral law exist then the bible god does not exist. and since objective moral law exist then the bible god does not exist. I will state a few objective moral laws.
1. It is wrong to kill or commaned the killing of innocent children.
2. It is wrong to kill or command the killing of innocent people in general.
3. It is wrong to rape women no matter what the reason is.
4.It is wrong to ensalve people.

The bible god has violated all of these objective moral laws hance he CANNOT be the giver of objective moral injucntions as mazaje has stated in one of his post you do not have an example of any god giving any moral laws all you have are the writings of ancient civilizations ascribing their laws and ethics which they formulated to fit in with the time and civilization they lived in and ascribed it to to the god they created in their very own image. No wonder when their morals and ethics change the morals and ethics of their god changes.

“I am the LORD, I change not. therefore ye sons of Jacob are not consumed.”Malachi 3:6 James 1:17: "Every good and perfect gift is from above, coming down from the Father of the heavenly lights, who does not change like shifting shadows."

What evidence is there for its truthfulness of Malachi 3:6 and James 1:17 when we have the bible God changing his position(including his moral laws) all over the bible?

@bindex
Not sure I have said this before but I am really a big fan of yours, I like the way you string words together( try re reading what you wrote with a russian accent, nothing way cooler than that!
@NofearNyc
Shame I got a christian girlfriend she lets me do everything I like! In exchange I drop her off at church on sundays and have to wait till she is done which means I get to sit inside sometimes especially when the young priest comes to scare them about hell and she keeps pinching me because I am giggling hehehe,
My point is there's loads of christians who understand how absurd it is to believe there is a God, never underestimate the power of a learned habit they all need a fix.
@postergirl
Way to go girl, I was like you for a while, sympathising until I just didnt give a crap, why should I anyway I am right 98% of the time!
By the way why save sex for marriage?
Cheers y'all

The sick irony is that most of them really don't care about the rape the killing and all the other deviltry that was and is attributed to this God.
I mean it takes a real zombie not to see fissure in the character of this supposed perfect God.
@bindex
Before I forget can I have an autograph now

Chrisbenogor:

The sick irony is that most of them really don't care about the rape the killing and all the other deviltry that was and is attributed to this God. I mean it takes a real zombie not to see fissure in the character of this supposed perfect God.
@bindex
Before I forget can I have an autograph now

But they clearly see the ones attributed to the Islamic god. Very funny people.

bindex:

Do you then concede that it is delusional to believe in what you can not use your senses to comprehend? why do you guys always shoot yourselves in the foot each time you are trying to defend your imaginary god? Does having faith in things that do not make sense sound rational to you? Why then are you sometimes on the Islamic thread haranguing them for their own beliefs since you have conceded that your own god can not be discerned through the natural human senses? Is that what the bible tells you or are you just making things up to keep yourself in your world of delusion?

And as for the bible being the word of a divine entity how do you know that? There's plenty of evidence and it points to the bible being written by non-eyewitnesses, internally contradictory, morally repugnant, irrational, scientifically false, and historically inaccurate. So why did your god, presumably omniscient, cause them to write so much that was demonstrably false? Was it your all knowing god who said breeding animals by striped sticks produced striped offspring? What a dumbass god.

In as much that I do not have time for your unreasonable babblings, I just want to point out that because your limited human reasoning cannot fathom the Creator God does not give you the excuse to condemn what you don't know. The fact that your finite mind that is only limited to your five senses cannot understand the spiritual dimension does not mean that you cannot humble yourself to learn from the contact point between the finite man and the infinite eternal uncreated Creator which is the Bible.

The creation we see around us is sufficient for me to scientifically defend the existence of God but to prove it would have to be by faith in the undiluted, inerrant and inspired word of God. This can only be possible when you humble yourself and climb down from your high seat of pride and rebellion and diligently seek for the truth, it is only after this will God open the eyes of your heart to see, hear and comprehend what you have been blinded from since all these years.

@This is to all atheists in the house especially the poster, toneyb and Tudor,

Can you match up to the moral standard of God?  Either you like it or not you are going to be accountable to God by these same moral laws.  If you will answer these questions with your conscience (if you still have any) you will find out that these are the highest standards that we have to judge ourselves with and it does not matter what moral ethics you adopt if you don't measure up to these standards you will have no excuse when you face your maker as your conscience, which you have silenced, will expose you.  Now answer these questions conscientiously, that is, try to listen to your conscience without arguing if that is possible.

Have I always loved God my Creator with all my heart, mind, soul and strength?  ____YES  ___NO 
Have I made a god in my own image? a god to suit myself?  ____YES  ___NO 
Have I ever used God's name in vain?   ____YES  ___NO
Have I kept the Sabbath holy?  ____YES  ___NO 
Have I always honoured my parents implicitly?  ____YES  ___NO 
Have I murdered (God considers hatred, abortion and euthanasia as murder)?  ____YES  ___NO 
Have I committed adultery (including premarital sex and lust)?  ____YES  ___NO 
Have I stolen (the value is irrelevant)?  ____YES  ___NO 
Have I lied (including fibs and these questions)?  ____YES  ___NO 
Have I coveted (been greedy or materialistic)?  ____YES  ___NO 

If you have even broken one Law, then you have sinned against God and therefore will "surely die," for the "wages of sin is death."  Rom.3:23 (Death is the separation from God, either temporary or permanently)

We are all guilty of breaking the Commandments.  Listen to the voice of your conscience, and let it remind you of some of the sins of the past.  We are not perfect as we are commanded to be (Matthew 5:48), neither is our heart pure.  On Judgment Day our transgressions will be the evidence of our shame.  Think of it: God has seen every sin we have ever committed. We share our thought-life with Him.

We are guilty of violating His Law a multitude of times, yet if we repent, God can forgive us because Jesus stepped into the courtroom 2,000 years ago and paid the fine for us.

His death on the cross satisfied the Law we so blatantly transgressed, and at the same time demonstrated how much God loves us[i]—"For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life."[/i] His shed blood on the cross can make you clean in the sight of a holy God, as though you have never sinned.

God doesn't want you to go to Hell.  Please, forget your arguments, repent and put your trust in Jesus and be saved from God's wrath.  Make Psalm 51 your prayer, then read your Bible daily and always obey what you read; God will never let you down.

@

toneyb:

This is a very false assertion and a very wrong analogy.

I think you did not read her post very well, by the way if there is an intelligent designer what makes you think that he is has human personalities? By the way if there is a designer as you claim then that designer is not an intelligent designer. The designer would have designed the human body far better than it is designed. The human body is very poorly designed. What kind of intelligent designer is this that designed the world as we see it? What about the problem of Evil in the world, did the designer designed the world with all the evil that is in it too? is it the same intelligent designer that allows earth quakes, hurricanes, thunder storms, famine and diseases like small pox that killed about five hundred million people in the world, and most of the other natural evils that occur all the time. Why do ten of thousands of little babies drop dead every year in the world for no apparent reason — what we call (but cannot explain) SIDS are all this part of the intelligent design too? What about the animal kingdom? please take some time out to watch animal planet or national goe wild, does the animal kingdom with its prey vs game look like any design that looks intelligent?

For those who still have a conscience but still wants scientific evidence that demands a Creator God, you can read the article below that defends the existence of God through scientific evidence available to our finite senses.

http://www.answersingenesis.org/articles/nab/is-there-really-a-god

@

toneyb:

I don’t mean to suggest that there are no Christian efforts to answer these sorts of questions, just that I personally find those answers very unpersuasive. When Christians tell us that we have no right to expect God to “create the world for our comfort,” or that we “deserve natural evils as a punishment for sin,” that doesn’t seem to mesh with day-old babies dying for no reason. Nor does the “free will defence” seem to apply to tsunamis, diseases like small pox that killed hundred of millions of people for no reason at all and little babies. Simply put:the world looks indifferent, even hostile, to us. By the way if Christians insists that diseases and natural disaster are all from god then are they also trying to tell us that man can alter the actions of the all powerful god by inventing drugs to cure disease or altering natural disaster by using machines? Over 70% of the earth is covered in salt-water oceans that we cannot stand on, live in, or breathe or drink from. Of the remaining land, half of that is taken up by uninhabitable mountains, glaciers, deserts, or other inhabitable terrain. On the tiny slice of land that is habitable, we are subject to the uncontrollable whims of nature, such as the vicious tsunami, earth quakes, sun burns, diseases and other harmful natural phenomena that I describe above. So God who is an intelligent designer put us into existence on a planet that is constantly trying to kill us with natural disasters, deadly viruses and bacteria, poisonous insects, and so on and so on.

Since this is the question most atheists use as an excuse to rebel against their Creator and because I do not want to be repeating myself, I am suggesting that you read this brilliant article that attempts to tackle your questions and you will find out that you have absolutely no excuse.

http://www.answersingenesis.org/articles/nab/why-does-creation-include-suffering

And if you not convinced with the explanation made or you are so lazy to read the articles suggested in the weblink provided you may wish to watch a 50 minutes videolink that is in two parts that shows how the general editor of answers in Genesis precisely defended the creationists worldview with scientific evidences in the link below.

http://www.answersingenesis.org/media/video/ondemand/god-come-from/where-god-come-from

@OLAADEGBU
Every time you post links to stuff that people never bother to read, I made the mistake of actually going to your why does God's creation Include death and suffering link and I just have to give you a piece of my mind for having wasted my precious time.

In the beginning, about 6000 years ago. God created the universe and everything in it in actual six days. At the end of his creative acts on the sixth day God saw everything that he had made and indeed it was very good.
To have been very good, God's creation must have been without blemish defect or disease, suffering or death. There was no survival of the fittest animals did not prey on each other, and the first two humans Adam and Eve , did not kill animals for food, the tale goes on

Did it occur to you that the human body was designed to eat meat? of course there are vegans today but if God was as sensible as you think he is then why create man with the capability to digest meat he must have seen that man will fall abi?
Did the lion grow its fangs overnight? or did the mosquito just pick up the bad habit of leaving a parasite behind in you each time it sucks blood from you which I hardly need not tell you is a heck of a long way from being a vegetarian. I could go n but I know it would make no sense to you so for wasting my time today ( oh by the way I didnt read past that paragraph the author souinds to immature no offence meant ) just tell me how you managed to convince your self that the razor sharp tooth of the croc grew the minute eve took a bite at that apple, just how pretty please?

Have I always loved God my Creator with all my heart, mind, soul and strength?  ____YES  ___NO
Have I made a god in my own image? a god to suit myself?  ____YES  ___NO
Have I ever used God's name in vain?   ____YES  ___NO
Have I kept the Sabbath holy?  ____YES  ___NO
Have I always honoured my parents implicitly?  ____YES  ___NO
Have I murdered (God considers hatred, abortion and euthanasia as murder)?  ____YES  ___NO
Have I committed adultery (including premarital sex and lust)?  ____YES  ___NO
Have I stolen (the value is irrelevant)?  ____YES  ___NO
Have I lied (including fibs and these questions)?  ____YES  ___NO
Have I coveted (been greedy or materialistic)?  ____YES  ___NO

If you have even broken one Law, then you have sinned against God and therefore will "surely die," for the "wages of sin is death."  Rom.3:23 (Death is the separation from God, either temporary or permanently)
[color=#990000]
We are all guilty of breaking the Commandments.  Listen to the voice of your conscience, and let it remind you of some of the sins of the past.  We are not perfect as we are commanded to be (Matthew 5:48), neither is our heart pure.  On Judgment Day our transgressions will be the evidence of our shame.  Think of it: God has seen every sin we have ever committed. We share our thought-life with Him.

We are guilty of violating His Law a multitude of times, yet if we repent, God can forgive us because Jesus stepped into the courtroom 2,000 years ago and paid the fine for us.

His death on the cross satisfied the Law we so blatantly transgressed, and at the same time demonstrated how much God loves us—"For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life." His shed blood on the cross can make you clean in the sight of a holy God, as though you have never sinned.

God doesn't want you to go to Hell.  Please, forget your arguments, repent and put your trust in Jesus and be saved from God's wrath.  Make Psalm 51 your prayer, then read your Bible daily and always obey what you read; God will never let you down.

lol, The best way to sell God is to threaten people with hell?

All i can say is this,
1, Religion is mans creation and divinity claim,
2, If God exists, we wouldn't need extensive arguement, logic and research to find out,
3, Morality,religions, are what people use to lord and manage others,( power play)
4, If God exists, he hasnt in any general way revealed himself to every man, ( this is important if he needs all men to believe in him)
5, Religion caused more harm,death,conflict war,divisions than it united.
6, Most people believe in religion out of ,fear,need and general insecurity,
7, The concept of God is personal, selfish and demographical.
8, Possibly, God can exist in supernatural but natural human cannot comprehend him,just like artificals i.e car,can not comprehend human ( if so, then any religious claim of the concept of God is fales)

OLAADEGBU:

In as much that I do not have time for your unreasonable babblings, I just want to point out that because your limited human reasoning cannot fathom the Creator God does not give you the excuse to condemn what you don't know.  The fact that your finite mind that is only limited to your five senses cannot understand the spiritual dimension does not mean that you cannot humble yourself to learn from the contact point between the finite man and the infinite eternal uncreated Creator which is the Bible. 

I can see that you are very good when it comes to word play. When has your god moved into the spiritual dimension? I thought you were once trying to use mathematics to prove his existence here on nairaland, what happened? Who told you that what ever created this universe is your god? did your intelligent designer god create this universe  with all its too much destruction  like exploding stars? is that a good or intelligent design? all arguments for god can be explained without god through natural means. Here is a very nice quote from toneyb

  [b]I do concede, of course, that there are things about the Earth and about the Universe that we can’t explain. But I don’t think these unexplained phenomena are sufficient to give rise to an inference of supernatural causation. Just 1000 years ago, we couldn’t explain lightning, earth quakes or why maggots seemed to form spontaneously on rotting meat, or why the other planets seemed to zigzag across the sky, or why human beings have a coccyx, or why the rainbow appears in the sky or countless other everyday phenomena. And 1000 years ago, people ascribed those events to God or to their various Gods.

Since then, however, we’ve developed very good and empirical explanations for these things and by extension I’m not ready to go with a “god of the gaps” for the remaining things we don’t understand today. I don’t see anything conceptually that requires a god for explanation.

The bottom line is that this simply does not look like the kind of world, in the kind of universe, which was created and is watched over by an all-loving God for the benefit of his special creation. I thus conclude that the third line of objections to my general case for atheism does not warrant belief in God as an explanation for the existence of this universe. [/b]

Toneyb says its all in the quote above.

The creation we see around us is sufficient for me to scientifically defend the existence of God but to prove it would have to be by faith in the undiluted, inerrant and inspired word of God. This can only be possible when you humble yourself and climb down from your high seat of pride and rebellion and diligently seek for the truth, it is only after this will God open the eyes of your heart to see, hear and comprehend what you have been blinded from since all these years.

Because you see things around you suddenly assume that your own god created everything right? Where is your evidence that he created everything? don't point to the embrassing creation accounts we have in genesis 1 and 2 please. I asked you a simple question but you refused to answer instead you just went ahead and continued to fire away with your drivel.  And as for the bible being the word of a divine entity how do you know that? There's plenty of evidence and it points to the bible being written by non-eyewitnesses, internally contradictory, morally repugnant, irrational, scientifically false, and historically inaccurate. So why did your god, presumably omniscient, cause them to write so much that was demonstrably false? Was it your all knowing god who said breeding animals by striped sticks produced striped offspring? Did your all knowing god tell them to write that he created all animals as vegetarians?

banom:

All i can say is this,
1, Religion is mans creation and divinity claim,
2, If God exists, we wouldn't need extensive arguement, logic and research to find out,
3, Morality,religions, are what people use to lord and manage others,( power play)
4, If God exists, he hasnt in any general way revealed himself to every man, ( this is important if he needs all men to believe in him)
5, Religion caused more harm,death,conflict war,divisions than it united.
6, Most people believe in religion out of ,fear,need and general inseurity,
7, The concept of God is personal, selfish and demographical.
8, Possibly, God can exist in supernatural but natural human cannot comprehend him,just like artificals i.e car,can not comprehend human ( if so, then any religious claim of the concept of God is fals)

That is the bottom line, All you hear these days in churches are "the favour of the lord will be with you in your finances, your marriage, your health and all your doings" favour, favour, favour, the favour of the lord shall be with you in all you do, you shall find favour amongst all men and on and on(Sweet lies that pastors love telling people). The problem is that Nigerians do not see any favour from any imaginary god but they keep believeing in lies myths and deciet. Nigerians keep waiting for the favour of their gods while the country keeps decaying. Religion is the outcome of man’s struggle with natural phenomenon that is why there are so many religions. There is no god only religion.

angelgirl1:

I noticed that a lot of Nigerians are very religious. I know that not all of them are. But it seems to be a big part of Nigerian culture. I am not religious. I do not believe that god even exist. I don't disrespect those who are religious however and I certainly do not try to turn them against religion. I think that religion has a lot of good advice. Things such as saving sex for marriage, and just general morality I follow those same rules because they are sensible. I was wondering if most Nigerians are religious first of all and is so then would most of them look down upon Atheists such as myself?

Very good topic !!. Christians are the most complex people of any who discuss the Bible. They pose the most difficult challenges in religious communications because they make a wide variety of mistakes when they interact with those of differing beliefs and points of views. This is primarily a result of their unique religious philosophy. Christians  presume that everyone they associate with has a moral obligation to have the same religious feelings that they do. They firmly believe that others who hold differing opinions are either uninformed or confused and are unable to correctly interpret biblical writings without guidance and insight. Christians never consider that other people's beliefs and points of views might be as valid as their own. This is the most insulting characteristic a Christians  portrays. He begins interactions with skeptics and analysts with the preconceived attitude that he has all the answers and the other person is ignorant.