Welcome, Guest: Register On Nairaland / LOGIN! / Trending / Recent / New
Stats: 3,154,739 members, 7,824,129 topics. Date: Friday, 10 May 2024 at 11:52 PM

Worship Vs Greetings (can We Bow Or Prostrate For Others Than Allah?) - Islam for Muslims (2) - Nairaland

Nairaland Forum / Nairaland / General / Religion / Islam for Muslims / Worship Vs Greetings (can We Bow Or Prostrate For Others Than Allah?) (5292 Views)

Atheists, Allah is Your Creator. Repent, Bow And Stop Being Like Shaitan / Something You Must Know About Islamic Greetings / Responding To The Greetings Of A Parrot Or Phone Ringing? (2) (3) (4)

(1) (2) (Reply) (Go Down)

Re: Worship Vs Greetings (can We Bow Or Prostrate For Others Than Allah?) by bitingcool: 12:02pm On Feb 01, 2018
My friend sells Muslim story books for young children .

now this is important so that your children grow up with the knowledge that they could show love and be loved irrespective of your religion. please check out her page and give her a call she retails to the whole of nigeria

Let your kids have fun learning about their religion

Checkout @1strevelation on instagram and also give your children an opportunity to experience joy in learning stories as regards the muslim way of life

Re: Worship Vs Greetings (can We Bow Or Prostrate For Others Than Allah?) by alisheriff: 12:08pm On Feb 01, 2018
it is recommended to reply greeting in the same way or which is even greater than what they greet you with. the question now is, did the Islam has it mode of greeting or it doesn't. if it yes how? Yoruba will say eku aaro, eka san o e.t.c for greeting while kneeling and the elders will reply aajire bi if it is morning, then they will pray for the young or child if it happens to be the parent been greeted. this is the mode of greeting in Yoruba culture, ALLAH A'LAM but what I think is most preferable is too be conscious of Allah (s.w.t) in the varied aspect of what you uphold in mind, because the standing in prayer is with bending in such a way that you will be looking down to where you will put your forehead,and in every standing bending and prostrating we do all says Allahu Akbar meaning Allah is the greatest, I think we should be conscious of this as well. even there is an ayah that idkulul l-baba sujada( surootul baqarrah verse 58) Surah Al-Baqara, Verse 58:
وَإِذْ قُلْنَا ادْخُلُوا هَٰذِهِ الْقَرْيَةَ فَكُلُوا مِنْهَا حَيْثُ شِئْتُمْ رَغَدًا وَادْخُلُوا الْبَابَ سُجَّدًا وَقُولُوا حِطَّةٌ نَّغْفِرْ لَكُمْ خَطَايَاكُمْ وَسَنَزِيدُ الْمُحْسِنِين َ

And when We said: Enter this city, then eat from it a plenteous (food) wherever you wish, and enter the gate making obeisance, and say, forgiveness. We will forgive you your wrongs and give more to those who do good (to others).
(English - Shakir)

via iQuran, the word sujud is also used here and its clear that they don't prostrate but some how bow while moving in, so I think the question we should be forwarding is bending, kneeling applicable in other affairs apart from greeting, like taking a food on some ones hand while kneeling to be given to ones parent or elders, because all those ayat in which our beloved brother(albaqir) brought does not bring greeting in except the mutual respect between fatimoh(r.a.h)and his father(saaw) in which the Yoruba can never do( the parent will never stand up to welcome their children talkless of kneeling to welcome them but they only prefer sitting, lying down while the children stand or kneel to welcome or greet them- this is obvious differeces). Allahu a'alm. Asalam alaekum warahmatullah wabarakatuh
Re: Worship Vs Greetings (can We Bow Or Prostrate For Others Than Allah?) by BetaThings: 4:38pm On Feb 04, 2018
AlBaqir:

When Muadh bin Jabal came from Sham, he prostrated (sajadah) to the Prophet (saw) who said: 'What is this, O Muadh?' He said: 'I went to Sham and saw THEM* prostrating their bishops and patricians and I wanted to do that for you.' The Messenger of Allah (saw) said: 'Do not do that. If I were to command anyone to prostrate to anyone other than Allah, I would have commanded women to prostrate to their husbands. By the one in who hand is the soul of Muhammad! No woman can fulfill her duty towards Allah until she fulfills her duty towards her husband. If he asks her (for intimacy) even if she is on her camel saddle, she should not refuse."

Comment: (The hadith is) Hasan (good).

* The version documented by Imam Hakim and Imam Ahmad which are both authentic revealed Muadh ibn Jabal saw the Christians and Jews prostrating to their Rabbi and Scholars. {[Imam Ahmad Ibn Hanbal related it with a sound chain of transmission in his Musnad vol. 4, p. 381]}.

QUE: Why did the Prophet, salallahu alayhi wa Ahli, forbid Muadh from prostrating to him? Quran clarify:

[9:31] Al-Tawbah-التَّوْبَة
"‏اِتَّخَذُوۡۤا اَحۡبَارَہُمۡ وَ رُہۡبَانَہُمۡ اَرۡبَابًا مِّنۡ دُوۡنِ اللّٰہِ وَ الۡمَسِیۡحَ ابۡنَ مَرۡیَمَ ۚ وَ مَاۤ اُمِرُوۡۤا اِلَّا لِیَعۡبُدُوۡۤا اِلٰـہًا وَّاحِدًا ۚ لَاۤ اِلٰہَ اِلَّا ہُوَ ؕ سُبۡحٰنَہٗ عَمَّا یُشۡرِکُوۡنَ ﴿۳۱﴾‏

They (christians and jews) took their priests and monks for lords besides Allah and (also) the Messiah, the son of Maryam (Mary), whilst in truth they had not been given (any) command except to worship (only) the One God besides Whom there is no God. Holy is He, far above those that they associate with Him as partners. "

What the Christians and Jews did are worshipping in the real sense (prostrating while they recognize their monks and Nabi E'esa as their lords and gods). This is shir'k, absolutely. And it is in this context that Muadh's sajdah (bowing) was forbidden having stated his intention


This is incorrect. Infact it is very dangerous. Sunnis should watch out for the sophistry of the shias, esp the twelver shias
When a twelver start quoting Sunni ahadeeth, you must start reading very closely, pay attention and watch out because mischief is afoot

What the poster is indirectly saying is that the companions (RAA) did not know the difference between the prostration of worship and and prostration of greeting and honouring. That is clearly not true
The companions (RAA) who tried to prostrate for the Prophet (SAW) were not worshipping him (SAW), they(RAA) were honouring him(SAW) and he (SAW) forbade them (RAA) from that

And since prostration is forbidden explicitly by the Prophet (SAW), that suffices for us. All the circumstantial inquiry we have here are designed to raise doubts with the ultimate intention of justifying the determination of shias and sufis to venerate their figures.

Shias mention the name of Ali (RA) when they need help or want to embark on an activity. Sunni begin in the name of Allah
Sufis in Nigeria call on the powers of Niyas and dsiplay his photos all over the place

So prostration is nothing to this group

As for this,

[quote author=AlBaqir post=44465234]
Narrated Anas bin Malik:

The Prophet (s) came out after the sun had declined and offered the Zuhr prayer (in congregation). After finishing it with Taslim, he stood on the pulpit and mentioned the Hour and mentioned there would happen great events before it. Then he said, "Whoever wants to ask me any question, may do so, for by Allah, you will not ask me about anything but I will inform you of its answer as long as I am at this place of mine." On this, the Ansar wept violently, and Allah's Messenger (s) kept on saying, "Ask Me! " Then a man got up and asked, ''Where will my entrance be, O Allah's Messenger (s)?" The Prophet (s) said, "(You will go to) the Fire." Then `Abdullah bin Hudhaifa got up and asked, "Who is my father, O Allah's Messenger (s)?" The Prophet (s) replied, "Your father is Hudhaifa." The Prophet (s) then kept on saying (angrily), "Ask me! Ask me!" `Umar THEN KNELT ON HIS KNEES and said, "We have accepted Allah as our Lord and Islam as our religion and Muhammad as an Apostle." Allah's Messenger (s) became quiet when `Umar said that. Then Allah's Messenger (s) said, "By Him in Whose Hand my life is, Paradise and Hell were displayed before me across this wall while I was praying, and I never saw such good and evil as I have seen today."

We can ask, did Umar (RA) kneel for the Prophet and praise him?
He said "We have accepted Allah as our Lord and Islam as our religion and Muhammad as an Apostle."
He mentioned Allah and the deen before mentioning the Prophet (SAW)
Does that imply kneeling for the Prophet (SAW) while declaring his belief in Allah (SWT)? No

As for standing

There is this hadith

The Messenger of Allaah, sallAllaahu ‘alayhi wa sallam, said: “Whoever loves that the people appear before him standing (up for him), then let him find his seat in the Hellfire.” Reported by Al-Bukhaaree in Al-Adab-ul-Mufrad (977) and others

It occurs from the path of Habeeb Ibn Ash-Shaheed on the authority of Abu Mujliz, who said: “Mu’awiyah entered a house in which was ‘Abdullaah Ibn Az-Zubair and ‘Abdullaah Ibn ‘Aamir. So Ibn ‘Aamir stood up while Ibn Az-Zubair remained seated – and he was the one with the most experience of the two. So Mu’awiyah, radyAllaahu ‘anhumaa, said: “Sit O Ibn ‘Aamir for I heard the Messenger of Allaah, sallAllaahu ‘alayhi wa sallam, say: [and he mentioned the hadeeth]. At-Tirmidhee said: “It is a hasan hadeeth.”

Finally, we should ask. What is so important about prostrating for an ordinary human being who cannot remove sickness from himself, let alone another. Why do we need to go to all these length to contest the rights of Allah? What is the reward? If I grow old and people start prostrating for me, what will it add to me?

Since the OP brought up this issue, it is necessary to make use of the opportunity
[quote author=AlBaqir post=44465234]
In fiqh, before Sujjud (putting one's forehead on the ground) can be valid, SEVEN bones MUST compliment the forehead also. {[see: Taudhihul Masael of Ayatullah al-Khoei, section of Sajdatayn (two prostrations)]}

* Narrated Ibn 'Abbas:

The Prophet said, "I have been ordered to prostrate on seven bones i.e. on the forehead along with the tip of the nose and the Prophet pointed towards his nose, both hands, both knees and the toes of both feet and not to gather the clothes or the hair."
Ref: Sahih Bukhari Vol 1, Book 12, No 776

Thanks for clarifying this
The sujood normally done by shia on the turbah (clay pebble) carried around by Shia is incomplete. They claim they want to prostrate on the earth. The turbah that shias carry around allows them to put only their forehead on what they regard as "the earth". The other six bones are on rug or carpet.
If the shias claim that sunnis praying on a rug are not following the sunna, Shias too are not! 1 out of 7 is not pass mark

2 Likes 1 Share

Re: Worship Vs Greetings (can We Bow Or Prostrate For Others Than Allah?) by Empiree: 4:44pm On Feb 04, 2018
[quote author=BetaThings post=64781849][/quote] you dey look for trouble with our Shia brother cheesy
Re: Worship Vs Greetings (can We Bow Or Prostrate For Others Than Allah?) by AlBaqir(m): 4:50pm On Feb 04, 2018
[quote author=BetaThings post=64781849][/quote]

You have already ask this question on this thread:

www.nairaland.com/4210474/prostration-sajda-earth-dust-clay

And appropriate reply has been given perhaps you did not check the reply. And that either shows you don't even follow your own comment or you only want to comment.

Kindly check the thread.
Re: Worship Vs Greetings (can We Bow Or Prostrate For Others Than Allah?) by AlBaqir(m): 4:52pm On Feb 04, 2018
Empiree:
you dey look for trouble with our Shia brother cheesy

He only wish to repeat himself. Check his comment here - same question, and our reply.
www.nairaland.com/4210474/prostration-sajda-earth-dust-clay
Re: Worship Vs Greetings (can We Bow Or Prostrate For Others Than Allah?) by AlBaqir(m): 4:59pm On Feb 04, 2018
BetaThings:

Thanks for clarifying this
The sujood normally done by shia on the turbah (clay
pebble) carried around by Shia is incomplete. They claim
they want to prostrate on the earth. The turbah that shias
carry around allows them to put only their forehead on what they regard as "the earth". The other six bones are on rug or carpet.
If the shias claim that sunnis praying on a rug are not
following the sunna, Shias too are not! 1 out of 7 is not
pass mark

Here's your comment and our reply on the other thread (Dec.15, 2017)

Why repeating yourself? Perhaps you forget too often grin

BetaThings:

There are two points
1. Shias turbah that they carry around allow them to prostrate on only one bone, instead of 7. Is that salat correct too?

There is a debate on this matter here.

http://forum.twelvershia.net/general-sunni-vs-shia/turbah-sajdah-to-the-imams*/

# In sahih Bukhari, we read:

* Narrated Ibn 'Abbas:

The Prophet said, "I have been ordered to prostrate on
seven bones i.e. on the forehead along with the tip of the
nose and the Prophet pointed towards his nose, both hands, both knees and the toes of both feet and not to gather the clothes or the hair
."
Ref: Sahih Bukhari Vol 1, Book 12, No 776

This is also agreed upon in Shi'i book of Hadith and Fiqh
{[see: Taudhihul Masael of Ayatullah al-Khoei, section
of Sajdatayn (two prostrations)]}


# However, what is the meaning of this Hadith in respect to the forehead touching the earth? Naturally the two knees are usually covered by clothes. And for someone that wears pair of socks, his two toes are equally covered. And let's say on a cold winter day, one wears pair of gloves covering his hands (palms). This technically make "6 bones" covered against the earth.

# Obviously, the Prophet wear clothes and at least two of his seven bones are covered (i.e knees), and for sure he had a mat on which he prayed meaning that his two toes might not directly touch the earth. What is left and more conspicuous is the FOREHEAD.

* Interestingly, all the OP's ahadith submissions only emphasised on "forehead touching the earth, clay, soil". So the idea of other "6 bones specifically touching the earth" does not arise.

# Am afraid, what you have copied and pasted from that polemic website is of no use.

www.nairaland.com/4210474/prostration-sajda-earth-dust-clay

(1) (2) (Reply)

Truth Vs. Lie / Sanctity Of Masjid & Essence Of Human Existence. / The Islamic Etiquettes Of Using The Telephone: The Time Of Calling And Ringing

(Go Up)

Sections: politics (1) business autos (1) jobs (1) career education (1) romance computers phones travel sports fashion health
religion celebs tv-movies music-radio literature webmasters programming techmarket

Links: (1) (2) (3) (4) (5) (6) (7) (8) (9) (10)

Nairaland - Copyright © 2005 - 2024 Oluwaseun Osewa. All rights reserved. See How To Advertise. 47
Disclaimer: Every Nairaland member is solely responsible for anything that he/she posts or uploads on Nairaland.