Nezan and some people have been saying that Allaah is not a Supreme Being that He was the 'chief idol' whom the Arabs used to worship, Nezan has challenged me on this, I now invite him and his friends to prove their point. Sir Olabowale et al, come around too.

I don;t see why you need to even start a topic of this nature, considering that now it has been historically established that the very foundation of Pauline Christianity is a theft from Mithra---the true dying man paganistic myth who came to save the people from their sins, sounds similar?

If you want to begin an investigation on who is Allah, the history of the name, the semantics, let us start with these videos that are on youtube by Jews and Muslim. No theory is as dead as the Moon God assertion.

When you type in God in the standard Aramaic lexicon here is the answer

"Meaning:God
Pronunciation: (Eastern) AaLaH


Look like Jesus was worshipping Allah and called his lord as such , he didnt use the word Lord or God. Not a good argument to put forward.

NOW here is a vidoe that completely distroys the moon god assertion(most christian abadon the theory)

here are three videos since am objective dubunking your assertion

from a jew:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H_l3wmMSJcU

here is another aramaic jewish speaking guy


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y3XUNwPcIZg&feature=related

Here is another video that totally destroys the Moon GOD assertion made by a white dude


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aJ4rYO_4JDE

See all different perspectives

when did youtube become the "authentic koran"?

Instead of using Muslim arguments, ill be objective and show what christian scholarships tell us now


Rick Brown in an article entitled "Who Is "Allah"?" in the International Journal Of Frontier Missions - a well-known missiology journal - which appeared in the summer of 2006, addressed the issue of various claims concerning Allah by his fellow Christian brethren. He starts by saying in the beginning of his article:


"Much of the anger expressed in the West has taken the form of demonizing the Islamic religion, to the extent of accusing Muslims of worshipping a demon. A key element of this attack has been the claim of some that the name Allah refers to a demon or at least a pagan deity, notably the so-called "moon god." Such claims have even been made by scholars who are reputable in their own fields but who are poorly acquainted with the Arabic language and Middle-Eastern history. The Kingdom of God, however, is never advanced by being untruthful, so this matter bears further investigation."

on whether Allah is the name of a demon or have rooted in paganism

"Suppose for the sake of argument that the ancient Arabs did worship the moon. This would have no bearing on the name Allah, for there is no inscription that identifies Allah as a moon god or as a pagan deity. This contrasts with the Hebrew, Greek, Latin, and English words for God, all of which descend from words that were commonly used by pagans in reference to pagan deities. So the name Allah is freer of pagan roots than are these other names"

Imad Shehadeh from Jordan Evangelical Theological Seminary refuted Morey's claim of Allah originally being the Moon-god of Arabia using textual, lexical, historical and theological evidences

"A recent popular theory asserts that Allah was originally the moon god worshiped in Arabia before and during Muhammad's time. According to this theory, when Muhammad came on the scene, the Ka‘bah contained 360 idols, among which was the moon god called 'ilah, or "a god." Then it is said that Muhammad declared this moon god to be the chief god and called it 'al 'ilah by adding the article 'al to 'ilah, thus yielding the meaning "the god.", Morey, who is foremost in popularizing this theory, cites many references from encyclopedias, dictionaries, works of philosophy and history, as well as various writers. However, though there is little doubt about the existence of moon god worshiped in Arabia before and during Muhammad's time, there are several weaknesses with identifying this moon god with Allah. In fact Muhammad initially adopted the name "Allah" as it was used by the Arabic-speaking Jews and Christians of his day in referring to the true God of the Bible. This assertion is based on four factors: textual, lexical, historical, and theological"("Do Muslims And Christians Believe In The Same God?)

what do the majority of scholars say

"d in the journal Christian Century recently. The question of whether Christians and Muslims worship the same God was dealt with by Jewish, Christian and Muslim scholars. They all reached the same conclusion that both Jews, Christians and Muslims worship the same God albeit they differ on the nature of God."

As a note here it would be interesting for you too look into the thousands of claims of coptic Arabic christian going back before Islam who say Allah is the one true God and as a consequence it is all over their bible.

Here here is an interesting question, If ISLAM NEVER EXISTED, WOULD ALLAH still be a known Name for GOD Almighty among the Arab Jews and Christians today?

"Allah" in Arabic is "Elaw" in Aramaic. The Jews and Christians before Islam called GOD Almighty as "Allah" in the Middle East. "Allah" means the GOD Almighty that is above all gods (idols, humans, etc, ). "Elaw" in Aramaic means "God" or "GOD", and it means the same thing that the Arabic "Allah" means."

Here are archeological evidence that proved that the Arabic and Aramaic-speaking Jews and Christians in the 4rd century (200 years before Islam) called GOD Almighty as "Allah". The Hebrew speaking ones of course called Him "Yahweh" or "Jehovah", which means "The LORD" or "GOD". "Yahweh" is a Hebrew-language word. "Allah" is both Arabic and Aramaic.

Now where there Christian and Jews believing in God and not Paganism before Islam?

"Were there Jewish and Christian Arabs before Islam?

In the city of Madina in what we call today "Saudi Arabia", there were three main religions: Idol worshiping, Judaism and Christianity. The name of the Jewish leader who also was the Highest Priest in Madina before Islam came was "Abdallah Bin-Saba". His Arabic name was not "AbdElohim Bin-Saba" or "AbdElloi Bin-Saba" or "AbdGOD Bin-Saba". The reason why his first name was "Abdallah" is because the Arab Jews in Madina used the word "Allah" for GOD in their Holy Scriptures. The word "Allah" did indeed exist in the Arabic Talmud and the other Jewish Holy Scriptures.

Also, the Christians' Arabic Bible at that time used the word "Allah" for GOD. Even today's Christians' Arabic Bibles use the word "Allah" for GOD. Today in the Middle East, Christians sometimes name their kids "Abdallah". Also there are Christian families who's last names is "Abdallah".

In today's Arabic Bible, the word "Allah" is used for both the Old Testament and the New Testament. "

Here are the archelogical finding, i will quote the source at the end.

"Were there Jewish and Christian Arabs before Islam?

In the city of Madina in what we call today "Saudi Arabia", there were three main religions: Idol worshiping, Judaism and Christianity. The name of the Jewish leader who also was the Highest Priest in Madina before Islam came was "Abdallah Bin-Saba". His Arabic name was not "AbdElohim Bin-Saba" or "AbdElloi Bin-Saba" or "AbdGOD Bin-Saba". The reason why his first name was "Abdallah" is because the Arab Jews in Madina used the word "Allah" for GOD in their Holy Scriptures. The word "Allah" did indeed exist in the Arabic Talmud and the other Jewish Holy Scriptures.

Also, the Christians' Arabic Bible at that time used the word "Allah" for GOD. Even today's Christians' Arabic Bibles use the word "Allah" for GOD. Today in the Middle East, Christians sometimes name their kids "Abdallah". Also there are Christian families who's last names is "Abdallah".

In today's Arabic Bible, the word "Allah" is used for both the Old Testament and the New Testament. "

Another Christian affirming the finding

" "The history of Arabs before Islam" volume 8 pp. 178-179, and Vol 6, page 689. We can find thesites of the churches, temples and houses of our ancestors everywhere in today Arabic Countries especially in Syria, Iraq, Saudi Arabia, Egypt, Lebanon, Jordan and Palestine.

Recently Father Pecerillo, a famous Franciscan Archiologist, found morethan twenty churches in Madaba at the south of Jordan. From the Forth Century we found houses in Syria, Lebanon, Iraq and Palestine with this inscriptionin Arabic :"Bism El-Lah (Allah) al Rahman al Rahim" that showed that Christians were the first to use this name so as to indicate their beliefin the Holy Trinity, more than two hundred years before Islam. "

-http://www.al-bushra.org/arbhrtg/arbxtn04.htm:

Last the last punch in the Gut of Nioletic, here is an interesting article by a Christian refuting the notion of Allah being a separate Diety or being a demon God.



"1- The Name of Allah is the name of the true God:

a- The Moslems worship the true God who has been the God of the Ancient and New Testament. They confess that "in order to be a good Moslem, you have to be a good Jew and a good Christian", a statement of confessing to the truth of the other two religions.

b- The name of Allah was taking by the Moslems from the Christians who existed five centuries before the arrival of Islam. Arabs were mentioned in the book of Acts at the time of the Pentecost."

On the liguistic formation of Allah:

"- The Name of Allah is the same as the name of Elohim:

a- In the Semetic languages Vowels do not count. Consonants form the words. These consonants are not written because they are not important and they do make the word sick and ill. So if we look at the name of Allah and the name of Elohim we will find the following:

Allah = L + H, Elohim = L+H+M (we will ignore the M and come back to it later).

b- In the Semetic languages, word roots are formed of three letters. It was found later on that these three letters were formed of two two-letter verbs. A complete study was made by several scholars among which is Fr. Marmarji S.J. in Lebanon.

c- L+H= LH (pronounced 'lahh') means "to him". God, Allah or Yahweh is not the name of God, Allah and Yahweh. God is not the name. He exists and no one knows his name. If we know His name then we will possess Him and understand Him, then He is not God the Omnopotents the Existant etc,

d- So instead we say "to Him" be the glory. "To Him" be the praise Look at the book of Revelation 5:13: Blessing and honor and glory and power be unto Him that sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb for ever and ever. It is safe to say that instead of saying God you can say "To Him"

e- Till our present day, Christians and Moslems replace the name of God with "Taala" (pronounced 'Tah-ah-lah') the excelsior, the most high."

abulbanaat i saved you precious time from having to even debate this boy. I rarely botheres with the Muslim sources but most of them are actually coptic Christians who laugh at his face if he ever mentioned that Allah is a demon God, amazing how western Christian are ignorant about their Semitic roots. Jesus wasnt a Nigerian or a white man, he was an Arab/jewish looking man who resembled Osama Bin Laden :p


Close this thread up, i think my work has been done.


"among his signs are the night and the day, and the sun and the moon. do not prostrate to the sun and the moon, but prostrate to Allah, who created them, if it is him ye wish to serve."

Thank you Shakerz for your quick intervention, let me take a rest until any of them troubles us again. I am very impressed.

shakerz:

I don;t see why you need to even start a topic of this nature, considering that now it has been historically established that the very foundation of Pauline Christianity is a theft from Mithra---the true dying man paganistic myth who came to save the people from their sins, sounds similar?

If you want to begin an investigation on who is Allah, the history of the name, the semantics, let us start with these videos that are on youtube by Jews and Muslim. No theory is as dead as the Moon God assertion.

When you type in God in the standard Aramaic lexicon here is the answer

"Meaning:God
Pronunciation: (Eastern) AaLaH


Look like Jesus was worshipping Allah and called his lord as such , he didnt use the word Lord or God. Not a good argument to put forward.

NOW here is a vidoe that completely distroys the moon god assertion(most christian abadon the theory)

here are three videos since am objective dubunking your assertion

from a jew:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H_l3wmMSJcU

here is another aramaic jewish speaking guy


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y3XUNwPcIZg&feature=related

Here is another video that totally destroys the Moon GOD assertion made by a white dude


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aJ4rYO_4JDE

See all different perspectives

do u through this acknowledge that the koran is meaningless without any meaningful insights? else how do u explain the fact that all ur "sources" are from youtube
did allah inspire youtube too?

shakerz:

Instead of using Muslim arguments, ill be objective and show what christian scholarships tell us now


Rick Brown in an article entitled "Who Is "Allah"?" in the International Journal Of Frontier Missions - a well-known missiology journal - which appeared in the summer of 2006, addressed the issue of various claims concerning Allah by his fellow Christian brethren. He starts by saying in the beginning of his article:


"Much of the anger expressed in the West has taken the form of demonizing the Islamic religion, to the extent of accusing Muslims of worshipping a demon. A key element of this attack has been the claim of some that the name Allah refers to a demon or at least a pagan deity, notably the so-called "moon god." Such claims have even been made by scholars who are reputable in their own fields but who are poorly acquainted with the Arabic language and Middle-Eastern history. The Kingdom of God, however, is never advanced by being untruthful, so this matter bears further investigation."

on whether Allah is the name of a demon or have rooted in paganism

"Suppose for the sake of argument that the ancient Arabs did worship the moon. This would have no bearing on the name Allah, for there is no inscription that identifies Allah as a moon god or as a pagan deity. This contrasts with the Hebrew, Greek, Latin, and English words for God, all of which descend from words that were commonly used by pagans in reference to pagan deities. So the name Allah is freer of pagan roots than are these other names"

Imad Shehadeh from Jordan Evangelical Theological Seminary refuted Morey's claim of Allah originally being the Moon-god of Arabia using textual, lexical, historical and theological evidences

"A recent popular theory asserts that Allah was originally the moon god worshiped in Arabia before and during Muhammad's time. According to this theory, when Muhammad came on the scene, the Ka‘bah contained 360 idols, among which was the moon god called 'ilah, or "a god." Then it is said that Muhammad declared this moon god to be the chief god and called it 'al 'ilah by adding the article 'al to 'ilah, thus yielding the meaning "the god.", Morey, who is foremost in popularizing this theory, cites many references from encyclopedias, dictionaries, works of philosophy and history, as well as various writers. However, though there is little doubt about the existence of moon god worshiped in Arabia before and during Muhammad's time, there are several weaknesses with identifying this moon god with Allah. In fact Muhammad initially adopted the name "Allah" as it was used by the Arabic-speaking Jews and Christians of his day in referring to the true God of the Bible. This assertion is based on four factors: textual, lexical, historical, and theological"("Do Muslims And Christians Believe In The Same God?)

what do the majority of scholars say

"d in the journal Christian Century recently. The question of whether Christians and Muslims worship the same God was dealt with by Jewish, Christian and Muslim scholars. They all reached the same conclusion that both Jews, Christians and Muslims worship the same God albeit they differ on the nature of God."

As a note here it would be interesting for you too look into the thousands of claims of coptic Arabic christian going back before Islam who say Allah is the one true God and as a consequence it is all over their bible.

what is the relevance of the above to the historical origin of the idolic allah?

shakerz:

Last the last punch in the Gut of Nioletic, here is an interesting article by a Christian refuting the notion of Allah being a separate Diety or being a demon God.



"1- The Name of Allah is the name of the true God:

a- The Moslems worship the true God who has been the God of the Ancient and New Testament. They confess that "in order to be a good Moslem, you have to be a good Jew and a good Christian", a statement of confessing to the truth of the other two religions.

b- The name of Allah was taking by the Moslems from the Christians who existed five centuries before the arrival of Islam. Arabs were mentioned in the book of Acts at the time of the Pentecost."

On the liguistic formation of Allah:

"- The Name of Allah is the same as the name of Elohim:

a- In the Semetic languages Vowels do not count. Consonants form the words. These consonants are not written because they are not important and they do make the word sick and ill. So if we look at the name of Allah and the name of Elohim we will find the following:

Allah = L + H, Elohim = L+H+M (we will ignore the M and come back to it later).

b- In the Semetic languages, word roots are formed of three letters. It was found later on that these three letters were formed of two two-letter verbs. A complete study was made by several scholars among which is Fr. Marmarji S.J. in Lebanon.

c- L+H= LH (pronounced 'lahh') means "to him". God, Allah or Yahweh is not the name of God, Allah and Yahweh. God is not the name. He exists and no one knows his name. If we know His name then we will possess Him and understand Him, then He is not God the Omnopotents the Existant etc,

d- So instead we say "to Him" be the glory. "To Him" be the praise Look at the book of Revelation 5:13: Blessing and honor and glory and power be unto Him that sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb for ever and ever. It is safe to say that instead of saying God you can say "To Him"

e- Till our present day, Christians and Moslems replace the name of God with "Taala" (pronounced 'Tah-ah-lah') the excelsior, the most high."

I am not impressed. . .these lies have been in circulation for a very long time.
start by answering the questions in my first post.

shakerz:

abulbanaat i saved you precious time from having to even debate this boy. I rarely botheres with the Muslim sources but most of them are actually coptic Christians who laugh at his face if he ever mentioned that Allah is a demon God, amazing how western Christian are ignorant about their Semitic roots. Jesus wasnt a Nigerian or a white man, he was an Arab/jewish looking man who resembled Osama Bin Laden :p


Close this thread up, i think my work has been done.


"among his signs are the night and the day, and the sun and the moon. do not prostrate to the sun and the moon, but prostrate to Allah, who created them, if it is him ye wish to serve."

can anyone make sense of the above?

Noetic, do not be a disgrace to the faith you profess. Do you think you are being sensible in the way you have been writimg some stupid few lines? Come with an analysis and let us see you. Haven't you seen the way GODSON once did (though he failed), and very recently, Nezan (he too is failing)? Your own style is a very stupid one, pardon me for the offensive.

I want to be gentler with you O Noetic. Okay let see what you have said:

You wrote: “I am not impressed. . .these lies have been in circulation for a very long time.”

I say: You cannot be impressed with what Shakerz has brought because you deliberately closed your eyes to the truth. So the Word of Allaah can be used against you:

“Verily, those who disbelieve, it is the same to them whether You (O Muhammad Sal-Allaahu 'alayhe Wa Sallam) warn them or do not warn them, they will not believe. Allâh has set a seal on their hearts and on their hearings, (i.e. they are closed from accepting Allâh's Guidance), and on their eyes there is a covering. Theirs will be a great torment.” [Q2: 6-8].

The verses I brought may not interest you because of what you said below:


“start by answering the questions in my first post.”

I say: And what was that?

You wrote in your that post:

“a. who was the allah that mohammed's father was serving?”

If by Muhammad’s father you mean ‘Abdullah’ then open your eyes and your heart (I am not going to lose hope on you).
Literally ‘Abdullah’ means ‘Slave of Allaah’ by that you may not be wrong in saying that he was serving Allaah. You asked who was that Allaah that he was serving because then the message of Islam, a supposed message of monotheism, you will say, had not come, then why was Abdullah, the father of the Prophet of Islam named so if truly that Allaah was not an idol (purified is the Mighty Lord from such an evil ascription)?

Shakerz had brought some works of your Christian theologians to debunk that but you were not ‘impressed’ by them because you have your hidden motive.

Well Shakerz had brought those materials from Christian point of view (may Allaah the Most Sublime reward him for that), I will give you the Islamic version, so sit back Noetic and enjoy it:

The Arabs before Muhammad had believed in a Supreme being called Allaah, the Qur’aan testifies to that:

“And if You (O Muhammad Sal-Allaahu 'alayhe Wa Sallam) ask them: "Who has created the heavens and the earth," they will certainly say: "Allâh." say: "All the praises and thanks be to Allâh!" but Most of them know not.” [Q31: 25]

If the Arabs did not believe so they would have said the Prophet was telling a lie. And do you say an idol can create the heaven and the earth? If you say yes, I see the heaven falling on you.

And when the Qur’aan says:

“Do You feel secure that He, Who is over the heaven (Allâh), will not Cause the earth to sink with you, Then behold it shakes (as In an earthquake)?
Or do You feel secure that He, Who is over the heaven (Allâh), will not send against You a violent whirlwind? Then You shall know How (terrible) has been My Warning?” [Mulk: 16-17].

Noetic, don’t you think that if Allaah is not truly in the Heaven the Arabs would say O Muhammad stop it, Allaah is there in Ka’bah.

And if you are not satisfied yet, Noetic you will agree with me that if Allaah were an idol, then He ought to be seen, but the Qur’aan says:

“Such is Allâh, Your Lord! Lâ ilâha illa Huwa (none has the Right to be worshipped but He), the Creator of All things. so Worship Him (Alone), and He is the Wakîl (Trustee, Disposer of affairs, Guardian, etc.) over All things.
No vision can grasp Him, but His grasp is over All vision. He is the Most Subtle and Courteous, Well­Acquainted with All things.” [Q6: 106-107].

Vision can definitely grasp an idol, all idols of this world have their pictures with people (very unfortunately our noble Prophet Jesus Christ has been made an idol too, but Allaah will save him on the Day of Resurrection) it is only the Mighty Lord Allaah that you cannot have His Picture. Will you now understand O Noetic?

And if Allaah were an idol (I seek refuge in Allaah from that), the Arabs would have told Muhaamad that stop it we see him every day at Ka’bah or what a view.

And see the description of Allaah below and see whether it fits an idol:

“Allâh! Lâ ilâha illa Huwa (none has the Right to be worshipped but He), the ever living, the one who sustains and protects All that exists. neither slumber, nor sleep overtake Him. to Him belongs whatever is In the heavens and whatever is on earth. who is He that can intercede with Him except with his Permission? He knows what happens to them (his creatures) In This world, and what will happen to them In the Hereafter . and they will never compass anything of his knowledge except that which He wills. His Kursî extends over the heavens and the earth, and He feels no fatigue In guarding and preserving them. and He is the Most High, the Most Great. [This Verse 2:255 is called Ayat-ul-Kursî.]” [Q2: 255].

Can an idol be so described O Noetic?

So the father of our dear Prophet was called Abdullah because the Arabs in his time still have a faint sense of monotheism in them in that they knew Allaah was the Supreme Being

It is this Allaah that sent all the Prophets: Adam, Abraham, Moses, Jesus and Muhammad.

“Verily, we have inspired You (O Muhammad ) as we inspired Nûh (Noah) and the Prophets after him; we (also) inspired Ibrâhim (Abraham), Ismâ'il (Ishmael), Ishâque (Isaac), Ya'qûb (Jacob), and Al­Asbât [the twelve sons of Ya'qûb (Jacob)], 'Iesa (Jesus), Ayub (Job), Yûnus (Jonah), Hârûn (Aaron), and Sulaimân (Solomon), and to Dawûd (David) we gave the Zabûr (Psalms).

And Messengers we have mentioned to You before, and Messengers we have not mentioned to you, - and to Mûsa (Moses) Allâh spoke directly.

Messengers as bearers of good news as well as of warning In order that mankind should have no plea against Allâh after the Messengers. and Allâh is ever All­Powerful, All­Wise.” [Q4: 163-165].

See it Allaah spoke to Moses directly! Was that the idol of the Arabs?

I wish Allaah open your heart to the truth.

And your second question:

“b. why did allah stop using anointing oil and stopped accepting priestly sacrifices?”

I can tell you I don’t understand what you are saying, and you yourself do not understand yourself (that can be a form of insanity), please can you explain yourself further.



“allah is an arabian idolic demon rebranded by mohammed.”


I think with the foregoing you should be ashamed of yourself for writing that.

Hope to hear from you, Noetic my newest.

abulbanaat:

I want to be gentler with you O Noetic. Okay let see what you have said:

You wrote: “I am not impressed. . .these lies have been in circulation for a very long time.”

I say: You cannot be impressed with what Shakerz has brought because you deliberately closed your eyes to the truth. So the Word of Allaah can be used against you:

“Verily, those who disbelieve, it is the same to them whether You (O Muhammad Sal-Allaahu 'alayhe Wa Sallam) warn them or do not warn them, they will not believe. Allâh has set a seal on their hearts and on their hearings, (i.e. they are closed from accepting Allâh's Guidance), and on their eyes there is a covering. Theirs will be a great torment.” [Q2: 6-8].

The verses I brought may not interest you because of what you said below:


“start by answering the questions in my first post.”

I say: And what was that?

You wrote in your that post:

“a. who was the allah that mohammed's father was serving?”

If by Muhammad’s father you mean ‘Abdullah’ then open your eyes and your heart (I am not going to lose hope on you).
Literally ‘Abdullah’ means ‘Slave of Allaah’ by that you may not be wrong in saying that he was serving Allaah. You asked who was that Allaah that he was serving because then the message of Islam, a supposed message of monotheism, you will say, had not come, then why was Abdullah, the father of the Prophet of Islam named so if truly that Allaah was not an idol (purified is the Mighty Lord from such an evil ascription)?

Shakerz had brought some works of your Christian theologians to debunk that but you were not ‘impressed’ by them because you have your hidden motive.

Well Shakerz had brought those materials from Christian point of view (may Allaah the Most Sublime reward him for that), I will give you the Islamic version, so sit back Noetic and enjoy it:

The Arabs before Muhammad had believed in a Supreme being called Allaah, the Qur’aan testifies to that:

“And if You (O Muhammad Sal-Allaahu 'alayhe Wa Sallam) ask them: "Who has created the heavens and the earth," they will certainly say: "Allâh." say: "All the praises and thanks be to Allâh!" but Most of them know not.” [Q31: 25]

If the Arabs did not believe so they would have said the Prophet was telling a lie. And do you say an idol can create the heaven and the earth? If you say yes, I see the heaven falling on you.

And when the Qur’aan says:

“Do You feel secure that He, Who is over the heaven (Allâh), will not Cause the earth to sink with you, Then behold it shakes (as In an earthquake)?
Or do You feel secure that He, Who is over the heaven (Allâh), will not send against You a violent whirlwind? Then You shall know How (terrible) has been My Warning?” [Mulk: 16-17].

Noetic, don’t you think that if Allaah is not truly in the Heaven the Arabs would say O Muhammad stop it, Allaah is there in Ka’bah.

And if you are not satisfied yet, Noetic you will agree with me that if Allaah were an idol, then He ought to be seen, but the Qur’aan says:

“Such is Allâh, Your Lord! Lâ ilâha illa Huwa (none has the Right to be worshipped but He), the Creator of All things. so Worship Him (Alone), and He is the Wakîl (Trustee, Disposer of affairs, Guardian, etc.) over All things.
No vision can grasp Him, but His grasp is over All vision. He is the Most Subtle and Courteous, Well­Acquainted with All things.” [Q6: 106-107].

Vision can definitely grasp an idol, all idols of this world have their pictures with people (very unfortunately our noble Prophet Jesus Christ has been made an idol too, but Allaah will save him on the Day of Resurrection) it is only the Mighty Lord Allaah that you cannot have His Picture. Will you now understand O Noetic?

And if Allaah were an idol (I seek refuge in Allaah from that), the Arabs would have told Muhaamad that stop it we see him every day at Ka’bah or what a view.

And see the description of Allaah below and see whether it fits an idol:

“Allâh! Lâ ilâha illa Huwa (none has the Right to be worshipped but He), the ever living, the one who sustains and protects All that exists. neither slumber, nor sleep overtake Him. to Him belongs whatever is In the heavens and whatever is on earth. who is He that can intercede with Him except with his Permission? He knows what happens to them (his creatures) In This world, and what will happen to them In the Hereafter . and they will never compass anything of his knowledge except that which He wills. His Kursî extends over the heavens and the earth, and He feels no fatigue In guarding and preserving them. and He is the Most High, the Most Great. [This Verse 2:255 is called Ayat-ul-Kursî.]” [Q2: 255].

Can an idol be so described O Noetic?

So the father of our dear Prophet was called Abdullah because the Arabs in his time still have a faint sense of monotheism in them in that they knew Allaah was the Supreme Being

It is this Allaah that sent all the Prophets: Adam, Abraham, Moses, Jesus and Muhammad.

“Verily, we have inspired You (O Muhammad ) as we inspired Nûh (Noah) and the Prophets after him; we (also) inspired Ibrâhim (Abraham), Ismâ'il (Ishmael), Ishâque (Isaac), Ya'qûb (Jacob), and Al­Asbât [the twelve sons of Ya'qûb (Jacob)], 'Iesa (Jesus), Ayub (Job), Yûnus (Jonah), Hârûn (Aaron), and Sulaimân (Solomon), and to Dawûd (David) we gave the Zabûr (Psalms).

And Messengers we have mentioned to You before, and Messengers we have not mentioned to you, - and to Mûsa (Moses) Allâh spoke directly.

Messengers as bearers of good news as well as of warning In order that mankind should have no plea against Allâh after the Messengers. and Allâh is ever All­Powerful, All­Wise.” [Q4: 163-165].

See it Allaah spoke to Moses directly! Was that the idol of the Arabs?

I wish Allaah open your heart to the truth.

And your second question:

“b. why did allah stop using anointing oil and stopped accepting priestly sacrifices?”

I can tell you I don’t understand what you are saying, and you yourself do not understand yourself (that can be a form of insanity), please can you explain yourself further.



“allah is an arabian idolic demon rebranded by mohammed.”


I think with the foregoing you should be ashamed of yourself for writing that.

Hope to hear from you, Noetic my newest.

can anyone make sense of the above post?

Noetic, do not be a disgrace to the faith you profess. Do you think you are being sensible in the way you have been writimg some stupid few lines? Come with an analysis and let us see you. Haven't you seen the way GODSON once did (though he failed), and very recently, Nezan (he too is failing)? Your own style is a very stupid one, pardon me for the offensive.

abulbanaat or whatever you call yourself, you will notice that I stopped posting further on the contradictions in the koran, not that I lacked ideas or I failed. I stopped because you deluded slaves of allah are too scared to face up to the false claims in islam. My posts (where I roundly trounced your big daddy, olabowale on that thread) were deleted, owing to your inability to face up to my arguments. I will also not respond to this thread because even if I did, your fears on the failures in islam wont allow my posts to stand. Your mods even went as far as locking a thread I opened to complained . . . why?

But you can read this for keeps . . .


The biblical God is called Yahweh (or Jehovah) nearly 9,000 times. Yet Allah is not called by that name even once in the Koran. Why not, if Allah is the same God? God is also referred to as Elohim more than 2,500 times in the Bible, but again that word never appears for Allah in the Koran. Why? The God of the Bible is called "The God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob “Israel" (Jacob's name was changed by God to Israel later in life, so he is referred to by either name). He is the father of the Jews.



The God of the Bible revealed himself to Moses at the burning bush by this name ("God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob “Israel" and told Moses, "this is my name for ever, and this is my memorial unto all generations" (Ex 3:1-16). If Allah is the God of the Bible, why is he never called by these names? The God of the Bible tells us again and again that He is the God of the Jews. Many times He is called "the God of Israel." Yet there is such hatred for Israel among Muslims! The Koran talks about Abraham and Ishmael, even claims they built the Kaaba, but gives Isaac no prominence. The Bible mentions Isaac favorably and prominently more than 150 times. God very clearly says that His covenant is with Isaac, not with Ishmael (Genesis 17:19-21), from whom the Arabs claim they are descended. The God of the Bible calls the Jews His chosen people. He loves them and gave the land of Israel to them as an heritage forever, as hundreds of verses in the Bible declare. Islam denies this basic biblical truth. The Jews are certainly not Allah's chosen people! How can Allah be the God of the Bible, yet not choose the Jews?



In your Koran, as you must know, Allah commands Muslims, "Take not the Jews and Christians as friends 1 Surah 5:51, A1 Hi1-a1i, v. 54, Jusuf a1i), so Allah is not the God of the Christians either. In the hadith, Muhammad himself said, "The last hour will not come before the Muslims fight the Jews, and the Muslims kill them" (Mishkat al Masabih Sh. M. Ashraf, 1990, pp. 147, 721, 810-11, 1130, etc.). Islam's god hates the Jews; the God of the Bible loves them as His chosen people! Allah is very clearly not Jehovah, Elohim, the God of Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, the God of the Bible!



The God of the Bible chose Jerusalem as His holy city. Forty times He calls Jerusalem "the city of David" and repeatedly He promises that the Messiah will be descended from David and will rule on David's throne in Jerusalem over the whole world (2 Chronicles 6:6; 33:7; 2 Samuel 7: 16; Psalm 89:3-29, etc.). Never does the Bible (or the God of the Bible) mention Mecca or Medina, but Jerusalem is mentioned more than 800 times. Yet Allah never mentions Jerusalem. How can this be if Allah is the God of the Bible? And how can the Muslims today claim Jerusalem as a holy city of Islam, when it isn't even mentioned in the Koran? That recent claim comes from those who want to take that city from the Jews.



That Allah has no son is further proof that He is not the God of the Bible, who definitely has a Son, as both the Old and New Testaments declare. Psalms 2 says, "Kiss the Son." Referring to the God of the Bible, Solomon says, "What is his son's name, ?" (Proverbs 30:4). The angel Gabriel, whom Islam claims to honor, told the virgin Mary (Islam accepts the virgin birth of Jesus), " And, behold, thou shalt, bring forth a son, and shalt call his name JESUS. He shall be, called the Son of the Highest , the Son of God, and the Lord God shall give unto him the throne of his father David, " (Luke 1:31-35). That throne is in Jerusalem, not in Mecca.



Muslims insist that the name " Allah" must be used in every language; it cannot be translated Dios in Spanish, Dieu in French, or God in English. Muslims thus treat " Allah" not as a generic word for God, but as the name of a particular god. In fact, Allah was the god of the Kuraish tribe centuries before Muhammad was born. You deny that he was the chief god in the Kaaba, but you admit there were for centuries 360 idols in the Kaaba and one of these was called Allah. What is Allah doing in a temple among 360 idols if he is the God of the Bible, who forbids idolatry? Why does Islam keep this idol temple, and why must Muslims to this day make a pilgrimage there? That Allah was the chief idol in the Kaaba is documented history. Let me quote one of the greatest historians: The desert Arab, feared and worshiped incalculable deities in stars and moons, Now and then he offered human sacrifice; and here and there he worshiped sacred stones. The center of this stone worship was Mecca (with) the Kaaba and its sacred Black Stone, in its southeast corner, five feet from the ground, just right for kissing.…



Within the Kaaba, in pre-Moslem days, were several idols representing gods. One was called Allah, three others were Allah's daughters, al-Uzza, al-Lat, and Manah. We may judge the antiquity of this Arab pantheon from the mention of A1-il Lat (AI-Lat) by Herodotus [fifth century B.C. Greek historian] as a major Arabian deity . The Quraish [Muhammad's tribe controlling Mecca] paved the way for monotheism by worshiping Allah as chief god; He was presented to the Meccans as the Lord of their soil, to Whom they must pay a tithe of their crops and the first-born of their herds. The Quraish, as alleged descendants of Abraham and Ishmael, appointed the priests and guardians of the shrine and managed its revenues (Will Durant, "The Story of Civilization," IV: 160-61).



The Kaaba still stands, without its idols, but with the Black Stone. The pilgrimage to the Kaaba, to, kiss the sacred stone, to run between Safa and Marwa, and to climb Mount Arafa, was practiced by pious pagan Arabs for centuries before Muhammad. Why did your prophet keep, as part of Islam, these pagan rituals?



You say "Islam is the religion of Adam, Noah, Abraham, Moses, Jesus, " Do you think Adam, Abraham, Moses, Jesus, et al. journeyed to the idol temple, the Kaaba, and kissed its Black Stone? Impossible! Not one follower of the God of the Bible would ever have gone near the Kaaba, because the God of the Bible forbids any association with idols; and you admit (as history tells us) that the Kaaba was filled with idols before Muhammad destroyed them all. In history and the Bible, you will find no mention of Islam or any religion like it. How could you have Islam without the Koran and Muhammad?



The only people who journeyed to the Kaaba and kissed the Black Stone were pagan Arabs who worshiped one or more of the idols within and around it. Muhammad started a new religion called Islam to which Arabs, Persians, Egyptians, Turks and everyone else in the region had to convert at the point of the sword. They became Muslims, and there is no way you can say that Islam was the original religion of that or any other region.



You ask me to explain, "The God of the Bible is love, an impossibility for Allah." If Allah is a single being, as Muslims insist, then he cannot be love in and of himself, because he had no one to love until he created others; but the God of the Bible is love in and of Himself because He is three Persons but One God. Father, Son and Holy Spirit loved and communed with one another before men or angels were created.



While the Jews know that Allah is not Jehovah, they try to say (as Muslims do for Allah) that Jehovah is a single being. If so, then why does the Bible refer to Him more than 2,500 times with the plural Elohim (gods)? Interestingly, however, always with the plural noun there is a singular verb. One cannot escape the plurality combined with singularity repeatedly used.



The famous shema (Dt 6:4), the most fundamental saying about God for a Jew, declares, "Hear, O Israel: Jehovah our Elohim is one Jehovah." Far from declaring that the God of the Bible is a singular being, the Hebrew word translated "one" is echad, which means a unity of several becoming one, as when God said the man and woman became "one (echad) flesh" (Genesis 2:24); when many soldiers became "one (echad) troop" (2 Samuel 2:25) or when two sticks became "one (echad) stick" (Ezekiel 37:17) etc.



The Bible teaches that God's very essence is love and says, "God is love" (1 John 4:. This is not true of Allah. The Bible repeatedly speaks of God's love for man and the love we must have for Him. But love is scarcely mentioned in the Koran. Not once is "love" listed in the index of the popular Marmaduke Pickthall translation of the Koran. Of Allah's 99 attributes, love is not one. The Koran does say that Allah loves "the beneficent" (Surah 2:195), "the stedfast ( and) those whose deeds are good" (Surah 3:146-48), and "those who battle for his cause" (Surah 61:4). But never does it say he loves all mankind, much less sinners; but the God of the Bible loves sinners, even those who hate Him. Allah is said to be merciful, but he does not show mercy to those who need it. The God of the Bible, however, is merciful to all, ready to forgive confessed sin.



The first of the Ten Commandments is that we are to love the God of the Bible with our whole heart; but never does the Koran say a Muslim is to love Allah. You cannot love Allah, because he is unknowable. The God of the Bible can be known and repeatedly calls upon men to know Him; but the Koran says no one can know Allah because he is too great. In spite of being infinite, without beginning and end, and the Creator of the universe, the biblical God reveals himself so that men can know Him. Jesus himself said, "This is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent" (John 17:3). Those who don't know the God of the Bible are lost eternally. No one knows Allah.



The Bible is filled with prophecies of the coming of Messiah Jesus, but there is not one such prophecy in the Koran for Jesus or Muhammad. In fact, the Koran was written after Muhammad came, so it could not prophesy his coming, but the Old Testament prophesied the coming of Jesus centuries and even thousands of years beforehand. The Jewish prophets in the Old Testament said the Messiah would be crucified and rise from the dead the third day. Jesus came at exactly the time prophesied and died for the sins of the world, as the Bible says over and over. But the Koran contradicts this and says He didn't die on the cross at all, much less for our sins. The Bible says that the penalty for sin must be paid and that God himself had to come as a man to die for our sins. Allah did not do that.



How does Allah save sinners? It would be unjust to forgive the guilty without the penalty being paid. Where does Allah explain the penalty? When and by whom was that penalty paid? If Allah forgives, how does he forgive? Allah simply refuses to forgive or forgives whom he will, but there is no consistent or just basis for either. No Muslim can be sure Allah will forgive him. As a Christian I know for certain that I have been forgiven all my sins and that I have eternal life as a free gift from God through the death and resurrection of Christ and that I will be in heaven—not by my good works, but by Christ paying the penalty for my sins. Allah is merciful to those who do good. The Bible says that none do good, all have sinned, and that God saves sinners if they believe in the Christ who died for them.

@Noetic
You wrote: “when did this brainless scum-bag join nairaland?”

I say: Does that you have been around on Nairaland mean you should be such unreasonable soul?

And who told you that being long at Nairaland mean one is wise. Well I will not stoop so low to trade words with you. Those who will answer you will answer you.

you wrote: “There are over 10 threads where I have successfully analysed the fraud of allah”

i say: You mean where you have showcased your foolery, show us your stuff and stop vituperating, are you a viper?

You still wrote after the lesson I taught you: “can anyone make sense of the above post?”

I say: What a dead soul you are.

@Nezan,

“abulbanaat or whatever you call yourself, you will notice that I stopped posting further on the contradictions in the koran, not that I lacked ideas or I failed. I stopped because you deluded slaves of allah are too scared to face up to the false claims in islam. My posts (where I roundly trounced your big daddy, olabowale on that thread) were deleted, owing to your inability to face up to my arguments. I will also not respond to this thread because even if I did, your fears on the failures in islam wont allow my posts to stand.”


I say: This is rather delusion par excellence from you, O Nezan. Please bring proof of your allegation of that treatment. But the owner of the Forum is a Christian.

“Your mods even went as far as locking a thread I opened to complained . . . why?”

I say: I saw that they asked you to prove it but you could not, so they locked that.

As for what you have posted on this thread, though you have stylishly said you will not go further, I can see that as a trick from you, as Muhsin has said in the other thread, I will answer you (Insha Allaah) and i pray you do not stylishly run away crying foul.

Watch out.

I shall be brief as much as possible, I will not give you ‘close marking’ this time around but paragraph by paragraph rejoinder. I will quote your paragraph and leave my own open, this is how far the WAP-version I am using will permit me. Still the work is going to be a bit long, so you have to read it Nezan.

Let’s go:

“The biblical God is called Yahweh (or Jehovah) nearly 9,000 times. Yet Allah is not called by that name even once in the Koran. Why not, if Allah is the same God? God is also referred to as Elohim more than 2,500 times in the Bible, but again that word never appears for Allah in the Koran. Why? The God of the Bible is called "The God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob “Israel" (Jacob's name was changed by God to Israel later in life, so he is referred to by either name). He is the father of the Jews.”

If the biblical God is called Yahweh (or Jehovah) must the Qur’an call Him so? Don’t you see that the Qur’aan was revealed in Arabic. And if that is the standard, then all who call Yahweh in other names like ‘God,’ ‘Olohun,’ ‘Chukwu,’ ‘Ubangiji’ are wrong because they do not call Him Yahweh.

The same explanation goes for Elohim; Muslims do not dispute the fact that God can be called any other name if that is what the people know Him to be, but we say the name of God in the Arabic Language is Allaah. So if Allaah is an idol (I seek refuge in Allaah from that), then tell us what name the Arabs give to God. Simple.

There is no special thing in God being called ‘God of Abraham’ or ‘God of Isaac’ nobody except a fool will say God is not his God. And the Qur’aan does bear a semblance of that, since you insist. So see Q2: 136 below:

“Say (O Muslims), "We believe In Allâh and that which has been sent down to us and that which has been sent down to Ibrâhim (Abraham), Ismâ'il (Ishmael), Ishâque (Isaac), Ya'qûb (Jacob), and to Al-Asbât [the twelve sons of Ya'qûb (Jacob)], and that which has been given to Mûsa (Moses) and 'Iesa (Jesus), and that which has been given to the Prophets from their Lord. We make no distinction between any of them, and to Him we have submitted (in Islâm)."

An implicit message in the above is that it was Allaah Who sent all those so He was their God. Are you now satisfied?




“ The God of the Bible revealed himself to Moses at the burning bush by this name ("God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob “Israel" and told Moses, "this is my name for ever, and this is my memorial unto all generations" (Ex 3:1-16). If Allah is the God of the Bible, why is he never called by these names? The God of the Bible tells us again and again that He is the God of the Jews. Many times He is called "the God of Israel." Yet there is such hatred for Israel among Muslims! The Koran talks about Abraham and Ishmael, even claims they built the Kaaba, but gives Isaac no prominence. The Bible mentions Isaac favorably and prominently more than 150 times. God very clearly says that His covenant is with Isaac, not with Ishmael (Genesis 17:19-21), from whom the Arabs claim they are descended. The God of the Bible calls the Jews His chosen people. He loves them and gave the land of Israel to them as an heritage forever, as hundreds of verses in the Bible declare. Islam denies this basic biblical truth. The Jews are certainly not Allah's chosen people! How can Allah be the God of the Bible, yet not choose the Jews?”

I have answered part of what you raised above in the last paragraph, it is immaterial that God is known with many Names but what is important is that it is only this God that should be worshipped.

The phrase ‘God of Israel’ is often used to prove the supremacy of the Jewish race over all other races, and many Christians like Nezan here, subscribe to this thought, and this often makes the race to be immaculate such that it can never be accused of doing what is wrong. It is funny that Christians say that whoever does not believe in the death of Jesus Christ on the cross will dwell forever in hell but will not include the Jews who ‘killed’ Jesus and who still call him an impostor till these days, the Christians will not condemn the Jews because they ‘are chosen of God.’

Islam does not subscribe to that – the Jews are like normal human beings, they do not have any superiority over the non-Jews. So also the Arabs, they have no superiority, Islam has said superiority is an individual affair, and that will be base on one’s piety. See Q49: 13 below:

“O mankind! we have created You from a male and a female, and made You into nations and tribes, that You may know one another. Verily, the Most honourable of You with Allâh is that (believer) who has At-Taqwa [i.e. one of the Muttaqûn (pious - see V.2:2). Verily, Allâh is All-Knowing, All-Aware.”

And the prophet of Islam has declared that ‘there is no superiority of the Arabs on the non-Arabs, superiority is only by piety of Allaah.’

It is true that the Qur’aan says the Jews were once a favoured nation when they were of God but after their proven rebellion (even when Moses was alive) by their refusal to accept Muhammad as the Prophet of Allaah (and their refusal to accept Jesus Christ), Allaah withdrew His favour from them and gave to whom? The Arabs? No, the Muslims.

See this:

“O Children of Israel! Remember My Favour which I bestowed upon you, and fulfil (your obligations to) My Covenant (with you) so that I fulfil (My obligations to) Your Covenant (with Me), and fear none but Me.

And believe In what I have sent down (this Qur'ân), confirming that which is with you, [the Taurât (Torah) and the Injeel (Gospel)], and be not the first to disbelieve therein, and buy not with My Verses [the Taurât (Torah) and the Injeel (Gospel)] a small price (i.e. getting a small gain by selling My Verses), and fear Me and Me Alone.

And mix not Truth with falsehood, nor conceal the Truth [i.e. Muhammad Sal-Allaahu 'alayhe Wa Sallam is Allâh's Messenger and his qualities are written In Your Scriptures, the Taurât (Torah) and the Injeel (Gospel)] while You know (the truth).” [Q2: 40-42].

If you think that the description above does not fit the Jew, then check your record.

Mind you the Qur’aan is replete with the description of the Jews (their treachery, folly, rebellion, etc.), what I have brought is just a tip of an iceberg.

To say Qur’an does not make a mention of Isaac is but a fallacy of the highest order, the verse above has partly debunked that. Now see these others:

“Salâmun (peace) be upon Ibrâhim (Abraham)!"
Thus indeed do we reward the Muhsinûn Verily, He was one of Our believing slaves.
And we gave Him the glad tidings of Ishâque (Isaac) a Prophet from the righteous.
We blessed Him and Ishâque (Isaac), and of their progeny are (some) that do right, and some that plainly wrong themselves.” [Q37: 109-113].

Yet another:

“And Remember Our slaves, Ibrâhim (Abraham), Ishâque (Isaac), and Ya'qûb (Jacob), (all) owners of strength (in worshipping Us) and (also) of religious understanding.
Verily, we did choose them by granting them (a good thing, i.e.) the remembrance of the home [in the Hereafter and they used to make the people Remember it, and also they used to invite the people to obey Allâh and to do good deeds for the Hereafter].
And they are with us, Verily, of the chosen and the best!” [Q38: 45-47].

Will you still say Isaac was not given any prominence in the Qur’aan?


And you said God’s Covenant was with Isaac, so God had no plan for Ishmael. Didn’t He say He would make him a great nation? Didn’t He say the Jews will be jealous of his nation? So God do not have covenant with other Prophets too?



“ In your Koran, as you must know, Allah commands Muslims, "Take not the Jews and Christians as friends 1 Surah 5:51, A1 Hi1-a1i, v. 54, Jusuf a1i), so Allah is not the God of the Christians either. In the hadith, Muhammad himself said, "The last hour will not come before the Muslims fight the Jews, and the Muslims kill them" (Mishkat al Masabih Sh. M. Ashraf, 1990, pp. 147, 721, 810-11, 1130, etc.). Islam's god hates the Jews; the God of the Bible loves them as His chosen people! Allah is very clearly not Jehovah, Elohim, the God of Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, the God of the Bible!”

Qur’aan warns the Muslims about the Christians and the Jews because Allaah knew that because of the revelation the Muslims had received, that would cause enmity from the Christians and the Jews towards the Muslims and they would want that the Muslims had not received that. And that is what is practically happening; the Jews and Christians do not want to fathom the fact that their salvation lies in accepting what Allaah has revealed to Muhammad.

See this:

‘Neither those who disbelieve among the people of the Scripture (Jews and Christians) nor Al-Mushrikûn (the disbelievers In the Oneness of Allâh, idolaters, polytheists, pagans, etc.) like that there should be sent down unto You any good from Your Lord. But Allâh chooses for his Mercy whom He wills. and Allâh is the Owner of great Bounty.” [Q2: 105]

So that is the cuase of the enmity from the Peopel of the Book to the Muslims.

Allaah says further:

“Never will the Jews nor the Christians be pleased with You (O Muhammad and Muslims) till You follow their religion. say: "Verily, the guidance of Allâh (i.e. Islâmic Monotheism) that is the (only) Guidance.” [Q2: 120]

Maybe Nezan will you say the above is not true.

So because of that Islam says the Jews and the Christians are enemies of Islam so Muslims should be wary of them. Period.



“The God of the Bible chose Jerusalem as His holy city. Forty times He calls Jerusalem "the city of David" and repeatedly He promises that the Messiah will be descended from David and will rule on David's throne in Jerusalem over the whole world (2 Chronicles 6:6; 33:7; 2 Samuel 7: 16; Psalm 89:3-29, etc.). Never does the Bible (or the God of the Bible) mention Mecca or Medina, but Jerusalem is mentioned more than 800 times. Yet Allah never mentions Jerusalem. How can this be if Allah is the God of the Bible? And how can the Muslims today claim Jerusalem as a holy city of Islam, when it isn't even mentioned in the Koran? That recent claim comes from those who want to take that city from the Jews.”


That the Qur’aan does not mention Jerusalem shows how far you are from the basic Islamic learning. Every Muslim knows from childhood that Jerusalem is important to the Muslims because of its housing the third holiest mosque which the Muslims still pray in today. [And you should know that Jerusalem bears more semblance for Islam today than any other religion, ask the JP’s who are sincere enough to say the truth.]

And there is no disputing the fact that the reference to the ‘farthest mosque’ in the verse below is but the mosque which the Muslims pray in today in Jerusalem.

Glorified (and Exalted) be He (Allâh) Who took his slave (Muhammad) for a journey by night from Al-Masjid-al-Harâm (at Makkah) to the farthest mosque (in Jerusalem), the neighbourhood whereof we have blessed, In order that we might show Him (Muhammad) of Our Ayât (proofs, evidences, lessons, signs, etc.). Verily, He is the All-Hearer, the All-Seer.

There are lot of narrations from the Prophet saying the mosque in Jerusalem is as important to the Muslims as the One at Ka’bah and Madinah.

If not the Balfour Declaration which gave Israel to the Jews (and eventually Jerusalem), the present location of Israel and Jerusalem had been under the control of the Muslims for centuries. Ask yourselves, who are now in the biblical cities, Damascus, etc, the Muslims of course, how? The glory of Islam. (And it is a matter of time that Jerusalem will come back to the Muslims fully, that when the Arabs stop fighting in the name of Arab nationalism but in the name of Islam.)





“That Allah has no son is further proof that He is not the God of the Bible, who definitely has a Son, as both the Old and New Testaments declare. Psalms 2 says, "Kiss the Son." Referring to the God of the Bible, Solomon says, "What is his son's name, ?" (Proverbs 30:4). The angel Gabriel, whom Islam claims to honor, told the virgin Mary (Islam accepts the virgin birth of Jesus), " And, behold, thou shalt, bring forth a son, and shalt call his name JESUS. He shall be, called the Son of the Highest , the Son of God, and the Lord God shall give unto him the throne of his father David, " (Luke 1:31-35). That throne is in Jerusalem, not in Mecca.”

Are you then saying a good God must have sons? Let me share a story with you of our past Muslim scholars: This Muslim scholar was invited to the court of a Roman king who used to have the pope in his court too. By practice, the King would come before the Pope, and when the Pope arrives everybody including the King would pay him homage. So iy happened that when this Muslim scholar was in the court of this King and the pope arrived, everybody paid him homage except this Muslim scholar. He was asked why, he said he wanted to make his own greeting to the Pope special, so he went to the Pope greeted him and asked him ‘How are your sons and daughters?’ Everybody in the hall including the Pope was embarrassed because of what the Muslim scholar had said. How dare he asked of the Pope’s sons and daughters while it is known that Pope does not give birth. The Muslim scholar (our scholars have always been sharp) then lampooned everybody in the hall that if it would sound insulting to the pope to have sons, then what about the God of Pope? The Muslim scholar was to stay for some days in the country but he was made to leave immediately because his continuous stay in the place ‘was dangerous.’

So do you still say a good God should have sons, Nezan?


Please can you explain how the throne of David (father of God-Jesus) was given to Jesus?




“ Muslims insist that the name " Allah" must be used in every language; it cannot be translated Dios in Spanish, Dieu in French, or God in English. Muslims thus treat " Allah" not as a generic word for God, but as the name of a particular god. In fact, Allah was the god of the Kuraish tribe centuries before Muhammad was born. You deny that he was the chief god in the Kaaba, but you admit there were for centuries 360 idols in the Kaaba and one of these was called Allah. What is Allah doing in a temple among 360 idols if he is the God of the Bible, who forbids idolatry? Why does Islam keep this idol temple, and why must Muslims to this day make a pilgrimage there? That Allah was the chief idol in the Kaaba is documented history. Let me quote one of the greatest historians: The desert Arab, feared and worshiped incalculable deities in stars and moons, Now and then he offered human sacrifice; and here and there he worshiped sacred stones. The center of this stone worship was Mecca (with) the Kaaba and its sacred Black Stone, in its southeast corner, five feet from the ground, just right for kissing.…”


This is where you actually addressed the issue at hand. Muslims prefer that God should be called Allaah because that is what He says His Name is in the Final Revelation. This does not mean Allaah cannot be called in other names that people call God. But it is better that Muslims call Him Allaah because some other names God is called might have one form of corruption or the other. For instance the word ‘God’ is somehow ambiguous. When you hear ‘God’ or ‘god’ how do you differentiate that? One can easily slip into error, so this is why Muslims feel safe calling God Allaah often.

Yes the Arabs used to worship more than 360 idols before Prophet Muhammad stop that. Allaah was never part of those idols otherwise the Arabs would have got a stataue for him as they did for other gods. Why? Because they knew He was a Supreme Being that cannot be seen. In fact just like the Jews, they had demanded from the Prophet that they liked to see Allaah:

“And those who expect not for a Meeting with us (i.e. those who deny the Day of Resurrection and the life of the Hereafter), say: "Why are not the angels sent down to us, or why do we not see Our Lord?" indeed they think too highly of themselves, and are scornful with great pride.” [Q25: 21].

So if Allah were an idol (I seek refuge in Him from that), they would not have asked the Prophet to let them see Him.

To say that Allah is an idol, that is a documented history, shows another aspect of your referencing history. You yourself know within your heart that you have told a BIG LIE. Where is it documented O Nezan that Allaah is a chief idol? Bring it or else, as usual, you are a [finish it yourself, so that you will not say I am abusing you.]

And did that your phantom ‘greatest historian’ say Allaah was an idol?

As for the origin of the Ka’bah and the Hajj, I think i have addressed that in the answer i gave to Kola Oloye in ‘Ask Me About Islam’ but let me reproduce it here for those who have not read it (I know you have read it but have an axe to grind):

“The last pillar is going on hajj.

The Muslims have evidence for Hajj they go to, we do not copy people. But people copy us.

“, And Hajj (pilgrimage to Makkah) to the House (Ka'bah) is a duty that mankind owes to Allâh, those who can afford the expenses (for one's conveyance, provision and residence); and whoever disbelieves [i.e. denies Hajj (pilgrimage to Makkah), then he is a disbeliever of Allâh], then Allâh stands not in need of any of the 'Alamîn (mankind and jinns).” [Q3: 97].

Non-Muslims should know that the institution of Hajj had been a commandment handed down by Allaah to Ibrahim (Abraham) – the Father of Faith.

“And (remember) when We showed Ibrâhim (Abraham) the site of the (Sacred) House (the Ka'bah at Makkah) (saying): "Associate not anything (in worship) with Me, [Lâ ilâha ill-Allâh (none has the right to be worshipped but Allâh Islâmic Monotheism], and sanctify My House for those who circumambulate it, and those who stand up for prayer, and those who bow (submit themselves with humility and obedience to Allâh), and make prostration (in prayer, etc.);” [Q22: 26].

“And (remember) when Ibrâhim (Abraham) and (his son) Ismâ'il (Ishmael) were raising the foundations of the House (the Ka'bah at Makkah), (saying), "Our Lord! Accept (this service) from us. Verily! You are the All-Hearer, the All-Knower.” [Q2: 127].

Note, Oh Christians, that the Arabs whom the Prophet (sallallâhu ’alayhi wa sallam) met in Makkah never denied that fact even though they would have denied it as they did for other facts, because they knew it was nothing but the truth. But you Christians, here and in other places, you open your mouths and say Ka’bah ‘is a house in Makkah that houses a god called Allaah.’

“Indeed you have brought forth (said) a terrible evil thing. Whereby the heavens are almost torn, and the earth is split asunder, and the mountains fall in ruins” [Q19: 89-90].

It is stated in the Bible (get it right now, the Bible is an admixture of words of God and men [some of you have confirmed that on other threads]; Muslims believe in what comes from God there as confirmed by the Qur’ân and the authentic narrations from the Prophet (sallallâhu ’alayhi wa sallam) [like here O Israel our God is One] and we dsibeleive in what comes from men [e.g. that Jesus is God or that he is son of God {may Allaah be glorified from that}], so please take note.) so it is stated (in the Bible) that Abraham was commanded to take Ishmael (Isma’eel) and his mother (Haajar) away. To where? Please we need your answer.

Meanwhile Islâm has answered that:

Allah said quoting Ibrahim:

“O our Lord! I (Ibrahim) have made some of my offspring to dwell in an uncultivable valley by Your Sacred House (the Ka'bah at Makkah); in order, O our Lord, that they may perform As-Salât (Iqâmat-as-Salât), so fill some hearts among men with love towards them, and (O Allâh) provide them with fruits so that they may give thanks.” [Q14: 37]

Notice Ibrahim’s supplication for Makkah in the verse. Will you understand, O Christians?

So a nation has been born through Islâm Muhammad, a grandson of Ishmael, brought as commissioned by Allaah. The nation is a great one, as the Bible (the one that comes from God) attests to; and the Jews are highly Jealous of it, as it (the Bible) also says.

So Ka’abah was the first house of worship on the surface of the earth.

“Verily, the first House (of worship) appointed for mankind was that at Bakkah (Makkah), full of blessing, and a guidance for Al-'Alamîn (the mankind and jinns).” [Q3: 96]” [End of qoute]




“ Within the Kaaba, in pre-Moslem days, were several idols representing gods. One was called Allah, three others were Allah's daughters, al-Uzza, al-Lat, and Manah. We may judge the antiquity of this Arab pantheon from the mention of A1-il Lat (AI-Lat) by Herodotus [fifth century B.C. Greek historian] as a major Arabian deity . The Quraish [Muhammad's tribe controlling Mecca] paved the way for monotheism by worshiping Allah as chief god; He was presented to the Meccans as the Lord of their soil, to Whom they must pay a tithe of their crops and the first-born of their herds. The Quraish, as alleged descendants of Abraham and Ishmael, appointed the priests and guardians of the shrine and managed its revenues (Will Durant, "The Story of Civilization," IV: 160-61).

So Will Durant was that ‘greatest historian’ who told you that Allaah was the chief idol of the Makkans. See what I have been telling you that the historians that you in particular quote are fools. A fact that a toddler among the Bedouin Arabs know; that Allaah is in the heaven and cannot be seen, and that the Arabs had never thought Him to be an idol, but your Will Durant said otherwise. He must be a fool. Well tell us who said he ‘was the greatest’ historian so that we would see how foolish that person is also. It must be your imagination!

That some idols were called al-Uzza, al-Lat and al-Manaat, and that the Arabs say they are ‘daughters of Allaah’ is a phenomenon well-known, that is, that they said that. And Allaah had repeatedly faulted that in the Qur’aan. See this, and please read it carefully:

“Have You Then considered Al-Lât, and Al-'Uzza
And Manât (another idol of the pagan Arabs), the other third?
Is it for You the males and for Him the females?
That indeed is a division Most unfair!
They are but names which You have named, You and Your fathers, for which Allâh has sent down no authority. they follow but a guess and that which they themselves desire, whereas there has surely come to them the guidance from their Lord!”

So it is glaring from the above that the idols were conjectures of the pagan Arabs.






“The Kaaba still stands, without its idols, but with the Black Stone. The pilgrimage to the Kaaba, to, kiss the sacred stone, to run between Safa and Marwa, and to climb Mount Arafa, was practiced by pious pagan Arabs for centuries before Muhammad. Why did your prophet keep, as part of Islam, these pagan rituals?”

You mean to say the Black Stone is Allaah. You should have said that openly, I think you should not be afraid any longer you have said what is worse. I only fear for you.

Well as for the Black Stone, I know for sure you will wonder what I will say as regard it. Well it is a matter well settled in Islâm. The Hajj rites which include pointing to or kissing the Black Stone were handed down by Ibrahim (Abraham). That is why the Arabs even before the Prophet had been going on pilgrimage to Makkah why? Because their fore-fathers on top of which was Ibrahim and Ishaaq had been doing so, but the pagan Arabs had innovated a lot of things which included their bringing to the Ka’bah those numerous idols, and their act of going round the Ka’bah naked while they clap their hands! All those, the Prophet stopped, and upon guidance through revelation, he retained the rites that were handed down by Ibrahim.

The Black Stone, the Prophet had said, was from the paradise, this may be hard for you to believe, but that was what our Prophet said:

“The Black Stone came down from Paradise and it was whiter than milk, but the sins of the sons of Adam turned it black.” Narrated by al-Tirmidhi (877).
Al-Tirmidhi said: It is a saheeh hasan hadeeth. It was classed as saheeh by Ibn Khuzaymah (4/219) and by al-Diya’ al-Maqdisi in al-Mukhtaarah (10/260). It was classed as hasan by Ibn al-Qattaan in Bayaan al-Wahm wa’l-Ayhaam (5/732), al-Haafiz Ibn Hajar in Fath al-Baari (3/540) and al-Albaani in al-Silsilah al-Saheehah (2618).
It was also narrated from Ibn ‘Abbaas, Ibn ‘Amr and others, see Musannaf Ibn Abi Shaybah (4/35); and from Anas (may Allaah be pleased with him) in Musnad Ahmad (3/277).

So what is glaring from the above was that the Black Stone was actually a White Stone, it turned black over the centuries as a result of the hands of sins that toughed it, and that was even before Islâm began to rule Makkah.

The statement of the prophet above is a clear one, if there was another thing to it, the Arabs would have said it. And if the Black Stone had actually represented Allaah, the Arabs would have said it, they knew it had been since the time of Ibrahim.

So it is recommended for whoever goes on hajj to kiss it, as did Ibrahim and Prophet Muhammad (and as attested to by the Arabs), not that his kissing it mean he is worshiping it but to emulate the prophets of Allaah whom it had been made permissible for to kiss, and because the Stone is from Paradise.

Nezan, if you are sure a thing comes from Paradise won’t you like to touch it even to kiss it. Does your touching or kissing it mean the you are worshipping it?

For more on hajj rites see this link:

http://www.islam-qa.com/en/ref/30897






“You say "Islam is the religion of Adam, Noah, Abraham, Moses, Jesus, " Do you think Adam, Abraham, Moses, Jesus, et al. journeyed to the idol temple, the Kaaba, and kissed its Black Stone? Impossible! Not one follower of the God of the Bible would ever have gone near the Kaaba, because the God of the Bible forbids any association with idols; and you admit (as history tells us) that the Kaaba was filled with idols before Muhammad destroyed them all. In history and the Bible, you will find no mention of Islam or any religion like it. How could you have Islam without the Koran and Muhammad?”

But Islam does say there was no Prophet of Allaah except that He performed the pilgrimage in Makkah, but you may not know. For instance our Prophet went and prayed in the mosque at Jerusalem miraculously!




“ The only people who journeyed to the Kaaba and kissed the Black Stone were pagan Arabs who worshiped one or more of the idols within and around it. Muhammad started a new religion called Islam to which Arabs, Persians, Egyptians, Turks and everyone else in the region had to convert at the point of the sword. They became Muslims, and there is no way you can say that Islam was the original religion of that or any other region.”

I think I have cleared that.




“ You ask me to explain, "The God of the Bible is love, an impossibility for Allah." If Allah is a single being, as Muslims insist, then he cannot be love in and of himself, because he had no one to love until he created others; but the God of the Bible is love in and of Himself because He is three Persons but One God. Father, Son and Holy Spirit loved and communed with one another before men or angels were created.”

But God in the Bible commanded the Jews to kill their enemies, and He made many of the Prophets like David to fight wars.

Till eternity, Christian will not be able to explain how 1+1+1=3. Even a computer programme cannot solve it.




“While the Jews know that Allah is not Jehovah, they try to say (as Muslims do for Allah) that Jehovah is a single being. If so, then why does the Bible refer to Him more than 2,500 times with the plural Elohim (gods)? Interestingly, however, always with the plural noun there is a singular verb. One cannot escape the plurality combined with singularity repeatedly used.”

This has been answered by me earlier on.





“The famous shema (Dt 6:4), the most fundamental saying about God for a Jew, declares, "Hear, O Israel: Jehovah our Elohim is one Jehovah." Far from declaring that the God of the Bible is a singular being, the Hebrew word translated "one" is echad, which means a unity of several becoming one, as when God said the man and woman became "one (echad) flesh" (Genesis 2:24); when many soldiers became "one (echad) troop" (2 Samuel 2:25) or when two sticks became "one (echad) stick" (Ezekiel 37:17) etc.

When a husband and his wife become one, do they have one soul, one thinking, one mannerism, etc.? So can God, Jesus and Holy Ghost be one that way? What if Mary, Mother of God (as John Paul) wanted the Christians to include her, is added? Still one soul? You must author a book O.




“The Bible teaches that God's very essence is love and says, "God is love" (1 John 4:. This is not true of Allah. The Bible repeatedly speaks of God's love for man and the love we must have for Him. But love is scarcely mentioned in the Koran. Not once is "love" listed in the index of the popular Marmaduke Pickthall translation of the Koran. Of Allah's 99 attributes, love is not one. The Koran does say that Allah loves "the beneficent" (Surah 2:195), "the stedfast ( and) those whose deeds are good" (Surah 3:146-48), and "those who battle for his cause" (Surah 61:4). But never does it say he loves all mankind, much less sinners; but the God of the Bible loves sinners, even those who hate Him. Allah is said to be merciful, but he does not show mercy to those who need it. The God of the Bible, however, is merciful to all, ready to forgive confessed sin.

So if God’s love is absolute, that is, without demarcation, why will He throw some of His Loved ones into fire?




“The first of the Ten Commandments is that we are to love the God of the Bible with our whole heart; but never does the Koran say a Muslim is to love Allah. You cannot love Allah, because he is unknowable. The God of the Bible can be known and repeatedly calls upon men to know Him; but the Koran says no one can know Allah because he is too great. In spite of being infinite, without beginning and end, and the Creator of the universe, the biblical God reveals himself so that men can know Him. Jesus himself said, "This is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent" (John 17:3). Those who don't know the God of the Bible are lost eternally. No one knows Allah.”

You talk as if you know the Qur’aan, ‘Sue’ then what is the meaning of this:

“And of mankind are some who take (for worship) others besides Allâh as rivals (to Allâh). they love them as they love Allâh. but those who believe, love Allâh more (than anything else). if only, those who do wrong could see, when they will see the torment, that All power belongs to Allâh and that Allâh is Severe In punishment.”

And you say Allaah cannot be loved.

So that verse of the Bible said Jesus was sent by God, and you say he is God!

So you have seen (known) God before?

See Islâm says Allaah is closer to us His slaves very much:

“And when My slaves ask You (O Muhammad ) concerning Me, Then (answer them), I am indeed near (to them by My Knowledge). I respond to the invocations of the supplicant when He calls on Me (without any mediator or intercessor). so let them obey Me and believe In Me, so that they may be led aright.” [Baqarah: 186].








“The Bible is filled with prophecies of the coming of Messiah Jesus, but there is not one such prophecy in the Koran for Jesus or Muhammad. In fact, the Koran was written after Muhammad came, so it could not prophesy his coming, but the Old Testament prophesied the coming of Jesus centuries and even thousands of years beforehand. The Jewish prophets in the Old Testament said the Messiah would be crucified and rise from the dead the third day. Jesus came at exactly the time prophesied and died for the sins of the world, as the Bible says over and over. But the Koran contradicts this and says He didn't die on the cross at all, much less for our sins. The Bible says that the penalty for sin must be paid and that God himself had to come as a man to die for our sins. Allah did not do that.”

Do you know what you are saying at all, you want the Qur’aan to give the prophesy of Muhammad. To whom was it revealed? Did Jesus prophesize his coming as Jesus in the New Testament.

If you will open your heart very well you will see that Deut. 18: 18 fits Muhammad than any other person.


Allaah did not need somebody’s blood before He would forgive His slaves of their sins, He is not a blood-sucker. Man just needs to turn in penitence to him and that is all.

He said:

“Say: "O 'Ibâdî (My slaves) who have transgressed against themselves (by committing evil deeds and sins)! Despair not of the Mercy of Allâh, Verily Allâh forgives All sins. Truly, He is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful.

"And turn In repentance and In obedience with true faith (Islâmic Monotheism) to Your Lord and submit to him, (in Islâm), before the torment comes upon you, Then You will not be helped.” [Q39: 63-64]

But He warned in some places in the Qur’aan that he would not forgive whoever ascribes partners unto Him, like the Christians saying Jesus is God.






“How does Allah save sinners? It would be unjust to forgive the guilty without the penalty being paid. Where does Allah explain the penalty? When and by whom was that penalty paid? If Allah forgives, how does he forgive? Allah simply refuses to forgive or forgives whom he will, but there is no consistent or just basis for either. No Muslim can be sure Allah will forgive him. As a Christian I know for certain that I have been forgiven all my sins and that I have eternal life as a free gift from God through the death and resurrection of Christ and that I will be in heaven—not by my good works, but by Christ paying the penalty for my sins. Allah is merciful to those who do good. The Bible says that none do good, all have sinned, and that God saves sinners if they believe in the Christ who died for them.”


But you must know that you are being greatly unjust for still ascribing partners unto God, partners that Abraham did not know neither Moses nor other Prophet, even John the Baptist never venerated Jesus. So the assurance you are giving yourself, you will find out that it will fail you if you do not do the will of God as it is in Islam.

I am very sorry for you Nezan if you are heedless.

Anyway, by now you should have come to realize it that you made blunder by following Will Durant or GJO Morshay in saying Allaah was an idol in Makkah.

I still hope to see your hand, no pretense O.

Noetic antic is well established. only angry nonsense comes from nezan.

if allah of the father of Muhammad (AS) was an idol, does it mean that the Allah of Muhammad have to be idol, too?
we noticed that from filth of idolatry Ibrahim (AS), the "father of pure faith" came from! this is the same with Muhammad (AS) the last Messenger and Prophet to mankind.

i do not worship allah, but i worship Allah. in yoruba i do not worship alaiye, but i worship Alaiye.

moon god is ilah qamar or qamar ilah. unless the accusers (noetic, etc) can proof how all of a sudden Allah is now just moon god, and not God to anything else, including humans, then we need just to tell the Noetics(s) to proof their bonafides.

but then, can the noetics(s) of this world proof the Singular God of the muslims, and indeed all mankind, all creations?


now, how is the God of jewish religion the same as the christian God in Trinity (Tri is 3)?

I shall be brief as much as possible, I will not give you ‘close marking’ this time around but paragraph by paragraph rejoinder. I will quote your paragraph and leave my own open, this is how far the WAP-version I am using will permit me. Still the work is going to be a bit long, so you have to read it Nezan.

Let’s go:

“The biblical God is called Yahweh (or Jehovah) nearly 9,000 times. Yet Allah is not called by that name even once in the Koran. Why not, if Allah is the same God? God is also referred to as Elohim more than 2,500 times in the Bible, but again that word never appears for Allah in the Koran. Why? The God of the Bible is called "The God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob “Israel" (Jacob's name was changed by God to Israel later in life, so he is referred to by either name). He is the father of the Jews.”

If the biblical God is called Yahweh (or Jehovah) must the Qur’an call Him so? Don’t you see that the Qur’aan was revealed in Arabic. And if that is the standard, then all who call Yahweh in other names like ‘God,’ ‘Olohun,’ ‘Chukwu,’ ‘Ubangiji’ are wrong because they do not call Him Yahweh.

The same explanation goes for Elohim; Muslims do not dispute the fact that God can be called any other name if that is what the people know Him to be, but we say the name of God in the Arabic Language is Allaah. So if Allaah is an idol (I seek refuge in Allaah from that), then tell us what name the Arabs give to God. Simple.

There is no special thing in God being called ‘God of Abraham’ or ‘God of Isaac’ nobody except a fool will say God is not his God. And the Qur’aan does bear a semblance of that, since you insist. So see Q2: 136 below:

“Say (O Muslims), "We believe In Allâh and that which has been sent down to us and that which has been sent down to Ibrâhim (Abraham), Ismâ'il (Ishmael), Ishâque (Isaac), Ya'qûb (Jacob), and to Al-Asbât [the twelve sons of Ya'qûb (Jacob)], and that which has been given to Mûsa (Moses) and 'Iesa (Jesus), and that which has been given to the Prophets from their Lord. We make no distinction between any of them, and to Him we have submitted (in Islâm)."

An implicit message in the above is that it was Allaah Who sent all those so He was their God. Are you now satisfied?




“ The God of the Bible revealed himself to Moses at the burning bush by this name ("God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob “Israel" and told Moses, "this is my name for ever, and this is my memorial unto all generations" (Ex 3:1-16). If Allah is the God of the Bible, why is he never called by these names? The God of the Bible tells us again and again that He is the God of the Jews. Many times He is called "the God of Israel." Yet there is such hatred for Israel among Muslims! The Koran talks about Abraham and Ishmael, even claims they built the Kaaba, but gives Isaac no prominence. The Bible mentions Isaac favorably and prominently more than 150 times. God very clearly says that His covenant is with Isaac, not with Ishmael (Genesis 17:19-21), from whom the Arabs claim they are descended. The God of the Bible calls the Jews His chosen people. He loves them and gave the land of Israel to them as an heritage forever, as hundreds of verses in the Bible declare. Islam denies this basic biblical truth. The Jews are certainly not Allah's chosen people! How can Allah be the God of the Bible, yet not choose the Jews?”

I have answered part of what you raised above in the last paragraph, it is immaterial that God is known with many Names but what is important is that it is only this God that should be worshipped.

The phrase ‘God of Israel’ is often used to prove the supremacy of the Jewish race over all other races, and many Christians like Nezan here, subscribe to this thought, and this often makes the race to be immaculate such that it can never be accused of doing what is wrong. It is funny that Christians say that whoever does not believe in the death of Jesus Christ on the cross will dwell forever in hell but will not include the Jews who ‘killed’ Jesus and who still call him an impostor till these days, the Christians will not condemn the Jews because they ‘are chosen of God.’

Islam does not subscribe to that – the Jews are like normal human beings, they do not have any superiority over the non-Jews. So also the Arabs, they have no superiority, Islam has said superiority is an individual affair, and that will be base on one’s piety. See Q49: 13 below:

“O mankind! we have created You from a male and a female, and made You into nations and tribes, that You may know one another. Verily, the Most honourable of You with Allâh is that (believer) who has At-Taqwa [i.e. one of the Muttaqûn (pious - see V.2:2). Verily, Allâh is All-Knowing, All-Aware.”

And the prophet of Islam has declared that ‘there is no superiority of the Arabs on the non-Arabs, superiority is only by piety of Allaah.’

It is true that the Qur’aan says the Jews were once a favoured nation when they were of God but after their proven rebellion (even when Moses was alive) by their refusal to accept Muhammad as the Prophet of Allaah (and their refusal to accept Jesus Christ), Allaah withdrew His favour from them and gave to whom? The Arabs? No, the Muslims.

See this:

“O Children of Israel! Remember My Favour which I bestowed upon you, and fulfil (your obligations to) My Covenant (with you) so that I fulfil (My obligations to) Your Covenant (with Me), and fear none but Me.

And believe In what I have sent down (this Qur'ân), confirming that which is with you, [the Taurât (Torah) and the Injeel (Gospel)], and be not the first to disbelieve therein, and buy not with My Verses [the Taurât (Torah) and the Injeel (Gospel)] a small price (i.e. getting a small gain by selling My Verses), and fear Me and Me Alone.

And mix not Truth with falsehood, nor conceal the Truth [i.e. Muhammad Sal-Allaahu 'alayhe Wa Sallam is Allâh's Messenger and his qualities are written In Your Scriptures, the Taurât (Torah) and the Injeel (Gospel)] while You know (the truth).” [Q2: 40-42].

If you think that the description above does not fit the Jew, then check your record.

Mind you the Qur’aan is replete with the description of the Jews (their treachery, folly, rebellion, etc.), what I have brought is just a tip of an iceberg.

To say Qur’an does not make a mention of Isaac is but a fallacy of the highest order, the verse above has partly debunked that. Now see these others:

“Salâmun (peace) be upon Ibrâhim (Abraham)!"
Thus indeed do we reward the Muhsinûn Verily, He was one of Our believing slaves.
And we gave Him the glad tidings of Ishâque (Isaac) a Prophet from the righteous.
We blessed Him and Ishâque (Isaac), and of their progeny are (some) that do right, and some that plainly wrong themselves.” [Q37: 109-113].

Yet another:

“And Remember Our slaves, Ibrâhim (Abraham), Ishâque (Isaac), and Ya'qûb (Jacob), (all) owners of strength (in worshipping Us) and (also) of religious understanding.
Verily, we did choose them by granting them (a good thing, i.e.) the remembrance of the home [in the Hereafter and they used to make the people Remember it, and also they used to invite the people to obey Allâh and to do good deeds for the Hereafter].
And they are with us, Verily, of the chosen and the best!” [Q38: 45-47].

Will you still say Isaac was not given any prominence in the Qur’aan?


And you said God’s Covenant was with Isaac, so God had no plan for Ishmael. Didn’t He say He would make him a great nation? Didn’t He say the Jews will be jealous of his nation? So God do not have covenant with other Prophets too?



“ In your Koran, as you must know, Allah commands Muslims, "Take not the Jews and Christians as friends 1 Surah 5:51, A1 Hi1-a1i, v. 54, Jusuf a1i), so Allah is not the God of the Christians either. In the hadith, Muhammad himself said, "The last hour will not come before the Muslims fight the Jews, and the Muslims kill them" (Mishkat al Masabih Sh. M. Ashraf, 1990, pp. 147, 721, 810-11, 1130, etc.). Islam's god hates the Jews; the God of the Bible loves them as His chosen people! Allah is very clearly not Jehovah, Elohim, the God of Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, the God of the Bible!”

Qur’aan warns the Muslims about the Christians and the Jews because Allaah knew that because of the revelation the Muslims had received, that would cause enmity from the Christians and the Jews towards the Muslims and they would want that the Muslims had not received that. And that is what is practically happening; the Jews and Christians do not want to fathom the fact that their salvation lies in accepting what Allaah has revealed to Muhammad.

See this:

‘Neither those who disbelieve among the people of the Scripture (Jews and Christians) nor Al-Mushrikûn (the disbelievers In the Oneness of Allâh, idolaters, polytheists, pagans, etc.) like that there should be sent down unto You any good from Your Lord. But Allâh chooses for his Mercy whom He wills. and Allâh is the Owner of great Bounty.” [Q2: 105]

So that is the cuase of the enmity from the Peopel of the Book to the Muslims.

Allaah says further:

“Never will the Jews nor the Christians be pleased with You (O Muhammad and Muslims) till You follow their religion. say: "Verily, the guidance of Allâh (i.e. Islâmic Monotheism) that is the (only) Guidance.” [Q2: 120]

Maybe Nezan will you say the above is not true.

So because of that Islam says the Jews and the Christians are enemies of Islam so Muslims should be wary of them. Period.



“The God of the Bible chose Jerusalem as His holy city. Forty times He calls Jerusalem "the city of David" and repeatedly He promises that the Messiah will be descended from David and will rule on David's throne in Jerusalem over the whole world (2 Chronicles 6:6; 33:7; 2 Samuel 7: 16; Psalm 89:3-29, etc.). Never does the Bible (or the God of the Bible) mention Mecca or Medina, but Jerusalem is mentioned more than 800 times. Yet Allah never mentions Jerusalem. How can this be if Allah is the God of the Bible? And how can the Muslims today claim Jerusalem as a holy city of Islam, when it isn't even mentioned in the Koran? That recent claim comes from those who want to take that city from the Jews.”


That the Qur’aan does not mention Jerusalem shows how far you are from the basic Islamic learning. Every Muslim knows from childhood that Jerusalem is important to the Muslims because of its housing the third holiest mosque which the Muslims still pray in today. [And you should know that Jerusalem bears more semblance for Islam today than any other religion, ask the JP’s who are sincere enough to say the truth.]

And there is no disputing the fact that the reference to the ‘farthest mosque’ in the verse below is but the mosque which the Muslims pray in today in Jerusalem.

Glorified (and Exalted) be He (Allâh) Who took his slave (Muhammad) for a journey by night from Al-Masjid-al-Harâm (at Makkah) to the farthest mosque (in Jerusalem), the neighbourhood whereof we have blessed, In order that we might show Him (Muhammad) of Our Ayât (proofs, evidences, lessons, signs, etc.). Verily, He is the All-Hearer, the All-Seer.

There are lot of narrations from the Prophet saying the mosque in Jerusalem is as important to the Muslims as the One at Ka’bah and Madinah.

If not the Balfour Declaration which gave Israel to the Jews (and eventually Jerusalem), the present location of Israel and Jerusalem had been under the control of the Muslims for centuries. Ask yourselves, who are now in the biblical cities, Damascus, etc, the Muslims of course, how? The glory of Islam. (And it is a matter of time that Jerusalem will come back to the Muslims fully, that when the Arabs stop fighting in the name of Arab nationalism but in the name of Islam.)





“That Allah has no son is further proof that He is not the God of the Bible, who definitely has a Son, as both the Old and New Testaments declare. Psalms 2 says, "Kiss the Son." Referring to the God of the Bible, Solomon says, "What is his son's name, ?" (Proverbs 30:4). The angel Gabriel, whom Islam claims to honor, told the virgin Mary (Islam accepts the virgin birth of Jesus), " And, behold, thou shalt, bring forth a son, and shalt call his name JESUS. He shall be, called the Son of the Highest , the Son of God, and the Lord God shall give unto him the throne of his father David, " (Luke 1:31-35). That throne is in Jerusalem, not in Mecca.”

Are you then saying a good God must have sons? Let me share a story with you of our past Muslim scholars: This Muslim scholar was invited to the court of a Roman king who used to have the pope in his court too. By practice, the King would come before the Pope, and when the Pope arrives everybody including the King would pay him homage. So iy happened that when this Muslim scholar was in the court of this King and the pope arrived, everybody paid him homage except this Muslim scholar. He was asked why, he said he wanted to make his own greeting to the Pope special, so he went to the Pope greeted him and asked him ‘How are your sons and daughters?’ Everybody in the hall including the Pope was embarrassed because of what the Muslim scholar had said. How dare he asked of the Pope’s sons and daughters while it is known that Pope does not give birth. The Muslim scholar (our scholars have always been sharp) then lampooned everybody in the hall that if it would sound insulting to the pope to have sons, then what about the God of Pope? The Muslim scholar was to stay for some days in the country but he was made to leave immediately because his continuous stay in the place ‘was dangerous.’

So do you still say a good God should have sons, Nezan?


Please can you explain how the throne of David (father of God-Jesus) was given to Jesus?




“ Muslims insist that the name " Allah" must be used in every language; it cannot be translated Dios in Spanish, Dieu in French, or God in English. Muslims thus treat " Allah" not as a generic word for God, but as the name of a particular god. In fact, Allah was the god of the Kuraish tribe centuries before Muhammad was born. You deny that he was the chief god in the Kaaba, but you admit there were for centuries 360 idols in the Kaaba and one of these was called Allah. What is Allah doing in a temple among 360 idols if he is the God of the Bible, who forbids idolatry? Why does Islam keep this idol temple, and why must Muslims to this day make a pilgrimage there? That Allah was the chief idol in the Kaaba is documented history. Let me quote one of the greatest historians: The desert Arab, feared and worshiped incalculable deities in stars and moons, Now and then he offered human sacrifice; and here and there he worshiped sacred stones. The center of this stone worship was Mecca (with) the Kaaba and its sacred Black Stone, in its southeast corner, five feet from the ground, just right for kissing.…”


This is where you actually addressed the issue at hand. Muslims prefer that God should be called Allaah because that is what He says His Name is in the Final Revelation. This does not mean Allaah cannot be called in other names that people call God. But it is better that Muslims call Him Allaah because some other names God is called might have one form of corruption or the other. For instance the word ‘God’ is somehow ambiguous. When you hear ‘God’ or ‘god’ how do you differentiate that? One can easily slip into error, so this is why Muslims feel safe calling God Allaah often.

Yes the Arabs used to worship more than 360 idols before Prophet Muhammad stop that. Allaah was never part of those idols otherwise the Arabs would have got a stataue for him as they did for other gods. Why? Because they knew He was a Supreme Being that cannot be seen. In fact just like the Jews, they had demanded from the Prophet that they liked to see Allaah:

“And those who expect not for a Meeting with us (i.e. those who deny the Day of Resurrection and the life of the Hereafter), say: "Why are not the angels sent down to us, or why do we not see Our Lord?" indeed they think too highly of themselves, and are scornful with great pride.” [Q25: 21].

So if Allah were an idol (I seek refuge in Him from that), they would not have asked the Prophet to let them see Him.

To say that Allah is an idol, that is a documented history, shows another aspect of your referencing history. You yourself know within your heart that you have told a BIG LIE. Where is it documented O Nezan that Allaah is a chief idol? Bring it or else, as usual, you are a [finish it yourself, so that you will not say I am abusing you.]

And did that your phantom ‘greatest historian’ say Allaah was an idol?

As for the origin of the Ka’bah and the Hajj, I think i have addressed that in the answer i gave to Kola Oloye in ‘Ask Me About Islam’ but let me reproduce it here for those who have not read it (I know you have read it but have an axe to grind):

“The last pillar is going on hajj.

The Muslims have evidence for Hajj they go to, we do not copy people. But people copy us.

“, And Hajj (pilgrimage to Makkah) to the House (Ka'bah) is a duty that mankind owes to Allâh, those who can afford the expenses (for one's conveyance, provision and residence); and whoever disbelieves [i.e. denies Hajj (pilgrimage to Makkah), then he is a disbeliever of Allâh], then Allâh stands not in need of any of the 'Alamîn (mankind and jinns).” [Q3: 97].

Non-Muslims should know that the institution of Hajj had been a commandment handed down by Allaah to Ibrahim (Abraham) – the Father of Faith.

“And (remember) when We showed Ibrâhim (Abraham) the site of the (Sacred) House (the Ka'bah at Makkah) (saying): "Associate not anything (in worship) with Me, [Lâ ilâha ill-Allâh (none has the right to be worshipped but Allâh Islâmic Monotheism], and sanctify My House for those who circumambulate it, and those who stand up for prayer, and those who bow (submit themselves with humility and obedience to Allâh), and make prostration (in prayer, etc.);” [Q22: 26].

“And (remember) when Ibrâhim (Abraham) and (his son) Ismâ'il (Ishmael) were raising the foundations of the House (the Ka'bah at Makkah), (saying), "Our Lord! Accept (this service) from us. Verily! You are the All-Hearer, the All-Knower.” [Q2: 127].

Note, Oh Christians, that the Arabs whom the Prophet (sallallâhu ’alayhi wa sallam) met in Makkah never denied that fact even though they would have denied it as they did for other facts, because they knew it was nothing but the truth. But you Christians, here and in other places, you open your mouths and say Ka’bah ‘is a house in Makkah that houses a god called Allaah.’

“Indeed you have brought forth (said) a terrible evil thing. Whereby the heavens are almost torn, and the earth is split asunder, and the mountains fall in ruins” [Q19: 89-90].

It is stated in the Bible (get it right now, the Bible is an admixture of words of God and men [some of you have confirmed that on other threads]; Muslims believe in what comes from God there as confirmed by the Qur’ân and the authentic narrations from the Prophet (sallallâhu ’alayhi wa sallam) [like here O Israel our God is One] and we dsibeleive in what comes from men [e.g. that Jesus is God or that he is son of God {may Allaah be glorified from that}], so please take note.) so it is stated (in the Bible) that Abraham was commanded to take Ishmael (Isma’eel) and his mother (Haajar) away. To where? Please we need your answer.

Meanwhile Islâm has answered that:

Allah said quoting Ibrahim:

“O our Lord! I (Ibrahim) have made some of my offspring to dwell in an uncultivable valley by Your Sacred House (the Ka'bah at Makkah); in order, O our Lord, that they may perform As-Salât (Iqâmat-as-Salât), so fill some hearts among men with love towards them, and (O Allâh) provide them with fruits so that they may give thanks.” [Q14: 37]

Notice Ibrahim’s supplication for Makkah in the verse. Will you understand, O Christians?

So a nation has been born through Islâm Muhammad, a grandson of Ishmael, brought as commissioned by Allaah. The nation is a great one, as the Bible (the one that comes from God) attests to; and the Jews are highly Jealous of it, as it (the Bible) also says.

So Ka’abah was the first house of worship on the surface of the earth.

“Verily, the first House (of worship) appointed for mankind was that at Bakkah (Makkah), full of blessing, and a guidance for Al-'Alamîn (the mankind and jinns).” [Q3: 96]” [End of qoute]




“ Within the Kaaba, in pre-Moslem days, were several idols representing gods. One was called Allah, three others were Allah's daughters, al-Uzza, al-Lat, and Manah. We may judge the antiquity of this Arab pantheon from the mention of A1-il Lat (AI-Lat) by Herodotus [fifth century B.C. Greek historian] as a major Arabian deity . The Quraish [Muhammad's tribe controlling Mecca] paved the way for monotheism by worshiping Allah as chief god; He was presented to the Meccans as the Lord of their soil, to Whom they must pay a tithe of their crops and the first-born of their herds. The Quraish, as alleged descendants of Abraham and Ishmael, appointed the priests and guardians of the shrine and managed its revenues (Will Durant, "The Story of Civilization," IV: 160-61).

So Will Durant was that ‘greatest historian’ who told you that Allaah was the chief idol of the Makkans. See what I have been telling you that the historians that you in particular quote are fools. A fact that a toddler among the Bedouin Arabs know; that Allaah is in the heaven and cannot be seen, and that the Arabs had never thought Him to be an idol, but your Will Durant said otherwise. He must be a fool. Well tell us who said he ‘was the greatest’ historian so that we would see how foolish that person is also. It must be your imagination!

That some idols were called al-Uzza, al-Lat and al-Manaat, and that the Arabs say they are ‘daughters of Allaah’ is a phenomenon well-known, that is, that they said that. And Allaah had repeatedly faulted that in the Qur’aan. See this, and please read it carefully:

“Have You Then considered Al-Lât, and Al-'Uzza
And Manât (another idol of the pagan Arabs), the other third?
Is it for You the males and for Him the females?
That indeed is a division Most unfair!
They are but names which You have named, You and Your fathers, for which Allâh has sent down no authority. they follow but a guess and that which they themselves desire, whereas there has surely come to them the guidance from their Lord!”

So it is glaring from the above that the idols were conjectures of the pagan Arabs.






“The Kaaba still stands, without its idols, but with the Black Stone. The pilgrimage to the Kaaba, to, kiss the sacred stone, to run between Safa and Marwa, and to climb Mount Arafa, was practiced by pious pagan Arabs for centuries before Muhammad. Why did your prophet keep, as part of Islam, these pagan rituals?”

You mean to say the Black Stone is Allaah. You should have said that openly, I think you should not be afraid any longer you have said what is worse. I only fear for you.

Well as for the Black Stone, I know for sure you will wonder what I will say as regard it. Well it is a matter well settled in Islâm. The Hajj rites which include pointing to or kissing the Black Stone were handed down by Ibrahim (Abraham). That is why the Arabs even before the Prophet had been going on pilgrimage to Makkah why? Because their fore-fathers on top of which was Ibrahim and Ishaaq had been doing so, but the pagan Arabs had innovated a lot of things which included their bringing to the Ka’bah those numerous idols, and their act of going round the Ka’bah naked while they clap their hands! All those, the Prophet stopped, and upon guidance through revelation, he retained the rites that were handed down by Ibrahim.

The Black Stone, the Prophet had said, was from the paradise, this may be hard for you to believe, but that was what our Prophet said:

“The Black Stone came down from Paradise and it was whiter than milk, but the sins of the sons of Adam turned it black.” Narrated by al-Tirmidhi (877).
Al-Tirmidhi said: It is a saheeh hasan hadeeth. It was classed as saheeh by Ibn Khuzaymah (4/219) and by al-Diya’ al-Maqdisi in al-Mukhtaarah (10/260). It was classed as hasan by Ibn al-Qattaan in Bayaan al-Wahm wa’l-Ayhaam (5/732), al-Haafiz Ibn Hajar in Fath al-Baari (3/540) and al-Albaani in al-Silsilah al-Saheehah (2618).
It was also narrated from Ibn ‘Abbaas, Ibn ‘Amr and others, see Musannaf Ibn Abi Shaybah (4/35); and from Anas (may Allaah be pleased with him) in Musnad Ahmad (3/277).

So what is glaring from the above was that the Black Stone was actually a White Stone, it turned black over the centuries as a result of the hands of sins that toughed it, and that was even before Islâm began to rule Makkah.

The statement of the prophet above is a clear one, if there was another thing to it, the Arabs would have said it. And if the Black Stone had actually represented Allaah, the Arabs would have said it, they knew it had been since the time of Ibrahim.

So it is recommended for whoever goes on hajj to kiss it, as did Ibrahim and Prophet Muhammad (and as attested to by the Arabs), not that his kissing it mean he is worshiping it but to emulate the prophets of Allaah whom it had been made permissible for to kiss, and because the Stone is from Paradise.

Nezan, if you are sure a thing comes from Paradise won’t you like to touch it even to kiss it. Does your touching or kissing it mean the you are worshipping it?

For more on hajj rites see this link:

http://www.islam-qa.com/en/ref/30897






“You say "Islam is the religion of Adam, Noah, Abraham, Moses, Jesus, " Do you think Adam, Abraham, Moses, Jesus, et al. journeyed to the idol temple, the Kaaba, and kissed its Black Stone? Impossible! Not one follower of the God of the Bible would ever have gone near the Kaaba, because the God of the Bible forbids any association with idols; and you admit (as history tells us) that the Kaaba was filled with idols before Muhammad destroyed them all. In history and the Bible, you will find no mention of Islam or any religion like it. How could you have Islam without the Koran and Muhammad?”

But Islam does say there was no Prophet of Allaah except that He performed the pilgrimage in Makkah, but you may not know. For instance our Prophet went and prayed in the mosque at Jerusalem miraculously!




“ The only people who journeyed to the Kaaba and kissed the Black Stone were pagan Arabs who worshiped one or more of the idols within and around it. Muhammad started a new religion called Islam to which Arabs, Persians, Egyptians, Turks and everyone else in the region had to convert at the point of the sword. They became Muslims, and there is no way you can say that Islam was the original religion of that or any other region.”

I think I have cleared that.




“ You ask me to explain, "The God of the Bible is love, an impossibility for Allah." If Allah is a single being, as Muslims insist, then he cannot be love in and of himself, because he had no one to love until he created others; but the God of the Bible is love in and of Himself because He is three Persons but One God. Father, Son and Holy Spirit loved and communed with one another before men or angels were created.”

But God in the Bible commanded the Jews to kill their enemies, and He made many of the Prophets like David to fight wars.

Till eternity, Christian will not be able to explain how 1+1+1=3. Even a computer programme cannot solve it.




“While the Jews know that Allah is not Jehovah, they try to say (as Muslims do for Allah) that Jehovah is a single being. If so, then why does the Bible refer to Him more than 2,500 times with the plural Elohim (gods)? Interestingly, however, always with the plural noun there is a singular verb. One cannot escape the plurality combined with singularity repeatedly used.”

This has been answered by me earlier on.





“The famous shema (Dt 6:4), the most fundamental saying about God for a Jew, declares, "Hear, O Israel: Jehovah our Elohim is one Jehovah." Far from declaring that the God of the Bible is a singular being, the Hebrew word translated "one" is echad, which means a unity of several becoming one, as when God said the man and woman became "one (echad) flesh" (Genesis 2:24); when many soldiers became "one (echad) troop" (2 Samuel 2:25) or when two sticks became "one (echad) stick" (Ezekiel 37:17) etc.

When a husband and his wife become one, do they have one soul, one thinking, one mannerism, etc.? So can God, Jesus and Holy Ghost be one that way? What if Mary, Mother of God (as John Paul) wanted the Christians to include her, is added? Still one soul? You must author a book O.




“The Bible teaches that God's very essence is love and says, "God is love" (1 John 4:. This is not true of Allah. The Bible repeatedly speaks of God's love for man and the love we must have for Him. But love is scarcely mentioned in the Koran. Not once is "love" listed in the index of the popular Marmaduke Pickthall translation of the Koran. Of Allah's 99 attributes, love is not one. The Koran does say that Allah loves "the beneficent" (Surah 2:195), "the stedfast ( and) those whose deeds are good" (Surah 3:146-48), and "those who battle for his cause" (Surah 61:4). But never does it say he loves all mankind, much less sinners; but the God of the Bible loves sinners, even those who hate Him. Allah is said to be merciful, but he does not show mercy to those who need it. The God of the Bible, however, is merciful to all, ready to forgive confessed sin.

So if God’s love is absolute, that is, without demarcation, why will He throw some of His Loved ones into fire?




“The first of the Ten Commandments is that we are to love the God of the Bible with our whole heart; but never does the Koran say a Muslim is to love Allah. You cannot love Allah, because he is unknowable. The God of the Bible can be known and repeatedly calls upon men to know Him; but the Koran says no one can know Allah because he is too great. In spite of being infinite, without beginning and end, and the Creator of the universe, the biblical God reveals himself so that men can know Him. Jesus himself said, "This is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent" (John 17:3). Those who don't know the God of the Bible are lost eternally. No one knows Allah.”

You talk as if you know the Qur’aan, ‘Sue’ then what is the meaning of this:

“And of mankind are some who take (for worship) others besides Allâh as rivals (to Allâh). they love them as they love Allâh. but those who believe, love Allâh more (than anything else). if only, those who do wrong could see, when they will see the torment, that All power belongs to Allâh and that Allâh is Severe In punishment.”

And you say Allaah cannot be loved.

So that verse of the Bible said Jesus was sent by God, and you say he is God!

So you have seen (known) God before?

See Islâm says Allaah is closer to us His slaves very much:

“And when My slaves ask You (O Muhammad ) concerning Me, Then (answer them), I am indeed near (to them by My Knowledge). I respond to the invocations of the supplicant when He calls on Me (without any mediator or intercessor). so let them obey Me and believe In Me, so that they may be led aright.” [Baqarah: 186].








“The Bible is filled with prophecies of the coming of Messiah Jesus, but there is not one such prophecy in the Koran for Jesus or Muhammad. In fact, the Koran was written after Muhammad came, so it could not prophesy his coming, but the Old Testament prophesied the coming of Jesus centuries and even thousands of years beforehand. The Jewish prophets in the Old Testament said the Messiah would be crucified and rise from the dead the third day. Jesus came at exactly the time prophesied and died for the sins of the world, as the Bible says over and over. But the Koran contradicts this and says He didn't die on the cross at all, much less for our sins. The Bible says that the penalty for sin must be paid and that God himself had to come as a man to die for our sins. Allah did not do that.”

Do you know what you are saying at all, you want the Qur’aan to give the prophesy of Muhammad. To whom was it revealed? Did Jesus prophesize his coming as Jesus in the New Testament.

If you will open your heart very well you will see that Deut. 18: 18 fits Muhammad than any other person.


Allaah did not need somebody’s blood before He would forgive His slaves of their sins, He is not a blood-sucker. Man just needs to turn in penitence to him and that is all.

He said:

“Say: "O 'Ibâdî (My slaves) who have transgressed against themselves (by committing evil deeds and sins)! Despair not of the Mercy of Allâh, Verily Allâh forgives All sins. Truly, He is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful.

"And turn In repentance and In obedience with true faith (Islâmic Monotheism) to Your Lord and submit to him, (in Islâm), before the torment comes upon you, Then You will not be helped.” [Q39: 63-64]

But He warned in some places in the Qur’aan that he would not forgive whoever ascribes partners unto Him, like the Christians saying Jesus is God.






“How does Allah save sinners? It would be unjust to forgive the guilty without the penalty being paid. Where does Allah explain the penalty? When and by whom was that penalty paid? If Allah forgives, how does he forgive? Allah simply refuses to forgive or forgives whom he will, but there is no consistent or just basis for either. No Muslim can be sure Allah will forgive him. As a Christian I know for certain that I have been forgiven all my sins and that I have eternal life as a free gift from God through the death and resurrection of Christ and that I will be in heaven—not by my good works, but by Christ paying the penalty for my sins. Allah is merciful to those who do good. The Bible says that none do good, all have sinned, and that God saves sinners if they believe in the Christ who died for them.”


But you must know that you are being greatly unjust for still ascribing partners unto God, partners that Abraham did not know neither Moses nor other Prophet, even John the Baptist never venerated Jesus. So the assurance you are giving yourself, you will find out that it will fail you if you do not do the will of God as it is in Islam.

I am very sorry for you Nezan if you are heedless.

Anyway, by now you should have come to realize it that you made blunder by following Will Durant or GJO Morshay in saying Allaah was an idol in Makkah.

I still hope to see your hand, no pretense O.

I have posted this since yesterday but I came to realize that it was not showing probably because of its length, hence I have decided to remove some of Nezan’s writing, just an introduction to each paragraph. And I have divided into two.

Let’s go:

Part One:

“The biblical God is called Yahweh (or Jehovah) nearly 9,000 times, ”

If the biblical God is called Yahweh (or Jehovah) must the Qur’an call Him so? Don’t you see that the Qur’aan was revealed in Arabic. And if that is the standard, then all who call Yahweh in other names like ‘God,’ ‘Olohun,’ ‘Chukwu,’ ‘Ubangiji’ are wrong because they do not call Him Yahweh.

The same explanation goes for Elohim; Muslims do not dispute the fact that God can be called any other name if that is what the people know Him to be, but we say the name of God in the Arabic Language is Allaah. So if Allaah is an idol (I seek refuge in Allaah from that), then tell us what name the Arabs give to God. Simple.

There is no special thing in God being called ‘God of Abraham’ or ‘God of Isaac’ nobody except a fool will say God is not his God. And the Qur’aan does bear a semblance of that, since you insist. So see Q2: 136 below:

“Say (O Muslims), "We believe In Allâh and that which has been sent down to us and that which has been sent down to Ibrâhim (Abraham), Ismâ'il (Ishmael), Ishâque (Isaac), Ya'qûb (Jacob), and to Al-Asbât [the twelve sons of Ya'qûb (Jacob)], and that which has been given to Mûsa (Moses) and 'Iesa (Jesus), and that which has been given to the Prophets from their Lord. We make no distinction between any of them, and to Him we have submitted (in Islâm)."

An implicit message in the above is that it was Allaah Who sent all those so He was their God. Are you now satisfied?

“ The God of the Bible revealed himself to Moses at the burning bush, ”

I have answered part of what you raised above in the last paragraph, it is immaterial that God is known with many Names but what is important is that it is only this God that should be worshipped.

The phrase ‘God of Israel’ is often used to prove the supremacy of the Jewish race over all other races, and many Christians like Nezan here, subscribe to this thought, and this often makes the race to be immaculate such that it can never be accused of doing what is wrong. It is funny that Christians say that whoever does not believe in the death of Jesus Christ on the cross will dwell forever in hell but will not include the Jews who ‘killed’ Jesus and who still call him an impostor till these days, the Christians will not condemn the Jews because they ‘are chosen of God.’

Islam does not subscribe to that – the Jews are like normal human beings, they do not have any superiority over the non-Jews. So also the Arabs, they have no superiority, Islam has said superiority is an individual affair, and that will be base on one’s piety. See Q49: 13 below:

“O mankind! we have created You from a male and a female, and made You into nations and tribes, that You may know one another. Verily, the Most honourable of You with Allâh is that (believer) who has At-Taqwa [i.e. one of the Muttaqûn (pious - see V.2:2). Verily, Allâh is All-Knowing, All-Aware.”

And the prophet of Islam has declared that ‘there is no superiority of the Arabs on the non-Arabs, superiority is only by piety of Allaah.’

It is true that the Qur’aan says the Jews were once a favoured nation when they were of God but after their proven rebellion (even when Moses was alive) by their refusal to accept Muhammad as the Prophet of Allaah (and their refusal to accept Jesus Christ), Allaah withdrew His favour from them and gave to whom? The Arabs? No, the Muslims.

See this:

“O Children of Israel! Remember My Favour which I bestowed upon you, and fulfil (your obligations to) My Covenant (with you) so that I fulfil (My obligations to) Your Covenant (with Me), and fear none but Me.

And believe In what I have sent down (this Qur'ân), confirming that which is with you, [the Taurât (Torah) and the Injeel (Gospel)], and be not the first to disbelieve therein, and buy not with My Verses [the Taurât (Torah) and the Injeel (Gospel)] a small price (i.e. getting a small gain by selling My Verses), and fear Me and Me Alone.

And mix not Truth with falsehood, nor conceal the Truth [i.e. Muhammad Sal-Allaahu 'alayhe Wa Sallam is Allâh's Messenger and his qualities are written In Your Scriptures, the Taurât (Torah) and the Injeel (Gospel)] while You know (the truth).” [Q2: 40-42].

If you think that the description above does not fit the Jew, then check your record.

Mind you the Qur’aan is replete with the description of the Jews (their treachery, folly, rebellion, etc.), what I have brought is just a tip of an iceberg.

To say Qur’an does not make a mention of Isaac is but a fallacy of the highest order, the verse above has partly debunked that. Now see these others:

“Salâmun (peace) be upon Ibrâhim (Abraham)!"
Thus indeed do we reward the Muhsinûn Verily, He was one of Our believing slaves.
And we gave Him the glad tidings of Ishâque (Isaac) a Prophet from the righteous.
We blessed Him and Ishâque (Isaac), and of their progeny are (some) that do right, and some that plainly wrong themselves.” [Q37: 109-113].

Yet another:

“And Remember Our slaves, Ibrâhim (Abraham), Ishâque (Isaac), and Ya'qûb (Jacob), (all) owners of strength (in worshipping Us) and (also) of religious understanding.
Verily, we did choose them by granting them (a good thing, i.e.) the remembrance of the home [in the Hereafter and they used to make the people Remember it, and also they used to invite the people to obey Allâh and to do good deeds for the Hereafter].
And they are with us, Verily, of the chosen and the best!” [Q38: 45-47].

Will you still say Isaac was not given any prominence in the Qur’aan?

And you said God’s Covenant was with Isaac, so God had no plan for Ishmael. Didn’t He say He would make him a great nation? Didn’t He say the Jews will be jealous of his nation? So God do not have covenant with other Prophets too?



“ In your Koran, as you must know, Allah commands Muslims, "Take not the Jews and Christians as friends, ”

Qur’aan warns the Muslims about the Christians and the Jews because Allaah knew that because of the revelation the Muslims had received, that would cause enmity from the Christians and the Jews towards the Muslims and they would want that the Muslims had not received that. And that is what is practically happening; the Jews and Christians do not want to fathom the fact that their salvation lies in accepting what Allaah has revealed to Muhammad.

See this:

‘Neither those who disbelieve among the people of the Scripture (Jews and Christians) nor Al-Mushrikûn (the disbelievers In the Oneness of Allâh, idolaters, polytheists, pagans, etc.) like that there should be sent down unto You any good from Your Lord. But Allâh chooses for his Mercy whom He wills. and Allâh is the Owner of great Bounty.” [Q2: 105]

So that is the cause of the enmity from the People of the Book to the Muslims.

Allaah says further:

“Never will the Jews nor the Christians be pleased with You (O Muhammad and Muslims) till You follow their religion. say: "Verily, the guidance of Allâh (i.e. Islâmic Monotheism) that is the (only) Guidance.” [Q2: 120]

Maybe Nezan will say the above is not true.

So because of that Islam says the Jews and the Christians are enemies of Islam so Muslims should be wary of them. Period.

“The God of the Bible chose Jerusalem as His holy city, ”

That the Qur’aan does not mention Jerusalem shows how far you are from the basic Islamic learning. Every Muslim knows from childhood that Jerusalem is important to the Muslims because of its housing the third holiest mosque which the Muslims still pray in today. [And you should know that Jerusalem bears more semblance for Islam today than any other religion, ask the JP’s who are sincere enough to say the truth.]

And there is no disputing the fact that the reference to the ‘farthest mosque’ in the verse below is but the mosque which the Muslims pray in today in Jerusalem.

Glorified (and Exalted) be He (Allâh) Who took his slave (Muhammad) for a journey by night from Al-Masjid-al-Harâm (at Makkah) to the farthest mosque (in Jerusalem), the neighbourhood whereof we have blessed, In order that we might show Him (Muhammad) of Our Ayât (proofs, evidences, lessons, signs, etc.). Verily, He is the All-Hearer, the All-Seer.

There are lot of narrations from the Prophet saying the mosque in Jerusalem is as important to the Muslims as the One at Ka’bah and Madinah.

If not the Balfour Declaration which gave Israel to the Jews (and eventually Jerusalem), the present location of Israel and Jerusalem had been under the control of the Muslims for centuries. Ask yourselves, who are now in the biblical cities, Damascus, etc, the Muslims of course, how? The glory of Islam. (And it is a matter of time that Jerusalem will come back to the Muslims fully, that when the Arabs stop fighting in the name of Arab nationalism but in the name of Islam.)

“That Allah has no son is further proof that He is not the God of the Bible, ”

Are you then saying a good God must have sons? Let me share a story with you of our past Muslim scholars: This Muslim scholar was invited to the court of a Roman king who used to have the pope in his court too. By practice, the King would come before the Pope, and when the Pope arrives everybody including the King would pay him homage. So iy happened that when this Muslim scholar was in the court of this King and the pope arrived, everybody paid him homage except this Muslim scholar. He was asked why, he said he wanted to make his own greeting to the Pope special, so he went to the Pope greeted him and asked him ‘How are your sons and daughters?’ Everybody in the hall including the Pope was embarrassed because of what the Muslim scholar had said. How dare he asked of the Pope’s sons and daughters while it is known that Pope does not give birth. The Muslim scholar (our scholars have always been sharp) then lampooned everybody in the hall that if it would sound insulting to the pope to have sons, then what about the God of Pope? The Muslim scholar was to stay for some days in the country but he was made to leave immediately because his continuous stay in the place ‘was dangerous.’

So do you still say a good God should have sons, Nezan?


Please can you explain how the throne of David (father of God-Jesus) was given to Jesus?


“ Muslims insist that the name " Allah" must be used in every language…”


This is where you actually addressed the issue at hand. Muslims prefer that God should be called Allaah because that is what He says His Name is in the Final Revelation. This does not mean Allaah cannot be called in other names that people call God. But it is better that Muslims call Him Allaah because some other names God is called might have one form of corruption or the other. For instance the word ‘God’ is somehow ambiguous. When you hear ‘God’ or ‘god’ how do you differentiate that? One can easily slip into error, so this is why Muslims feel safe calling God Allaah often.

Yes the Arabs used to worship more than 360 idols before Prophet Muhammad stop that. Allaah was never part of those idols otherwise the Arabs would have got a stataue for him as they did for other gods. Why? Because they knew He was a Supreme Being that cannot be seen. In fact just like the Jews, they had demanded from the Prophet that they liked to see Allaah:

“And those who expect not for a Meeting with us (i.e. those who deny the Day of Resurrection and the life of the Hereafter), say: "Why are not the angels sent down to us, or why do we not see Our Lord?" indeed they think too highly of themselves, and are scornful with great pride.” [Q25: 21].

So if Allah were an idol (I seek refuge in Him from that), they would not have asked the Prophet to let them see Him.

To say that Allah is an idol, that is a documented history, shows another aspect of your referencing history. You yourself know within your heart that you have told a BIG LIE. Where is it documented O Nezan that Allaah is a chief idol? Bring it or else, as usual, you are a [finish it yourself, so that you will not say I am abusing you.]

And did that your phantom ‘greatest historian’ say Allaah was an idol?

As for the origin of the Ka’bah and the Hajj, I think I have addressed that in the answer I gave to Kola Oloye in ‘Ask Me About Islam’ so go back and read it.

“ Within the Kaaba, in pre-Moslem days, were several idols representing gods. One was called Allah, three others were Allah's daughters, al-Uzza, al-Lat, and Manah, (Will Durant, "The Story of Civilization," IV: 160-61).”

So Will Durant was that ‘greatest historian’ who told you that Allaah was the chief idol of the Makkans. See what I have been telling you that the historians that you in particular quote are fools. A fact that a toddler among the Bedouin Arabs know; that Allaah is in the heaven and cannot be seen, and that the Arabs had never thought Him to be an idol, but your Will Durant said otherwise. He must be a fool. Well tell us who said he ‘was the greatest’ historian so that we would see how foolish that person is also. It must be your imagination!

That some idols were called al-Uzza, al-Lat and al-Manaat, and that the Arabs say they are ‘daughters of Allaah’ is a phenomenon well-known, that is, that they said that. And Allaah had repeatedly faulted that in the Qur’aan. See this, and please read it carefully:

“Have You Then considered Al-Lât, and Al-'Uzza
And Manât (another idol of the pagan Arabs), the other third?
Is it for You the males and for Him the females?
That indeed is a division Most unfair!
They are but names which You have named, You and Your fathers, for which Allâh has sent down no authority. they follow but a guess and that which they themselves desire, whereas there has surely come to them the guidance from their Lord!”

So it is glaring from the above that the idols were conjectures of the pagan Arabs.

Part Two:

The Black Stone

“The Kaaba still stands, without its idols, but with the Black Stone, ”

You mean to say the Black Stone is Allaah. You should have said that openly, I think you should not be afraid any longer you have said what is worse. I only fear for you.

Well as for the Black Stone, I know for sure you will wonder what I will say as regard it. Well it is a matter well settled in Islâm. The Hajj rites which include pointing to or kissing the Black Stone were handed down by Ibrahim (Abraham). That is why the Arabs even before the Prophet had been going on pilgrimage to Makkah why? Because their fore-fathers on top of which was Ibrahim and Ishaaq had been doing so, but the pagan Arabs had innovated a lot of things which included their bringing to the Ka’bah those numerous idols, and their act of going round the Ka’bah naked while they clap their hands! All those, the Prophet stopped, and upon guidance through revelation, he retained the rites that were handed down by Ibrahim.

The Black Stone, the Prophet had said, was from the paradise, this may be hard for you to believe, but that was what our Prophet said:

“The Black Stone came down from Paradise and it was whiter than milk, but the sins of the sons of Adam turned it black.” Narrated by al-Tirmidhi (877).
Al-Tirmidhi said: It is a saheeh hasan hadeeth. It was classed as saheeh by Ibn Khuzaymah (4/219) and by al-Diya’ al-Maqdisi in al-Mukhtaarah (10/260). It was classed as hasan by Ibn al-Qattaan in Bayaan al-Wahm wa’l-Ayhaam (5/732), al-Haafiz Ibn Hajar in Fath al-Baari (3/540) and al-Albaani in al-Silsilah al-Saheehah (2618).
It was also narrated from Ibn ‘Abbaas, Ibn ‘Amr and others, see Musannaf Ibn Abi Shaybah (4/35); and from Anas (may Allaah be pleased with him) in Musnad Ahmad (3/277).

So what is glaring from the above was that the Black Stone was actually a White Stone, it turned black over the centuries as a result of the hands of sins that toughed it, and that was even before Islâm began to rule Makkah.

The statement of the prophet above is a clear one, if there was another thing to it, the Arabs would have said it. And if the Black Stone had actually represented Allaah, the Arabs would have said it, they knew it had been since the time of Ibrahim.

So it is recommended for whoever goes on hajj to kiss it, as did Ibrahim and Prophet Muhammad (and as attested to by the Arabs), not that his kissing it mean he is worshiping it but to emulate the prophets of Allaah whom it had been made permissible for to kiss, and because the Stone is from Paradise.

Nezan, if you are sure a thing comes from Paradise won’t you like to touch it even to kiss it. Does your touching or kissing it mean the you are worshipping it?

For more on hajj rites see this link:

http://www.islam-qa.com/en/ref/30897

“You say "Islam is the religion of Adam, Noah, Abraham, Moses, Jesus, ”

But Islam does say there was no Prophet of Allaah except that He performed the pilgrimage in Makkah, but you may not know. For instance our Prophet went and prayed in the mosque at Jerusalem miraculously!

“ The only people who journeyed to the Kaaba and kissed the Black Stone, ”

I think I have cleared that.


“ You ask me to explain, "The God of the Bible is love, an impossibility for Allah, ”

But God in the Bible commanded the Jews to kill their enemies, and He made many of the Prophets like David to fight wars.

Till eternity, Christian will not be able to explain how 1+1+1=3. Even a computer programme cannot solve it.

“While the Jews know that Allah is not Jehovah, they try to say (as Muslims do for Allah) that Jehovah is a single being, ”

This has been answered by me earlier on.

“The famous shema (Dt 6:4), the most fundamental saying about God for a Jew, declares, "Hear, O Israel: Jehovah our Elohim is one Jehovah." ,

When a husband and his wife become one, do they have one soul, one thinking, one mannerism, etc.? So can God, Jesus and Holy Ghost be one that way? What if Mary, Mother of God (as John Paul) wanted the Christians to include her, is added? Still one soul? You must author a book O.


“The Bible teaches that God's very essence is love and says, "God is love" , ”

So if God’s love is absolute, that is, without demarcation, why will He throw some of His Loved ones into fire?

“The first of the Ten Commandments is that we are to love the God of the Bible with our whole heart; but never does the Koran say a Muslim is to love Allah, ”

You talk as if you know the Qur’aan, ‘Sue’ then what is the meaning of this:

“And of mankind are some who take (for worship) others besides Allâh as rivals (to Allâh). they love them as they love Allâh. but those who believe, love Allâh more (than anything else). if only, those who do wrong could see, when they will see the torment, that All power belongs to Allâh and that Allâh is Severe In punishment.”

And you say Allaah cannot be loved.

So that verse of the Bible said Jesus was sent by God, and you say he is God!

So you have seen (known) God before?

See Islâm says Allaah is closer to us His slaves very much:

“And when My slaves ask You (O Muhammad ) concerning Me, Then (answer them), I am indeed near (to them by My Knowledge). I respond to the invocations of the supplicant when He calls on Me (without any mediator or intercessor). so let them obey Me and believe In Me, so that they may be led aright.” [Baqarah: 186].

“The Bible is filled with prophecies of the coming of Messiah Jesus, but there is not one such prophecy in the Koran for Jesus or Muhammad, ”

Do you know what you are saying at all, you want the Qur’aan to give the prophesy of Muhammad. To whom was it revealed? Did Jesus prophesize his coming as Jesus in the New Testament.

If you will open your heart very well you will see that Deut. 18: 18 fits Muhammad than any other person.

Allaah did not need somebody’s blood before He would forgive His slaves of their sins, He is not a blood-sucker. Man just needs to turn in penitence to him and that is all.

He said:

“Say: "O 'Ibâdî (My slaves) who have transgressed against themselves (by committing evil deeds and sins)! Despair not of the Mercy of Allâh, Verily Allâh forgives All sins. Truly, He is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful.

"And turn In repentance and In obedience with true faith (Islâmic Monotheism) to Your Lord and submit to him, (in Islâm), before the torment comes upon you, Then You will not be helped.” [Q39: 63-64]

But He warned in some places in the Qur’aan that he would not forgive whoever ascribes partners unto Him, like the Christians saying Jesus is God.

“How does Allah save sinners? It would be unjust to forgive the guilty without the penalty being paid, ”

But you must know that you are being greatly unjust for still ascribing partners unto God, partners that Abraham did not know neither Moses nor other Prophet, even John the Baptist never venerated Jesus. So the assurance you are giving yourself, you will find out that it will fail you if you do not do the will of God as it is in Islam.

I am very sorry for you Nezan if you are heedless.

Anyway, by now you should have come to realize it that you made blunder by following Will Durant or GJO Morshay in saying Allaah was an idol in Makkah.

I still hope to see your hand, no pretense O.

I have posted this since yesterday but I came to realise that it was not showing probably because of its length, hence I have decided to remove some of Nezan’s writing, just an introduction to each paragraph. And I have divided into two.

[And still after reposting it i saw that the Part One did not appear so I have broken into two again]

Let’s go:

“The biblical God is called Yahweh (or Jehovah) nearly 9,000 times, ”

If the biblical God is called Yahweh (or Jehovah) must the Qur’an call Him so? Don’t you see that the Qur’aan was revealed in Arabic. And if that is the standard, then all who call Yahweh in other names like ‘God,’ ‘Olohun,’ ‘Chukwu,’ ‘Ubangiji’ are wrong because they do not call Him Yahweh.

The same explanation goes for Elohim; Muslims do not dispute the fact that God can be called any other name if that is what the people know Him to be, but we say the name of God in the Arabic Language is Allaah. So if Allaah is an idol (I seek refuge in Allaah from that), then tell us what name the Arabs give to God. Simple.

There is no special thing in God being called ‘God of Abraham’ or ‘God of Isaac’ nobody except a fool will say God is not his God. And the Qur’aan does bear a semblance of that, since you insist. So see Q2: 136 below:

“Say (O Muslims), "We believe In Allâh and that which has been sent down to us and that which has been sent down to Ibrâhim (Abraham), Ismâ'il (Ishmael), Ishâque (Isaac), Ya'qûb (Jacob), and to Al-Asbât [the twelve sons of Ya'qûb (Jacob)], and that which has been given to Mûsa (Moses) and 'Iesa (Jesus), and that which has been given to the Prophets from their Lord. We make no distinction between any of them, and to Him we have submitted (in Islâm)."

An implicit message in the above is that it was Allaah Who sent all those so He was their God. Are you now satisfied?

“ The God of the Bible revealed himself to Moses at the burning bush, ”

I have answered part of what you raised above in the last paragraph, it is immaterial that God is known with many Names but what is important is that it is only this God that should be worshipped.

The phrase ‘God of Israel’ is often used to prove the supremacy of the Jewish race over all other races, and many Christians like Nezan here, subscribe to this thought, and this often makes the race to be immaculate such that it can never be accused of doing what is wrong. It is funny that Christians say that whoever does not believe in the death of Jesus Christ on the cross will dwell forever in hell but will not include the Jews who ‘killed’ Jesus and who still call him an impostor till these days, the Christians will not condemn the Jews because they ‘are chosen of God.’

Islam does not subscribe to that – the Jews are like normal human beings, they do not have any superiority over the non-Jews. So also the Arabs, they have no superiority, Islam has said superiority is an individual affair, and that will be base on one’s piety. See Q49: 13 below:

“O mankind! we have created You from a male and a female, and made You into nations and tribes, that You may know one another. Verily, the Most honourable of You with Allâh is that (believer) who has At-Taqwa [i.e. one of the Muttaqûn (pious - see V.2:2). Verily, Allâh is All-Knowing, All-Aware.”

And the prophet of Islam has declared that ‘there is no superiority of the Arabs on the non-Arabs, superiority is only by piety of Allaah.’

It is true that the Qur’aan says the Jews were once a favoured nation when they were of God but after their proven rebellion (even when Moses was alive) by their refusal to accept Muhammad as the Prophet of Allaah (and their refusal to accept Jesus Christ), Allaah withdrew His favour from them and gave to whom? The Arabs? No, the Muslims.

See this:

“O Children of Israel! Remember My Favour which I bestowed upon you, and fulfil (your obligations to) My Covenant (with you) so that I fulfil (My obligations to) Your Covenant (with Me), and fear none but Me.

And believe In what I have sent down (this Qur'ân), confirming that which is with you, [the Taurât (Torah) and the Injeel (Gospel)], and be not the first to disbelieve therein, and buy not with My Verses [the Taurât (Torah) and the Injeel (Gospel)] a small price (i.e. getting a small gain by selling My Verses), and fear Me and Me Alone.

And mix not Truth with falsehood, nor conceal the Truth [i.e. Muhammad Sal-Allaahu 'alayhe Wa Sallam is Allâh's Messenger and his qualities are written In Your Scriptures, the Taurât (Torah) and the Injeel (Gospel)] while You know (the truth).” [Q2: 40-42].

If you think that the description above does not fit the Jew, then check your record.

Mind you the Qur’aan is replete with the description of the Jews (their treachery, folly, rebellion, etc.), what I have brought is just a tip of an iceberg.

To say Qur’an does not make a mention of Isaac is but a fallacy of the highest order, the verse above has partly debunked that. Now see these others:

“Salâmun (peace) be upon Ibrâhim (Abraham)!"
Thus indeed do we reward the Muhsinûn Verily, He was one of Our believing slaves.
And we gave Him the glad tidings of Ishâque (Isaac) a Prophet from the righteous.
We blessed Him and Ishâque (Isaac), and of their progeny are (some) that do right, and some that plainly wrong themselves.” [Q37: 109-113].

Yet another:

“And Remember Our slaves, Ibrâhim (Abraham), Ishâque (Isaac), and Ya'qûb (Jacob), (all) owners of strength (in worshipping Us) and (also) of religious understanding.
Verily, we did choose them by granting them (a good thing, i.e.) the remembrance of the home [in the Hereafter and they used to make the people Remember it, and also they used to invite the people to obey Allâh and to do good deeds for the Hereafter].
And they are with us, Verily, of the chosen and the best!” [Q38: 45-47].

Will you still say Isaac was not given any prominence in the Qur’aan?

And you said God’s Covenant was with Isaac, so God had no plan for Ishmael. Didn’t He say He would make him a great nation? Didn’t He say the Jews will be jealous of his nation? So God do not have covenant with other Prophets too?



“ In your Koran, as you must know, Allah commands Muslims, "Take not the Jews and Christians as friends, ”

Qur’aan warns the Muslims about the Christians and the Jews because Allaah knew that because of the revelation the Muslims had received, that would cause enmity from the Christians and the Jews towards the Muslims and they would want that the Muslims had not received that. And that is what is practically happening; the Jews and Christians do not want to fathom the fact that their salvation lies in accepting what Allaah has revealed to Muhammad.

See this:

‘Neither those who disbelieve among the people of the Scripture (Jews and Christians) nor Al-Mushrikûn (the disbelievers In the Oneness of Allâh, idolaters, polytheists, pagans, etc.) like that there should be sent down unto You any good from Your Lord. But Allâh chooses for his Mercy whom He wills. and Allâh is the Owner of great Bounty.” [Q2: 105]

So that is the cause of the enmity from the People of the Book to the Muslims.

Allaah says further:

“Never will the Jews nor the Christians be pleased with You (O Muhammad and Muslims) till You follow their religion. say: "Verily, the guidance of Allâh (i.e. Islâmic Monotheism) that is the (only) Guidance.” [Q2: 120]

Maybe Nezan will say the above is not true.

So because of that Islam says the Jews and the Christians are enemies of Islam so Muslims should be wary of them. Period.

“The God of the Bible chose Jerusalem as His holy city, ”

That the Qur’aan does not mention Jerusalem shows how far you are from the basic Islamic learning. Every Muslim knows from childhood that Jerusalem is important to the Muslims because of its housing the third holiest mosque which the Muslims still pray in today. [And you should know that Jerusalem bears more semblance for Islam today than any other religion, ask the JP’s who are sincere enough to say the truth.]

And there is no disputing the fact that the reference to the ‘farthest mosque’ in the verse below is but the mosque which the Muslims pray in today in Jerusalem.

Glorified (and Exalted) be He (Allâh) Who took his slave (Muhammad) for a journey by night from Al-Masjid-al-Harâm (at Makkah) to the farthest mosque (in Jerusalem), the neighbourhood whereof we have blessed, In order that we might show Him (Muhammad) of Our Ayât (proofs, evidences, lessons, signs, etc.). Verily, He is the All-Hearer, the All-Seer.

There are lot of narrations from the Prophet saying the mosque in Jerusalem is as important to the Muslims as the One at Ka’bah and Madinah.

If not the Balfour Declaration which gave Israel to the Jews (and eventually Jerusalem), the present location of Israel and Jerusalem had been under the control of the Muslims for centuries. Ask yourselves, who are now in the biblical cities, Damascus, etc, the Muslims of course, how? The glory of Islam. (And it is a matter of time that Jerusalem will come back to the Muslims fully, that when the Arabs stop fighting in the name of Arab nationalism but in the name of Islam.)

“That Allah has no son is further proof that He is not the God of the Bible, ”

Are you then saying a good God must have sons? Let me share a story with you of our past Muslim scholars: This Muslim scholar was invited to the court of a Roman king who used to have the pope in his court too. By practice, the King would come before the Pope, and when the Pope arrives everybody including the King would pay him homage. So iy happened that when this Muslim scholar was in the court of this King and the pope arrived, everybody paid him homage except this Muslim scholar. He was asked why, he said he wanted to make his own greeting to the Pope special, so he went to the Pope greeted him and asked him ‘How are your sons and daughters?’ Everybody in the hall including the Pope was embarrassed because of what the Muslim scholar had said. How dare he asked of the Pope’s sons and daughters while it is known that Pope does not give birth. The Muslim scholar (our scholars have always been sharp) then lampooned everybody in the hall that if it would sound insulting to the pope to have sons, then what about the God of Pope? The Muslim scholar was to stay for some days in the country but he was made to leave immediately because his continuous stay in the place ‘was dangerous.’

So do you still say a good God should have sons, Nezan?


Please can you explain how the throne of David (father of God-Jesus) was given to Jesus?


“ Muslims insist that the name " Allah" must be used in every language…”


This is where you actually addressed the issue at hand. Muslims prefer that God should be called Allaah because that is what He says His Name is in the Final Revelation. This does not mean Allaah cannot be called in other names that people call God. But it is better that Muslims call Him Allaah because some other names God is called might have one form of corruption or the other. For instance the word ‘God’ is somehow ambiguous. When you hear ‘God’ or ‘god’ how do you differentiate that? One can easily slip into error, so this is why Muslims feel safe calling God Allaah often.

Yes the Arabs used to worship more than 360 idols before Prophet Muhammad stop that. Allaah was never part of those idols otherwise the Arabs would have got a stataue for him as they did for other gods. Why? Because they knew He was a Supreme Being that cannot be seen. In fact just like the Jews, they had demanded from the Prophet that they liked to see Allaah:

“And those who expect not for a Meeting with us (i.e. those who deny the Day of Resurrection and the life of the Hereafter), say: "Why are not the angels sent down to us, or why do we not see Our Lord?" indeed they think too highly of themselves, and are scornful with great pride.” [Q25: 21].

So if Allah were an idol (I seek refuge in Him from that), they would not have asked the Prophet to let them see Him.

To say that Allah is an idol, that is a documented history, shows another aspect of your referencing history. You yourself know within your heart that you have told a BIG LIE. Where is it documented O Nezan that Allaah is a chief idol? Bring it or else, as usual, you are a [finish it yourself, so that you will not say I am abusing you.]

And did that your phantom ‘greatest historian’ say Allaah was an idol?

As for the origin of the Ka’bah and the Hajj, I think I have addressed that in the answer I gave to Kola Oloye in ‘Ask Me About Islam’ so go back and read it.

“ Within the Kaaba, in pre-Moslem days, were several idols representing gods. One was called Allah, three others were Allah's daughters, al-Uzza, al-Lat, and Manah, (Will Durant, "The Story of Civilization," IV: 160-61).”

So Will Durant was that ‘greatest historian’ who told you that Allaah was the chief idol of the Makkans. See what I have been telling you that the historians that you in particular quote are fools. A fact that a toddler among the Bedouin Arabs know; that Allaah is in the heaven and cannot be seen, and that the Arabs had never thought Him to be an idol, but your Will Durant said otherwise. He must be a fool. Well tell us who said he ‘was the greatest’ historian so that we would see how foolish that person is also. It must be your imagination!

That some idols were called al-Uzza, al-Lat and al-Manaat, and that the Arabs say they are ‘daughters of Allaah’ is a phenomenon well-known, that is, that they said that. And Allaah had repeatedly faulted that in the Qur’aan. See this, and please read it carefully:

“Have You Then considered Al-Lât, and Al-'Uzza
And Manât (another idol of the pagan Arabs), the other third?
Is it for You the males and for Him the females?
That indeed is a division Most unfair!
They are but names which You have named, You and Your fathers, for which Allâh has sent down no authority. they follow but a guess and that which they themselves desire, whereas there has surely come to them the guidance from their Lord!”

So it is glaring from the above that the idols were conjectures of the pagan Arabs.

Corrigendum

“That is why the Arabs even before the Prophet had been going on pilgrimage to Makkah why? Because their fore-fathers on top of which was Ibrahim and Ishaaq had been doing so, but the pagan Arabs had innovated a lot of things which included their bringing to the Ka’bah those numerous idols”

The phrase ‘Ibrahim and Ishaaq’ is supposed to read ‘Ibrahim and Ismail.’ It was a slip of hand.

As for what you have posted on this thread, though you have stylishly said you will not go further, I can see that as a trick from you, as Muhsin has said in the other thread, I will answer you (Insha Allaah) and i pray you do not stylishly run away crying foul.

Watch out.

How long will it take you to compile your answers?

shakerz is still peddling the discredited Mythra myths? What do you expect from a muslim anyway?

^^^^^^^^^^^
He probably might have read about it for the first time.

@Davidylan: « #26 on: Today at 05:18:36 PM »

shakerz is still peddling the discredited Mythra myths? What do you expect from a muslim anyway?

discreditted? a single doubt is enough to poke fun at the myth of your human godship. david, listen, what they guy has to do is what the lawyer who found OJ Simpson coperable about the slaughter of two people, though he was found to be aquitted in criminal court, but its a different result in civil.

let me show you; the crminal court not guilty pronouncement is similar to the glossy first glance of your human god and only he is the savior motifs.

the reality is the civil case where the proof proves that OJ was a killer, similar to the humanness of Jesus to show that he was simply a human being who is empowered by God with miracles, just like Moses was, and not God, the Reality of realities!

I shall ignore Nezan here because he is not making any tangible contribution.

Allah is NOT the God of Israel, but the PERSONAL NAME of the 'divine spirit' that according to the beliefs of the pagan Arabs,RESIDED in the Black Stone meteorite - embedded in the wall of the Ka'ba - that was VENERATED by the pagan Arabians long before Muhammad and his Quran.

Allah is an Arabian idol.

ALLAH IN THE BIBLE

(my comment:this article proves that Allah is the name for the divine Supreme Being and has its roots in the semitic languages of arabic,hebrew and aramaic.the author goes on to prove that Allah is the name of God and argues against bible thumpers such as the Jehovah's Witnesses on why God should not be called "Jehovah".i started with chapter 4 since it is relevant to the discussion.you can reading the previous chapters in the website provided below)

The suffix "IM" of the word "ELOHIM" is a plural of respect in Hebrew.

(Remember that in Arabic and Hebrew there are two types of plurals. One of numbers and the other of honour as in Royal proclamations. Since the plural of honour is uncommon in the language of the European, he has confused these plurals to connote a plurality in the "godhead," hence his justification for his Doctrine of the Holy Trinity - the Father, Son and Holy Ghost).

Hence ELOHIM = ELOH + IM. Now I want you to perform an exercise. Do you see the words: YA-HUWA ELOH-IM? Place your left hand index finger on the first two letters "YA" meaning oh! and the other index finger on the "IM" a plural of respect. What you now have remaining in Huwa Eloh or Huwa Elah. El in Hebrew means god, and Elah or Eloh also stands for the same name - god. Therefore, "Huwa el Elah" or HUWA 'L LAH, which is identical to the Quranic expression - Huwal lah hu (meaning: HE IS ALLAH) of the verse QUL HUWAL LAH HU AHUD


http://www.jamaat.net/name/name4.html

Alien people even know that Allah is the supreme being! If u no work to do, go to church and pay ur tithe. that shining man is ever waiting for u. Someone may wish to know my religion. It is d religion of d alien guy. Back to milky!