http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1242076/Cameron-Ill-cut-immigration-75-cent.html

Immigration would be cut by as much as 75 per cent under a Conservative government to prevent Britain's population hitting 70million, David Cameron said today.

He said he wanted to see annual net immigration levels fall from the 200,000 figure of recent years to the 'tens of thousands' seen under the Thatcher and Major governments.

Reducing levels to those of the 1990s would mean around 50,000 immigrants a year would be allowed to settle in Britain, a fall of three-quarters on numbers seen under Labour.

Mr Cameron made the pledge in a wide-ranging interview in which he underlined Tory plans to cut the £178billion budget deficit further and faster than Labour.

Economists agreed that plugging the black hole in the public finances was a key part of 'getting the economy to grow', he said.

He also said he wanted to 'pull back' the state from many areas of people's lives, but insisted there would be no return to the 'old Tories of the 1980s'.

On immigration, Mr Cameron said he was focused on the pressure on public services, including health, education and housing, created by the new arrivals.

Last week a coalition of MPs and public figures, including former Archbishop of Canterbury Lord Carey, demanded the population be kept under 70million - or else risk public disharmony. The Office for National Statistics says it expects it to hit
71.6million in 2033.


Mr Cameron said a Tory administration would set an annual migration cap, determined each year depending on the needs of the economy. 'I don't support our population going to 70million,' he said.

He said that in the past ten years net migration - the difference between the numbers leaving and arriving - had been around 200,000 a year. He wanted to return the figure to what it was in the early 1990s under the last Tory government - in the tens of thousands.

Election fever: David Cameron, seen here with Andrew Marr and DJ Chris Evans, also pledged to start reducing the budget deficit sooner than Labour

'We've benefited from immigration, but I think the pressures - particularly on our public services - have been very great,' he added.
Mr Cameron highlighted proposals to close dangerous loopholes in the student visa system that have let almost 1.5million into the country unchecked.

The Tories would require foreign students to pay a deposit of up to £6,000 that is repaid only when they return home, clamp down on bogus colleges and ban people switching between student and work visas.

A Tory government is pledged to set limits on economic migration from outside the EU 'substantially lower' than the current rate, set up a border police force with powers to track down and remove illegal migrants, and impose transitional controls on the right of nationals of the new EU member states to work in the UK.


Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1242076/Cameron-Ill-cut-immigration-75-cent.html#ixzz0cFEGVGSM

NordicRace:


The Tories would require foreign students to pay a deposit of up to £6,000 that is repaid only when they return home, clamp down on bogus colleges and ban people switching between student and work visas.

A Tory government is pledged to set limits on economic migration from outside the EU 'substantially lower' than the current rate, set up a border police force with powers to track down and remove illegal migrants, and impose transitional controls on the right of nationals of the new EU member states to work in the UK.

jokers

No, I think you will find they are quite serious. And there are more than enough students who will pay a £6000 deposit.

NordicRace:

No, I think you will find they are quite serious. And there are more than enough students who will pay a £6000 deposit.

Okay. as long as they pay an interest added to the 6,000 quid when they are refunding the deposit.

yeye people. so 6,000 pounds plus an added 10,000 pounds (average school fees) plus 5,400 maintenancefunds (outside London) and 7,200 pounds (within London)

they have not learnt from the muttalab case. prolly when they start having graduates from pprestigious schools like oxford and imperial turning into suicide bombers , they will shift emphasis from the ''money'' they think they are churning out from foreign students.

Okay. as long as they pay an interest added to the 6,000 quid when they are refunding the deposit

Dont thinkso, students dont pay tax when they study or work in the UK. And they are free to use our resources, so we owe them nothing.

NordicRace:

Okay. as long as they pay an interest added to the 6,000 quid when they are refunding the deposit

Dont thinkso, students dont pay tax when they study or work in the UK. And they are free to use our resources, so we owe them nothing.

pele oh.
UK tax payer.

shior !

i see that you are in support of the 6000 quid. i no get time to 'yeye' you today.
i have work to do.

pele oh.
UK tax payer.

shior !

i see that you are in support of the 6000 quid. i no get time to 'yeye' you today.
i have work to do.


Can you repeat this in proper English. I don't understand backwards nigerian gutter talk ?

NordicRace:

pele oh.
UK tax payer.

shior !

i see that you are in support of the 6000 quid. i no get time to 'yeye' you today.
i have work to do.


an you repeat this in proper English. I don't understand backwards nigerian gutter talk ?

hissss !!!!!!

olodo rabata 

Immigration needs to be cut, and will cut itself in some respects as economic growth struggles along in the UK.

Immigration controls inevitably need to be tightened in order to maintain a reasonable standard of living in the UK. This is both beneficial to would be immigrants and the UK population - no one wants to eemigrate to a country with poorly functioning services and as a result these changes have to be made.

Whether putting a specific percentage to cut immigration makes sense is another issue altogether.

Majority of the people entering the UK under the PBS are students, who later on try to get work permits and thus stay on permanently in the UK. A lot of these people will still be willing to stay in the country and pay the £6,000 pounds in the hope of future earnings.

Merely charging more money will not stop them, unless the work visa restrictions he mentions will apply to the IGS scheme for people already studying in the UK. If that happens, the allure to come to the UK might well be reduced

What needs to happen is for there to be a firm track on students entering and leaving the country, with very stringent scrutiny during renewal of study visas and the eradication of bogus colleges. The government needs to be able to know when someone comes in and when he/she leaves or is supposed to leave.

In addition, a solution to the problem with travel documents for those who destroy their passports must be found. I would advocate every person coming in be made to submit an emergency travel certificate valid for 5 years from date of entry. That way if the person is caught, you can deport easily without waiting for the embassies to issue the documents.

Every person who illegally stays in the UK is inevitably taking the place of a legitimate, deserving immigrant who will obey the rules and contribute usefully to society.

@ NordicRace. Ibu onye ara.

@ NordicRace. Ibu onye ara.

I dont speak Nigerian, or whatever that is.

Majority of the people entering the UK under the PBS are students, who later on try to get work permits and thus stay on permanently in the UK. A lot of these people will still be willing to stay in the country and pay the £6,000 pounds in the hope of future earnings.

The Conservatives are planning to ban students from switching to work permits after they finish their degree courses.

NordicRace:

The Conservatives are planning to ban students from switching to work permits after they finish their degree courses.

Really? That will be interesting. How will the 'high flying' candidates that the UK want to retain be selected?

The link in my view is a little to easy at the moment to transit and the bar must be raised if the level of students remaining in the UK is to be curbed.

To completely remove that link will create issues, especially for employers who often want to pick the best graduates from UK universities irrespective of nationality or visa status.

NordicRace:

The Conservatives are planning to ban students from switching to work permits after they finish their degree courses.

The US has something similar except they have a quota (45,000 per year) of aliens who can receive work permits. There are no quotas though for those who choose to work in non-profit organisations.

To completely remove that link will create issues, especially for employers who often want to pick the best graduates from UK universities irrespective of nationality or visa status.

The best candidates will still be free to apply outside the UK with the appropriate qualifications.

NordicRace:


The best candidates will still be free to apply outside the UK with the appropriate qualifications.

That will might not work for the UK - if they are indeed the best candidates then they will likely be internationally mobile and will be taken up by other employers outside the UK. The reasoning is that you retain the best candidates, not train them and let others pick the best leaving the slim pickings behind.

A better approach would be the quota style system operated by the US, not the current financial requirement which simply gives people a guaranteed 2 year stay after graduation.

The current system allows students to stay on irrespective of whether their skills are needed by the UK or if they would be taking up employment spaces that would otherwise have gone to UK/EU citizens. Many who stay on just find ways to cheat the system till they achieve settlement.

More important for me is border control - there simply must be a better way to determine if people have left the country or not, and if not to remove them promptly.

This is the reason David Cameron and his party will not win the election.

How is this realistic?

Is he saying he is going to risk losing approximately £8billlion by sending students back immediately after they finish University?

Furthermore, i don't see him putting a cap on tourists, people getting married to UK citizens or people who are due to become citizens by virtue of time spent in the UK ??etc etc.

The real cut as I see it will come from work permits.
Even this has its own problems.

OMO IBO:

This is the reason David Cameron and his party will not win the election.

How is this realistic?

Is he saying he is going to risk losing approximately £8billlion by sending students back immediately after they finish University?

How is he risking 8billion? Is the US risking 8billion because it caps the number of work visas it issues yearly?

Furthermore, i don't see him putting a cap on tourists, people getting married to UK citizens or people who are due to become citizens by virtue of time spent in the UK ??etc etc.

That number is very small - the largest increases are from student visas, who then stay on and get work permits under the IGS. This near-automatic link must be broken if you want to encourage more people to return to their home countries after school.

The real cut as I see it will come from work permits.
Even this has its own problems.

Not really, it will have to be based on a quota system, and likely only for those with a job offer already in hand. In a recession, it is foolish for any government to continuously allow more people to stay in the country thereby providing additional competition for the very few available jobs. In that regard, the system MUST be tightened up.

What this will do is prevent the abuses, such as one company alone bringing over 1,000 people from India all in the name of work permits. Companies will have to be very careful in using the available quota.

This is all hot air, election is just around the corner, so this kind of spin is expected, immigration illegal or not keeps this country going. Govt is cuting funding for education, Universities and colleges rely on foreign students to keep going.

Home students pay nothing, they get loans which they hardly pay back after graduating. I repeat hot air!!!

^^^
EXACTUM!

justwise:

This is all hot air, election is just around the corner, so this kind of spin is expected, immigration illegal or not keeps this country going. Govt is cuting funding for education, Universities and colleges rely on foreign students to keep going.

This comment is bandied around loosely and is not quite substantiated. Most of the Chinese students return to China and they are the highest supplier of foreign students - they won't stop coming even if 6,000 extra is levied. The fact is that an alarming number of students come in and go to 'colleges' which serve primarily immigrants and few UK citizens. . . often awarding sham degrees and then allowing the 'graduates' to merge into the population. These institutions must be clamped down on and eliminated - they give genuine students a very hard time.

Home students pay nothing, they get loans which they hardly pay back after graduating. I repeat hot air!!!

They pay fees and not everyone is on loans. If the number of foreign students drops slightly, it also reduces the amount of funding required to fund the urgently required additional university places that the government cannot afford to fund.

There is a greater cost to the UK government in terms of unemployment benefits that must be paid to locals as a result of undue competition with immigrants in certain aspects of the labour market, especially the lower rungs - both from students taking part time jobs and those who continue to do these low paying jobs after they've obtained their IGS, hoping for better jobs.

Immigration is going to be one of the major issues at this election and even Labour is trying to tighten up the requirements. You will definitely see further tightening by Cameron if he wins - it's definitely more than hot air.

UK is a welfare state, alot of UK citizens are quite happy to live on benefit than getting employed. It pays more to be on benefit than doing 9-5, the more babies u make the more money u claim. Uk got high number of pensioners and many youths are work-shy, even with loans doing a degree is not attractive to them. Tell me who is going to work and pay into the system?

NHS is full of foreign doctors who works so hard and contribute to the system, they hardly call sick every friday and monday like some british workers does, they hardly go out on wkends and get wasted, waste police and ambulance time, who is going to work and feed the work-shy, If the immigrant. . illegal or not down tools for a day, just a day the UK will come to stand-still.

Uk has alway reply in immigration for those unskilled jobs cos its poorly paid job, british citizens want jobs that pay living-wage.

Immigration issue is always the target for any political party but when they get elected its busines as usual.
If they want to cut any form of immigration then asylum seekers need to be checked, they don't work but they use the system.

Debosky, is it me or are you increasingly pugnacious??

Anyways:

On average, international students paid £6,868 in tuition fees and £187.57 a week in living costs. Hepi estimates that international students "injected" £2.35bn into the UK in 2004-05.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/education/2007/jul/12/highereducation.uk

The Home Office said yesterday that international students boosted the economy by almost £8.5bn a year.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/overseas-students-boost-uk-economy-by-pound8bn-a-year-400587.html. This was reported in 2007

As you can see, there is a significant increase between 2004-2005 to  2007.

UK is a welfare state, alot of UK citizens are quite happy to live on benefit than getting employed

The UK is not a welfare state, before the reccession britain had the lowest unemployment rate in the world and the longest working hours in the developed world.


Nigeria has one of the largest unemployed workforces in the world. Look at your own figures and then tell me who the real welfare state.

NHS is full of foreign doctors who works so hard and contribute to the system

Foregin staff make up only 3% of the NHS workforce, look up at the home office statistics.


Uk has alway reply in immigration for those unskilled jobs cos its poorly paid job, british citizens want jobs that pay living-wage

Britain has a  minimum wage, therefore ALL jobs pay a living wage you african slowpoke.
Your argument is complete hearsay, none of it is valid and you cite no sources for your pathetic, misconcepted arguments.

Home students pay nothing, they get loans which they hardly pay back after graduating. I repeat hot air!!!
So please get a bleeping clue.

1. We pay fees that are subsidized through our own tax you ignorant african.

2. The conservatives are not stopping students coming from outside europe, they are making them pay a huge deposit, that most students will have no probme paying, you dumb african.

This is the reason David Cameron and his party will not win the election.

This is why he WILL win the election. Incase you are to st*pid to notice the Britian people simply do not want you here, the British public are sick of third world immigrants, this is why it is the most important issue in politics. And the conservatives will win the next election according to their progress in the european elections, local elections and opinion polls.

delete

@NordicRace

U said Uk is not a welfare state? DO u know what welfare means?

Britain has a  minimum wage, therefore ALL jobs pay a living wage you african slowpoke.
Your argument is complete hearsay, none of it is valid and you cite no sources for your pathetic, misconcepted arguments.

Have u ever worked b4? so £5.83 is a living wage to u? How many hrs do u need to work to save for mortgage and other bills?
U see this is the problem with these benefit spongers, they can't work, almost unemployable, endless list of criminla record, how then will u know what living wage means. Silly cow, and u are in university?

OMO IBO:

Debosky, is it me or are you increasingly pugnacious??

Anyways:

On average, international students paid £6,868 in tuition fees and £187.57 a week in living costs. Hepi estimates that international students "injected" £2.35bn into the UK in 2004-05.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/education/2007/jul/12/highereducation.uk

The Home Office said yesterday that international students boosted the economy by almost £8.5bn a year.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/overseas-students-boost-uk-economy-by-pound8bn-a-year-400587.html. This was reported in 2007

As you can see, there is a significant increase between 2004-2005 to  2007.

I'm not questioning the contributions, what I am saying is that the changes proposed by the conservatives will not threaten the bulk of that contribution. It's all well and good to talk about 'contributions' - what about the costs of managing the additional immigration pressures? The effects on the NHS, school places, transport systems and others?

justwise:

UK is a welfare state, alot of UK citizens are quite happy to live on benefit than getting employed. It pays more to be on benefit than doing 9-5, the more babies u make the more money u claim. Uk got high number of pensioners and many youths are work-shy, even with loans doing a degree is not attractive to them. Tell me who is going to work and pay into the system?

That is exactly why immigration must be controlled. The Conservatives plan to reduce the benefits payable (especially to those claiming they are unable to work) and thus FORCE people into employment. This will be accompanied by tightening up of the immigration system to allow more of those lower paying jobs to be available.

Besides, immigrants too will get old, and will want pensions someday. It is foolish to think that the UK can import people ad infinitum to meet these needs. There will be a need for structural changes to address those problems, including immigration caps.

In any case, the immigrants are doing mostly lower wage jobs that are taxed at low rates and don't make that much of a contribution to the benefits system, rather, they take a lot out of the system through higher birth rates which use up school and NHS resources.

NHS is full of foreign doctors who works so hard and contribute to the system, they hardly call sick every friday and monday like some british workers does, they hardly go out on wkends and get wasted, waste police and ambulance time, who is going to work and feed the work-shy, If the immigrant. . illegal or not down tools for a day, just a day the UK will come to stand-still.

First of all, it is easy to make sweeping generalisations claiming immigrants work hard and Brits don't, but please show some evidence. Even at that, controlling immigration does not mean kicking out people working hard and contributing to society - it's preventing an undue build up of people in the country and limiting the number of people coming in the future, as well as empowering the British to participate more in their own economy,

Uk has alway reply in immigration for those unskilled jobs cos its poorly paid job, british citizens want jobs that pay living-wage.

With a near endless supply of immigrants you cannot raise wages - by curbing immigration, then wages can begin to rise.

Immigration issue is always the target for any political party but when they get elected its busines as usual.
If they want to cut any form of immigration then asylum seekers need to be checked, they don't work but they use the system.

Asylum users are small in the overall scheme of things, with the overwhelming majority coming from work permits or students transiting into work permits. These legal immigrants bring in family members, start families and have a wider impact on the economy hence the need to curb the near direct link between getting into the UK and staying permanently.

First of all, I think Debosky is right. The UK will have to tighten its rules on immigration in the coming years. It is only natural in a recession for the government and UK citizens to look at immigration as a negative thing. It is cyclical. When jobs, budget and services are cut, immigration becomes a sore thumb and foreigners are not welcome as they are seen as taking jobs and resources.

The link between schooling and getting a 2 year visa PSW (IGS) visa after schooling will be cut, Work permits wont be given to students when they finish their course even if they find a job, Unfortunately, this will have to happen. In a few years time due to the cyclical nature of the global economy, when things pick up, they will "lower the bar" again.


On a final note, I think NordicRace is a little sad as he hangs around Nigerian forums disrespecting "Africans", very sad, get a life! There is nothing you can do about it. As long as there are UK/European citizens working in Africa then Africans will work in Europe. Cause and effect. You colonized Africa, when you leave Africa, we will come over and colonize Europe. It is only fair!

What goes around, comes around!

I don't mind any European who doesn't want immigrants. When they specifically don't want third world immigrants, then I know they are racist (i.e they are happy to have Americans, Australians, New Zealanders, Canadians in their country but not Africans, Indian etc.)

I don't mind any European who doesn't want immigrants. When they specifically don't want third world immigrants, then I know they are racist (i.e they are happy to have Americans, Australians, New Zealanders, Canadians in their country but not Africans, Indian etc.)

Americans, australians, new zealanders etc are white, we want to live with our own people. If you dont like it tough.

second white immigrants do not comitt a massively disproportiante amount of crime white immigrants do not contribute to massive rises in aids levels, white immigrants are not a sexual threat tou our white women.

silentc:


I don't mind any European who doesn't want immigrants. When they specifically don't want third world immigrants, then I know they are racist (i.e they are happy to have Americans, Australians, New Zealanders, Canadians in their country but not Africans, Indian etc.)

I don't think it's a matter of race per se - the immigration potential of the likes of Nigeria, Pakistan, India and China far exceeds anything that could come from the countries you listed. It is only natural that there will be a need for more stringent curbs on the countries I mentioned, just to properly manage the numbers.

There isn't much net migration between the countries you mentioned except maybe from the UK to Australia, so there isn't as much a need to regulate immigration from there as there would be from elsewhere.

PS - I do understand Nordic's primitive motivations, I just want the wider issue to be discussed.

Interesting