According to the stories and hypothesis god allegedly preserved his word through "inspiration" of those that copied and compiled the biblical texts people are made to believe. But Why did god not "inspire" people to preserve god's artifacts since they are equally or more important than mere words and stories men keep telling themselves over and over and over? The real artifacts would be miraculous to behold, being prepared or inspired by god, and the message of seeing them would further Christianity immensely no? If a picture is worth a thousand words, how many words would be worth seeing the original stone tablets that were alleged to be inscribed by god himself? God deemed them important to introduce them to people in stories, but not to inspire to preserve them? The Jews with the help and full support of their all powerful god who can do all things supposedly managed to preserve their verbal histories for thousands of years, yet can't preserve the physical things?

Even timely things like contemporary paintings of Jesus, bust, empty tomb etc would be valuable. Wouldn't that be something. Why did god's message have to be completely verbal?

toneyb:

According to the stories and hypothesis god allegedly preserved his word through "inspiration" of those that copied and compiled the biblical texts people are made to believe. But Why did god not "inspire" people to preserve god's artifacts since they are equally or more important than mere words and stories men keep telling themselves over and over and over? The real artifacts would be miraculous to behold, being prepared or inspired by god, and the message of seeing them would further Christianity immensely no? If a picture is worth a thousand words, how many words would be worth seeing the original stone tablets that were alleged to be inscribed by god himself? God deemed them important to introduce them to people in stories, but not to inspire to preserve them? The Jews with the help and full support of their all powerful god who can do all things supposedly managed to preserve their verbal histories for thousands of years, yet can't preserve the physical things?

Even timely things like contemporary paintings of Jesus, bust, empty tomb etc would be valuable. Wouldn't that be something. Why did god's message have to be completely verbal?

As a man blinded by pride and perishing in sin, you ask your silly questions.
1. No where in the scriptures are these artifacts said to be more important than the Word of God. It is nothing but the suppositions of your heart.
2. Men have always had the tendency to worship artifacts rather than God, a transgression of the commandment. As the Israelites did for the bronze serpent Moses made in the wilderness, which they called Nehushtan and worshiped. (2 Kings 18:4)
3. Could it be that you desire these artifacts so that you will worship a god of your own making?

where are your great grand mothers Aso ebi??

aletheia:

As a man blinded by pride and perishing in sin, you ask your silly questions.

What ever. I am not blinded by no pride or perishing in no mythical religious construct known as sin.

1. No where in the scriptures are these artifacts said to be more important than the Word of God. It is nothing but the suppositions of your heart.

According to the bible the ark of covenant is where Yahweh himself resides in. It was so much powerful that even people that tried to save it from falling down were instantly killed by Yahweh himself. There were other places like the place of the lords presence where Yahweh resided and told all the ancient Jews to and meet him there. Just wandering why Yahweh elevated his status and stopped living inside a box and ascended into heaven. The ark of covenant where Yahweh used to reside in will be a very good artifact no?

2. Men have always had the tendency to worship artifacts rather than God, a transgression of the commandment. As the Israelites did for the bronze serpent Moses made in the wilderness, which they called Nehushtan and worshiped. (2 Kings 18:4)
3. Could it be that you desire these artifacts so that you will worship a god of your own making?

The artifacts are missing because they never existed. The problem is that most Christians hope for the rediscovery of these objects so those of us without faith will finally see the truth Christians even go to extra lengths just to show that their religious beliefs are not based on blind faith alone. The trouble is that when these objects are uncovered, they turn out to be frauds or misleads (Noah's ark in Anatolia, The Shroud of Turin, The tomb of Jesus, The wheels of Pharaohs soldiers that were drowned at sea etc). So many long for these objects to be found to re-enforce their own faith. Is that not why a lot of Christians go to Israel for pilgrimage? To see and re-enforce that beliefs?

toneyb:


The artifacts are missing because they never existed. The problem is that most Christians hope for the rediscovery of these objects so those of us without faith will finally see the truth Christians even go to extra lengths just to show that their religious beliefs are not based on blind faith alone. The trouble is that when these objects are uncovered, they turn out to be frauds or misleads (Noah's ark in Anatolia, The Shroud of Turin, The tomb of Jesus, The wheels of Pharaohs soldiers that were drowned at sea etc). So many long for these objects to be found to re-enforce their own faith. Is that not why a lot of Christians go to Israel for pilgrimage? To see and re-enforce that beliefs?

So they never existed, ehn? Just like the dead sea scrolls never existed, huh? When will you allow that sciences reality today is tomorrow's fallacy. At least, nothing like the dead sea scrolls NEVER EXISTED till they were found. And if the believers seek re-assurance for their belief, are you not so desperately doing same for your religion by coming into the Religion forum to preach your religion? Do your own, bro, and leave us deluded folks to our devices, except if you have proof they do not exist and will NEVER be discovered

nuclearboy:

So they never existed, ehn? Just like the dead sea scrolls never existed, huh? When will you allow that sciences reality today is tomorrow's fallacy. At least, nothing like the dead sea scrolls NEVER EXISTED till they were found. And if the believers seek re-assurance for their belief, are you not so desperately doing same for your religion by coming into the Religion forum to preach your religion? Do your own, bro, and leave us deluded folks to our devices, except if you have proof they do not exist and will NEVER be discovered

Take a chill brother. The dead sea scrolls are words and writings. They are not what I was alluding to. I was referring to artifacts like the ark of covenant, Naoh' ark, The tomb of Jesus, The cross Jesus was crucified on etc. The tablet and wall Yahweh was alleged to have written on(Every believer will like to see how Yahweh's handwriting looks like no?), The are the things I was talking about not some writings.

I once asked my dad where were the remains of his cars he bought&used btw 1950-1980,he couldnt show me,but some of his friends told me he once bought a benz brand new in 1970.The point is this,words were told to me about my dads cars,but i never saw any.It would be unwise for me to say since i never saw any,he never had them.
[toneyb]
Take a chill brother. The dead sea scrolls are words and writings. They are not what I was alluding to. I was referring to artifacts like the ark of covenant, Naoh' ark, The omb of Jesus, The cross Jesus was crucified on etc. The tablet and wall Yahweh was alleged to have written on(Every believer will like to see how Yahweh's handwriting looks like no?), The are the things I was talking about not some writings.
[quote][/quote]

@Toneyb:

I understand, bro and I believe you also get my point. The fact these things have not been found doesn't mean they never existed which was your unapologetic "judgement". Thats why I spoke of those scrolls - imagine someone saying they existed 48 hours before they were found - he'd have been ridiculed plus even the discovery would have become another issue for debate, being supposedly timely for his purposes. We don't know all things and I am really glad to have met people like you (of recent you are changing), MyJoe and the "superb" ganja-man Krayola especially who show us a fairness often that one cannot but admire. You "knowing this" suprised me.

Your intellect is such (in my estimation) that it just seemed so low of you to judge that way knowing what I believe you do.

nuclearboy:

@Toneyb:

I understand, bro and I believe you also get my point. The fact these things have not been found doesn't mean they never existed which was your unapologetic "judgement". Thats why I spoke of those scrolls - imagine someone saying they existed 48 hours before they were found - he'd have been ridiculed plus even the discovery would have become another issue for debate, being supposedly timely for his purposes. We don't know all things and I am really glad to have met people like you (of recent you are changing), MyJoe and the "superb" ganja-man Krayola especially who show us a fairness often that one cannot but admire. You "knowing this" suprised me.

Your intellect is such (in my estimation) that it just seemed so low of you to judge that way knowing what I believe you do.

On a serious note brother, Please don't take some of my banters here seriously and I mean it. I did not expect any Christian in the house to respond to this topic at all and I truly mean it, I posted it only because I saw Jagunlabi, Mudley313, Mazaje and Zodiac on line yesterday and I decided that we should have some fun, I just wanted people like Jagunlabi to come and make me laugh with their short comments. But to my disappointment non of them responded to the topic. I made this topic only because Jagunlabi especially was on line and I wanted him to drop his usual comments because I noticed he likes these type of topics. No need to bother about my banters, this topic was mostly for the atheist here to share a laugh.

The holy grail is somewhere in france and david's stone is somewhere in scotland.

I see. I get your point yet cannot but smile remembering when you said we (religionists) like to play the victim.

It might have been funny (knowing Jagunlabi, it probably would have ended up being so) at our expense but had the shoe been on the other foot, I wonder if you'd have felt the same.

Enjoy easter Bro. Meanwhile, not believing in anything, what do you do at xmas, easter etc? We all know these things have "funny" origins but try to have some fun. What do you do - look for a xtian or two, string them up and burn at a stake or what?  

nuclearboy:

I see. I get your point yet cannot but smile remembering when you said we (religionists) like to play the victim.

It might have been funny (knowing Jagunlabi, it probably would have ended up being so) at our expense but had the shoe been on the other foot, I wonder if you'd have felt the same.

Enjoy easter Bro. Meanwhile, not believing in anything, what do you do at xmas, easter etc? We all know these things have "funny" origins but try to have some fun. What do you do - look for a xtian or two, string them up and burn at a stake or what?  

Roger that brother, No need to worry because my stay here on NL religion section is already at its end. As you have stated I have truly changed, I have noticed it myself. My purpose of coming here like most atheist here have said is just to let Nigerians(Who happen to be the most religious people I know) know that it is VERY OK and normal to be an atheist and that atheist are not the embodiment of lost, greed, pure evil and other vices that they have been made to believe all their lives in most cases. I will come around once in a while but will not be posting much any more. This topic was supposed to be my last laugh before I leave, but unfortunately non of my peeps even bothered to give me my last laugh .

You are one of the peeps here that have earned my highest respect, am not saying it to flatter you at all, I am saying it because it is true. As for easter and X mas I follow what ever it is that is hot and kicking . Cheers.

^^^

Why are all the interesting people leaving? Can you imagine Noah's junior brother Olabowale has disappeared? AbuMighty who needed a bomb between his legs to sport a package there has also vaporized The insanely civil DeepSight has been cannibalized by Viaro and now you too want to leave?

You guys want this place to become a haunt populated by mosquitoes, roaches and their second cousins, the WOF gods? And the people who gave pope john paul the occultic powers he uses or TB Joshua's babalawos? Chei, this forum will soon be renamed Christ embassy

Na wa O.

nuclearboy:

^^^

Why are all the interesting people leaving? Can you imagine Noah's junior brother Olabowale has disappeared? AbuMighty who needed a bomb between his legs to sport a package there has also vaporized The insanely civil DeepSight has been cannibalized by Viaro and now you too want to leave?

You guys want this place to become a haunt populated by mosquitoes, roaches and their second cousins, the WOF gods? And the people who gave pope john paul the occultic powers he uses or TB Joshua's babalawos? Chei, this forum will soon be renamed Christ embassy

Na wa O.

perhaps because we've all exhausted the reasonable topics and all we've got left are just caricatures?

David u re right.I dnt think theres anything new that havent been discussed.
Now is the time for christians to battle it out among themselves on some biblical issues that can over heat this section and make it lively

jesus.:

David u re right.I dnt think theres anything new that havent been discussed.
Now is the time for christians to battle it out among themselves on some biblical issues that can over heat this section&make it lively

which is why i joined the clamor for a christian-only section. There are some interesting topics i have to discuss.

toneyb:

On a serious note brother, Please don't take some of my banters here seriously and I mean it. I did not expect any Christian in the house to respond to this topic at all and I truly mean it, I posted it only because I saw Jagunlabi, Mudley313, Mazaje and Zodiac on line yesterday and I decided that we should have some fun, I just wanted people like Jagunlabi to come and make me laugh with their short comments. But to my disappointment non of them responded to the topic. I made this topic only because Jagunlabi especially was on line and I wanted him to drop his usual comments because I noticed he likes these type of topics. No need to bother about my banters, this topic was mostly for the atheist here to share a laugh.

Sorry to have disappointed you, toneyb.I really don't have anything to say on the topic.

davidylan:

which is why i joined the clamor for a christian-only section. There are some interesting topics i have to discuss.

U could as well post them on this same board. . .will make an interesting discourse.

jesus.:

David u re right.I dnt think theres anything new that havent been discussed.
Now is the time for christians to battle it out among themselves on some biblical issues that can over heat this section&make it lively

Rather, I think that atheists have finally realised that xtians are probably more intelligent and knowledgeable. When I started posting on this board, it was practically an atheist board. . . . .with all manner of innuendos and lies passing out as facts. but as xtians started standing up to them and exposing their ignorance. . . .they started questioning their beliefs and stopped having fun.

where is theoretina or huxley who used to dominate the religion section with his blasphemous posts? where is mazaje, toneyb, tudor, bawomolo, wirinet, KAG, . . . . . ? where are they all? . . , . .u need to see what the religion section homepage looked like some 2 years ago.

I support this call for intra-christian debates. Tithes have been over flogged but I'm sure there are other stuff we can educate ourselves on. I personally keep coming across acolytes who say pastors are too busy to have time to do other work - how come Jesus, Peter and definitely Paul had other "worldly" work yet are the bencchmark for us today.

Can someone start off threads based on such or like "ideas"?

nuclearboy:

I support this call for intra-christian debates. Tithes have been over flogged but I'm sure there are other stuff we can educate ourselves on. I personally keep coming across acolytes who say pastors are too busy to have time to do other work - how come Jesus, Peter and definitely Paul had other "worldly" work yet are the bencchmark for us today.

Can someone start off threads based on such or like "ideas"?

that would make a rich discourse too . . . . .we could even debate about (a) how to walk with God? . . . . (b) the limitations of biblical revelations to our present reality. . .and many more.

Will start off a thread on the founders of Christianity versus its so-called proponents now

I salute all the intelligent christians, who took the fight(of faith) in the midst of adversities.I told my Elder brother earlier today that it seems we already winning the Nl battle gradually.He prayed we overcome in time,to scare off distraction so the debate will be more of intra than inter.U guy really tried.David(defending champ) viaro(awaiting champ)noetic,nuclear,mavenbox,Nezan,Godson&many others.Whats happening now gives me more assurance that we are in the right part&path.We shall be rewarded on earth&in paradise(not with 72virgins) with eternal life&reign with christ forever more(AMEN)

72 Virgins does seem like a good deal sha especially if ogogoro mixed with Schweppes is available.

nuclearboy:

72 Virgins does seem like a good deal sha especially if ogogoro mixed with Schweppes is available.

so soso funny. what kind of a mixture is that?