As it seems today, most of us religious people, often do "GOOD" and are "RIGHTEOUS", either because we want a favour from GOD or we want to make Heaven. This Question comes to my MIND. What if we were told that theres no heaven or hell (pls, take a second to imagine it briefly), that theres no reward for Good or Evil.
WILL WE STILL DO GOOD
WILL WE STILL LOVE OUR NEIGHBOURS AS OURSELVES

Thats not possible jare, y do u allow urself to fink somtin like this?

freeman07:

As it seems today, most of us religious people, often do "GOOD" and are "RIGHTEOUS", either because we want a favour from GOD or we want to make Heaven. This Question comes to my MIND. What if we were told that theres no heaven or hell (pls, take a second to imagine it briefly), that theres no reward for Good or Evil.
WILL WE STILL DO GOOD
WILL WE STILL LOVE OUR NEIGHBOURS AS OURSELVES

It is quite an interesting question (if we grant that there is a heaven and hell) and it quickly generates another, which I have been planning to ask (what an opportunity!). WHAT IS THE MOTIVE FOR A RIGHTEOUS LIFE? Finding the answers to this question will help us answer your questions. But to answer your questions in a few words (while we continue to rub minds),we (believers) will still desire to please God (by keeping His commandments) and in truth , hell doesn’t exist for us and we are not trying to make heaven (we have made heaven!) and are waiting to enter in. Our minds and desires (our hearts) have been changed to desire to please God on our believing and we have been given the Holy Spirit to help us desire and strive after righteousness.Of course we would have to please God still to enjoy His favours and to avoid His chastisement. But it is quite a different story for the non-believer and hell exists for them.

It is quite an interesting question, I repeat, if you believe there’s a heaven and there is a hell (as there is in truth!).

O Lord! If I worship you[b] from fear of hell[/b], cast me into hell.

If I worship you from desire for paradise, deny me paradise.

- Rabia

imhotep:

O Lord! If I worship you[b] from fear of hell[/b], cast me into hell.

If I worship you from desire for paradise, deny me paradise.

- Rabia

Why then do u worship him? Longtime no post hope no problem

toba:

Why then do u worship him?

Food for thought => Luke 17:10

"So you also, when you have done everything you were told to do, should say, 'We are unworthy servants; we have only done our duty.' "

toba:

Longtime no post hope no problem

Oh yes, i have really been tied down for the past couple of weeks. I am very fine indeed, thanks for your concern.

imhotep:

Food for thought => Luke 17:10

"So you also, when you have done everything you were told to do, should say, 'We are unworthy servants; we have only done our duty.' "

still cant get ur parable like that of christ. What good reason should a conscious christian give/have to serve/worship God

toba:

still cant get your parable like that of christ. What good reason should a conscious christian give/have to serve/worship God

Should there be a reason in the first place?

(I  have posted this before)

Religion, as practiced today, deals in PUNISHMENTS [/b]and [b]REWARDS,

In other words, it breeds FEAR [/b]and [b]GREED/

The two things most destructive [/b]of [b]SPIRITUALITY . . .

If there is nothing after death, then each indivudual existence ends in nothingness, thus = zero (0).

If all things = zero as an end result, the pre-death equation accordingly sums up to zero.

Within a zero equation, there cannot exist anything - not to speak of a concept of good and evil.

No degree of violence or evil will be significant, since everything will culminate in zero.

Meaningfulness must thus inherently avoid the zero factor.

Conclusively, if death leads to nothingness, or zero, morality is moot, exaggerated, purposeless and irrelevant.

This does not mean I do not appreciate goodness for goodness sake and nothing else; I am rather trying to show that a death that results in a state of nothingness is inconceivable.

imhotep:

(I  have posted this before)

Religion, as practiced today, deals in PUNISHMENTS [/b]and [b]REWARDS,

In other words, it breeds FEAR [/b]and [b]GREED/

The two things most destructive [/b]of [b]SPIRITUALITY . . .

Have 2questn for you. One first. Are u a theist or an atheist? Ur response will make the 2nd question

imhotep:

O Lord! If I worship you[b] from fear of hell[/b], cast me into hell.

If I worship you from desire for paradise, deny me paradise.

- Rabia

Sounds familiar. I agree.

Acts 5:41. And they departed from the presence of the council, rejoicing that they were counted worthy to suffer shame for his name.

They chose to suffer and rejoiced in it! Would they have gone to hell if they didn't? I think not!

toba:

Have 2questn for you. One first. Are u a theist or an atheist? your response will make the 2nd question

I have always been a theist. . .

imhotep:

I have always been a theist. . .

happy for u. i believe a theist would know how awesome God is. Dnt u think neither theres heaven&hell or not that being a theist ur God deserves to be praised,worshiped or served?

Deep Sight:

If there is nothing after death, then each indivudual existence ends in nothingness, thus = zero (0).

If all things = zero as an end result, the pre-death equation accordingly sums up to zero.

Within a zero equation, there cannot exist anything - not to speak of a concept of good and evil.

No degree of violence or evil will be significant, since everything will culminate in zero.

Meaningfulness must thus inherently avoid the zero factor.

Conclusively, if death leads to nothingness, or zero, morality is moot, exaggerated, purposeless and irrelevant.

This does not mean I do not appreciate goodness for goodness sake and nothing else; I am rather trying to show that a death that results in a state of nothingness is inconceivable.

Hmmm. . .

there is hell there is no hellfire they are two different things. if you do good thing because of wat you want to get from God them you have a mobid fear of god wich God detest.luv god with all your heat wether there is anything or not. that is exactly what should be done.

Deep Sight:


If there is nothing after death, then each indivudual existence ends in nothingness, thus = zero (0).

If all things = zero as an end result, the pre-death equation accordingly sums up to zero.

Within a zero equation, there cannot exist anything - not to speak of a concept of good and evil.

No degree of violence or evil will be significant, since everything will culminate in zero.

Meaningfulness must thus inherently avoid the zero factor.

If we grant there’s a heaven and a hell after death, then your point is difficult to see.

Deep Sight:



Conclusively, if death leads to nothingness, or zero, morality is moot, exaggerated, purposeless and irrelevant.

This does not mean I do not appreciate goodness for goodness sake and nothing else; I am rather trying to show that a death that results in a state of nothingness is inconceivable

I find it very difficult to reconcile the statements  above.

probably not

toba:

Why then do u worship him? Longtime no post hope no problem

Do you worship Him for or partly for fear of hell then?

5solas:

Do you worship Him for or partly for fear of hell then?

Though ur questn isnt clear. Let me answer no

Oh sure I will. My love for God does not stem from awareness of heaven or hell. I love & fear him because He is my loving heavenly father, He gave His best (Jesus) for me. He is toooooo good a father!!!

For some people, 'the fear of God'-the realisation of His awesomeness, the reverential unspoken worship of His essence-has nothing to do with the existence of 'Heaven' or 'Hell'. It has more to do with a vibrant spirituality, a connectedeness of a sort that some would prefer to call just 'Faith'. And for such people that have this 'faith', of which i speak, it would remain even if they were told that there was no 'heaven' or 'hell'. 

Faith is, because God is. It has nothing to do with a yearning for 'heaven' or 'a fear of 'hell'.

Man is created in the image of God

What man fails (ever so often) to understand that the same rules that govern heaven also govern earth.

The Angels fear and tremble in his presence. the one dude who showed some liver was brutally kicked out into hell

Fear is a primary component of a dictatorship, it is what brings out Love, Obedience, Choice and Loyalty


[b]Luke 12:5 (NIV) But I will show you whom you should fear: Fear him who, after the killing of the body, has power to throw you into hell. Yes, I tell you, fear him

Ps 89:7 (NIV) In the council of the holy ones God is greatly feared.

Isa 8:12-13 (NIV) , Do not fear what they fear, and do not dread it. The Lord Almighty is the one you are to regard as holy, he is the one you are to fear, he is the one you are to dread.

Job 23:13-16 (NIV) "But he stands alone, and who can oppose him? He does whatever he pleases. He carries out his decree against me, and many such plans he still has in store. That is why I am terrified before him; when I think of all this, I fear him. God has made my heart faint; the Almighty has terrified me."

Ps 111:10 (NEB) The fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom, and they who live by it grow in understanding,

Prov 16:6 (NEB) , the fear of the Lord makes men turn from evil.

Ps 25:12-14 (NEB) If there is any man who fears the Lord, he shall be shown the path that he should choose; he shall enjoy lasting prosperity, and his children after him shall inherit the land. The Lord confides his purposes to those who fear him, and his covenant is theirs to know.

Phil 2:12-13 (NIV) , continue to work out your salvation with fear and trembling, for it is God who works in you to will and to act according to his good purpose.

Heb 10:31 (KJV) It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God. (he'll bi.tch-slap the bJezus out of u)  [/b]

As you can see, Fear is an important component for Worshiping God, If there was no Hell, there'd be no God to worship

lagerwhenindoubt:

Man is created in the image of God

What man fails (ever so often) to understand that the same rules that govern heaven also govern earth.

The Angels fear and tremble in his presence. the one dude who showed some liver was brutally kicked out into hell

Fear is a primary component of a dictatorship, it is what brings out Love, Obedience, Choice and Loyalty


[b]Luke 12:5 (NIV) But I will show you whom you should fear: Fear him who, after the killing of the body, has power to throw you into hell. Yes, I tell you, fear him

Ps 89:7 (NIV) In the council of the holy ones God is greatly feared.

Isa 8:12-13 (NIV) , Do not fear what they fear, and do not dread it. The Lord Almighty is the one you are to regard as holy, he is the one you are to fear, he is the one you are to dread.

Job 23:13-16 (NIV) "But he stands alone, and who can oppose him? He does whatever he pleases. He carries out his decree against me, and many such plans he still has in store. That is why I am terrified before him; when I think of all this, I fear him. God has made my heart faint; the Almighty has terrified me."

Ps 111:10 (NEB) The fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom, and they who live by it grow in understanding,

Prov 16:6 (NEB) , the fear of the Lord makes men turn from evil.

Ps 25:12-14 (NEB) If there is any man who fears the Lord, he shall be shown the path that he should choose; he shall enjoy lasting prosperity, and his children after him shall inherit the land. The Lord confides his purposes to those who fear him, and his covenant is theirs to know.

Phil 2:12-13 (NIV) , continue to work out your salvation with fear and trembling, for it is God who works in you to will and to act according to his good purpose.

Heb 10:31 (KJV) It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God. (he'll bi.tch-slap the bJezus out of u) [/b]

As you can see, Fear is an important component for Worshiping God, If there was no Hell, there'd be no God to worship

That we should fear God is not in doubt.

toba:

Though your questn isnt clear. Let me answer no

If you don't worship Him for fear of hell (in whole or in part), then I think I can safely conclude that you would still worship Him, even if there were no heaven or hell.

5solas:

If you don't worship Him for fear of hell (in whole or in part), then I think I can safely conclude that you would still worship Him, even if there were no heaven or hell.

That's a point. I was also wondering about the basis of "worship" - is it fear or love, or both? One of my fav verses for "worship" is 1 John 4:18 - "There is no fear in love; but perfect love casteth out fear: because fear hath torment. He that feareth is not made perfect in love." This perhaps explains "fear" (in terms of "dread" does not seem to cross my mind when in "worship". . . except where the word "fear" has the meaning in context of reverence. I don't know. . . just musing.

this is food for tot for the over zealeous religious pips
i can say for a fact, that if god had his own bank account, say in barclays where we cld all pay our tithes and offerings directly into gods account
trust me, the nos of churches in nigeria will reduce by 99.9999percent

i will serve God cos i love him. Agape love is goodness u do to someone irrespective of the person's action or reacting to you. as a brand new creature of God uncorrupted . have the nature of God naturally-love. so i am loving. i love the lord and my neigbour