Kingsley10000:
China is currently the world's leading economic power, in
China there is Zero Church!
Finland has the most stable economy in the world today.
There are less than twenty churches in Finland!
Switzerland has the second most stable economy in the
world. Switzerland has fewer than thirty churches!
Denmark is the third most stable economy in the world,
there are about 23 churches in Denmark.
These countries are considered to have the highest number
of atheists, but they are blessed!
Come to Nigeria, there are more than 70,000 churches.
+25 000 churches in Lagos.
+2 500 churches in Oyo
+30000 churches in the south east
In Africa, we have more churches than schools and
hospitals combined!
More pastors than doctors.
Everyone is born again!o
Everyone is covered with the blood of Jesus!
Jesus even became the husband of all single women
(according to them) in revival churches!
Everyone is filled with the Holy Spirit!
However, none of these claims reflect the moral elevation
that is hoped for in a society.
We are among the laziest, the most deceiving, the most
corrupt, the most hypocritical, the most hateful on the planet
today, with all our Jesus and the Holy Spirit!
Our people need to distinguish between religion and
stupidity or between spirituality and tradition!.
Wake up!!!
religion is the modern day slavery holding Africans down

Nope. China is currently recording the fastest rate of people converting to Christianity. I am a Historian please. Many of the things you hear and quote are very wrong. Alexander S, the greatest writer in USSR then told Americans and Europeans not to neglect the secret of their greatness. He said their advancement was traceable to their faith in Christ. And that since they are finding faults in Church, that they have been going down. Behold, Alexander was a man who had no religion or faith. The Church is not the problem of Africa. The education you think you have today had its roots in Christianity. The church you are blaming is contributing lots to your economy. Go and goggle how much bilions the federal government confirmed that Synagogue alone is contributing to Naija revenue thru the foreigners coming to his services. Saudi and Israel as rich as they are still make a lot from those coming as pilgrims to their lands.

I totally agree with the op because paying a pastor doesn’t make any sense. The church can employ an outsider to do any other thing like operating the piano or someone to clean the church. So far you are a member of the church you should not be paid anything at all it should be done for God!

Kingsley10000:
China is currently the world's leading economic power, in
China there is Zero Church!
Finland has the most stable economy in the world today.
There are less than twenty churches in Finland!
Switzerland has the second most stable economy in the
world. Switzerland has fewer than thirty churches!
Denmark is the third most stable economy in the world,
there are about 23 churches in Denmark.
These countries are considered to have the highest number
of atheists, but they are blessed!
Come to Nigeria, there are more than 70,000 churches.
+25 000 churches in Lagos.
+2 500 churches in Oyo
+30000 churches in the south east
In Africa, we have more churches than schools and
hospitals combined!
More pastors than doctors.
Everyone is born again!o
Everyone is covered with the blood of Jesus!
Jesus even became the husband of all single women
(according to them) in revival churches!
Everyone is filled with the Holy Spirit!
However, none of these claims reflect the moral elevation
that is hoped for in a society.
We are among the laziest, the most deceiving, the most
corrupt, the most hypocritical, the most hateful on the planet
today, with all our Jesus and the Holy Spirit!
Our people need to distinguish between religion and
stupidity or between spirituality and tradition!.
Wake up!!!
religion is the modern day slavery holding Africans down

any mofo who cannot make it. Just opens a church with shop space and slowly scam pple till he gets to permanent site. Wat a joke

Kingsley10000:
China is currently the world's leading economic power, in
China there is Zero Church!
Finland has the most stable economy in the world today.
There are less than twenty churches in Finland!
Switzerland has the second most stable economy in the
world. Switzerland has fewer than thirty churches!
Denmark is the third most stable economy in the world,
there are about 23 churches in Denmark.
These countries are considered to have the highest number
of atheists, but they are blessed!
Come to Nigeria, there are more than 70,000 churches.
+25 000 churches in Lagos.
+2 500 churches in Oyo
+30000 churches in the south east
In Africa, we have more churches than schools and
hospitals combined!
More pastors than doctors.
Everyone is born again!o
Everyone is covered with the blood of Jesus!
Jesus even became the husband of all single women
(according to them) in revival churches!
Everyone is filled with the Holy Spirit!
However, none of these claims reflect the moral elevation
that is hoped for in a society.
We are among the laziest, the most deceiving, the most
corrupt, the most hypocritical, the most hateful on the planet
today, with all our Jesus and the Holy Spirit!
Our people need to distinguish between religion and
stupidity or between spirituality and tradition!.
Wake up!!!
religion is the modern day slavery holding Africans down

United states of America undoubtedly the most powerful state in the world has thousands of churches....

Before you continue lying....
Read this about Denmark
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_in_Denmark

Work for God not the church. Learn religion from the Bible not the church

pressplay411:
Interesting.
God knows who's working for Him.
So many work for free but complain through out. What do you expect is their reward?
Some get paid but the value and service they give far exceeds the pay, cos they would have charged more secularly. We're in no place to judge.
Though it's obviously more rewarding to render your services and talents to God for free.
I believe God and only God knows who's working for Him because only He knows our Hearts.

Yes! Ultimately. God help us all!

Kingsley10000:
China is currently the world's leading economic power, in
China there is Zero Church!
Finland has the most stable economy in the world today.
There are less than twenty churches in Finland!
Switzerland has the second most stable economy in the
world. Switzerland has fewer than thirty churches!
Denmark is the third most stable economy in the world,
there are about 23 churches in Denmark.
These countries are considered to have the highest number
of atheists, but they are blessed!
Come to Nigeria, there are more than 70,000 churches.
+25 000 churches in Lagos.
+2 500 churches in Oyo
+30000 churches in the south east
In Africa, we have more churches than schools and
hospitals combined!
More pastors than doctors.
Everyone is born again!o
Everyone is covered with the blood of Jesus!
Jesus even became the husband of all single women
(according to them) in revival churches!
Everyone is filled with the Holy Spirit!
However, none of these claims reflect the moral elevation
that is hoped for in a society.
We are among the laziest, the most deceiving, the most
corrupt, the most hypocritical, the most hateful on the planet
today, with all our Jesus and the Holy Spirit!
Our people need to distinguish between religion and
stupidity or between spirituality and tradition!.
Wake up!!!
religion is the modern day slavery holding Africans down

You are so on point...
Permission to copy this.

Nigerians spend all their time fasting and praying and forget to get creative, then they run around to find fast money in order to buy imported food, cream, phone and wrist-watches so they dont have to waste time being creative when they should be worshipping God.

Now churches run 5 services on Sundays, and a midweek service on wednesdays, not forgetting tarry nights and vigils.

The mohammedans are not left out, they pray 5 times a day, and are constantly checking their time to make sure they dont miss a date with Allahu, what remains of their time is spent separating quarrels between their 4 wives, the rest is spent reminding the kids of the need to go to the Alfas and Imams for tutelages.

So, what time do we have to plant tomatoes or engineer apples that can grow on our climate.

We are not poor because we are religious, we are poor as a country because we have found an excuse in God.

oyetunder:
Nope. Chine is currently recording the fastest rate of people converting to Christianity. I am a Historian please. Many of the things you hear and quote are very wrong. Alexander S, the greatest writer in USSR then told Americans and Europeans not to neglect the secret of their greatness. He said their advancement was traceable to their faith in Christ. And that since they are finding faults in Church, that they have been going down. Behold, Alexander was a man who had no religion or faith. The Church is not the problem of Africa. The education you think you have today had its roots in Christianity. The church you are blaming is contributing lots to your economy. Go and goggle how much bilions the federal government confirmed that Synagogue alone is contributing to Naija revenue thru the foreigners coming to his services. Saudi and Israel as rich as they are still make a lot from those coming as pilgrims to their lands.

If education is attached to Christianity ..
Who educated the I Indians ..
Stop changing history ...
The missionary came to African as a disquise to survey for slave traders and colonial masters ..
My question ..
Who educated the chinesse ?
Who educated the Japanese ?
Who was sponsoring the missionary ?
Who sponsored the slave traders ?
Who sponsored the colonial masters ?

oyetunder:
Nope. Chine is currently recording the fastest rate of people converting to Christianity. I am a Historian please. Many of the things you hear and quote are very wrong. Alexander S, the greatest writer in USSR then told Americans and Europeans not to neglect the secret of their greatness. He said their advancement was traceable to their faith in Christ. And that since they are finding faults in Church, that they have been going down. Behold, Alexander was a man who had no religion or faith. The Church is not the problem of Africa. The education you think you have today had its roots in Christianity. The church you are blaming is contributing lots to your economy. Go and goggle how much bilions the federal government confirmed that Synagogue alone is contributing to Naija revenue thru the foreigners coming to his services. Saudi and Israel as rich as they are still make a lot from those coming as pilgrims to their lands.

The number of christian in China is responsible for their economic growth ?

First and foremost, let's get back to the Bible....



The truth is no g. o anywhere big or small, if he doesn't have foreknowledge about some issues firsthand from the Bible, then he is likened to a fool.



Church administration can be very much gotten from the Bible.


Looking at the Leviticus book, we see a lot about administration of God's work. The Priests and Levites were distinguished and they had portions and tomorrow leave also.


The salary of a structure became a way to encourage these ministers and rotation was introduced to ensure they had time to go and work for their family's sustenance while on leave too. so they weren't just waiting on the portions the public provided them. they had fields and worked too.



Working for God is a selfless service that makes you to Rey solely on Hid word from day to day.


It's very much different from working for the church. We know a different group called church workers exists. But those that have calling aren't church workers. However, someone called can first be a worker and then step up to fulfill his/her calling. It's while Levites had this mentality that once they were consecrated, they had to stop and set asides all previous engagements to serve fully and undistracted.



Many today because of ignorance are eager to work for the church and be at the helm of affairs..


But let's go back to elementary ways of expression



You're called a Minister of God, which means that you first minister and answer to your Boss, then go about doing what he says should be done. first to God, then the people.


But now, people full workers group like water and feel they work for God when in actual sense they are just a means to ensuring the church activities move smoothly (Similar to the Levites)


One can however work for the church and work for God because of the mandate that requires all to preach salvation to everyone, up and doing. But administering spiritual things like the 5fold ministry that are the called ones is a big mistake.


The e at lunch church's standard for being a deacon was very high that if we wana evaluate today's church worker by these standard(Stephen in focus here), we won't have deacons atall qualified in most churches today.


What I see is a bunch of businessmen that when the pastor wishes, he tells them to drop money and remind them it's for God's work and they believe too that God will replenish them. so they are mostly the sit and wait type of workers. SMH. The Holy Spirit will fill that void.


But never, never can working for the church equate to working for God.


It's why you hear people sound in church admin for 15-35years thinking they can now plant churches..... the reason why we have many uncalled God of men now a days.



That day, they will be called "workers of Iniquity."


Cos they weren't given "appointment letters" by the boss to function as any one of the 5fold ministry.


They can't or ever will be the same!!!!


The standard however for a worker was, is and should still be very high like the early church. Same for the process of nomination.


Happy Sunday.

Am a Christian but there's no such thing as "working for God", it's just a phrase used by pastors for modern day slavery. You are made to believe that what you do in church is for God, whereas you are being used to build and maintain there empire while the pastors enjoy your labor. Anything you do in a church without being paid is just plain stupidity. Why didn't they tell the contractors that built there mega churches that they are working for God. Nigerians have refused to think.
I pray a time will come when Nigerians will receive sense and be set free from mental slavery. God deliver this generation

[b][/b]d
Differences of working for God in the mosque
Why always attacking Christian d trend now a days is getting to much pls enough of dis rubbish already

pressplay411:
Interesting.
God knows who's working for Him.
So many work for free but complain through out. What do you expect is their reward?
Some get paid but the value and service they give far exceeds the pay, cos they would have charged more secularly. We're in no place to judge.
Though it's obviously more rewarding to render your services and talents to God for free.
I believe God and only God knows who's working for Him because only He knows our Hearts.

Best things to say.

McXponent:
Difference between working for God and working for church, or does it means if you work for church,you automatically work for God?
Pastors or church workers receiving salaries at the end of each months are said to be working for God.. How's that possible and meanwhile most of this pastors/church workers aren't on full time.
To my own understanding, any work you do and earn salaries or wages, so far you're being paid.. You're working for your Tommy.
If you're working for God, you shouldn't expect salaries or wages from anywhere, you give in all and wait till God rewards you massively on his own.
Don't let us mix things up.. So far you're earning monthly payments of which you agreed on it means you're working for the church.
However, anything you agreed on doing for the church growth without expecting a dime from anybody.. You're working for God.

Let's have people's views on this issue.
I'll be glad if this could be shifted to the front page.. People really need to know the difference.
Thanks.

seconded

McXponent:
Difference between working for God and working for church, or does it means if you work for church,you automatically work for God?
Pastors or church workers receiving salaries at the end of each months are said to be working for God.. How's that possible and meanwhile most of this pastors/church workers aren't on full time.
To my own understanding, any work you do and earn salaries or wages, so far you're being paid.. You're working for your Tommy.
If you're working for God, you shouldn't expect salaries or wages from anywhere, you give in all and wait till God rewards you massively on his own.
Don't let us mix things up.. So far you're earning monthly payments of which you agreed on it means you're working for the church.
However, anything you agreed on doing for the church growth without expecting a dime from anybody.. You're working for God.

Let's have people's views on this issue.
I'll be glad if this could be shifted to the front page.. People really need to know the difference.
Thanks.

Whatever name you call it is what it is in your life....Gen 2:19... You call it salary and that is what it is. You call it service or offering to God whiter you got a stipend or not, it will remain an offering to God.

It is you that determines not the work or the reward thereof

gentlegenius:
You are so on point... Permission to copy this.

you're free...people must be enlightened

Kingsley10000:
China is currently the world's leading economic power, in
China there is Zero Church!
Finland has the most stable economy in the world today.
There are less than twenty churches in Finland!
Switzerland has the second most stable economy in the
world. Switzerland has fewer than thirty churches!
Denmark is the third most stable economy in the world,
there are about 23 churches in Denmark.
These countries are considered to have the highest number
of atheists, but they are blessed!
Come to Nigeria, there are more than 70,000 churches.
+25 000 churches in Lagos.
+2 500 churches in Oyo
+30000 churches in the south east
In Africa, we have more churches than schools and
hospitals combined!
More pastors than doctors.
Everyone is born again!o
Everyone is covered with the blood of Jesus!
Jesus even became the husband of all single women
(according to them) in revival churches!
Everyone is filled with the Holy Spirit!
However, none of these claims reflect the moral elevation
that is hoped for in a society.
We are among the laziest, the most deceiving, the most
corrupt, the most hypocritical, the most hateful on the planet
today, with all our Jesus and the Holy Spirit!
Our people need to distinguish between religion and
stupidity or between spirituality and tradition!.
Wake up!!!
religion is the modern day slavery holding Africans down

You're wrong

Churches are growing in n China

Go check the percentage of Christians in Finland, Sweden, Switzerland vs Nigeria.

You will realize they have higher Christian population than Nigeria.

hopefulLandlord:


I don't see what difference this makes

You don't see because you are a atheist

Cant u just focus on the topic or do u tink saying dis makes u wise...wat impact have made to our society...............quote author=paxonel post=67514101]whether paid or not what benefit has your church work imparted to the society? [/quote]

Grupo:
When I was still a Christian. I used to play guitar for free. But after sometime, I retraced my steps and started taking money from the churches. If the pastor could get paid for preaching the word of God, why shouldn't I?

Hmm... When you were still a Christian..
What are you now? �
I play drums in church as well.. Likewise I do Mc in events.. I don't charge for church programs though. But whatever they deem fit to give me.. I'd collect o
Praise God.

McXponent:

Hmm... When you were still a Christian..
What are you now? �
I play drums in church as well.. Likewise I do Mc in events.. I don't charge for church programs though. But whatever they deem fit to give me.. I'd collect o
Praise God.

I'm an atheist now bro.

Better start taking money for your services o. Well, drummers are plenty everywhere, so, if you "do guy", they can easily get someone to play. For lead guitarists like me, we are rare. So, if I say I'm not playing, you would have no alternative than to negotiate with me.

Those days, there were a lot of churches in my area, so, any church that didn't want to pay would not see a single musician in their church.

CHRISTIANITY IS THE NOT THE BANE OF YOUR PROBLEM , STOP BEING MYOPIC AND FACE REALITY.

Kingsley10000:
China is currently the world's leading economic power, in
China there is Zero Church!
Finland has the most stable economy in the world today.
There are less than twenty churches in Finland!
Switzerland has the second most stable economy in the
world. Switzerland has fewer than thirty churches!
Denmark is the third most stable economy in the world,
there are about 23 churches in Denmark.
These countries are considered to have the highest number
of atheists, but they are blessed!
Come to Nigeria, there are more than 70,000 churches.
+25 000 churches in Lagos.
+2 500 churches in Oyo
+30000 churches in the south east
In Africa, we have more churches than schools and
hospitals combined!
More pastors than doctors.
Everyone is born again!o
Everyone is covered with the blood of Jesus!
Jesus even became the husband of all single women
(according to them) in revival churches!
Everyone is filled with the Holy Spirit!
However, none of these claims reflect the moral elevation
that is hoped for in a society.
We are among the laziest, the most deceiving, the most
corrupt, the most hypocritical, the most hateful on the planet
today, with all our Jesus and the Holy Spirit!
Our people need to distinguish between religion and
stupidity or between spirituality and tradition!.
Wake up!!!
religion is the modern day slavery holding Africans down

AFRICA IS AFRICA AND NOT CHINESE OR THE JAPANESE .

lakesider:



If education is attached to Christianity ..
Who educated the I Indians ..
Stop changing history ...
The missionary came to African as a disquise to survey for slave traders and colonial masters ..
My question ..
Who educated the chinesse ?
Who educated the Japanese ?
Who was sponsoring the missionary ?
Who sponsored the slave traders ?
Who sponsored the colonial masters ?

So let me get this straight OP. A particular Church doesn't have anyone who can play say, drums for them. And they decided to hire a drummer. So you are telling me that drummer is not working for God especially if he's a Christian cos he's collecting money from them?

What do we even mean by working for God? It simply means doing anything that will promote the Gospel of Christ. Now, whether you do it for free or for cash, the most important thing is your heart which only God sees. Someone that doesn't work for free with his heart might be acceptable to God than the person who works for free & with grumblings. Let's not enslave or manipulate ourselves. Working in the Church, within & outside the Church, for the Church, to promote The Gospel all mean working for God. Or do you see God physically to work for Him?

I know a one man Pentecostal church in ijebu ode, Ogun state, you can't get married in the church except you're a worker!


I know people being forced to go back to the work force of the church against their will!


Is this also working for God? Or for church?

Just2gud:
Cant u just focus on the topic or do u tink saying dis makes u wise...wat impact have made to our society

religion is a mess to the society accept it or leave it.

It is better to work for educational institutions and commercial establishments and help the needy, than to be fooling yourself saying you are working for God in church .

Anyway, if I'm paid real good i will do the absolutely rubbish for the money

Kingsley10000:
China is currently the world's leading economic power, in
China there is Zero Church!
Finland has the most stable economy in the world today
...
Everyone is filled with the Holy Spirit!
However, none of these claims reflect the moral elevation
that is hoped for in a society.
We are among the laziest, the most deceiving, the most
corrupt, the most hypocritical, the most hateful on the planet
today, with all our Jesus and the Holy Spirit!
Our people need to distinguish between religion and
stupidity or between spirituality and tradition!.
Wake up!!!
religion is the modern day slavery holding Africans down

Yada yada...

Ain't you tired of posting this from thread to thread?

While you are yet to make a decision on your faith, please stop discouraging others who have.

McXponent:
Difference between working for God and working for church, or does it means if you work for church,you automatically work for God?
Pastors or church workers receiving salaries at the end of each months are said to be working for God.. How's that possible and meanwhile most of this pastors/church workers aren't on full time.
To my own understanding, any work you do and earn salaries or wages, so far you're being paid.. You're working for your Tommy.
If you're working for God, you shouldn't expect salaries or wages from anywhere, you give in all and wait till God rewards you massively on his own.
Don't let us mix things up.. So far you're earning monthly payments of which you agreed on it means you're working for the church.
However, anything you agreed on doing for the church growth without expecting a dime from anybody.. You're working for God.

Let's have people's views on this issue.
I'll be glad if this could be shifted to the front page.. People really need to know the difference.
Thanks.

Brother you are confused.

1 Corinthians 9 Paul sets out elaborate argument on why it is actually ordained of God that ministers of the gospel be supported.

God never comes down from heaven to pay them; this comes from men, from the hearers of the gospel. Supposing a minister is not an Evangelist but a pastor meaning they have a fixed locale for sharing the word to a fixed congregation. Then support should be coming from that congregation.

If the church pays the minister a salary, why is that not the support envisaged by 1 Cor 9? Because it is regular? Remember the pay is there as long as the offerings can support it so it may be fixed but subject to availability. That makes it uncertain. Your regular pay on the other hand is fixed come rain or sunshine, and in fact you may sue your employer nfor withholding or not paying you on time etc.

So a minister on payroll is still working for God.

Working for God and working for church are not necessarily mutually exclusive. It's not like you can't have both at the same time and that's where you are getting it bad.

What I may add is, oft times working in church comes with some sacrifices especially where the pay may be less than what the market would normally pay.

I'm talking about peripheral or administrative or support duties in a church.

Let's say you are a plumber and you offer your services to your church for less than what you'd otherwise charge. In fact you did it free. I'd be inclined to classify your work as being work for God because you sacrificed the difference between what you charged the church and what you normally charge.

But if you did plumbing for the church at your normal rates then you are working for the church.

Cc Anas09

24sqm:
Working for God and church.........

Most churches employ drummers and the likes so they can come work for them,most of the aren't church members.. They just come and work and get paid at the end of the month.

While working for God is when you do it voluntarily... You can decide to sweep/be an usher depending on which department you want to join.

Where did you get this idea that serving God is done 'voluntarily' by which I take it to mean without pay?

The laborer is worth his wages and the fact that he is not paid does not mean that he is not entitled to

Please study 1 Cor 9 for my perspective

Shalom

pressplay411:
Interesting.
God knows who's working for Him.
So many work for free but complain through out. What do you expect is their reward?
Some get paid but the value and service they give far exceeds the pay, cos they would have charged more secularly. We're in no place to judge.
Though it's obviously more rewarding to render your services and talents to God for free.
I believe God and only God knows who's working for Him because only He knows our Hearts.

To add to your point, any activity carried out for the direct furtherance of the gospel is working for God whether it is free or paid for.

Work for God is not defined by the remuneration but the purpose

M0ron:


Brother you are confused.

1 Corinthians 9 Paul sets out elaborate argument on why it is actually ordained of God that ministers of the gospel be supported.

God never comes down from heaven to pay them; this comes from men, from the hearers of the gospel. Supposing a minister is not an Evangelist but a pastor meaning they have a fixed locale for sharing the word to a fixed congregation. Then support should be coming from that congregation.

If the church pays the minister a salary, why is that not the support envisaged by 1 Cor 9? Because it is regular? Remember the pay is there as long as the offerings can support it so it may be fixed but subject to availability. That makes it uncertain. Your regular pay on the other hand is fixed come rain or sunshine, and in fact you may sue your employer nfor withholding or not paying you on time etc.

So a minister on payroll is still working for God.

Working for God and working for church are not necessarily mutually exclusive. It's not like you can't have both at the same time and that's where you are getting it bad.

What I may add is, oft times working in church comes with some sacrifices especially where the pay may be less than what the market would normally pay.

I'm talking about peripheral or administrative or support duties in a church.

Let's say you are a plumber and you offer your services to your church for less than what you'd otherwise charge. In fact you did it free. I'd be inclined to classify your work as being work for God because you sacrificed the difference between what you charged the church and what you normally charge.

But if you did plumbing for the church at your normal rates then you are working for the church.

Cc Anas09

I couldn't have said it better.

A whole lot of confusion because people refuse to learn the ways (Principles) of the Kingdom.