Hello there, im here to invite you to surrender your will to your creator, the one, the only one most mercifull and generous whos every good attributes belong to who created humans from mud, threw a catch to heven and a catch to hell , nobody ask why coz nobody existed then but we will be asked on that day when the good guys get what they deserve and the bads too

the one who is the god of Adam and eve our parents
the one who is the god of Noah and Abraham
the one who is the god of Josef and Jacob
the one who is the god of Moses and Jesus
the one who is the god of his last messenger Muhammad
the one whos will is over all
the one whos death will be served to every body over the earth to drink
the one whos life will flow in the deads for the account

the one who isnt contained by when and where
but he created the when and where


he asks little from his slaves, (witness that im one and only god and do good to people as you like them to treat you , )

so if you are from the tribe of the good, the catch of the heaven, dont late away unfreindly away , come on to your only who cares about you, submit to him like the heavenly people and be with them
im not inviting you to me myself, nor asking for fee, folwo your heart and dig to the truth with your brains

finally im here to answer any question and reply to any doubts with PROOF in simple and small words May Allah bless you and guide you to the right way

May Allah reward you abundantly.

Maybe they will listen to you as they have been rejecting the truth has been telling them

misright:

Hello there, im here to invite you to surrender your will to your creator, the one, the only one most mercifull and generous whos every good attributes belong to who created humans from mud, threw a catch to heven and a catch to hell , nobody ask why because nobody existed then but we will be asked on that day when the good guys get what they deserve and the bads too

Make una dey deceive una sef. If na stimulus post that harrumph, you will still praise me, even if I had lied that I was a Baptist as misright did. No wahala, al-Taqiyya (the Islamic tenet of lying) is hardly a secret today.

babs787:

May Allah reward you abundantly.

Maybe they will listen to you as they have been rejecting the truth has been telling them

Thanks alot babs787. Its seems we have something in common like someone said earlier. Keep on, i like your spirit.


@ stimulus
Stimulus, i cant be lying about my religion, am a Baptist. Dont tell me you dont know where you belong!

@misright,

I certainly know where I belong. It's only a matter of days that yours becomes apparent.

?
are you both muslims or xtains?

   

I knew that question was going to pop up sooner than later. Okay, I'm a Christian who knows where I belong.

In retrospect, my pally just hinted me that there's such a thing as a Baptist-Muslim nowadays. I'm unable to convince him otherwise, even though I strongly feel he's kidding. Can you help? 

An islamic baptist? This taqqiya is going too far.

misright:

he asks little from his slaves, (witness that im one and only god and do good to people as you like them to treat you , )

Thank God i have a FATHER who calls me SON and not a slave. No matter how hardworking a slave is, he has no inheritance in his masters kingdom. Only a son can be a heir.

davidylan:

An islamic baptist? This taqqiya is going too far.

Bros, I tire for my pally. The guy dey thrash me with his so-called "proof" that there is such a thing as Baptist-Muslims nowadays. Major difference is that they do not believe in the Hadiths, and bla-bla. Does anyone have a remote idea what this chap is yapping about?

Baptist muslims as those who dont believe the hadith? This people are struggling so hard to look and sound like christians.

Does SHE understand what "baptism" really means and that the root word comes directly from christian teachings?

What do the anglican muslims believe in?

@davidylan,

The whole wahala-chat started when someone mentioned something about the religion of Chrislam - a syncretistic religion blending Christianity and Islam.

Next thing, my pally hissed and opined that chrislam is becoming old-fashioned, and the in-thing now is the Baptist-Muslim movement!    I chuckled and thought he was just playing pinocio. . . but what was my surprise when he roled up his sleeves and engaged us full circle debating this issue. He initmated that the movement started with this verse in the Qur'an:

Q.2 vs.138 - (Our religion is) the Baptism of Allah: And who can baptize better than Allah? And it is He Whom we worship.

Then he expounded blah-blah about how many adherents the movement now has; why the imams have failed to live up to the "baptism of Allah"; the reason why the Hadiths have been manufactured to make Muhammad look and sound bad. . . and why only "idiots" believe in the Hadith and refuse baptism, etc.

More astonishing is his claim that the movement is now growing in the UK - which is why I asked if anyone knows anything about this chap's claim at all. I have sweated it out trying to burst his bubble, googled it and nothing came up. . . but he's so concrete that I had to let him be.

Infact, that's the first time I saw that verse in the Qur'an about the "baptism of Allah!" 

typical of muslims, just a single verse from the whole mumbo jumbo in the quran and build a shrine around it.

The real intent being a desperate struggle to resemble christianity as much as possible in order to acquire some credibility. Why the sudden denial of the hadith after so many centuries? Is it because it is now becoming very embarassing to explain away the several discrepancies, confu stiision and absurdities that exist in it?
If this people discredit the hadith then why do they still follow the prayer patterns, fasting tradition contained in the hadith that are absent in the quran?

Q.2 vs.138 - (Our religion is) the Baptism of Allah: And who can baptize better than Allah? And it is He Whom we worship.

What is meant by the baptism of allah? Does it have a religious significance? Who is allah baptizing, with what and why?

These are questions that our dear "baptist" muslims should endeavour to answer before running off still deeply enmeshed in their ignorance and deciet. Baptism in the christian sense is not built around a mere incongrous verse, IT IS A FUNDAMENTAL TENET OF THE CHRISTIAN FAITH.

So what if we find a verse in the quran that possesses the word "protestant"? Some muslims will suddenly become "protestant" muslims?

@Davidylan and stimulus,
Are you guys joking or serious? Baptist Muslim ke? Very soon we'll hear of born-again muslims speaking in the holy ghost.
The spirit of confusion and deception reigns supreme in Islam: that is the ultimate truth and proof on Islam.
While we have a hope and assurance of Salvation through faith in Christ Jesus as it is written, sealed by the Spirit and confirmed by signs and wonders; the truth is that islamic faith is hinged on insecurity. As such, every action and teaching in Islam is aimed towards looking for proof that their faith is true. So they are looking for validation of Muhammed from Deuteronomy in the Bible, or that Muhammed is the comforter spoken of in John.
Additionally, it is prophesied in the quran that muslims will defeat the jews/unbeliever in battle which is why they shout "death to Israel, death to America" every friday. However, every time they attack Israel or America and fail, they become jittery because that is suggesting that the Quran is false and muhammed is a liar (truth though) which is unthinkable to the average muslim.

batu:

the truth is that islamic faith is hinged on insecurity. As such, every action and teaching in Islam is aimed towards looking for proof that their faith is true. So they are looking for validation of Muhammed from Deuteronomy in the Bible, or that Muhammed is the comforter spoken of in John.

This is the crux of the matter! It is no wonder that each time we have threads on islam here, it is either aimed at discrediting christianity or struggling desperately to insert ishmael, allah, mohammed and the arabs in the bible and under the Abrahamic covenant.

It is important to note that majority of muslims here quote the bible 99% of the time rather than the quran!

@batu,

batu:

Are you guys joking or serious? Baptist Muslim ke? Very soon we'll hear of born-again muslims speaking in the holy ghost.

My bros, no be joke O! My pally thrashed me left-right-and-center with his "proof" of the Baptist-Muslims, which he termed a pure religious movement, promoters of the real essence of peace, blah-blah-blah.

Wonders of it is that this morning, he invited me to one of their 'worship services'. A quick glance at him revealed his tight clutch of the Bible and the Qur'an. Out of curiosity, I almost obliged him - just to be sure he wasn't joking; but then I changed my mind and went to church instead. Fine and intelligent chap he is, though - but when I asked him about the Cross, offered that would be another discussion. Keep you posted; though I've given up searching this movement on Google.


@davidylan,

davidylan:

It is important to note that majority of muslims here quote the bible 99% of the time rather than the quran!

Well, we really don't mind as long as they understand what they're quoting. That is why the idea that Deut. 18 was about the prophet of Islam cannot be substantiated by any thinking Muslim mind.

Gaddafi says that Islam is the only universal religion -
http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20070330/wl_nm/religion_gaddafi_dc_1

That is why I feel so sorry for Gaddafi - ever so confused.

On the one hand, denying the Crucifixion, he knew nothing better than to base his arguments on the Koran, stating the following: "Christianity is not a faith for people in Africa, Asia, Europe and the Americas."

Then on the other hand, he seriously believes that: "Libya has turned its back on the Arabs , Libya is an African nation. As for Arabs, may God keep them happy and far away."

Besides the bigotry against his own people the Arabs, would anyone fail to notice how confused is Gaddafi? If he feels that Christianity is not a faith for people in Africa, what sense was he making in turning his back on the Arabs? Which is highly suggestive that Gaddafi is neither here nor there. Just think if he was living in the days of Muhammad and making the statement that "Libya has turned its back on the Arabs."

Guys, am a christian and a Baptist specified. Dont misquote me for what Stimulus thinks.

misright:

Guys, am a christian and a Baptist specified. Dont misquote me for what Stimulus thinks.

I wasn't thinking anything about you other than what you claimed of yourself. The reference to Baptist-Muslim was not from or about you, as you're not the pally who intimated me about it. So relax.

@stimulus

This is what we have in the verse you quoted

Quran 2 v 138; [Our Sibghah (religion) is] the Sibghah (religion) of Allah (Islam) and which Sibghah (religion) can be better than Allah's? And we are His worshipper.



@davidylan


Do you ever read your bible? Havent you read in the book of Romans where Paul said that you will gain eternal life by being a slave?

@babs787,

babs787:

@stimulus

This is what we have in the verse you quoted

Quran 2 v 138; [Our Sibghah (religion) is] the Sibghah (religion) of Allah (Islam) and which Sibghah (religion) can be better than Allah's? And we are His worshipper.

Yep, so you say. But you can't blame me much as I was not previously a Muslim.

However, these are the following translations of the same verse of Qur'an 2 vs. 138 (with your preferred tr. given first):

Muhammad Al-Hilali & Muhsin Khan: (Our Sibghah (religion) is) the Sibghah (Religion) of Allah (Islam) and which Sibghah (religion) can be better than Allahs? And we are His worshippers. (Tafsir Ibn Katheer.)

YUSUFALI: (Our religion is) the Baptism of Allah: And who can baptize better than Allah? And it is He Whom we worship.

PICKTHAL: (We take our) colour from Allah, and who is better than Allah at colouring. We are His worshippers.

SHAKIR: (Receive) the baptism of Allah, and who is better than Allah in baptising? and Him do we serve.

MUNSHEY: (Imbue) the hue (and the halo) of Allah! What better shade of color to acquire than that of Allah? We are His sincere devotees!

SHERALI: Say, `We have adopted the religion of ALLAH; and who is better than ALLAH in teaching religion, and him alone do we worship.

SALE[/b]The [b]baptism of God have we received, and who it better than God to baptize? Him do we worship.

PALMER: The dye of God! and who is better than God at dyeing? and we are worshippers of Him.

KHALIFA: Such is GOD's system, and whose system is better than GOD's? "Him alone we worship."

RODWELL: Islam is the Baptism of God, and who is better to baptise than God? And Him do we serve.

ARBERRY: the baptism of God; and who is there that baptizes fairer than God? Him we are serving.

Again, me I no know Arabic, nor am I a scholar in Islamic literature. I'm just letting those who claim they understand enough as translators to do all the talking.

babs787:

Do you ever read your bible? Havent you read in the book of Romans where Paul said that you will gain eternal life by being a slave?

I'm interested in reading the text in Romans where Paul stated it exactly as you did.

Shalom.

@stimulus

This is how you will see it:


servant of jesus

2nd corinthians 7 v 22: says: 'for he who was called in the Lord as a Slave is a freedman of the Lord. Likewise he who was free when called is a slave of christ. You are bought with a price'

2nd corinthians 4 v 5: for what we preach is not ourselves but jesus christ as Lord, with ourselves as your SERVANT.

God rewarding his servants with paradise

Romans 6 v 16: know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey, whether of sin unto death, nor of obedience unto righteousness

v 17: but God be thanked that ye were the servants of sin, but ye have obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine which was delivered to you.

v 18: Being then made free from sin, ye became the servant of righteousness.

v 20 : When you were slaves of sin, you were free in regard to righteousness.

v 22: but now that you have been set free from sin and have become slaves of God, the return you get is sanctification and its end, eternal life.

Revelatin 11 v 18: the nations raged, but thy wrath came and the time for dead to be judged for rewarding thy servants, the prophets and saints.

@babs787,

Right, this was your earlier statement:

babs787:

Do you ever read your bible? Havent you read in the book of Romans where Paul said that you will gain eternal life by being a slave?

Now, in all the references you gave, Paul did not say that anyone will gain etrnal life by being a slave. If that were the case, why have most Muslim apologists been accusing him of all sorts of derogatory names under the sun? Further, the Muslim concept of 'slave' is quite a different thing than is understood in Christianity or Judaism. That is the point in 2 Corinthians and Revelations that you referenced.

The relationship that a Christian has with God is not predicated on being a 'slave' or 'servant'. Rather, it is based on the faith of the believer in in Jesus Christ: "That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation. " (Rom. 10:9-10).

However, the result of someone's being saved is manifested in his walk after he or she confesses the Lordship of Jesus Christ. That is what Rom. 6:16-23 posits - "ye have your fruit unto holiness, and the end everlasting life. . . but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord."

Eternal life is a gift of God through grace in Christ, not something anyone gains as a reward for hardwork. That is the consistent theme of Romans. This is the difference -

"Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt. . . And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then is it no more grace: otherwise work is no more work." (Rom. 4:4 and 11:6).

We are saved by grace through faith in Jesus Christ. The believer in Christ is not rewarded by being a "slave" of God; but by simply faith in the redemption freely provided in the Son of God.

@stimulus

Very funny translation of the word ' slave'.

Let me start with a verse

Romans 6 v 16: know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey, whether of sin unto death, nor of obedience unto righteousness

What is your understanding of the verse that you are the servant of whom you yield yourself to? A very clear statement made by Paul. Are you yielding to God. So if you are yielding to God, what are you then as said by paul in the above verse.


A very funny translation. Honestly, christians will never stop amusing me

babs787,

you are mixing up issues here. Paul was talking CLEARLY about being a "servant" either to sin unto death or to righteousness unto life.
The word "servant" here is used hypothetically to convey a message. How can you be a literal servant to sin? Is sin a living being?

stimulus:

@babs787,

Yep, so you say. But you can't blame me much as I was not previously a Muslim.

However, these are the following translations of the same verse of Qur'an 2 vs. 138 (with your preferred tr. given first):

Muhammad Al-Hilali & Muhsin Khan: (Our Sibghah (religion) is) the Sibghah (Religion) of Allah (Islam) and which Sibghah (religion) can be better than Allahs? And we are His worshippers. (Tafsir Ibn Katheer.)

YUSUFALI: (Our religion is) the Baptism of Allah: And who can baptize better than Allah? And it is He Whom we worship.

PICKTHAL: (We take our) colour from Allah, and who is better than Allah at colouring. We are His worshippers.

SHAKIR: (Receive) the baptism of Allah, and who is better than Allah in baptising? and Him do we serve.

MUNSHEY: (Imbue) the hue (and the halo) of Allah! What better shade of color to acquire than that of Allah? We are His sincere devotees!

SHERALI: Say, `We have adopted the religion of ALLAH; and who is better than ALLAH in teaching religion, and him alone do we worship.

SALE[/b]The [b]baptism of God have we received, and who it better than God to baptize? Him do we worship.

PALMER: The dye of God! and who is better than God at dyeing? and we are worshippers of Him.

KHALIFA: Such is GOD's system, and whose system is better than GOD's? "Him alone we worship."

RODWELL: Islam is the Baptism of God, and who is better to baptise than God? And Him do we serve.

ARBERRY: the baptism of God; and who is there that baptizes fairer than God? Him we are serving.

Again, me I no know Arabic, nor am I a scholar in Islamic literature. I'm just letting those who claim they understand enough as translators to do all the talking.

I'm interested in reading the text in Romans where Paul stated it exactly as you did.

Shalom.

wow,I thought babs once accussed the Bible of having too many translations.
who are all these translators desecrating the koran?
And how on earth did allah let them?

babyosisi:

wow,I thought babs once accussed the Bible of having too many translations.
who are all these translators desecrating the koran?
And how on earth did allah let them?

You mean I can come out now and give my own translation of the Koran?
Does Allah even exist?

@pataki

Well, you may give it your own translation but you will never come across a verse saying 500 men and another saying 5000 men. So go on and let me know when you are through so that I will buy one from you . I only pity you people how you blaspheme against Allah, no muslim will tell you that God never exist.



@babyosis,

I know you. You will always avoid issues concerning christians but the first to say anything on Islam.

You are mixing up things. I never said that there are no translators of the Quran too but read the verses very well, you will not see one saying 7000 and another saying 700.

If only you know read, and understand the Tafsir, then you will understand what I am trying to tell you that they are all saying the same regardless of the grammar being used and not a verse saying today and another saying yesterday.





@davidylan



Ok. You said that I am mixing things up. If one cant be a servant of sin, what of one being servant of God as used below:


v 22: but now that you have been set free from sin and have become slaves of God, the return you get is sanctification and its end, eternal life.


What do you have to say to the above?

Also slave of sin and slave of righteousness being used refer to Satan and God respectively. By being slave of sin, you are also slave of Satan and by being slave of righteousness, you have become slave of God as used above.

Also the below verse gives us better understanding that, whoever you receive instruction from, is your master and you are his slave

Romans 6 v 16: know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey, whether of sin unto death, nor of obedience unto righteousness.



17: but God be thanked that ye were the servants of sin, but ye have obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine which was delivered to you.

v 18: Being then made free from sin, ye became the servant of righteousness.

v 20 : When you were slaves of sin, you were free in regard to righteousness.

@davidylan,

davidylan:

babs787,

you are mixing up issues here. Paul was talking CLEARLY about being a "servant" either to sin unto death or to righteousness unto life.
The word "servant" here is used hypothetically to convey a message. How can you be a literal servant to sin? Is sin a living being?

Any intelligent reader by now should know that babs787 dribbles round issues and scoots quickly away from his own argument when faced with his inconsistencies.


@babs787,

babs787:

@stimulus

Very funny translation of the word ' slave'.

Let me start with a verse

Romans 6 v 16: know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey, whether of sin unto death, nor of obedience unto righteousness

What is your understanding of the verse that you are the servant of whom you yield yourself to? A very clear statement made by Paul. Are you yielding to God. So if you are yielding to God, what are you then as said by paul in the above verse.


A very funny translation. Honestly, christians will never stop amusing me

Well, your attention has been quickly called back to the main issue you raised. The point was not about the so-called "funny translation" - because there are as many funny translations of the Qur'an, as I've attempted to offer above in a single verse.

However, the point is that no one "gains" eternal life by being a "slave" - and I've quoted that line in yours specifically:

babs787:

Do you ever read your bible? Havent you read in the book of Romans where Paul said that you will gain eternal life by being a slave?

. . . and my rebuttal was that the Bible does not teach your assertion. Eternal life is a GIFT of God by faith through Jesus Christ (Rom. 6:23). Whether or not you understand the Biblical meaning in context of servant/slave is another thing entirely. The point is that one who is truly saved will be yielded to "serve" God in a renewed mind (Rom. 12:1-2).

babs787:

Ok. You said that I am mixing things up. If one can't be a servant of sin, what of one being servant of God as used below:

v 22: but now that you have been set free from sin and have become slaves of God, the return you get is sanctification and its end, eternal life.

Romans 6:22 - "But now being made free from sin, and become servants to God, ye have your fruit unto holiness, and the end everlasting life."

babs787:

What do you have to say to the above?

Precisely what it says.

babs787:

Also slave of sin and slave of righteousness being used refer to Satan and God respectively. By being slave of sin, you are also slave of Satan and by being slave of righteousness, you have become slave of God as used above.

Oga, wrong, and dead wrong! In Romans, Paul does not use SIN as a referral to Satan. An example, if I transliterate your suggestion that sin refers to Satan, would you not be rather confused to read the following verses in your own slant this way -

Rom. 4:8 - "Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sin Satan."

Rom. 5:21 - "That as sin Satan hath reigned unto death, even so might grace reign through righteousness God unto eternal life by Jesus Christ our Lord."

Rom. 6:2 - "God Righteousness forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin Satan, live any longer therein?"

Rom. 6:12 - "Let not sin Satan therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof."

How could you infer what you neither understand nor even know at all?

babs787:

Also the below verse gives us better understanding that, whoever you receive instruction from, is your master and you are his slave

Romans 6 v 16: know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey, whether of sin unto death, nor of obedience unto righteousness.

Oh, I see now how people often infer that you twist words around. Sorry, but that verse does not intimate your claim that "whoever you receive instruction from". A person may be yielded to sinful habits - does that mean that the sinful habit is giving such a person "instruction"??

babs787:

17: but God be thanked that ye were the servants of sin, but ye have obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine which was delivered to you.

v 18: Being then made free from sin, ye became the servant of righteousness.

v 20 : When you were slaves of sin, you were free in regard to righteousness.

As above, Paul does not use sin and righteouness to refer to Satan and God respectively; nor should you force-fit that drama in issues you don't understand.

I try not to respond to him so I don't call him names which I 've apologised for using.
I simply got tired of his "wealth of Biblical knowledge"