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The Religion Of War Iii by vedaxcool(m): 12:04pm On Jul 07, 2010
If we look at Biblical verses, aren’t the Jews actually the existential threat to Amalek?

Amalek doesn’t actually appear for the first time in Deuteronomy. As an individual, he appears in Genesis 36, as the grandson of Esau, Jacob’s brother and rival. The tribe descended from him and named after him appears in Exodus 17, where it attacks the children of Israel and is defeated. And the end of the battle story, God promises to “erase the memory of Amalek.” In Deuteronomy 25, the story is retold in all of two verses, after which God transfers responsibility, ordering the Israelites to “erase the memory of Amalek from under under heaven – do not forget.” How to erase the memory while not forgetting has provided work for generations of commentators.

In I Samuel 15, King Saul is ordered to do the erasing, wiping out every living Amelekite and even their livestock. But he fails to kill their king, Agag, and he takes the livestock as spoils. If this all isn’t shocking enough, the prophet Samuel takes care of the leftover business of Agag, and tells Samuel that because he didn’t complete the slaughter, he has lost the right to rule. Nonetheless, if “Amalek” represented real people, we could conclude here that their story is over.

Except that in the book of Esther, they pop back up again, subtly but surely. The Jews have become a Diaspora people, scattered through the Persian empire. The evil minister who would eradicate them is Haman, the “Agagite” – that is, a still surviving descendant Amalek. In this late Biblical book, the battle of Israel and Amalek is no longer between two armed tribes; it’s between the evil face of an empire and Jews, living as a minority, who can only save themselves through their wiles. Haman’s enemy in the story is Mordechai, who just happens to be descended from Kish, Saul’s father. In this rematch, the guy from Saul’s family defeats and kills the guy from Agag’s family.

Except that now the story has really become unending. Amalek appears capable of reappearing. He is entirely evil, unreformable; to defeat him means killing him, and he doesn’t quite stay dead. He could always be present, as mythical enemy of the Jews. In later generations, Amalek would be sometimes be conflated with Esau, who became the symbol of the oppressive Roman empire, and later of Christendom. In that mythical viewpoint, Amalek would have to be destroyed for the world to be redeemed.

The problem with such a mythological view is that it flies in the face of the Jewish view of human beings. In the myth, Amalek is irredeemable, evil by nature. In Jewish ethics, all human beings have free choice between good and evil. This is a rather classic religious dilemma: The mythical and ethical views of the world lead to drastically different conclusions.

One solution: Other rabbis allegorized Amalek. Amalek was the urge to do evil, lurking in every person. We have to fight the inner Amalek, we should try to erase him, we can’t forget to fight. (Note the parallel to defining true jihad as an inner spiritual battle).

There are several lessons: First, don’t try to seek to understand a religion by going back to its founding text and just reading it cold. This applies to the Hebrew Bible, the New Testament, the Quran, or any other founding text. What matters is how the text is read today, and it is usually read in several ways.

Second, looking at current enemies in mythical terms is a bad business. It dehumanizes them. It makes compromise and reconciliation impossible. It is unethical. It leads to very bad decision-making.

If there are people in Bibi’s team who think of Iran as Amalek, even one-quarter seriously, even as a mild literary metaphor, they are high-risk advisers

Islam on the other hands says in the Qur an: if one
2:256 “Let there be no compulsion in religion. Truth has been made clear from error. Whoever rejects false worship and believes in Allah has grasped the most trustworthy handhold that never breaks. And Allah hears and knows all things.”


16:82 But if they turn away from you, (O Prophet remember that) your only duty is a clear delivery of the Message (entrusted to you).

6:107 Yet if God had so willed, they would not have ascribed Divinity to aught besides him; hence, We have not made you their keeper, nor are you (of your own choice) a guardian over them.

4:79, 80 (Say to everyone of them,) 'Whatever good betides you is from God and whatever evil betides you is from your own self and that We have (O Prophet) sent you to mankind only as a messenger and all sufficing is God as witness. Whoso obeys the Messenger, he indeed obeys God. And for those who turn away, We have not sent you as a keeper."

11:28 (Noah to his people) He (Noah) said "O my people! think over it! If 1 act upon a clear direction from my Lord who has bestowed on me from Himself the Merciful talent of seeing the right way, a way which you cannot see for yourself, does it follow that we can force you to take the right path when you definitely decline to take it?°

17:53, 54 And tell my servants that they should speak in a most kindly manner (unto those who do not share their beliefs). Verily, Satan is always ready to stir up discord between men; for verily; Satan is mans foe , Hence, We have not sent you (Unto men O Prophet) with power to determine their Faith.

21:107 to 109 (O Prophet?) 'We have not sent you except to be a mercy to all mankind:" Declare, "Verily, what is revealed to me is this, your God is the only One God, so is it not up to you to bow down to Him?' But if they turn away then say, "I have delivered the Truth in a manner clear to one and all, and I know not whether the promised hour (of Judgment) is near or far."

22:67 To every people have We appointed ceremonial rites (of prayer) which they observe; therefore, let them not wrangle over this matter with you, but bid them to turn to your Lord (since that is the main objective of religion). You indeed are rightly guided. But if they still dispute you in this matter, (then say,) `God best knows (the value of) what you do."

88:21, 22; also see 24:54 And so, (O Prophet!) exhort them your task is only to exhort; you cannot compel them to believe.

48:28 He it is Who has sent forth His Messenger with the (task of spreading) Guidance and the Religion of Truth, to the end that tie make it prevail over every (false) religion, and none can bear witness to the Truth as God does.

36:16, 17 (Three Messengers to their people)Said (the Messengers), "Our Sustainer knows that we have indeed been sent unto you, but we are not bound to more than clearly deliver the Message entrusted to us.'

39:41 Assuredly, We have sent down the Book to you in right form for the good of man. Whoso guided himself by it does so to his own advantage, and whoso turns away from it does so at his own loss. You certainly are not their keeper.

42:6, 48 And whoso takes for patrons others besides God, over them does God keep a watch. Mark, you are not a keeper over them. But if they turn aside from you (do not get disheartened), for We have not sent you to be a keeper over them; your task is but to preach ,

64:12 Obey God then and obey the Messenger, but if you turn away (no blame shall attach to our Messenger), for the duty of Our Messenger is just to deliver the message.

67:25, 26 And they ask, "When shall the promise be fulfilled if you speak the Truth?" Say, "The knowledge of it is verily with God alone, and verily I am but a plain warner."

60:8 Allah forbids you not, with regard to those who fight you not for (your) Faith nor drive you out of your homes, from dealing kindly and justly with them: for Allah loveth those who are just.

60:9 Allah only forbids you, with regard to those who fight you for (your) Faith, and drive you out of your homes, and support (others) in driving you out, from turning to them (for friendship and protection). It is such as turn to them (in these circumstances), that do wrong.
Re: The Religion Of War Iii by vedaxcool(m): 2:52pm On Jul 07, 2010
VAcancy! Vacancy!! Vacancy!!!
this post is looking for highly intelligent and persons with high cerebral volume to respond not dimwits.
You are right not to respond it is too much for you. you run, off run off and go pray for the server to crash.
hahahaa it is too funny smiley
Re: The Religion Of War Iii by vedaxcool(m): 3:01pm On Jul 07, 2010
VAcancy! Vacancy!! Vacancy!!!
this post is looking for highly intelligent and persons with high cerebral volume to respond not dimwits.
You are right not to respond it is too much for you. you run, off run off and go pray for the server to crash.
hahahaa it is too funny

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