OLAADEGBU:

Rather, I think frosbel has more in common with your Society since he believes in most, if not all, of the doctrines you teach. Choosing not to fellowship with the body of Christ will expose you to false doctrines and prophets that are designed to make us go astray. If you don't fellowship means that you are not a fellow sheep.

how?

Are you saying that JW dont meet together?

What are the JW kingdom halls meant for if not to meet together?

The Post does not reflect true attitude of JWs, and the man question is truly suffering from psychiatric disorder. JW teachings are different from what a lot of replies posted here, for example one poster who call himself Knowledge4 did not even know what Bible teaches on some issue yet he is making assertion that JW are fake christian.

knowledge4: The JW deny the Deity of Christ saying that the Christ is the archangel Michael,therefore a created being and not God and no virgin birth.The Bible refuttal is clearly stated in Micah 5:2,John 1:1,John 10:30,Phil 2:5-7

JW never deny virgin birth of Jesus Christ, But as regarding the issue of archangel they have Bible references to support it. And did Bible not show that Christ was created?

The JW deny the bodily resurrection of Jesus Christ saying that he resurrected only in the spirit
The Bible refutes this wrong doctrine in Luke 24:36-46,Acts 2:23-32,1 Corinth 15

The Bible is very clear when it says: “Christ died once for all time concerning sins a righteous [person] for unrighteous ones, that he might lead YOU to God, he being put to death in the flesh, but being made alive in the spirit.” (1 Peter 3:18) Humans with flesh-and-blood bodies cannot live in heaven. Of the resurrection to heavenly life, the Bible says: “It is sown a physical body, it is raised up a spiritual body. . . . flesh and blood cannot inherit God’s kingdom.” (1 Corinthians 15:44-50) Only spirit persons with spiritual bodies can live in heaven.

The JW deny the existence of a Hell and the eternal punishment of the wicked and say that the soul of Man is mortal
The Bible refuttal is in Isaiah 66:24,Matthew 25:46,Mark 9:43,Rev 14:9-11,Rev 19:2-3,Rev 20:10-15

If man soul is not mortal why are you propagate resurrection? Maybe you still need to educate yourself on some Bible verses that you dont understand and you think they are supporting theory of hell fire and immortality of soul. Bible says that Soul does DIE. (Ezekiel 18:4)  Look! All the souls—to me they belong. As the soul of the father so likewise the soul of the son—to me they belong. The soul that is sinning—it itself will die.

The JW deny the Trinity which the Bible affirms in 1 John 5:7. If you read the Bible's 1 John 5:7,the content is different from that of the JW Bible's 1 John 5:7. The JW Bible's 1 John 5:7 is a polluted or distorted version of the Bible's 1 John 5:7

The content of 1 John 5:7 never affirms any Trinity teaching in any Bible translation except for a spurious passage added by some Trinitarian, which were not part of the Bible.

The Bible curses anyone who adds to,or removes from the Bible in order to distort its messages (Revelations 22:18-19)

And that is what some Trinitarian do by adding to 1 John 5:7.

truthislight:

how?

Are you saying that JW dont meet together?

What are the JW kingdom halls meant for if not to meet together?

Who said that you don't meet together? and for what purpose?

OLAADEGBU:

Who said that you don't meet together? and for what purpose?

they meet together to study the bible and from there the move to do their preaching from house to house.
That is their work to teach people the bible.

They dont meet together to collect tith.

They dont meet together to collect offering.

OLAADEGBU:

Who said that you don't meet together? and for what purpose?

they meet together to study the bible and from there the move to do their preaching from house to house.
That is their work to teach people the bible.

They dont meet together to collect tith.

They dont meet together to collect offering.

@The clown

I Left Jehovah's Witnesses After 28 Years
My Story by Gordon Cook


June 2000

I first met Jehovah's Witnesses (JW) in March 1971, I would be 20 the following month. I had always had an interest in the Bible, not that my parents had been religious in any sense. But I wanted to know why this particular book had such an influence on people. But really had no idea what to do about it and where to learn. My friends and I at the time used to have long discussions about religion, meaning of life etc. Sometimes when we where in a local bar, we would have everyone in the room involved. One of these friends worked with a man who was a JW (actually he was just having a study with the JWs at the time and was baptised later) and he used to come back and tell me about it. It sounded interesting and I asked to meet him. The JW arranged for me to meet another one who was more experienced. The way in which this JW answered my questions impressed me. The answers were clear, concise and logical. He used the Bible to answer questions. A regular study was arranged using the book "The Truth that Leads to Eternal Life" which is no longer used. I also started to attend the meetings at the local Kingdom Hall. I knew a few of those who were there as I worked in a local shop and they were customers.

In time I became convinced that this was the "truth" and was baptised on January 6th.1972. I was a fairly shy person and found the door-to-door preaching work hard going. But as what you were going to say was usually set out for you it wasn't to bad. Eventually I joined the Theocratic Ministry School in the congregation where you where taught to speak, give talks etc. If there is anything that I am grateful for to the JWs is that they did teach me how to get up in front of an audience and speak. By the time I left I was able to give talks, handle items on the platform ranging from 5 minutes to 45 minutes, in front of 100+ people.

One thing I must say at this point is that though this was the early 1970's and the well known year of 1975 was coming up. I can honestly say that in the congregation I was in it was never put over as a big thing, in fact it was rarely mentioned. Yet from what I have read recently other congregations took to it in a big way. In fact through the years I noticed how congregations did vary in some ways from each other.

In 1974 I got married to a JW sister. In the due course of time between 1975 to 1989 we had seven children. Of course our life centred on being JWs, attending meeting, field ministry, going to conventions etc. I became a Ministerial Servant in 1988. All in all we had a fairly good life, I didn't have a well paid job but we managed.

Through the years as a JW I never really questioned any teachings, except for the way in which Jesus Christ was sort of given a secondary role, when the Scriptures clearly stated that He was the only means if being saved. Everything was "Jehovah" centred, we must use the name of Jehovah, Jehovah did this or that, be part of Jehovah's organisation to be saved. Yet when reading the Greek scriptures, the whole emphasis is on Jesus being the only means of salvation. Every writer, Paul, James, John, Peter, Jude all spoke about Jesus with no mention of Jehovah. When asking any Elder about this I would get a vague answer, "Jehovah's the only one" or "Those scriptures are only for the 144,000." I now know that according to the Watchtower organisation the ordinary JW, (those not of the 144,000 or one of the 8,000 plus of that group left on Earth.) have no relationship with Christ, because according to the Watchtower, Christ is only mediator between Jehovah and the "anointed" 144,000. The only way an ordinary JW can approach God is through the fact that the Watchtower is the only channel.

But I digress, lets get back to where I am now. In 1989 we moved to a bigger house. This meant extra expense, 5 bedroom house, 7 children you can imagine. Also I wanted my children to have what I could give them, I wanted a family life that a JW should have. Bills kept coming in and I started to use credit cards to pay them, you can imagine what was going to happen, I took out a loan to try and pay everything off. I kept all this hidden from my wife, because I knew she wouldn't approve and also that as a JW you weren't suppose to get yourself into debt. I suppose also being from a upbringing where the man was considered the breadwinner, I felt I was letting everyone down. I am not proud of how I got into that state. If I had turned round and said "we can't afford it" it might have been different. Its with great sorrow that I feel I betrayed the trust of my wife and family. As a husband and father I wanted the best for my family and that sometimes clouds your judgment and I must carry that side of it with me. By the beginning of 1996 the pressure of all this became too much and by April I had a breakdown. I won't go in to details over what I did, but basically I walked out of the house one morning never intending to return, planning to commit suicide. I ended up in the Lake District.

One night I decided the time had come, so I took about 30 or so Paracetmol tablets, some aspirin and drank a bottle of brandy. This was while sitting on a hill overlooking a valley, it was beautiful. But I felt I had lost everything, wife, family and my God. I gradually fell unconscious, only to wake up the next morning, still on the hill, feeling awful. I went back to the guesthouse, spent the day in bed, taking even more tablets. I was still here the next day, for some reason, and so decided to head back home. Eventually I got to a hospital and told them what I had done. They put me on a drip, next day they said considering what I had taken there was hardly any trace of anything in my blood. My wife had been contacted, we had a tearful reunion. Subsequently, I was due to spend about 4 weeks in a psychiatric hospital. I was diagnosed as having acute clinical depression and that I had probably had it for about three years or more and that this was the culmination of it. I was given ECT treatment. One aside was that whenever any of the medical staff found out I was a JW. They would sort of say "Well, that explains it", one of the psychiatrists said that depression was very common amongst JW and I was the fourth one that year.

Now during all this I thought that "Jehovah's loving organisation" would help me recover. Boy! Was I wrong. While in the hospital my wife would visit, as it was some distance she usually got a lift, most times from an Elder of the congregation. You would think they would try and give me some encouragement, but they usually came and said hello then waited outside. I saw other patients visited by their ministers who spent time talking to them.

When I was allowed home I had visits from those concerned with my "case." They did not seem to be able to deal with it. The main concern was how soon can we have a "judicial committee" , they seem to spend more time talking to my wife than me. Also I got the feeling my wife was more concerned with the shame that it brought on her and what her standing in the congregation was, from the time I came home we never slept together again.

At this point I want to say thanks to one JW who helped me. Remember I still had the debts. He put me in touch with a person who deals with such things to see if they could come up with a solution, but eventually I had to be declared bankrupt. That brother paid for that person to help. Even though I had not seen him for a long time, of them all, he was the only one to give any practical help and I will always be grateful to him.

I was eventually brought before a "judicial committee" and was "privately reproved." Their whole answer to my problem was "go on the preaching work, attend meetings." To anyone who has depression the last thing you want to do is knock on doors and talk to strangers. This is when I started getting the feeling that it was not the "loving organisation" I thought it was. Over the following weeks I got the impression that I was "persona non grata."

Then one day my wife told me she wanted me to leave the home, she even found me a bedsit and paid the deposit. Later on I was told that she had been told to do this by the Elders as I was considered a "spiritual danger" to the family. I moved to another town as my wife didn't want me to attend the same congregation. My new congregation was not interested in me either. In the three years I had been there I had one visit from an Elder and that was to ask why I wasn't going on the ministry. One sister there said that in the twenty years she had been there she has never had an Elder visit her. While attending a circuit assembly an Elder from another congregation I knew came up to me and said how sorry he was to hear about what happened, he seemed to know it all, I asked how he knew, he said "There are some brothers who can't keep their mouth shut" when he was going he said "They'll get rid of you, they don't know how to deal with you, you're an embarrassment to them." Up till now I still believed the Watchtower to be God's organisation, but doubts where beginning to appear. Then one day, just over a year ago in the local library, I came across the book "Awake to the Watchtower" by Doug Harris and Bill Browning by the Reachout Trust. I picked it up and thought "another of those books against JWs" and sat down to see what lies were being said. I sat and practically read the whole book. I saw Scripture in a new light (to use a JW saying).

I felt something lift from me especially when I read about Christ being the only way to salvation, it brought back what I had thought years ago. It also brought attention to the Watchtower not being God's organisation and much more.

But I had to have more evidence, the library had recently had a computer section installed where for a fee you could use them. I decided to look on the Internet to see if there was anything. Boy! what stuff did I find! Being of a cautious nature I checked and double checked what I was finding. It was all clear evidence that for the past 28 years it had all been a lie. The Watchtower Society started to condemn the Internet, virtually saying it was Satan's tool and only apostates used it and put lies on it. I got the feeling they were scared of what it contained because they couldn't control it. I started to amass a huge amount of information, from how the WT had changed doctrine to false prophecy. I spoke to various ones over the phone, ex-JWs who had been in it for 20, 30, 40 or more years and then found out the truth. Because of learning all this I was at a meeting at the Kingdom Hall in August 1999, listening to the speaker I realised it was the same old thing "do more hours, place more books this is the only way to get spiritual and be close to God." That was my last meeting. I have never had a visit from the Elders, not even to see if I was coming to the Memorial, which is what I had decided was my cut off point, if they didn't contact me then for such an important event then they didn't care about me, so I finished with them.

I now realised that I needed to talk to someone about it. So I got in touch with the Reachout Trust and they put me in contact with one of their representatives Vince McCann, who I am grateful to for putting up with me over the last few months and giving me some spiritual support. A couple of weeks ago he took me to a Christian meeting, where we watched a film about Christ. It was a simple meeting nothing special, the person in charge, not a minister or Elder, just an ordinary man who is a Christian, gave a short talk and asked a prayer. He asked if anyone wanted to give themselves to Christ to raise their hand. I did! Now I need to learn more about Christ. There is probably a lot more I could have put in this story, but some of them are still hurtful to me.

November 2000 update

During the last 3 months I have been attending an Elim Pentecostal church. At first I found it quite strange, because it was so full of emotion. The singing, raising hands in the air, shouts of praise, people talking in tongues. All this to a JW is extremely strange and considered satanic, because of the JW view of other religions. Because of the past experience I was very wary at first and not wanting emotion to lead me down the wrong path again. But having spoken to members of this church and attended Bible classes they hold and a house group. I have come to learn that they have a genuine love for God and Christ, not based on being part of some organisation that claims to be Gods only true organisation. The only book they use is the Bible, no magazines or books like the JWs, just the Bible. When they say a Bible study that is what it is, not using some book and the Bible on the side. At the house groups they discuss various aspects of Christian life and I mean discuss, not following some format laid down by an organisation. I have started what is called a "Nurture" course where you learn about the basics of Christian faith, Christ, salvation, baptism, prayer etc. If you don't agree with some aspect of the teachings you are not considered an apostate or troublemaker. There is a great belief in the power of the Holy Spirit bringing people to God and guiding them. There is also a tremendous belief in the power of prayer, I don't think I have come across a group who pray so much at their meetings.

As time goes on I am learning more an more about the true Christian faith. I have learnt about the true Christ not the one the JWs believe is the Archangel Michael, which is an insult to both Jehovah and Christ. Oh! Yes, Christians do use the name Jehovah, maybe not as often as the JWs but they do use it and know it is God's name. They also call on people from door to door, maybe not in such a highly organised way as the JWs but they do, do it. They call it an Outreach ministry where they try to tell people about Christ and the hope and love He holds out to them. They do not tell people that they have to be part of some organisation to be saved, but to believe in Christ and follow Him.

What affect has this had on me? I feel that a burden has been lifted from me that I am no longer following the teachings of a man-made organisation who wants to control people's lives. I no longer attend meetings where you worry about what "they" think of you. No longer is the love shown to you conditional that you "toe the party line" and accept all without question. This does not mean that everything is all well, I still have periods of depression, I still have financial problems. But now I know I have someone you I can turn to and understands and no matter what happens that Christ will be there to help me through it all.

What about my family? Those children of mine who live with me have noticed a difference in me. My daughter said that I seem less inhibited and have a happier attitude, she has expressed an interest in attending one of the meetings at the church. The children who live wife my wife I see every week. Though they still go to the JW meetings with my wife they have no desire to be one. My wife has not spoken to me for about a year. I have not disassociated myself from the JWs or as far as I know I have not been disfellowshipped as when I'm out they still say hello to me. No JW elder has been to see me or contacted me in any way for 15 months since I last attended a meeting at the Kingdom Hall.

Judging by what has been happening with the Watchtower organisation in recent months over the blood doctrine and reorganisation, etc., many JWs are in a state of confusion as to what or which way they organisation is going. Some who I have spoken to have been shaken by the way the blood doctrine has been whittled away to such an extent that it barely means anything now. To them this was one of the main doctrines that set them apart from Christendom. Just like the change in the "1914 generation" teaching it has hit their confidence in the organisation. It will be interesting to see in coming months what develops.

Though my leaving the JWs has been a painful process. I now know the true meaning of relying on God and not a man-made organisation. Since my story has appeared on the Internet I have had many many letters from ex-JW's giving support, JWs wanting to leave and how difficult they find it. People wanting help in dealing with JWs, those with family or friends who are JWs or are studying with them. One thing I must say is that when I get the occasional letter from a serving JW it always has the same style, they are usually arrogant, self-righteous, and sometimes downright abusive, using words I thought a JW wouldn't know. One I received just said "You suck! I'm a JW and you're going to die at Armageddon". I always reply and ask for a reason why I should remain a JW. If I get a reply they usually say because the Watchtower organisation is God's only true one on earth, but no scriptural basis for their belief. If you tell them about the Watchtower's past, false prophecies, changes in doctrine, doctrine that changes to new then back to old, then even back again to new. They say I'm making it up, when it can all be found in their own publications.

If anyone wants to make any comment about the above please write to : swgco2@netscape.net

unfortunately,i have only heard from you now,and i have seen write up like this that tries to present jws in bad light only to get into investigations and i discovered things that jws will not compromised on which you knew before or livestyles that would tanish image of jws that cannot be condoned, like i have seen someone whom they studied with and has fully joined only to start smoking 'igbo' marijuanah and warned people not to reveal it, only to be ambushed and revealed,he felt bittered and was says that jws should have protected him,but not also thinking of the bad name that it will bring to the org.im not saying that is your case,but i have seen areas that you have hidden your faults, you edited your story, and can you pls mention your congregation and i pay an independent visit there, and im very sure that some hidden facts will be uprooted, if you know that your story is true give us the address and details of those who handled your case or direct it to barnabas_oba@yahoo.com, but know that i will come here to make my findings public,with proofs,so if you are sure, im waiting pls!

@The clown

One I received just said "You suck! I'm a JW and you're going to die at Armageddon". I always reply and ask for a reason why I should remain a JW. If I get a reply they usually say because the Watchtower organisation is God's only true one on earth,

can you reveal the person who said this above,are you sure? in your later writings above because i want to investigate.

but no scriptural basis for their belief. If you tell them about the Watchtower's past, false prophecies, changes in doctrine, doctrine that changes to new then back to old, then even back again to new. They say I'm making it up, when it can all be found in their own publications.

your claims above is laughable, because im seing ''OLAADEGBU IN DISGUISE HERE'' trying to play on emotions.

may i ask you that did jws prophecy? or it was jesus who actually did the endtime prophecy?,or that the jws actually directs your attention to what jesus says would be sign to watch out for in the endtime,or are you not aware that the 1st and 2nd world war claimed one third and two third respectively of worlds inhabitants the worst ever in human's history?,and that alone constitutes the whole sign of luke 10:21-30? and are you saying that jesus endtime prophecy would not be fuffiled? or do you join jws only to escape into Gods kingdom? you claimed to be 28yrs old but there is no sign that you are once a jws,''YOU CANNOT EVEN QUOTE ONE BIBLE VERSE IN ALL YOUR WRITE UP HERE IS NOTEWORTHY'' even a 5yr old jws will answer you logically using the bible.

you see, people who needs Gods kingdom must work for it bro.

Naturaly when ur a "light with unique lumination" critics are bound to your direction,,,,ur story is not openly reavelled,,,possibly ur an ex-JEHOVAHS WITNESS,4rm ur use of words direction on them i can say that....but been frank u hide about 85% of this story,,only to write 15% just to criticise JW's which is very unfair......am a witness for many years till date,,but i av never xperienced the wickedness ur trying to labell them with,,they are known for their love and kind heart in general,but especialy towards their felow christain brothers.....then u saying thier teachings is based on everlasting hope is only on the usage of watchtower and awake magazines is a very big lie,,non witnesess givs us credit for our usage of bible truth and recognition of Jesus christ as Jehovah's son(as some cal him god)...plz if ur here for some religious advert b open and straight to the point....criticising JW's is not the best way.....if ur story is true,,plz drop the address of ur congregation and its name.....(tripplej4rufus@yahoo.com).

@The clown;

im still waiting for the details of your claim that form the basis for this story, and ready to contact the jehovahs witnesses cong. responsible, all you need to do is give the details of all individuals in the case and send to barnabas_oba@yahoo.com, i will give detailed analysis on this forum. this is to establish the genuineness of your claim on jehovahs witnesses. [size=18pt]waiting pls! [/size]

BARRISTERS: @The clown;

im still waiting for the details of your claim that form the basis for this story, and ready to contact the jehovahs witnesses cong. responsible, all you need to do is give the details of all individuals in the case and send to barnabas_oba@yahoo.com, i will give detailed analysis on this forum. this is to establish the genuineness of your claim on jehovahs witnesses. [size=18pt]waiting pls! [/size]

Come off your high horse and smell the coffee! Information on why folks leave JW's are all over the world wide web and you are here feigning ignorance. Help yourself to a videolink of why people leave JW's


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Aov4lWw3H0s

And if you would'nt or cannot watch it then below is a summary of what was said:

In 1997, I started studying with the Jehovah's Witnesses. They were so sincere, so studious and so kind. After a year or so, I began going out in field service as an un-baptized publisher.

Much to my chagrin, I had mistaken their sincerity for accuracy. Have you done the same? Are you doing the same?

You see, the more I learned about the Jehovah's Witnesses, the more I discovered that many of their key teaching are man-made. And to help you and your loved ones conduct your research, I created www.JWTruth.org to help you find the facts in a clear, concise and compelling manner.

We will examine many of the prophesies and beliefs of the Jehovah's Witnesses- from their prophesy that the world would end in 1975, to the belief that Jesus would return in 1914 and their belief in the chosen 144,000.

My intention is to educate and create dialogue in a loving and helpful manner. For more information on me and our team, please visit http://www.JWTruth.org

@OLAADEGBU,

Come off your high horse and smell the coffee! Information on why folks leave JW's are all over the world wide web and you are here feigning ignorance. Help yourself to a videolink of why people leave JW's

I HAVE ONLY ASK FOR DETAILS FOR INVESTIGATION, AND IM NOT GOING TO CHARGE YOU, BUT YOU AND YOUR MEN ARE BRINGING CONCORTED CLAIMS THAT NEED TO BE INVESTIGATED, DO YOU UNDERSTAND MY ENGLISH, GIVE ME DETAILS OF THE CONGREGATION AND ELDERS INVOLVED,SO THAT PEOPLE CAN ALSO HAVE THEIR OWN VIEW SO THAT EVERYONE ON THE FORUM WILL BE OUR JUDGE.
ANYBODY CAN SIT DOWN ANYWHERE TO FORMULATE A LIE. BUT FAILURE TO GIVE THE NAMES OF ELDERS AND CONG. INVOLVED SHOWS THAT YOU ARE A LIAR.
REMEMBER THAT IM NOT YET A JWS, BUT I DARED YOU TO SUPPLY THE DETAILS THAT CAN REALLY BE CONFIRMED, AND I WILL GET BACK HERE FOR FEEDBACK SIMPLE!!!

THE GUY IN THE VIDEO CLAIMED THAT HE IS 'AN UNBAPTISED PUBLISHER' MEANING THAT HE IS NOT A JEHOVAH'S WITNESSES.CONFIRMED BAPTISED WITNESSES CAN ONLY BE REVIEWED!

In 1997, I started studying with the Jehovah's Witnesses. They were so sincere, so studious and so kind. After a year or so, I began going out in field service as an un-baptized publisher.

THIS ADDMITTANCE ON HIS SIDE HAD ALREADY NULLIFIED ANY CLAIM IN THE VIDEO AS NULL VOID AND OF NO EFFECT. SUPPLY FACTS PLS. if you want it privately,forward it here; barnabas_oba@yahoo.com

BUT I WILL COME HERE FOR THE FEEDBACK. WAITING PLS!

That was just the intro wait till you hear all about it.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4RixC0o5gVA

@OLAADEGBU

Just to show you that i have went through the purported video,and found nothing substancial as evidence, its just a calculated charade to promote a new church.
The man Daniel Grisson in the video is a businessman with some ideas about sales, he holds a masters degree, and for that reason he finds things like this below,very difficult to abide with;

hebrews 13:17

''Obey your leaders and submit to their authority. They keep watch over you as men who must give an account. Obey them so that their work will be a joy, not a burden, for that would be of no advantage to you''.

while he was still learning with jws as claimed by him, he simply would not comply with simple instructions best known to him because he believed that there must be a reason for giving instructions in the first place.

so, he failed to cooperate with the direction of the leaders,simple!
he also believed that direction given on 1914 and jesus coming does not satisfy his own personal belief.

But the fact remains that he confessed not to be a baptised jws, and that alone shows that he did not even went through their learning process and even if he attain few knowledge, his masters degree makes him more superior to be a jws. isn'nt it?

but he admitted below;

Today, I am a baptized Christian and[b] a member of Cross Pointe Church in Duluth, GA.[/b]

a church founded less that a decade ago, so he wants to recruit many to join Cross Pointe Church

nothing can be put together on the site www.JWtruth.org and his targets are new people who are prospective jws, finish.

but back to the topic,Daniel claimed innacuracy in 1914 calculation, when he also countered himself that he was an 'unbaptised witness' which shows that he had not even sit down to link bible prophecy with the i914 issue and no counter proof on his own part dispell the jws stand on 1914 other than verbal rejection, and that is noteworthy!!!

his 'sincerity for innaccuracy' brand shows that he is puffed up with knowlege and wordly wisdom,i saw Daniel videos bosting about what jws termed 'wordly things' or 'material aquisitions',jws are not saying its bad,but in parallel with 'the faith' can daniel boast in faith the way he boasted in tutoring brands? but what did apostle paul says about understanding Gods word, he identified 'one' particular barrier, see the bolded below;

1 corinthians 1:20-21;
20 Where is the wise person? Where is the teacher of the law? Where is the philosopher of this age? [size=14pt]Has not God made foolish the wisdom of the world?[/size] 21 For since in the wisdom of God the world through its wisdom did not know him, [size=18pt]God was pleased through the foolishness of what was preached to save those who believe.[/size]

so simple, he viewed jws as promoting foolishness, but here is a piece for that in the bible;God was pleased through the foolishness of what was preached to save those who believe.

now, can you now forward details of jws that the OP said was involve in his case? to my link above for investigation, im waiting pls.

This thread still dey?

The Clown,

This thread still dey?

im still waiting for the details of your claim that form the basis for this story, and ready to contact the jehovahs witnesses cong. responsible, all you need to do is give the details of all individuals in the case and send to barnabas_oba@yahoo.com, i will give detailed analysis on this forum. this is to establish the genuineness of your claim on jehovahs witnesses.

OLAADEGBU:

Come off your high horse and smell the coffee! Information on why folks leave JW's are all over the world wide web and you are here feigning ignorance. Help yourself to a videolink of why people leave JW's


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Aov4lWw3H0s

And if you would'nt or cannot watch it then below is a summary of what was said:

i was almost thinking Ola will dere list what JW teach that is false so that we can use it to educate people here on this thread

but he refered us to a link of JW detractors.

Sorry Ola. Next time list what they teach that is false.
Peace

The Clown: This thread still dey?

have you shown up?

We have been waiting.

frosbel:


The days of using scripture to deceive the masses is over.

Do you know that where 2 or 3 are gathered together in the name of Jesus , that he is there -

"For where two or three come together in my name, there am I with them." - Matthew 18:20

For example I have fellowship with my wife and children, this is also acceptable in the sight of GOD.

I also fellowship in a NON-DENOMINATIONAL church where I live with no strings attached. Just praise God, share the word but no compulsion to adhere to any particular doctrine or do things in a certain way that pleases the pastor.

JW, Catholic church , mega churches , and the likes are all Man made 'control freak' cults.

Incidentally:

- the founder of the JW religion started out by calling organised religion a fraud
- the JWs held on to that belief until they became big
- and then it became compulsory to attend up to 5 different 'meetings' (indoctrination classes) every week
- ordinary JWs are not allowed to gather together on their own, by their choice
- they are not also allowed to study the bible independently: they must use Watchtower materials
- any interpretation not sanctioned by the leaders is 'demonic', and means apostasy; JWs who do this can be expelled & shunned
- the JW leaders today claim ordinary JWs do not have Jesus as mediator to God (the leaders are the mediators)
- for other special JWs (those that will go to heaven, < 10,000), Jesus is their mediator
- this means, essentially that: all ordinary JWs are subservient to the leaders; the leaders at the same time claim to be invisible
- and because the leaders claim they are "God's mouthpiece", or "God's only channel" to earth today, ordinary JWs are 'trapped'
- JWs don't excplain these things to their new recruits; most recruits find out when it is too late

.

Incidentally:

- the founder of the JW religion started out by calling organised religion a fraud

is it a lie? catholic is a fraud,and big one, with proofs,so no apology, i concur.

- the JWs held on to that belief until they became big
- and then it became compulsory to attend up to 5 different 'meetings' (indoctrination classes) every week
- ordinary JWs are not allowed to gather together on their own, by their choice
- they are not also allowed to study the bible independently: they must use Watchtower materials
- any interpretation not sanctioned by the leaders is 'demonic', and means apostasy; JWs who do this can be expelled & shunned
- the JW leaders today claim ordinary JWs do not have Jesus as mediator to God (the leaders are the mediators)
- for other special JWs (those that will go to heaven, < 10,000), Jesus is their mediator
- this means, essentially that: all ordinary JWs are subservient to the leaders; the leaders at the same time claim to be invisible
- and because the leaders claim they are "God's mouthpiece", or "God's only channel" to earth today, ordinary JWs are 'trapped'
- JWs don't excplain these things to their new recruits; most recruits find out when it is too late

can you supply proofs to back you claims above, broda-elenu-gboro!

Nimshi:

Incidentally:

- the founder of the JW religion started out by calling organised religion a fraud
- the JWs held on to that belief until they became big
- and then it became compulsory to attend up to 5 different 'meetings' (indoctrination classes) every week
- ordinary JWs are not allowed to gather together on their own, by their choice
- they are not also allowed to study the bible independently: they must use Watchtower materials
- any interpretation not sanctioned by the leaders is 'demonic', and means apostasy; JWs who do this can be expelled & shunned
- the JW leaders today claim ordinary JWs do not have Jesus as mediator to God (the leaders are the mediators)
- for other special JWs (those that will go to heaven, < 10,000), Jesus is their mediator
- this means, essentially that: all ordinary JWs are subservient to the leaders; the leaders at the same time claim to be invisible
- and because the leaders claim they are "God's mouthpiece", or "God's only channel" to earth today, ordinary JWs are 'trapped'
- JWs don't excplain these things to their new recruits; most recruits find out when it is too late

.

Frosbel knows better than you a muslim.

You that insult Yahweh, that he is a tribal God.

You that tells lies.

You have been ask to present evidence on pdf that shows where the JW predicted a particular day that the world will end.

Jesus by the way said that the day/hour no one knows.

Jesus did not say the year no one knows.

You people just twisted what the JW said and pelted on this forum.

So, come up with the evidence.

Liar.

@nimshi

you have lied again o!

What with 10,000

That is the way you have been lying against the JW.

Lol.

This is child's play

truthislight: @nimshi

you have lied again o!

What with 10,000

That is the way you have been lying against the JW.

Lol.

This is child's play

Do you also have an arithmetic impediment?

I wrote '<10,000', meaning - oh, dear, must I explain this?! - 'less than 10,000'

Isn't that correct for the number of the 'remnant' your religion claims remains of the 144,000?

Years of Watchtower indoctrination appears to have stagnated your reasoning. This is a sorry thing.

.

Barrister u always ask people to prove and show evidence to back their claims. can u provide an evidence; in fact gice me a scanned evidence to show that catholic is a fraud or to show that JW is not a fraud

Barrister u always ask people to prove and show evidence to back their claims. can u provide an evidence; in fact give me a scanned evidence to show that catholic is a fraud or to show that JW is not a fraud

[quote author=Horus]The Jehovah's Witnesses racist message and racism that white is good, and brown, red, and yellow are bad is quite blatant. With  millions of Jehovah's Witnesses, of multi races and nationalities that are a part of the organization, why aren't any of the prophets, prophetesses, princes, princesses, priests, Adam and Eve, Jesus, or pharaohs of a different race than Caucasian? Moreover, please don't say that it doesn't matter because if it didn't, then they all wouldn't be Caucasians. Moreover, if it really didn't “matter” you wouldn't have made any pictures at all! [/

You views above are totally untrue and shocking. Jehovahs Witnesses are the most all embracing of religions(John 13:25). There is a lot of intermarraige between races and those who serve at the Branch offices can attest to this.

I am a Witness and I feel for you. If you felt let down, you are definitely not the first. Apostle felt that way in his most trying period(2 Timothy 4:16). This really depressed him. Remember his end was drawing near(2 timothy 4:6-.

Yet, he did not abandon Jehovah- he continued preaching with renewed zeal (2 Timothy 4:17-18). You can do the same.

I noticed you tried to do some soul searching. This is good (Proverbs 19:11).

Your taking a large loan was well meaning but without your wife's consent was wrong whether it turned out "well" or not.
Without your wife's consent it is a dangerous stunt and it rocks the trust which is a foundation of a good marriage.

Your wife seemed more interested in spiritual things and was probably contented with the way things were(Proverbs 31:10-31). She probably loved you.

Her handling of the after effect of your suicide attempt was disappointing. That STILL is your side of the story. We need to know her side.

I suspect she was devastated and overwhelmed by what happened. Her world crumbled. Can you imagine how David Oyedepo would feel if his wife attempted suicide. It sends a message. It would devastate him and his Church. Will it not take him time to recover that is if he does.

Your attempt probably did the same to her.

Also, I suspect you might not have made the truth fully yours. Perhaps you lacked the zeal and passion.

We have a great crowd of witnesses (Hebrews 11) who suffered persecutions and some even wished for death such as Job and Jeremiah. But they did not tire out.

The having 4 witnesses in the hospital in 1 year alone is nothing impressive. We stand out! Secondly we tend to be far more enlightened about mental health issues and many elders would even advise you seek medical help rather than simply rely on prayers and ignorance (Luke 5:31). Though Pentecostals far outnumber us, they are splinted into several churches so may go undetected when they simply state pentecostal or born again. We witnesses are a large block. In some lands, we are in the top 10 religious group and some even top 5.

I don't understand how you can leave. Yes you have "grounds"(6:60-67). But where will you turn to? (John 6:68-69)

I don't understand how you can go a church where there is a special seat for pastor and his wife or where their picture will be hanging in the church or on posters everywhere.

Or where they go round with a bag collecting tithes, offering and sowing seed. Where the monthly church earnings are not accounted for as is done in the congregation.

Where there is a competitive spirit and you can be sure that many of the junior pastors are only dying to break forth and start their own church and become big time pastors. How can you cope hearing someone call the pastor"daddy" or the wife "mummy"(Matthew 23:1-13). Many of these churches are not conscious we are in the last days.Matthew 24:36-40)

It can be a challenge living a Christian life (Romans 7:14-23). But we can win the war (Romans 7:24-25)

Please come back (Romans 8:38,39). I beg you.

Pls go to www.jw.org. We have some new songs now and they are faith strengthening. You come to realise that you are worth more than 2 small sparrows.

My co-nairalanders,
it's unfortunate that many people dont reason well before they post. What is the big-D in the man's narration? Is he the first person to be converted from one sect to other?
The summary of it all is that, what rules you is in your mind. If this man had enjoyed love from the organization, he would not have dissociated himself.
Love is paramount irrespective of doctrine or organisation. You have freedom to join any group but if not treated well, the decision is left in your mind.
We have read pathetic stories of christians converted to Islam and from Islam to christianity as well. This is should not mean the former group is bad.
Because this man left JW does not mean JW is bad, as some of you concluded.
What of some pastors who use bible and christ name to seduce and extort people?
Wakeup!
Dont alllow people to think for you. This man was a victim of another man's thought but the day he realised that he was under bondage of another man's thought, he reversed. Such is life.
Why did God create man with mind? It is the only resource to triumph on this planet. All inventors did not use the name of jesus or mahammad or JW to discover a lot, but their minds. So dont allow any story to confuse you. Whether you belong to any group or not, your mind will work.
Someone founded JW, you too can start your own, just like Latter day saint, sat guru maraj, olumba olumba, brotherhoo, church of satan, reformed fraternity, etc
let you mind work for you

truthislight:

i was almost thinking Ola will dere list what JW teach that is false so that we can use it to educate people here on this thread

but he refered us to a link of JW detractors.

Sorry Ola. Next time list what they teach that is false.
Peace

Former JW's tell it all here.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9AuXDy4kqDs

lets see OLAADEGBU'S pope conspiracy with hitler that makes catholics soldiers kill each other;

knowledge4:
Their assembly is known as kingdom halls.They believe that all religions,churches and governments are organizations controlled by Satan.Their doctrines are at total variance with the doctrines of the Bible.

To be fair to all, christian doctrines are nothing short of gradually developed man-made, copy and use pagan doctrines and dogma that have come to be norms in christian worships. JW founders understood these realities that is why it was easy for them like the old copy cat Roman Bishops to write their own religious doctrines and dogma using attractive religious elements like christian did with the Jewish tradition and the prevailing pagan practice of the time.

knowledge4:
The JW deny the Deity of Christ saying that the Christ is the archangel Michael,therefore a created being and not God and no virgin birth.The Bible refuttal is clearly stated in Micah 5:2,John 1:1,John 10:30,Phil 2:5-7

JW are not the first to have questioned the deification of christ or him being of thesame nature as God. The whole trinity doctrine and the explanations behind them are very pagan and imposed by the Roman Emperors and Roman Bishops. There is nothing devine about the claims.
The whole story about Christ is nothing short of gnosticism.
Micah 5v2
New International Version (©1984) "But you, Bethlehem Ephrathah, though you are small among the clans of Judah, out of you will come for me one who will be ruler over Israel, whose origins are from of old, from ancient times."
The messiah described in this jewish scripture is nothing close to the ones described in the canonical gospels or the gnostic Pauline epistles. Neither is Jesus the Jewish messiah Micah was talking about.
As for the narratives of the canonical gospels John, Mathew, Mark and luke they have all been proven to be altered works of forgeries from Roman church fathers. Whatever narratives they give about Jesus's life, they are not reliable The Pauline Epistles are not any different either they are modified version of early gnostic christian writings, in their raw forms and even in the new versions, the Jesus described in these epistles are quite different from the one in the canonical gospels.
First of all the canonical gospels are written works of unknown authors, besides, they are canonical because they are the accounts from the very numerous gospel narratives of Jesus Christ in circulation that the Early church father and thought was fitting of their own story of christ, they are holy and sacred because they have been voted by a panel of Roman church bishops and Roman politicians not because they are the devine words of God.
So it will be good that you don't use the bible alone as basis to arrive at your conclusion that JW is false or whatever. Religion itself is man-made, the divinity around it is as well man-made, just because approaches differ does not make anyone right or wrong.

numo86: @poster......
So ur still wondering if Jesus is d arch angel
Jehovahs witnesses dnt 100 percent call Jesus d arch angel....but evidences from d scriptures is what brought about that conclusion...if there were never scriptures supportin that fact would we have bothered our head about it??
Its not becos we just wanna conclude....
Its becos no other person can feel d shoes of micheal d arch angel......
I mean who would u say d arch angel is
We delve into various bible points and come out with sound reasonings.....
Which other person ,appointed by Yahweh has d sole right to defeat satan and his angels if not Jesus?
For ur latest information not only Jehovahs witnesses now conclude that micheal is Jesus...other theologians and scholars now agree with that fact.....because d evidence is just there...
I recently had this same discussion with a close freind of mine who has been on us for a long time and he did his own internet research and drew d same conclusion.......
Is it d angel mention after d ARCH that's ur problem or what
Trinitarians never agree with d arch angel stuff becos they feel Jesus can never be an angel...has that become ur view now too??
But I'll tell u to go check d meaning of an angel and then u might as well re-conclude that Jesus was and is 1......
Because he was and is always sent....(Messanger).......even Jesus was an apostle.....

Let's just begin wit d arch angel issue.....
Is that ur email up there u wrote??

Can u pls give bible references that refer to Jesus as an angel?

Can olaadegbu explain why pope conspired with hitler to cause catholics soldiers killing each other, someone have asked earlier before but there was'nt an answer!

is it right for a cleric to bless amunitions,not meant for killing animals but fellow humans,does it please or show respect to God who cause lives to exist?