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Luke 19:27:
"But those mine enemies, which would not that I should reign over them, bring hither, and slay them before me."


Exodus 32:26-28:
"Then Moses stood in the gate of the camp, and said, Who is on the LORD's side? let him come unto me. And all the sons of Levi gathered themselves together unto him. And he said unto them, Thus saith the LORD God of Israel, Put every man his sword by his side, and go in and out from gate to gate throughout the camp, and slay every man his brother, and every man his companion, and every man his neighbour. And the children of Levi did according to the word of Moses: and there fell of the people that day about three thousand men."

Numbers 25:1-9:
"And Israel abode in Shittim, and the people began to commit whoredom with the daughters of Moab. And they called the people unto the sacrifices of their gods: and the people did eat, and bowed down to their gods, And the LORD said unto Moses, Take all the heads of the people, and hang them up before the LORD against the sun, And, behold, one of the children of Israel came and brought unto his brethren a Midianitish woman in the sight of Moses, and in the sight of all the congregation, And when Phinehas, saw it, he rose up, and took a javelin in his hand, and thrust both of them through, So the plague was stayed from the children of Israel. And those that died in the plague were twenty and four thousand."

1 Kings 18:17-40:
"And it came to pass, when Ahab saw Elijah, that Ahab said unto him, Art thou he that troubleth Israel? And he answered, I have not troubled Israel; but thou, and thy father's house, in that ye have forsaken the commandments of the LORD, and thou hast followed Baalim. Now therefore send, and gather to me all Israel unto mount Carmel, and the prophets of Baal four hundred and fifty, and the prophets of the groves four hundred, which eat at Jezebel's table, And call ye on the name of your gods, and I will call on the name of the LORD: and the God that answereth by fire, let him be God. And all the people answered and said, It is well spoken, Then the fire of the LORD fell, and consumed the burnt sacrifice, and the wood, and the stones, and the dust, and licked up the water that was in the trench. And when all the people saw it, they fell on their faces: and they said, The LORD, he is the God; the LORD, he is the God. And Elijah said unto them, Take the prophets of Baal; let not one of them escape. And they took them: and Elijah brought them down to the brook Kishon, and slew them there."


Numbers 16:20:
"And the LORD spake unto Moses and unto Aaron, saying, Separate yourselves from among this congregation, that I may consume them in a moment. And they fell upon their faces, and said, O God, the God of the spirits of all flesh, shall one man sin, and wilt thou be wroth with all the congregation?"

Numbers 16:31-33:
", the ground clave asunder that was under them: And the earth opened her mouth, and swallowed them up, and their houses, and all the men that appertained unto Korah, and all their goods. They, and all that appertained to them, went down alive into the pit, and the earth closed upon them: and they perished from among the congregation."

2 Samuel 12:26-31:
", Joab fought against Rabbah of the children of Ammon, and took the royal city. And Joab sent messengers to David, and said, I have fought against Rabbah, and have taken the city of waters. Now therefore gather the rest of the people together, and encamp against the city, and take it: lest I take the city, and it be called after my name. And David gathered all the people together, and went to Rabbah, and fought against it, and took it, And he brought forth the people that were therein, and put them under saws, and under harrows of iron, and under axes of iron, and made them pass through the brick-kiln: and thus did he unto all the cities of the children of Ammon."

@Dayokanu: « #179 on: Today at 06:47:25 PM »
[Quote]Quote from: Sweetnecta on Today at 05:58:41 PM
Muslims were in the mix of those who protested. Yet George Bush said to every one of the Christian to "K--s off". What is the value of protests that makes no impact? In Texas, during the reign of Bush, somebody said "F--k you" to Cheney, the same thing he had said to Senator Leahy of Vermont, the secret service got the guy down the road.

Muslims protests and have TV shows denouncing any ounce of evil committed and discouraging ignorance that will lead a person to commit any; WWW.TheDEEN SHOW.COM and there are many more that you can learn about Islam.

They protested against Bush and Israel which goes to show that they dont support it.

If you protest against something what does that mean? It doesnt matter if your wish gets done at the end or not, the Fact is that you dont support it and George Bush did not act based on their wishes.

When would moderate Moslems do the same and condemn publicly the "extremists"[/Quote]There was no protest from conservative christians, and almost the whole congress body; senate and house of representatives supported the war against Iraq, and those who went against it were the ultra liberals. Lets leave it to the christians because here in NYC, the jews are advocating the killing of all palestinians, just like the nazis did of them in the 1940s.



[Quote]Quote
Your Ogbomosho people who are muslims are head and shoulders better in human decency than Benjamin Adekunle from the same Ogbomosho who didn't see a human moving that he would not want to kill.

By the way, i am a yoruba man, so there is no ethnic bashing in my statement.

What did Benjamin Adekunle do that was bad? In case you dont know he is well revered in the town as a man who avenged the gruesome killing of a prominent Ogbomoso man Ladoke Akintola.

It was in a war situation, if the Ibos dont have scruples killing our leader on his bed in front of his wife, for not committing any offense, why should Adekunle have any scruples about repaying back in 100 folds[/Quote]tell you are too young to know the terror of Adekunle first hand and you were told the beauty of his "handwork" by evil minded Christians who refused to obey the turn the other cheek of jesus Christ? Ladoke Akintola, though i liked the man, and i know that you have said he was your grand Uncle, was no longer an ogbomosho property when he went into politics. you live in the USA, at least you should know that politicians are public figures. Killing a people because of their death is almost bordering genocide. Unfortunately, this was a crime of christians against christians. i remembered the evil jack gowon got married to victoria and spend millions of pounds on that wedding while nigerians were being slaughtered by nigerians. this is the good thing you are comparing islam to be inferior to?

Adekunle didn't stop at 100 folds, more like 10s of 1000 folds. we in high school then used to say he was drinking human blood. and if adekunle was a muslim, he would have known that Muhammad [as] said not to kill women and children and non combatants. Neither Ojukwu nor Gowon who are christians stopped at killing anything that moved, too. I remember that the biafrans raped the heck out of bini women. All of you were christians and none of these behaviors was advocated by Jesus. you dont see muslims blaming Christianity, until you blame Islam for the evil of deviant muslims. i am sure dayokanu is better than what he wrote. he must have been improved from his former ogbomosho bloodletting in the style of adekunle to bush junior preemptive strike cowboy mentality.

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Deuteronomy 25:11-12
“If two Israelite men get into a fight and the wife of one tries to rescue her husband by grabbing the testicles of the other man, 12 you must cut off her hand. Show her no pity.

Deuteronomy 7:1-2
“When the LORD your God brings you into the land you are about to enter and occupy, he will clear away many nations ahead of you: the Hittites, Girgashites, Amorites, Canaanites, Perizzites, Hivites, and Jebusites. These seven nations are greater and more numerous than you. 2 When the LORD your God hands these nations over to you and you conquer them, you must completely destroy[a] them. Make no treaties with them and show them no mercy.

Deuteronomy 20:16
16 In those towns that the LORD your God is giving you as a special possession, destroy every living thing.

Exodus 22:20
"He that sacrificeth unto any god, save unto the LORD only, he shall be utterly destroyed."

Psalms 79:6:
"Pour out thy wrath upon the heathen that have not known thee, and upon the kingdoms that have not called upon thy name."

Deuteronomy 13:6-10
"If thy brother, the son of thy mother, or thy son, or thy daughter, or the wife of thy bosom, or thy friend, which is as thine own soul, entice thee secretly, saying, Let us go and serve other gods, which thou hast not known, thou, nor thy fathers; Namely, of the gods of the people which are round about you, nigh unto thee, or far off from thee, from the one end of the earth even unto the other end of the earth; Thou shalt not consent unto him, nor hearken unto him; neither shall thine eye pity him, neither shalt thou spare, neither shalt thou conceal him: But thou shalt surely kill him; thine hand shall be first upon him to put him to death, and afterwards the hand of all the people. And thou shalt stone him with stones, that he die, "


Deuteronomy 13:12-15
"If thou shalt hear say in one of thy cities, which the LORD thy God hath given thee to dwell there, saying, Certain men, the children of Belial, are gone out from among you, and have withdrawn the inhabitants of their city, saying, Let us go and serve other gods, which ye have not known; Then shalt thou inquire, and make search, and ask diligently; and, behold, if it be truth, and the thing certain, that such abomination is wrought among you; Thou shalt surely smite the inhabitants of that city with the edge of the sword, destroying it utterly, and all that is therein, and the cattle thereof, with the edge of the sword."

1 King 18:19; 18:40
"Now therefore send, and gather to me all Israel unto mount Carmel, and the prophets of Baal four hundred and fifty, and the prophets of the groves four hundred, which eat at Jezebel's table, And Elijah said unto them, Take the prophets of Baal; let not one of them escape. And they took them: and Elijah brought them down to the brook Kishon, and slew them there."


Deuteronomy 17:2-5
"If there be found among you, within any of thy gates which the LORD thy God giveth thee, man or woman, that hath wrought wickedness in the sight of the LORD thy God, in transgressing his covenant, And hath gone and served other gods, and worshipped them, either the sun, or moon, or any of the host of heaven, which I have not commanded; And it be told thee, and thou hast heard of it, and inquired diligently, and, behold, it be true, and the thing certain, that such abomination is wrought in Israel: Then shalt thou bring forth that man or that woman, which have committed that wicked thing, unto thy gates, even that man or that woman, and shalt stone them with stones, till they die."

2 Chronicles 15:10-15
"So they gathered themselves together at Jerusalem, And they entered into a covenant to seek the LORD God of their fathers with all their heart and with all their soul; That whosoever would not seek the LORD God of Israel should be put to death, whether small or great, whether man or woman. [The LORD] was found of them: and the LORD gave them rest round about."

Palms 139:19-22:
"Surely thou wilt slay the wicked, O God: Depart from me therefore, ye bloodthirsty men. For they speak against thee wickedly, And thine enemies take (thy name) in vain. Do not I hate them, O Jehovah, that hate thee? And am not I grieved with those that rise up against thee? I hate them with perfect hatred: They are become mine enemies."

Is-lam(e) is a religion of piss, tolerates, if not encourages terrorism,  paed.ophilia and oppression of women.
Christian pastors are mostly thieves and catholic bishops love sleeping with boys.
Both religions are basically Middle Eastern mythology invented by some cave-dwelling men high on hashish.
Their followers hardly reason on their own and believe blindly on a book purported to be from "God". Both groups have killed their fellow humans in the name of that thing they call "God".

@LagosShia You are a monkey for supporting your brother who are distroying the world

ovo4u:

@LagosShia You are a monkey for supporting your brother who are distroying the world

and you're a baboon for accusing me of supporting anyone who is destroying the world.

[size=28pt]The history of Islam is the history of terrorism.

You need to know more about the life of the founder and not from what is written in the Koran.

How did the founder lead his daily life?

I have addressed this in my historical fiction that is only available underground, because majority of Muslims prefer to live in denial of the TRUTH.

Read the following.

The Origins of the Sunni/Shia split in Islam
After Ali's army defeated Aisha's forces at the Battle of the Camel in 656, , The division between the Shia and what came to be known as the Sunni was set. , 4) Hajj (Pilgrimage to Makkah) 5) Khums (The Charity of 20%) ,
www.islamfortoday.com/shia.htm[/size]

@BetaThings,

LagosShia and Sweetnecta are the types that are the problem of Islam and why people like you are tarnished for your religion.

If you cannot find a way of clearly separating yourself and your likes from their likes and the cretinous fundamentalist, the people that are victims or potential victims of their evil will have no option but to group you all together and treat you as the same since that it the lowest common denominator they can get to. That is "Muslims", not the "bad muslims and their active/passive supporters".

Orikinla:

The history of Islam is the history of terrorism.

You need to know more about the life of the founder and not from what is written in the Koran.

so when the Quran which describes him as "of sublime morals" is not your source,then is lala land your source?

what does shia-sunni split got to do with what we are talking about?why present a one sided (sunni) account on the issue?or is it a lame attempt by you to divide us muslims in this thread into sunni and shia?i appeal to my sunni brothers to join hands together to expose the nonsense your type is spreading here against our Islam,Quran and Prophet (sa).

the fight against oppression and struggling for justice has nothing to do with our dicussion.mumu!

IN.CEST IN THE BIBLE:


1.) Lot In.cestous encounter with his daughters:

Genesis 19:33-35
33And they made their father drink wine that night: and the firstborn went in, and lay with her father; and he perceived not when she lay down, nor when she arose.

34And it came to pass on the morrow, that the firstborn said unto the younger, Behold, I lay yesternight with my father: let us make him drink wine this night also; and go thou in, and lie with him, that we may preserve seed of our father.

35And they made their father drink wine that night also: and the younger arose, and lay with him; and he perceived not when she lay down, nor when she arose.

2.) Jacob Son's Incestous replationship with his father's wife:

Genesis 35:22
22And it came to pass, when Israel dwelt in that land, that Reuben went and lay with Bilhah his father's concubine: and Israel heard it. Now the sons of Jacob were twelve:


3.) Judah (ancestor of your "lord and savior" commits prostitution and in.cest and pregnantes his son's wife

Genesis 38:15-18
15When Judah saw her, he thought her to be an harlot; because she had covered her face.

16And he turned unto her by the way, and said, Go to, I pray thee, let me come in unto thee; (for he knew not that she was his daughter in law.) And she said, What wilt thou give me, that thou mayest come in unto me?

17And he said, I will send thee a kid from the flock. And she said, Wilt thou give me a pledge, till thou send it?

18And he said, What pledge shall I give thee? And she said, Thy signet, and thy bracelets, and thy staff that is in thine hand. And he gave it her, and came in unto her, and she conceived by him.


IN.CEST AND RA.PE BETWEEN BROTHER AND SISTER(children of "holy" David)

2 Samuel 13:5-14 :
5And Jonadab said unto him, Lay thee down on thy bed, and make thyself sick: and when thy father cometh to see thee, say unto him, I pray thee, let my sister Tamar come, and give me meat, and dress the meat in my sight, that I may see it, and eat it at her hand.

6So Amnon lay down, and made himself sick: and when the king was come to see him, Amnon said unto the king, I pray thee, let Tamar my sister come, and make me a couple of cakes in my sight, that I may eat at her hand.

7Then David sent home to Tamar, saying, Go now to thy brother Amnon's house, and dress him meat.

8So Tamar went to her brother Amnon's house; and he was laid down. And she took flour, and kneaded it, and made cakes in his sight, and did bake the cakes.

9And she took a pan, and poured them out before him; but he refused to eat. And Amnon said, Have out all men from me. And they went out every man from him.

10And Amnon said unto Tamar, Bring the meat into the chamber, that I may eat of thine hand. And Tamar took the cakes which she had made, and brought them into the chamber to Amnon her brother.

11And when she had brought them unto him to eat, he took hold of her, and said unto her, Come lie with me, my sister.

12And she answered him, Nay, my brother, do not force me; for no such thing ought to be done in Israel: do not thou this folly.

13And I, whither shall I cause my shame to go? and as for thee, thou shalt be as one of the fools in Israel. Now therefore, I pray thee, speak unto the king; for he will not withhold me from thee.

14Howbeit he would not hearken unto her voice: but, being stronger than she, forced her, and lay with her.



WHOLESALE RA.PING AND IN.CEST BETWEEN SON (of David) AND HIS MOTHERS!


2 Samuel 16:22
22So they spread Absalom a tent upon the top of the house; and Absalom went in unto his father's concubines in the sight of all Israel

BIBLICAL GOD GIVES AWAY THE WIVES OF HIS BELOVED DAVID TO BE RA.PED AS PUNISHMENT!

2 Samuel 12:11-12
11Thus saith the LORD, Behold, I will raise up evil against thee out of thine own house, and I will take thy wives before thine eyes, and give them unto thy neighbour, and he shall lie with thy wives in the sight of this sun.

12For thou didst it secretly: but I will do this thing before all Israel, and before the sun.


ONANISM


Genesis 38:8-9
8And Judah said unto Onan, Go in unto thy brother's wife, and marry her, and raise up seed to thy brother.

9And Onan knew that the seed should not be his; and it came to pass, when he went in unto his brother's wife, that he spilled it on the ground, lest that he should give seed to his brother.



PROPHETS BUT NA.KED IN THE BIBLE!


(a) “And he (Noah) drank of the wine, and was drunken; and he lay unclothed within his tent.” GENESIS 9-21

(b) ‘And he (Saul) stripped off his clothes also, and prophesied before Samuel in like manner, and lay down unclothed all that day and all that night Wherefore they say, Is Saul also among the prophets? ” 1 SAMUEL 19:24

(c) “How glorious was the king of Israel (David) to day, who UNCOVERED (became unclothed) himself to day in the eyes of the handmaids of his servants, as one of the vain fellows shamelessly UNCOVERS himself 2 SAMUEL 6:20

(d) And the Lord said, like as my servant ISAIAH hath walked unclothed and barefoot three years . . . ” . . young and old, unclothed and barefoot, even with their buttocks UNCOVERED, to the shame of Egypt. ISAIAH 20:3-4


SON OF "RIGHTEOUS" DAVID RA.PES HIS SISTER!


Howbeit he (Amnon, one of the sons of David) would not hearken unto her this sister Tamar’s voice: but, being stronger than she, forced (violated) her, and LAY (Were Intimate) with her.” 2 SAMUEL 13:14


“Man after God’s own heart”,DAVID COMMITS ADULTERY!


And David sent messengers, and took her (Bathsheba); and she came in unto him, and he LAY (had intercourse) with her. . . 2 SAMUEL 11:4

senseless posting. i call dat les indirectus spamius.

Sagamite:

Did Clifford eat human flesh because he believed it was his religious duty?

All the Biblical verses certainly have no single blemish. By 'Biblical verses' I meant those that came from GOD and His Messenger. The error popped up when human began to smuggle in some verses to suite their wayward dispositions.

The Quran as a whole contain message directly from Allah alone. There is no single error in the book. It is error free. We start having problems when people that don't even qualify to call themselves students of Quran and Hadiths start misinterpreting the verses of Noble Quran.

 Here I come, a Muslim engaging in violence act is truly going against the teaching of Islam. Quran contains the history, the directives, rules and guidelines etc. Thinking this is religion obligation could never be right. I know what I am saying. You can't just quote a verse containing a directive to fight from history and think this where the Muslim see the evidence to go violent. You need a lot of knowledge to interpret the Quran.

ziccoit:

All the Biblical verses certainly have no single blemish. By 'Biblical verses' I meant those that came from GOD and His Messenger. The error popped up when human began to smuggle in some verses to suite their wayward dispositions.

The Quran as a whole contain message directly from Allah alone. There is no single error in the book. It is error free. We start having problems when people that don't even qualify to call themselves students of Quran and Hadiths start misinterpreting the verses of Noble Quran.

 Here I come, a Muslim engaging in violence act is truly going against the teaching of Islam. Quran contains the history, the directives, rules and guidelines etc. Thinking this is religion obligation could never be right. I know what I am saying. You can't just quote a verse containing a directive to fight from history and think this where the Muslim see the evidence to go violent. You need a lot of knowledge to interpret the Quran.    

Now the issue there is that, it is so easy for any fooool to go out in a lot of countries and he will be able to gather a lot of muslims that will be happy to kill under the belief that the scriptures has instructed them. In no other religion can anyone easily and rapidly find the same amount of people (if at all) willing to do such based on a religious conviction.

If the scriptures is not teaching it, yet there are a lot of muslims that think it is and are gong-ho to execute it by slaughtering others, don't you think this is a big problem, it has destroyed Islams reputation and needs to be dealt with instead of burying your head in the sand with lame excuses?

Sagamite:

Now the issue there is that, it is so easy for any fooool to go out in a lot of countries and he will be able to gather a lot of muslims that will be happy to kill under the belief that the scriptures has instructed them. In no other religion can anyone easily and rapidly find the same amount of people (if at all) willing to do such based on a religious conviction.

If the scriptures is not teaching it, yet there are a lot of muslims that think it is and are gong-ho to execute it by slaughtering others, don't you think this is a big problem, it has destroyed Islams reputation and needs to be dealt with instead of burying your head in the sand with lame excuses?

did islam even hav a reputation   unless u count their reputation for slaughter.

Sagamite:

Now the issue there is that, it is so easy for any fooool to go out in a lot of countries and he will be able to gather a lot of muslims that will be happy to kill under the belief that the scriptures has instructed them. In no other religion can anyone easily and rapidly find the same amount of people (if at all) willing to do such based on a religious conviction.

If the scriptures is not teaching it, yet there are a lot of muslims that think it is and are gong-ho to execute it by slaughtering others, don't you think this is a big problem, it has destroyed Islams reputation and needs to be dealt with instead of burying your head in the sand with lame excuses?

 This is where we always get it wrong. Prophet Muhammed (peace be unto Him) was the one who gave a complete explanation of what Islam means by His sayings, deeds and actions. We also know that, there is nothing in-between. You either a Muslim or non-Muslim.

 Should my physics teacher and the subject (Physics) be blamed for my misinterpretation of the teacher and the subject matter when others are getting it right? NO. This is a pond of ignorant most people are swimming in. The people even in the face of heavy proofs to the contrary start to nail Islam, Quran and the Prophet for a mistake committed by a deranged ones.

 There is more to this Oga. You must know people are hiding under hypocrisy to deface Islam. I am not justifying anything here but look at this. When an Israelite murder a Palestine, he is called a gallant soldier but when the opposite happened the Palestine is a terrorist.

 An average Muslim especially from the South loves his Christians fellow by Heart. I have many instances that make me believe Christians are more cruel and intolerance to the Muslims and any ideas that has to do with Islam. We can go on and on and on, the truth is Islam has nothing to do with how a people misinterpret the scripture.

LagosShia sound like Eko Ile .

Se him quoting irrelevant scriptures to defend himself.

HOW MANY CHRISTIANS HAVE YOU SEEN KILLING PEOPLE, BACKING IT WITH SCRIPTURES.

BUT EVERY MUSLIMS JIHADS QUOTES THE SCRIPTURES TO DEFEND THEIR ACTIONS.

ziccoit:

 This is where we always get it wrong. Prophet Muhammed (peace be unto Him) was the one who gave a complete explanation of what Islam means by His sayings, deeds and actions. We also know that, there is nothing in-between. You either a Muslim or non-Muslim.

 Should my physics teacher and the subject (Physics) be blamed for my misinterpretation of the teacher and the subject matter when others are getting it right? NO. This is a pond of ignorant most people are swimming in. The people even in the face of heavy proofs to the contrary start to nail Islam, Quran and the Prophet for a mistake committed by a deranged ones.

 There is more to this Oga. You must know people are hiding under hypocrisy to deface Islam. I am not justifying anything here but look at this. When an Israelite murder a Palestine, he is called a gallant soldier but when the opposite happened the Palestine is a terrorist.

 An average Muslim especially from the South loves his Christians fellow by Heart. I have many instances that make me believe Christians are more cruel and intolerance to the Muslims and any ideas that has to do with Islam. We can go on and on and on, the truth is Islam has nothing to do with how a people misinterpret the scripture.  

So Prophet Muhammed has given an explanation, yet a lot of muslims do not understand this explanation and are willing to kill indiscriminately. And you think it is not a huge problem? Remember, we are talking of A LOT of muslims (millions).

No other religion has that kind of problem, only the religion of peace has a problem with violence and you think it should not be addressed and claiming people are "defacing" Islam?

prophet muhammad himself killed innocent Pagan Quraysh tribals, whos only offence was their refusal to convert.

jehovah's witnesses have lived qietly for over 120 years without carrying anything like gun or amunition, they remain the most peaceable people under the sun. they will never fight war or join army. infact they are already enjoying the spiritual paradise mentioned. why not make yourself available to these pple and let them teach you why there is so much violence in this crocked and twisted generation that has defied all psychologycal solution?

Op
Becos muslims has turn dere self 2 SUCICIDE BOMBER, evev in 9ja and other country in d world 2day.

No offence!!!

@Sagamite; « #97 on: Today at 01:45:27 PM »
[Quote]Quote from: abubello on Today at 01:20:19 PM
sagamite

So  all l the palestinians killed were killede at war?

No 1, let me make it clear that I am not saying Palestinians are not facing injustice.

No 2, most times the killing of Palestinians is during conflict, they are not some sitting ducks being killed for their religion or being non-believers (basically they are not being killed in the name of religion). They have some retards intentionally killing innocents of people more powerful than them who then retaliate.

No 3, these Palestinians killed during conflict, not for religion will not compare to the amount killed by Islamic fundamentalists who think their religion is disrespected and kill for religion.[/Quote]if  have a nickel for every time somebody lied about zionism and palestinians i will be billionaire just by it. the jews lost 6 millions in a conflict. what do you think the palestinians lost by the hands of the zionist part of the same jews since 1946 or so; count with me
a nation.
an identity
and if only 50,000 dies per year as a result of this, only in the first 20 years, 1 million people. the slaughters of palestinians in the refugee's camps where hordes of people spent their entire lives in these places. i have met many palestinians who never have seen palestine and definitely eager to go, if the opportunity presents itself, without the heavy boot of new nazist  zionism. the jews kill palestinians for not being  jews. jew as a religion. jew as an ethnic people. by the way they were the first to bomb properties and collateral [innocent humans] to achieve their goal; the state of israel by being victorious over the british with terror.
finally, before the jews, there were no conflicts within the palestinian people, irrespective of their religions.




[Quote]Quote from: LagosShia on Today at 01:23:45 PM
first let me ask you to get a dictionary.secondly i will present to your the verse in question in different Quran translations.lastly,i will present to you the the commentary by a famous Quranic exegesis.

Pickthall:
Fight in the way of Allah against those who fight against you, but begin not hostilities. Lo! Allah loveth not aggressors.

Yusuf Ali:
Fight in the cause of Allah those who fight you but do not transgress limits; for Allah loveth not transgressors.

English Quranic Commentary on Verse 2:190 by Ayatollah Agha Mehdi Pooya:

I must first say that I struggle to understand all these religious stuff written in Arabic. My concentration goes quick. You can make my life much easier by trying to interpret in simple English as often as you can.

From my understanding so far, are you saying the Quran terms "hostilities" that justifies "self-defense" through violence/fight as aggression, transgression, and ascribing falsehood to Allah and His last prophet?

These "aggression, transgression, and ascribing falsehood to Allah and His last prophet" are what is termed as oppression, persecution, seduction by the Quran?[/Quote]if the bold is your status, Quran is not a thing you argue against. you need to read it, believe in it and it will better your memory. let me say to you in simple english; God says do not fight anyone, except those who fight you because of their intent to disturb your commitment to the religion of Islam given to you by Allah. Those who start fights are aggressors and God do not like those who are aggressors.

What I've learnt from this thread is that nairaland muslims either don't read the koran or cannot understand unless someone else explains it to them.

I'm always yabbing christians for swallowing and vomiting everthing their pastors tell them instead of reading the bible for themselves but what I've seen here has shocked me. You muslims are truly living in lalaland.

All of you are basically parroting the same crap you see on islamist websites. There's nothing to suggest that you came to this conclusion yourselves otherwise, ther wuld be some muslims who agree with some facets of the "islam is violent" argument. Instead, its like arguing with Man U fans that Chelsea is better.

How can you watch CNN or al Jazeera and claim that Islam is not violent? How can you read the koran and claim that your religion is of peace? You keep claiming that the koran doesn't encourage killing when all of us can read it and see that it quite clearly does. I find it difficult to understand how muslims can so boldly deny something that is so glaring. You might as well say that the sky is not up or that water is not wet. The level of bullsheat and hubris from muslims is truly ridiculous. Its either none of you went to good secondary schools or you're all hopelessly self-deluded.

You people had better stop decieving yourself. Your people are causing far too much death and misery. You better fix your religion before outsiders are forced to fix it for you.

Oh, and have you guys heard the news?

m.aljazeera.net/?name=aj_standard_en&i=8784&guid=2011628224144784687&showonly=1

Deadly attack on Kabul hotel 'ends'

06/29/2011 03:29:44 AM
A brazen attack on a major hotel in Kabul has ended with the
killing of attackers by security forces, an Afghan interior ministry
spokesman said.
"We believe between six and seven attackers have been killed,"
Sediq Sediqqi said on Wednesday. "All have been killed."
The NATO-led coalition in Afghanistan said two of its helicopters
fired on and killed three fighters on the roof of the hotel.
At least six Afghan civilians were killed in the attack. "They seem to
be hotel employees," Sediqqi said.
However, Mohammad Zahir, the head of the Kabul police crime
unit, told Reuters news agency that "at least 10 civilians, including
hotel staff, were killed when six suicide bombers attacked the Intercontinental." Sediqqi said lights were back on at the hotel after it was plunged into darkness during the five-hour-long raid.
An AFP news agency photographer close to the scene said part of the hotel was on fire. Ambulances were being sent to the scene of the attack, a favourite spot for foreigners in Afghanistan and Afghan government officials.
Among the guests staying at the hotel were Afghan government officials from around the country who were in Kabul for a conference on the handover of power from foreign to Afghan
security forces.
"There are foreign and Afghan guests staying at the hotel,'' Sediqqi said. "We have reports that they are safe in their rooms.''
Local police sources told Al Jazeera that the attackers entered the hotel after a firefight. At least one of them detonated himself, they said.
Bystanders were ordered to lay down on the ground for their own safety as the Afghan police battled the attackers with machine guns and other weapons.
Rocket-propelled grenades and tracer rounds could be seen and heard during the attack. Reporters at the scene said they could hear bursts of gunfire and shooting from the roof of the five-storey building.
Samoonyar Mohammad Zaman, a security officer for interior ministry, said the attackers were armed with machine guns, anti-aircraft weapons, rocket-propelled grenades and hand grenades. Zaman said there were 60-70 guests at the hotel, and that he had seen the bodies of two suicide bombers at the main entrance to the hotel.
Bette Dam, an independent journalist who was at the scene, told Al Jazeera that gunfire had gone on for "hours after hours", and that she had seen rocket-propelled grenades being fired. She reported hearing two loud explosions at the site, though it was unclear what caused them. She described the attack as "very
coordinated".
Taliban claim Zabiullah Mujahid, a Taliban spokesman, claimed responsibility for the attack in a telephone call to the press.
Al Jazeera's Bernard Smith, reporting from Kabul, said the Interncontinental is a very "well-defended hotel". "This happens - possibly coincidentally - as a two-day conference here in Kabul is due to start tomorrow, with people coming from across Afghanistan to talk about the transition - the taking over of the security responsibility by the Afghan security forces," he said. "People who are going to that conference are staying at the hotel."
Streets leading to the Intercontinental were blocked. The hotel is situated on a hill overlooking Kabul. The scene was dark as electricity was out at the hotel.
Jawid, a guest at the hotel, said he jumped out of a first-storey window to flee the shooting.
"I was running with my family," he said. "There was shooting. The restaurant was full with guests."
Attacks in Kabul have been relatively rare, although violence has increased since the May 2 killing of Osama bin Laden, the al-Qaeda chief, in a US raid in Pakistan and the start of the Taliban's annual spring offensive.
On 18 June, armed men wearing Afghan army uniforms stormed a police station near the presidential palace and opened fire on officers, killing nine. Late last month, a suicide bomber wearing an Afghan police uniform infiltrated the main Afghan military hospital, killing six medical students. A month before that, a suicide attacker in an army uniform sneaked past security at the Afghan defence ministry, killing three people.

Not that this has anything to do with what we're discussing. I just thought you guys might want to hear the latest news.

@seanT: « #202 on: Yesterday at 09:28:29 PM »
[Quote]LagosShia, you are the worst debater on this forum.

Sweetnecta close behind.

Your posting of those biblical scriptures doesn't prove anything.[/Quote]this is good news that i am regarded in the same string as lagosshia. i guess biblical verses do not prove anything to seant. i can live with that.



@Sagamite « #205 on: Yesterday at 10:13:23 PM »
[Quote]Quote from: ziccoit on Yesterday at 09:59:03 PM
All the Biblical verses certainly have no single blemish. By 'Biblical verses' I meant those that came from GOD and His Messenger. The error popped up when human began to smuggle in some verses to suite their wayward dispositions.

The Quran as a whole contain message directly from Allah alone. There is no single error in the book. It is error free. We start having problems when people that don't even qualify to call themselves students of Quran and Hadiths start misinterpreting the verses of Noble Quran.

 Here I come, a Muslim engaging in violence act is truly going against the teaching of Islam. Quran contains the history, the directives, rules and guidelines etc. Thinking this is religion obligation could never be right. I know what I am saying. You can't just quote a verse containing a directive to fight from history and think this where the Muslim see the evidence to go violent. You need a lot of knowledge to interpret the Quran.    

Now the issue there is that, it is so easy for any fooool to go out in a lot of countries and he will be able to gather a lot of muslims that will be happy to kill under the belief that the scriptures has instructed them. In no other religion can anyone easily and rapidly find the same amount of people (if at all) willing to do such based on a religious conviction.

If the scriptures is not teaching it, yet there are a lot of muslims that think it is and are gong-ho to execute it by slaughtering others, don't you think this is a big problem, it has destroyed Islams reputation and needs to be dealt with instead of burying your head in the sand with lame excuses?[/Quote]shouldn't common sense tells us that those people who are going against 'the scripture' are hypocrites and ignorant and evil doers n spite of being warned by the scripture not to?



@emmatok; « #208 on: Yesterday at 10:51:37 PM »
[Quote]LagosShia sound like Eko Ile .

Se him quoting irrelevant scriptures to defend himself.

HOW MANY CHRISTIANS HAVE YOU SEEN KILLING PEOPLE, BACKING IT WITH SCRIPTURES.

BUT EVERY MUSLIMS JIHADS QUOTES THE SCRIPTURES TO DEFEND THEIR ACTIONS.[/Quote]while these 'jihadists' are wrong, the crusader emperor bush made sure many died in iraq without any tie to 9/11, using false reason however,which paved way for the chrstians preaching and GI winning souls for jesus. what was the reason bush invaded and slaughtered iraqis except for his religion. ironically, he used the force of the most powerful military organization in the world to do it. did you forget abu graib?



@Sagamite (m)
[Quote]London (Don't let me catch you giving a stupid opinion on this forum)« #209 on: Yesterday at 10:56:24 PM »[/Quote]and he gives the type of opinion he is railing against.



[Quote]Quote from: ziccoit on Yesterday at 10:38:26 PM
This is where we always get it wrong. Prophet Muhammed (peace be unto Him) was the one who gave a complete explanation of what Islam means by His sayings, deeds and actions. We also know that, there is nothing in-between. You either a Muslim or non-Muslim.

 Should my physics teacher and the subject (Physics) be blamed for my misinterpretation of the teacher and the subject matter when others are getting it right? NO. This is a pond of ignorant most people are swimming in. The people even in the face of heavy proofs to the contrary start to nail Islam, Quran and the Prophet for a mistake committed by a deranged ones.

 There is more to this Oga. You must know people are hiding under hypocrisy to deface Islam. I am not justifying anything here but look at this. When an Israelite murder a Palestine, he is called a gallant soldier but when the opposite happened the Palestine is a terrorist.

 An average Muslim especially from the South loves his Christians fellow by Heart. I have many instances that make me believe Christians are more cruel and intolerance to the Muslims and any ideas that has to do with Islam. We can go on and on and on, the truth is Islam has nothing to do with how a people misinterpret the scripture.  

So Prophet Muhammed has given an explanation, yet a lot of muslims do not understand this explanation and are willing to kill indiscriminately. And you think it is not a huge problem? Remember, we are talking of A LOT of muslims (millions).[/Quote]1 billion is 1,000 millions. so 1.5 billions will be 1,500 millions. what % are the suicide bombers, etc that we blame the whole of 1,500,000,000 people on? if 50% i see a half full cup nstead of the disliked half empty. if 25% i see 75% full cup instead of 25% empty. if 10% i see 90% full cup instead of 10% empty. i will the condition of the christians alone. i will not even look at the condition of the jews. neither allows people to be who they were in history, which was not the case in Madina of Muammad [as].



[Quote]No other religion has that kind of problem, only the religion of peace has a problem with violence and you think it should not be addressed and claiming people are "defacing" Islam?[/Quote]the jews said they kill the God of the christians, the christians are happy. Is the one who stood by when Jesus was killed according to the bible not equal to the killers, if the christians believe that those of us who were not alive are guiltyfor  the sins of Adam and Eve, arent the christians killers of Jesus just as the jews? what is the worth of the life of jesus; equal to 1 person or billions of people? are the christians not mass murderers, therefore?



@ibukun obi « #211 on: Yesterday at 11:03:12 PM »
[Quote]jehovah's witnesses have lived qietly for over 120 years without carrying anything like gun or amunition, they remain the most peaceable people under the sun. they will never fight war or join army. infact they are already enjoying the spiritual paradise mentioned. why not make yourself available to these pple and let them teach you why there is so much violence in this crocked and twisted generation that has defied all psychologycal solution?[/Quote]and they have not even died and they can't escape death. is this truly their paradise as the Messenger [as] said? this is truly a testament to the authenticity.



@M M M 3 (m)
[Quote]IF I WAZ MY POPSI, I FOR BE D RICHEST GUY IN NAIRALAND DOWN TOWN PUERTO RICO.
« #212 on: Today at 12:06:09 AM »

Op
Becos muslims has turn dere self 2 SUCICIDE BOMBER, evev in 9ja and other country in d world 2day.[/Quote]can anyone tell me what this dude is saying? i can read ebonics, but this is too sophisticated for me.
No offence!![quote][/Quote]



@Caliente « #213 on: Today at 12:51:32 AM »
[Quote]By their fruits we shall know them. Islam is a religion/cult of violence and terror, whether its mohammed or almajiri[/Quote]kkk, arian nation, skinhead, etc. they are all muslims.

stop blamin dem Jews!!!!!!

it has been proved that the Romans killed Jesus and that the Jews had nuthing to do with it. Emperor Constantine forged the new testament and blamed it all on the Jews so that he could gather the suport of the xtians.

Sweetnecta:




@emmatok; « #208 on: Yesterday at 10:51:37 PM »while these 'jihadists' are wrong, the crusader emperor bush made sure many died in iraq without any tie to 9/11, using false reason however,which paved way for the chrstians preaching and GI winning souls for jesus. what was the reason bush invaded and slaughtered iraqis except for his religion. ironically, he used the force of the most powerful military organization in the world to do it. did you forget abu graib?

Guy your are wrong, Bush invaded Iraq for economic reasons .

In-fact most American Christians opposed that war.

But killing of innocent people is justified by most Muslims , because those innocent people are "INFIDEL".

Sweetnecta:


@emmatok; « #208 on: Yesterday at 10:51:37 PM »while these 'jihadists' are wrong, the crusader emperor bush made sure many died in iraq without any tie to 9/11, using false reason however,which paved way for the chrstians preaching and GI winning souls for jesus. what was the reason bush invaded and slaughtered iraqis except for his religion. ironically, he used the force of the most powerful military organization in the world to do it. did you forget abu graib?

So, in your opinion, Bush went to war in Iraq because he is a Christian? Do Anstagar furulai 200 times!

Sagamite, you better pass this one na.

So if person A kills 1000 in the name of religion and B kills 100000 in other names (money, state, etc). Then A gives you more headache?

Killing should be treated as killing no matter what. It must be seen as a common threat to humanity.

In history, people have always killed for a reason, and they normally rationalize it one way or the other. It doesn't make one better than the other. Because these judgements are subjective. Lets not fall for cheap propaganda.

@Danzal2009; ^^^^^^^^ i do live in the USA. and what bush said on camera is on youtubel it is in a series of christian missionary atrocities. lie to yourself. you can't lie to me.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=br_70Kbdpow



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VWNst2YduRg&NR=1



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fYz5gawnUeY&playnext=1&list=PL16842B1B8F42C33D

I know it was shocking for many bible-thumpers to see bible verses that they have never read in their existence. To shock them and prove to them how evil and violent their book is since they don’t bother to read it. And I also proved to them the morality and civility of the Holy Quran.

I am not spamming or offending anyone. The fact is when talking about violence fools bring a Quranic verse from here and there and then misinterpret it. all the Quranic verses which exist and which talks about fighting or defense are under the verse:"and begin not hostilities for Allah loves not the aggressors" (2:190).but we still fools parroting of how Islam is violent and that is the problem Muslims are violent. They forget that of the more than 1.3 billion Muslims on the face of the earth, only a small number carry out terrorist activities while another number fight for their rights (like the resistance and fight for freedom against israeli occupation).now those Muslims that fight for legitimate causes and these that are foolish are all lumped into one parcel thanks to the media and they are all called "terrorists" and "violent”. when you want to point an accusing finger against the Muslims, you have to identify which group is fighting legitimate cause and which is transgressing and going against the Quranic injunction that Allah does not love aggressors.

even when one step further, we see clearly that the Quran is free and innocent from the accusations pointed against it. We actually see the  opposite when we examine the bible. We see that every evil from violence, ra.pe, in.cest to other abominations are there and perpetrated by "men of God" held in high esteem but Christians and also those same "men of God" were praised by the same God in the same bible before and after the evil they committed. If a quarter of the evil contained in the bible is in the Quran,then i can shut my mouth up and accept that the Quran is evil and violent. But the Quran is not.so why do you keep attacking the Quran and Islam for what they are not?

if you must identify the problem about violence and terrorism, you need to take everyone issue on its own. Examine every case of violence to see if that case is terrorism or self-defense and right to resistance. You cannot tell me for example that Palestinians or Lebanese do not have the right to defend their countries against Israeli occupation and land theft. If you accuse boko haram for violence and terror and ignorance and illiteracy and stu.pidity, I accept. But don’t lump everything into one and then generalize that Muslims are violent. To even provoke Muslims, you get Quranic verses and put them as evience that they are violent because the Quran teaches them violence after you have being told that the Quran only says we should fight against those who fight us and oppress us and we should not begin hostilities because Allah does not love hostilities. If you keep repeating that muslims are violent, of the more than  1.3 billion people who are Muslims, how many of them have taken up a gun or knife to fight? if half or more of the 1.3 billion have taken to violence, then I can hear you.

The problem also is the biased media that is spreading nonsense. How many wars were started by Muslims and how many were started by non-Muslims in both our present and past? how many Muslims are killed daily? you that is talking nonsense ignore those that are killed daily in Iraq and Afghanistan and Palestine. But you have the effrontery to accuse those victimized of terrorism because book haram is stu.pid and carrying out senseless attacks against innocent Nigerian civilians.