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African Identity Crisis: A Must Read For All. - Culture (2) - Nairaland

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Re: African Identity Crisis: A Must Read For All. by PAGAN9JA(m): 9:24pm On Jul 22, 2011
actually i gave it all a thought and came to a conclusion. an African man is only truly African in the sense, if he belong to certain tribe or ethnic group. i mean, if he is mixed, thaen how does that make him any different from the black-american man they will both be the same people, except with different histories and lives. undecided
Re: African Identity Crisis: A Must Read For All. by pleep(m): 1:49am On Jul 24, 2011
k.o.n.y:

The term "African American" was imposed on black people. Millions of us do not agree with the term. It is beyond silly for me to consider myself an "african"-American.lol Im an american that happens to be  black,thus black american
Likewise the term black was forced on millions of Africans. I don't think the average ijaw, Igbo or Yoruba thought of himself as a 'blackman' untill recently. Black is a word used to describe the amalgamation of different African ethnicities in the u.s same as white discribes the amalgamation of different european ethnicities. Anyway this viewpoint spread outside America and racialized the world.
Dede1:


Forms such as the one you posted are used to test intellectual ability or lack thereof of Africans. Most of the times, Africans tend to drop the ball by following the silly trend of being "Black". I always select the “other please state”. You do not need to be angered when such form provides an opportunity to educate the presenter.
   
Therin lies the problem. The lack of a seperate spot for Africans prevents us from displaying our academic achievements in the same way Asians are able to giving the impression that black people preform poorly in academics across the board. The average act score for blacks, Africans and A.A's combined is 17. I bet the average score for Africans is somewhere around 27. Which would be the highest of any group of Americans. (Asians have 23, north Asians 25 if I'm not mistaken)

it would be a deathblow to racism if Africans (pure black people) were shown to be the smartest racial group in America. And it would prove that low academic performance in some a.a groups is because of circumstances not inherabt inferiority.
Re: African Identity Crisis: A Must Read For All. by BABE3: 2:00am On Jul 24, 2011
OP: That one be small matter now. At least Africans can still manage "BLACK". The issue that angers me the most is not putting an option for the "mixed people". Very annoying.

Those yeye forms should either have the "mixed" option, or give the mixed people a chance of ticking more than one option.
Re: African Identity Crisis: A Must Read For All. by PAGAN9JA(m): 2:21am On Jul 24, 2011
pleep:

Likewise the term black was forced on millions of Africans. I don't think the average ijaw, Igbo or Yoruba thought of himself as a 'blackman' untill recently. Black is a word used to describe the amalgamation of different African ethnicities in the u.s same as white discribes the amalgamation of different european ethnicities.

EXACTLY MY POINT!!!!! black and white are actually used to describe mixed people. the europeans had already lost their tribes due to intermarriage, around 1000 yrs ago after the advent of christianity. in the case of the blacks, the slaves in america from different tribes intermarried and also mixed with a few whites and natives.

therefore, tribal Africans such as ourselves are completely different in ethnicity from the blacks.
Re: African Identity Crisis: A Must Read For All. by pleep(m): 2:55am On Jul 24, 2011
BABE!:

OP: That one be small matter now. At least Africans can still manage "BLACK". The issue that angers me the most is not putting an option for the "mixed people". Very annoying.

Those yeye forms should either have the "mixed" option, or give the mixed people a chance of ticking more than one option. 

  Well naturally you think your little problem is more Important, because it concerns you lol
who r u to call our issue a small matter? You can check the box 'other' if u like, that's what it was made for. . . wink
Re: African Identity Crisis: A Must Read For All. by kony1(m): 6:18am On Jul 24, 2011
PAGAN 9JA:

EXACTLY MY POINT!!!!! black and white are actually used to describe mixed people. the europeans had already lost their tribes due to intermarriage, around 1000 yrs ago after the advent of christianity. in the case of the blacks, the slaves in america from different tribes intermarried and also mixed with a few whites and natives.

therefore, tribal Africans such as ourselves are completely different in ethnicity from the blacks.

Exactly. The term black was originally meant to represent us black americans. How it seeped out to represent africans and caribbeans is really not our problem

http://youtu.be/2VRSAVDlpDI
Re: African Identity Crisis: A Must Read For All. by BABE3: 6:22am On Jul 24, 2011
pleep:

 Well naturally you think your little problem is more Important, because it concerns you lol.
who r u to call our issue a small matter? You can check the box 'other' if u like, that's what it was made for. . . wink


lol---Funny enough, it's not a personal problem. I'm not mixed.

As for the "other" box, I don't feel it's "right". It's a very lazy way of ignoring mixed people's genre. Plus I'm so sure that in most cases, "other" is made for minor ethnic groups/races (that are not included), and not for mixed people.

Who am I to call your issue a small matter? Well, I'm someone that doesn't really care about your issue. Plus, you're "black", aren't you? So, it's technically a small matter. Get over it.  wink

Oh yh, hope you know that "black" is not really referring to your skin color, it's simply a racial classification. There're light-skinned "black" people. So, again, get over it.
Re: African Identity Crisis: A Must Read For All. by PhysicsQED(m): 6:25am On Jul 24, 2011
Don't really understand the OP's complaint.

In countries where the different groups are defined by "race" rather than "ethnic origin" it is perfectly alright for only those categories to be used.


Also the claim that Asians get to specify their specific continent of origin seems faulty. In many of those forms in the U.S. (I can't speak for Europe), Hawaiians and other Pacific Islanders are grouped together with Far East Asians in one category because they are considered to be of the same race.
Re: African Identity Crisis: A Must Read For All. by pleep(m): 6:34am On Jul 24, 2011
BABE!:

lol---Funny enough, it's not a personal problem. I'm not mixed.

As for the "other" box, I don't feel it's "right". It's a very lazy way of ignoring mixed people's genre. Plus I'm so sure that in most cases, "other" is made for minor ethnic groups/races (that are not included), and not for mixed people.

Who am I to call your issue a small matter? Well, I'm someone that doesn't really care about your issue. Plus, you're "black", aren't you? So, it's technically a small matter. Get over it.  wink

Oh yh, hope you know that "black" is not really referring to your skin color, it's simply a racial classification. There're light-skinned "black" people. So, again, get over it.

I dunno maybe you don't find this important or you just can't read. Let me repost my rationale:

"
The lack of a seperate spot for Africans prevents us from displaying our academic achievements in the same way Asians are able to giving the impression that black people preform poorly in academics across the board. The average act score for blacks, Africans and A.A's combined is 17. I bet the average score for Africans is somewhere around 27. Which would be the highest of any group of Americans. (Asians have 23, north Asians 25 if I'm not mistaken)

it would be a deathblow to racism if Africans (pure black people) were shown to be the smartest racial group in America. And it would prove that low academic performance in some a.a groups is because of circumstances not inherabt inferiority."

now if you think your silly little mixed ppl issue is more important na wa for you oo.
This is not about race.

And why don't you name an ethnic group that isn't represented in the act ethnicity form?  Can you? No, because that's what the 'other' category is for. So stop spazzing out over a non-issue.
Re: African Identity Crisis: A Must Read For All. by PhysicsMHD(m): 6:43am On Jul 24, 2011
"The lack of a seperate spot for Africans prevents us from displaying our academic achievements in the same way Asians are able to giving the impression that black people preform poorly in academics across the board. The average act score for blacks, Africans and A.A's combined is 17. I bet the average score for Africans is somewhere around 27. Which would be the highest of any group of Americans. (Asians have 23, north Asians 25 if I'm not mistaken)

it would be a deathblow to racism if Africans (pure black people) were shown to be the smartest racial group in America. And it would prove that low academic performance in some a.a groups is because of circumstances not inherabt inferiority."

^^^^

If it turned out that the average ACT score for Africans was as high as you guessed, then yes, it might be a valid concern, but I doubt that it would be a "deathblow" to "scientific" racism. It would probably just be dismissed as a minor discrepancy in a naturally bleak overall picture. grin

But since few people are even aware that Africans in the West score high on these tests to begin with, it isn't an issue that could really come to people's attention to the point where they'll change how they take census data or data about race and educational attainment.

Showing that children of Ghanaians and Nigerians score high on these tests isn't really a priority for the few who know about it, anyways.
Re: African Identity Crisis: A Must Read For All. by pleep(m): 6:52am On Jul 24, 2011
^When kids look up Average black act score and see 16.9 how do u think that makes them feel?? I don't give a damn about some idiot racial scientist.
it's damaging for black kids to see 17 as thier average compared to an Asian 23 and not have that tempered out by high African scores.
What do you think that does to the mentality of disadvantaged blacks who already think they are inferior?

For the record I know: (African & Asian scores are only high because immigrants tend to focus on education)
Re: African Identity Crisis: A Must Read For All. by BABE3: 6:53am On Jul 24, 2011
pleep:

I dunno maybe you don't find this important or you just can't read. Let me repost my rationale:


I seriously hope everything is ok. What do you mean by the "bolded"? I simply responded to the topic , you decided to question me and I replied you---so, where on earth did you expect me to read that "article" of yours from?

pleep:


now if you think your silly little mixed ppl issue is more important na wa for you oo.
This is not about race.

And why don't you name an ethnic group that isn't represented in the act ethnicity form?  Can you? No, because that's what the 'other' category is for. So stop spazzing out over a non-issue.

This isn't about race? So what is it about? Food?

Well, I've read you lil' bitty "rationale". It's pretty interesting, but unfortunately, I don't care for it. I was never talking about that issue in the first place, so I don't see why you should present it as a "case". I was all about the "mixed" people.

As for the "omitted" races--I can't mention one right now. But, I'm pretty sure there're some lost in the mix.

To me, it's an issue. To you, it's not. We can agree to disagree, can't we?

BTW, are you Nigerian?
Re: African Identity Crisis: A Must Read For All. by pleep(m): 6:59am On Jul 24, 2011
Yes i'm a Nigerian. And if "you don't care" about the topic maybe it's better you didn't post mmk? tongue
anyway, that post I made about illiteracy was stupid & I apologise.

You can't find any other ethnicities because there aren't any. The 'other' box is for mullatos, obviously, case closed.
Re: African Identity Crisis: A Must Read For All. by PhysicsMHD(m): 7:05am On Jul 24, 2011
pleep:

^When kids look up Average black act score and see 16.9 how do u think that makes them feel?? I don't give a damn about some  racial scientist.
it's damaging for black kids to see 17 as thier average compared to an Asian 23 and not have that tempered out by high African scores.
What do you think that does to the mentality of disadvantaged blacks who already think they are inferior?

For the record I know: (African & Asian scores are only high because immigrants tend to focus on education)

Yeah. You're completely right. It's actually far better that African Americans themselves see that the discrepancy is not racially based.

But the second issue this might bring up is why African Americans would be under performing on those tests. Addressing this issue might be a good thing for both blacks and non-blacks in America. The blacks will be able to better identify what the real problems are (people can't always claim that the tests are culturally biased as an excuse).

And the non-blacks will no longer be able to so blindly and casually dismiss the statements from AAs that many of the issues they face today are due to past discrimination against their ancestors in areas like education.
Re: African Identity Crisis: A Must Read For All. by BABE3: 7:11am On Jul 24, 2011
pleep:

Yes i'm a Nigerian. And if "you don't care" about the topic maybe it's better you didn't post mmk?  tongue
anyway, that post I made about illiteracy was silly & I apologise.

You can't find any other ethnicities because there aren't any. The 'other' box is for mullatos, obviously, case closed.

Uhn? I see you're fond of making silly comments.  grin It's not that "I don't care" really. Let me make myself clearer----> I just don't agree that it's a big issue.

Apology accepted.  smiley

I'm sure there are other ethnicities omitted. I'm gonna find them, and (maybe) report back to you.

Ok, I'm gonna agree with you for a minute that the "other" is technically meant for the mulattoes. I still don't think it's suitable for them though. Why can't they be allowed to tick all that applies? (rhetorical question).
cheesy
Re: African Identity Crisis: A Must Read For All. by pleep(m): 7:18am On Jul 24, 2011
You won't find any other ethnicities.

I Think I can answer that question. The scaning machine can only read one oval in a column.  If you think it's prudent to have a seperate oval for ever concievable ethnic mixture perhaps you should advocate that. wink
Re: African Identity Crisis: A Must Read For All. by BABE3: 7:28am On Jul 24, 2011
pleep:

You won't find any other ethnicities.

I Think I can answer that question. The scaning machine can only read one oval in a column.  If you think it's prudent to have a seperate oval for ever concievable ethnic mixture perhaps you should advocate that. wink

Ditto. Actually,since the scanning machine was made to read one oval per column, I guess it can be modified to read more than one then. smiley
Re: African Identity Crisis: A Must Read For All. by ADM1(m): 1:51pm On Jul 24, 2011
k.o.n.y:

The term "African American" was imposed on black people. Millions of us do not agree with the term. It is beyond silly for me to consider myself an "african"-American.lol Im an american that happens to be black,thus black american

The term "black" was imposed on "black people," too, at a time when many preferred "negro" (another imposed term) and considered "black" as an insult. I'm talking about a study somewhere. Do you have a study or survey that goes along with your statement? Just because you don't like the term does not mean others will feel the same. Again, not monolithic. And technically, everybody in the western hemisphere is American.
Re: African Identity Crisis: A Must Read For All. by kony1(m): 7:25pm On Jul 24, 2011
A.D.M.:

The term "black" was imposed on "black people," too, at a time when many preferred "negro" (another imposed term) and considered "black" as an insult. I'm talking about a study somewhere. Do you have a study or survey that goes along with your statement? Just because you don't like the term does not mean others will feel the same. Again, not monolithic. And technically, everybody in the western hemisphere is American.

Blacks have embraced the term black more than any other term we've called ourselves. We are not african thus we are not african americans. The term black is an american construct meant to identify blacks in america(descendants of slaves). If it escalated into defining the diaspora worldwide,than that is their problem not ours. It just shows you the influence black america has over the african diaspora worldwide

Ask black people,our age, which term they prefer. They will say black american, and thank god
Re: African Identity Crisis: A Must Read For All. by ADM1(m): 1:34am On Jul 25, 2011
k.o.n.y:

Blacks have embraced the term black more than any other term we've called ourselves. We are not african thus we are not african americans. The term black is an american construct meant to identify blacks in america(descendants of slaves). If it escalated into defining the diaspora worldwide,than that is their problem not ours. It just shows you the influence black america has over the african diaspora worldwide

Ask black people,our age, which term they prefer. They will say black american, and thank god

The only real, true Americans are Native Americans. This land is technically theirs, so they're really the only ones who can lay claim to this land. Hey, did you know "black" is used in Britain? The first black folks Britain were from the English-speaking Caribbean and arrived in Britain in the 1950s due to a labor shortage (they're descendants of slaves from West Africa, too). The term was used at that time, a time when "black" was considered an insult in the U.S.

You keep making these claims about the term. Show me a survey or a study that corroborates your claim. I can't take your word for it without evidence. I really don't like it when people make a claim and don't back it up. And yes, black (U.S.) culture has been influential in astronomical ways (I'm a black American, too, so of course I know that to be a fact), but black culture outside the U.S. has also been influential. You seem very hateful and ignorant. Since you can't see why, I guess there's no getting that into your head. I guess you support the unjust wars in Iraq and Afghanistan and the drone bombings, too.

And "black" is still just a color, nothing more.
Re: African Identity Crisis: A Must Read For All. by odumchi: 3:22am On Jul 25, 2011
A.D.M.:

The only real, true Americans are Native Americans. This land is technically theirs, so they're really the only ones who can lay claim to this land. Hey, did you know "black" is used in Britain? The first black folks Britain were from the English-speaking Caribbean and arrived in Britain in the 1950s due to a labor shortage (they're descendants of slaves from West Africa, too). The term was used at that time, a time when "black" was considered an insult in the U.S.

You keep making these claims about the term. Show me a survey or a study that corroborates your claim. I can't take your word for it without evidence. I really don't like it when people make a claim and don't back it up. And yes, black (U.S.) culture has been influential in astronomical ways (I'm a black American, too, so of course I know that to be a fact), but black culture outside the U.S. has also been influential. You seem very hateful and ignorant. Since you can't see why, I guess there's no getting that into your head. I guess you support the unjust wars in Iraq and Afghanistan and the drone bombings, too.

And "black" is still just a color, nothing more.

In that period, American blacks were called Negros or "coloured".Im sure they were happy to be called "black" instead of "negro"

BABE!:

OP: That one be small matter now. At least Africans can still manage "BLACK". The issue that angers me the most is not putting an option for the "mixed people". Very annoying.

Those yeye forms should either have the "mixed" option, or give the mixed people a chance of ticking more than one option.


You're right. I'm just happy to see that Im not the only one who sees this type of form a form of disrespect.
Re: African Identity Crisis: A Must Read For All. by pleep(m): 3:59am On Jul 25, 2011
BABE!:

Ditto. Actually,since the scanning machine was made to read one oval per column, I guess it can be modified to read more than one then. smiley
grin so you think it's a good idea to spend hundreds of millions of $ replacing every single scanning machine just so mixed ppl can select more than one option?

Even though there's a boxed called "other" that was made specially for them? tongue
Re: African Identity Crisis: A Must Read For All. by PAGAN9JA(m): 7:24am On Jul 25, 2011
A.D.M.:

The only real, true Americans are Native Americans. This land is technically theirs, so they're really the only ones who can lay claim to this land.

true. and they are tribals and most of them are even Pagan.  grin grin

they also have the right to lay claim on any unused Government land.

whites and black are foreigners and must be thrown into the North Atlantic sea for good. cool
Re: African Identity Crisis: A Must Read For All. by ADM1(m): 3:43pm On Jul 25, 2011
Odumchi, I know that. I'm just giving a historical perspective.

Pagan 9ja, are you advocating mass murder? Even though the land technically belongs to the American Indians, that doesn't make or anyone else less American. I could say the same thing about Europe. That land technically belongs to white people. I guess all Africans and Arabs should be thrown into Mediterranean Sea. Idiot.
Re: African Identity Crisis: A Must Read For All. by Horus(m): 8:14pm On Jul 25, 2011
The people being called Caucasians, born in America, called Americans, should be called Euro-Americans if that is their nationality. The same way they took it upon themselves to call Africans born in America, Afro-Americans.
Re: African Identity Crisis: A Must Read For All. by PAGAN9JA(m): 9:31pm On Jul 25, 2011
^^^^ true that.

A.D.M.:

Odumchi, I know that. I'm just giving a historical perspective.

Pagan 9ja, are you advocating mass murder? Even though the land technically belongs to the American Indians, that doesn't make or anyone else less American[b]. I could say the same thing about Europe. That land technically belongs to white people. I guess all Africans and Arabs should be thrown into Mediterranean Sea[/b]. .

NO. in the case of America, the land was forcefully taken from the Natives, while the true claimants were forced into tiny overcrowded reservations. dont deny that. angry angry angry angry
Re: African Identity Crisis: A Must Read For All. by pleep(m): 11:19pm On Jul 25, 2011
There aren't enough natives to repopulate america and the black people didn't force anyone of their land. And most of the whites didn't either, most white Americans are probably decended from immigrants.
A.D.M.:

Odumchi, I know that. I'm just giving a historical perspective.

Pagan 9ja, are you advocating mass murder? Even though the land technically belongs to the American Indians, that doesn't make or anyone else less American. I could say the same thing about Europe. That land technically belongs to white people. I guess all Africans and Arabs should be thrown into Mediterranean Sea. .
lol! Nice reply.
Re: African Identity Crisis: A Must Read For All. by PAGAN9JA(m): 11:51pm On Jul 25, 2011
pleep:

There aren't enough natives to repopulate america and the black people didn't force anyone of their land. And most of the whites didn't either, most white Americans are probably decended from immigrants.

oh dont worry about that. these excuses are very lame. there are many natives, and anywayz, its not upto the thieves to bargain stolen goods. then America, must atleast divide the land and give them their rightful share, if so. angry angry angry angry

the whites did force. r u suggesting then, that the devil forced them undecided undecided



pleep:

lol! Nice reply.

actually a very bad reply, considering the Africans and Arabs didnt steal or force the land from the europeans.
Re: African Identity Crisis: A Must Read For All. by odumchi: 1:25am On Jul 26, 2011
America's Native population is on a decline. Very few still cling to the old ways, few practice Animism, intermarriage has complicated things, and very few can speak their native tongues. I'd be surprised if there were 1 million Natives in America.
Re: African Identity Crisis: A Must Read For All. by pleep(m): 2:10am On Jul 26, 2011
oh dont worry about that. these excuses are very lame. there are many natives, and anywayz, its not upto the thieves to bargain stolen goods. then America, must atleast divide the land and give them their rightful share, if so.

hmm I thought about it, and I guess ur right. But I'm telling u these so called 'native americans' are mainly just white ppl with like 25% native American ancestry.
They are more or less white ppl. One drop of native American blood doesn't make u a native American.


But u are right anyway.
Re: African Identity Crisis: A Must Read For All. by PAGAN9JA(m): 9:31am On Jul 26, 2011
^^^^^

yes intermarriage is a big problem due to the past assimilation programs by the whites. also many white people with even 1% Native Ancestry blood quantum, are claiming tribal status. this is wrong. However, there ARE still many Natives who are pure-bred, and these must be saved for future generations, their culture, religion and way of life. If a division occurs, then intermarriage is certain to stop.

let me show you two examples of Native AMericans, a pure-blood Native, and a mixed-blood Native. they are so different:

Pure-blood Native:

Chief Henry of the Cherokee tribe:









Redhawk Tribal:



Mixed-blooded Native:





half black half Native american:




see the difference. wink


odumchi:

America's Native population is on a decline. Very few still cling to the old ways, few practice Animism, intermarriage has complicated things, and very few can speak their native tongues. I'd be surprised if there were 1 million Natives in America.

actually most practice the Native American Church or[b] Peyote religion[/b] which is church only in name, but is in fact a Pagan indigenous religion and has nothing to do with christianity. since it has the word ""church"", it always creates misconceptions.

Today there are 2,423,531 Full-Blooded Native Americans Tribals, unmixed with any other race or even other Native Tribe. and there might be even more. Also there are many pure-bloods in South America also.

if you add those mixed with other tribes, the total increase to 3 million and if you aded the mixed peoples with other races, lyk the europeans and blacks, the total increases to 4-5 million. however these two must be erradicated and not counted in case of a division.
Re: African Identity Crisis: A Must Read For All. by BABE3: 9:38pm On Jul 26, 2011
pleep:

grin so you think it's a good idea to spend hundreds of millions of $ replacing every single scanning machine just so mixed ppl can select more than one option?

Even though there's a boxed called "other" that was made specially for them? tongue

undecided undecided (lol)---I thought we've already gone over the "other" thing?

The machines don't have to be replaced. New ones should/can be made for new "establishments".

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