aletheia:

^
Refute away all you want. The god of this world holds you in thrall and you will never understand the Mystery of God Incarnate unless the Holy Spirit gives you let. May God the Father of the Lord Jesus have mercy on you!

On that Great Day false prophet Mohammed himself will have no time for you for he himself will be pleading for mercy to no avail!
(Rev 19:20 [KJV])
And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.

You are now without excuse:

I pray NEVER to have the MISFORTUNE of abandoning the worship of ALLAH
Let us wait till they of resurrection when anyone who did not practise Islam in this world will realise their errors and start sweating BLOOD

@Alethea; « #23 on: Yesterday at 12:14:39 PM »
[Quote]Quote from: Sweetnecta on Yesterday at 02:57:05 AM
Alethea and Nuclearboy are here. MashaAllah.
the decision is that i am not a sunni, but a simple muslim. i told you not to put your foot in your mouth, but you don't listen because you do it, each time you open your mouth to speak. hunger does not heighten was not there, which is delusion. i am sure your christian mind will work it out that everyone in england rioting is a muslim.

So which of the "70" or "72" sects of Islam do you belong to?

Quote from: Sweetnecta on Yesterday at 02:57:05 AM
only if he can write the mother tongue of Jesus this well.
And I guess your god can only understand Arabic.

Quote from: Sweetnecta on Yesterday at 02:57:05 AM
monotheists christians and jews? are you for real or you have been playing around all the time? Jews in their monotheism rejected Jesus even as a prophet, even though the are expecting return of Elijah, the coming of messiah and the coming of that prophet. the christians in their monotheism say God is Trinity [meaning 3 persons, in the same way triangle is 3 angles; if i am a liar, you are a nuclear science mind, tell me what tri mean except 3], so they say Jesus is God, Holy Ghost without a Name [actually it does not exist except a holy spirit which is Angel Gabriel does exist, ghost does not exist] is God and the Third God is Yahweh. Is this really monotheism, nuclearboy? Omo yoruba nie. Ro nu e jile ko to dami lowun? Aa ma tete ngbo oro ni. Aki ma tete n fesi, tori o mi lati lo ogbon daa daa.
You have started your discombobulated ramblings again. Ghost means Spirit. Confused Abd. . .still repeating your lies about Ruh Qudus even after about a year of my waiting for you to prove from your koran and hadiths that Gabriel is the Holy Spirit. If you show me the word Trinity in the Bible. Then I will explain it to you. On the other hand, the Bible clearly shows from Genesis to Revelation who Jesus is.

Jesus is Lord. Jesus is the Son of God. Jesus is God! I say to you: Unless you believe that Jesus is He, you shall surely perish in your sins. Repent![/Quote]Good morning where ever you are. When you are up to it, my challenge to you is that I will prove from Quran and Sunnah that Malaika Jibril is Ruuh Qudus. You will prove from your Bible that Another Comforter is not a human prophet. You will also prove that Jesus is not human, but 100% God who only pretending to be human, and he is Yahweh, Jehovah or Eli/Ellah as the pretender cried out. You will in effort to do these two will prove that Jesus role included as pretender to die for mankind. I will give you prove from your Bible that you are incorrect in your assertions when I provide proves that evidence that God normally send human prophets to human communities, angels to the prophets and sometimes to individual, but never Himself to human communities, etc, etc, so if the third in the trinity is God, that third will not be another comforter because God will not be sent by God to human community or even prophets. I will prove from your Bible that Jesus is a mere human like every human, and a prophet like every prophet. I will prove that his promised another comforter is the "the prophet" and thats Muhammad [as], unless you have "the prophet" already somewhere in the bible after Jesus? I will also show you that Jesus job that God himself sent him to do as the pretender was completed from the lips of Jesus long before the crucifixion.


Your effort is to disprove my statement that Malaika Jibril is not Ruuh Qudus, which is a mere title among other titles God gave him, as angel messenger.

i want to remind you that if you take this challenge from me and I win over you, inchaAllah, you must enter Islam fully. If Jesus is powerless as he said in your bible, and he is a senior God to another comforter as many christians have argued about Jesus' role and position, the holy spirit which you call another comforter must be such a junior God that he is god because to call him God i pure idolatry. Same condition goes for Jesus son of Mary like all born gods.

set your pace and if you wish a new thread. But make it public because i don't check my emails often enough.

suddenly, alethea is quiet as a church during full service. i am ready for you and i dont want you to hide now.

church mouse.

Sweetnecta is the man. The church rats will swoop on him now. But no matter how many rats are the single cat is d king of the domain

Christianity and Violence

It's rather ironic that a religion which so publicly proclaims Absolute Love as its basis should, over the course of history, spawn so much unmitigated hatred and violence. Is it simply that Christianity is a failure in inspiring better conduct from otherwise hopelessly evil human beings, or is there some aspect of Christianity which in fact encourages or promotes some of the baser aspects of human behavior? Perhaps it is a bit of both.

Concern about rampant violence has become ever more central in public discussions in America recently, especially where it involves the nation's youth. Recent incidents of brutal and deadly attacks by children against children have prompted an intense debate as to the cause and solutions for what is perceived as degenerating culture. It is rather ironic that the increase in attention happens at a time when actual incidents of violence are decreasing. Not only are the general statistics of violence showing a dramatic decrease with increasing rates of decrease, but even violence against children is decreasing.

But it is a truism that exceptional cases make for bad law and bad legal precedents. Following along in parallel, the exceptional cases of youth violence are being used by opportunistic politicians and religious leaders to create genuinely bad laws. Simple people are searching for simple causes and simple solutions.

The simplest among them immediately claim that the cause for youth violence must be the lack of government supported religion in children's lives, so their natural conclusion is that our government should increase its involvement with religion. And not just any religion - Christianity is the first and usually only choice. Practical policy suggestions include daily prayers, bible readings, and the ever popular posting of the Ten Commandments.

It would perhaps be unacceptable in some circles to point out the fact that in many European countries, religion plays an even smaller role in people's lives than it does in America - yet levels of violence are lower than here. Were a lack of religion any sort of cause of violence, then we would find higher amounts of violence in countries like Germany rather than Ireland, where both religion and violence have been prominent in daily life.

Facts like this must lead any rational person to treat claim of religion as a solution to our ills - real or perceived - with real skepticism. Religion has in fact done even more to promote base inhumanity when it has become wedded to ruling political powers. It has been a common pattern throughout human history that wherever religious dogmas have gained worldly power, violence was abetted rather than stopped. Even if a person were to successfully argue that none of the violence was caused by religion, the fact would remain that religion not only failed to stop it, but has actually served as a useful tool for those perpetuating it.

Is Christianity only a religion of Peace and Love? I do not think that anyone can honestly and objectively examine American or European history and answer "yes" to that question. Christianity can encourage Peace and Love - but it certainly need not, and it quite often has done just the opposite. Although the people responsible for violence might have found a way to express their hatred without Christianity, it cannot be ignored that Christianity offers a convenient divine mandate for hatred and violent acts against a wide range of people.

As a reference for those who find that it is sometimes necessary to education others about the history of violence associated with Christianity, below is a list of links to various eras and incidents. In each case, religion has served as a principle catalyst for the violence or has, at the very least, assisted in justifying and perpetuating that violence.

Christian Violence: Early History

Violent inclinations in Christianity are apparent right from the beginning. Jesus is traditionally portrayed as a kind and loving teacher, such that even non-Christians often have an idealized image of him. However, not all of what he reportedly said or did fits within such a characterization - and some of what he did certainly doesn't reflect the better teachings he is supposed to have promoted. For example, he was quite explicit in his condemnation of those who would not follow his teachings, saying to his disciples: "And if any one will not receive you in your words, shake off the dust from your feet as you leave that house or town. Truly, I say unto you, it shall be more tolerable on the day of judgment for the land of Sodom and Gomorrah than for that town." (Matt. 10:14-15).

If Jesus and God have so little regard for nonbelievers, why should any of their followers? If Jesus can relegate nonbelievers to an eternity of torment, why should they expect higher standards from his followers here? In fact, nonbelievers did not fare any better after Christianity gained official support from the Roman Empire. Despite having been on the receiving end of persecution for many years, Christians refused to take any moral high ground and quickly proceeded to treat pagans with as much contempt and violence as they previously experienced.

Despite the fact that forgiveness is supposed to be a central aspect of Christian theology, Jesus was clear that not everyone could be forgiven: ", whoever blasphemes against the Holy Spirit never has forgiveness and is guilty of an eternal sin." (Mark 3:29) If someone considers another person to have committed such an act, they would not need to take their feelings very far into account - after all, if Jesus will not forgive that person, why should anyone else? As we will see, Christians certainly did not act in a forgiving manner to the pagans whom they had in their control.

Chrstianity and Violence: Modern America

Although one might imagine that the violence of Christianity would be relegated to the distant past, that hasn't been the case. The course of modernity has been one strewn with blood, bones, and bodies - much of which can be attributed to Christianity.

This isn't simply a matter of attributing violence to individual Christians who may or may not have been following their own ideals. Attributing violence to Christianity itself means that the violence must somehow stem more-or-less directly from Christian doctrines and Christian ideas. That is exactly what we see happen during the religious wars of the Reformation, the treatment of witches, and even Northern Ireland.

Reformation
The Reformation was supposed to restore a more original and more pure form of Christianity. One of the results was the death of millions upon millions of Europeans during decades almost unprecedented religious violence.

Witches
Witches have long been feared and hated in Christian circles. Even today, pagans and Wiccans remain a target of Christian persecution and violence - even in America. It seems that they long ago took on an identity which reached far beyond their own existence and became a symbol for Christians - but a symbol of what?

Holocaust
Was the Nazi Holocaust religious or was it secular? A bit of both, actually. Nazi oppression and massacres against political opponents and gypsies were obviously secular in nature - but the determination to exterminate the Jews from the face of the earth cannot possibly be understood without the background of centuries of persistent and violent Christian anti-semitism, generally encouraged by religious authorities.

Northern Ireland
The terrible combination of nationalism, politics and religion has had deadly consequences for the people living in Northern Ireland. Catholics and Protestants have been vilifying, attacking, torturing and killing each other in a seemingly endless cycle. What role does Christianity play in all of this violence?

Chrstianity and Violence: Modern America

America in the 20th century has suffered from many violent incidents which can be traced back to Christianity. Some have been organized, others not so organized, but all the result of specifically violent or dangerous doctrines promoted in Christian churches. Often the hatred and violence circles around particular issues, like homosexuality or abortion

Is Christianity only a religion of Peace and Love? I do not think that anyone can honestly and objectively examine these situations in American society and answer "yes" to that question. Christianity can encourage Peace and Love - but it certainly need not, and it quite often has done just the opposite.

Although the people responsible for violence might have found a way to express their hatred without Christianity, it cannot be ignored that Christianity offers a convenient divine mandate for hatred and violent acts against a wide range of people in our diverse country. Christians are going to have to seriously rethink and revamp their faith if they are going to join in building a prosperous, pluralistic America of the future.

Bible Wars
One sad bit of American and Christian history which few (if any) manage to learn about are the "Bible Wars" between Catholics and Protestants in the latter half of the 19th century. This is especially unfortunate because is remarkably resembles some of the issues which face us today with regards to having religion in public school. If it could lead to violence and death then, we should be wary today.

Jonesboro & Paducah
Commentary on the school violence which occurred in Jonesboro and Paducah. Would more religion in the schools have prevented the violent outbursts, as some religious leaders claim?

Christianity & Homosexuality
The first thing to look at is the nature of the rhetoric and propaganda which is disseminated by "good Christians" in America when addressing this and similar issues. Senator Trent Lott has openly compared homosexuals with thieves, expressing the fundamental assumption that homosexuality is essentially criminal in nature and deserving of similar treatment.

Christianity & Abortion
Government officials in both Canada and the United States have issued warnings to abortion doctors to take extra precautions. Anti-abortion extremists in Britain have warned the public that there "will be casualties" in the coming war, and that they did not intend to "turn the other cheek." As the anti-abortion rhetoric has increased over the years, so has the anti-abortion violence - property is destroyed, people are killed, and women are denied access to medical care.

Christianity & Wiccans
Do prejudice and discrimination against Wiccans exist in America? Absolutely - although those who engage in it are among the last to be willing to admit it. Wicca, in case you weren't aware, comes from the Old English word for "witch" and is a religion which celebrates seasonal- and life-cycles using rituals dating from pre-Christian Europe.

Christian Cults
No account of Christian violence in America would be complete without including some of the acts perpetrated by small groups usually known as "cults." I deplore stereotyping of cults - something which is perhaps most common among Christian apologists. But although "cults" are no more likely to be violent or neurotic than traditional religions, the fact remains that some very famous and very public incidents of violence have occurred with so-called cults.

Published on Tuesday, July 26, 2005 by the Toronto Star


[size=14pt]Who's Taking Blame for Christian Violence?[/size]

by Calvin White

Now that imams in Britain and Canada are standing up and publicly condemning terrorist acts as anti-Muslim and against the teachings in the Qur'an, I wonder if pressure might be put on Christian leaders to take a similar stand.

Contrary to what some might like to insist, Christianity is not the religion of "an eye for an eye" but it is the religion of Jesus, who refined those earlier directions and distilled the ten commandments into two. One was to "love thy neighbor as thyself." Pretty definitive isn't it? As is the edict of turning the other cheek.

Jesus expected to be betrayed. He expected to be arrested by the authorities. There was no exhortations to prepare for battle. There was no bloody attempt to stop the proceedings.

Even as Jesus was brutalized while carrying his own crucifixion cross and being nailed onto the timbers, there was no violent counterforce from his disciples. Not even an outcry.

No matter where one reads in the accounts of Jesus, the only conclusion one can come to is that Jesus was about love.

So where are the Christian leaders when it comes to violent actions by our Western leaders? Where are the televangelists, who every Sunday take over the airwaves to trumpet the message of Jesus, when it comes to taking on bunker busting bombs and mass carnage?

Where are they when it comes to the death penalty prevalent in the majority of American states?

When President George Bush insists that billions of dollars need to continue flowing to the war effort in Iraq which leads to more American body bags and Iraqi graves, why is there no outcry? Why don't the Christian leaders stand up and challenge those decisions, and passionately assert that Jesus would have sought another way of solving the problems?

In this time when Christianity is on the rise all over America, when there is a growing surge in extolling Christian values, why is it that when the born-again Bush says it's better to fight "them" over there than on American soil, no concerted group of leaders stands up and yells that he's got it wrong?

Like Bush, British Prime Minister Tony Blair is also born again.

Yet, their combined leadership has been responsible for excruciating death and injury to innocent civilians in Afghanistan and Iraq.

They both claim a righteousness in their policies of destruction. They were even counseled by their secular allies not to resort to the carnage. Where was the equal pressure from the Christian leadership?

Interesting, isn't it, that Muslim fanatics use the idea of holy jihad and rewards in paradise to recruit their dupes into terrible acts of destruction, and in Christian circles there is the solemn assembling for prayer and seeking of blessings for the troops and leaders in their mission of war.

Interesting, isn't it, that polling clearly indicates the Christian right in America is emphatically against bad language on TV and in the movies, horrified by Janet Jackson's bare nipple � but drawn with considerable relish to violence in the same media.

The additional galling irony of Jesus being emblazoned on the foreheads of those in command of the sharpest swords is that Jesus was also all about intelligence. He was all about deeper understanding, about using insight and keenness of mind to solve problems. Think of how the Pharisees tried to trick him by holding up different sections of the law to trip him up.

His disciples picking corn, for instance, and thus working, on the Sabbath. Jesus answered that the Sabbath was for man and not the other way around. There was the adulteress brought before him to be stoned; he responded that any without sin might cast the first stone.

What kind of insight have Bush and Blair employed? What intelligence, what deeper understanding is demonstrated by the tactic of blast and shoot with as much technologically advanced weaponry as is available?

What compassion, what recognition of common humanity is shown when the biggest concern is how to pad the soldiers with as much body Kevlar and the humvees with as much armour as possible so they can kill all the easier without casualties � and thus retain the support of the home front.

How do our current religious leaders think Jesus would react to the concept of collateral damage?

Calvin White is a freelance commentator and poet who lives in British Columbia.

did Jesus say his kingdom is of this world?

there are rulers and principalities governing human affairs and to understand these things you need to have wisdom.

lol

^^what's so amusing?

you dont understand my post, i suppose.

BetaThings:

I pray NEVER to have the MISFORTUNE of abandoning the worship of ALLAH
Let us wait till they of resurrection when anyone who did not practise Islam in this world will realise their errors and start sweating BLOOD

Do you think any body that is not a Muslim will lose sleep because of some baseless treat about the after life? The reality is that 80 percent of the world population does not care about the treats that are to be found in the Koran,because it means nothing to them and the treat remains imaginary. . .

aletheia:

^
Refute away all you want. The god of this world holds you in thrall and you will never understand the Mystery of God Incarnate unless the Holy Spirit gives you let. May God the Father of the Lord Jesus have mercy on you!

On that Great Day false prophet Mohammed himself will have no time for you for he himself will be pleading for mercy to no avail!
(Rev 19:20 [KJV])
And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.

You are now without excuse:

Do you think any body that is not a Christian will lose sleep because of some baseless treat about the after life? The reality is that over 70 percent of the world population does not care about the treats that are to be found in the bible and do not believe in it ,because it means nothing to them and the treat remains imaginary. . .

tpia@:

^^what's so amusing?

you dont understand my post, i suppose.

i know it must have offended you.but sorry,there is really nothing in your post to "understand".its the usual christian rhetoric to make people believe through obedience without understanding which is equal to blindness.i really dont know what wisdom and understanding it requires man to comprehend basic truths and realities.

mazaje:

Do you think any body that is not a Christian will lose sleep because of some baseless treat about the after life? The reality is that over 70 percent of the world population does not care about the treats that are to be found in the bible and do not believe in it ,because it means nothing to them and the treat remains imaginary. . .

“And if you obey most of those on the earth, they will mislead you far away from the path of Allah. They follow nothing but conjecture and they do nothing but lie.” (Holy Quran 6:116)

“, but most men know not.” (Holy Quran 12:40)

LagosShia:

i know it must have offended you.but sorry,there is really nothing in your post to "understand".its the usual christian rhetoric to make people believe through obedience without understanding which is equal to blindness.i really dont know what wisdom and understanding it requires man to comprehend basic truths and realities.

^^no, i wasnt offended.

i knew it wasnt the answer you wanted to hear, but the fact remains Jesus said his kingdom is not of this world.

tpia@:


^^no, i wasnt offended.

i knew it wasnt the answer you wanted to hear, but the fact remains Jesus said his kingdom is not of this world.

LOL again!

it looks like you didnt understand what my LOL was meant for.

what does Jesus' statement got to do with the fact that christians are violent and violence is abundant in the bible?

yeah,we've heard of the cliche that Jesus said that,but the fact remains that violence is part and parcel of christianity from the onset.

^^i've given you the response to your question by telling you what Jesus himself said.

you were asking why bush invaded iraq, etc.

like i told you, world affairs are controlled by certain powers and principalities, and it would be beyond your understanding [or maybe not], to grasp what really is at play here.

@above

you can preach all you want but that got nothing to do with the topic of the thread.i am not the one you need to preach to and inform.you need to inform your fellow christians who are burning the UK and places around the world.tell them,not me!

^^where is the preaching? You asked a question and i gave you an answer.

in any case, london is the muslim capital of europe, so it's quite unrealistic to assume only christians did the looting.

never mind the fact that most of the people you're calling "christian" possibly dont identify as such?

tpia@:

^^where is the preaching? You asked a question and i gave you an answer.

in any case, london is the muslim capital of europe, so it's quite unrealistic to assume only christians did the looting.

never mind the fact that most of the people you're calling "christian" possibly dont identify as such?

sorry, but i never asked you any question before you came here preaching about "kingdom".you must see a doctor asap.you're suffering from braindead head.

you can repeat the lie again based on your imagination that muslims could have taken part in the violence when it was reported that 3 young muslim men were killed trying to protect their father's shop in london.the evil christian medias would not tell the world about that.

^^look, no need to get all nasty and insultive when faced with simple facts.

i'm sure you're not new to this forum and by now you should know who to trash talk here. Certainly not me.


if you dont like the basic information i gave you, then that's your prerogative.

but you need to stop whining.

oh, you joined in november 2010 and you have ayatollah khomeini on your profile.

we shall see!!!

tpia@:

^^look, no need to get all nasty and insultive when faced with simple facts.

i'm sure you're not new to this forum and by now you should know who to trash talk here. Certainly not me.


if you dont like the basic information i gave you, then that's your prerogative.

but you need to stop whining.

tpia@:

oh, you joined in november 2010 and you have ayatollah khomeini on your profile.

we shall see!!!

LOL

lmao

@Tpia@: « #49 on: Today at 05:20:09 AM »
[Quote]Quote from: LagosShia on Today at 05:13:16 AM
i know it must have offended you.but sorry,there is really nothing in your post to "understand".its the usual christian rhetoric to make people believe through obedience without understanding which is equal to blindness.i really dont know what wisdom and understanding it requires man to comprehend basic truths and realities.


^^no, i wasnt offended.

i knew it wasnt the answer you wanted to hear, but the fact remains Jesus said his kingdom is not of this world.[/Quote]Is Jesus the king of the Jews or not? Is he not the king that the christians yell 'every knee shall bow'? Is he not the king of kings as the christians say? if not on this earth, how many kings in heavens that Jesus is going to be their king?

anti Tpia@ e je jawo kuro ni nu apon tio yo.

@alethea; On the matter of Jibril [as] being the holy spirit, here is whetting your appetite:

016.102
YUSUFALI: Say, the Holy Spirit has brought the revelation from thy Lord in Truth, in order to strengthen those who believe, and as a Guide and Glad Tidings to Muslims.

So the Holy spirit has brought down the Quran to the prophet Muhammad, this is non other than the angel Jibreel, this is what the Quran says concerning Jibreel:

002.097
YUSUFALI: Say: Whoever is an enemy to Gabriel-for he brings down the (revelation) to thy heart by Allah's will, a confirmation of what went before, and guidance and glad tidings for those who believe,-

@Alethea: Chapter on the meaning of Rooh al-Qudus:

Allaah said (interpretation of the meaning):

"O ?Eesa (Jesus), son of Maryam (Mary)! Remember My Favour to you and to your mother when I supported you with Rooh ul Qudus [Jibreel (Gabriel)]."

[al-Maa'idah 5:110]

Allaah supported the Messiah (peace be upon him) with Rooh al-Qudus as He mentions in this aayah. In al-Baqarah Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

"And We gave ?Eesa (Jesus), the son of Maryam (Mary), clear signs and supported him with Rooh-ul-Qudus [Jibreel (Gabriel)]

[al-Baqarah 2:87]

@Alethea; Which the trustworthy Rooh has brought down' [al-Shu'ara' 26:193]
then We sent to her our Rooh' [Maryam 19:17]."

@Alethea; Al-Bukhari recorded `A'ishah saying that the Messenger of Allah erected a Minbar in the Masjid on which Hassan bin Thabit (the renowned poet) used to defend the Messenger of Allah (with his poems). The Messenger of Allah said, (O Allah! Aid Hassan with Ruh Al-Qudus, for he defended Your Prophet.)


Abu Dawud recorded this Hadith in his Sunan as did At-Tirmidhi who graded it Hasan Sahih. Further, Ibn Hibban recorded in his Sahih that Ibn Mas`ud said that the Prophet said, (Ruh Al-Qudus informed me that no soul shall die until it finishes its set provisions and term limit. Therefore, have Taqwa of Allah and seek your sustenance in the most suitable way.)

And Allah Knows Best!

http://www.muslim-responses.com/