Re: The Bible Justified It That A Women Can Go To Church With Her Hair Uncovered! by Image123(m): 4:19pm On Sep 16, 2014 |
Vin14:
No,please read it again KJV and older accurate translations say that the hair is given the woman FOR a covering. You are saying it is given her AS a covering.Do not contradict and twist yourself. Vin14: Yes,i said that and i never denied it.What i is said is that , i actually meant it as "for" as in the original accurate versions like KJV.So it becomes clear that you are accusing vainly by twisting my subsequent correction of "as" as "for". So it becomes clear that you only want to accuse vainly and try to win the argument regardless of the real merit of your argument.So i say again, stop trying to twist the eternal scriptures for your selfish temporary gains. no, yes, no, yes. Is this a joke or what? |
Re: The Bible Justified It That A Women Can Go To Church With Her Hair Uncovered! by Vin14(m): 4:29pm On Sep 16, 2014 |
Image123:
no, yes, no, yes. Is this a joke or what? So it becomes abundantly clear that you only want to twist and mock God's word and show off your lack of intelligence.Vain accusations show your lack of intelligence.Don't make yourself a "joke" by your vain accusations. |
Re: The Bible Justified It That A Women Can Go To Church With Her Hair Uncovered! by BodyKiss(m): 11:44pm On Sep 16, 2014 |
Vin14:
Common sense will lead you to scriptures because of it's clarity of teachings and prophetic fulfillments.1000's of Bible prophecies have been fulfilled till date according to secular historic data,Jesus himself fulfilled more than 300 messianic prophecies,thus proving he is the Christ ,1000's of miracle healings happen throughout the world , few of which gets reported in christian media,is all open for verification and certified credible by many.To see and verify some of these fulfilled prophecies visit-http://yah12..in/
Lord Jesus said in Mathew 7:12-So in everything, do to others what you would have them do to you, for this sums up the Law and the Prophets.-That is the clarity of teaching of God.
God bless you. Totally off topic to the post you quoted. |
Re: The Bible Justified It That A Women Can Go To Church With Her Hair Uncovered! by Vin14(m): 4:53am On Sep 17, 2014 |
BodyKiss:
Totally off topic to the post you quoted. 1 Corinthians 11:1-16 is a part of scriptures and therefore what i posted is totally on topic. |
Re: The Bible Justified It That A Women Can Go To Church With Her Hair Uncovered! by Vin14(m): 5:00am On Sep 17, 2014 |
August17: I don't really understand the point you are interpreting it from. So I guess you didn't read 1 cor11vs5 and 6... The bible is not a novel... Study to show yourself approved.... #Kpakam Shorn= cutting all hairs with scissors=Shaven=shaving all hair with razor. In 1Corinthians11:5-Apostle says- But every woman who prays or prophesies with her head uncovered dishonors her head,it is the same as having her head shaved.In the next verse he says-For if the woman be not covered, let her also be shorn: but if it be a shame for a woman to be shorn or shaven, let her be covered.So it becomes clear that to be "shorn" is v.6 is synonymous with "shaven" in v.5.So the meaning of shorn in this context is to cut all hair with scissors.If the women want to twist the God given purpose of their natural long hair to cut and resemble male hair pattern,then it's better to cut off or shave off all hair on their head. Shorn means to cut closely with scissors -it's akin to being shaven .That is why Apostle Paul says to "shave or shorn" as synonyms.The very purpose why God gave long hair to women, is for intimate differentiation which is the meaning of "covering".If women cut that long hair to resemble men's short hair ,then there is no need for hair on a women's head.So that is what Apostle was saying here.Women should not try to cut their hair short to resemble men,because their long hair is given as a covering over their body which project man's glory which is also the symbol of authority on womens head because it clearly differentiate between man and a woman from an angelic point of view-1 Corinthians 11:10.Now if for some reason (cancer chemo/radio therapy or other disease) a woman donot have natural long hair,then she should cover her head with a cloth/cap. |
Re: The Bible Justified It That A Women Can Go To Church With Her Hair Uncovered! by Vin14(m): 5:12am On Sep 17, 2014 |
tpia1:
this shows context.
most of the verses discussing these things, are in the context of the presence of both genders in the church, eg:
I Timothy 2 12 I do not permit a woman to teach or to assume authority over a man she must be quiet.
13 For Adam was formed first, then Eve.
14 And Adam was not the one deceived; it was the woman who was deceived and became a sinner.
Even today it's shameful for a woman to go bald/shaven.Just look at cancer chemo/radio induced patients without any hair on head.They cover their head with a cloth/cap when going out in public.So this long hair is given to women by God for a covering not just for a specific time or cultural context,but always.
Women can put up their hair in the fashions they wish at other times,but whenever a woman pray or preach/prophesy in front of public(even if it's a little house prayer in front of your husband and children),they must put down their hair as natural covering as God intents.If for some reason a woman cuts her hair then she should definitely cover hear head with a cloth/cap while praying or prophesying(preaching) in public.
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Re: The Bible Justified It That A Women Can Go To Church With Her Hair Uncovered! by Vin14(m): 5:29am On Sep 17, 2014 |
tpia1:
this shows context.
most of the verses discussing these things, are in the context of the presence of both genders in the church, eg:
I Timothy 2:12
-1 Thimothy2:12-donot allow wives to teach or have authority over their husband.It can also be interpreted as man and woman,because single men and women will have to follow this when they marry.That is why the scriptural context is regarding the order in church with respect to women and men in general rather than husband and wives.
So these scriptures effectively ban women from position of senior Pastor/leader/Overseer/bishop of the church(all these are different titles for the same office of the Pastor/leader of the church).Single pastor for every church with many deacons comprising of both men and women to help him is the biblical model(1 Timothy 3:1-16).
Women are allowed to do all other public ministry in church like apostolic healing/miracle ministries,evangelization,teaching(both Men and women,but authoritarian teaching cannot be given to women),giving testimony,music ministry,prophesying.But while doing these ministries they must cover their head with their natural long hair/wig/ cloth/cap or any other thing that will symbolically cover her head, to show that she is in submission to God.(1 Corinthians 11:2-16).Full perfect covering is not essential as the head covering is only symbolic(1 Corinthians 11:10) to show that the women doing God’s ministry is doing it in submission to the Godly order of God-Christ-Man-Woman.
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Re: The Bible Justified It That A Women Can Go To Church With Her Hair Uncovered! by Vin14(m): 5:32am On Sep 17, 2014 |
booqee: even if i were to analyse with vs 1-14: it says christ is head over man, and so if he covers his head, he dishonors christ, the man is head over d woman, but if she does not cover her head, she dishonors her husband. In other words, a single lady like me who is not married MAY NOT cover her head, because she's got no husband to dishonor, and so therefore she has not committed any sin. ~and even dis 'uncovered hair' i've been mentioning implies a shaven head, so A married woman cannot shave head hair. ~to know dat d hair is d covering, and the uncovered head is d shaven one, vs 6 says if a woman would not have her covered(doesn't want to have hairs on her head), she should shave it, but because shaving it is a shame then she should leave it and have her head covered(with her hair). ~and yet, i believe all this law still only applies to d married women, as woman used here means 'a married woman' just like joagbaje said. No,you are incorrect.It applies to all women.But it's particularly important in married women.Otherwise it will sent a wrong signal to those getting married. God diferentiated mankindnas man and woman and long hair for woman and short hair for men is a part of that natural God given differentiation. The reason for this differentiation is also given in 1 Corinthians 11:1-16 - which is Man being the glory of Christ Jesus -God ,man projects glory of God so he doesn't need to cover this glory in the presence of God, while woman is the glory of Man and this manly glory which is only a creation of God should be blocked/not visible in the presence of God's glory. That is why woman are commanded to cover their head while doing public ministry (prophesying) or while praying, either with long hair or if long hair is not available a scarf or cloth. So may God bless you and all who read this to see the truth and reality. |
Re: The Bible Justified It That A Women Can Go To Church With Her Hair Uncovered! by Kingsmeado(m): 5:58pm On Sep 24, 2014 |
Insightful God bless myfab: I think we have all had problems understanding Paul's words in 1COR 11:1-16, and that is evident in the number of differing church doctrines and writings. Part of the problem of understanding, I believe, is in the use and understanding of the word `head' because it has more than one meaning in these verses. One meaning being the head on which the hair grows, and the other meaning, cardinal, chief, or foremost. So what is the truth, what does God's bible the KJV really say ?
We must first of all understand that Paul was writing to the church at Corinth and before you say, that's obvious, I think we should try to understand all that that entails, the history, the religion, and especially the culture. If one was reading a letter from a pen- pal in India one would need to grasp the conditions under which he or she lived to better understand what was being said. So when we read any book of the bible, because it refers to churches in other countries, we should first try to understand the things pertaining to that country, during that time period, before we make statements, or judgements, or jump to conclusions.
In order to comprehend why Paul needed to answer this question for the Corinthian Church of God, which held their meetings in members houses, as to whether a woman should cover her head or not, we should all know that Corinth was a pagan city, the capital of the Roman province Achaia, and was the most important city in Greece during Roman times. The Corinthians worshipped Aphrodite the pagan goddess of love, beauty, and fertility, and in the temple dedicated to her worship over 1,000 slave-priestesses, known as sacred prostit- utes, served. During their worship, if they were prophesying, they let their hair hang down loosely round their shoulders.
The city of Corinth had a population of over 700,000 who were mainly given to self indulgence, and vice. The morals of the Corinthians were very bad, corrupt even when compared to pagan Rome. It was the custom throughout the region to shave the heads of female slaves and also women who were guilty of fornication or adultery. The sign of marriage in that day was the wearing of a veil or distinctive hair style, as a wedding ring is in our society today.
Obviously the emerging Christian church had it's problems just as the Israelites had when they left Egypt, learning new things but remembering the old. One can imagine how hard it must have been for Paul to establish a Christian church there, he also had opposition from some of the resident Jews.
So let's examine what Paul says in 1COR 11:1-16 and then reply.
In his 1st Letter to the Corinthians he advises, guides, and replies to a number of questions and then in chapter 11 writes, obviously in reply to a question asked, about whether a woman should cover her head in church. THAT IS - IN THE CHURCH AT CORINTH.
He replies:- 1CO 11:1 Be ye followers of me, even as I also {am} of Christ. (KJV) 1CO 11:2 Now I praise you, brethren, that ye remember me in all things, and keep the ordinances, as I delivered {them} to you. (KJV) 1CO 11:3 But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman {is} the man; and the head of Christ {is} God. (KJV) PAUL IS SAYING HERE THAT CHRIST IS THE CHIEF OR FOREMOST OF EVERY MAN AND WOMAN, AND MAN IS THE CHIEF OR FOREMOST OF THE WOMAN, AND GOD IS THE CHIEF OR FOREMOST OF CHRIST.
1CO 11:4 Every man praying or prophesying, having {his} head covered, dishonoureth his head. (KJV) EVERY MAN HAVING HIS ACTUAL HEAD COVERED, DISHONOURETH CHRIST. 1CO 11:5 But every woman that prayeth or prophesieth with {her} head uncovered dishonoureth her head: for that is even all one as if she were shaven. (KJV) SOME MARRIED WOMEN IN THE CHURCH WERE OBVIOUSLY REMEMBERING AND COPYING WHAT THE TEMPLE-SLAVES DID, AND WERE UNCOVERING THEIR HEADS AND LETTING THEIR HAIR DOWN. IN DOING THIS THEY DISHONOURED THEIR HEAD, THEIR HUSBANDS. UNCOVERING THEIR HEADS WAS THE SAME AS HAVING THEIR HEADS SHAVED.
1CO 11:6 For if the woman be not covered, let her also be shorn: but if it be a shame for a woman to be shorn or shaven, let her be covered. (KJV) IF THE WOMAN IS NOT VEILED THEN LET HER BE SHAVED. BUT IF IT SHAMES HER THEN LET HER BE COVERED, VEILED.
1CO 11:7 For a man indeed ought not to cover {his} head, forasmuch as he is the image and glory of God: but the woman is the glory of the man. (KJV) 1CO 11:8 For the man is not of the woman; but the woman of the man. (KJV) 1CO 11:9 Neither was the man created for the woman; but the woman for the man. (KJV) 1CO 11:10 For this cause ought the woman to have power on {her} head because of the angels. (KJV) THE WOMAN OUGHT TO HAVE POWER, A VEIL, ON HER HEAD TO SHOW THE ANGELS WHO WATCH OVER US THAT SHE RESPECTS AND SUBMITS TO HER HUSBAND AND THEREFORE TO CHRIST.
1CO 11:11 Nevertheless neither is the man without the woman, neither the woman without the man, in the Lord. (KJV) 1CO 11:12 For as the woman {is} of the man, even so {is} the man also by the woman; but all things of God. (KJV) NEVERTHELESS BOTH SHOULD LOVE AND RESPECT EACH OTHER.
1CO 11:13 Judge in yourselves: is it comely that a woman pray unto God uncovered? (KJV) PAUL IS ASKING THE CORINTHIANS, BECAUSE OF YOUR CUSTOM OF MARRIED WOMEN WEARING THEIR HAIR IN A CERTAIN FASHION AND/OR WEARING A VEIL AT ALL TIMES, TO SHOW THEIR SUBMISSION TO THEIR HUSBANDS, IS IT RIGHT THAT THEY SHOULD LET THEIR HAIR HANG DOWN LOOSELY WHEN PROPHESYING BEFORE GOD IN CHURCH ?
1CO 11:14 Doth not even nature itself teach you, that, if a man have long hair, it is a shame unto him? (KJV) BECAUSE HE WILL LOOK LIKE A WOMAN.
1CO 11:15 But if a woman have long hair, it is a glory to her: for {her} hair is given her for a covering. (KJV) PAUL IS SAYING HERE THAT THE LONG HAIR OF A WOMAN IS NATURAL EVIDENCE OF HER WOMANLY POSITION UNDER MAN, INSTEAD OF A VEIL.
1CO 11:16 But if any man seem to be contentious, we have no such custom, neither the churches of God. (KJV) BUT IF ANY MAN IN THE CORINTHIAN CHURCH WANTS TO ARGUE OVER THE ISSUE AND WHAT I HAVE WRITTEN, PAUL SAYS, "WE HAVE NO SUCH CUSTOM, NEITHER THE CHURCHES OF GOD." HE IS SAYING, WE OF OURSELVES HAVE NO SUCH CUSTOM AND NEITHER DO THE CHURCHES OF GOD.
I think it should now be plain to all what Paul was saying in 1COR 11:1-16.
He starts out by telling us the order of things under Almighty God in relation to humans. GOD is first with Christ under Him then man under both God the Father and Christ and finally woman is under man. The bible states quite clearly, woman was made for man, man was not made for woman. That does not mean woman is less than man, because God once again says in EPH 5:24-28, both should respect each other. It simply means that there is an order with God and man, just as there is an order in the animal world. ALL BY DESIGN.
EPH 5:24 Therefore as the church is subject unto Christ, so {let} the wives {be} to their own husbands in every thing. (KJV) EPH 5:25 Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it; (KJV) EPH 5:26 That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word, (KJV) EPH 5:27 That he might present it to himself a glorious church, not having spot, or wrinkle, or any such thing; but that it should be holy and without blemish. (KJV) EPH 5:28 So ought men to love their wives as their own bodies. He that loveth his wife loveth himself. (KJV)
Paul then says, if a man prays with his head covered he dishonours Christ, who is his head, or who is head over him.
In that region during that time period the heads of slave women were shaved, and also the heads of any women found guilty of fornication, and adultery. It was also the custom of the slave-priestesses who worshipped Aphrodite to take off their veils and let their hair hang down when prophesying in the temple. On the other hand because it was the custom for married women to wear veils or to wear their hair in a particular fashion to show they were married, Paul advised it was wrong for the Corinthian women to take off their veils and let down their hair when praying or prophesying in church as it gave the wrong impression, and dishonoured their husbands and therefore Christ.
The bible says a woman's long hair is in itself a covering given by God so there is no need for any other covering.
Paul ends this discourse by saying if anyone disagreed with his appraisal of that situation, in the Corinthian church, then they should know that neither he (and his companions) nor the Church of God had such a custom.
SO QUITE CLEARLY THERE IS NO RULING IN THE BIBLE WHICH SAYS ALL WOMEN SHOULD COVER THEIR HEADS IN CHURCH. |
Re: The Bible Justified It That A Women Can Go To Church With Her Hair Uncovered! by Vin14(m): 5:07am On Nov 24, 2014 |
Kingsmeado: Insightful God bless If Paul ended the discourse by saying they had no such custom,why would Paul go into the troubles of what men and women should do with regards to head covering in 1 Corinthians 11:1-15.It's not logical.What Paul meant is he nor God's churches have any other custom,other than natural long hair covering of women. |
Re: The Bible Justified It That A Women Can Go To Church With Her Hair Uncovered! by Vin14(m): 5:08am On Nov 24, 2014 |
Kingsmeado: Insightful God bless Even today it's shameful for a woman to go bald/shaven.Just look at cancer chemo/radio induced patients without any hair on head.They cover their head with a cloth/cap when going out in public.So this long hair is given to women by God for a covering not just for a specific time or cultural context,but always. Women can put up their hair in the fashions they wish at other times,but whenever a woman pray or preach/prophesy in front of public(even if it's a little house prayer in front of your husband and children),they must put down their hair as natural covering as God intents.If for some reason a woman cuts her hair then she should definitely cover hear head with a cloth/cap while praying or prophesying(preaching) in public. |
Re: The Bible Justified It That A Women Can Go To Church With Her Hair Uncovered! by Saraha1(f): 10:14am On Nov 24, 2014 |
Why will I need to uncover my head while going to church? Have you ever seen the muslim christain opening their hair when going for prayers? Is only we (christain) that make issue out of nothing. We know the truth , but just because we want to satify our immortal body, will just jump over.
Some of this so called men of God are the major problems. When their wives open their hair while at church whhy on earth will some of their members not fellow such a silly step?
Above all , one thing is certain. On that day everyone man for himself , nothing like I thought !
Why not cover your hair to avoid unnecessary story. |
Re: The Bible Justified It That A Women Can Go To Church With Her Hair Uncovered! by Vin14(m): 2:47pm On Nov 25, 2014 |
Saraha1: Why will I need to uncover my head while going to church? Have you ever seen the muslim christain opening their hair when going for prayers? Is only we (christain) that make issue out of nothing. We know the truth , but just because we want to satify our immortal body, will just jump over.
Some of this so called men of God are the major problems. When their wives open their hair while at church whhy on earth will some of their members not fellow such a silly step?
Above all , one thing is certain. On that day everyone man for himself , nothing like I thought !
Why not cover your hair to avoid unnecessary story. You are wrong according to God's Word-Bible.Islamic/Pagan head covering is based on the principle of modesty.Just like women cover other parts of body they need to cover their hair according to pagan sects. According to God's word-Bible,women should cover their head(not hair) by their natural God given long hair covering when they project glory of God to others while praying or preaching(prophesy) in public , in order to cover the man's glory that woman's body projects.This is the principle,unlike in pagan customs which is rooted mainly in modest dressing,christian head covering is rooted mainly in authority and modesty indirectly.Read 1 Corinthians 11:1-15.Paul clearly says in 1 Corinthians 11:15 that this covering is the natural long hair of women which is given in place of the pagan veil.That is why Paul says in 1 Corinthians 11:5,6 that if woman donot want to cover (that is to cut her long hair to resemble men) , then she should go all the way and cut all her head hair(shorn) or shave off all head hair , because the very purpose of the long head hair that God gave to you women is to cover the man's glory that your bodies project.Therefore further covering in the form of veil is not needed , unless for some reason you women donot have hair as in cancer chemotherapy patients. So understand that it's an issue of authority (God-Christ-Man-Woman-1 Corinthians 11:3) first and modesty only secondarily.While when it comes to your bodily cloth covering modesty comes first and authority only second (1 Timothy 2:9-15). |
Re: The Bible Justified It That A Women Can Go To Church With Her Hair Uncovered! by Opengates(m): 2:26pm On Sep 06, 2015 |
booqee:
even if i were to analyse with vs 1-14: it says christ is head over man, and so if he covers his head, he dishonors christ, the man is head over d woman, but if she does not cover her head, she dishonors her husband. In other words, a single lady like me who is not married MAY NOT cover her head, because she's got no husband to dishonor, and so therefore she has not committed any sin. ~and even dis 'uncovered hair' i've been mentioning implies a shaven head, so A married woman cannot shave head hair. ~to know dat d hair is d covering, and the uncovered head is d shaven one, vs 6 says if a woman would not have her covered(doesn't want to have hairs on her head), she should shave it, but because shaving it is a shame then she should leave it and have her head covered(with her hair). ~and yet, i believe all this law still only applies to d married women, as woman used here means a married woman' just like joagbaje said. Jesus Christ is your husband, why dishonouring Him? |
Re: The Bible Justified It That A Women Can Go To Church With Her Hair Uncovered! by Vin14(m): 7:21pm On Sep 18, 2017 |
tpia1:
Its not a sin dear.
That which cometh out of a man ( or woman)'s heart is what defileth him (or her).
If you are doing the one (covering hair) you should also not neglect the other ( your mind). No, God diferentiated mankindnas man and woman and long hair for woman and short hair for men is a part of that natural God given differentiation. The reason for this differentiation is also given in 1 Corinthians 11:1-16 - which is Man being the glory of Christ Jesus -God ,man projects glory of God so he doesn't need to cover this glory in the presence of God, while woman is the glory of Man and this manly glory which is only a creation of God should be blocked/not visible in the presence of God's glory. That is why woman are commanded to cover their head while doing public ministry (prophesying) or while praying, either with long hair or if long hair is not available a scarf or cloth. So may God bless you and all who read this to see the truth and reality. |
Re: The Bible Justified It That A Women Can Go To Church With Her Hair Uncovered! by Vin14(m): 7:24pm On Sep 18, 2017 |
BodyKiss:
Totally off topic to the post you quoted. Not at all off topic. The fact that the fulfilled prophecies of the eternal God's Word - the Holy Bible makes it more credible and very important for all mankind to follow it as the God's eternal word. Otherwise all christian theological discussions are irrelevant. |