@OP
Jesus is the Christ,the redeemer of mankind.

@ Kola Oloye: Thanks for your very succinct and on-topic response.

However, if I may - just a very little question, as you have drawn our attention to Christ's role as redeemer of mankind:

1. What was the state of mankind prior to Jesus sojourn on earth - redeemed or unredeemed - and what were the manifestations of such a state?

2. What is the state of mankind now, after Jesus' sojourn on earth - redeemed or unredeemed - and what is the manifestation of such a state?

Many thanks.

brainpulse:

@ Deepsight i am forced to respond to your allusion here on the bolded, i would rather say you are not a believer in the words of God at all and a deceiver of the brethren, because every words as written in the bible are the mind of God and inspired only by him(II Tim 3:16). For all the words to survive generations and brought together is never the effort of any man if God has not willed. For you to say Paul was lying even when you were not born during this period shows you are deliberately ignorant or mislead in your beliefs.
I will suggest that Enigma seize to discuss with you on this issue because it shows that you are only out to paint the truth lies despite evidences posed before you. I regret if my words sounds harsh but know its in good faith.
Thanks

Quite obviously a waste of time, isn't it?

brainpulse:

@ Deepsight i am forced to respond to your allusion here on the bolded, i would rather say you are not a believer in the words of God at all and a deceiver of the brethren, because every words as written in the bible are the mind of God and inspired only by him(II Tim 3:16). For all the words to survive generations and brought together is never the effort of any man if God has not willed. For you to say Paul was lying even when you were not born during this period shows you are deliberately ignorant or mislead in your beliefs.
I will suggest that Enigma seize to discuss with you on this issue because it shows that you are only out to paint the truth lies despite evidences posed before you. I regret if my words sounds harsh but know its in good faith.
Thanks

Thanks for your comments, and yes, I take them in good faith. Don't worry about Enigma, as a famed sissy, he has a long habit of behaving like a girl: so no doubt he will take your advise. No one but her over-aged r[i]a[/i]ping suitors should be concerned about that.

As to the issue, you too should cease to read scripture with the lens of infallibility. Scripture is not infallible: and I can show you this in an instant, if you care.

The plain fact is that Paul stated that God made a statement about Jesus: he quoted from Psalm 45: and any reading of Psalm 45 shows that no such statement was made regarding Jesus!

That is the plain and undeniable fact. As such Paul either was ignorant or simply lied. The latter more likely: which in fact renders him a dubious manipulator of scripture in addittionm to his well-earned status as a notorious chauvinist.

Deep Sight:

Thanks for your comments, and yes, I take them in good faith. Don't worry about Enigma, as a famed sissy, he has a long habit of behaving like a girl: so no doubt he will take your advise. No one but her over-aged raping suitors should be concerned about that.

As to the issue, you too should cease to read scripture the lens of infallibility. Scripture is not infallible: and I can show you this in an instant, if you care. The plain fact is that Paul stated that God made a statement about Jesus: he quoted from Psalm 45: and any reading of Psalm 45 shows that no such statement was made regarding Jesus!

That is the plain and undeniable fact.

But you will still beeeg in future to discuss with this famed sissy who in your fit you referred to in one go as "he" and "her".

^ Yawn.

Its so clear! That Jesus is the Son of God like us, thus a separate being different and connected by a fidiucary relationship with God!

Simple, except if matters of divinity is above reason.

^^^^ You would think that that would be a simple enough thing to say: on the contrary you have sissified buffoons spewing native inferiority of the most lamentable kind, while seeking to worship a foreign mere mortal man: and lampooning those who do not kow-tow as - wait for it - dishonest.

What an interesting place this world is.

Kay 17: Its so clear!

I'm not quite sure it's so clear, could you clarify a couple of things for me as below? Thanks.

Kay 17: That Jesus is the Son of God like us, thus a separate being different and connected by a fidiucary relationship with God!

1. How is Jesus "the son of God"?

2. How is "us" the son/s of God?

3. How is Jesus' sonship comparable with that of "us"?

4. What exactly do you mean by a "fiduciary relationship with God"?

Kay 17: Simple, except if matters of divinity is above reason.

Certain matters of divinity must ex necessitate be above reason. Having said that, there are logical and reasoned conceptions of divinity even within the Christian faith as you should know.

Enigma:

I'm not quite sure it's so clear, could you clarify a couple of things for me as below? Thanks.




1. How is Jesus "the son of God"?

2. How is "us" the son/s of God?

3. How is Jesus' sonship comparable with that of "us"?

4. What exactly do you mean by a "fiduciary relationship with God"?




Certain matters of divinity must ex necessitate be above reason. Having said that, there are logical and reasoned conceptions of divinity even within the Christian faith as you should know.

1. The frequent claims of the Christian with scriptural confirmation.

2.Working on an assumption that God created all that exists except himself, Jesus becomes a creation of his, just like we are.

3. Same creation.

4. In other words, father and son relationship.

For these matters beyond reason, does it include the trinity concept?

Kay 17:

1. The frequent claims of the Christian with scriptural confirmation.

Christians of course accept Jesus to be the Son of God. Your post implied you did too and it would be nice to see you explain your own understanding.

Kay 17: 2.Working on an assumption that God created all that exists except himself, Jesus becomes a creation of his, just like we are.

If you are still working with "claims of the Christian with scriptural confirmation" then you are wrong I'm afraid. Christians do not believe that Jesus is a "creation". You see now why it is important that you explain your own understanding?

Kay 17: 3. Same creation.

Well, this is a non-starter I'm afraid since Christians do not believe Jesus to be a "creation".

Kay 17: 4. In other words, father and son relationship.

A father and son relationship does not ipso facto create a "fiduciary relationship"! Are you aware that the concept of "fiduciary relationship" is a particular concept in the common law system/family of laws?

Kay 17: For these matters beyond reason, does it include the trinity concept?

The doctrine of "The Trinity" per se is not beyond human reason. Firstly, it is revealed in scripture; secondly, it has been articulated in logical forms over the years, indeed over centuries, by Christians.

However, the full nature of God's divinity or the interrelationships within The Trinity is indeed beyond human reason.

For the genuinely intelligent and honest reader, let us carefully note the context of this "Son of God" business.

"Son of God" is a phrase which, according to most Christian denominations Trinitarian in belief, refers to the relationship between Jesus and God, specifically as "God the Son". To a minority of Christians, nontrinitarians, the term "Son of God", applied to Jesus in the New Testament, is accepted, while the non-biblical but less ambiguous "God the Son" is not.

Throughout history, emperors have assumed titles that amount to being "a son of god", "a son of a god" or "son of Heaven".[1] Roman Emperor Augustus referred to his relation to the deified adoptive father, Julius Caesar as "son of a god" via the term divi filius which was later also used by Domitian and is distinct from the use of Son of God in the New Testament.[2]

In the New Testament, the title "Son of God" is applied to Jesus on many occasions.[3] It is often seen as referring to his divinity, from the beginning in the Annunciation up to the Crucifixion.[3] The declaration that Jesus is the Son of God is made by many individuals in the New Testament, and on two separate occasions by God the Father as a voice from Heaven, and is asserted by Jesus himself.

For thousands of years, emperors and rules ranging from the Western Zhou dynasty (c. 1000 B.C.) in China to Jimmu Tenno of Japan (perhaps c. 600 B.C.) to Alexander the Great (c. 360 BC) have assumed titles that reflect a filial relationship with deities.[1][7][8][9]

Around the time of Jesus, the title divi filius (son of the divine one) was specially, but not exclusively, associated with Emperor Augustus (as adopted son of Julius Caesar). Later, it was also used to refer to Domitian (as son of Vespasian).[2][10] Augustus used the title " Divi filius", not " Dei filius", and respected the distinction.[11]

In the Book of Exodus Israel as a people is called "God's son", using the singular form.[12] Both the terms sons of God and "son of God" appear in Jewish literature predating the New Testament. In Jewish literature, the leaders of the people, kings and princes were called "sons of God" based on the view of the king as the lieutenant of God.[3] However, the Messiah, the Anointed One, was uniquely called the Son of God, as in Psalm 2:7: The "Lord hath said to me: Thou art my son, this day have I begotten thee".[3] This psalm can obviously be seen as referring to a particular king of Judah, but has also been understood of the awaited Messiah.[13]


In the New Testament, the title "Son of God" is applied to Jesus on many occasions.[3] It is often used to refer to his divinity, from the beginning of the New Testament narrative when in Luke 1:32-35 the angel Gabriel announces: "the power of the Most High shall overshadow thee: wherefore also the holy thing which is begotten shall be called the Son of God."[3]

The declaration that Jesus is the Son of God is echoed by many sources in the New Testament. On two separate occasions the declarations are by God the Father, when during the Baptism of Jesus and then during the Transfiguration as a voice from Heaven. On several occasions the disciples call Jesus the Son of God and even the Jews scornfully remind Jesus during his crucifixion of his claim to be the Son of God."[3]

Of all the Christological titles used in the New Testament, Son of God has had one of the most lasting impacts in Christian history and has become part of the profession of faith by many Christians.[15] In the mainstream Trinitarian context the title implies the full divinity of Jesus as part of the Holy Trinity of Father, Son and the Spirit.[15]

However, the concept of God as the father of Jesus, and Jesus as the exclusive Son of God is distinct from the concept of God as the Creator and father of all people, as indicated in the Apostle's Creed.[16] The profession begins with expressing belief in the "Father almighty, creator of heaven and earth" and then immediately, but separately, in "Jesus Christ, his only Son, our Lord", thus expressing both senses of fatherhood within the Creed.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Son_of_God

And as far as the term "only begotten" son is concerned, the word is translated from the word "Monogenes" - the very same word the bible uses to refer to single children of human parents. Jesus was not a single child of his parents, and as such it was a reference to him being the only begotten son of God. That the very same word is used for single children of human parents conclusively tells that the NT refers to Jesus as being a firstborn of God, and as such, having a beginning.

NT USAGES -

Luke 7:12 "her only son (o monogenes uios)"
Luke 8:42 "only daughter (e monogenes thugater)"
Luke 9:38 "only son (o monogenes uios)"
John 1:18 textual variation in manuscripts: a. "only begotten" God (monogenes theos / b. "the only begotten Son" (o monogenes uios)
John 3:16 "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son (o monogenes uios)"
John 3:18 "he has not believed in the name of God’s only son (o monogenes uios)"
Heb.11:17 "only-legitimate son (o monogenes uios)" – since Abraham also fathered Ishmael, from the slave girl Hagar, and six other sons, from Keturah.
1 John 4:9 "God sent his only Son (o monogenes uios) into the world"


Please do not let cultists spread lamentable lies.

@Kay17

Going through your posts again, I realise you did not really answer this one.

2. How is "us" the son/s of God?

Enigma: Whatever!

You already have my advice: continue in your ignorance or deliberate dishonesty.


Next!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Next no ...
You have completely lost his temper, has distorted thread.
You have done that of ex-profeso, because it could not provide a single element for its outdated idea.
His fanaticism compels him to intervene, but lacks the knowledge and arguments. You just insulted, screamed and kicked like a sulkily child and uneducated.
I'm not going to continue arguing with you because you do not argue, nor think. It is impossible to speak with an slowpoke like you. I do not enter the forum to insult, so I prefer not to intervene more in this thread. You and I are not going to understand ... from up here I can not quite read what you write from down there.
Be happy and do not forget my advice .. drink plenty of fresh milk.
Do you yelling uselessly from down there.
The eagles do not hunt flies.

^^

You still have my excellent advice --- generously given to you twice already.

Ptolomeus:

His fanaticism compels him to intervene, but lacks the knowledge and arguments. You just insulted, screamed and kicked like a sulkily child and uneducated.
I'm not going to continue arguing with you because you do not argue, nor think. It is impossible to speak with an slowpoke like you. I do not enter the forum to insult, so I prefer not to intervene more in this thread.

Seems the wholse world has come to an accurate understanding of our good fella. The bolded words say it all very succintly.

Deep Sight:

Seems the wholse world has come to an accurate understanding of our good fella. The bolded words say it all very succintly.

Let good boy.
Can you be a little more clear?
You think an insult what you put in bold?
You followed the thread of the conversation?
Please be clear and as I do.
If you have something to tell me, do it!
I'm not a boy. I wish it were.
Por ejemplo, mirá, a mi me gustaría explicarte un poco, que parece que vos no entendiste un pomo que yo no manyo un carajo de este idioma de "damier" que hablan ustedes. Es un idioma imperialista, que yo comprendo que a ustedes les guste, pero que para mi es una verdadera mierda. No te gusta cómo escribo? Ay, que pena...hoy no voy a poder dormmir...
Pasale traductor, que es divertido!

Enigma:

Christians of course accept Jesus to be the Son of God. Your post implied you did too and it would be nice to see you explain your own understanding.

We can proceed.

enigma: If you are still working with "claims of the Christian with scriptural confirmation" then you are wrong I'm afraid. Christians do not believe that Jesus is a "creation". You see now why it is important that you explain your own understanding?

Since God CREATED everything, everything comes after. God's creation can be categorically seen as his Sons/Son.

enigma: A father and son relationship does not ipso facto create a "fiduciary relationship"! Are you aware that the concept of "fiduciary relationship" is a particular concept in the common law system/family of laws?

as long as there is a son, there is the presence of a father which complements the relationship. Thus two separate persons at both ends, with rights, trust and duties in slope towards the Son.

enigma: The doctrine of "The Trinity" per se is not beyond human reason. Firstly, it is revealed in scripture; secondly, it has been articulated in logical forms over the years, indeed over centuries, by Christians.

However, the full nature of God's divinity or the interrelationships within The Trinity is indeed beyond human reason.

At least there is reason to discuss.

Kay 17:

We can proceed.

I believe this was for you to explain your understanding of Jesus as "son of God"; perhaps you want to stick with the basic explanation you already gave. As for Christians, it is a given that He is the Son of God as I said earlier.

Kay 17:
Since God CREATED everything, everything comes after. God's creation can be categorically seen as his Sons/Son.

Christians believe that "everything" was made by or through Jesus. Jesus Himself is not created but is eternal with the Father and the Holy Spirit.

Kay 17: as long as there is a son, there is the presence of a father which complements the relationship. Thus two separate persons at both ends, with rights, trust and duties in slope towards the Son.

But this is not what is meant by "fiduciary relationship" as such - though this is not a big issue.

Kay 17: At least there is reason to discuss.

No problemo.


EDIT Meanwhile, we never did settle how "us" is/are son/s of God!

Enigma:

I believe this was for you to explain your understanding of Jesus as "son of God"; perhaps you want to stick with the basic explanation you already gave. As for Christians, it is a given that He is the Son of God as I said earlier.

Christians believe that "everything" was made by or through Jesus. Jesus Himself is not created but is eternal with the Father and the Holy Spirit.

But this is not what is meant by "fiduciary relationship" as such - though this is not a big issue.
No problemo.

EDIT Meanwhile, we never did settle how "us" is/are son/s of God!

Jesus not God is the creator of everything, while Jesus wasn't created by God, right?

Consequently, there three deities in Chirstianity. And we nor Jesus can't be Creations of God, since God didn't create anything.

Please try read this commentary with an opened mind

http://www.christnotes.org/commentary.php?b=43&c=1&com=mhc

Gill's Exposition of the Entire Bible
In the beginning was the word,.... That this is said not of the written word, but of the essential word of God, the Lord Jesus Christ, is clear, from all that is said from hence, to John 1:14 as that this word was in the beginning, was with God, and is God; from the creation of all things being ascribed to him, and his being said to be the life and light of men; from his coming into the world, and usage in it; from his bestowing the privilege of adoption on believers; and from his incarnation; and also there is a particular application of all this to Christ, John 1:15. And likewise from what this evangelist elsewhere says of him, when he calls him the word of life, and places him between the Father and the Holy Ghost; and speaks of the record of the word of God, and the testimony of Jesus, as the same thing; and represents him as a warrior and conqueror, 1 John 1:1. Moreover this appears to be spoken of Christ, from what other inspired writers have said of him, under the same character; as the Evangelist Luke, Luke 1:2, the Apostle Paul, Acts 20:32 and the Apostle Peter, 2 Peter 3:5. And who is called the word, not as man; for as man he was not in the beginning with God, but became so in the fulness of time; nor is the man God; besides, as such, he is a creature, and not the Creator, nor is he the life and light of men; moreover, he was the word, before he was man, and therefore not as such: nor can any part of the human nature be so called; not the flesh, for the word was made flesh; nor his human soul, for self-subsistence, deity, eternity, and the creation of all things, can never be ascribed to that; but he is the word as the Son of God, as is evident from what is here attributed to him, and from the word being said to be so, as in John 1:14 and from those places, where the word is explained by the Son, compare 1 John 5:5. And is so called from his nature, being begotten of the Father; for as the word, whether silent or expressed, is the birth of the mind, the image of it, equal to it, and distinct from it; so Christ is the only begotten of the Father, the express image of his person, in all things equal to him, and a distinct person from him: and he may be so called, from some action, or actions, said of him, or ascribed to him; as that he spoke for, and on the behalf of the elect of God, in the eternal council and covenant of grace and peace; and spoke all things out of nothing, in creation; for with regard to those words so often mentioned in the history of the creation, and God said, may Jehovah the Son be called the word; also he was spoken of as the promised Messiah, throughout the whole Old Testament dispensation; and is the interpreter of his Father's mind, as he was in Eden's garden, as well as in the days of his flesh; and now speaks in heaven for the saints. The phrase, , "the word of the Lord", so frequently used by the Targumists, is well known: and it is to be observed, that the same things which John here says of the word, they say likewise, as will be observed on the several clauses; from whence it is more likely, that John should take this phrase, since the paraphrases of Onkelos and Jonathan ben Uzziel were written before his time, than that he should borrow it from the writings of Plato, or his followers, as some have thought; with whose philosophy, Ebion and Cerinthus are said to be acquainted; wherefore John, the more easily to gain upon them, uses this phrase, when that of the Son of God would have been disagreeable to them: that there is some likeness between the Evangelist John and Plato in their sentiments concerning the word, will not be denied. Amelius (f), a Platonic philosopher, who lived after the times of John, manifestly refers to these words of his, in agreement with his master's doctrine: his words are these,
"and this was truly "Logos", or the word, by whom always existing, the things that are made, were made, as also Heraclitus thought; and who, likewise that Barbarian (meaning the Evangelist John) reckons was in the order and dignity of the beginning, constituted with God, and was God, by whom all things are entirely made; in whom, whatsoever is made, lives, and has life, and being; and who entered into bodies, and was clothed with flesh, and appeared a man; so notwithstanding, that he showed forth the majesty of his nature; and after his dissolution, he was again deified, and was God, as he was before he descended into a body, flesh and man.

Jesus was not Jesus as a MAN before he came to the World, but was the Word of God that was God that is God and with God before creation, spoken and became flesh in the World as Jesus Christ to fulfill the works of salvation. So the word that became flesh makes reference to Himself as the "Son of God" i.e that which came from God(as a product- used as a Greek word) in the form of the word thru the spirit of Godin some terms in the Bible and equally addressed Himself when referring to the Supremacy of his Original attributes in heaven.

That is why Islam will never understand the meaning of the "SON OF GOD".

That is why Islam will never understand the meaning of the "SON OF GOD". Jesus Christ is the PRODUCT of God's Word( Used as the Son or taken from or born of)spoken to fulfill a mission and became flesh to carry out the mandate. The holy Spirit is the word of God or referred to as the Wisdom of God "Ephesians 1:17-19", John 16, Rom 16:27.
Mat 12: 42, Luke 11:31 said another greater than Solomon is here in wisdom, Why? Because He was borne form the wisdom of GOD.

Kay 17:

Jesus not God is the creator of everything, while Jesus wasn't created by God, right?

Consequently, there three deities in Chirstianity. And we nor Jesus can't be Creations of God, since God didn't create anything.

No, my good friend, there is only one deity in Christianity. The Bible is emphatic that God is One.

Nevertheless, though God is One, He has revealed Himself in three persons i.e. The Father, The Son and The Holy Spirit.

Accordingly, Christians do not have a difficulty accepting the following passages, inter alia, from the Bible.


1. Genesis 1:1

In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.

2a. John 1:1-4

1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 He was with God in the beginning.

3 Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made. 4 In him was life, and that life was the light of men.

2b. John 1:14,15

14 The Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us. We have seen his glory, the glory of the One and Only, who came from the Father, full of grace and truth.

15 John testifies concerning him. He cries out, saying, “This was he of whom I said, ‘He who comes after me has surpassed me because he was before me.’”

3. Hebrews 1:1,2

1 In the past God spoke to our forefathers through the prophets at many times and in various ways, 2 but in these last days he {God} has spoken to us by his Son, whom he appointed heir of all things, and through whom he made the universe.

4. Hebrews 1:3

3 The Son is the radiance of God’s glory and the exact representation of his {God's} being, sustaining all things by his powerful word.

OK, the passages I've quoted reveal the following.

1. God created the heavens and earth in the beginning.
2. Jesus was in the beginning.
3. Jesus was with God in the beginning.
4. Jesus was God
5. Through Jesus all things were made and without Him nothing was made {(edit) and God appointed Him heir of all things and God made the universe through Him}.
6. Jesus became flesh and dwelt among us
7. Jesus is the radiance of God's glory and the exact representation of God's being!

Now, I can understand if you say you do not believe all these or if you say you do not believe in the Bible. However, can you honestly deny that the Bible teaches what I have just summarised?

John 1: 1 says it all.Jesus Christ is the Lord and that is name of the father,son and holy spirit.
I buttress this statement with the baptism the apostles of the old did in the name of Jesus Christ and not in the figurative expression in the name of the father,son,and holy spirit.
I believe the apostles should be our role models in Christianity and we must not deviate from what their good deeds.
I was appalled to read from one of these posts about the ridiculing of apostle Paul.Apostle Paul was a man who was fearless in his faith and a man of immense virtues who charted the gospel par excellence.I must admit that I hold him in such a high esteem amongst all the apostles.
If anyone can open a contrary scripture where the apostles did baptize in the name of the father,son,and holy spirit;I would be very willing to learn from that fellow.
In summary,the bible is quite a difficult book to comprehend with our human senses, we need to seek spiritual guidance on it and in tandem equally be willing to open up ourselves to learning rather than unnecessary and spiritually unhealthy arguments.
Jesus Christ is Lord!

^^^ I see where you are coming from. However, according to Matthew . . .

Matthew 28

18 Then Jesus came to them and said, “All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. 19 Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 20 and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age.”

Let us add also

2 Corinthians 13:14

May the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the fellowship of the Holy Spirit be with you all.

Well, the apostle Paul must have known something, no?

@Enigma well said

brainpulse: @Enigma well said

Cheers, brainpulse.

Deep Sight: Christian scripture discloses Jesus as a man only. Not God. Not half God-Half Man. A man.

The words of Jesus:

John 8:40: “You are determined to kill me, a man who has told you the truth that I heard from God.”

John 17:3: "Now this is eternal life: that they may know you, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom you have sent."

Mark 13:32:"No one knows about that day or hour, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father."

John 5:19: "Jesus gave them this answer: "I tell you the truth, the Son can do nothing by himself; he can do only what he sees his Father doing, because whatever the Father does the Son also does”

John 14:28: "You heard me say,'I am going away and I am coming back to you.' If you loved me, you would be glad that I am going to the Father, for the Father is greater than I."

John 20:17: "Jesus said, " Do not hold on to me, for I have not yet ascended to the Father. Go instead to my brothers and tell them,'I am ascending to my Father and your Father, to my God and your God.”

Mark 10:18: “Do not call me good, only God is good.”

The words of the Apostles:

1Timothy 2:5: "For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus.

1 Peter 1:3: “Praise be to the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ.”

Acts 2:22 - “Men of Israel, listen to this: Jesus of Nazareth was a man accredited by God to you by miracles, wonders and signs, which God did among you through him, as you yourselves know.”

The reason I designed www.my-refuge.com was because I needed to assist Christians with a reference resource for Bible scriptures with regards to life situations. For example, in your responce to my post, you chose to quote John 4 which says Jesus was a Man, Who is "Man" http://www.my-refuge.com/?pid=1&sid=107:Man
I have explained who a man is according to the Word of God.

Jesus was "Sent and there was a prophecy of that in the Old testament. He IS the Word of God an he was made a man in order for him to function in the World.

For example, His death was so significant that even the Calendar changed. Today is 2012 years and 5 months after his death.

There is so much that I could say but you know what, it is not my wish to argue, I believe we are all free to believe what we want to believe. My post was meant for those who are interested in growing in the Word of God.

What is the difference btw God and the father?