The European Union (EU) is now moving ever closer to full integration. European states now form a massive economic community using a single currency called Euro. When powerful countries integrate with each other like this, small countries are overwhelmed. When there is a clash concerning national interest, war is inevitable. That’s how nations rise against nations. The Lord taught us that when nations stand against nations, when war breaks out, and when natural disasters such as famines and earthquakes occur, then that is the beginning of sorrows.

When this happens, we all must remember clearly in our hearts that these events will happen in the end times. The Lord said that these events will unfold in the end times. There is nothing strange here in today’s Scripture passage. Everything will come to pass exactly as the Lord said. Simply put, there will be no peace in the end times. The Lord taught us that the world will turn into an unlivable place, filled with chaos, confusion, disorder, and madness.

The European Union (EU) is now moving ever closer to full integration. European states now form a massive economic community using a single currency called Euro. When powerful countries integrate with each other like this, small countries are overwhelmed. When there is a clash concerning national interest, war is inevitable. That’s how nations rise against nations. The Lord taught us that when nations stand against nations, when war breaks out, and when natural disasters such as famines and earthquakes occur, then that is the beginning of sorrows.

When this happens, we all must remember clearly in our hearts that these events will happen in the end times. The Lord said that these events will unfold in the end times. There is nothing strange here in today’s Scripture passage. Everything will come to pass exactly as the Lord said. Simply put, there will be no peace in the end times. The Lord taught us that the world will turn into an unlivable place, filled with chaos, confusion, disorder, and madness.

HUMANS ARE A BROOD OF EVILDOERS!

A human body commits sin from birth until the moment of its death. Not only does a human body like to commit sin, but it also likes to follow only its carnal desires. Isaiah 1:4 records that humans are “a brood of evildoers,” and Isaiah 59 records that there are all kinds of filthy and disgraceful things inside a human heart. Hence, a human is a mass of sin. Then, if we could deduce conclusively from God’s Word that “A human is a mass of sin,” then, we must receive this Word of God in our heart. And we must acknowledge before the presence of God that we are such sinners and then wait for the teaching of Jesus.

Humans are lewd. When a person looks at himself clearly, he can conclude that he is lewd and that lewdness is the person himself. A person who is honest with himself would accept that a human possesses the twelve kinds of sins God speaks of. Even so, there doesn’t seem to be many persons who acknowledge that he himself is lewd, that he is a mass of sin. Many people live a life like beasts in this world because they do not think they are lewd. Humans make the culture of lewdness themselves because humans are “a brood of evildoers.” One would be embarrassed if he was the only lewd person in the world doing lewd behaviors, but they have made such a lewd culture so that they are not embarrassed because everyone else is also lewd.

However, everyone’s heart feels embarrassed in one’s conscience about his behaviors of sin. It’s because God has given conscience to humans. The human conscience is the servant of God that He has sent as His deputy. Adam and Eve hid themselves between many trees after committing sin. Many trees imply a human society that is covered with lewd culture. However, they could not hide the evil in their heart. Even now, many who are a mass of sin go in the midst of many people and hide themselves behind the culture of evil sins and go on living like a prisoner waiting for execution.

However, when one seeks to be saved from his lifetime sins and be exempted from its due punishment, then Jesus is always there waiting to receive him through His gospel of water and Spirit.

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[quote author=Kobojunkie post=128990240] God's mercy DOES NOT cause humans to avoid punishment/judgment.

Yes it does. The punishment here isn't talking about physical punishment as you have narrated. Instead it's talking about the eternal punishment of hell, naturally meant for all mankind born as sinners. The wages/ punishment of sin is death, death here refers to the punishment of hell.

It is only by knowing and believing in His mercy revealed through His salvation works that humans can avoid punishment. Otherwise everyone is destined for hell naturally.

THE HEART OF EVERYONE IS NATURALLY EVIL!

When we really understand humans, we realize humans are all a mass of sin. Humans are the seeds of lewd sin that cannot but commit sin throughout the entire life. Therefore, humans commit sin filled with lewdness, pride, evil thoughts, hatred, murder, theft, and all kinds of evil sins.

Would you believe if I told you humans are beings who do such things? Do you believe that humans are beings that swindle and steal much? Would you believe if I told you that humans are beings that commit adultery? Would you believe if I told you that you were such people? All such people are humans. Do you believe in the Word of the original innate sin according to the Scriptures that says all humans are born with evil sins and commit a tremendous amount of evil sins?

Human flesh only commits sin throughout the entire life. It’s not an exaggeration to say that the body of a human is a factory producing sin. The human body lives on sin that God hates as a daily meal. The flesh of a human likes to commit sin; it enjoys committing adultery, the sin of lewdness, and going against God. And that is why it needs God's mercy to avoid its due punishment.

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NATION WILL RISE AGAINST NATION, AND KINGDOM AGAINST KINGDOM

What else did the Lord say would happen in the time of the Great Tribulation? He said, “Nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. And there will be famines, pestilences, and earthquakes in various places.”

Recently Russia has seen a surge of extreme nationalism. It is calling for the expulsion of all nonRussians and demanding that foreigners, including the Jews, give up all their commercial and economic interests in Russia and return home. In the years to come, Jewish people all over the world will have to return to Israel. At the present time, Jews scattered throughout the world have a dominant commercial presence. But nations are now rising against nations. Nationalism is surging ahead, just as God said it would in the end times. Because of this, when we look at these events, we realize that everything is coming to pass exactly as the Lord had said.

With the end of World War II, many independent, nationalist states were formed. More recently, when the Soviet Union collapsed in the 1990s, a number of independent states were formed. The Soviet Union had been a federal state formed by sixteen republics, tightly controlled by the central government in Moscow. With its disintegration under President Gorbachev, each republic became an independent nation-state. These republics have now formed independent states. But there still are many ethnic groups engaged in civil war, and struggling for independence. Just like this, every nation is actively seeking to form its own social community.

The problem is that a struggle for independence often leads to ethnic conflicts. The prevalence of racial supremacy is often followed by ethnic cleansing to suppress and rout out other ethnic groups. Just as the Lord taught us that nations would rise against nations and invade each other, some of these events have already occurred throughout the world. Many countries all over the world saw a surge of nationalist movements with people gaining their independence. In the years to come, we will continue to see nations rising against nations. Weak countries like Korea will be swallowed up by the great powers, while the great powers will struggle against each other for supremacy. Since God said that this would happen, it will happen exactly as He said.

NATION WILL RISE AGAINST NATION, AND KINGDOM AGAINST KINGDOM

What else did the Lord say would happen in the time of the Great Tribulation? He said, “Nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. And there will be famines, pestilences, and earthquakes in various places.”

Recently Russia has seen a surge of extreme nationalism. It is calling for the expulsion of all nonRussians and demanding that foreigners, including the Jews, give up all their commercial and economic interests in Russia and return home. In the years to come, Jewish people all over the world will have to return to Israel. At the present time, Jews scattered throughout the world have a dominant commercial presence. But nations are now rising against nations. Nationalism is surging ahead, just as God said it would in the end times. Because of this, when we look at these events, we realize that everything is coming to pass exactly as the Lord had said.

With the end of World War II, many independent, nationalist states were formed. More recently, when the Soviet Union collapsed in the 1990s, a number of independent states were formed. The Soviet Union had been a federal state formed by sixteen republics, tightly controlled by the central government in Moscow. With its disintegration under President Gorbachev, each republic became an independent nation-state. These republics have now formed independent states. But there still are many ethnic groups engaged in civil war, and struggling for independence. Just like this, every nation is actively seeking to form its own social community.

The problem is that a struggle for independence often leads to ethnic conflicts. The prevalence of racial supremacy is often followed by ethnic cleansing to suppress and rout out other ethnic groups. Just as the Lord taught us that nations would rise against nations and invade each other, some of these events have already occurred throughout the world. Many countries all over the world saw a surge of nationalist movements with people gaining their independence. In the years to come, we will continue to see nations rising against nations. Weak countries like Korea will be swallowed up by the great powers, while the great powers will struggle against each other for supremacy. Since God said that this would happen, it will happen exactly as He said.

The free Christian books of The New Life Mission provide a clear explanation of the standard of salvation by grounding it in thorough and solid Biblical foundations, and they address the basic concepts of salvation as to how one can be born again of water and the Spirit. For more details, we encourage our visitors to read the free Christian books that we provide in printed or electronic format. Visit
www.bjnewlife.org

For those in Nigeria, pls call 08135683431 to have the books delivered to your nearest location, absolutely FREE OF CHARGE. YOU ARE NOT TO PAY A DIME TO ANYONE. Order for yours now, at no cost at all.

The free Christian books of The New Life Mission provide a clear explanation of the standard of salvation by grounding it in thorough and solid Biblical foundations, and they address the basic concepts of salvation as to how one can be born again of water and the Spirit. For more details, we encourage our visitors to read the free Christian books that we provide in printed or electronic format. Visit www.bjnewlife.org to order or download it

For those in Nigeria, pls call 08135683431to have the books delivered to your nearest location, absolutely FREE OF CHARGE. YOU ARE NOT TO PAY A DIME TO ANYONE. Order for yours now, at no cost at all.

Let’s look at the Revelation 6:5-6. It says, “When He opened the third seal, I heard the third living creature say, ‘Come and see.’ So I looked, and behold, a black horse, and he who sat on it had a pair of scales in his hand. And I heard a voice in the midst of the four living creatures saying, “A quart of wheat for a denarius, and three quarts of barley for a denarius; and do not harm the oil and the wine.””

It says that when the third seal is opened, the period of the black horse will arrive, and it will be the period of famine. What the period of famine means, as we have read in today’s Scripture passage, there will be famine and earthquake in various places and nations will rise against nations. After this will be the period of the pale horse, when the anti-Christ will appear and the killing of the Israelites will occur. Then we who have received the remission of the sin among the Gentiles will be martyred.

2 Thessalonians 2:4 also talks about this is this manner, “Who opposes and exalts Himself above all that is called God or that is worshiped, so that he sits as God in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God.” It means that, in the end times, a leader, under the guise of serving the Lord, will go against God and proclaim that he is the Messiah. The Apostle Paul continues to say, “The coming of the lawless one is according to the working of Satan, with all power, signs, and lying wonders, and with all unrighteous deception among those who perish, because they did not receive the love of the truth, that they might be saved” (2 Thessalonians 2:9-10).

Let’s look at the Revelation 6:5-6. It says, “When He opened the third seal, I heard the third living creature say, ‘Come and see.’ So I looked, and behold, a black horse, and he who sat on it had a pair of scales in his hand. And I heard a voice in the midst of the four living creatures saying, “A quart of wheat for a denarius, and three quarts of barley for a denarius; and do not harm the oil and the wine.””

It says that when the third seal is opened, the period of the black horse will arrive, and it will be the period of famine. What the period of famine means, as we have read in today’s Scripture passage, there will be famine and earthquake in various places and nations will rise against nations. After this will be the period of the pale horse, when the anti-Christ will appear and the killing of the Israelites will occur. Then we who have received the remission of the sin among the Gentiles will be martyred.

2 Thessalonians 2:4 also talks about this is this manner, “Who opposes and exalts Himself above all that is called God or that is worshiped, so that he sits as God in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God.” It means that, in the end times, a leader, under the guise of serving the Lord, will go against God and proclaim that he is the Messiah. The Apostle Paul continues to say, “The coming of the lawless one is according to the working of Satan, with all power, signs, and lying wonders, and with all unrighteous deception among those who perish, because they did not receive the love of the truth, that they might be saved” (2 Thessalonians 2:9-10).

When we look at Matthew chapter 24, Jesus pointed to the Temple in Jerusalem and said, “Assuredly, not one stone that form the Jerusalem Temple shall be left here upon another, that shall not be thrown down.” The disciples heard this and asked two questions: “When will these things be?” and “What will be the sign of Your coming, and of the end of the age?”

The Lord always prophesies the things He will do in the future by using the real things of this world as an illustration. He says that not one stone that forms the Temple of Jerusalem shall be left here upon another. Through this, the Lord is telling us how the world will be destroyed He said those words with such implication, and the disciples asked the Lord with consecutive questions “When will these things be? And what will be the sign of Your coming, and of the end of the age?”

The Lord uses reality manlike this to illustrate the work He will do in the future. The Lord speaks of the beginning of the disasters, saying, “Take heed that no one deceives you. For many will come in My name, saying, ‘I am the Christ,’ and will deceive many. And you will hear of wars and rumors of wars. See that you are not troubled; for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet. For nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. And there will be famines and earthquakes in various places. All these are the beginning of sorrows” (Matthew 24:4-.

The beginning of sorrows that the Lord talks about means the disasters that announce the beginning of the Seven-year Tribulation. He is saying that before the Great Seven-year Tribulation, there will be nations rising against nations, famines, and earthquakes in various places. The Great Seven-year Tribulation will begin after many people appear and say they are Christ.

When we look at Matthew chapter 24, Jesus pointed to the Temple in Jerusalem and said, “Assuredly, not one stone that form the Jerusalem Temple shall be left here upon another, that shall not be thrown down.” The disciples heard this and asked two questions: “When will these things be?” and “What will be the sign of Your coming, and of the end of the age?”

The Lord always prophesies the things He will do in the future by using the real things of this world as an illustration. He says that not one stone that forms the Temple of Jerusalem shall be left here upon another. Through this, the Lord is telling us how the world will be destroyed He said those words with such implication, and the disciples asked the Lord with consecutive questions “When will these things be? And what will be the sign of Your coming, and of the end of the age?”

The Lord uses reality manlike this to illustrate the work He will do in the future. The Lord speaks of the beginning of the disasters, saying, “Take heed that no one deceives you. For many will come in My name, saying, ‘I am the Christ,’ and will deceive many. And you will hear of wars and rumors of wars. See that you are not troubled; for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet. For nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. And there will be famines and earthquakes in various places. All these are the beginning of sorrows” (Matthew 24:4-.

The beginning of sorrows that the Lord talks about means the disasters that announce the beginning of the Seven-year Tribulation. He is saying that before the Great Seven-year Tribulation, there will be nations rising against nations, famines, and earthquakes in various places. The Great Seven-year Tribulation will begin after many people appear and say they are Christ.

Revelation 1:7
"Behold, He is coming with clouds, and every eye will see Him, even they who pierced Him. And all the tribes of the earth will mourn because of Him. Even so, Amen."

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An apple tree is bound to bear apples even if it doesn’t want to, and a pear tree can only yield pears when it grows no matter how desperately it might want to bear some other fruits. Human beings, too, cannot help but continue to sin, no matter how much they don’t want to and how hard they try not to sin, precisely because they were all born with sin. Everyone commits sin constantly with their thoughts, acts, and hearts. If circumstances would allow, people put into action the sins they committed only with their thought, and they even commit each and every one of the twelve kinds of sin all at once.


The secular law punishes only the sins committed in deed. However, the Law of God says that even the transgressions committed with the heart are sins, and they are to be punished also. Therefore, what people may not grasp as a sin, God still sees it all clearly. As such, the iniquities that we commit in our hearts are also counted as sins in God’s sight. This is the Godspoken Law. Just as His Word is true—that sin entered through one man, and death through this sin—the claim that human beings, who are all seeds of evildoers, can live in holiness without committing any sin is a lie. It is nothing more than a whitewashed tomb; a deception that tries to hide the fact that all human beings are sinful seeds through one man Adam.

Of course, I am not suggesting here that we should try to sin deliberately. Rather, what I mean is that it’s not because people are deliberately determined to sin that they commit sin, but they cannot help but sin because they were all born as seeds of sin. Whether people sin or not has nothing to do with their level of education or character. Everyone is a sinner who repeatedly commits sin in various forms under various circumstances.


How, then, can human beings, who can only be sinners, ever become God’s sinless children? Paul answers that just as sin entered this world through one man, it is also through one Man that everyone can receive the gift of salvation and be remitted from all his sins by believing in the righteousness of God.


https://www.bjnewlife.org/sub.php?newlife=mission03&bidx=5&list=mission01&language1=English&displaying=&page_lang=english

Kobojunkie:
Again .. Being born-again does not make one righteous as only those who remain faithful to the end are saved aka guaranteed righteous - Matthew 24 vs 12 - 13 and Mark 13 vs 13

Those who aren't born-again and aren't under God’s Old Covenant cannot be regarded as sinners as they are instead unbelievers.

Psalms 1:5
[5]Therefore the ungodly shall not stand in the judgment, Nor sinners in the congregation of the righteous.

Romans 5:19
"For as by one man’s disobedience many were made sinners, so also by one Man’s obedience many will be made righteous."

Human beings can be biblically divided into 2: sinners or the righteous.

I keep asking you who don't even know your spiritual status;
Are you a sinner or a righteous?

Kobojunkie:
If you look closely you will see this too.

One of the greatest lies told by pastors and mogs for example, is that all persons who do not believe in Jesus Christ will end up on Hell. That directly contradicts the very teachings of Jesus Christ who instead taught His followers that only those who are born-again have access to the Kingdom of God either by way of the Broad Gate which leads to destruction(Hell) or the Narrow Gate which leads to true life(Heaven) - John 3 vs 5 - 8 and Matthew 7 vs 13 - 14. How can an unbeliever who has no access to the Kingdom of God end up in Hell? Do you judge a man who is a citizen of Nigeria by Laws that rule over those who are instead citizens of another country?

Where darkness encompasses, lies poses as truth. You are lying through your teeth, claiming to know.

If you correctly believe in Jesus and are truly bornagain, you go to Heaven. But if you incorrectly believe ( ie unsaved Christian/ not bornagain) or you don't believe at all, you end in hell.
John 3:18
“He who believes in Him is not condemned; but he who does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God."

The Bible is very clear on the fact that people who do not believe are condemned; this condemnation is the condemnation/ judgement of hell fire. Your knowledge of the Bible is quite limited yet you speak confidently though what you say are apparent lies.

Lighthouse50:
Both estheragha and kobojunkie are saying the same thing but from different angle. Its like two people viewing a house at different angles. The one viewing from the front will claim to see garden and gate while the one viewing from the side will argue there is no gate or garden but only hanger with clothes on it and pegs holding the clothes to the rope. They both viewed the house and are both corqect. We as christian need to keep studying GOD'S WORDS To be able to go round the house and have the knowlege of every angle of it

If you read well,you ll see we are definitely not saying the same things.

Kobojunkie:
Being born-again does not make one righteous as only those who remain faithful to the end are saved aka guaranteed righteous - Matthew 24 vs 12 - 13 and Mark 13 vs 13

Those who aren't born-again and aren't under God’s Old Covenant cannot be regarded as sinners as they are instead unbelievers.

What are you?

A sinner or a righteous?

Kobojunkie:
1. I am afraid you are wrong!

God said only those human beings who become born-again can get a chance at either His Heaven or His Hell to begin with. So your assertion is wrong as far as God's agreement/contract/Covenant and Law, Jesus Christ.

2. The statement in bold is against God. You think God's Love and mercy exists in isolation of His Justice and you are wrong because everything God does, including Hell, is love In action.

*When God drowned the earth, leaving just Noah and His family, that was love in action.
*When God buried over 14000 Israelites in sand for disobeying Him that was love in action.
* When God destroyed Jerusalem and the people of Israel each time they disobeyed Him, that was also God's Love and mercy in action.
* When God ordered famine and drought on the land of Israel, that was also God's Love in action.
....

So don't delude yourself thinking you can separate God into ideas of your own making. Instead accept and understand Him as He presents Himself to you.

3. This statement is meaningless

You talk a lot of nonsense without understanding.

You tagged God as a legalistic God who has to justly follow His own law.
The law of God states that the wages of sin is death. If He applies that then all will go to hell because all sins both the bornagain and the unsaved. But in His love He has taken away the sins of humanity with the gospel of water and Spirit and those who know and believe in this true gospel have become the recipient of His love which has surpassed His judgment considering that they were supposed to die for their sins.

His love is greater than His judgment. If He were to follow His judgment explicitly, no one will go to heaven. All must pay the wages of their sins.

All you do is open your mouth and say things without meaning contradicting yourself and lacking understanding, just for speaking sake.

Kobojunkie:
You mean hypocrites, right?

God Himself is God of Laws. He is a Faithful God meaning He sticks to the terms and conditions of the Law He makes with men and so in a sense God Himself is legalistic.

God, in making Laws with men in form of Covenants, calls on men to also be faithful to the agreement He makes with them .i.e. God expects us to abide by the terms and conditions of the Covenant, Law, which He gives to us. So, God is Legalistic and He calls on us to submit to and obey the commandments/laws He gives us meaning He calls us to the having of a legalistic relationship with Him.

If God is a Legalistic God, then all mankind would burn in hell for His Law states that the wages/ payment of sin is death. In other words, we must die for any and all sin we commit. That is the justice of God, to justly punish sinners with death for their sins.

However, the love and mercy of God is greater than His justice. That's why He sent Jesus to take away the sins of mankind with His water, blood and Spirit and make them sinless/ righteous, fit to enter His kingdom.

Indeed His love has prevailed over His justice!

*Among the religious leaders of Christianity at the present, there are those who claim that Jesus took away our original sin but not our personal sins. The Bible does not speak of the original and personal sins, and no mention of such things is found in it.*

Before Jesus, all sins, great and small, from those we were born with to those that belong to us and those that we commit with our own acts—indeed, every possible sin—are the same, all manifested as the sins of the world. Water is water, whether it is sewage water or tap water. No one knows for sure when people started to distinguish their original sin from their personal sins.

*Because many Christian leaders themselves have not been born again, they do not know how to solve all the problems of sin, and because they do not know, they have turned Christianity into a mere religion, claiming that God would forgive our sins if we ‘repent’ our sins. The word ‘repent’ is far different from the word ‘confess’ (1 John 1:9).*

What is repentance? It only means to turn around; it does not mean praying for God to forgive us of our sins. God has said that He wants us to give Him offerings that ask for His mercy and grace. Having compassion for the souls heading to hell because of sin, God wants to save us—this is what His heart is all about. What His heart desires is to make the sinful beings sinless and holy through Jesus Christ and thereby enable them to take part in His Kingdom, and He has indeed fulfilled this completely.
Bk 11 pg 104


*“He [Christ] might sanctify and cleanse her [the Church] with the washing of water by the word” (Ephesians 5:26). Hebrews 9:14 says, “How much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered Himself without spot to God, cleanse your conscience from dead works to serve the living God?” Hebrews 10:22 also says, “Let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience and our bodies washed with pure water.”*

*We can find in these passages that the Bible emphasizes the water of Jesus’ baptism as well as His death on the Cross. Christ has saved us from all our sins by receiving the baptism and dying on the Cross. Jesus took all the sins of our conscience. In other words, Jesus took all the sins we commit through our actions, the sins we commit in our thoughts, the sins we commit intentionally, the sins we commit unconsciously, and the sins we commit because we are weak, and so on. Sin is recorded in the tablet of conscience when people commit sin. And they feel the pain in their conscience.*

*The conscience is the detector of the sins. Jesus took all our sins that torment our conscience when He received the baptism and He removed all our sins by dying on the Cross. That’s why God has cleansed our conscience from dead works to make us serve the living God.*

An apple tree is bound to bear apples even if it doesn’t want to, and a pear tree can only yield pears when it grows no matter how desperately it might want to bear some other fruits. Human beings, too, cannot help but continue to sin, no matter how much they don’t want to and how hard they try not to sin, precisely because they were all born with sin. Everyone commits sin constantly with their thoughts, acts, and hearts. If circumstances would allow, people put into action the sins they committed only with their thought, and they even commit each and every one of the twelve kinds of sin all at once.


The secular law punishes only the sins committed in deed. However, the Law of God says that even the transgressions committed with the heart are sins, and they are to be punished also. Therefore, what people may not grasp as a sin, God still sees it all clearly. As such, the iniquities that we commit in our hearts are also counted as sins in God’s sight. This is the Godspoken Law. Just as His Word is true—that sin entered through one man, and death through this sin—the claim that human beings, who are all seeds of evildoers, can live in holiness without committing any sin is a lie. It is nothing more than a whitewashed tomb; a deception that tries to hide the fact that all human beings are sinful seeds through one man Adam.

Of course, I am not suggesting here that we should try to sin deliberately. Rather, what I mean is that it’s not because people are deliberately determined to sin that they commit sin, but they cannot help but sin because they were all born as seeds of sin. Whether people sin or not has nothing to do with their level of education or character. Everyone is a sinner who repeatedly commits sin in various forms under various circumstances.


How, then, can human beings, who can only be sinners, ever become God’s sinless children? Paul answers that just as sin entered this world through one man, it is also through one Man that everyone can receive the gift of salvation and be remitted from all his sins by believing in the righteousness of God.


https://www.bjnewlife.org/sub.php?newlife=mission03&bidx=5&list=mission01&language1=English&displaying=&page_lang=english

Kobojunkie:
1. Those who are guilty of sin are those who are already judged and condemned by God Judgement. God judged and condemned all unbelievers guilty of sin from the beginning since Adam. That judgement is what is known as the condemnation of sin aka Death. Once a person has been condemned by a law there is no longer any hope for that person under that same law .I.e. the person is pretty much dead to the law.

A sinner, on other hand, is one who has yet to be judged guilty and as such is not condemned. He or she still has hope under the very same law .i.e. a sinner is one who is still under law.

The question was are you a sinner or a righteous? Have you been born of water and Spirit according to John 3:5 as a what?

Kobojunkie:
1. So where in scripture did God say that by not believing in Him man sins against Him??

2. Yet God's punishment in Genesis 3 vs 16 - 22 was directly connected to their disobedience of His commandment to them in Genesis 2 vs 15 - 17 ? Do you notice how unscriptural your claims continue to be?

3. But unbelievers are removed from "the presence of God", this by God Himself since after Adam and Eve fell.

And if you read closely the entire content of Psalm 1 vs 1 - 6, you will find that unbelievers are addressed as the wicked - Psalm 1 vs 4 - since they have no place before God - they are like chaff that the wind blows away .

4. Stop spinning tales and begin to open your eyes to what is in fact stated by God.

Unbelief is a sin.

Jesus said in John 16:8-9
[8]And when He has come, He will convict the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment:
[9]of sin, because they do not believe in Me;


Are you a sinner or a righteous?

Kobojunkie:
1. Again, sin is disobedience of God's Law and commandments and disobedience is a choice made against.

Abel, & Abraham etc., were not born sinners but instead unbelievers. They then made choice to obey God rather than sin against Him leading them to righteousness eventually..

2. I, a Gentile, was born an unbeliever from my birth. I then made the choice to believe God entering under His Law by which I continue to chose to and live in continuous submission to and obedience of His commandments.

To be an unbeliever also is to be a sinner.
Sin is not just transgression/ disobedience of the law but unbelief in the word of God. It is a sin not to believe. All human beings are born as unbelievers in God / sinners, until they believe in the word of God. No one was born righteous nor a believer.
Romans 3:10
[10]As it is written: “There is none righteous, no, not one;


Before Adam and Eve disobeyed God, they had already committed the sin of unbelief by refusing to believe in the word of God that told them not to eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. Unbelief, ie, not believing in the word God told them is the IST SIN they committed inside their hearts even before they disobeyed with their body. That's is why sin is inside the human heart. If they had believed wholly in the word God told them inside their heart, they would not have disobeyed His Word.

In the presence of God, there can either be sinners or righteous . This is shown in Psalms 1:5 that says
Therefore the ungodly shall not stand in the judgment, Nor sinners in the congregation of the righteous.

So I still ask you even as you say you are a believer, are you a sinner or a righteous person since you already know that Abraham, Abel etc were transformed into righteous though they were previously sinners?

Kobojunkie:
1. Now of what I have stated so far is personal since all I have done is tell you what is instead written in scripture.

2. Again, the statement in bold is inaccurate aka a lie. What mankind instead inherited from Adam is God's judgement aka curse and that curse remains the reason why both the unbelievers and believers( even the righteous) alike suffer.

3. Do you know the proper use of the word "nature"? It is used to describe that aspect of a thing that cannot be easily gotten rid of no matter what one tries.

According to you, man has has sin nature. Yet, you believe there are also men who were able to rid themselves of this nature simply by obeying God. That alone already indicates either a lack of understanding as far as your use of the term "nature" to qualify sin in men, or that you are simply propagating an idea you don't even have a real understanding of.

God cursed mankind and that curse is what remains on all mankind - unbelievers and believers alike(even the righteous among them). The curse can be regarded of nature because nothing man does can rid Him of the curse. Only God can lift it and His redemption plan instead has man making different choices even as He continues to exist in this world that is cursed.

4a. The Old Covenant aka the Constitution of the Nation of Israel given by God to the Children of Israel. also offered remission of sins.

4b.Transformation that you speak of happens only to those who stand faithful - living in continous submission and obedience of Jesus Christ's commandments(and teachings) - till the very end - Matthew 24 vs 13. .

So far you haven't told me anything written in the scripture in relation to sin. Check your past posts. What you have been saying are your personal opinions devoid of any scripture. All human beings are indeed born sinners according to scripture for all have sinned.( Romans 3:23)

In this age and time people can indeed rid themselves of the sin nature gotten through Adam through Jesus ( through believing in the original gospel of being born of water and Spirit). This is according to the scripture that says Romans 5:19
[19]For as by one man’s disobedience many were made sinners, so also by one Man’s obedience many will be made righteous.

However, according to your understanding, were Abel, Abraham etc BORN into this world AS RIGHTEOUS?

And are you a sinner or a righteous?

Our sins are never healed in several stages❗

A woman who had been suffering from hemorrhage was healed once and for all just by touching Jesus’ garment (Mark 5:29). She was freed from not only the symptom of bleeding, but its very cause. Naaman, commander of the army of the king of Syria, was also healed from leprosy all at once (2 Kings 5:14), and a leper was immediately cleansed from his leprosy as well (Matthew 8:1-4).

The religious believe that they can receive the remission of sin through their daily repentance, even as they live everyday in sin. But for the people of faith who follow the Word, all the problems of their sins have been solved once and for all, and they live in the midst of the grace of God.

The Sadducees and the Pharisees, even as they professed to believe in God, were not the ones who were healed by Jesus, but those who were healed by Him all at once were only those who, like the hemorrhaging woman and the leper, could not do anything about their illnesses on their own.

Jesus thus fulfilled all the righteousness of God by coming to this earth, becoming our own sacrificial offering like the sacrificial lambs and goats of the Old Testament, actually accepting the iniquities of sinners onto His body through His baptism, and thereby blotting out the sins of the world. This truth was shown through the daily offerings of the Old Testament. We must realize just how Jesus Christ accepted all the sins of mankind that we commit everyday when He came to this world. Only then can we be freed from all the sins of the world.
https://www.bjnewlife.org/sub.php?newlife=mission05&bidx=2186&language1=English&page_lang=english

Man's inherent nature of sin

Kobojunkie:
1
Again,there is no evidence to back up this claim, your personal interpretation of Paul's statement in scripture. Instead, there is an abundance of evidence against this claim - Abel, Abraham,Noah... even Jesus Christ.

2. The very definition of the word Sin - transgression/disobedience of God's direct command - already establishes it as a choice. So?

3. Redemption aka Salvation as offered by God is offered from God's curse on mankind from Adam - Genesis 3 vs 16 - 22 - aka the condemnation of sin, and not from sin - John 3 vs 16 - 21

4. Because if you read and digest that verse in the context within which it was given, you immediately realize that Jesus Christ never said what He did of all men but was instead of the cause of sin common to sinners. And all men aren't sinners.

5. Wrong, the reason we inherited God's judgement against Adam is because are, all of us, descended from Adam. Adam was made Man, and we are all born sons of men. That is why we inherited God's judgement against Adam. This isn't rocket science.

It doesn't matter whether you agree or not. Everything you are voicing is still your personal opinion and clear lack of understanding or perhaps a deliberate denial of a passage which shows the clear truth. Romans 5:12 is enough and very clear evidence which even a child can understand. ALL MEN ARE BORN SINNERS!
Romans 5:12,
[12]Therefore, just as through ONE MAN SIN ENTERED the WORLD, and death through sin, and thus death spread to ALL MEN, because all sinned—.

It’s because of one man’s offense, Adam, that you became a sinner. In other words, you became a sinner automatically because you were born as a descendant of Adam. Because Adam and Eve sinned against God, all of us became sinners by nature. We INHERITED sin and judgement because sin leads to judgement. WITHOUT SIN, THERE IS NO JUDGEMENT.
Psalms 51:5
]Behold, I was brought forth in iniquity, And in sin my mother conceived me.



Adam, Abel, Abraham, Noah are all born as sinners. However they became righteous through BELIEVING, ie, FAITH in the word of God.

Romans 4:3
For what does the Scripture say? “Abraham BELIEVED God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness.”

He didn't become righteous due to not transgressing. He became righteous by virtue of BELIEVING in the Word of God.
Likewise in this era, all sinners can become righteous by BELIEVING in the GOSPEL WORD of Jesus water and Spirit.
The Word, in other words, is the only benchmark of salvation. Washing away people’s sins is only achieved according to the standard set by God. This standard is the gospel of the water and the Spirit. Outside the true gospel of salvation no one can be remitted of his or her sins and receive holiness.
Just as the Word of God had power to transform Abraham into a righteous man through his believing in it, even now, the Gospel Word of what Jesus did for the salvation of mankind has power to transform all sinners into righteous people.
Romans 5:19
[19]For as by one man’s disobedience many were made sinners, so also by one Man’s obedience many will be made RIGHTEOUS.


But you must ist realise that every human beings is born with sin inside their heart which is why everyone commits sin inevitably. It is NEVER by choice. Even if you determine not to sin, you will still commit sin inevitably. Try and see. We are all doomed to sin whether we like it or not, therefore we are all doomed to judgement. Which human never transgressed? We all transgressed because of the sinful tendency already inside us and that is why we are doomed to receive judgement without the salvation of Jesus. No one can say I will not sin and actually be able to NEVER SIN. Its an impossibility. It goes against human nature. Human nature is such that transgresses because of the sins inside them already. We sin because we have sin in us. As SINNERS we are doomed to HELL until we achieve salvation.

Salvation in Christianity means ‘deliverance from the power or penalty of sin.’ We receive salvation when we admit that we cannot but go to hell for our sins and believe that Jesus saved us from all our sins through His birth, baptism and the blood on the Cross. It also entails the remission/ forgiveness of sins. Sins are forgiven when we become CLEANSED of all sins once and for all through BELIEVING in the gospel of being born again of the water and the Spirit. The faith in the gospel of the water and the Spirit is to believe in a series of truths: Jesus Christ’s divinity, the incarnation of the Son of God, His baptism and crucifixion, and His resurrection. Those who become sinless by believing in the salvation of Jesus, the baptism and blood of Jesus, are called ‘the saved, the born-again, and the righteous.’

Let me ask you , Are you a sinner or a righteous man?

Kobojunkie:
1. Adam was a sinner because Adam transgressed God's direct commandment/Law. He chose to sin against God and that is why he wss a sinner. Abel was not recorded as being as sinners because Abel instead obeyed God's Law. Abel instead chose to obey God. The only thing we all inherited from Adam is God's judgement against Adam’s sin. That we learn from Genesis 3 vs 16 - 22.

2. Mark 7 vs 21 never states that everyone has the same 12 set of sins in them. I don't know how any sane individual can read the entire passage of Matthew 15 vs 10 - 20 and Mark 7 vs 9 - 23 , only to conclude that every one has the same set of 12 sins in them. That conclusion makes no logical sense .

3. Yet beginning with Abel, men were able to escape, how?

4. Again, beginning with Abel, men were able to escape what you claim an inherent nature?

5. Since you admit here that sin is born of choice, you have pretty much thrown all your argurment that man's nature is inherently sinful into the garbage where it belongs. By acknowledging that a choice exists from birth for all men to choose either sin or faithfulness aka trust and obedience, you basically proved that your claim that all men are born sinners is hogwash.

Clearly you are hard of hearing and devoid of understanding . Adam became a sinner and transferred this nature of sin to all his descendants, ie, all human beings, including you and I, as well as Abel. We all INHERITED SIN from Adam. Every single human being with no exception.

Romans 5:12
[12]Therefore, just as through one man sin entered the world, and death through sin, and thus death spread to all men, because all sinned—

This one man is Adam, through him sin and death entered the world, ie, all all men with no exception inherited sin for all indeed commit sin. I never in any way implied that being a sinner is by choice. It is not by choice. We are born as sinners whether we like it or not, that is why we need salvation. If we were not born with sin then why do we need salvation? What did Jesus saved us from? What was His purpose of coming to this earth? Every human being is born with sin inside their heart. We commit sin because we are sinners, not for any other reason. We can't help but sin and are thus doomed to face judgement/death. Jesus our God came for salvation precisely because of that, to save us from sin and death.


Mark 7:21
[21]For from within, out of the heart of MEN, proceed evil thoughts, adulteries, fornications, murders,.....

Why would any person not read this and be able to understand that MEN refers to ALL human being in this world with no exception? It is clear even to a child. You admit we inherited judgement/condemnation/death yet you fail to realise that the reason we inherited judgement is because we inherited sin as well for it is sin that
brings about judgement/ death.

Think about this passage:
Romans 5:12
[12]Therefore, just as through one man sin entered the world, and death through sin, and thus death spread to all men, because all sinned—