haibe: John 6:46, "Not that any man hath seen the Father, save he
which is of God, he hath seen the Father."
Would this be contradiction frosbel? No, but lets see
Exo. 6:2-3, "And God spake unto Moses, and said unto him, I
am the LORD: 3And I appeared unto Abraham, unto Isaac,
and unto Jacob, by the name of God Almighty, but by my
name JEHOVAH was I not known to them."
Num. 12:6-8, "And he said, Hear now my words: If there be a
prophet among you, I the LORD will make myself known
unto him in a vision, and will speak unto him in a dream. 7My
servant Moses is not so, who is faithful in all mine house.
8 With him will I speak mouth to mouth, even apparently, and
not in dark speeches; and the similitude of the LORD shall he
behold: wherefore then were ye not afraid to speak against my
servant Moses?"
Frosbel check also, Exo. 24:9-11; Gen. 17:1; 18:1; 19:24 with Amos
4:10-11; Acts 7:2.

As you can see from the above scriptures, God Almighty was seen,
but it was not God the Father. But the Son and thats why i said to ijawkid that you cant conclude that Yahweh is a name exclusive to the Father only but the Godhead in general.
Well thats me and ijawkids discussion, so i will leave that.

So did the bible contradict itself frosbel?

haibe:

Nope u are actually the one defending the undefendable, the trinity is clear in the scriptures, u guys just wont accept.

truthislight:

liar!

Where did you get that idea from?

This thread shows that the trinity is false and you jump to the lying conclussion that it is being defended?

Shows how deceitful you guys are

truthislight:

liar!

Where did you get that idea from?

This thread shows that the trinity is false and you jump to the lying conclussion that it is being defended?

Shows how deceitful you guys are

frosbel:

these chaps are truly blinded .

frosbel:

The Trinity , a word coined by Pagans as is clearly reflected in many idol-worshipping cultures , is not and I repeat , is not in any form or shape represented, intended, implied, reflected or affirmed in Holy Scripture.

It is not only illogical but confusing, misleading, direct from the father of lies and a great danger to the ignorant.

Ihedinobi:

My my! Dude, you still harping on the pagan thing. Do you perhaps realize why nobody is calling you on it? It's because your ignorance is spilling all over the place. It's obvious that you know nothing of Church history.

frosbel:

church history my foot !!

I only need to read the Acts of the Apostles to understand church history not through the lenses of tradition. Maybe that's why you are misled.

haibe: "And the LORD rained upon sodom and gomorrah brimestone and fire "from" the LORD out of heaven"

@ijawkid i can see 2 capital LORDS now, can you explain?
OR
Then Jehovah made it rain sulphur and fire from
Jehovah, from the heavens, upon Sod′om and upon Go‧mor
′rah.

Ihedinobi:

hehehe...... There's that "I'm ignorant and I like it like that" again. Cool, dude. You read about Constantine and the council of Nicaea from Acts of the Apostles. And he asks about my schooling

frosbel:


The Pagan origins of an apostate church mean zilch to me , of course I have read the history about that pagan emperor and his bishops who reduced Christianity to a set of creeds and traditions, who diminished the authority of the bible and elevated man to positions of Infallibility.

The catholic church is where you belong.

As for your schooling , I apologise , no hurt intended

Ihedinobi:

Don't worry about it. I'm actually having me some fun.

See that bit about Constantine and the Nicene Council? I did say you didn't know what you're talking about. Here's a clue: an insubordinate presbyter opposed his bishop over the issues of the Trinity. The same man was the one whose name was associated with anti-Trinitarian doctrines. It was his movement that first took the high hand to their opponents who held the Trinity. If there were going to be persecutions in the Church then at all, it would have been all anti-Trinitarian authoritarians.

haibe: John 6:46, "Not that any man hath seen the Father,
save he
which is of God, he hath seen the Father."
Would this be contradiction frosbel? No, but lets see
Exo. 6:2-3, "And God spake unto Moses, and said unto
him, I
am the LORD: 3And I appeared unto Abraham, unto Isaac,
and unto Jacob, by the name of God Almighty, but by my
name JEHOVAH was I not known to them."
Num. 12:6-8, "And he said, Hear now my words: If there
be a
prophet among you, I the LORD will make myself known
unto him in a vision, and will speak unto him in a dream.
7My
servant Moses is not so, who is faithful in all mine house.
8 With him will I speak mouth to mouth, even apparently,
and
not in dark speeches; and the similitude of the LORD shall
he
behold: wherefore then were ye not afraid to speak against
my
servant Moses?"
Frosbel check also, Exo. 24:9-11; Gen. 17:1; 18:1; 19:24
with Amos
4:10-11; Acts 7:2.
As you can see from the above scriptures, God Almighty
was seen,
but it was not God the Father. But the Son and thats why i
said to ijawkid that you cant conclude that Yahweh is a
name exclusive to the Father only but the Godhead in
general.
Well thats me and ijawkids discussion, so i will leave that.
So did the bible contradict itself frosbel?

Ijawkid you can help frosbel in answering this one.

frosbel:


And it was your Pagan Emperor Constantine who endorsed the doctrine of the Trinity on behalf of the so called church , you should be proud of yourself.

The only church I know is the body of Christ , you can indulge yourself with the harlot church because they tickle your toes , but that's your prerogative.

frosbel:

If the fullness of the Deity dwells in Christ , how then can he be God seeing that the fullness of God had to dwell in him or how do you reconcile it to the following statement

Ephesian 3:19
"...... and to know this love that surpasses knowledge -- that you may be filled to the measure of all the fullness of God."

Based on the underlined can we also claim to be God just because we are filled with the fullness of God through his Spirit ?

Ihedinobi:

Geez! Dude, you're boring me. That's what you got? Boohoohoo How disappointing. Checking out your link anyway. Maybe I'll see something to laugh at there.

haibe: "When Abram was ninety-nine years old the LORD
APPEARED to Abram and said to him, ‘I am God
Almighty; walk before me, and be blameless, …’ When he
had finished talking with him, God went up from
Abraham." Genesis 17:1, 22

"God spoke to Moses and said to him, ‘I am the LORD. I
APPEARED to Abraham, to Isaac, and to Jacob, as God
Almighty, but by my name the LORD I did not make
myself known to them.’" Exodus 6:2-3

"And Stephen said: ‘Brothers and fathers, hear me. The
God of glory APPEARED to our father Abraham when he
was in Mesopotamia, before he lived in Haran,’" Acts 7:2

Anyone who believes the word of God should therefore have no problem accepting the
Bible’s clear teaching that on at least one occasion Yahweh
appeared to Abraham as a man who then left him to destroy
Sodom and Gomorrah.

PS: No man has seen the father at anytime_Jesus Christ(John 6:46)

haibe: "When Abram was ninety-nine years old the LORD
APPEARED to Abram and said to him, ‘I am God
Almighty; walk before me, and be blameless, …’ When he
had finished talking with him, God went up from
Abraham." Genesis 17:1, 22

"God spoke to Moses and said to him, ‘I am the LORD. I
APPEARED to Abraham, to Isaac, and to Jacob, as God
Almighty, but by my name the LORD I did not make
myself known to them.’" Exodus 6:2-3

"And Stephen said: ‘Brothers and fathers, hear me. The
God of glory APPEARED to our father Abraham when he
was in Mesopotamia, before he lived in Haran,’" Acts 7:2

Anyone who believes the word of God should therefore have no problem accepting the
Bible’s clear teaching that on at least one occasion Yahweh
appeared to Abraham as a man who then left him to destroy
Sodom and Gomorrah.

PS: No man has seen the father at anytime_Jesus Christ(John 6:46)

frosbel: Guys can you help me here.

I read the following scripture and need to to understand how you see it and point out the trinity.


Exodus 33:18 - 34:5-7
New International Version (NIV)
18 Then Moses said, “Now show me your glory.”

19 And the Lord said, “I will cause all my goodness to pass in front of you, and I will proclaim my name, the Lord, in your presence. I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion. 20 But,” he said, “you cannot see my face, for no one may see me and live.”

21 Then the Lord said, “There is a place near me where you may stand on a rock. 22 When my glory passes by, I will put you in a cleft in the rock and cover you with my hand until I have passed by. 23 Then I will remove my hand and you will see my back; but my face must not be seen.”


Then the Lord came down in the cloud and stood there with him and proclaimed his name, the Lord. 6 And he passed in front of Moses, proclaiming, “The Lord, the Lord, the compassionate and gracious God, slow to anger, abounding in love and faithfulness, 7 maintaining love to thousands, and forgiving wickedness, rebellion and sin. Yet he does not leave the guilty unpunished; he punishes the children and their children for the sin of the parents to the third and fourth generation.”


Can you kindly help us wrench the concept of the Trinity out of this scripture master piece.

Secondly :

1. how many Faces do we have here

2. how many Backs do we have here

3. how many Hands do we have here

Thanks in advance.

haibe:

1 face, 1 back, 1 hand.

Now my Question is how come Moses saw God even when Jesus stated that no man has seen the father "at any time" except him ?

ijawkid:

Something must be wrong with u haibe.....SMH!!!!

Those persons who appeared to abraham were angels....

Did u read your bible well @ all.??

John 1:18 still confirms that no one has ever seen GOD(Yahweh).....

Did it elude johns reasoning that Yahweh had earlier appeared to abraham as a man??

My freind u better go settle down and do your research.....

Nobody has ever seen Yahweh....only representatives of Yahweh can and has been seen through out history....

U dey hear me??

Please read john 1:18 and think well....

frosbel:


The Pagan origins of an apostate church mean zilch to me , of course I have read the history about that pagan emperor and his bishops who reduced Christianity to a set of creeds and traditions, who diminished the authority of the bible and elevated man to positions of Infallibility.

The catholic church is where you belong.

As for your schooling , I apologise , no hurt intended

frosbel:

1 face, 1 back, 1 hand and 3 gods, no

Where is that 'early church' historian wannabe Ihedinobi , he just might be able to bail you out with his strange logic

haibe:


Anti-trinitarians you may like to give an explanation on this post, i cant find ijawkid again.

haibe:

Lol, i now see what the watch tower has done to you, So it was an angel that later went to destroy sodom and gomorrah after leaving abraham? Nice one.

My bro, please read your bible well, frosbel i think you can help ijawkid, seems you have a better understanding than him in this aspect.

Was the LORD used in those texts referring to an angel?