plaetton:

I reckon that it would sound childish and absurd to you, but then, most religious fables have the same childish and absurd quality about them.

This says it all. I already told you that neither ridiculous notion negates the existence of God.

Deep Sight:

This says it all. I already told you that neither ridiculous notion negates the existence of God.

Of course, they only show how absurd the arguments for him are.

Deep Sight:

This says it all. I already told you that neither ridiculous notion negates the existence of God.

The FSM theology does not negate the existence of god. Rather, it proposes that the FSM is indeed the much talked-about god.

We seem to be going back and forth.
Are we on the same page or are we having arguments on seperate threads?

Deep Sight:

Escapism.

ADDRESS THE ATTRIBUTES REQUIRED OF A CAUSE.

SIMPLE.

lol, they won't. they'd much rather ridicule

@plaetton, all he is asking is that you describe what attributes first cause would have. Simples. A conceptual analysis if you may.

Mr_Anony: lol, they won't. they'd much rather ridicule

@plaetton, all he is asking is that you describe what attributes first cause would have. Simples. A conceptual analysis if you may.

why not start by giving us reasons why you think there is a first cause?

you just assume there is one and you would want us to agree to your assumptions.

cyrexx:

why not start by giving us reasons why you think there is a first cause?

Because the universe demonstrably had a beginning.

you just assume there is one and you would want us to agree to your assumptions.

FSM also presupposes first cause.

cyrexx:

why not start by giving us reasons why you think there is a first cause?

you just assume there is one and you would want us to agree to your assumptions.

see deep sight's answer

Anony, please dont try your tactics here oooo!


I dont want to see your debunked and ridiculed like in the other thread. Please oooo



Deep Sight has suffered enough, do you want to carry his cross?

Deep Sight:

Because the universe demonstrably had a beginning.

And of course, by your logic, god demostrably had no beginning ., Right?

I just dont know how you can so fiercely argue that the universe must have a first cause, but magically, god cannot.
Because the universe occupies a spot in space and time, and ,god magically does not. right?

Mr_Anony: lol, they won't. they'd much rather ridicule

@plaetton, all he is asking is that you describe what attributes first cause would have. Simples. A conceptual analysis if you may.

By what means?
Through my imagination, or by revelation?

plaetton:

And of course, by your logic, god demostrably had no beginning ., Right?

I just dont know how you can so fiercely argue that the universe must have a first cause, but magically, god cannot.
Because the universe occupies a spot in space and time, and ,god magically does not. right?

Conscisely, because the universe is matter,and matter cannot cause itself and as such, the cause of matter cannot be matter: and is therefore immaterial. That which is immaterial is naturally permanent and uncaused.

Simples.

Now answer my questions!

plaetton:

By what means?
Through my imagination, or by revelation?

By reason.

It is logical to say that a first cause is eternal or immaterial:

Is it logical to say that a first cause is Indomie Noodles?

Come on. Be serious.

@Deepsight:

Pls answer honestly.
No matter how elegant,complete and reassuring it sounds, Is god, the uncaused cause, the eternal, immutable overlord of space and time, not a mental construct?

Can you demonstrate how god is demostrably eternal, immutable, uncaused, or that god even exists at all?

Deep Sight:

Conscisely, because the universe is matter,and matter cannot cause itself and as such, the cause of matter cannot be matter: and is therefore immaterial. That which is immaterial is naturally permanent and uncaused.

Simples.

Now answer my questions!

"The cause of matter can not be matter"

#things that Deep Sight pulls from his Azz

MacDaddy01:


"The cause of matter can not be matter"

#things that Deep Sight pulls from his Azz

So your responses to premises are not counter premises but only mockery?

plaetton: @Deepsight:

Pls answer honestly.
No matter how elegant,complete and reassuring it sounds, Is god, the uncaused cause, the eternal, immutable overlord of space and time, not a mental construct?

Can you demonstrate how god is demostrably eternal, immutable, uncaused, or that god even exists at all?

1. Something exists.

2. Something cannot come from nothing.

3. Thus something pre exists.

4. The pre existent cannot be nothing.

5. It is thus a permanent something.

Deep Sight:

By reason.

It is logical to say that a first cause is eternal or immaterial:

Is it logical to say that a first cause is Indomie Noodles?

Come on. Be serious.

Seriously speaking, first cause, eternal, immaterial; all these are mere mental gymnastics.
I should have the same liberty as you have to add noodles to the entire mental exercise. Why not?
Why should you display such prejudice against my own version of the mental gymnastics?

Deep Sight:

So your responses to premises are not counter premises but only mockery?

Dont hold ridiculous beliefs if you dont want to be ridiculed.

The term "matter" is used throughout physics in a bewildering variety of contexts: for example, one refers to "condensed matter physics",[87] "elementary matter",[88] "partonic" matter, "dark" matter, "anti"-matter, "strange" matter, and "nuclear" matter. In discussions of matter and antimatter, normal matter has been referred to by Alfvén as koinomatter.[89] It is fair to say that in physics, there is no broad consensus as to a general definition of matter, and the term "matter" usually is used in conjunction with a specifying modifier.

Deep Sight:

1. Something exists.

2. Something cannot come from nothing.

3. Thus something pre exists.

4. The pre existent cannot be nothing.

5. It is thus a permanent something.

Beautiful logic.
By the same token, So if god exists, god cannot come from nothing, so there must be something pre-existent and more permanent than god.right?

Hhhmmm, what should we call it?
Let me see.
I know. please please, lets call it the Flying Spaghetti Monster(FSM).
What do you think?

^^^^
Pls dont get ticked off by the name.
Its just a name.
After all, the universe is said to be spiral in shape, much like spaghetti.

plaetton:

Beautiful logic.
By the same token, So if god exists, god cannot come from nothing, so there must be something pre-existent and more permanent than god.right?

Hhhmmm, what should we call it?
Let me see.
I know. please please, lets call it the Flying Spaghetti Monster(FSM).
What do you think?

O no: remember that matter is mutable and hence not self xistent. Thats the key. Simples.

The intagible is not caused. Eternity is intangible. Is it caused? There's your answer.

Deep Sight:

O no: remember that matter is mutable and hence not self xistent. Thats the key. Simples.

The intagible is not caused. Eternity is intangible. Is it caused? There's your answer.

Eternity is an infinite. Infinites do no exist n the real world.


#back to life, back to reality

MacDaddy01:


Eternity is an infinite. Infinites do no exist n the real world.


#back to life, back to reality

Nonsense. If eternity does not exist,then what else exists? In what does the universe exist? What timeline. Get serious.

MacDaddy01:


Eternity is an infinite. Infinites do no exist n the real world.

In fact,just to re inforce how wrong this statement is: infinites DO EXIST in our reality.

Every particle can be sub divided to sub particles to infinity. Same with numbers. Same with everything.

So infinity is in fact the only reality.

Deep Sight:

Nonsense. If eternity does not exist,then what else exists? In what does the universe exist? What timeline. Get serious.

Universe had a beginning? Is that not your argument?


Isnt that the point of the big bang?

plaetton:

By what means?
Through my imagination, or by revelation?

By thinking. I presume you are capable of thought are you not?

Deep Sight:

In fact,just to re inforce how wrong this statement is: infinites DO EXIST in our reality.

Every particle can be sub divided to sub particles to infinity. Same with numbers. Same with everything.

So infinity is in fact the only reality.

Ode, numbers dont exist in the real world, they are ideological constructs


matter is the smallest material. No infinite in particles.


#Deep sight debunked


NEXT!

MacDaddy01: Anony, please dont try your tactics here oooo!
I dont want to see your debunked and ridiculed like in the other thread. Please oooo
Deep Sight has suffered enough, do you want to carry his cross?

lol, there is a difference between logical arguments and mockery.

MacDaddy01:


Universe had a beginning? Is that not your argument?


Isnt that the point of the big bang?

And the big bang was massive motion. Now tell me: are you unscientific enough to believe that such massive motion occurs without a trigger?

Do you think that such a trigger could be noodles?

MacDaddy01:


Ode, numbers dont exist in the real world, they are ideological constructs

Numbers do exist, otherwise you won't even be typing. I don't expect that you are philosophically mature enough for us to venture into the discussion on numbers though.

matter is the smallest material. No infinite in particles.

O really? Oya, show me the smallest particle na?

plaetton:

Seriously speaking, first cause, eternal, immaterial; all these are mere mental gymnastics.
I should have the same liberty as you have to add noodles to the entire mental exercise. Why not?
Why should you display such prejudice against my own version of the mental gymnastics?

wow! the bolded is a plain example of willful ignorance. "I do not know, I do not want to ponder it but I am very happy to ridicule it"
I am sorry sir, that's just poor.

Deep Sight:

And the big bang was massive motion. Now tell me: are you unscientific enough to believe that such massive motion occurs without a trigger?

Do you think that such a trigger could be noodles?

we dont know what is beofre the big bang. If there was a trigger, yes it wouldnt be noodle, neither will it be spiritual ectoplasm