Deep Sight:

Point taken, but as one well acquainted with the views of M_Nwankwo, let me just inform you that he does not see God as merely free floating love. He also regards God as a definite but transcendental being. As such, his analogy is directed at indicating what he believes it takes to connect with God - that is love, no more, and no less.

Let me add personally that if you really believe God to be transcendental, you would realize that you are belittling God by thinking that he would insist on people knowing of or accepting a particular individual regardless of their cultural, religious and historical differences - whether this individual was God himself or not, or whether this individual was God's son or not - because the mind of God surely transcends such things and looks to the core - the heart.

Now this is not even touching on that which is meant by "acceptance" of christ. For the write-up by Nwankwo above actually shows us that "acceptance" is a mind-state of love and not merely declaration of belief in Christ as Messiah. That is nothing. Surely you know that.



You know, many non-Christians and even atheists; in fact, I dare say most - accept the generality of Jesus's teachings on love. Except of course misguided people like Martian who say that "love thy neighbour as thyself" is a bad teaching, I can safely say that the generality of people regard it as a sound teaching.

The problem lies with the more specific and cult-like teaching that one must accept Jesus the man in person, as personal lord and saviour, and also accept him as God, and only begotten son of God, and further believe that his death on the cross represents ritual sacrificial salvation and redemption for mankind. I do not believe any of these things: and many a sound man who has love for humanity in his heart would similarly disbelieve these things.

Does this amount to rejecting Christ?

cyrexx: Hmm.

This is gonna be interesting. Discussion between the "wisest, most intelligent nairalander" and the popular apologist for christianity on nairaland.

This will be nothing but interesting.

Let the discusssion begin....

cyrexx: Logicboy,

you should have detected my subtle sarcasm when I called Deepsight the "wisest, most intelligent nairalander".

It's the kind of praise you give a man who believe his wife is the world's most beautiful woman, you know.

Negro_Ntns: the sacrifice of jesus, the cross, the walking on water are all symbolic and have a deeper spiritual meaning than mere physical senses can perceive and understamd. many of the themes and symbolism and mysteries of Christianity are remnants of Jewish mystical practices which were adopted legacies of pre- Mosaic times.

davidylan: sigh. once again a nice topic is ruined by the obsessive widely off tangent comments of those who claim God doesnt exist but waste 20 out of the 24hrs in their day bawling about him.

Negro_Ntns: i am not sure that civilization will be a good time marker to use in this regard since civilizations can span over different prophetic times.

but my reference is in point to nohadic time. this would be the earliest of any trackable social and cultural institutions of human history. that time period gave us the narration of productive work and social relationships and covenants.

plaetton:

Nohadic time? which historical period was this?

You can't just pull things out of your hat without explaining what it means.
You have mentioned pre-mosaic time, and now, Nohadic time, without any kind of explanation about these terms mean.

Human history, let me remind you, is not measured on biblical characters.
Biblical chronology is not, and has never been a reliable benchmark for tracing human history.
You cannot say nohadic time without letting us know whether you are talking about 5,000,10,000 or 20,000 BC.

davidylan: sigh. once again a nice topic is ruined by the obsessive widely off tangent comments of those who claim God doesnt exist but waste 20 out of the 24hrs in their day bawling about him.

davidylan:

kinda reminds me perfectly of the atheist tactic. You know... like those who just post youtube videos or skeletons without telling us exactly what they mean and why they are important? Why is it a problem now?

plaetton:

There must be something about you xtians and your zombie mentality. You seem to think everyone is infected with the disease that affects critical thinking?. That is why you think it's okay for someone to come on a thread and throw around words like pre-mosaic or Nohadic, without any context, that have absolutely no broad academic meaning.

If you are talking about pre-mosaic times, you have to mention with reference to a particular civilisation, Egyptian,Summerian, Babylonian, Akkadian, etc.

plaetton: ^^^^^

And let me repeat, in case you have not learned:

Moses has never been proven to be a bona fide historical figure.
Therefore it is grossly misleading to use the term pre-mosaic in any meaningful discussion.

davidylan:

and who was arguing about mosaic times with you? Apparently you just post without thinking.

plaetton:

You always dissappoint me davidylan. You argue just for argument sake, just like a motor park tout. No broad perspective.

plaetton:

Nohadic time? which historical period was this?

You can't just pull things out of your hat without explaining what it means.
You have mentioned pre-mosaic time, and now, Nohadic time, without any kind of explanation about these terms mean.

Human history, let me remind you, is not measured on biblical characters.
Biblical chronology is not, and has never been a reliable benchmark for tracing human history.
You cannot say nohadic time without letting us know whether you are talking about 5,000,10,000 or 20,000 BC.

plaetton:

There must be something about you xtians and your zombie mentality. You seem to think everyone is infected with the disease that affects critical thinking?. That is why you think it's okay for someone to come on a thread and throw around words like pre-mosaic or Nohadic, without any context, that have absolutely no broad academic meaning.

If you are talking about pre-mosaic times, you have to mention with reference to a particular civilisation, Egyptian,Summerian, Babylonian, Akkadian, etc.

davidylan:

You simply responded to my post WITHOUT a shred of thinking. I was not in any way endorsing Negro_nts post. I'm 120% positive nohadic times makes zero sense.

My post was a simple retort on the sheer hypocrisy of folks like you snarling about throwing around words with "context" and "broad academic meaning". Your ranks are heavily populated with people who merely throw around internet memes, plagiarized links from atheist websites, youtube videos, meaningless scientific terms you cannot explain and skeletons all WITHOUT broad academic meaning. When we ask, all we get from you is "go and read".

I'm sure if i asked you a simple question based on your post it would be very apparent that you dont understand the times you babble about either. If google/wikipedia didnt exist i wonder how many of you would last 2 days here.

The one who wants to throw stones should make sure his own isnt built of glass...

oh and by the way, negro_nts isnt christian. You should not jump to conclusions before you have properly researched your subject... one would think a self-professed purveyor of the scientific process would know that.

Negro_Ntns:

we will see how far your academic weight can stretch. egyptian, summerian, babylonian, akkadian.....etc are all biblical settlements and cultures. there is no way you can talk about human history and not reference the bible......no way!

humanity is defined by the bible and I challenge you to prove otherwise. You cannot be more dogged on this topic than huxley was, and i am yet to find an atheist more stubborn and intellectually gifted in nairaland than huxley when he was a member here.

Negro_Ntns:

i deliberately use "uncommon" terms in my discussion for the very reason you pointed out in the bold above; to lure these so called "search engine intellectuals" out of the comfort of google and stress-test their thoughts and insight unaided.

if i had used 20,000bc he can easily probe google to respond.....but when i use something like pre-mosaic he had no valid response..... i wonder if google did not tell him that BC is the same as Pre-Christ.

Logicboy03:


Heard of BCE?

Hmmm?

plaetton:

Thanks for that. I was just about to educate him on this.

Can you imagine this statement that human history is defined by the bible?
Man, the educational system in Nigeria is really really bad. I cannot even believe that an adult, no matter his religious belief, can utter such nonsense in this day and age.

As soon as he said that, I knew there was no point arguing with guy.
Why bother?
This guy should be having this debate with my 11yr old kid in JSS 1.
Anyone, any adult that went through JSS 1 at least, and says boldly that human history is defined by the bible is really really really dumb.

Logicboy03:


Worse than dumb! the person is actually a willing Jewish slave, putting Jewish history at the centre of history.

The slave actually forgets that the Chinese were long civilized and advanced befroe the Jews were.