Damest09:

@KAG

If you can read the bible, read the whole of Revelation and if you can't sit down to read it, read chapter 20 and 21.

Chapter 20 talks more about the rapture and 21 talks more about what will happen in heaven after the rapture.

Only Jesus is the way.

I've read it, Kubla Khan was better, less enigmatic, and had far less room for mis-interpretations and re-interpretations.

@KAG

What is Kubla Khan?

Damest09:

@KAG

What is Kubla Khan?

Poem by Samuel Taylor Coleridge. Hold on, I'll get it for you.

Kubla Khan
OR, A VISION IN A DREAM. A FRAGMENT.


In Xanadu did Kubla Khan
A stately pleasure-dome decree :
Where Alph, the sacred river, ran
Through caverns measureless to man
Down to a sunless sea.
So twice five miles of fertile ground
With walls and towers were girdled round :
And there were gardens bright with sinuous rills,
Where blossomed many an incense-bearing tree ;
And here were forests ancient as the hills,
Enfolding sunny spots of greenery.

But oh ! that deep romantic chasm which slanted
Down the green hill athwart a cedarn cover !
A savage place ! as holy and enchanted
As e'er beneath a waning moon was haunted
By woman wailing for her demon-lover !
And from this chasm, with ceaseless turmoil seething,
As if this earth in fast thick pants were breathing,
A mighty fountain momently was forced :
Amid whose swift half-intermitted burst
Huge fragments vaulted like rebounding hail,
Or chaffy grain beneath the thresher's flail :
And 'mid these dancing rocks at once and ever
It flung up momently the sacred river.
Five miles meandering with a mazy motion
Through wood and dale the sacred river ran,
Then reached the caverns measureless to man,
And sank in tumult to a lifeless ocean :
And 'mid this tumult Kubla heard from far
Ancestral voices prophesying war !
The shadow of the dome of pleasure
Floated midway on the waves ;
Where was heard the mingled measure
From the fountain and the caves.
It was a miracle of rare device,
A sunny pleasure-dome with caves of ice !
A damsel with a dulcimer
In a vision once I saw :
It was an Abyssinian maid,
And on her dulcimer she played,
Singing of Mount Abora.
Could I revive within me
Her symphony and song,
To such a deep delight 'twould win me,
That with music loud and long,
I would build that dome in air,
That sunny dome ! those caves of ice !
And all who heard should see them there,
And all should cry, Beware ! Beware !
His flashing eyes, his floating hair !
Weave a circle round him thrice,
And close your eyes with holy dread,
For he on honey-dew hath fed,
And drunk the milk of Paradise.

@KAG

It poem is OK, I understand some while i don't understand some part. I understand bible more. Were you just teasing me or you meant the question you've being asking? Anyway it all good 'cause i don't always talk about things like this. Thanks for the questions. I might be wrong in few points of what i said, it will help me to ask more questions about it someday soon and also the questions made me realize some things too. Thanks

Damest09:

@KAG

It poem is OK, I understand some while i don't understand some part. I understand bible more. Were you just teasing me or you meant the question you've being asking? Anyway it all good 'cause i don't always talk about things like this. Thanks for the questions. I might be wrong in few points of what i said, it will help me to ask more questions about it someday soon and also the questions made me realize some things too. Thanks

I was teasing a little, sorry (I'm in an impish mood for some unknown reason), but I agree with you though, thinking never hurt anyone. Thanks for indulging me too, and yes I admit it, you made me think too - especially of memories long forgotten.

@KAG

So you know all this before, that means you are a Christian? Good.

Damest09:

@KAG

So you know all this before, that means you are a Christian? Good.

I knew several, not all, but I'm *blushes* not a Christian. Sorry?

oh i thought you are. when you know some of it why ain't you a Christian or you don't have any religion or believe?

Damest09:

oh i thought you are. when you know some of it why ain't you a Christian or you don't have any religion or believe?

You won't be the fisrt to make that assumption, and probably wont be the last. I'm not christian, because I'm not a theist. I'm an atheist.

An atheist who's going to bed as soon as people on some other forum tell me what Smh and nothing dey par mean.

All what you know suppose to change you. maybe you should think about it. good night.

Damest09:

All what you know suppose to change you. maybe you should think about it. good night.

I will, force of habit really. And a good night to you too.

Blasphemy!!!!

I know that the God that I worship, Jesus Christ is Alive, whether the world likes it or not.

Can you imagine the nerve , ?

I will liken you to some of the Hausa Elder's who (when i use to live in Kano) out of mockery incite their illiterate almajiri's against the yoruba's in 1999. and they all stepped back when it turns into a riot. i witness it all, and it does not pay at all.

Instead of mocking religious beliefs (either mulim/christian-i don't care). Let us open ground for dialogue and let everyone have a right to their beliefs.

I won't comment on the Zeus thing, 'because everyman has freedom of speech.

@Damest09
i write this with a huge sigh because at this time one needs ones faith to be strengthened and then this?

i wish i was so confident like you in what you believe, hold on tight to it
we need "people like you" around us.
Seun, i dont understand this really- you're scaring me
you dont seem like this sort
whats going on?

:-x :-x :-x :-x :-x ;d

Thank goodness someone is thinking the way i am,

I am not saying he is wrong to change his name, i am only accusing him of not putting up a public notice!

$eun or is it seun.which one should i call, please do explain!

@Gomer

Thanks, as i have said earlier, this is the first time I've ever done this type of thing 'cause I'm always scared of what people might think of me. but now i enjoyed it.

So, thanks again for the encouragement.

Ndipe:

Blasphemy!!!!

I know that the God that I worship, Jesus Christ is Alive, whether the world likes it or not.

Can you imagine the nerve , ?

It isn't blasphemy, as it doesn't insult any of the Christian Gods ().

gbengaijot:

I wont be suprise if i am banned from Nairaland with my comments below,

$eun, what is the motive behind your first post?, is it to make a mockery of christaindom?. why did i asak, the above tract u got seems to only mock rather than give a ground for discussion.
I personally think your are feeling thesame way like you were when you were a christian. Trying to let people believe you that there is no God. In as much as everyone has their own beliefs, there is no point to mock.

In Nwoke's defence, the "tract" he posted in the OP, is not as much an attack on christianity, as it is a satirical rebuttal of Pascal's wager.

KAG:

It isn't blasphemy, as it doesn't insult any of the Christian Gods ().

In Nwoke's defence, the "tract" he posted in the OP, is not as much an attack on christianity, as it is a satirical rebuttal of Pascal's wager.

In that case I want the MUSLIM VERSION posted, the one where the guy believed in ALLAH and not ZEUS.

@zebudaya, i didnt realise you notice oooo,
while freedom of speech is essential, then also respect to all religion is paramount as well.

zebudaya:

In that case I want the MUSLIM VERSION posted, the one where the guy believed in ALLAH and not ZEUS.

Well this is what you do then, get photoshop (or something similar), get a tutorial or a tutor to teach you how to use the software; then you go on Jack Chicks website, pick a tract of your choice, save/copy/paste, then edit it. Voila! you have yourself a muslim version, be as creative as you want.


by the way, like I sated before, I don't think I've ever heard or met a muslim use Pascal's wager as an argument. I'm sure there are muslims that do, but it seems to be overwhelmingly used by Christians. I'd wager the author of the comic has had a similar experience.

KAG:

Well this is what you do then, get photoshop (or something similar), get a tutorial or a tutor to teach you how to use the software; then you go on Jack Chicks website, pick a tract of your choice, save/copy/paste, then edit it. Voila! you have yourself a muslim version, be as creative as you want.


by the way, like I sated before, I don't think I've ever heard or met a muslim use Pascal's wager as an argument. I'm sure there are muslims that do, but it seems to be overwhelmingly used by Christians. I'd wager the author of the comic has had a similar experience.

I teach people how to use photoshop. I guess i am proficient in photoshop, but that's not the point. You post a cartoon in which Zeus tells the man that he was worshiping a fake God, and his religion is a facade, but you would not dare post/talk about the muslim version. Like gbengaijot said it's all about respect. "You don't ram a shopping cart in my ankle intentionally then tell me sorry."

zebudaya:

I teach people how to use photoshop. I guess i am proficient in photoshop, but that's not the point. You post a cartoon in which Zeus tells the man that he was worshiping a fake God, and his religion is a facade, but you would not dare post/talk about the muslim version. Like gbengaijot it's all about respect. "You don't ram a shopping cart in my ankle intentionally then tell me sorry."

That is the point. The author created it as a rebuttal to the constant use of Pascal's wager and it's variations by Christians. It would be a tad odd rebutting people you haven't even come into contact with, no? There was absolutely no reason for him to have created a muslim version, but now that you feel so strongly about it, you can make your version.

@Nwoke

While all this is going on, don't you have anything to say or you are enjoying reading the replies? and what's your main purpose or what do you want to achieve by posting the thread?

@Damest09- dont ever stop. you are an encouragement
Nwoke, dont let a war start here
say something

gbengaijot:

@kag, Zebudaya is not making another version because there is a christian version, this is the kind of things that causes war.

Has he forgotten that as a administrator, he is a role model?, even if he olds biased mind about christiandom, is that a justification of the cartoons above?
. it is true that he owns the forum, he is the administrator and he is also the commander-in-chief, but i wont support dictatorial rule!

like gbengadot said, you are a role model, what are you trying to prove here?
why are you not saying anything
with all due respect, nwoke, you dont seem like a coward or are you?

KAG is right. Someone posted a link to the source on a different thread and I decided to promote it.

A lot of people on this forum are fond of saying "if I believe in God but he's not real, no problem, but if you don't believe in God and he's real, then you're in trouble. Therefore it is better to believe in God." This argument is a very old one and it even has a name: [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pascal's_Wager]Pascal's Wager[/url].

The problem with Pascal's wager is that there are so many gods to choose from. So how do you know that the one you've chosen is the right one? What if you choose Jesus and Allah or Zeus is the right One? Are you safe?

Nwoke:

The problem with Pascal's wager is that there are so many gods to choose from. So how do you know that the one you've chosen is the right one? What if you choose Jesus and Allah or Zeus is the right One? Are you safe?

The question is first and foremost about whether or not God exists - establishing the fact comes before making a choice. I was once a Muslim and later became a Christian. I didn't choose to become a believer before establishing for myself that God does exist. The problem is: what convinces me that my choices provide me with peace to my heart and conscience? It isn't merely in the doctrines, but because it's a heart problem. For me, there's no confusing the issue - only the sacrifice of Christ on the cross and faith in that finished work has since given me peace and hope beyond this life: I know that now in my heart without a doubt!

KAG,I love you!Honestly,i do!

The question is first and foremost about whether or not God exists

He most likely does not exist. If he exists, it cannot be the Christian God. that I am sure of.

Prove it Nwoke.
I believe its the same way you can prove that God exists you can also prove that he doesnt.So Mr moderator,prove it!

@Nwoke, you really haven't said anything and I respect your opinion simply because that's what you really want to believe. Even the most respected atheists and skeptics are not that brazen - they'll always tell you that the non-existence of God cannot be proven! So, could you break the record and tell us how you came by your omniscient discovery?