arsenalwenger: I dont attach my loyalty to any church but the bible alone. If a church is preaching false doctrine i will leave, its not by force.

A saying goes thus: exclusivity is the right claim when making a 'truth' statement. From your point of view all christian churches are worshipping the devil except JW that was formed in the late 19th century by Russel. The same organization that has jettisoned many of their biblical teachings (I am not saying xmas, easter or birthday pls, i mean core bible doctrines) replacing them with new ones. That have made many failed predictions but maintain only unbiblical 1914 as the sole surviving one.

I have nothing to disprove again cos there is no any biblical basis for 1914, it was only conjured up by WTS to deceive the gullible. Many a prediction made such as 1925, 1935, 1975 etc have all been trashed as false. What gives you the impression that 1914 must be true when 100% of all JW predictions are all false.

I like you loyalty, but there is danger in blind loyalty.

The bold is commendable, and that is why I left the church to join the witnesses. I wonder what you are still waiting for, savoring heresy.

^^^ can you be that blind? Na wa oh!

arsenalwenger: The word of God is not dynamic or subject to changes when the light gets brighter. We are to increase in the knowledge of the word of God and not switching beliefs from one form to another.

Christains have a traditional belief system based on the word of God, among which is the trinity. The trinity will not make sense to a Jw as long as the Holy spirit is regarded as a non-living thing by JW. The doctrine will not make sense as long as the son is regarded as angel michael by JW, all in a cunning attempt to 'debunk' trinity at all cost (as against the bibble teaching).

So you are yet to fully understand how your organization operate.

Mark 7:13

13 and thus YOU make [the word of God invalid by YOUR tradition which YOU handed down. And many things similar to this YOU do.”

Whatever the bible says is now invalid because of your man made tradition of trinity which has no place in God's word.

@arsenalwenger

For 1914, start from this page:

https://www.nairaland.com/1525969/jman05-bernimoore-jonahs-warning-vs#19747459

https://www.nairaland.com/1525969/jman05-bernimoore-jonahs-warning-vs/1#19773623

https://www.nairaland.com/1525969/jman05-bernimoore-jonahs-warning-vs/2#19780247

arsenalwenger: The word of God is not dynamic or subject to changes when the light gets brighter. We are to increase in the knowledge of the word of God and not switching beliefs from one form to another.

Christains have a traditional belief system based on the word of God, among which is the trinity. The trinity will not make sense to a Jw as long as the Holy spirit is regarded as a non-living thing by JW. The doctrine will not make sense as long as the son is regarded as angel michael by JW, all in a cunning attempt to 'debunk' trinity at all cost (as against the bibble teaching).

So you are yet to fully understand how your organization operate.

Of course, the word of God does not change. Our understanding can and does change if we humbly allow it, as did that of the early apostles. As you correctly point out, we are to increase in knowledge of the word of God, and doing so leads to changes including rejecting false teachings no matter how popular. Truly, "the path of the righteous is like the light of dawn, That shines brighter and brighter until the full day" - (Prov 4:18).

(Trinity might be a "traditional" belief, but it has no basis in the Bible. JWs today are actually not the 1st or only ones to reject the false Trinity. Truth-seekers have over the centuries, from Trinity's inception in Nicean Council of 325CE, questioned it, rejected it. Feel free to research the origin of Trinity yourself).

Yooguyz:

how would you feel, if the new current watchtower teaching says hell is real?

But this ^ statement can only be the epitome of ignorance.

How can 'hell' be real when the word is not even a word that was used by bible writers ?
But crept into the bible through translation ?

Or, do you mean grave is real ?

You and your lot keep on exposing your chronic lack of knowledge and refusal to learn.

Smh.

Why are you guys just full of talks instead of picking up your bible and exposing this Jws sef ?

Talk and emotion is cheap, but the real stuff is not what any of you can carry, no, you all cannot effectively use the bible.

If someone decides to take you up on Angel Michaels identity now, you will show how empty you are and resort to this same talk, but unable to use the scriptures.

Smh for so call christians that are unable to handle the word of truth aright.

arsenalwenger: The word of God is not dynamic or subject to changes when the light gets brighter. We are to increase in the knowledge of the word of God and not switching beliefs from one form to another.

Christains have a traditional belief system based on the word of God, among which is the trinity. The trinity will not make sense to a Jw as long as the Holy spirit is regarded as a non-living thing by JW. The doctrine will not make sense as long as the son is regarded as angel michael by JW, all in a cunning attempt to 'debunk' trinity at all cost (as against the bibble teaching).

So you are yet to fully understand how your organization operate.

truthislight:

But this ^ statement can only be the epitome of ignorance.

How can 'hell' be real when the word is not even a word that was used by bible writers ?

if the new edition of watchtower says otherwise, you'ld probably not have written.

If i told you arch-angel micheal was the pope and the antichrist you would have said my statement was " an epitome of ignorance ". And off course it would have been different if we were in the year 1876.

You and your lot keep on exposing your chronic lack of knowledge and refusal to learn.

Smh.

you keep emphasizing the words "truth" and "knowledge" in many of your posts, buh the truth is that your posts reflects some one whose thinking is heavily wired with watchtower quotes and who is heavily brainwashed. Gosh! Do you even think at all?

truthislight: Why are you guys just full of talks instead of picking up your bible and exposing this Jws sef ?

i love the way the OP avoided biblical discussion with you guys.
This thread would have filled with torrents of watchtower quotes from narrow minded Jw's like you.

Talk and emotion is cheap, but the real stuff is not what any of you can carry, no, you all cannot effectively use the bible.

you've started to lie like your magazine.

If someone decides to take you up on Angel Michaels identity now, you will show how empty you are and resort to this same talk, but unable to use the scriptures.

i opened a thread on angel micheals identity but what do you guys do? You all ran away like cowards! How dare you criticize us.

Yooguyz:

if the new edition of watchtower says otherwise, you'ld probably not have written.

If i told you arch-angel micheal was the pope and the antichrist you would have said my statement was " an epitome of ignorance ". And off course it would have been different if we were in the year 1876.


you keep emphasizing the words "truth" and "knowledge" in many of your posts, buh the truth is that your posts reflects some one whose thinking is heavily wired with watchtower quotes and who is heavily brainwashed. Gosh! Do you even think at all?

Laffing all through. Thats the danger of a wired brain, programmed to think robotically and not logically. The key words truth and knowledge has always been misused at the expense of common sense.

An organization made a prediction that says christ will return 1914, 1925, apostles with return in 1935, generation that saw 1914 will see armagadon before or at their 70 years of age, that is 1984. All this teachin were now considered mistakes except 1914. If the calculation that gave room to all those dates are now considered false by watchtower, my question remains why would the calculation that gave room to 1914 still valid?

I think truthislight has been seriosly brainwasheD to accept anything from JW.

lets keep to the topic .......JMAN05, BERNIMOORE ON JONAH'S WARNING VS JW RUSSELL 1914 PREDICTION.)

bolded above reads jonah vs jw russel, russel was marked out as an entity,

russel was said to have predicted about 1914! Im not admitting the screenshut below as a true copy of the jw about the claim b/f by hisblud

but can still be used to verify some details

now

Russel who is an entity, and a "singular" person here cannot be reffered to as "we" neither does the statements below refer to russel as receiving information from a source to arrive as such conclusion, because on line 10 below, there was a disclaimer, like this

.........we are not directly informed!......

see it again; quotes from Hisblud below

@Hisblud

[size=15pt]The alleged 1915 edition of "studies in the scriptures" that you posted above of "thy kingdom come" was a fake![/size] unlike the first one in 1908 by the left which has a particular page(pg 228) the alleged 1915 edition where the quote[i] "deliverance of saints must take place very soon after 1914"[/i] was lifted has no page ! and suspicious! can you provide the particular page that it says "must take place very soon after 1914"

im waiting for that!

meanwhile the 1908 issue that has a date, there was a disclaimer regarding the "direct imformation" and there was no mention of day and hour! then it could be regarded as "stiring up minds by way of reminder! like peter did below


2 Peter 3,15-17

3 Beloved, I now write to you this second epistle (in both of which I stir up your pure minds by way of reminder), 2 that you may be mindful of the words which were spoken before by the holy prophets, and of the commandment of us,[a] the apostles of the Lord and Savior, 3 knowing this first: that scoffers will come in the last days, walking according to their own lusts, 4 and saying, “Where is the promise of His coming? For since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of creation.”

and instead of getting the message, some untaught and unstable people twist to their own destruction, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures

15 and consider that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation—as also our beloved brother Paul, according to the wisdom given to him, has written to you, 16 as also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which untaught and unstable people twist to their own destruction, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures.

17 You therefore, beloved, since you know this beforehand, beware lest you also fall from your own steadfastness, being led away with the error of the wicked;

like i said, no matter how you try to mix them up, it will be laid bare where people distorts what was not said, which page do you lift your 1915 quote above, so that we can start from there!

[quote author=arsenalwenger]

I have nothing to disprove again cos there is no any biblical basis for 1914, it was only conjured up by WTS to deceive the gullible.

keeping to the topic

if you say that there is no biblical basis for 1914, a year that the 1st world war started, of which one third of people living on earth died and peace was taken out of the earth according to report, its not the normal war but a unique type

then

is there anywhere you can point to where God directly told jonah to mention a figure pointing to a day of doom, ....in forty days...nineveh shallbe overthrown in Gods message to jonah? if you cant point to any then does it mean that there is no basis for mentioning a figure in the first place,.....and does that stir up the minds of the people of nineveh to repentance?

I like you loyalty, but there is danger in blind loyalty

you dont know what loyalty means

1, in case of jonah he lost out, and looks to be ashamed that he told God that he wants to die because what he said did not come to pass in 40days

2, in case of Noah's children shem Ham and japhet who were married,their obedience streched to not even giving birth at all for decades because of the seeming deluge, and had it been that the people then repented, do you still see the case of loyalty of Noahs children as dangerous as you put it? because it will be twisted as if they were been deprived by blind loyalty to their father, and NOT tp God

you can see now that projecting ones personal benefit ahead of Gods can distort your sense of reasoning!

religion itself can be faulted in all ramification, but those living by a devoted doctrine to please God do not deserve jest from those doing Nothing to please God!

arsenalwenger: Laffing all through. Thats the danger of a wired brain, programmed to think robotically and not logically. The key words truth and knowledge has always been misused at the expense of common sense.

An organization made a prediction that says christ will return 1914, 1925, apostles with return in 1935, generation that saw 1914 will see armagadon before or at their 70 years of age, that is 1984. All this teachin were now considered mistakes except 1914. If the calculation that gave room to all those dates are now considered false by watchtower, my question remains why would the calculation that gave room to 1914 still valid?

I think truthislight has been seriosly brainwasheD to accept anything from JW.

My brother gave you this reply above. When you apply ignorance, you only show that you are not here for a serious discussion. No need to write more cos you ve been answered already.

Of course, the word of God does not change. Our understanding can and does change if we humbly allow it, as did that of the early apostles. As you correctly point out, we are to increase in knowledge of the word of God, and doing so leads to changes including rejecting false teachings no matter how popular. Truly, "the path of the righteous is like the light of dawn, That shines brighter and brighter until the full day" - (Prov 4:18).

(Trinity might be a "traditional" belief, but it has no basis in the Bible. JWs today are actually not the 1st or only ones to reject the false Trinity. Truth-seekers have over the centuries, from Trinity's inception in Nicean Council of 325CE, questioned it, rejected it. Feel free to research the origin of Trinity yourself).

Oga when you are serious we will know. Just see how we are poised to reply your question on the issue on board, but you keep vacillating.

JMAN05:

My brother gave you this reply above. When you apply ignorance, you only show that you are not here for a serious discussion. No need to write more cos you ve been answered already.



Oga when you are serious we will know. Just see how we are poised to reply your question on the issue on board, but you keep vacillating.

As i said earlier, the trinity doctrine must be debunked at all cost by the JW (even if they have to lie against the Bible to achiev that), so the escape route is to turn Jesus christ to an angel (against Heb 1:4-6) and the Holy spirit to a non-living thing or active force (as against Jesus' own teaching in John 16:7-15). And this is what an average JW teaches as bible truth, thats terrible!

I am very sure if WTS change the doctrine tomorow (as they have been doing) and tell you that the Holy spirit is no longer an active force you will flow along naturally. The implication of this robotic lifestyle is that you guys are not loyal to the bible but watchtower organization (you accept what they teach as truth whether they are right or wrong).

On the subject at hand, it is quite simple that you want to relate your prophetic failures to the failure of Jonah's prediction of the destruction of Nineveh, though the events are in entirely 2 differnet context under a complete different dimensions and states.

As hisblud said earlier, was Jonah grieve that his predictions failed, hence wish he shuold die? Did watchtower accept their failed predictions as their mistake? The latter rather choose to feign ignorance that they never made predictions, that they are not inspired prophets, that their members are over-zealous, thats Jonah also made failed predictions.

The above is a classic case of superios intelligence against the gullible followers who cant question what a more intelligent master (watchtower) tell him.

you admit that jonah made a false prophecy, and such felt bad that he wanted to die, unlike Hisblud that that was still battling with explicit evidence when it was clear that his case lack all the elements to even suggest warning, because it was very clear in a short quote "40 days nineveh will be overthown" jonah 3:4

what you termed as "two different cases here" is that jonah felt bad, when his prophecy failed, but the jw latter came out with excuses that they never aknowledged before

below is your comment;



quote author=arsenalwenger

As hisblud said earlier, was Jonah grieve that his predictions failed, hence wish he shuold die? Did watchtower accept their failed predictions as their mistake? The latter rather choose to feign ignorance that they never made predictions, that they are not inspired prophets, that their members are over-zealous, thats Jonah also made failed predictions.

The above is a classic case of superios intelligence against the gullible followers who cant question what a more intelligent master (watchtower) tell him.

im picking you-up here (at the bolded above) brother

from hisblud's own evidence far above(screenshut), there was a disclaimer contained from the onset, see the 1908 thing above, and read line 10, it states clearly that ...."we are not directly informed".... so it was not a latter excuse! as you want to pose it!

im i right?

BERNIMOORE: you admit that jonah made a false prophecy, and such felt bad that he wanted to die, unlike Hisblud that that was still battling with explicit evidence when it was clear that his case lack all the elements to even suggest warning, because it was very clear in a short quote "40 days nineveh will be overthown" jonah 3:4

what you termed as "two different cases here" is that jonah felt bad, when his prophecy failed, but the jw latter came out with excuses that they never aknowledged before

below is your comment;



quote author=arsenalwenger



im picking you-up here (at the bolded above) brother

from hisblud's own evidence far above(screenshut), there was a disclaimer contained from the onset, see the 1908 thing above, and read line 10, it states clearly that ...."we are not directly informed".... so it was not a latter excuse! as you want to pose it!

im i right?

You are cunny and not sincere. Ok JW is now putting her shoe in the place of Jonah for their failed prediction.

Jonah warned the people of Ninehveh of God's coming judgement, the people trembled, repented and asked God not to bring his wrath to pass. God listend to them and forgave them.

Now my question is this, did JW pray that their predictions should not come to pass as the peaple on nineveh did? Will the coming of christ be negotiable, through prayer, as the peaple of Nineveh did concerning the warning and prediction of Jonah? Will God change his mind postponed the date of armagedon after a prediction had been made by JW?

So if you try compare prophet Jonah with failed watchtower prophets you are wrong. You will agree with me that 1914, 1925, 1935, 1975 and 1914 where all prophesied as the time for the end of gentile and when God will take over the rulership of the earth from satan. Did that happen? You and i knw that it is false dates. So if all the dates prophesied are all false, what makes you think 1914 is not also false.

Did JW pray that God's rulership on earth should be postponed just as the peaple of Nineveh prayed that his judgemment should not come to pass? They do not pray that his kingdom should not come, but they were eagerly expecting it to fulfil and turned out to be false dates.

[quote author=arsenalwenger]

You are cunny and not sincere. Ok JW is now putting her shoe in the place of Jonah for their failed prediction.

im not a jw, im only giving you valid evidences that parrallel their case, as well as the assemblies of God on 1914 issue

Jonah warned the people of Ninehveh of God's coming judgement

you have just LIED no statement from jonah himself to ninevites shows warning, if you have jonahs own personal message he delivered to the ninevites "that contain warning, show me pls" im NOT reffering to what others might say, but his own direct message that he personally declared

Now my question is this, did JW pray that their predictions should not come to pass as the peaple on nineveh did?

did jonah himself pray that ...40 days should not come to pass?.......no he did nt, but eagerly waited until it passed and his prophecy Did not happen! can you show evidence of his recorded statements where he prayed that God should hold on? bring them on, but i doubt

Will the coming of christ be negotiable, through prayer, as the peaple of Nineveh did concerning the warning and prediction of Jonah? Will God change his mind postponed the date of armagedon after a prediction had been made by JW?

you question above shows that you dont read to understand opponents view, but all you are interested in is "scoffing" back to your question;

the coming of christ "can be delayed" and "negotiable" on condition of which is "the new converts who changed their bad ways" (i have treated this on page 3 and 4 of this thread.
read 2peter3


Habakkuk 2:2-3
GOD’S WORD Translation (GW)

2 Then the Lord answered me,
“Write the vision.
Make it clear on tablets
so that anyone can read it quickly.
3 The vision [b]will still happen at the appointed time[/b].
It hurries toward its goal.
It won’t be a lie.
If it’s delayed, wait for it.
It will certainly happen.
It won’t be late.

note the clause, prophecy of God can be delayed,or seem to slack......but true servant of God should wait for it.

[color=#000099]2 Peter 3:8-9

8 But, beloved, do not forget this one thing, that with the Lord one day is as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day. 9 The Lord is not slack concerning His promise, [b]as some count slackness, but is longsuffering toward us[/b], not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance.

So if you try compare prophet Jonah with failed watchtower prophets you are wrong

im may be wrong with your own MYOPIC VIEW, but with the evidenced that i have shown which you and hisblud had failed totally to adress, jonah's issue is same with russel 1914

. You will agree with me that 1914, 1925, 1935, 1975 and 1914 where all prophesied as the time for the end of gentile and when God will take over the rulership of the earth from satan. Did that happen? You and i knw that it is false dates.

i have not seen evidences to that respect, and the only evidence brought forward by hisblud in pg 4 was false! because the 1908 issue he quoted the screenshut had a "page" pg 228 but the changes alledged in 1915 on same issus of "thy kingdom come" was falsified and had NO PAGE!

You pretend not to see that fault in the page, and also pretend not to see that the jw added from the onset in 1908 evidence that hisblud provided they earlier say in line 10 of 1908 edition ...we are not Directly informed.....yet you falsely accuse then of later adding that as a latter cover up or feghning ignorance or using a latter excuse,

as you can see, all what you all base your talks are false and with no basis!

So if all the dates prophesied are all false, what makes you think 1914 is not also false

who is admitting false dates here? what we have is "delayed" and not "false" ok

the same thing with jonah, nineveh's destruction was delayed, nahum prophecied again on the same city, but both nahum and jonah never witnessed the destruction until some several decades later when God finally decides and did destroyed nineveh.

Are you taking the advantage of Gods delay to better your own personal relationship with God? you better thing well and take the advantage instead of occupying yourself with jesting and scoffing

i just seem to imagine why even animals listened to noah and escape the deluge, but addictive scoffers did not

and even jesus words that ..it will be easier for a camel to pass through the hole of a needle than rich man to enter into the kingdom of God

i cant imagine you and others spending whole lifetime on internet Not to know God, but to scoff

even at that your evidence was exposing you as not reading through and discover the flaws, just like someone who submit cv but ignorant of his own details in the cv

arsenalwenger: As i said earlier, the trinity doctrine must be debunked at all cost by the JW (even if they have to lie against the Bible to achiev that), so the escape route is to turn Jesus christ to an angel (against Heb 1:4-6) and the Holy spirit to a non-living thing or active force (as against Jesus' own teaching in John 16:7-15). And this is what an average JW teaches as bible truth, thats terrible!

I am very sure if WTS change the doctrine tomorow (as they have been doing) and tell you that the Holy spirit is no longer an active force you will flow along naturally. The implication of this robotic lifestyle is that you guys are not loyal to the bible but watchtower organization (you accept what they teach as truth whether they are right or wrong).

On the subject at hand, it is quite simple that you want to relate your prophetic failures to the failure of Jonah's prediction of the destruction of Nineveh, though the events are in entirely 2 differnet context under a complete different dimensions and states.

As hisblud said earlier, was Jonah grieve that his predictions failed, hence wish he shuold die? Did watchtower accept their failed predictions as their mistake? The latter rather choose to feign ignorance that they never made predictions, that they are not inspired prophets, that their members are over-zealous, thats Jonah also made failed predictions.

The above is a classic case of superios intelligence against the gullible followers who cant question what a more intelligent master (watchtower) tell him.

Dont even talk about the trinity doctrine....that is a doctrine that is as false as any doctrine can be...That doctrine has been debated and in dispute and disrepute as soon as it came up up after the death of the faithful apostles...it only became widely accepted because of political pressure.
If you stubbornly refuse to accept the fact that JW never predicted but only expected, then what is the purpose of having any further discussion on this.

rabzy:

Dont even talk about the trinity doctrine....that is a doctrine that is as false as any doctrine can be...That doctrine has been debated and in dispute and disrepute as soon as it came up up after the death of the faithful apostles...it only became widely accepted because of political pressure.
If you stubbornly refuse to accept the fact that JW never predicted but only expected, then what is the purpose of having any further discussion on this.

i took time to study their claims, and it was zero, but your people too are too easy to wind down, dont expect addicted jesters or scoffers to reason with facts, as you can see

[quote author=BERNIMOORE][/quote]The prophecy of Jonah was for the pple of Nineveh, they got the message, repented and God didnt bring his wrath to pass. Jw predicted that the generation that saw 1914 will not die off till armagedon. The JW message was for this contemporary generation and most JW was expecting it fulfilment (they wish it had happened) and it turns out false.

Any organization that predicted 1914 and still hold unto it till today, be it assemblies of God, JW, seventh-day adventist is a false organization, because it has been proven over and over that 1914 is false. Seventhday adventsit, whom JW copied most of their escathololical teachings, has discarded those predictions and moved on. Why did JW hold unto 1914 after it has been proven false?

You will agree with me that 1914 is not the only year JW prophesied for an important spiritual occurence, the JW have equally discarded all other years as false, even though some of you dont admit making false prediction.

I dont think it is ok to defend falshood at all cost, it is not injurios to admit mistakes and move on. As a matter of fact, watchtower believes that they are still doing research on the bible teachings, which means that some of their truth today might be false tomorrow. Watchtower history will proove me right here.

rabzy:
If you stubbornly refuse to accept the fact that JW never predicted but only expected, then what is the purpose of having any further discussion on this.

This is hillarios, JW never predicted but expected. Dont come with another dimension, wait till this new view is published in the next edition of your magazine for real authentication.

Please say something else.
You can access the old prediction and teachings of the JW using the link below. The link has attached pdf which you can access and reconcile with materials you have locally.
www.jehovah.net.au/classic-watchtower-publications

The prophecy of Jonah was for the pple of Nineveh, they got the message, repented and God didnt bring his wrath to pass

Asking you severally you fail to answer, did God ask jonah to include repentance in his prophecy "as a condition" that can make him change his mind? if yes show me the verse!

Jw predicted that the generation that saw 1914 will not die off till armagedon. The JW message was for this contemporary generation and most JW was expecting it fulfilment (they wish it had happened) and it turns out false

it wasnt false, it was delayed

an assignment for you to test your own knowledge, since you say the jw followers are gullible, as a smarter person, what will be your answer to what jesus said below…

Mathew 16:27-28

27"For the Son of Man is going to come in the glory of His Father with His angels, and WILL THEN REPAY EVERY MAN ACCORDING TO HIS DEEDS. 28"Truly I say to you, there are some of those who are standing here who will not taste death until they see the Son of Man coming in His kingdom."

unfortunately, all those people jesus was talking to are ALL dead! was jesus a liar? i need your own answer, pls dont jump or evade this very important question, im waiting

Any organization that predicted 1914 and still hold unto it till today, be it assemblies of God, JW, seventh-day adventist is a false organization, because it has been proven over and over that 1914 is false. Seventhday adventsit, whom JW copied most of their escathololical teachings, has discarded those predictions and moved on. Why did JW hold unto 1914 after it has been proven false?

i have not see any proof! and the one Hisblud brought the 1915 edition was falsified, and you have not come up with the "page" of "thy kingdom come" you relied on that the jw changed their earlier stand, isnt that funny?

I dont think it is ok to defend falshood at all cost, it is not injurios to admit mistakes and move on

you are yet to prove falsehood with "sound evidence" cant you get that? your claims are not tenable, but best regarded as "frivolous".

As a matter of fact, watchtower believes that they are still doing research on the bible teachings, which means that some of their truth today might be false tomorrow. Watchtower history will proove me right here

right from the onset they had always said it that they are not inspired! or directly informed! they tied this to paul predictions in 1 cor 8 that "if there are prophecies, they will cease"

so what we have now is "fufilment of prophecies already prophecied in the bible" can you see why your own story is always not in tune to the subject matter?

again your assignment; is jesus a liar? when he said this below;

mattew 16:27-28

27" For the Son of Man is going to come in the glory of His Father with His angels, and WILL THEN REPAY EVERY MAN ACCORDING TO HIS DEEDS. 28"Truly I say to you, there are some of those who are standing here who will not taste death until they see the Son of Man coming in His kingdom."

^^^ Jesus was seing them in their true reality as spirits and not bodies. Bodies die but spirit doesn't.
Remember apostle Paul compares sleep to death...

@BERNIMORE, as an active JW are you saying Jesus is a liar just like the watchtower society?

[quote author=Yooguyz]

Jesus was seing them in their true reality as spirits and not bodies. Bodies die but spirit doesn't.
Remember apostle Paul compares sleep to death...

do you understand what the verse was saying at all? you see what im talking about, most of you dont even read to understand, you have just made a mistake now,

lets read it again

mathew 16:28
28"Truly I say to you, there are some of those who are standing here who will not taste death until they see the Son of Man coming in His kingdom

lets break the verse

"some of those who are standing"
"will not taste death until they see the Son of Man"
"coming in His kingdom"

can you see what the verse was actually saying now, that some will not taste death at all "until they see the Son of Man coming in His kingdom"

now you, are making a case for Bodies die but spirit doesn't

youguys; Bodies die but spirit doesn't

lets assume that their bodies are dead and their spirits are waiting for the coming of the son of man, remember the verse says "will not taste death at all until they see the Son of Man" which means they are not seeing the son of man right now in whatever form, until he comes in his glory

which according to your analogy, it is when the son of man arrived then their spirit will taste death, which means spirit dies you failed badly!

if jesus was talking about spirit he does not need you to tell him, all those listening to him are all dead now!

@BERNIMORE, as an active JW are you saying Jesus is a liar just like the watchtower society?

im not saying that jesus is a liar, but i need some true explanations on the issue

im not a jehovahs witnesses, i have said it severally neither assemblies of God, i have them as friends and we discuss very deep in scriptures, so i dont know what you are saying when you said they are liars

you have failed to prove them wrong if you have been reading the thread 4,5 lately, the evidences that hisblud brought was a fake, because the 1908 issue of "thy kingdom come" has a page (pg 228) where quotes were lifted, but the 1915 issue was falsified and presented without a particular page, i thought that you will come up with the actual page of "1915 thy kingdom come" where they actually change what they said in 1908 issue

i need evidence not just verbal talk, ok?

back to the topic,if jesus was talking about spirit he does not need you to tell him, all those listening to him are all dead now! is he a liar? or false prophet?

arsenalwenger: As i said earlier, the trinity doctrine must be debunked at all cost by the JW (even if they have to lie against the Bible to achiev that), so the escape route is to turn Jesus christ to an angel (against Heb 1:4-6) and the Holy spirit to a non-living thing or active force (as against Jesus' own teaching in John 16:7-15). And this is what an average JW teaches as bible truth, thats terrible!

There is a reason we dont believe the trinity. We can discuss this if you wish in another thread. But I have to know whether you are sincere first.
the way you feel about this trinity as important is less than the way I view it as a heresy. But discussion will help us know who is on the right. Even if you want us to do it on 2go, better, cos I value sincerity than anything else. We dont want to deceive ourselves in this race.

I am very sure if WTS change the doctrine tomorow (as they have been doing) and tell you that the Holy spirit is no longer an active force you will flow along naturally. The implication of this robotic lifestyle is that you guys are not loyal to the bible but watchtower organization (you accept what they teach as truth whether they are right or wrong).

No, I dont accept what they teach whether it is right or wrong. Rather it will be good you say, I sometimes, make the same mistake as they do, or BETTER still, I see it that way until the spirit leads to a clearer understanding.

Their are things I dont understand even now. I keep studying to prove it to myself. this is because sometimes, it takes time for one to understand some teachings. When discussion shifts to that, I simply tell you that I am still studying it or call my brother to explain it to the person.

I will however, not allow one thing to disturb me as such. why? the majority of the truth I have confirmed in my personal study are found in this religion, apart from this religion, others are not not not even interested in the truth not to talk of teaching it. Imagine people, who will see they made mistake and change it, chai chai, what a humility!. This is the people I can respect what they say, knowing that they will change when they see a need to, not refusing change cos you proclaim your doctrines as infallible. no matter what, you remain there. What it means is that if I have a contrary opinion from my personal study in a religion that is infallible, I should pack my luggage and leave cos they can never never change (whether now or in the future) cos they make there doctrines infallible. To me, this is dangerous. And this witnesses are ready to prove it to you. they also have many books that you can use to confirm the truth to yourself. You can also ask question to the Gov Body, if you have a strong prove. I never see the like anywhere before.

Most importantly, they possess the identity of true Christians.

So, my request to you is: is there anything you observe is wrong biblically about there teachings? I will like to know.

On the subject at hand, it is quite simple that you want to relate your prophetic failures to the failure of Jonah's prediction of the destruction of Nineveh, though the events are in entirely 2 differnet context under a complete different dimensions and states.

As hisblud said earlier, was Jonah grieve that his predictions failed, hence wish he shuold die? Did watchtower accept their failed predictions as their mistake? The latter rather choose to feign ignorance that they never made predictions, that they are not inspired prophets, that their members are over-zealous, thats Jonah also made failed predictions.

The above is a classic case of superios intelligence against the gullible followers who cant question what a more intelligent master (watchtower) tell him.

About Jonah, scan well, you will see I have not said anything on that issue. I ve not used that as a prove, and have never said whether it is a good prove or not. I am only observing the logic on that point to see whether I will adopt it. I am yet to do that. check well. I can only defend that 1914 issue as a true date from scriptural chronology.

I have also believe that; that one has wrong expectation does not mean he lacks the spirit's leading. that they try to understand bible prophesies shows their trust that all predictions in the bible must come true. they should not live any scripture untouched as a good result is expected in this time of the end. compare Dan. 12:4. that their understanding was wrong doesn't make that scriptural prediction wrong, hence, they persist to decipher it.

As for the bold. I want to state that sincerity will do us much good dear. When they make mistake in doctrine, they admit it. please dont lie about this(unless you ve never seen it before).

secondly, it is honesty to admit that you are not inspired, if they were, then when they fell, it now becomes more dangerous to associate yourself with them. Though truth comes progressively. compare prov 4:8

it seems some people had ran out of gas! simple question, they cant answer, yet they call others gullible, Hisbluuuuuuud, arsenalwengerrrrr and yooguuuyz, im expecting this thread to hit page 50 with meaninful contribution, are you guys tired?

help yourself with these assignment, to prove true and false prophet, (im not saying jesus is false, but i want a better explanations than the jw and assemblies of God)

here we go;

mathew 16:28
28"Truly I say to you, there are some of those who are standing here who will not taste death until they see the Son of Man coming in His kingdom

lets break the verse

"some of those who are standing"
"will not taste death until they see the Son of Man"
"coming in His kingdom"

that some will not taste death at all "until they see the Son of Man coming in His kingdom"

BERNIMOORE: it seems some people had ran out of gas! simple question, they cant answer, yet they call others gullible, Hisbluuuuuuud, arsenalwengerrrrr and yooguuuyz, im expecting this thread to hit page 50 with meaninful contribution, are you guys tired?

help yourself with these assignment, to prove true and false prophet, (im not saying jesus is false, but i want a better explanations than the jw and assemblies of God)

here we go;

mathew 16:28
28"Truly I say to you, there are some of those who are standing here who will not taste death until they see the Son of Man coming in His kingdom

lets break the verse

"some of those who are standing"
"will not taste death until they see the Son of Man"
"coming in His kingdom"

that some will not taste death at all "until they see the Son of Man coming in His kingdom"

It makes no sense prolonging this matter.

Jesus' invisible return was not 1914 as being taught by JW. It is against bible teachings and against common sense.



Relating Jonah's experience with failed JW predictions is deceitful and can only be used to hoodwink the gullible into accepting watchtower's failed prediction as bible truth.


This is my humble submission and will not do me good going back and forth.

arsenalwenger: It makes no sense prolonging this matter.

Jesus' invisible return was not 1914 as being taught by JW. It is against bible teachings and against common sense.



Relating Jonah's experience with failed JW predictions is deceitful and can only be used to hoodwink the gullible into accepting watchtower's failed prediction as bible truth.


This is my humble submission and will not do me good going back and forth.

You presented no biblical reason of note or even common sense discussion on why Christ couldn't have been enthroned in 1914. The little point you made on secular history was rebuffed scripturally.

Funny cop out. No wonder your cohort praised the OP ( and you obviously) for having "avoided biblical discussion"!

One truth you said though is that discussing this further with you lot, with no demonstrated interest in searching the scriptures is a waste of valuable time.

arsenalwenger: The word of God is not dynamic or subject to changes when the light gets brighter. We are to increase in the knowledge of the word of God and not switching beliefs from one form to another.

Christains have a traditional belief system based on the word of God, among which is the trinity. The trinity will not make sense to a Jw as long as the Holy spirit is regarded as a non-living thing by JW. The doctrine will not make sense as long as the son is regarded as angel michael by JW, all in a cunning attempt to 'debunk' trinity at all cost (as against the bibble teaching).

So you are yet to fully understand how your organization operate.

hmm true talk. They have successfully failed to disprove that "how can God who is Spirit, have a Spirit"

Yooguyz:
i love the way the OP avoided biblical discussion with you guys.
This thread would have filled with torrents of watchtower quotes from narrow minded Jw's like you.


you've started to lie like your magazine.


i opened a thread on angel micheals identity but what do you guys do? You all ran away like cowards! How dare you criticize us.

oya all jw lets port to that thread yooguz opened and lets trash the other false doctrine of arch angel michael.

arsenalwenger: Laffing all through. Thats the danger of a wired brain, programmed to think robotically and not logically. The key words truth and knowledge has always been misused at the expense of common sense.

An organization made a prediction that says christ will return 1914, 1925, apostles with return in 1935, generation that saw 1914 will see armagadon before or at their 70 years of age, that is 1984. All this teachin were now considered mistakes except 1914. If the calculation that gave room to all those dates are now considered false by watchtower, my question remains why would the calculation that gave room to 1914 still valid?

I think truthislight has been seriosly brainwasheD to accept anything from JW.

abi oh