Gombs: At this point, am lost....in my own thread...

Wonderful

alexleo: Sometimes some of us christians think that God is our robot that we can manipulate anyhow. Yes faith works but faith doesnt mean that God should foolishly fall to your faith even when he is seeing that the faith you are exercising is not going to earn you any good. As much as we are exercising our faith in Christ let us also give room for "thine will be done". God is not a slowpoke. Jesus asked for the cup to be removed(typical of the flesh) but he quickly made room for God's will to be done. This flesh is so selfish and can never give better offer than God. If God in his wisdom feels its time to take me out of this world to come and be with him why should i feel he should keep me more? Since when did my little wisdom become much more than God's wisdom? Some of you are telling stories here. At the end of the day God will always have his way. " I will show mercy to whom i will show mercy". Thats God. If he doesnt want to show you mercy then you are wasting your time.

mbaemeka:

God always responds to faith. He responded to Hezekiahs faith even when what he demanded for was contrary to God's will for his life. That's the first thought you have to settle in your mind and stop relegating God's word to your experiences.

mbaemeka: .
For one to say thy will be done one must already know what that will

mbaemeka: .
is or else you are just faithless and will be tossed to and fro by the devil. Or how else do you explain why Paul healed a man who slept during his service falling from a tall building and dying? Why didn't Paul wonder if it was GOD'S WILL to have the man raised back to life? Why didn't he just concede that it was Gods will and leave the man dead? You see Christian maturity also includes knowing the mind of God at each point in time and this becomes known when we spend time 'koinonia-ing' with him by the Holy Spirit. That's why Jesus could sacrifice his fleshly desire to let the cup pass from him by accepting the will of God- a will he knew about. Same way with Peter and Paul and even John the Baptist. They all knew what God expected of them at each point in time (including how they were to die) and they accepted it exemplifying true Christian maturity..

mbaemeka: .
So the question for you and your ilk is: Do you know thw will of God for your life? If you do not know it you may accept an attack from the devil as one and die miserably even when it was against God's will for your life. Do you pray to be relieved of a situation and when it doesn't work you automatically assume it must be the will of God? What if you didn't have faith as much as you thought for the situation or what if what you thought was faith wasn't really faith?

The scriptures are clear about somethings that we can be sure of. For example, sicknesses and diseases do not come from God. God wants us well because we serve him better that way. Besides he let Jesus die for us. So when any christian is attacked by a disease he/she doesn't need to ask God whether it is his will- it can never be. What we need to do is exercise our God given rights to either pray to him to 'heal us' or command the healing to take place by using his name on the situation. That's why the apostles didn't ask God for his will before healing people. They simply acted on his word. So again spot the difference so you won't be bashed by the devil any how and erroneously think by some weird means that God had a hand in it.

So to know if it was GOD'S time to call you home at least even you agrees that you must hear from God first before assuming it was his will. Then we can debate on whether one should accept such a call or resist it. I believe that is part of what the OP has been alluding to. For example, we can agree that if God says to you- 'preach the gospel to 1000 men' and you have only done 200 so far when you hear a voice telling you to come home you would surely doubt that such a voice is from God, No?

Now you get the message.

alexleo: ^^^Oga you are always wise in your own eyes. Save your long story. God is not a robot. While you make your request to him still make room for his will to prevail. Some of you think you are wiser than God. For me, once I pray for the will of God to prevail it comes out best so I don't know what you are explaining again. Sometimes his will goes in line with my prayers or in contrast but at the end of the day I ll still see that its the best.

shdemidemi:

Now, you need to understand the Old Covenant the nation of Israel had with God. Self-righteousness was a valid principle on which to approach God under the law. Hezekiah's prayer would almost be ungodly in this present dispensation of grace, he was presenting self-justification, self-righteousness and his own merits.

Romans 3 declared to the church after the resurrection of Christ that none is good, not one. We are all in the cesspool of sin justified only on the back of the righteousness of the only one that is good.




On the contrary, no man knows the detailed will of God. All we know and stand firmly upon is the sure word that says -all things will work together for good to those who are called by God. The day any man knows exactly what tomorrow holds for him is the same day God seizes to be God all by Himself.



These men(apostles) knew nothing about God's holistic plan for their lives. They trusted God's word and thus they were sold out to what they were assigned to do. They never had any a preconceived plan to do miracles but latch on to what God was doing through them by the help of the Holy Spirit at that era of Pentecost(initiation of the church).



No man/no Christian knows God's will for their life like I said earlier, we can only soar with Him as His Spirit leads.

ayoku777: While it is true that christians suffer and indeed should suffer; even so we should be careful not to attribute every suffering and affliction that comes our way as being something we should go through. Some are attacks from the devil to truncate our destiny, while some are just natural consequences of the fall. Both of which we can and should exercise authority over as new creations in Christ.

Take Jesus for example, the template of our faith; even though He knew He came to suffer, shed His blood and give His life for us; He also knew when NOT TO DIE or just suffer for suffering sake.

There was a time they wanted cast Him down a cliff in Luke 4. Verse 30 said "But he passing through the midst of them went His way.". Another time after saying He and His father are one, the jews took up rocks to stone Him "but He escaped out of their hands. -John 10v39." Did He escape because He was afraid of death and suffering? Or He simply knew which suffering had nothing to do with the will of God

Also here; John 11v53-54 -Then from that day forth they took counsel together for to put him to death. Jesus therefore walked no more openly among the jew; but went thence unto a country near to the wilderness, into a city called Ephraim, and there continued with his disciples.

Did Jesus leave Jerusalem for Ephraim out of fear of persecution? Or He simply knew when not to suffer and what affliction had nothing to do with God's purpose?

What about when He told his disciples that they should cross over to the other side, and a storm met them on the way. They woke Jesus up. What did He do? He didn't encourage them to endure it. Or call it "afflictions of the righteous" or "hazards of mission work". No, He rebuked the storm, because it was a storm to be rebuked not endured. And He turned around and rebuked His disciples for their unbelif, becaus He expected them to have done the same in His name.

All these shows that knowing the will of God and being a matured christian also involves knowing when NOT TO SUFFER, knowing when to rebuke a storm and not endure it.

Jesus came to suffer, die and resurrect for us, even so, He didn't just let himself be pushed around, stoned at will or endure every storm in the name of "affliction of the righteous." Infact, if you study the scriptures, you will discover that the only time He let himself be man-handled was from gethsmane to golgotha. No one and nothing could harm Him before then. He was incharge, even of His own suffering. That is Jesus -our template.

Its not everything we suffer that Has anything to do with the will of God, or even something to help us grow spiritually. A lot of them are just natural challenges of life which we can exercise authority over as new creation. And some are even devil-orchestrated storms designed to prevent us from "crossing to the other side". Which God expects us to rebuke in His name, as He did -not endure it.

For many christians "thy will be done" has become just another fancy expression to describe throwing our hands in the air and submitting to whatever happens. We ought to know the will of God that we are asking to be done, otherwise it is submitting to FATE not to the WILL OF GOD.

In closing let me say this, christianity is not comfort or suffering, it is being filled and led of the spirit. Comfort is not carnality and suffering is not spirituality. Christian maturity is beseeching to behold the glory of Christ, and doing that entails both times to abase and times to abound.

mbaemeka:
As per Romans 3 please read it in context. Paul wasn't saying that no one is righteous- that will be a lie. In the context he was saying no one WAS righteous going by even the standard of the law and indeed no one could ever be. He was trying to set the floor ready to introduce righteousness by faith there..

mbaemeka: As per the will of God, there are many of us that know the will of God for our lives. Paul knew his, peter knew his, John knew his and so on. It is not new. If you fellowship with God enough he will speak to you and you will know. It takes nothing away from the scripturesfor what God reveals to you he always does it in line with his word. Remember Paul was told not to go to Bithynia to preach, he was also told that the ship will suffer wreck but no man's life will be lost. That was specific enough if you ask me.

mbaemeka: Scripture contradicts you totally on whether the apostles performed miracles because of any pentecost. The Holy Spirit came to replace Jesus as the second paraklete. He does exactly what Jesus did while on earth and he will never stop (I emphasize the never).

mbaemeka:
Also you said if God reveals his plans to a man he ceases to be God. That's another lie. God has been in the business of revealing his plans to his kids. He let Abraham know about his intention to wipe out Sodom and Gomorrah. He let Moses know about his plans to wipe out the stiff-necked Israelites. There's a scripture that says the things that God reveals to us are subject to change. If he doesnt reveal it to us then nobody can do anything about it. For example, no one knows when the 'rapture will occur'. That day only God knows.

mbaemeka:
Many christians know the will of God for their lives. Many of us. If you don't know yours then you better start listening because God is always speaking to us. Many just don't listen and then get surprised when they get into trouble.

mbaemeka:

If I had seen this before posting I would have simply requoted you. You have said everything I wanted to say.

God bless you.

shdemidemi:

Yes, he was introducing a way of righteousness asides the law/the flesh. He was intoducing a righteousness that can only be found in God by the acceptance of the gospel of Christ(death, burial, resurrection)

If you say Paul wasn't saying no one is righteous, My question to you would then be- who on the face of the earth is righteous?



Bro, you don't seem to understand what it means not to know God's will. For illustration sake, do you know how you will spend your entire day tomorrow? I don't think so. You can only make plans and speculations but only God knows and bring things into fruition.

Paul knew what God wanted Him to know, he had no complete picture of what God was doing. At a point he said he wasn't sure if he was going to be killed or not, but every time he finds himself alive he will continue the work of faith(preaching the gospel).

Same applies to any man in scripture, even Jesus told the disciples only God knows time and seasons.

The bible made it clear that we know not how to pray as we ought to, because we are limited by our flesh.
Romans 8
26 In the same way, the Spirit helps us in our weakness. We do not know what we ought to pray for, but the Spirit himself intercedes for us through wordless groans. 27 And he who searches our hearts knows the mind of the Spirit, because the Spirit intercedes for God’s people in accordance with the will of God.

Only the Spirit of God can pray according to God's will for He knows the complete will of God concerning us.


The bible never said the office of the Holy Spirit was to do what Jesus did- we were informed about the office and roles of the Holy Spirit by Christ Himself. Please check what they are.



Exactly, God revealing a titbit of Himself to man does not equate to the man knowing the complete will of God for their lives. God showed a part of Himself to the patriarchs and pioneers of the gospel does not mean they know the absolute will of God.

Today, God has revealed the part of Himself that was hidden from humanity through Christ/the word(not the bible) but His will concerning our daily living remains secret to man.


Wishful thinking is what you erroneously interpret as God's will.

Do you know when you will die, that is if you think you would eventually do at some point?

ayoku777: While it is true that christians suffer and indeed should suffer; even so we should be careful not to attribute every suffering and affliction that comes our way as being something we should go through. Some are attacks from the devil to truncate our destiny, while some are just natural consequences of the fall. Both of which we can and should exercise authority over as new creations in Christ.

Take Jesus for example, the template of our faith; even though He knew He came to suffer, shed His blood and give His life for us; He also knew when NOT TO DIE or just suffer for suffering sake.

There was a time they wanted cast Him down a cliff in Luke 4. Verse 30 said "But he passing through the midst of them went His way.". Another time after saying He and His father are one, the jews took up rocks to stone Him "but He escaped out of their hands. -John 10v39." Did He escape because He was afraid of death and suffering? Or He simply knew which suffering had nothing to do with the will of God

Also here; John 11v53-54 -Then from that day forth they took counsel together for to put him to death. Jesus therefore walked no more openly among the jew; but went thence unto a country near to the wilderness, into a city called Ephraim, and there continued with his disciples.

Did Jesus leave Jerusalem for Ephraim out of fear of persecution? Or He simply knew when not to suffer and what affliction had nothing to do with God's purpose?

What about when He told his disciples that they should cross over to the other side, and a storm met them on the way. They woke Jesus up. What did He do? He didn't encourage them to endure it. Or call it "afflictions of the righteous" or "hazards of mission work". No, He rebuked the storm, because it was a storm to be rebuked not endured. And He turned around and rebuked His disciples for their unbelif, becaus He expected them to have done the same in His name.

All these shows that knowing the will of God and being a matured christian also involves knowing when NOT TO SUFFER, knowing when to rebuke a storm and not endure it.

Jesus came to suffer, die and resurrect for us, even so, He didn't just let himself be pushed around, stoned at will or endure every storm in the name of "affliction of the righteous." Infact, if you study the scriptures, you will discover that the only time He let himself be man-handled was from gethsmane to golgotha. No one and nothing could harm Him before then. He was incharge, even of His own suffering. That is Jesus -our template.

Its not everything we suffer that Has anything to do with the will of God, or even something to help us grow spiritually. A lot of them are just natural challenges of life which we can exercise authority over as new creation. And some are even devil-orchestrated storms designed to prevent us from "crossing to the other side". Which God expects us to rebuke in His name, as He did -not endure it.

For many christians "thy will be done" has become just another fancy expression to describe throwing our hands in the air and submitting to whatever happens. We ought to know the will of God that we are asking to be done, otherwise it is submitting to FATE not to the WILL OF GOD.

In closing let me say this, christianity is not comfort or suffering, it is being filled and led of the spirit. Comfort is not carnality and suffering is not spirituality. Christian maturity is beseeching to behold the glory of Christ, and doing that entails both times to abase and times to abound.

trustman: On God’s Answer to Prayers
God DOES NOT ALWAYS respond positively (i.e. with a YES) to our prayer for something or our faith.
Paul prayed for the ‘thorn in the flesh’ to be removed. God responded; but it was with a NO! Paul pleaded with the Lord. HE DID NOT ADDRESS THE SITUATION (2 Cor. 12: 8, 9). Was Paul not matured enough to know the WILL of God without resorting to prayer? Why didn’t he rather address the situation if that is truly God’s system (God’s manner of approach for the believer).

On God’s WILL for the Christian
The Bible gives the general will of God for the Christian. Then, of course, God has his will for the individual believer. That WILL can include what may be regarded as ‘Negative’ such as suffering (including sickness and disease) and death.
In Revelation 2:10 Jesus Christ told those in the church in Smyrna “DO NOT BE AFRAID of what you are about to SUFFER”. So God’s will include permitting suffering in the life of the believer. Nowhere in the Bible is it stated that when a Christian is sick he should assume IT IS NOT God’s will Apostle James clearly showed us how we can approach prayer for the sick.

Is the Christian Omniscient?
There are things that, like death, are better left to the sovereignty of God. “the secret things belong to the LORD our God, but the things that are revealed belong to us and to our children forever, that we may DO ALL THE WORDS OF THIS LAW” (Deuteronomy 29:29).
Nowhere in the Bible are we told that the believer MUST necessarily KNOW or DECIDE the time of his death. It is God who determines the TIMING [/b]and [b]MANNER (sickness, accident; peaceful, violent – Acts 7:58, Hebrews 11) of death of the Christian. What matters is not this flesh. What matters is what counts for eternity; for the hereafter.
Stephen’s death in Acts 7 would be described by many today as ‘horrible’, ‘ghastly’, ‘gruesome’, or in such terms. But Jesus Christ literarily gave him a standing ovation. Why? Because through it all Stephen (like Job) glorified God. He kept the faith. He held his head high. Could Jesus Christ have saved Stephen? Yes. Did he save him? No. Why? Was it because Stephen did not ‘DECIDE’ to be saved? For those who may even think so (i.e. stand on the ground that he (Stephen decided NOT TO BE SAVED) how do you explain the standing ovation Jesus gave him?

The Sovereignty of God
When issues are left ONLY to man’s exercise of FAITH, the SOVEREIGNTY of God becomes relegated to the background. In other words, man’s actions are seen as being more important than God’s involvement in human affairs. The believer who thinks that God must accent to his will (or faith) is claiming to have greater wisdom and better plan than God. That is blasphemy! We DO NOT dictate to God. We go to him to ask for his grace. No Christian has the right to question the sovereignty of God.
No Christian ‘owns’ his life. He has been ‘bought with a price’ to ‘belong’ to another – God. He must therefore subject himself to and depend continually on his master.

On Exercise of Faith
Faith, for any issue or situation, should be in God or directed toward God and not ‘for’ or ‘to’ the situation. No Bible verse asks the Christian to have faith ‘for’ or ‘to’ a situation; it is always to be ‘in God’ or directed toward God.

Questions that need Consideration
• How come a number of foremost advocates for being in ‘control’ over situations have themselves (or their relatives) battled with sickness and disease and even death? What happened?
• Is the Christian free from issues that face other human? Look at this scenario: It rains continuously for days. The place where a Christian (or even a group of Christians) live, because of inadequate drainage or is low-lying gets flooded. Will he, simply because he is a Christian, be excluded from the others (unbelievers) in the neighborhood will face in having to battle with the flooding?

God’s positions on issues are clear from the Bible. What the Christian needs to do is to study to find them out and choose to align himself with them.

shdemidemi:

Now, you need to understand the Old Covenant the nation of Israel had with God. Self-righteousness was a valid principle on which to approach God under the law. Hezekiah's prayer would almost be ungodly in this present dispensation of grace, he was presenting self-justification, self-righteousness and his own merits.

Romans 3 declared to the church after the resurrection of Christ that none is good, not one. We are all in the cesspool of sin justified only on the back of the righteousness of the only one that is good.




On the contrary, no man knows the detailed will of God. All we know and stand firmly upon is the sure word that says -all things will work together for good to those who are called by God. The day any man knows exactly what tomorrow holds for him is the same day God seizes to be God all by Himself.



These men(apostles) knew nothing about God's holistic plan for their lives. They trusted God's word and thus they were sold out to what they were assigned to do. They never had any a preconceived plan to do miracles but latch on to what God was doing through them by the help of the Holy Spirit at that era of Pentecost(initiation of the church).



No man/no Christian knows God's will for their life like I said earlier, we can only soar with Him as His Spirit leads.

alexleo: ^^^Oga you are always wise in your own eyes. Save your long story. God is not a robot. While you make your request to him still make room for his will to prevail. Some of you think you are wiser than God. For me, once I pray for the will of God to prevail it comes out best so I don't know what you are explaining again. Sometimes his will goes in line with my prayers or in contrast but at the end of the day I ll still see that its the best.

ayoku777:

- part of quote above here snipped off here -

For many christians "thy will be done" has become just another fancy expression
to describe throwing our hands in the air and submitting to whatever happens.

We ought to know the will of God that we are asking to be done,
otherwise it is submitting to FATE not to the WILL OF GOD.

In closing let me say this, christianity is not comfort or suffering,
it is being filled and led of the spirit. Comfort is not carnality and suffering is not spirituality.

Christian maturity is beseeching to behold the glory of Christ,
and doing that entails both times to abase and times to abound.

- /nothing below snipped off here -

mbaemeka:

Is your God not the one that enters into a man and leaves the man and re-enters the man and leaves the man? Is your God not the one that takes note of women that use attachments and make up? Is that not your petty God? That is the robot we are talking about.

Jesus said the kingdom of God doesn't come through your careful observation. You don't say since God didn't respond to what I prayed for then it is against his will for my life. That's nonsense. Paul prayed to God to relieve him of his persecution and God RESPONDED saying my strength is made manifest in your weakness. The issue is that Paul heard God, he didn't assume like some faithless christians that anything that happens is the will of God.

As you may have noticed, I do not talk about the word of God like someone that is still guessing. I am sharing with you things that I put to work every day with tremendous results. If it makes me look wise to you it is because I am very wise. I prayed for it and I received it immediately. I didn't wonder if it was Gods will to make me dumb instead then conclude "may thy will be done o God". Trying to spiritualize unbelief like some of you have done to your own peril.

You may choose not to respond to me again or you may let God's will be done. What ever that means.

ayoku777: While it is true that christians suffer and indeed should suffer; even so we should be careful not to attribute every suffering and affliction that comes our way as being something we should go through. Some are attacks from the devil to truncate our destiny, while some are just natural consequences of the fall. Both of which we can and should exercise authority over as new creations in Christ.

Take Jesus for example, the template of our faith; even though He knew He came to suffer, shed His blood and give His life for us; He also knew when NOT TO DIE or just suffer for suffering sake.

There was a time they wanted cast Him down a cliff in Luke 4. Verse 30 said "But he passing through the midst of them went His way.". Another time after saying He and His father are one, the jews took up rocks to stone Him "but He escaped out of their hands. -John 10v39." Did He escape because He was afraid of death and suffering? Or He simply knew which suffering had nothing to do with the will of God

Also here; John 11v53-54 -Then from that day forth they took counsel together for to put him to death. Jesus therefore walked no more openly among the jew; but went thence unto a country near to the wilderness, into a city called Ephraim, and there continued with his disciples.

Did Jesus leave Jerusalem for Ephraim out of fear of persecution? Or He simply knew when not to suffer and what affliction had nothing to do with God's purpose?

What about when He told his disciples that they should cross over to the other side, and a storm met them on the way. They woke Jesus up. What did He do? He didn't encourage them to endure it. Or call it "afflictions of the righteous" or "hazards of mission work". No, He rebuked the storm, because it was a storm to be rebuked not endured. And He turned around and rebuked His disciples for their unbelif, becaus He expected them to have done the same in His name.

All these shows that knowing the will of God and being a matured christian also involves knowing when NOT TO SUFFER, knowing when to rebuke a storm and not endure it.

Jesus came to suffer, die and resurrect for us, even so, He didn't just let himself be pushed around, stoned at will or endure every storm in the name of "affliction of the righteous." Infact, if you study the scriptures, you will discover that the only time He let himself be man-handled was from gethsmane to golgotha. No one and nothing could harm Him before then. He was incharge, even of His own suffering. That is Jesus -our template.

Its not everything we suffer that Has anything to do with the will of God, or even something to help us grow spiritually. A lot of them are just natural challenges of life which we can exercise authority over as new creation. And some are even devil-orchestrated storms designed to prevent us from "crossing to the other side". Which God expects us to rebuke in His name, as He did -not endure it.

For many christians "thy will be done" has become just another fancy expression to describe throwing our hands in the air and submitting to whatever happens. We ought to know the will of God that we are asking to be done, otherwise it is submitting to FATE not to the WILL OF GOD.

In closing let me say this, christianity is not comfort or suffering, it is being filled and led of the spirit. Comfort is not carnality and suffering is not spirituality. Christian maturity is beseeching to behold the glory of Christ, and doing that entails both times to abase and times to abound.

Alwaystrue:

Weldone Ayoku. This resonates with me perfectly. Jesus is the template.
Christianity is being filled and led by the Spirit in Christ.
This is what happens when we know our purpose and assignment on earth.

Many things are wrong with your post. I can only highlight a few as I don't have so much time to burn.

1. You introduce James 5 as evidence that sickness can be the will of God. Does that make sense to you? If it's God's will, why is James encouraging people to violate God's will? And why would God go against His will by answering the prayer of faith to heal the sick as James 5 says He would?

2. God determines the timing and manner of everyone's death. Can you provide just ONE verse in the Bible where God says that? I'm not interested in your assumptions, just what the Bible says. The truth is that God gives SOME people a special assignment and within it determines when and how they die. For the rest, He lives their length of stay on earth to a number of factors: the faith of the individual, prayers of the saints, lifestyle choices (smoking, drinking etc), environment, etc. God Himself said we can do some things to prolong or shorten our life. He said to honor your parents so you can live long. If He timed me to live for 30 years and I honor my parents and still die at 30, He has not kept His Word. If His timing is that I'll live for 90 years, but I live recklessly, dishonor my parents, etc, I can be sure that His timing will prevail? Simply put, why did God tell His children they can lengthen their days when that means nothing as He has already set the time? Is God frivolous? Is God a liar?

It is God who determines the TIMING [/b]and [b]MANNER (sickness, accident; peaceful, violent – Acts 7:58, Hebrews 11) of death of the Christian.

The truth is that God gives SOME people a special assignment and within it determines when and how they die.

3. Faith leaders dying. None of them ever claimed they will never die. None of the ever claimed that people cannot succumb to sickness. All they keep on saying is that if you live by Faith, you'll get the results they're talking of. They are not immune from the principles they espouse. If they stop believing, it stops working for them. And you can't sit in your house and know if they kept believing or not. More importantly, using the principles they preached, and that you deride at every turn, they lived longer than anybody gave them a chance, even seeing their great grandchildren. Principles that work that far are to be celebrated, not denounced. And those of them alive continue to use it and are seeing the results. If they had followed your prescription, they'd have been long dead and buried.

BabaGnoni:

This is nothing but just a cliché - no offense intended Alwaystrue
OK, educate us, what is "...your purpose and assignment on earth..."

mbaemeka:

If I had seen this before posting I would have simply requoted you. You have said everything I wanted to say.

God bless you.

nlMediator:

Even in the time of Hezekiah, self-righteousness did not please God. So, I don't know where you're going with that point. It was Isaiah, long before Romans, that said all our righteousness are like filthy rags. God did not see what Hezekiah did then as wrong. Nor will He see it as wrong today.

nlMediator: ^^^

Nothing in your post refuted what I said.

1. Sickness as the will of God. Peter said we should suffer. Did he mention sickness there as what we'd suffer? No. He said we should follow in Jesus' steps. Did Jesus suffer sickness? No. Obviously, you can't find one scripture that says that sickness is the will of God. And you have no answer to the assertion that if sickness is the will of God, James would be encouraging us to go against God's will by calling on the elders to pray over the sick to be healed.

2. Timing of death. My quarrel is that your position is that God determines the time of everyone's death, while I said He only does for some people He's given a special assignment. You have no scripture to back your position.

3. So people believing God to live long as He promised them is boasting to you? Feel free to believe what you want but I don't see the boast there. It's God's will for us to live long and so there's no contradiction with James.

alexleo:

Unfortunately you wouldnt have said it the way he did. Your own would ve carried the usual "I too sabi" traits.(Sorry but thats just my view). He is a good teacher. Its a gift. I enjoyed reading him. Infact i read through his post again and again and i learned from his points.

alexleo:

I repeat again- mbaemeka you are always WISE IN YOUR OWN EYES. Twisting my words like you twist the bible will not work.

mbaemeka:

To the pure in heart all things are pure.

Whether you learnt from him or Nlmediator or Gombs I could careless. As long as you learnt something (of the truths in their posts) then my joy is fulfilled.