http://www.religioustolerance.org/chrdefnresp.htm

Christianity: introduction and definitions
So you disagree with our definition of "Christian!"



This essay was born out of frustration. We receive many Emails critical of our definition of "Christian." On 2007-DEC-20, coincidentally my 71st birthday, I received an extremely long letter on this topic. I spent over an hour answering it, only to find that the return Email address did not exist. So I decided to take excerpts out of that Email and expand them into this essay.


Definitions of "Christian" -- the current status: Many, perhaps most, Christians believe that their personal definition of "Christian" is the correct one.

We have listed over 40 different definitions of the term "Christian."

These definitions differ significantly from each other; many are mutually exclusive.

Each definition has been developed by one or more sincere, intelligent, devout, thoughtful person(s). Most or all of them sincerely believe that their definition is the true one.

According to the ARIS study in 2001, 76.5% (159 million) of American adults "said" that they are Christian.

Many people who consider themselves to be Christians do not recognize others as Christians.

Some definitions are quite inclusive and include approximately 160 million American adults -- over 70% of the population. Others are so restrictive that they might only include a few tens of thousands of adults (perhaps 0.02% of the total number of adults) in the U.S. as Christians.



The definition that we use:

We define "Christian" as including any individual or group who devoutly, thoughtfully, seriously, and prayerfully regards themselves to be Christian.

Included as Christians are members of the Roman Catholic church; the Eastern Orthodox churches, conservative, mainline, and liberal Christian faith groups; The church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (commonly called the Mormons); Jehovah's Witnesses, Unification Church, Christian Science, and a thousand or so other religious organizations that identify themselves as Christian. We also consider the early Jewish Christian movement led by James the brother of Jesus and Peter as Christian, even though their beliefs, practices, and expectations do not match modern-day denominations.

Also included are those who consider themselves to be Christian even though they do not identify themselves with any particular religious group.


Common negative comments we have received about our definition of Christian:

You have no academic qualifications to make definitions: Ours is a multi-faith group consisting of an Agnostic, Atheist, Christian, Wiccan and Zen Buddhist. None have a theological degree or diploma from a Bible college. We consider this an asset, because such an education would bias us in favor of one wing of Christianity, and against other wings. We look upon ourselves as reporters, not theologians. We feel that we have done a competent job in collecting a broad range of definitions created by others. We do not create any theological beliefs. We merely report what others believe.


Why not use the Bible's definition of "Christian?" The Bible is not clear on what a Christian is. Its text is ambiguous. If it were clear, then there would be a single, universally accepted definition in use among all Christian denominations. We have collected over 40 conflicting definitions. There are probably many more out there that we have missed.

Why not use God's definition of "Christian?" We could have the theists in our group attempt to pray to God to determine his definition. But we conducted a pilot study on assessing the will of God through prayer and found that it seems to be hopeless. Again, if people could assess the will of God through prayer, then there would be a single universally accepted definition of "Christian" among all Christian denominations. If prayer worked in this way, there would have been no schisms in Christendom over theology.


Your definition is wrong because it includes denomination XXXXX which is not Christian: This is one of the most common types of Emails that we receive, where "XXXXX" is most commonly R[b]oman Catholic, Mormon, Jehovah's Witnesses, United Church, and Progressive Christianity.[/b] The problem here is that if you went to a member of one of these groups, you would probably find that they regard themselves as Christians -- perhaps the only true Christians. They might well regard the letter writer as a non-Christian, sub-Christian. or quasi-Christian.

If you are getting lots of Emails about your definition of "Christian" perhaps you are wrong: As we indicated above, we have over 40 definitions of "Christian" in this section. They are all different. There is no right definition. So one can expect that no matter what definition we choose, most of our site visitors will disagree with it.

"Christian" means something; your definition doesn't mean anything: The term means a lot of different things to different people. There is no universally accepted definition. There is probably no definition that the majority of people who consider themselves to be Christians would accept.

You are arrogant to suggest that your definition is authoritative: We do not consider that our definition is authoritative. We merely consider it to be one of many available definitions -- the one that we chose for our web site.

A Christian is one who believes in Biblical Christianity: There is a problem with your definition, because "Biblical Christianity" has itself many meanings.[b] The Jewish Christians -- the only Christians prior to the arrival of Paul in the late 30's -- under the leadership of James the brother of Jesus, rejected the virgin birth, regarded Jesus as a prophet, and rejected his deity. Most liberal Christians today also reject the virgin birth, and doubt that most of the miracles described in the New Testament actually happened. [/b]Mainline and liberal theologians generally interpret the Gospels as including many sayings and activities of Jesus that never happened; they were added by the anonymous authors in order to promote their faith group's evolving theology. Even the Jehovah's Witnesses and Mormons believe that they "know" what Biblical Christianity is all about, although they differ greatly from each other and from other wings of Christianity.

So "biblical Christianity" is a meaningless term. One can only talk about Mormon biblical Christianity, Jehovah's Witness biblical Christianity, Roman Catholic biblical Christianity, progressive biblical Christianity, mainline biblical Christianity, evangelical biblical Christianity, fundamentalist biblical Christianity, and others.

http://www.religioustolerance.org/chr_defn3.htm

Which definition is correct?

This question assumes that there is one and only one correct definition of the term "Christian." However, depending upon your understanding of the nature of truth, many definitions may be "true" to various groups:
To conservative Protestants, a Christian is often defined according to their salvation status. Their definition is "true" to them, because it agrees with some of their foundational beliefs: that the Bible is inerrant, that salvation is by grace, and that one must be "born-again" to be saved and avoid eternal punishment in Hell.

To Roman Catholics, a Christian is often defined according to their baptism status. Their definition is "true" to them, because it agrees with their fundamental beliefs about the nature of sacrements, their understanding of the Bible, the declarations of many Church Councils, the statements of many popes, and their church's tradition.

To many in the very early Christian movement, a Christian was defined as a person who was baptized and proclaimed "Jesus is Lord." Their definition was "true" to them because it agreed with their understanding of their religious belief at a time when the Christian Scriptures (New Testament) had not yet been written and assembled.
And so on, with other faith groups.

Each group has their own definition of "Christian" which agrees with their own beliefs about the nature of Jesus, God, church tradition, written text, evolved theology, the cultures in which they are implanted, etc. There appears to be no way to compromise on a single definition that is acceptable to all. One apparently cannot call on a higher power to resolve the problem, because there seems to be no way to assess the will of God on such matters. If there were such a method, then different definitions would have been harmonized centuries ago. People would simply have prayed to God and asked Him to define what a Christian is. Then, a consensus would exist today on the true meaning of the word "Christian."

There is no consensus on what the "correct" definition of "Christian" is. There is only a near consensus within individual faith groups. Therefore questions like "Are you a Christian?" or "How many Christians are there in the U.S." are only meaningful:
Within a single denomination, or among a group of similarly-minded denominations.
In a public opinion poll where the definition of "Christian" is either clearly stated or left up to the subject to define.
The definition used on this web site:

We accept as Christian any individual or group who devoutly, thoughtfully, seriously, and prayerfully regards themselves to be Christian. That is, they honestly believe themselves to be a follower of Yeshua of Nazareth (a.k.a. Jesus Christ).

In North America there are over a thousand faith groups including the Roman Catholic church; the Eastern Orthodox churches, other conservative, mainline, liberal and progressive Christian faith groups; The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (the Mormons); Jehovah's Witnesses, the Unification Church, Christian Science, progressive Christians, and other religious organizations. They all identify themselves as Christian. In fact, many regard their group as the only "true" Christian church. Yet they, and their followers, have very different beliefs about the life, events, teachings, actions, sinlessness and expectations of Yeshua.

Also included as Christians are those who regard themselves as being followers of Jesus even though they do not affiliate themselves with any particular religious group. They appear to be growing in numbers.

We realize that we are defining Christians in terms of being Christian. As one person Emailed us, that is like defining a parrot as "something that has the characteristics of a parrot." But since there is no consensus on the definition of "Christian," we see no other choice. On the other hand, there is a general agreement about what a parrot -- or mountain, or car, or computer -- are.

who knows what the confused noetic is better go and sort yourself out before coming here to post rubbish

@noetic, it is obvious it's no use going all the way to convince you of facts. You ask for well researched chronological facts when you have been 'evading' those provided for you. I gave you simple facts that even a blind man would see yet you remain same old noetic- never getting the points in posts even when interpreted into simple and direct words. I would have said you scram out but I enjoy your rantings at times.Salam

@muhsin, trully the non muslim posters have made me a better muslim even though they meant otherwise.

squad1:

@ Noetic2
That was far after they got married.

Since u have decided not to ANSWER my question, and u have proved that u are very STUPID for 1)saying i am talking RUBBISH, 2) I lied (which u have refused to then say the truth since i was lying) 3.) Accusing me of making FALSELY claims (refer to the link http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rebecca) or better still google it to find her age when she got married. Moreover, i was only asking you about her age i was not asking about donkeys or chickens.

From what i said in my last post, Ow discussion ENDS HERE,

Its not by force, ur entitled to ur opinion (and im entitled to mine),

There is more to life than wasting my time on someone (sorry to say "STUPID" like you, (cos upon all ur EXTREME ANALYSIS, i cant believe u cant answer that simple question) How OLD was rebecca when she go married? Just give a number, SIMPLE!!!!

you are such a slowpoke.

I dont have to use google, thats what the bible says she did to abraham,s aide.
what does ur koran say? u PLAGIARIST and RIDICULOUS LIAR.

ronkeenuf:

@noetic, it is obvious it's no use going all the way to convince you of facts. You ask for well researched chronological facts when you have been 'evading' those provided for you. I gave you simple facts that even a blind man would see yet you remain same old noetic- never getting the points in posts even when interpreted into simple and direct words. I would have said you scram out but I enjoy your rantings at times.Salam

@muhsin, trully the non muslim posters have made me a better muslim even though they meant otherwise.

what fact did post in all the ridiculous and EVASIVE rants u have posted so far?
u failed to address the post and came here to troll for allah and mohammed on the assumption that others are gullible. what a slowpoke.

ronkeenuf:

@muhsin, trully the non muslim posters have made me a better muslim even though they meant otherwise.

AlhamduliLlah. May the Lord of Muhammad (pbuh), the Lord of Jesus (pbuh) bless and guide us, ameen.

Muhsin

Im not here to call u names, but give me her age, SIMPLE!!!! (just to prove ur not STUPID)
and why do u have Goosebumps on your face

O boy, TRY (i.e if u will ever) to get a life by doing/saying/posting something meaningful and educative.

Opo nu ara eee, anu en semi,

i intended to post this some years back:

ah,the never ending attempts by Christians to rehash old issues.It seems there isn´t an original bone in any of you.These are other famous slanders posted by the church against Muhammed(SAW) from as far back as the Middle Ages. From time immermorial, the only way christianity has spread is by slandering other religions and belief systems. not suprising going by the glaring contradictions and schisms in the religion of love.




But I digress.

Aisha was referred to as Prophet Muhammed´s favorite.A pedophile is a man sexually attracted to Children, IF as you so often Claim, Muhammed was a pedophile, he would have tired of Aisha as she matured. Furthermore, there is no evidence of any other children ´seduced´/ raped' by Prophet M'ohd. noetic, you should know that Pedophiles are serial perverts in nature (just look at the records of your pederast  priests-did they stop at molesting only one child each?    )

another interesting fact I recently came across - Mary was 14 when she gave birth to jesus(most of my facts are gleaned from secondary , non religious sources, i have no interest in reading your man made book of serial mistranslations).as you know, at the time she was suspected of being promiscuos.Joseph was Bleep  years when he married her. no one seemed to think that strange in that time.No one, apparently thought it strange that a 13/14 year old could be pregnant.no one suspectd that she´d been raped or molested. If a 14 year old was pregnant today, it´d be all about VVF, rape, etc. but the surounding facts about Mary indicate hat it was not strange in their time for girls to give birth at 14, or marry men  XX years older that them. abi the christian God imposes children on the  immature  .

the following are several hadiths on Aisha:

Adu-Dawood(124)
Narrated Aisha, Ummul Mu'minin

Aisha, Ummul Mu'minin"/>

Khallas al-Hujari reported: Aisha said: I and the Apostle of Allah (peace be upon him)
used to pass night in one (piece of) cloth (on me) while I menstruated profusely. If anything
from me (i.e. blood) smeared him (i.e. his body), he would wash that spot and would not
exceed it (in washing), then he would offer prayer with it.


Adu-Dawood(125)
Narrated Aisha, Ummul Mu'minin

Aisha, Ummul Mu'minin"/>

Umarah ibn Ghurab said that his paternal aunt narrated to him that she asked Aisha:
What if one of us menstruates and she and her husband have no bed except one? She
replied: I relate to you what the Apostle of Allah (peace be upon him) had done. One night
he entered (upon me) while I was menstruating. He went to the place of his prayer, that is,
to the place of prayer reserved (for this purpose) in his house. He did not return until I felt
asleep heavily, and he felt pain from cold. And he said: Come near me. I said: I am
menstruating. He said: Uncover your thighs. I, therefore, uncovered both of my thighs. Then
he put his cheek and chest on my thighs and I lent upon he until he became warm and
slept.

Al-Bukhari(1.293)

Narrated Al Qasim

'Aisha said, "We set out with the sole intention of performing Hajj and when we reached
Sarif, (a place six miles from Mecca) I got my menses. Allah's Apostle came to me while I
was weeping. He said 'What is the matter with you? Have you got your menses?' I replied,
'Yes.' He said, 'This is a thing which Allah has ordained for the daughters of Adam. So do
what all the pilgrims do with the exception of the Tawaf (Circumambulation) round the
Ka'ba.' " 'Aisha added, "Allah's Apostle sacrificed cows on behalf of his wives."


Al-Bukhari(3.348)
Narrated Aisha

Aisha"/>

Rarely did the Prophet fail to visit Abu Bakr's house everyday, either in the morning or in the
evening. When the permission for migration to Medina was granted, all of a sudden the
Prophet came to us at noon and Abu Bakr was informed, who said, "Certainly the Prophet
has come for some urgent matter." The Prophet said to Abu Bakr, when the latter entered,
"Let nobody stay in your home." Abu Bakr said, "O Allah's Apostle! There are only my two
daughters (namely 'Aisha and Asma') present." The Prophet said, "I feel (am informed)
that I have been granted the permission for migration." Abu Bakr said, "I will accompany
you, O Allah's Apostle!" The Prophet said, "You will accompany me." Abu Bakr then said "O
Allah's Apostle! I have two she-camels I have prepared specially for migration, so I offer
you one of them." The Prophet said, "I have accepted it on the condition that I will pay its price."

XXI doubt if any of you study anything about Islam beyond prophet of doom.com, bu the above indicates that before the emigration to medina, Muhammed had not married AishaXX

Al-Bukhari(5.236)
Narrated Hishams father

Khadija died three years before the Prophet departed to Medina. He stayed there for two
years or so and then he married 'Aisha when she was a girl of six years of age, and he
consumed that marriage when she was nine years old.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muhammad_in_Medina

Hijra to Medina
Main articles: Hijra (Islam) and Muhammad in Medina

A delegation from Medina, consisting of the representatives of the twelve important clans of Medina, invited Muhammad as a neutral outsider to Medina to serve as the chief arbitrator for the entire community.[1][2] There was fighting in Yathrib mainly involving its Arab and Jewish inhabitants for around a hundred years before 620.[1] The recurring slaughters and disagreements over the resulting claims, especially after the battle of Bu'ath in which all the clans were involved, made it obvious to them that the tribal conceptions of blood-feud and an eye for an eye were no longer workable unless there was one man with authority to adjudicate in disputed cases.[1] The delegation from Medina pledged themselves and their fellow-citizens to accept Muhammad into their community and physically protect him as one of themselves.[3]

Muhammad instructed his followers to emigrate to Medina until virtually all of his followers had left Mecca. Being alarmed at the departure of Muslims, according to the tradition, the Meccans plotted to assassinate him. With the help of Ali, however, he fooled the Meccans who were watching him, and secretly slipped away from the town.[4] By 622, Muhammad had emigrated to Medina, then known as Yathrib, a large agricultural oasis.[3] Following the emigration, the Meccans seized the properties of the Muslim emigrants in Mecca.[5]

Wikisource has original text related to this article:
Medina Charter

Among the things Muhammad did in order to settle down the longstanding grievances among the tribes of Medina was drafting a document known as the Constitution of Medina (date debated), "establishing a kind of alliance or federation" among the eight Medinan tribes and Muslim emigrants from Mecca, which specified the rights and duties of all citizens and the relationship of the different communities in Medina (including that of the Muslim community to other communities specifically the Jews and other "Peoples of the Book".[1][2] The community defined in the Constitution of Medina, umma, had a religious outlook but was also shaped by the practical considerations and substantially preserved the legal forms of the old Arab tribes.[3] Muhammad also adopted some features of the Jewish worship and customs such as fasting on the Yom Kippur day. According to Alford Welch, the Jewish practice of having three daily prayer rituals appears to have been a factor in the introduction of the Islamic midday prayer (previously Muhammad was keeping the morning and evening prayers). Welch thinks that Muhammad's adoption of facing north towards Jerusalem when performing the daily prayers (qibla) however need not to necessarily be a borrowing from the Jews as the reports about the direction of prayer before migration to Medina are contradictory and further this direction of prayer was also practiced among other groups in Arabia.

The first group of pagan converts to Islam in Medina were the clans who had not produced great leaders for themselves but had suffered from warlike leaders from other clans. This was followed by the general acceptance of Islam by the pagan population of Medina, apart from some exception. This was according to Ibn Ishaq influenced by the conversion of Sa'd ibn Muadh, one of the prominent leaders in Medina to Islam.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muhammad

excerpts

Conquest of Mecca
Main articles: Conquest of Mecca and Muhammad after the conquest of Mecca

The Kaaba in Mecca held a major economic and religious role for the area. It became the Muslim Qibla (prayer direction).

An artist's 16th-century depiction of Muhammad and his companions advancing on Mecca. The angels Gabriel, Michael, Israfil and Azrail, are also in the painting.

Muhammad prohibits intercalary months during the Farewell Pilgrimage. 17th century Ottoman copy of a 14th century (Ilkhanate) manuscript (Edinburgh codex). Illustration of Abū Rayhān al-Bīrūnī's The Remaining Signs of Past Centuries.

The Mosque of the Prophet (Al-Masjid al-Nabawi) is Islam's second most sacred site. The green dome in the background stands above Muhammad's tomb.

The truce of Hudaybiyya had been enforced for two years.[125][126] The tribe of Banu Khuza'a had good relations with Muhammad, whereas their enemies, the Banu Bakr, had an alliance with the Meccans.[125][126] A clan of the Bakr made a night raid against the Khuz'aah, killing a few of them.[125][126] The Meccans helped the Banu Bakr with weapons and, according to some sources, a few Meccans also took part in the fighting.[125] After this event, Muhammad sent a message to Mecca with three conditions, asking them to accept one of them. These were that either the Meccans paid blood money for those slain among the Khuza'ah tribe; or, that they should disavow themselves of the Banu Bakr; or, that they should declare the truce of Hudaybiyya null.[127]

The Meccans replied that they would accept only the last condition.[127] However, soon they realized their mistake and sent Abu Sufyan to renew the Hudaybiyya treaty, but now his request was declined by Muhammad.

Muhammad began to prepare for a campaign.[128] In 630, Muhammad marched on Mecca with an enormous force, said to number more than ten thousand men. With minimal casualties, Muhammad took control of Mecca.[129] He declared an amnesty for past offences, except for ten men and women who had mocked and ridiculed him in songs and verses. Some of these were later pardoned.[130] Most Meccans converted to Islam and Muhammad subsequently destroyed all the statues of Arabian gods in and around the Kaaba.[131][132] The Qur'an discusses the conquest of Mecca

prophet Muhammed was in Medina for eight year from 622 to 630

Khadija died three years before the Prophet departed to Medina. He stayed there for two
years or so and then he married 'Aisha when she was a girl of six years of age, and he
consumed that marriage when she was nine years old.

based on this, aisha was nine years old by 3 years into Prophet Muhammed (PBUH)'s  stay in medina. she would have been 14 by the time they left medina



so what age was she when the records of menstruation came about? so unless she started menustrating at the very end of their yeras in median, she was sexually mature during those yeras.

during the time in medina, aisha was accused of  adultery. hmm, what the implication of that? abi everyone else was into girls under 14 years of age?



also:

http://www.newworldencyclopedia.org/entry/Aisha#Indirect_evidence_of_older_age

Indirect evidence of older age
According to Ibn Hisham's recension of Ibn Ishaq's (d. 768) biography of Prophet Muhammad, the Sirat Rashul Allah, the earliest surviving biography of Muhammad, Aisha accepted Islam before Umar ibn al-Khattab. If true, then Aisha accepted Islam during its infancy. She could not have been less than 14 years in 1 A.H.—the time she got married. Sira, Ibn Hisham, Vol. 1, 227
Tabari reports that when Abu Bakr planned on migrating to Ethiopia (eight years before Hijrah), he went to Mut`am - with whose son Aisha was engaged at that time - and asked him to take Aisha as his son's wife. Mut`am refused because Abu Bakr had converted to Islam. If Aisha was only six years old at the time of her betrothal to Muhammad, she could not have been born at the time Abu Bakr decided on migrating to Ethiopia. Tehqiq e umar e Siddiqah e Ka'inat, Habib ur Rahman Kandhalwi, 38
Tabari in his treatise on Islamic history reports that Abu Bakr had four children and all four were born during the Jahiliyyah - the pre Islamic period. If Aisha was born in the period of Jahiliyyah, she could not have been less than 14 years in 1 A.H. Tarikh al-umam wa al-mamloo'k, Al-Tabari, Vol. 4, 50
According to Ibn Hajar, Fatima was five years older than Aisha. Fatima is reported to have been born when Muhammad was 35 years old. Muhammad migrated to Medina when he was 52, making Aisha 14 years old in 1 A.H. Tamyeez al-Sahaabah, Ibn Hajar al-Asqalaniy, Vol. 4, 377

Note: Muslim tradition generally says that Aisha was six years old when married to Muhammad, and that this marriage took place in 1 A.H. All of the above arguments are based on the hypothesis that —as reported by the original sources —the age at which Aisha was married is wrong, while the time at which she married (in the same sources) is correct.

does any of the bove refute the fact that mohammed had sexual relations with a 9 year old girl?

@Oyb: Salaamualeykum wa Rahamatullahi Taala wa barakatuh. I copied for my own personal use what you have written up. Maybe I will use it on a private email to $Osisi. I am sure she will read this above on this forum, in time. May Allah Almighty rewards you.

noetic2:

does any of the bove refute the fact that mohammed had sexual relations with a 9 year old girl?

noetic, i would have expected you to refute what i posted.

please also tell me, considering the fact that mary was 14 years when she gave birth to Jesus, what does that make his father in heaven? how could your god be so cruel as to force motherhood on an immature child?

and please do tell, how old was joseph when he married mary? estiamtes range from 35 to 90

and no one there found it strange. anyway, what should i expect, christianity has always been a religion that modifies itself according to cultural norm. thats why you guys have your gay issues. your leaders recognize that the er yanshmen's profile is rising, and they are acting accordingly

@ Oyb (Salam alaekum) I neva knew ur a muslim, i read most of ur posts on nairaland

On this noetic2 of a guy, please don't bother urself cos d guy is so DUMB to reason, he already has a wrong mindset and he is not ready to examine other views. I will just advise u not to waste your time.

Barka Jummuah

squad1:

@ Oyb (Salam alaekum) I neva knew ur a muslim, i read most of ur posts on nairaland

On this noetic2 of a guy, please don't bother urself cos d guy is so DUMB to reason, he already has a wrong mindset and he is not ready to examine other views. I will just advise u not to waste your time.

Barka Jummuah

Another brainless imbecilic troll of allah. . . .Go get a brain, , . . forsaken slowpoke.

oyb:

noetic, i would have expected you to refute what i posted.

please also tell me, considering the fact that mary was 14 years when she gave birth to Jesus, what does that make his father in heaven? how could your god be so cruel as to force motherhood on an immature child?

and please do tell, how old was joseph when he married mary? estiamtes range from 35 to 90

and no one there found it strange. anyway, what should i expect, christianity has always been a religion that modifies itself according to cultural norm. thats why you guys have your gay issues. your leaders recognize that the er yanshmen's profile is rising, and they are acting accordingly

u know that I am allergic to bullshit. are u trying to refute what the pioneer scholars of islam wrote in ur haddiths?
why are u trying to change the words of allah in ur haddith? isnt this dishonesty?

noetics god is a pedophile iya iya o
gets it on with 14 year olds iya iya o
and marries them off to 40 year olds iya iya o


when retards like noetic whose life is based on copy and psater are cahhlenged, they resort to insults to hide their shame.

@ Noetic2

As long as u don't answer my question(s) to me, ur DUMB (and i believe thats how u will remain for a very very long time)!!!! upon all ur so called "Extreme Analysis" u can't come up with an answer?

Ode, oponu, tie ti baje toba mo!!!!

oyb:

noetics god is a pedophile iya iya o
gets it on with 14 year olds iya iya o
and marries them off to 40 year olds iya iya o


when retards like noetic whose life is based on copy and psater are cahhlenged, they resort to insults to hide their shame.

is this what mohammed's CRIMES turned u to?

squad1:

@ Noetic2

As long as u don't answer my question(s) to me, ur DUMB (and i believe thats how u will remain for a very very long time)!!!! upon all ur so called "Extreme Analysis" u can't come up with an answer?

Ode, oponu, tie ti baje toba mo!!!!

what is this IDIOT saying?

I wish I could help you, noetic2.

muhsin:

I wish I could help you, noetic2.

why are u a muslim?

I have answered this on another thread. Or you only read yours?

muhsin:

I have answered this on another thread. Or you only read yours?

was that an answer?

Sincerely speaking, Christianity is wholly false. And pack that Atheism stuff aside, for I know NO same humanbeing can claim himself an atheist. Alhamdulillah.

I disbelief in Christianity and belief in Islam when I, ESPECIALLY, look at that Trinity obscurity and dogmatism. It's boldly and numerously said therein the Bible that the Lord?God is one, but they claim that he's three. I wonder it's in algebraic or in ordinary mathematics that 1+1+1=1. This rationally, intelligently and reasonably sound completely absurd and even thoughtless. Contrary to this it's said:

Old Testament:

1-Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God is one Lord. (Deuteronomy 6: 4)

2-Has not the One God made and sustained for us the spirit of life?(Malachi 2: 15)

3-I am the first and I am the last; besides Me there is no god. Who is like Me? (Isaiah 44: 6)

4-And many other verses.

New Testament:

1-One came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life? And he (Jesus) said unto him, Why callest thou me good? There is none good but one, that is, God.(Matthew 19: 16-17, in Kings James Version)

2-Now this is life eternal, that they know you, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom you have sent.(John 17: 3)

3-Hear O Israel: The Lord our God is One Lord. (Mark 12: 29)

4-And many other verses

You see? Why then would they say there are three God,i.e. god the father, god the son and god the holy spirit?

Qur'an, on this issue, states (in corroboration of these quoted verses ):

1-Say: He is Allah, the One; Allah, the Eternal, Absolute; He begets not, nor is He begotten; and there is none like unto Him. (112: 1-4)

2-There is no god but I; so worship Me. (21: 25)

3-Can there be another god besides Allah (God)? High is Allah above what they associate with Him.(27: 63)

Indeed, this message concerning the Oneness of God (i.e., Tawheed in Arabic) is the essential theme of the Qur’an. Why should I take Qur'an, then?

After Trinity, another issue in relation to it is the calling of all the Prophet to worship none but Allah. For example, when Moses (p.b.u.h) was asked about the first commandment in your Bible. He said in Mark 12:28-29 and said the Lord is One.

Noah (p.b.u.h) said in Qur'an 33:23 that God is One.

Prophet Hood (p.b.u.h) in Qur'an 7:59 said the same.

Salih (p.b.u.h) in Qur'an 7:65 also said the same.

Shu'aib (p.b.u.h) in the same vein uttered the same in Qur'an 7:73.

And all others said. Therefore, Muhammad (p.b.u.h)'s message is BUT true. Allah says unto him: "And We sent no messenger before you but commended him to inform his people that there is no true God except I; therefore worship Me alone. (Qur'an 21:25).

Moreover, I don't at all believe that Jesus was the son of God. This may come up next time. Now there are loads to do on the net.

Thanks for your understanding. May the Lord of Muhammad (p.b.u.h), the Lord of Jesus (p.b.u.h), our Lord--Allah, the Exalted, guide us all, ameen.

Muhsin

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When next I come, I shall continue.

no one asked "why u are not a christian?" the question was why are u a muslim. . . . .it should have little or nothing to do with christianity.

noetic2
London
Posts: 855

Online

 Re: Why I Am Not A Muslim
« #97 on: June 28, 2009, 10:34 PM »  

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what a shame . . . .  .no one could state why they are not a muslim.


why worship allah when u dont know him? why emulate mohammed when u dont condone his inhuman atrocities?

why EXACTLY are u a muslim?

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knowledge is profitable

This is what was said by he same people who are saying that the Muslims are confused! Not that they are saying that it is shameful that "no one can say why they are not Muslim!" Would muslim be the one who should be ashamed y the written statement, above?

You see, Allah reveals the inner feeling, the truth about a person when He wills it for it to be known.

Am not here to argue about this. I am only making observation(s).

what are u talking about? check the post again

Who? Me?

not u. I was talking to olabs.

@ muhsin

I already replied u in post 148

OK.

I'm only to worship that ONE LORD/GOD talks there. Thats the logic.

LET EVERYONE ON NAIRALAND CHECK OUT POST #97, dated June 28, 2009 at 10.34 PM. THE TRUTH ABOUT THAT POST SHOLUD BE KNOWN.

Any link, Olabs? Thanks

@Muhsin: As Salaamualeykum wa Rahmatullahi Taala wa Barakatuh. My brother the link is actually this thread; Why am I not a Muslim.

This guy thinks he is smart. Allah is Wiser. HE allows him to increase in arrogance, until he bacame careless that his finger just go anywhere! Even he posted it, and never protested its content. None of his "comrades" saw it. I saw it the moment he posted it. Allah did things the Best; I was unhappy with this guy, so I did not even respond and call him on his cofusion!

Its been about a week now that he made this post, and neither he nor Davidyland and company ever noticed it. Somehow, my heart lost all the dislikes for him because he couldnt be more than a younger brother to me; if not a son.

It is his continued arrogance that made me go back to PRESENT his own statement to convict himself! Allah inspired my heart to expose this young man.

Allah never perishes a people until He raised arrogance in their heart. They will increase in arrogance until they become complacent and make mistakes. It will be the time of their destuctions. May Allah save us from destruction.


I hope he will see wisdom in his mistake and hopefully before hlong ask himself; Who is Allah and what is Islam and who is that man Muhammad (AS)?

muhsin:

OK.

I'm only to worship that ONE LORD/GOD talks there. Thats the logic.

thats not enough reason why u are a muslim. please give a meaningful meaning to explain why EXACTLY u are a muslim.

olabowale:

@Muhsin: As Salaamualeykum wa Rahmatullahi Taala wa Barakatuh. My brother the link is actually this thread; Why am I not a Muslim.

This guy thinks he is smart. Allah is Wiser. HE allows him to increase in arrogance, until he bacame careless that his finger just go anywhere! Even he posted it, and never protested its content. None of his "comrades" saw it. I saw it the moment he posted it. Allah did things the Best; I was unhappy with this guy, so I did not even respond and call him on his cofusion!

Its been about a week now that he made this post, and neither he nor Davidyland and company ever noticed it. Somehow, my heart lost all the dislikes for him because he couldnt be more than a younger brother to me; if not a son.

It is his continued arrogance that made me go back to PRESENT his own statement to convict himself! Allah inspired my heart to expose this young man.

Allah never perishes a people until He raised arrogance in their heart. They will increase in arrogance until they become complacent and make mistakes. It will be the time of their destuctions. May Allah save us from destruction.


I hope he will see wisdom in his mistake and hopefully before hlong ask himself; Who is Allah and what is Islam and who is that man Muhammad (AS)?

Now I am enjoying this.

@ olabs

u need to post the link to that post for all to see the contents u claimed to have been from allah's heart.

Anyway it also has absolutely nothing to do with the topic.

Don't be simpleton, noetic2.