The Asymmetric Nature Of The Christian Sin Economy - Religion (8) - Nairaland
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| Re: The Asymmetric Nature Of The Christian Sin Economy by Nobody: 2:01pm On Nov 03, 2016 |
shadeyinka: Of course An insane mad man can't be charged in the Animal kingdom they also have rule this animals are not "mindless" meaning they are not mad! You do good you get rewarded you don't do good you don't get rewarded that's how it workes in the animal kingdom |
| Re: The Asymmetric Nature Of The Christian Sin Economy by shadeyinka(m): 2:03pm On Nov 03, 2016 |
raphieMontella: And I think I addressed it. Its not about condemnation, its about the consequence of sin! shadeyinka: ONLY IF A SOLUTION is found! It makes sense my Friend even if you dont like it. Its still a choice you have to make to be free from the consequence of sin or not! |
| Re: The Asymmetric Nature Of The Christian Sin Economy by shadeyinka(m): 2:07pm On Nov 03, 2016 |
Pastafarians: Your problem I think is desire to be free as air from the consequence of your actions. This you will have if and only if you were not created. However, if perchance you are created, I pity your advocates! 1 Like |
| Re: The Asymmetric Nature Of The Christian Sin Economy by LaClicKLaBenDin(m): 2:17pm On Nov 03, 2016 |
raphieMontella: 1. I already pointed out to you why salvation requires action (faith). Jesus dying for our sin was a ransom paid for our lives and for that ransom to come into effect, one has to meet the only condition, which is faith in Christ. Now is that difficult? 2. You can't inherit salvation from your parents, because salvation is personal, Jesus' death (salvation) only gets activated when you believe. Like I said earlier, if someone who didn't have to, pays a ransom for your life, and requires you to love him in exchange for what he has done, is it too much to ask? |
| Re: The Asymmetric Nature Of The Christian Sin Economy by Nobody: 2:20pm On Nov 03, 2016 |
shadeyinka:of course i want to be free that's why am going up and down killing who ever i see without thinking about the consequences Matter and Energy can't be created I wasn't Created bro |
| Re: The Asymmetric Nature Of The Christian Sin Economy by shadeyinka(m): 2:36pm On Nov 03, 2016 |
Pastafarians: See you quoting: So , what set off the Big Bang? Whatever set off the Big Bang set the Law of conservation of Energy and Matter in Motion. Or was this law in existence before the B-Bang? |
| Re: The Asymmetric Nature Of The Christian Sin Economy by Nobody: 2:41pm On Nov 03, 2016 |
shadeyinka:Who told you the big bang was set off?
What do you think the Big bang is? What do you think the Big bang is? |
| Re: The Asymmetric Nature Of The Christian Sin Economy by ValentineMary(m): 2:42pm On Nov 03, 2016 |
LaClicKLaBenDin:Na wa for u xtians. Have u not heard of genetics ans inheritance? |
| Re: The Asymmetric Nature Of The Christian Sin Economy by raphieMontella: 2:45pm On Nov 03, 2016 |
TheSixthSense:oh..forgive me for that! ''sin'' of all men---romans 3:10,romans 3:23 the criteria for salvation---john14:6 acts 4:12 |
| Re: The Asymmetric Nature Of The Christian Sin Economy by raphieMontella: 3:04pm On Nov 03, 2016 |
shadeyinka:Do animals have spirits? Bible says Yes.... So whats your point? hmm...so madmen go to heaven?.. What happened to romans 3:10 and 23? 2)saying animals cannot be put on trail is vague.. In nature...social animals live by laws...you break the laws---you face the laws.. A wolf who eats the food of the pack gets excommunicated.. So ? its all part of it.. |
| Re: The Asymmetric Nature Of The Christian Sin Economy by raphieMontella: 3:18pm On Nov 03, 2016 |
shadeyinka:consequence of the initial sin..=condemnation for all As the Op showed.. In romans 5 Even john 3:36 affirms the condemnation ''wrath'' and to absolve..conditioning sets in
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| Re: The Asymmetric Nature Of The Christian Sin Economy by raphieMontella: 3:21pm On Nov 03, 2016 |
LaClicKLaBenDin:you seem to be missing it... Condemnation is unconditional..but forgiveness is conditional an unfair and bigoted pattern from a supposed fair and all encompassing passionate being? but you inherit the sins of adam? it seems you didnt read 1 peter 8:20.. |
| Re: The Asymmetric Nature Of The Christian Sin Economy by LaClicKLaBenDin(m): 3:44pm On Nov 03, 2016 |
raphieMontella: My dear brother, Christianity is a faith based life style. Adam was the first man and all that came, came through him. But you can't say same for Jesus. Jesus' death was a rescue mission, and if the rescue plan of God to save men who otherwise would have been lost, is bigoted and unfair to you, well that's your understanding. There's no 1 Peter 8:20...get your verse right. The death of Jesus and it's manifestation of salvation is purely a physical occurrence, with far more reaching spiritual implications... You see the condition attached to forgiveness and salvation as a bigoted one, and fail to acknowledge the suffering and death as a sacrificial and loving gesture, right? Condemnation is unconditional, because it came directly from your father's loins; in sin did your father begat you. Forgiveness comes with a condition, because God so loved the world that he gave His Son that whoever believes in Him should not perish, but have everlasting life; Jesus didn't have to die, but he died for you and I, and that's why you must believe he died for you and accept it for the death to make any difference; it's very conditional and you can't change that. |
| Re: The Asymmetric Nature Of The Christian Sin Economy by shadeyinka(m): 4:30pm On Nov 03, 2016 |
Pastafarians: What's your discipline? |
| Re: The Asymmetric Nature Of The Christian Sin Economy by shadeyinka(m): 4:34pm On Nov 03, 2016 |
raphieMontella: The consequence of sin is condemnation! God prepared a solution, take it or leave it. You have a volition to choose! There is no reason to debate man over what God has done. Its like you have a better alternative, so feel free! |
| Re: The Asymmetric Nature Of The Christian Sin Economy by Nobody: 5:07pm On Nov 03, 2016 |
'...for when Gentiles, who do not have the law, by nature do the things in the law, these, although not having the law, are a law to themselves, who show the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and between themselves their thoughts accusing or else excusing them) in the day when God will judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ, according to my gospel Romans 2:14-16 Here is some cut copy and paste piece, hope it helps  :A Gentile is counted as a Jew -as one of God's people- when his conscience leads him to righteousness the way the law leads a virtuous Jew. The law is written in their hearts refers to a person's conscience. Because man's conscience is God-given, it has the same power to lead a person to God as the law does. According to St. John Chrysostom, those who are able to follow their conscience to God are more virtuous than those with the law, for they do not have the advantage of concrete instructions oracles of God (that is, the Law and the Prophets) to lead them (Rom 3:1,2) yet still desire to please God. Those who are uncircumcised but virtuous would judge the uncircumcised (Rom 2:25-27) The Basis of God's Judgement We pray 'For a good defense before the dread Judgement Seat of Christ, Let us pray to the Lord: Lord have mercy.' Roman 2 describes God's judgment. God's righteous judgement will be: 1. According to truth (Rom 2:2,3): Nothing is hidden from God, he sees everything and knows the truth about each of us. One of mankind's great self-deceptions is to say, 'Who sees us?' (Is 29:15) and think there is no judgement. 2. According to impenitent hearts (Rom 2:4,5): An unrepentant hard heart despises God's goodness, treasuring up the wrath of God at the judgement. A repentant hear on the other hand is grateful for God's patience and abides in Christ, practicing a lifetime of repentance, which produces confidence before Him at Judgement. (1Jn 2:28) 3. According to our deeds (Rom 2:6-15): The 'doing good' referred to in Rom 2:7 is not an attempt to gain merit with God. Rather, it is the unity of intentions with actions, faith with works. Even unbelievers are rewarded for good works, apart from spiritual understanding (Rom 2:14,15) but note the following: (a) 'Doing good' means seeking God's glory (Rom 2:10), not our glory, God's honour not our own; the eternal reward of immortality, not reward here and now. 'Doing good' is seeking first the kingdom of God. (Mt 6:33) (b) Good intentions alone, or faith without works, will not save (Rom 2:13). Simply to hear and not do is religion without reality. Those with the true faith, 'the doers' of the truth, practice virtue from pure and repentant hearts. (Jam 1:21-27) (c) 'By nature' (Rom 2:14) people are inspired by and cooperate with God's grace. Therefore, good deeds are natural to us, wheareas evil deeds are contrary to nature. Because we fail, we need God's mercy (Rom 3:9-19). The presence of God's law in our conscience (Rom 2:15) condemns anything contrary to true human nature. Therefore, even Gentiles-people not under the Law of Moses, those who do not know Christ- have an internal law from God, the natural law written in their hearts, according to which God will judge them. Melchizedek, Job and the Ninevites are Old Testament examples of non-Jews judged to be righteous Jews then have two laws from God -the Law of Moses and conscience- and are accountable to Him for both (Rom 2:12) (d) Those who are condemned choose to reject God. There is no automatic, fated condemnation: God's just judgement of us is based on our exercise of free will. Although sin impairs our powers, it does not destroy God's image in us or our free will. (e) By Jesus Christ (Rom 2:16): In the day of judgement we are not judged by directly by God the Father, whom we cannot see, but by the incarnate Son whom we do see, Christ Jesus (Acts 17:31; Jn 5:22, 3:16-21, 35, 36). Christ will judge on the basis of the light He Himself has given to each of us (Jn 1:9) and our response to His light (Jn 3:16-21). 'The secrets of men' (Rom 2:16) are 'the thoughts and intents of the heart' (Heb 4:12) About righteousness, I believe anyone who knows the Law, even those without, that seeks righteousness (doing the law) would believe in Jesus Christ because it is impossible to attain righteousness by keeping the Law and knowing the Law reveals and brings the knowledge of sin to the realisation that we have fallen from communion with God in other to turn our hearts to repentance. The law may be kept by obedience (Lv 18:15) and by faith (Dt 30:14). Obedience without faith cannot bring anyone to righteousness. Yet faith, even apart from the law can bring a person to righteousness because Jesus Christ supersedes the law. Rom 3:24 Being justified refers to the ongoing state of righteousness and not merely a one-time event. This justification requires a redemption: a sacrificial offering capable of (1) setting free from sin and death (2) uniting us eternally with righteousness and life. In the OT, this sacrificial offering was prefigured by blood sacrifices-the killing of physically perfect animals for the temporal remissions of sins (Heb 9). Under the new covenant, Christ is the sacrificial offering that once and for all eternally frees us from sin and death (Heb 10:14) and by His grace unites us with righteousness and life. The verses you mentioned do not say everyone is condemned and heading to the fires. Condemnation is based on what was done and what was known of the law according to conscience in a just judgement but those who reject Christ are condemned already as the wrath of God abides on such (John 3:36) Jesus Christ is the judge and through faith in Him one can be justified. **wrt to your original post which quotes Rom 5:18 as 'Therefore, just as one trespass brought condemnation for all men, so also one act of righteousness brought justification and life for all men' the NKJV reads Rom 5:18 'As through one man's offence judgement came to all men, resulting in condemnation, even so through one man's righteous act the free gift came to all resulting in justification of life. The difference is significant for interpretation, don't you think? with the NKJV their lies the input of the will that completes the equation to result in either condemnation or justification. You know too much to not to be a Christian and true a lot of people would probably give up all together if they knew and sought answers but it doesn't mean there are no answers, neither does it make God inexistent. raphieMontella: |
| Re: The Asymmetric Nature Of The Christian Sin Economy by frank317: 5:22pm On Nov 03, 2016 |
hopefullandlurd: Bill gate , whose cash is limited, will give to people he does not dream of meeting in his life time... But Yahweh, who has limitless every every, will want you to first believe, then follow all his rules, I mean every rule in the Bible, sacrifice your time for him, pray pray pray, sing praises to him, give to his already rich pastors, cry blood, before he gives you a little bit to make you smile, then he still expects you to come to thank him over and over again, if not, nothing for u next time. 1 Like |
| Re: The Asymmetric Nature Of The Christian Sin Economy by MrMontella(m): 12:38pm On Dec 02, 2016 |
frank317:no mind them |
| Re: The Asymmetric Nature Of The Christian Sin Economy by hopefulLandlord: 5:10pm On Dec 29, 2016 |
interesting |
| Re: The Asymmetric Nature Of The Christian Sin Economy by ScienceWatch: 1:58pm On Jan 12, 2017 |
hopefulLandlord:Have you ever met an intelligent person, that works very hard at proving that something they claim is a JOKE, or is NON-EXISTANT, has never existed in the first place? If Yahweh/God/Jesus/Allah is a JOKE, why do atheists use complex time consuming, data draining arguments to prove it? Could the answer be found at the back-door of RICHARD DAWKINS the God-Father of modern Atheism ? Dawkins preach to his followers that they and all their families were once fish. Is it any wonder that atheist world wide are being "fried." At then end of his confusing book, Dawkins Dawkins finishes MIRROR OF REALITY with a plea that his readers accept mysteries, things we don’t yet understand but which science may one day solve. The truth of science, he argues—not of ‘supernatural’ myth or miracle— has its own magic, that of reality." Other scientist pit in their own plea, "One hopes that some readers—including youngsters—will realize the intellectual poverty of Richard Dawkins’ bluff and bluster and discover genuinely satisfying answers to life’s big questions in the very Scriptures that he spends so much time attacking. |
| Re: The Asymmetric Nature Of The Christian Sin Economy by MrMontella(m): 2:06pm On Jan 12, 2017 |
still very much open and unrebutted |
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