Timbuktuo:
Mindfulness, your last post is what I've been trying to say. What the average voter saw in Trump is the hope of something different, not necessarily mind you. Clinton was clearly more of the same, and that impression was seared in people's minds when the contents of her speech to her Wall Street cronies got leaked. She effectively promised corporate America to continue the policies that benefited them but screwed over the average American, and she got good money to make these speeches, hundreds of them I think. Got paid as much as $250k. Meanwhile, she was telling the average American a different thing.

Now, when these speeches got wiki leaked and was called on to explain herself, she gave the excuse of having a public opinion and a private opinion. Of course, people gave her the side eye. The begging question was "who is she lying to, and who is she being truthful to?" The more information about her relationship with globalists that leaked, the further down her credibility went.

So, like I said, the media did Hillary and the world a great disservice by focussing on the 'irrelevancies' of Trump, as it were, they did not give Hillary nearly the same scrutiny and condemnation as thy did Trump. I mean, they literally campaigned free for Trump, he didn't need to spend as much as Hilary did. Dude, was lucky. The medua figured the more they condemned him, the less likely he would win, a wrong gambit. It turns out any publicity was good publicity for Trump. This also made Trump work on himself, by the day of elections Trump was a far cry from his pre-nominee self. He spoke shorter and to the point and said less damaging stuff.

I came across a comment in the Foreign Affairs section talking about filmmaker Michael Moore's research and resulting documentary on my Trump would win. Dude was hysterical and he was able to capture quite a bit of the reason for a Trump victory. So, while the media was talking about genital grabbing for days on end, Trump was forging ahead with what was important for him.

Timbuktuo:
This is the Michael Moore video from YouTube, Mindfulness and co:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YKeYbEOSqYc

So, you may call them whatever derogatory label your liberal mind can conjure, but this man gets close to explaining why Trump voters voted for him, but which the media would not tell you. Not that they knew or bothered to find out anyway.

Mindfulness:


It would not have mattered - according to the article - if the economy was doing better.



The media coverage is irrelevant too - according to economists as the article states.

From this perspective, it doesn't really matter who the candidate of either party is — much less their gaffes or their crude language or their bankruptcies or their reputed dealings with Vladimir Putin’s Russia. All that matters is whether voters want a change or not. And that depends on how well the economy has been performing under the outgoing administration; in this case, the Obama administration.




For the last, agonizing six months, the airwaves and newspapers have been filled with political prognoses. Every commentator claimed special insight into how voters would cast their ballots and why. Most of them were wrong, of course. And according to economic theory, completely irrelevant. None of the political factors the pundits cited ad nauseum even enter the best economic models.


You see it as a victory against the media but according to economic modelling, the media is not even considered a factor in how people vote.

Mindfulness:


The media - left, right and centre - have been considering the economic climate and social background of voters in correlation to who they would vote for. What Moore has said there is nothing new.

Timbuktuo:


And while the economy is in shambles who gets the blame for it being where it is curently? That's right, the establishment. embodied by Clinton. Policies generally determine economic welfare, and in this case the policy if globalism was burned at stake. Again, who embodies globalism, Clinton. Same Clinton, by the way who vowed to continue Obama's policies, double down on them, if you will.

I have said that people voted in Trump because he represents a change of fortunes. I don't think you have read or understood my points and stand all along, or even the article you quoted. You think if Hillary had come out with her smooth talk and failed against globalism and spoke to the economic worries of the 'racist' population like Trump did, we'd have a president Trump? She represented Obama2.0, as such she was untenable. Whether Trump actually fulfils his promise of economic prosperity is irrelevant, he was voted in on the 'change' platform, a platform Hillary could also have run on.

I'll tell you why the media coverage isn't irrelevant. If they had been objective and picked Trump's policy apart in relation to his support, they and other Hillary surrogates would have had a finger on the pulse of the people. All they did was dismiss anyone who supported Trump as uneducated, poorly educated or bigot in some form or the other. The real analysis of Trump's appeal was lost on them. Again, all Hillary had to do was see what was doing right and Tao into that market. Did she? No. Why? Because she was blind to it, and the media greatly helped keep the blindfold on.

You know why it is a victory against the media? Because the media had the gall to pontificate to these people who to vote for. The media said, "if you don't vote Hillary, you're sexist" but their bellies were rumbling. The media said, " if you support Trump, you're a dunce, you're uneducated, you're low information, you're etc." Trump and his supporters were openly derided and sneered at. There was show after show on TV questioning why any woman would vote for Trump. So, these people went underground waiting for election day. They bided their time and struck when the opportunity presented itself. And the media meltdown was music to their ears. Media engagement is at an all-time low in the US. Of course, you can google this as well. Blah, blah, blah.

Timbuktuo:


Really? So, please explain why the mainstream media is in shock as to the result of this election. Surely, if that were true, they would have correctly predicted the winner of the elections, like their economist counterparts.

Mindfulness:


What Moore says is that the average worker who struggles to make ends meet would vote for Trump. This is no surprise.

The mainstream media is in shock because they thought that Trump's offensive language would cost him votes. As we can see, people do not care about racism or sexism as long as they expect a candidate to boost the economy. Even conservative America voted for Trump who has been divorced two times. America is a world power in decline. This is a blow to their national identity and philosophy of exceptionalism and a threat to their very existence. Trump promises 'to make America great again', they did not trust Hillary could and would because Obama, with whom she is associated could not. Consequently, they go with Trump, against all odds.

I see many parallels with the Brexiters who were raving on a cloud of nostalgia for the time of the British Empire. We can all see how it is playing out now.

Timbuktuo:


Are you saying the media knew voters would vote along economic lines, but instead based their predictions on the behaviour of only one of the candidatesuates? Wonderful. What a wise group of people they must be. To ignore reality and still whinge and rant after pragmatism has led the day is nothing short of mental incapacity.

Mindfulness:


Clinton embodies globalism? What does that even mean?

Clinton represents the establishment, that people feel betrayed by. Clinton was also expected to continue Obama's legacy, which many people - if not even the majority (popular vs. electoral vote) opposed. Clinton is also associated with her husband's policies which paved the way for the financial markets to blow up. I am not sure the average voter knows that it was actually Clinton who deregulated the financial markets but let us assume they do.

However, according to the article, all that matters is the economic climate in the periods prior to the election. If it had been good, Democrats would stay in power.



There is nothing Hillary could have said or done to win - according to the article. She could have only won if the economy had been doing better. I think this is what you and the author of the article agree on. Correct me if I am wrong.



I agree that Hillary and her campaign team did a bad job. This is why I saw Trump's victory coming coupled with the fact that after Brexit I thought everything to be possible.



You are acting like the media is solely controlled by liberals, which is wrong.

Timbuktuo:


I believe Hillary would have stood a better chance of winning had she campaigned on a change platform. She did win the popular vote didn't she? All she had to do was distance herself from Obama's policies. Don't forget she also was a strong advocate of bringing in millions of Syrian refugees, and the thinking is why should these guys come here and be on welfare if I can't even make ends meet? I strongly believe of she had gone to the rust belt and said all what Trump said convincingly, she would have won.

I use the liberal media/mainstream media/media interchangeably in this thread. Please bear with me.

missjo:

That has always been one of his working principles when dealing with the media. He actually made this statement "Any kind of publicity is good publicity for me, as long as they keep talking about me and my buildings", back in the 70s when he was having problems with his real estate in New York and also after buying the Taj Mahal and running into debt in the millions as well as numerous labour disputes.

The media was all over those incidents and never said anything good, meanwhile Trump and his then socialite wife kept appearing in expensive public gatherings wearing expensive clothes much to the chagrin of the media. I'm sure he was like "you want to talk? Well here is another thing to talk about for the next one week"

And then everytime he went back to the banks and big corporations to get loans or woo financiers, they would still give him money because he was popular. It got to the point other real estate developers would seek his permission and then have the TRUMP name put up on their own buildings just so they can increase the rent. LOL

Mindfulness:


I agree that her campaign strategy was poorly thought out but I believe that she made a HUGE mistake by running for presidency in the first place.



That's the problem.

You insinuate that there is no conservative agenda promoted on the media. There is so stop complaining.

Timbuktuo:

Name a mainstream conservative media outlet in that supported Trump. Of course, Fox doesn't count. I'm waiting.

cococandy:
Any black man celebrating Trump's victory because of his own hate for women is just a pathetic creature.

I've seen some of them on facebook. Out of touch bruvs. Trump really loves your black arse.
That's why he spent all his political campaign blasting obama.

carammel:


This means that women only show they love their fellow women outwardly but deep within them,they would never support a woman to become a leader.

Modern-feminism will have a hard time staying.

Edwinmason:
who would imagine that after all the hardwork of hillary clinton she would lose this way

lilmax:
be your self....... hillary is fake

Mindfulness:


You are in no way authorized to speak for most women, white or black so cut that crap.



I read an article that women want different types of men in the different phases of their menstrual cycle and life, now what?



I live in Europe and I have white friends, plenty, but I do not know one woman who fancies Trump.

Believe whatever you want and if you think that Trump is most women's dream, may your daughters and sisters marry a man like him.

raumdeuter:
Its also funny when some posters on this forum brag about how the West and America is the standard and would tell us this can only happen in Nigeria/Africa

I wonder if in Nigeria a man who

- Has 5 kids from 3 wives and was openly cheating on each of them, actually he took the 1st and 2nd to a holiday resort to fight it out
- Openly said if he came home and doesnt meet food on his table he loses it
- Says you have to treat women like shitt
- Babies and pregnancy are an inconvenience
- Insults a woman by referring to "Blood coming out of her everywhere
- Calls women pigs sluts, bimbos fat and every degrading name

Is now voted as President

Nigerian women would have sworn this cant happen in advanced countries and berate Africa for all wrong in the world

davidif:


You live in Europe, he lives in America and he is telling you how some American women tend to be more conserivative.

bukatyne:
The world was shocked when Donald Trump 'hilariously trumped' Hillary Clinton and there was definitely several lessons to be learnt. Personally, I learnt:

1. Never Say Never: Donald graduated from a man with no political experience to become the POTUS....

2. The Social Media is powerful yet not as powerful as it seems: Going by the SM polls and atmosphere, one would have thought Hillary would win by a landslide however...

3. Discern the people that matter: Hillary was canvassing to the Blacks and Latinos (most of whom probably were not eligible to vote); Donald went to the core voters... The white men. Also, American's electoral voting system means some states are weightier than others. Imagine jacking all day for a 2units course and leaving your 6unit project to chance.

4. Strike the people that matter in the right place: Trump hit the white men/women where they wanted... Blacks are too much in their country and they wanted them out etc. His political incorrectness interestingly worked for him

5. You don't have to be good to be liked/wanted: Donald Trump / He did not have to be like 'Gentleman Obama' to get same results.

6. Turn your lemons to lemonade: With all the negative press, Donald's campaign team managed and rode on the negatives to success

7. People do not always mean what they say/ say what they mean: Who would have thought Trump would have any supporter/ vote with all the 'he is anti-woman/anti-gay/anti-black/anti-(fill in the gap)'? Who would have believed that the same women/Black/Latinos would vote for him more than Hillary? According to Huffington post, majority of the women, blacks & Latinos voted Trump.

8. No knowledge is 'lost': Donald did not have the experience/knowlegde of politricks however he is a successful business man and he brought his business sense to the campaign/ movement. He fitted his gift into the suitation and utilized it well.

This also confirmed that beneath the façade of liberalism and modern-feminism, Americans are a very conservative and traditional lot.

What did you learn?


*modified to include point 8

lilmax:
be your self....... hillary is fake

raumdeuter:


Grab them by the Pvssies baby

The leader of the world you all see as the perfect societies is a PVssy grabber

GOP - Grabber of Poossies

Timbuktuo:


Seventy years is not beans, my sister. The guy has lived long enough to find out what works and has taken advantage of it. It's quite interesting to see pundits scratch their heads and wonder how they got it so damn wrong.

carammel:


This means that women only show they love their fellow women outwardly but deep within them,they would never support a woman to become a leader.

Modern-feminism will have a hard time staying.