@Davidylan: #13 on: November 11, 2009, 04:14 PM »

Quote from: toneyb on November 11, 2009, 04:13 PM
Is is the same KJV that contains a lot of errors(even in the opening verse) and had to be reviewed? Does this person knows that there is the NKJV?

thou fool . . . i know. I even have a copy.
I however retain and use exclusively the KJV and ditto for most of my family members and those i know.

Since you have copy of each, so am asking you which one is original and which one is fake? Or are the both originals regardless or are as a fact they are both fakes?

@Davidylan: « #15 on: November 11, 2009, 04:27 PM »

Quote from: toneyb on November 11, 2009, 04:24 PM
So you and your family members now constitute what authority in christianity thou ridiculous and pathetic fool?

The fact that you and your equally deluded friends choose to use the KJV does not mean that it is without errors, it has a lot of errors in it hence the need for it to be reviowed and the birth of the NKJV.


No we dont . . . which is why only fools like you see "bible undergoes new revision" and automatically assume it applies for every christian out there.

The KJV contains errors . . . we already know that. We are not too blind to ignore them. Anything new you wanted to pass across to us?

David which Christians out there have a never revised, never edited original Bible? Are you one of them lucky ones with the original Bible, even though you said what you read is from 17th century at it earliest, while Christianity has been around since the first century? Even now, you have just confessed that you know that KJV contains error, but earlier in the year you had the audacity to ask me to show you an undiluted Bible, yet you are carrying around an error riddled copy, unless you will tell us here and now that whatever the Original was or is, it is error riddled? Yes, omo boy?

Dami lowun. Answer, ol boy.

@Davidylan; « #17 on: November 11, 2009, 04:39 PM »

Considering the fact that the original manuscripts are available on the internet or on ebay as compilations . . . your bawling is just a sad indictment of your depraved state of mind. Case closed.

When you compare it side by side with your KJV, I guess it is a dead ringer, while NKJV will not match quite like that? I wonder what the Douwy Bible people will say about your finding?

@Davidylan: « #30 on: November 11, 2009, 05:34 PM »

Quote from: toneyb on November 11, 2009, 05:29 PM
Some of them differ because some foot notes in some english version acknowledge or put some caveat saying that some verses are omitted because they do not appear in some early manuscripts. That constitute some difference. But that is not the point I was trying to make , the point I was trying to make is that even the KJV has been revised.


Each time i read this constant whine about "missing verses" it always amuses me. This is because at the end of the day you're basically talking of perhaps 1 or 2 missing verses! Besides the fact that some of the early writers may have consciously omitted a verse perhaps based on the audience they were writing for . . . it is possible that we lose some of these verses due to the level of preservation of these manuscripts. For instance certain books of the bible in the dead sea scrolls have numerous verses missing! That's because some of them are so badly damaged!

The revision of the KJV to the NKJV was primarily because some were no longer comfortable with the old version of English language employed with the KJV. Kinda makes your "point" moot.

David, you must be kidding! Is a single verse out of place not one enough to shame you out of the changing God's words/verses at will to satisfy human being? Pandering to the whim of humans at the expense of lying on God is paganism! Defend yourself, omo boy.

@Nezan: #38 on: November 12, 2009, 05:21 PM »

whether the Bible is revised or not, the basic message flows . . . so why are muslims crying? or do they now the Holy Bible as a devotional?

Right on. Right or wrong, he is a christian for life!

@Viaro: « #45 on: November 12, 2009, 10:44 PM »

But just what is wrong with a revised text of a translation? I sometimes are amazed at the very low IQ that muslims on Nairaland possess! Are you, dear muhsin, so ignorant of the very fact that there are already numerous REVISED qurans? I don't see what's biting you so much as to make that much noise on a revised English translation of the Bible - unless you're totally and calculatedly ignorant of the same thing happening to numerous English qurans -

Nothing is wrong with revision of translation, if you can show us an original, different from translation. Can you show us an original and in the original language, please? Simple direct answer is required please.

The organization Muslims Against Sharia is creating a new Koran
with the violent verses removed. How legitimate and wise is this action?
There is an effort in Turkey, for instance, to also revise Islamic texts.
What real hope can these acts offer to bring Islam into the modern and
democratic world?

curled from: "Symposium: A New Koran?"
http://97.74.65.51/readArticle.aspx?ARTID=30658

And when they use it to conduct daily salah, etc, we in Islam worldwide we say in one single voice, they are not Muslims! Can you show me an original Bible in original language please, because we already know that Quran is in Arabic?

This is what the Muslims Against Sharia stated on their website:
"The following verses promote divisiveness and religious hatred, bigotry and discrimination. They must be either removed from the Koran or declared outdated and invalid, and marked as such."
Then follows a list of such verses -
read more here


Even where muslim bookshops advertise some copies of the quran for sale, they (the muslims themselves) have clearly stated that the copies they carry for sale are revisions of some major works of some translators - an example:


The Quran: Saheh International:
"This is the now-familiar Saheeh International English translation of the Qur'an. It includes original Arabic text. It is a paperback edition, measuring roughly 4" x 6". Saheeh International checked many previous translations verse by verse against accepted Arabic tafseer and revised the wording accordingly in clear, contemporary English.
http://islamicbookstore.com/b5269.html


I just don't see how some of you muslims (especially the ones on Nairaland) even try to operate on the borders of sanity. What is the headline news to you, muhsin, that you thought it erstwhile to even open this thread? Has the same thing not happened to the quran in the Islamic world - even by a major Muslim movement in Turkey who are sponsored to revise the quran by entirely removing numerous verses from its

While you are fighting your own emotion on this issue, everyone and their grandpaps know that Quran is in authentic arabic, what language is the Bible, and can you walk in to any Christian Bookstore and find the ORIGINAL with the ease that you will find Quran in any and all muslim Bookstore?

Very good, Olabowale.

If the bible is perfect, why the bible need to undergo a New Revision, and new revision mean a Re-revision or a Revision again, this mean that it is not the first revision of the bible. Why this book need another revision if it was perfect?. Stop and think one moment. The name God is not really in the bible. If this is not an English book written by Englishmen, it’s not there; it was added. You will also find that God, whether you have a big G, or little g, is not being used in the singular tense, as Eloh. The beings spoken of in the Original bible in the Original language are the Eloheem, the plural of Eloh. So the word God is a substitute, it was added.

Anybody
Practically anyone can wake up tomorrow and print BIbles to suit their taste
They can even say fornication is allowed, but does that change the mind of God?

It is funny that Muslims accuse the Bible of the same things the Koran has gone through and worse

There are several versions of arabic Korans,we have had that discussion
There is evidence that the 3rd Caliph standardized the Koran and burnt the others,there;s a thread on that
There are a ,million English Korans and more coming out with differing texts another thread
There is evidence that several verses in the original Koran never made it into the modern Koran on one of my threads
There is evidence that some of the people who crammed Mohammeds Koran were killed in wars and their crammed verses buried with with them forever,discussed previously
There is evidence that goats under aisha's bed ate verses that were written on vegetables and the goat is dead and buried
There is evidence that Mohammed himself was influenced by the devil ,by his own words and that of his wife and wet nurse
There is evidence that Biblical stories were coipied and muddled up into that sham called the koran

use search and see the relevant threads.

I laugh when I read Muslims playing the tango to hide from the reality of the Koran and have the nerve to talk about the Bible.

The different  English Korans and counting

In chronological order of publication)

1. Alexander Ross, 1649, The Alcoran of Mahomet: Translated out of Arabique into French by the Sieur Du Ryer;

2. George Sale, 1734, KORAN, Commonly called The Alcoran of Mohammed, Translated into English immediately from the Original Arabic; with Explanatory Notes, taken from the most approved Commentators. To which is prefixed a Preliminary Discourse;

3. John Meadows Rodwell, 1861, The Koran (ISBN 0-8041-1125-1)

4. E.H. Palmer, 1880, The Qur'an: The Sacred Books of the East Part Nine (ISBN 1-4179-3010-1)

5. Mohammad Abdul Hakim Khan, 1905, The Holy Qur'an, Patiala[4]

6. Hairat Dehlawi,1912, The Koran Prepared, Delhi

7. Mirzal Abu'l Fadl, 1912, Qur'an, Arabic Text and English Translation Arranged Chronologically with an Abstract, Allahabad;

8. Maulana Muhammad Ali, 1917 The Holy Qur'an: Text[5] (ISBN 0-913321-11-7)

9. Al-Hajj Hafiz Ghulam Sarwar, 1920, Translation of the Holy Qur'an, Singapore;

10. Marmaduke Pickthall, 1930, The Meaning of the Glorious Qu'ran (ISBN 1-879402-51-3)

11. Abdullah Yusuf Ali, 1934, The Meaning of the Holy Qur'an, Lahore, (ISBN 0-915957-76-0)

12. Richard Bell, 1937-39, The Qur'an. Translated, with a critical re-arrangement of the Surahs

13. Abdul Majid Daryabadi, 1941 The Holy Qur'an, English Translation, Lahore;

14. Arthur John Arberry, 1955, The Koran Interpreted: A Translation (ISBN 0-684-82507-4)

15. N. J. Dawood, 1956, "The Koran", (ISBN 0-14-044558-7)

16. Muhammad Asad, 1980, The Message of The Qur'an (ISBN 1-904510-00-0)

17. M. H. Shakir, 1981 The Quran, Arabic and English (ISBN 0-940368-16-1) (see article on Shakir for controversy about this version)

18. T. B. Irving, 1985, The Qur'an: First American Version (ISBN 0-911119-33-7)

19. Zafar Ishaq Ansari, 1988 Towards Understanding the Qur'an, translated from Abul Ala Maududi's Urdu translation Tafhim al Qur'an

20. Dr. Rashad Khalifa, (died in January 31st,1990), Quran: The Final Testament, Universal Unity, (ISBN 0-9623622-2-0)

21. Dr. T. B. Irving, 1991 Noble Qur'an: Arabic Text & English Translation (ISBN 0-915597-51-9)

22. AbdalHaqq and Aisha Bewley, 1999, rev. ed. 2005 The Noble Qur'an: A New Rendering of its Meaning in English, Bookwork, (ISBN 0-9538639-3-X)

23. Dr. Muhammad Muhsin Khan and Dr. M. Taqi-ud-Din Al-Hilali, 1999, The Noble Quran (ISBN 1-59144-000-9)

24. Dr. Zohurul Hoque, 2000 Translation and Commentary on The Holy Quran, Holy Qur-An Pub. Project, (ISBN 0-9678304-0-0)

25. Dr. S.M. Afzal-your-Rahman 2001, The Holy Quran

26. Ahmed Ali, 2001 Al-Qur'an, a Contemporary Translation (ISBN 0691074992)(ISBN 978-0691074993)

27. Muhammad Taqiuddin Sarwar, 2001, The Holy Qur'an, Islamic Seminary Inc., (ISBN 0-941724-00-X)

28. Shabbir Ahmed, 2003 The Qur'an As It Explains Itself, Galaxy;

29. ProgressiveMuslims.Org, 2003, The Message: God's Revelation to Humanity, iUniverse, Inc, (ISBN 0595290353)(ISBN 978-0595290352)

30. M.A.S Abdel Haleem, 2004, The Qur'an (Oxford World Classics) (ISBN 0-19-283193-3)

30. Thomas Cleary, 2004, The Qur'an: A New Translation (ISBN 1-929694-44-X)

31. Ali Ünal, 2006 The Qur'an with Annotated Interpretation in Modern English (ISBN 978-1-59784-000-1)

32. Alan Jones, 2007, The Qur'an Translated into English, Oxford, Gibb Memorial Trust (ISBN 978-0-906094-63-1)

33. Dr. Edip Yuksel, Layth al-Shaiban, Dr. Martha Schulte-Nafeh, 2007 Quran: a Reformist Translation (Non-sexist, non-sectarian translation) BrainbowPress (ISBN 0-979-67150-7)

34. Laleh Bakhtiar, 2007 The Sublime Quran ("The first English translation of the Qur'an by an American woman"[6]

I know they'll tell you the one in Arabic is the only reliable one and others are translations
hogwash!
If the translators could not translate exactly what was written in arabic to English that means no one can understand the concoction the 3rd caliph,allah and his mohammed had in mind
Is that a plus or a minus for the al koran?

Note that there are 7 types of  Arabic Korans And secondly if the translators got it right the first time,why do we have more that 50 different ones?
some politically correct ones too used to deceive westerners
The last ones listed above were in 2007
A prostitute in Istanbul may be working on her version

I laff in German ! After that long story where is ur proof, no hadith nothing but mere talking, hehehe, the Quran was revealed into 7 dialect no doubt about it.

Translators are bound to make mistake, our one and only Arabic Quran will never undergo revised or plagarised. Up Quran

Abuzola:

I laff in German ! After that long story where is your proof, no hadith nothing but mere talking, hehehe, [size=24pt]the Quran was revealed into 7 dialect no doubt about it. [/size] Translators are bound to make mistake, our one and only Arabic Quran will never undergo revised or plagarised. Up Quran

proof of what? I laff in Mohammedan

Need I say more?

Nigeria is playing Switzerland now in the under 17 World Cup Final in Abuja. Can't u guys stop fighting, take a break and support your country.

manmustwac:

Nigeria is playing Switzerland now in the under 17 World Cup Final in Abuja. Can't u guys stop fighting, take a break and support your country.

I'm watching the game too
whta are you doing here

The top-selling Bible in North America will
undergo a revision, modernizing the language
in some sections and promising to reopen a
contentious debate about changing gender
terms in the sacred text. The New International
Version, the Bible of choice for conservative
evangelicals, is scheduled to be
completed late next year and published in 2011.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/0, _n_274299.html


Gender language has pitted evangelicals
against each other. So in some verses,
references to "sons of God" became "children
of God," for example. Supporters say gender-
inclusive language is more accurate and makes
the Bible more accessible, but critics contend
they twist meaning or smack of political
correctness.

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/, evision/print/

Maybe they are trying to to come up with a genderless Bible like the Koran did in 2007

Dr. Edip Yuksel, Layth al-Shaiban, Dr. Martha Schulte-Nafeh, 2007 Quran: a Reformist Translation[b] (Non-sexist, non-sectarian translation) [/b] BrainbowPress (ISBN 0-979-67150-7)

These Muslims will never understand due to spiritual blindness. The reason why these people are revising the Bible is so that the message can be more easily understood by everyone, new translations are being produced in contemporary languages. Even if the Bible is revised daily, and there are a billion versions available, THE HOLY SPIRIT GIVES LIFE to the words we read in the Bible. Its not the wording of the Bible that works for us, its the understanding that the Holy Spirit renders unto us by faith.

[size=18pt]Tell me, what language does God speak? Is he limited to a human language, or the semantic translation of any verse?[/size]

Of course HE isn't! he will TALK to you in your own language when you read His Word.

So even if a Bible is transliterated into PIDGIN or WAFFI, and ONE MAN gets saved by it, it will be like the parable of the lost sheep, one sheep got lost out of 100 and the shepherd left the 99 in search of the one. The 99 will be brothers like Davidylan who use the original manuscripts, the 1 will be people like a friend of mine, Gbadebo, who can only understand something like the Message, which is written in today's contemporary street-language (by the way, the Bible was written in contemporary language in their days, so why not write it in contemporary language in OUR days?)

The honest truth is that when Christians increase in maturity, they learn to read between the lines in the KJV (like Davidylan) and get the understanding. But until then, there are other versions that they can use to bring themselves up to speed, and the Holy Spirit will expand the meanings in their hearts.

Heaven rejoices over the altogether salvation of ONE person, no matter how the person got to know the truth.

I will support Bible translation with my last money, as long as the truth is not edited like the sects do, or like the koran has been known to do. Thank you.

@osisi thanks for showing us another change in the bible

@maven- once the bible is revised and some changes are made means it has been plagarized, hehehe, God's word indeed

mavenbox:

These Muslims will never understand due to spiritual blindness. The reason why these people are revising the Bible is so that the message can be more easily understood by everyone, new translations are being produced in contemporary languages. Even if the Bible is revised daily, and there are a billion versions available, THE HOLY SPIRIT GIVES LIFE to the words we read in the Bible. Its not the wording of the Bible that works for us, its the understanding that the Holy Spirit renders unto us by faith.

[size=18pt]Tell me, what language does God speak? Is he limited to a human language, or the semantic translation of any verse?[/size]

Of course HE isn't! he will TALK to you in your own language when you read His Word.

So even if a Bible is transliterated into PIDGIN or WAFFI, and ONE MAN gets saved by it, it will be like the parable of the lost sheep, one sheep got lost out of 100 and the shepherd left the 99 in search of the one. The 99 will be brothers like Davidylan who use the original manuscripts, the 1 will be people like a friend of mine, Gbadebo, who can only understand something like the Message, which is written in today's contemporary street-language (by the way, the Bible was written in contemporary language in their days, so why not write it in contemporary language in OUR days?)

The honest truth is that when Christians increase in maturity, they learn to read between the lines in the KJV (like Davidylan) and get the understanding. But until then, there are other versions that they can use to bring themselves up to speed, and the Holy Spirit will expand the meanings in their hearts.

Heaven rejoices over the altogether salvation of ONE person, no matter how the person got to know the truth.

I will support Bible translation with my last money, as long as the truth is not edited like the sects do, or like the koran has been known to do. Thank you.

The Bible is the most translated book in the world and more translations are going on as we speak
The best seller of all times translated in thousands of thousands of tongues,Halleluia
No book in the world has sold more copies than the Bible.

You are talking to people who are programmed with a one track mind even when the truth is clear.
The man Mohammed wanted to exalt his tribe far above anyother so despite the fact that he Mohammed was a start illiterate , he told them the Koran was diminished in anyother language but his Arabic dialect, these people like mumu spend man hours learning arabic.A language they will never understand.
They cramm and recite passages they have absolutely no clue what it means unless they have it explained in a language they understand.
How gullible can people be.

The rituals of Islam cannot save
Islam is incapable of saving anyone
Mohammed was not saved,he knew that too.
The vain repetitions will lead nowhere
Only Jesus can save and the power is in his word,no wonder the spirit of the bondwoman i.e Islam strives to silence the living word

@Ohsisi: LOL thanks for the rebuttal. I have made it a point of duty to ignore Abuzola unless he says something intelligent. He is not worth my time.

@maven- have you seen in thread engaging with u, i won't till you post something meaningful other than differences between islam and xtrianity

It's amazing how you all started poking fun at Bible translations forgetting that the koran also has translations and revisions which can be authenticated by history.
Funny people

Off course now what else do you want them to do . . . its better to talk say na someone else mess rather than own up say na you spoil the weather. . . .

@ohsisi - the bible has been changed time to time and thank God you agree to it, how can an adulterated book be equal to its original.


I laff in swahili: the reason why every xtrian has to accept the change is because you have no option, thats why you have to run ur mouth anyhow to support the change. Who dares the unique Quran. Smile

Abuzola:

@ohsisi - the bible has been changed time to time and thank God you agree to it, how can an adulterated book be equal to its original.


I laff in swahili: the reason why every xtrian has to accept the change is because you have no option, thats why you have to run your mouth anyhow to support the change. Who dares the unique Quran. Smile

Unique Quran . . . . oho o oo o oo o o o o ahaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaeeheheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeebbuahhhhhhhhaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa
heeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

- after Osisi talked about 7 arabic versions . . .
- after the caliph had to gather and destroy the other versions in other to save islam the embarrasment of having versions that say obviously embarrasing things.
- after a goat was said to have eaten part of the quran written on leaves.
- after there was no quran until after the death of mohammed.
- after the quran says sperm comes from between the ribs and the backbone.



. . . oho o oo o oo o o o o ahaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaeeheheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeebbuahhhhhhhhaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa
heeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

Oh hohahaha, save ur breathless breath, osisi is suffering from lack of adequate education, she meant to say dialect,

the Quran was revealed into 7 dialect, during uthman caliphate he chose the Quraish dialect to be used generally during his caliphate, for ur info we still use the 7 dialect, so ur assertion that it was destroy is baseless, for the copy of the 7 dialect go to any islamic book shop and purchase yours. What a unique Quran Mwah

Abuzola:

Oh hohahaha, save your breathless breath, osisi is suffering from lack of adequate education, she meant to say dialect,

the Quran was revealed into 7 dialect, during uthman caliphate he chose the Quraish dialect to be used generally during his caliphate, for your info we still use the 7 dialect, so your assertion that it was destroy is baseless, for the copy of the 7 dialect go to any islamic book shop and purchase yours. What a unique Quran Mwah

Una don hear am
There are seven different types of Arabic Koran

so what are we arguing about?

somethings that didn't make it into the modern koran

Bukhari: vol. 8, hadith 817, p. 539-540; book 82

Allah sent Muhammad with the Truth and revealed the Holy Book to him, and among what Allah revealed, was the Verse of the Rajam (the stoning of married person (male and female) who commits illegal sexual intercourse), and we did recite this Verse and understood and memorized it. Allah's Apostle did carry out the punishment of stoning and so did we after him. I am afraid that after a long time has passed, somebody will say, `By Allah, we do not find the Verse of the Rajam in Allah's Book,' and thus they will go astray by leaving an obligation which Allah has revealed.

Mohammed eh?
where is that verse?
missing in the revised standard Koran ?

so the Koran has missing verses?

Abuzola I dare you to produce that verse in your Koran since we know it was supposed to be there
who took it out,when and for what purpose? Discuss
I need the answer in 3 fullscap sheets

Abuzola please answer osisi and provide and submit your examination papers as soon as possible . . .

Oh boy! Laugh no go kill me for this Nairaland.

@Ohsisi: Correct, correct. even if you give him the marking scheme, he will still fail

@No2Atheism: Thumbs up,