FriendChoice:


Yes that's the way of Salafi following Allah, Prophet and Those in Authority. If they have misunderstanding they go back to Allah and his prophet. Salafism wount be mentioned. Hypocrite.

Salaf simply means predecessors. In this context, it would refer to Sahaba like Abu Bakr, Umar, Uthman and Ali{RA} to simply put. Did any of these people practiced Quran competition, walimot Quran, spent paper money and the list goes on. Your kind reply is needed, sir.

Empiree:
Salaf simply means predecessors. In this context, it would refer to Sahaba like Abu Bakr, Umar, Uthman and Ali{RA} to simply put. Did any of these people practiced Quran competition, walimot Quran, spent paper money and the list goes on. Your kind reply is needed, sir.

That has been answered by snapscore. Or do you forget when you alleged that I have no idea of what to say? Go back to previous post and check.

FriendChoice:


That has been answered by snapscore. Or do you forget when you alleged that I have no idea of what to say? Go back to previous post and check.

No. I need your input. Dont hide behind skirt. What she provided was not qola Allah qola Rosul.

Since you said you obey Allah, His messanger and authority and refer back to Allah's book, where is EVIDENCE of Quran competition and Walimot since you also believe or participates in it. If you dont, Saudi authority also organizes this program. But the program officially started by a Sunni-Sufi Sultan in Malaysia.

So is Quran competition and walimot ul Quran bid'a or not? It is YES or No answer akhi. You may never know where i am driving you so dont try messing with me

.

Empiree:
No. I need your input. Dont hide behind skirt. What she provided was not qola Allah qola Rosul.

Since you said you obey Allah, His messanger and authority and refer back to Allah's book, where is EVIDENCE of Quran competition and Walimot since you also believe or participates in it. If you dont, Saudi authority also organizes this program. But the program officially started by a Sunni-Sufi Sultan in Malaysia.

So is Quran competition and walimot ul Quran bid'a or not? It is YES or No answer akhi. You may never know where i am driving you so dont try messing with me

That was simply my answer what they said. School of taught. You won't here my input. Their input is basically my input. Some of them believe in it while some don't. (Which 1 I am don't concern you).

But one thing is sure we will not practice maulud and we will preach against it.

Where are you taking me to? Are you going 2 break my head.

FriendChoice:


That was simply my answer what they said. School of taught. You won't here my input. Their input is basically my input. Some of them believe in it while some don't. (Which 1 I am don't concern you).

But one thing is sure we will not practice maulud and we will preach against it.

Where are you taking me to? Are you going 2 break my head.

Good. The isnad simply did not go back to the prophet(SAW). But going by your narrow thought, "what is NOT in the Qur'an, NOT in the sunnah is bid'a". So you what they did was ijtihad, qiyas. These are part of Shar'a but can be flexible. The same way Mawlud started. It was based on ijtihad and qiyas. Hence, you have no right to label anyone innovator. No you dont have that right.

Ibn Taymiyah(ra) did not call Mawlud bid'a. He said it is simply "a matter of ijtihad but if some people innovate in it that what needs to be condemned."

So bye bye with you doggy ideology. You dont understand what you doing. Great Ulama have celebrated mawlud since 6th cent. You not gonna come here in 21st century and term it bid'a. Thats your opinion.

If you are not invited, simply do not go there. If you go there uninvited, and started yelling "bid'a bid'a bid'a", they need to tie your legs and hands together and place microphone by your mouth until they finish.

Ibn Taymiyyah ( may Allah be pleased with him) wrote regarding the celebration of the Prophet’s birthday,

And like this is what some of the people have innovated, either in opposition to the Christian celebration of the birthday of Jesus, or out of love for the Prophet (sallallaahu `alaihi wasallam) and in honour of him. And Allaah will reward them for this love and ijtihaad, but NOT FOR THE BID’AH of taking the day of the birth of the Prophet (sallallaahu `alaihi wasallam) as an eed - this along with the difference of the people as to when he was born. For indeed this (celebration) was not done by the salaf, despite the existence of factors that would necessitate it and the lack of any factors that would prevent them from doing so if it were indeed good. And if this was genuinely good or preferable then the salaf, may Allaah be pleased with them, would have more right to doing so then us, for they had more severe love and honour of the Prophet (sallallaahu `alaihi wasallam) in following him, obeying him, and following his command, and reviving his sunnah inwardly and outwardly, and spreading that which he was sent with, and performing jihaad for this in the heart, with the hand and upon the tongue. So indeed this was the way of the Saabiqeen al-Awwaleen from the Muhajiroon and the Ansaar, and those that followed them in good.

Source: Iqtida As-Sirat Al-Mustaqeem

For those interested in reading about it fully.

http://www.salafipublications.com/sps/sp.cfm?subsecID=bdh06&articleID=bdh060002&pfriend=
http://muslimmatters.org/2009/04/01/misunderstanding-ibn-taimiyyah-on-the-mawlid/
https://islamqa.info/en/128530

Empiree:
Good. The isnad simply did not go back to the prophet(SAW). But going by your narrow thought, "what is NOT in the Qur'an, NOT in the sunnah is bid'a". So you what they did was ijtihad, qiyas. These are part of Shar'a but can be flexible. The same way Mawlud started. It was based on ijtihad and qiyas. Hence, you have no right to label anyone innovator. No you dont have that right.

Ibn Taymiyah(ra) did not call Mawlud bid'a. He said it is simply "a matter of ijtihad but if some people innovate in it that what needs to be condemned."

So bye bye with you doggy ideology. You dont understand what you doing. Great Ulama have celebrated mawlud since 6th cent. You not gonna come here in 21st century and term it bid'a. Thats your opinion.

If you are not invited, simply do not go there. If you go there uninvited, and started yelling "bid'a bid'a bid'a", they need to tie your legs and hands together and place microphone by your mouth until they finish.

None of these school of taught celebrate Maulud. What you write would not stop us from calling bidi'a and Preaching for people to stay away from it. It's now left for the people to decide.

FriendChoice:


None of these school of taught celebrate Maulud. What you write would not stop us from calling bidi'a and Preaching for people to stay away from it. It's now left for the people to decide.

go ahead and call them alhu bida'a. Allah knows who truly worship Him. So long as those two practices are not traced back to rosul, according to your doggy ideology they will continue to mean bida'a....school of thought or not. Period. I got more but keep gasping on these two


@snapscore, Saudis celebrate their kings and national day on September 23rd. Where is that in kitab and sunnah?.

Thanks for quoting ibn taymiyah (ra). His only problem is the day set aside. That's his opinion unfortunately. Many great scholars were involved before him and after him but mawlud continues in 21st century since 6th century. Long enough if its concept was bad, Allah would have stopped it by Divine Power. Many religions appeared within 6th and 21st century and they are no more but mawlud prevails. What do you want to do about it?.

Empiree:
go ahead and call them alhu bida'a. Allah knows who truly worship Him. So long as those two practices are not traced back to rosul, according to your doggy ideology they will continue to mean bida'a....school or thought or not. Period. I got more but keep gasping on these two


@snapscore, Saudis celebrate their kings and national day on September 23rd. Where is that in kitab and sunnah?.

Thanks for quoting ibn taymiyah (ra). His only problem is the day set aside. That's his opinion unfortunately. Many great scholars were involved before him and after him but mawlud continues in 21st century since 6th century. Long enough if its concept was bad, Allah would have stopped it by Divine Power. Many religions appeared within 6th and 21st century and they are no more but mawlud prevails. What do you want to do about it?.

Look at your foolish thinking. Did Allah stop people from associating partners with Him? Did Allah used divine power to stop Christian from calling Jesus God? Talkless of innovation. You should have keep quiet than uttering these words.

FriendChoice:


Look at your foolish thinking. Did Allah stop people from associating partners tackles of innovation. You should have keep quiet than uttering this words.

these are Muslim people not mushrik. Over 80%of them do it except your side. If you go around calling people innovators bcuz of this you are going against sunnah.

Empiree:
these are Muslim people not mushrik. Over 80%of them do it except your side. If you go around calling people innovators bcuz of this you are going against sunnah.

I did not say they are mushriks sir. And I don't go calling people names. I even live with multiple of people doing it and does not stop me from saying it's bidi'a. Its not a fight. Someone resort to fight when he has nothing tangible to say.

FriendChoice:


I did not say they are mushriks sir. And I don't go calling people names. I even live with multiple of people doing it and does not stop me from saying it's bidi'a. Its not a fight. Someone resort to fight when he has nothing tangible to say.

changing tune. Isoright

Empiree:
changing tune. Isoright

Nothing like changing tune. Maulud is bid'a and we will warn people against practicing it.

FriendChoice:


Nothing like changing tune. Maulud is bid'a and we will warn people against practicing it.

There is something called "live and let's live" . You ever heard of it?.

As i said before, i want to speak less on this subject.If I am to ever post on Mawlud here again, it is only meant for academic purposes for readers.

And since you and your cohorts have also refused to tell us about Saudi national and kings day celebration, if it is bid'a or not, your claim of mawlud will ALWAYS be null and void.

I just dont want to dig too much. If i do that, you will realize yourself is bid'a. So you rather just leave it AS IT IS or provoke further and I will dig further and you will be shivering and gasping on straw.

This is my conclusion.

Empiree:
There is something called "live and let's live" . You ever heard of it?.

As i said before, i want to speak less on this subject.If I am to ever post on Mawlud here again, it is only meant for academic purposes for readers.

And since you and your cohorts have also refused to tell us about Saudi national and kings day celebration, if it is bid'a or not, your claim of mawlud will ALWAYS be null and void.

I just dont want to dig too much. If i do that, you will realize yourself is bid'a. So you rather just leave it AS IT IS or provoke further and I will dig further and you will be shivering and gasping on straw.

This is my conclusion.

That doesn't change the fact, Maulud is bid'a. If they born you well dig everything.

FriendChoice:


That doesn't change the fact, Maulud is bid'a. If they born you well dig everything.

You have a good day mister. You aint academia

Empiree:
You have a good day mister. You aint academia

Alright mister academia

In fact, it can be argued from the holy Qur'an that celebrating mawlud should be deemed an act that is at least permitted, mubah.

This is because if you carry out an act that expresses love or shows respect (or compassion) toward something that is regarded as something from among the symbols of Allah, then this show of love, respect, compassion etc is an indication of deep level of piety in the heart of such a person.

Qur'an 22:32
...if one observes the sanctity of the symbols of Allah, then such things emanate from the piety of the hearts.

...It means that respect for the Symbols of Allah is an evidence of the piety of heart, which indicates that the symbols of Allah are respected by the one who has taqwa (fear of Allah) in his heart and that taqwa is a quality which rests in one's heart...
Tafsir (Ma'ariful Qur'an)

Also it can be submitted that among the sha'airAllah, the coming of the prophet, sallAllahu alayhi wa sallam, is the most prominent. It is the moment the heart that is going to carry the message of Islam was delivered to the world. All other sha'airAllah became known to us through him, sallAllahu alayhi wa sallam.

It is mentioned in the Qur'an:
O Prophet, indeed We have sent you as a witness and a bringer of good tidings and a warner.
33:45

He, sallAllahu alayhi wa sallam, said in a hadith:
The Hour and I have been sent as close together as these two (his two fingers, sallAllahu alayhi wa sallam).
Sunan An-Nasa’i 1578

Now, this very important landmark for the entire humanity comes around only once in a year and some people are saying that it should not elicit any kind of reaction whatsoever from the entire muslim ummah? We should just keep mum like not a fly passed by?

For those who say the sahaba i kiram, radiyAllahu anh, did not celebrate mawlud, they should recall that the sahaba i kiram, radiyAllahu anhum, on a daily basis, showed personal connections to the prophet, sallAllahu alayhi wa sallam, out of respect and honor and that is besides what the religion has obligated upon them. They would kiss his hand, catch his spit etc. Were those actions recommended acts of worship? Of course, no. They did it out of love, respect and honor for him, sallAllahu alayhi wa sallam. However, us later muslims do not have this opportunity to connect to the personality of the prophet, sallAllahu alayhi wa sallam, like the sahaba, radiyAllahu anhum, had. Mawlud nabiyy offers that opportunity my dear brothers.

Imam Malik, rahmatUllahi alayh, is said to have rejected maulud nabiyy as quoted by @lexiconkabir.
Imaam Maalik said:
"The last generations of this ummah can only be rectified by that which rectified its first generations. What was not part of the religion then cannot become part of the religion now"

We ask: Where do they get this statement from if maulud nabiyy is meant to have been a sixth or seventh century innovation?

Imam Malik, rahmatUllahi alayh, is said to have rejected maulud nabiyy as quoted by @lexiconk.abir.
Imaam Maalik said:
"The last generations of this ummah can only be rectified by that which rectified its first generations. What was not part of the religion then cannot become part of the religion now"

We ask: Where do they get this statement from if maulud nabiyy is meant to have been a sixth or seventh century innovation?

shawl, i wonder how you think.

FriendChoice:


That doesn't change the fact, Maulud is bid'a. If they born you well dig everything.

LOL, dat 'if dem born u well' tho..LOL!

I've an advice akhee, once you've given much evidence, you just leave argument with Mr.Emp... He's been clamouring for this walimotu Quran and Quranic competition since, and our dear SNAPSCORE has done justice with evidence(S).

May Allaah preserve you, I and all of us upon goodness.

lexiconkabir:


shawl, i wonder how you think.

He thinks under the proverbial BOX!

RABIUSHILE04:


He thinks under the proverbial BOX!

imagine him saying what i did not say..

lexiconkabir:


shawl, i wonder how you think.

I grew up on Maliki School Of Thought. Although in my family, we do not celebrate mawlid. But at Ile-Kewu, we did one time including Quran competition and Walimot. None of the members of my family criticized it. They simply considered it a gathering to learn and part of ile-kewu curriculum. I have stated what we did in mawlud in 1996 and I have absolutely no reason to go against it.

However, from your quote about Imam Maliki, I have just read about it and I see CLEARLY prints of salafism there. They have exaggerate Maliki stance on Mawlud. His quote up there is true but at the same time, it is an open statement encompassing everything we may term bid'a today. That's why i told the brother up there that if we should dig, we will realize that, by definition of bid'a given by anti-mawlud people, ALL muslims one way or the other still practice bid'a. We better just leave it cuz it is bigger than we think.

Thats why i said in the other thread to Abumuhmmad that Shuyuk in Nigeria in the 80s and 90s have done exactly what we are doing now. Those Nigerian Shuyuk MUST have came across Imam Maliki's statement(ra). Did they misunderstoof it?. I dont think so. Most of them are Malikis.

So Imam Maliki's statement was simply not specific about Mawlud. If you want, i can post the link i just read and you will like it bcuz it is in your favor. Then again, I read on Muwattadotcom analysis of what and what is not permissible. Some acts are just plain neutral coined 'mubah'. But from the website i am talking about, one doesn't need Phd to figure out The Salafis and other anti-mawlud have interjected and exaggerated Imam malik's stance bcuz they have used the opportunity to quickly condemned many other things. That's when I laughed big I can see that RED FLAG.

Knowledge I gained there in 1996 still in my head today. But the website said nothing is good about mawlud even just the name itself and no beneficial knowledge. Really?.

Meanwhile, I have read some stuff recently where some scholar like Ibn Kathir and other(ra) wrote poetry on the day of Mawlud. Scholar are basically divided over it. This is contrary to the saying that "majority of scholars" go against Mawlud. Very well then, how come majority muslims still do it today?. What troubles me is the only countries that dont celebrate Mawlud are Saudi, Qatar and perhaps, UAE. But Saudi celebrate their Kings Day. UAE bought the largest xmas tree in 2010 (stand to be corrected) on display for millions of dollars (govt money). All these are permmisble and Shari'atic but Mawlud is bid'a and haram?. On the idelogical side, only Salafis and Deobandis do not celebrate Mawlud. Yet Deobandi scholars embraced other "great celebrations".This is why Muslims dont take anti-Mawlud serious. They see it like hypocricy.


Below is attachment from muwatta website

i wonder how Empiree also think, where in the quote did you see "mawlud"? abi ara n fun yin ni? are you being suspicious?

and yes! i didnt read that.

RABIUSHILE04:


LOL, dat 'if dem born u well' tho..LOL!

I've an advice akhee, once you've given much evidence, you just leave argument with Mr.Emp... He's been clamouring for this walimotu Quran and Quranic competition since, and our dear SNAPSCORE has done justice with evidence(S).

May Allaah preserve you, I and all of us upon goodness.

Ameen.

I agree with the evidence part. Issues that have clearly been discussed are still being brought up. One cannot be wasting his time going back and forth. Even Ibn Taymiyyah classified it as bidah but some people accept and take part (because it suits them) and then reject the others (that doesn't suit them).
Like Shaykh Al-Albaani (may Allah be pleased with him) mentioned - The person who is seeking the truth, one evidence will be enough for him. A person who is upon their desires, a thousand evidences will still not be clear for him.

RABIUSHILE04:


LOL, dat 'if dem born u well' tho..LOL!

I've an advice akhee, once you've given much evidence, you just leave argument with Mr.Emp... He's been clamouring for this walimotu Quran and Quranic competition since, and our dear SNAPSCORE has done justice with evidence(S).

May Allaah preserve you, I and all of us upon goodness.

Lol..."evidence"?. Evidence she prevented does not in any way validates Quran competition. It CLEARLY says scholars differ. And i was trying to say the same way they differ on mawlud. However, I was simply trying to frustrate friendchoice bcuz of his definition of bid'a bcuz i know for sure he is not against Quran competition. But it is not traced to the prophet either by definition of your bid'a. Quran competition itself started in 1961. Mawlud started centuries before that. So why supporting bida here, condemn it there is my problem with you people. And I still have more but hes already exhausted on Walimot and Quran competition.

I have no problems with Quran competition, Walimot etc but one of your brothers called fundament said it is bid'a. So i know how you people think.

RABIUSHILE04:


LOL, dat 'if dem born u well' tho..LOL!

I've an advice akhee, once you've given much evidence, you just leave argument with Mr.Emp... He's been clamouring for this walimotu Quran and Quranic competition since, and our dear SNAPSCORE has done justice with evidence(S).

May Allaah preserve you, I and all of us upon goodness.

Hahaha. He is threatening me as if am hiding some evil of Saudi that he wants to expose.

Ameen May Allah preserve you too.

lexiconkabir:
i wonder how Empi.ree also think, where in the quote did you see "mawlud"? abi ara n fun yin ni? are you being suspicious?

and yes! i didnt read that.

I imagined you replied the brother on Mawlud so i responded.

Empiree:
Lol..."evidence"?. Evidence she prevented does not in any way validates Quran competition. It CLEARLY says scholars differ. And i was trying to say the same way they differ on mawlud. However, I was simply trying to frustrate friendchoice bcuz of his definition of bid'a bcuz i know for sure he is not against Quran competition. But it is not traced to the prophet either by definition of your bid'a. Quran competition itself started in 1961. Mawlud started centuries before that. So why supporting bida here, condemn it there is my problem with you people. And I still have more but hes already exhausted on Walimot and Quran competition.

I have no problems with Quran competition, Walimot etc but one of your brothers called fundament said it is bid'a. So i know how you people think.

Hahaha frustrate who? Me or Yourself. The Truth is very clear from falsehood. You're only frustrating yourself 4 me to accept Maulud as Sunnah which is dead on arrival. Maulud is Bid'a.

FriendChoice:



Hahaha frustrate who? Me or Yourself. The Truth is very clear from falsehood. You're only frustrating yourself 4 me to accept Maulud as Sunnah which is dead on arrival. Maulud is Bid'a.

You basically speaking out of desire now. You dont think. It is as clear as day light neither you nor your cohorts answer my question. Free mind readers know where i am driving at. You all silent when i bring Saudi and clans up. Thats called hypocrisy bcus you know I can dig up many things. I rather just leave it.

Keep shouting milad is bida while you support celebrations of Kings who are far beneath the prophet. So i know how you think. Until you openly declare here that National/Kings holiday celebrated on September 24 in Saudi Arabia is bid'a, then, what's the point of arguing with you.

Empiree:
You basically speaking out of desire now. You dont think. It is as clear as day light neither you nor your cohorts answer my question. Free mind readers know where i am driving at. You all silent when i bring Saudi and clans up. Thats called hypocrisy bcus you know I can dig up many things. I rather just leave it.

Keep shouting milad is bida while you support celebrations of Kings who are far beneath the prophet. So i know how you think. Until you openly declare here that National/Kings holiday celebrated on September 24 in Saudi Arabia is bid'a, then, what's the point of arguing with you.

And who has tell that is part of religion? Do they tell you its part of religion. Example if you celebrate independence of Nigeria as a Nigerian is that Islam.

It's not even Islam talkles of categorizing it as Sunnah or Bid'a. What of Maulud and Salatul fatihi?



Educate yourself here

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saudi_National_Day