petra1:


We are not under the law as s system , how ever there are principles the law contains that are principles of the kingdom of God . These principles have no expiry date . Many of them even existed before the law came . Such as Prayer , fasting , Tiyhed and offering , helping strangers , honoring parents . Etc. These are not shadows which christ fulfilled .



What You’re talking was in the law too. It’s called FREEWILL OFFERING . No matter how much a man condemns content of the law . He will still find himself contradicting himself . Because the content of the law is good because if it is the law of God . It reveals Gods mins but seeking justification by the law is a curse .

So the most important laws that Pastors preach about these days are those pertaining to giving and money?
Whatever happens to the law concerning Sabbath. As far as I'm concerned, this was instituted at the 7th day of creation, yet we hear pastors preaching this law has been nailed to the cross (I wonder how a part of the moral can be nailed to the cross).
A point of correction, tithing laws didn't preceed the moral laws (ten commandments). What happened at Sinai was just a reminder (you can read up the verses). People have always known that killing, adultery, theft, worshipping images, profaning the Sabbath, etc, are sins. The moral laws of God is as old as sin itself (without the law, there is no sin, right?). What's new is the ceremonial laws which pertains to festivals, rites, first fruits, etc. All the mandatory givings are under this ceremonial laws.
I'm not aware of anyone in the New Testament paying tithes as it was done under the old covenant. What we had was believers giving according to their capabilities (may be more than a tenth) and how it was spent, was not at the discretion of one G.O. And it's on record that it wasn't all money. They used the proceed to assist believers who were lacking.
What do we have today? Pastors flying jets while church members go to bed empty stomach.
It's OK to pay tithes, but it should also be made clear that tithers may not necessarily make heaven.

Goshen360:


We the anti tithe knows this BUT....

The question is, when did or at what point up to the dispensation of Grace did Abraham tithe BECAME a LAW for CHRISTIANS to do EVERY MONTH OR WEEK?

The point when you became Abraham's seed.

otr1:

So the most important laws that Pastors preach about these days are those pertaining to giving and money?

Not true pastors are not preaching law. they teach the whole counsel of the word of God . salvation,holy spirit ,speaking in tongues,prayers,righteousness,evangelism. how come you didnt mention all these? you are the one dwelling on money .

happens to the law concerning Sabbath. As far as I'm concerned, this was instituted at the 7th day of creation, yet we hear pastors preaching this law has been nailed to the cross (I wonder how a part of the moral can be nailed to the cross).

sabbath is shadow . christ is sabbath

point of correction, tithing laws didn't preceed the moral laws (ten commandments). What happened at Sinai was just a reminder (you can read up the verses). People have always known that killing, adultery, theft, worshipping images, profaning the Sabbath, etc, are sins. The moral laws of God is as old as sin itself (without the law, there is no sin, right?). What's new is the ceremonial laws which pertains to festivals, rites, first fruits, etc. All the mandatory givings are under this ceremonial laws.

i said this many times , principles in the kingdom of God existed before the law and in the law. prayer ,fasting, offering ,tithe ,almsgiving ,worship etc are all eternal why do you do all these and its only tithe you single out nit to do? thats the question

not aware of anyone in the New Testament paying tithes as it was done under the old covenant.

its not about how it was done. Abel gave first fruit ,God told isreal to give first fruit because they came out of slavery.but Abel did not come out of slavery . first fruit ,first born all belong to God. because he's alpha. its not the HOW that counts but the WHAT. the offering structure or tithe structure may differ but the important thing is that tithes and offerings are principles in Gods kingdom

we had was believers giving according to their capabilities (may be more than a tenth)

of course some honest saints see tithe as a limitation and thats the problem they have with the legalism. my own is if God hasn't stopped tithe . we must keep giving tithe . it does not stop us from giving more for other things

and how it was spent, was not at the discretion of one G.O. And it's on record that it wasn't all money. They used the proceed to assist believers who were lacking.

there are different kings of givings or collections in the bible ,thats only one of them

do we have today? Pastors flying jets while church members go to bed empty stomach.

thats not true. how many members go to bed on empty stomach? are you saying the God they serve and pray to does not answer prayer? we should not rubbish the word of God because we don't want to give him his tithe, God promise those who give to receive.

OK to pay tithes, but it should also be made clear that tithers may not necessarily make heaven.

im not aware any preacher connects tithes to heaven

Gombs:



The point when you became Abraham's seed.

JOKER!

Next time, think before you report to a question like this. Paul didn't connect Christians with Abraham based on tithe BUT on FAITH IN CHRIST and the finished works. I'm not and Christians are not Abraham seed by tithe but by faith.

THOSE WHO ARE OF FAITH.....not those who tithe....ARE ABRAHAM SEED. Btw, seed NOT as in biological products because I know my biological father just as much as I know my heavenly father and my spiritual father. You guys like to confuse folks with KJV English.

petra1:


The Old Testament was with Moses. Secret of tithing was already revealed to Abraham 400 years earlier


theres no new testament tithe. tithe is tithe. 10% of what you are blessed with.



there are different kinds of givings in the word of God. free will offering to God,tithes, Alms for the poor, giving to parents etc. one should not take the place of the other.



thats the point . for a giver ,tithe is one of our smallest giving. but the issue is not about the size but the instruction and its spirituality

Really am not getting something here. You mean Abraham is not under old testament?
Or are you saying that everything Abraham did we should copy because he did under grace since we are now following Abraham?

Is Christ not the one that said new law he is giving us to Love God will all our mind and soul and love our neighbour as ourselves. That in that their is no Judgement but have moved from death to life.

luckyCO:


Really am not getting something here. You mean Abraham is not under old testament?

The Sinai covenant is what is referred to as Old covenant or testament .

Exodus 24:7-8
7 And he took the book of the covenant, and read in the audience of the people: and they said, All that the Lord hath said will we do, and be obedient. 8 And Moses took the blood, and sprinkled it on the people, and said, Behold the blood of the covenant, which the Lord hath made with you concerning all these words.

Hebrews 9:18-19
18 Whereupon neither the first testament was dedicated without blood. 19 For when Moses had spoken every precept to all the people according to the law, he took the blood of calves and of goats, with water, and scarlet wool, and hyssop, and sprinkled both the book, and all the people,

luckyCO:

Or are you saying that everything Abraham did we should copy because he did under grace since we are now following Abraham?

Abraham was not under the law . He was called father of faith . He was justified by faith . Every one who received justification by faith is called seed of Abraham

Galatians 3:7-8
7 Know ye therefore that they which are of faith, the same are the children of Abraham. 8 And the scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the heathen through faith, preached before the gospel unto Abraham, saying, In thee shall all nations be blessed.

Is Christ not the one that said new law he is giving us to Love God will all our mind and soul and love our neighbour as ourselves. That in that their is no Judgement but have moved from death to life.

Yes he is

petra1:
... thats the point
for a giver, tithe is one of our smallest giving
but the issue is not about the size but the instruction and its spirituality

If as you say "tithe is one of our smallest giving" sic, what are the examples or list of the remaining other smallest giving please?

petra1:

It's laughable when some who don't study their bibles feel there is a hidden conspiracy about tithing in the church which pastors have been covering up. Daddy freeze claims that the Bible. Command tithes to be uses to drink beer. Firstly that's is insult to God and stupid .

Let me explain the manipulation and error of Daddy freeze here . He told a lie that tithe is to be given to the poor and to eat and drink that is error .

Tithe belong to God right right from the days of father Abraham who’s principle of faith we follow .

Under the law God still commanded isreal to give tithes and offerings. Which is used for the service of the house of God and welfare and support of workers and ministers there .


Leviticus 27:30.
And all the tithe of the land, whether of the seed of the land, or of the fruit of the tree, is the Lord's: it is holy unto the Lord.

Numbers 18:21-25
21 And, behold, I have given the Levites all the tithes in Israel for an inheritance in return for their service which they serve, the [menial] service of the Tent of Meeting.

After God I used Ted them on the tithe he asked the people to give another 10% to the poor every 3 years and another 10% for a love feast to eat and drink . That doesn’t replace the tithe to God. And that is the error and deception of daddy freeze . He didn’t mentioned the title to God and gave the impression that the other 10% for feast and for the poor were the same. .

As much as we are not tithing based on the law. We tithe based on Abrahamic revelation . However the explanation here is to throw light on the misrepresentation by daddy freeze .


THERE WERE THREE DIFFERENT KINDS OF TITHES

There were three different kinds of tithes in the Bible . Daddy freeze dwell on a minor one to rubbish the major one .

The three different types are as follows:

1. THE LEVITICAL TITHE (sacred to God).

Leviticus 27:30
And all the tithe of the land, whether of the seed of the land, or of the fruit of the tree, is the Lord's: it is holy unto the Lord

This tithe is used for the work of service in the place of worship and also for the welfare of the workers there.

Numbers 18:21-25
21 And, behold, I have given the Levites all the tithes in Israel for an inheritance in return for their service which they serve, the [menial] service of the Tent of Meeting.


2. THE TITHE OF THE FEAST (Deut. 14:22-27).(daddy freeze beer boozing tithe )
Deuteronomy 14:22-23
Thou shalt truly tithe all the increase of thy seed, that the field bringeth forth year by year. And thou shalt eat before the Lord thy God, in the place which he shall choose to place his name there, the tithe of thy corn, of thy wine, and of thine oil, and the firstlings of thy herds and of thy flocks; that thou mayest learn to fear the Lord thy God always.


3. THE TITHE FOR THE POOR (Deut. 14:28, 29). (Every 3 years)
This is done once in very 3 years . It is shared among the poor . While the main annual tithe still runs .

Deuteronomy 14:28-29
At the end of three years thou shalt bring forth all the tithe of thine increase the same year, and shalt lay it up within thy gates: And the Levite, (because he hath no part nor inheritance with thee,) and the stranger, and the fatherless, and the widow, which are within thy gates, shall come, and shall eat and be satisfied; that the Lord thy God may bless thee in all the work of thine hand which thou doest

The first tithe, the one we trace back to Abra­ham (Gen. 14:18-20), is the sacred tithe, given to the Levites and priests for their service to the temple and the congregation in the Old Testa­ment. This is the tithe we continue to give under the priesthood of Melchizedek in the New Testa­ment. It is the tithe consecrated to God and the furtherance of the gospel and has, therefore, validity for all believers in Christ.

Paul was clear enough .

1 Corinthians 9:13-14
Do ye not know that they which minister about holy things live of the things of the temple? and they which wait at the altar are partakers with the altar? Even so hath the Lord ordained that they which preach the gospel should live of the gospel

Now some may say Paul didn't accept support . That's no big deal . He didn't accept support in Corinth because of their carnality . But he accepted support from some other churches . Same goes for pastors today . Most pastors serve voluntarily. They don't receive support . Over 9% of pastors in Deeper life ,Redeem ,CEC, winners are serving voluntarily. They have their own jobs . In fact one of the criterial by which you are sent out is to first have a good job . Except only few who may be required to serve full time and they may have to resign from their job. To get support from church . Church tithe is used to pay workers , church rent , maintainance , equipment ,projects , generator fuel. Chair hire etc and other expenditures. The pastor is not the owner of church money . Every ministry has structure by which money is handled . A pastor in redeem cannot dip his hand into church account . There are approvals from head quarters for expenditure. Not what bloggers online post who don't even go to church

We are not giving tithes as commanded under the law . Our tithing dates to Abraham before the law came . And that it why the other kinds of tithes were not emphasized . So daddy freeze only dwell on the feast party which is not abrahamic . And antitithers are jumping up that they have a hero (who is not even a Christian )

Live off the gospel and it doesn't say tithe.et me give you a run down as a major figure behind the scenes in what you call modern Pentecostalism. Reinhard Bonnke is not your first point of contact with money. People pay tithes to their so called churches, they then give offerings to that same church weekly, and finally what ever left overs they are, they call CFAN and donate. Don't ask me how I know, I'm in house with Ministries at this level i.e global and so I can safely say you are way back in the queue regarding running of what is called a global ministry. Hinn, Hagin, Reinhard, Copeland , creflo, Joyce etc are the global ministers who are known the world over and not limited to a country like Nigeria. The little amount Cfan gets, is sufficient for all the task you see. Reinhard earns what you call a decent salary, look it up online for ref. He doesn't have four jets and yet has the largest meetings which run monthly on average. The point is the so called tithe you make mention off was created to feed a whole tribe.. a tenth of God fed the twelfth of God. Every child of a Levite continued in the priesthood and the funds met that need. Your tithe to your local congregation does not feed a 12rh of it. God's given you a simple brain to use, so I bid thee to use it. Matthew ashimolowo had over £9 million GBP cash from offerings stacked in his house when the Charity commission raided. When you understand the extent to which the tithe went, you'll understand that God isn't a God of silly waste. Abraham was super rich with servants etc when he tithes once. It isn't recorded that Abraham was told to continue tithing neither did he state he would. The Israelites who were told tithe were all given lands apart from the tribe of Levite and thats why it was continuous. In the new testament, they sold all their lands and shared amongst themselves. Understand the work of the cross and what really happened at Calvary and you'll fling this tithe doctrine to where it belongs. Kenneth E having who I love and respect with all his knowledge could only write a page on tithing and also that was filled with many ifs and buts from him. People quote Jesus in Matt 23:23 how've they fail to realise that in that statement, he classed tithes as a lesser part of the law. The truth is that religiously we tithe the same way we circumcise our kids at birth. Hard to accept but true.

Melchizedek was an allegory of the work of the cross which you haven't grasped if not you would have seen that the whole book of Hebrews was written to show the depths of the work of the cross. The same way the tithes paid by Abraham was accredited to the Levites who were unborn and had done no work to deserve that payment, is the same way the price paid by Christ is accredited to you when you have faith in his finished work

petra1:


Abraham was not under the law . He was called father of faith . He was justified by faith . Every one who received justification by faith is called seed of Abraham

Galatians 3:7-8
7 Know ye therefore that they which are of faith, the same are the children of Abraham. 8 And the scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the heathen through faith, preached before the gospel unto Abraham, saying, In thee shall all nations be blessed.



Yes he is

Though you didn't answer my question. I will leave it because I want to learn.
Since I dont want to limit or bride God by my 10% as our pastors have made it look I hereby ask again.
Who replaced Melchizedek now that I should take my tithe to?
Who did Jacob paid tithe to and what did he pay?
Is vow the same as tithe, because only what I saw Jacob did was Vow



Who replaced Melchizedek

Goshen360:


JOKER!

Next time, think before you report to a question like this. Paul didn't connect Christians with Abraham based on tithe BUT on FAITH IN CHRIST and the finished works. I'm not and Christians are not Abraham seed by tithe but by faith.

THOSE WHO ARE OF FAITH.....not those who tithe....ARE ABRAHAM SEED. Btw, seed NOT as in biological products because I know my biological father just as much as I know my heavenly father and my spiritual father. You guys like to confuse folks with KJV English.

Abraham Seed referred often in the bible was Christ.Abraham was a vessel/channel God used to ursher Christ.
The Old was a shadow/prototype of the New.
Some pple need to google OLD and NEW,PAST and PRESENT.

petra1:


Abraham was not under the law . He was called father of faith . He was justified by faith . Every one who received justification by faith is called seed of Abraham

Galatians 3:7-8
7 Know ye therefore that they which are of faith, the same are the children of Abraham. 8 And the scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the heathen through faith, preached before the gospel unto Abraham, saying, In thee shall all nations be blessed.



Yes he is

What do you mean by seed of Abraham?
So if we are justify by faith we are Abraham seed and not Christ seed?

MuttleyLaff:
If as you say "tithe is one of our smallest giving" sic, what are the examples or list of the remaining other smallest giving please?

People do give seeds as they are led. Which is higher than tithe. Lands , cars . Also . In some churches like ours we do give partnership . For several ministry work , Tv programmes , satellite , radio , prison , hospital , Innercity for the less privilege motherless , scholarship etc . On monthly bases . These are far more than tithe . Someone once gave me a brand new Prado . I only used it for few months and dropped it at seed. Pls this is not self Glory . My elder brother gave me a 4runner last year . But by august i gave it as a seed . I’m using one old jalopy now without a/c. . This has happened often .

You probably read about someone gave 100 million dollar or so for loveworld USA . When Benny Hinn was trying to raise donation .Some even gave higher later. When someone lives a life of giving , tithe is a small thing . The biggest giving are the seed . Someone single handedly built a winner chapel church with billions . Sometimes in sowing seed a man may even empty his account as he is led . So to say somebody want to deliver sheep from 10% because that’s what makes pastors rich is laughable . Tithes and offerings belong to church . Pastors money comes from gifts . Especially if he has spiritual gift like healing , prophecy , miracles . Those who get Blessed will appreciate who had blessed them .

ichuka:

What do you mean by seed of Abraham?
So if we are justify by faith we are Abraham seed and not Christ seed?

Christ is seed of Abraham

ichuka:

Abraham Seed referred often in the bible was Christ.Abraham was a vessel/channel God used to ursher Christ.
The Old was a shadow/prototype of the New.
Some pple need to google OLD and NEW,PAST and PRESENT.

You're indeed a JOKER just like Goshen360 said. So tell us where in New Testament Christ collected tithe or paid tithe since you said "Abraham seed referred often in the bible was Christ" How come there wasn't continuation? You are just so confused. Imagine how our money focused pastors are milking us dry despite that we are not the real isrealite, what would have happened if we are the real isrealite. I don't blame the so called money focused pastors I blamed the gullible followers who think it's God collecting their tithe. Even when they are aware that paying of tithe won't make them inherit heaven if they lose the salvation of their soul.

Grace001:



You're indeed a JOKER just like Goshen360 said. So tell us where in New Testament Christ collected tithe or paid tithe since you said "Abraham seed referred often in the bible was Christ" How come there wasn't continuation? You are just so confused. Imagine how our money focused pastors are milking us dry despite that we are not the real isrealite, what would have happened if we are the real isrealite. I don't blame the so called money focused pastors I blamed the gullible followers who think it's God collecting their tithe. Even when they are aware that paying of tithe won't make them inherit heaven if they lose the salvation of their soul.

Do you problem with comprehsion?

petra1:


Christ is seed of Abraham

Then why focus on Abraham instead of Christ alone?

ichuka:

Do you problem with comprehsion?

Goshen360:


JOKER!

Next time, think before you report to a question like this. Paul didn't connect Christians with Abraham based on tithe BUT on FAITH IN CHRIST and the finished works. I'm not and Christians are not Abraham seed by tithe but by faith.

THOSE WHO ARE OF FAITH.....not those who tithe....ARE ABRAHAM SEED. Btw, seed NOT as in biological products because I know my biological father just as much as I know my heavenly father and my spiritual father. You guys like to confuse folks with KJV English.

Did anyone force you to tithe?
At what point did Christ Or His apostles forbid tithing or encouraged Christians to rebuke others tithing?

Grace001:



You're indeed a JOKER just like Goshen360 said. So tell us where in New Testament Christ collected tithe or paid tithe since you said "Abraham seed referred often in the bible was Christ" How come there wasn't continuation? You are just so confused. Imagine how our money focused pastors are milking us dry despite that we are not the real isrealite, what would have happened if we are the real isrealite. I don't blame the so called money focused pastors I blamed the gullible followers who think it's God collecting their tithe. Even when they are aware that paying of tithe won't make them inherit heaven if they lose the salvation of their soul.

Where in the NT did Christ take His bath? Can we say he didn't just because it wasn't written down?


Milk you dry? How much you get?

Gombs:

Where in the NT did Christ take His bath? Can we say he didn't just because it wasn't written down?

Milk you dry? How much you get?

This is where you guys ALWAYS go off course.

Is having bath the bone of contention?
Has anyone said that having bath brings material or financial blessings?
Is having bath a doctrinal issues?

You guys CANNOT JUSTIFY your monetary tithing for the Christian.

You then resort to deflecting questions when you're unable to provide answers.

Again, what Jesus Christ brought about in the Church is SUPERIOR to anything pre-law, under law or whatever else you can think of.

petra1:


Not true pastors are not preaching law. they teach the whole counsel of the word of God . salvation,holy spirit ,speaking in tongues,prayers,righteousness,evangelism. how come you didnt mention all these? you are the one dwelling on money .

They dwell most on monetary matters than on salvation. No Sunday will go by without the mention of how important it is to give in most churches.
Giving is not a priority in Christianity, salvation is. And no one can be saved by just giving.

People give in the hope of getting blessings from God in return (that's the preaching). How many people give nowadays without having that expectation?

sabbath is shadow . christ is sabbath

No Bro., Sabbath of the fourth commandment is not a shadow of anything or anyone. It's a law of God and it's not pointing us to the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ. It's a pity if you don't know the difference between the 10 commandments ( placed within the ark of covenant :Exodus 40:20) and the law of moses/ceremonial laws (placed outside the ark:Deut. 31:24-26). The formal points us to sin, while the latter was the remedy for sin. In this dispensation, the 10 commandments still point us to sin, but now, Jesus is our remedy for sin. In essence, the ceremonial or the law of Moses was a shadow of the death and resurrection of Jesus and was nailed to the cross, not the 10 commandments. Except of course, you don't know that it's part of the law that says 'thou shall not kill', 'thou shall not commit adultery', 'thou shall not have any other God beside me', etc. They are all cast in stone (you know that's a symbol of eternity right?).

i said this many times , principles in the kingdom of God existed before the law and in the law. prayer ,fasting, offering ,tithe ,almsgiving ,worship etc are all eternal why do you do all these and its only tithe you single out nit to do? thats the question

There is no principle that existed before the law. If you think the law first came into existence at Sinai, you're mistaken. On what basis was Lucifer banished from heaven? On what basis was Adam and Eve sent away from Eden? On what basis was the world destroyed during the days of Noah? On what basis was Sodom and Gomorrah destroyed?
We all know that the law defines what sin is and that there is no sin without the law. How then can you say anything existed before the law of God when sin itself is older than all the principles you've mentioned?
Of all the things you mentioned, it's the law of God and worship that are eternal. There won't be any need for prayer, fasting and offering in paradise, you know?

its not about how it was done. Abel gave first fruit ,God told isreal to give first fruit because they came out of slavery.but Abel did not come out of slavery . first fruit ,first born all belong to God. because he's alpha. its not the HOW that counts but the WHAT. the offering structure or tithe structure may differ but the important thing is that tithes and offerings are principles in Gods kingdom

Giving first fruit was not a requirement for Abel. He did it out of free will. Anybody can do that now. Now the principle of giving first fruits and tithes as specified for the Israelites are contained in the same law that Apostle Paul refers to as the handwriting of ordinance that was nailed to the cross.

of course some honest saints see tithe as a limitation and thats the problem they have with the legalism. my own is if God hasn't stopped tithe . we must keep giving tithe . it does not stop us from giving more for other things



there are different kings of givings or collections in the bible ,thats only one of them

Tithe-as specified in the old covenant-is not a requirement for Christians under the faith of Jesus Christ. You may check the whole New Testament and you will not find a single mention of tithe. What we had was believers giving according to their will -even selling their belongings -to take care of the less privileged among them.

thats not true. how many members go to bed on empty stomach?

This is like asking how many people are poor in Nigeria. Common man, are you seriously asking me that question?
How many people can afford to send their children to these universities owned by churches?
What's the essence of building a school with God's money when most God's children can not afford to study there? Proceeds of offerings in the time of the apostles were used to take care of the less privileged and not to make profits out of it.

are you saying the God they serve and pray to does not answer prayer?

No, that's not what I'm saying. But it's a fact that we will always have the poor among us (Jesus actually said it).

we should not rubbish the word of God because we don't want to give him his tithe, God promise those who give to receive.

Nobody is rubbishing the word of God. It's no more God's tithe if it's not serving the purpose of God.

im not aware any preacher connects tithes to heaven

That's the point. Why so much emphasis on a subject that can't get you eternity?

Grace001:

Do you have problems with comprehension?

Gombs:


Did anyone force you to tithe?
At what point did Christ Or His apostles forbid tithing or encouraged Christians to rebuke others tithing?

Because His Apostles rebuked or are against tithing FOR CHRISTIANS. Dare me on this one....

ichuka:

Abraham Seed referred often in the bible was Christ.Abraham was a vessel/channel God used to ursher Christ.
The Old was a shadow/prototype of the New.
Some pple need to google OLD and NEW,PAST and PRESENT.

Don't mind these tithe yahoos....lol. You dismantle the Abraham tithe and tell them to show why Christians should tithe because Abraham did or after the example of Abraham, they come up with.....you're Abraham seed. I'm just sick and tired of these guys twisting scriptures

Goshen360:


Don't mind these tithe yahoos....lol. You dismantle the Abraham tithe and tell them to show why Christians should tithe because Abraham did or after the example of Abraham, they come up with.....you're Abraham seed. I'm just sick and tired of these guys twisting scriptures

My Bro I tire oo.
The bible as a whole has one "Person" in Full view which is CHRIS.
All God wants to give us from the Beginning was Grace!!
In Genesis1:1 it was:God created the Heavens and Earth.(full stop)
It was never "in the begining God and man created anything"
So all God wants to give us was Grace!!
Adam was a type of Christ,Abraham was also a vessel of whom Christ will manifest,Isaac was purely a type of Christ(being the Son) he represent Grace because he did "NOTHING"
Jacob was the experience/dealings of the cross.Joseph was also purely a shadow of Christ ETC.
So Bro
Most Christains don't know that when Christ said "ITS FINISH" on the cross was when He's creation in Genesis was completed.

Goshen360:


Because His Apostles rebuked or are against tithing FOR CHRISTIANS. Dare me on this one....

Do you have comprehension issues?

My question was "at what point..."

plainbibletruth:


This is where you guys ALWAYS go off course.

Is having bath the bone of contention?
Has anyone said that having bath brings material or financial blessings?
Is having bath a doctrinal issues?

You guys CANNOT JUSTIFY your monetary tithing for the Christian.

You then resort to deflecting questions when you're unable to provide answers.

Again, what Jesus Christ brought about in the Church is SUPERIOR to anything pre-law, under law or whatever else you can think of.

Uncle, my point is.. Just because it wasn't written down in the Bible that Jesus paid tithes or his apostles,doesn't mean he didn't.

Hence the bath comparison. Do you understand now?

Gombs:

Uncle, my point is.. Just because it wasn't written down in the Bible that Jesus paid tithes or his apostles,doesn't mean he didn't.
Hence the bath comparison. Do you understand now?

And my point is.. Just because it wasn't written down in the Bible that Jesus paid tithes or his apostles MEANS that it is NOT an essential part of the Christian Way of Life.

Remember, the Church is The Body of Christ. Does that mean anything to you? Did any other people, pre-law or under the Law have the kind of relationship with God as the Church with Christ?

Insisting on GOING BACK to pre-law or the Law to determine the SPIRITUAL LIFE of the Church Age believer is CHEAPENING the work of Christ and the relationship today's believer has with God as a result of who he is IN CHRIST.

plainbibletruth:


And my point is.. Just because it wasn't written down in the Bible that Jesus paid tithes or his apostles MEANS that it is NOT an essential part of the Christian Way of Life.

Remember, the Church is The Body of Christ. Does that mean anything to you? Did any other people, pre-law or under the Law have the kind of relationship with God as the Church with Christ?

Insisting on GOING BACK to pre-law or the Law to determine the SPIRITUAL LIFE of the Church Age believer is CHEAPENING the work of Christ and the relationship today's believer has with God as a result of who he is IN CHRIST.

Thanks for teaching them the BASICS of our faith. My whole life changed with 1 Cor. 15v14.

plainbibletruth:


And my point is.. Just because it wasn't written down in the Bible that Jesus paid tithes or his apostles MEANS that it is NOT an essential part of the Christian Way of Life.

Same thing as
Child dedication
Church wedding
Etc
As they are not written down, does it mean that they are not essential parts of the Christian way of life.?

Let's not forget...Jesus knew better that there would be a new church. Yet, He gave tithes (he was a Jew) yet with this knowledge, he didn't condemn tithing,knowing he went against some Jewish customs in His day... But some of you are busy condemning tithing no one forced you to tithe, una Weldone o.

Remember, the Church is The Body of Christ. Does that mean anything to you? Did any other people, pre-law or under the Law have the kind of relationship with God as the church with Christ?

??

Insisting on GOING BACK to pre-law or the Law to determine the SPIRITUAL LIFE of the Church Age believer is CHEAPENING the work of Christ and the relationship today's believer has with God as a result of who he is IN CHRIST.

[/quote]

Who is termed the Father of faith? Is your faith better than his just because you are of a dispensation of Grace? If you are Christ's then you are Abraham's seed and heir according to the promise.

Your submission is invalid

Gombs:


Same thing as
Child dedication
Church wedding
Etc
As they are not written down, does it mean that they are not essential parts of the Christian way of life.?

Let's not forget...Jesus knew better that there would be a new church. Yet, He gave tithes (he was a Jew) yet with this knowledge, he didn't condemn tithing,

??

Who is termed the Father of faith?

Your submission is invalid

Yes! They are not essential part.
In case you're confused let me give you a question to clear your head: Is the marriage between two unbelievers valid or invalid before God?

If I ask you to show us where Jesus tithed your next response will be "Show me where he didn't" even though you made the unsubstantiated statement in the first place.

If Jesus hadn't made this statement; "Truly I tell you, among those born of women there has not risen anyone greater than John the Baptist; yet whoever is least in the kingdom of heaven is greater than he." many of you would have argued that John the Baptist is greater than anyone in Christ.

You're again just bandying words around. What is the meaning of father of faith? You make unsubstantiated statements and turn around to claim that another person's submission is invalid. What is YOUR meaning of "invalid"?

It is NOT about man. It's ALL about God. He chooses whom to ELEVATE and whom not to. He - God - decided in eternity past "that we, who were the first to put our hope in Christ, might be for the praise of his glory." Ephesians 1:12. God chose "that we might be a kind of firstfruits of all he created." James 1:18. Do you see any UNIQUENESS of the Church from these?

So, if you choose to elevate what God HAS NOT elevated you stand to bear the consequences. If you disregard your position IN Christ and choose to go back to live in the old, to your master you will stand accountable one day.

How THE LORD'S PEOPLE are to give is very CLEAR in the Scripture. The Gospel the Apostles preached was IN EVERY WAY new and different from whatever obtained before it. BUT many today dont seem to see that. No wonder Apostle Paul prayed "that the eyes of your heart may be enlightened in order that you may know the hope to which he has called you, the riches of his glorious inheritance in his holy people..." Ephesians 1:18.

It is the opening of the eyes of the heart that will help you guys distinguish between REALITY and the present day GIMMICK called TITHING for which Scriptures are twisted to argue from every conceivable position.