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Re: Is Sex In Marriage Carnal? by Nobody: 1:59pm On Feb 28, 2018 |
OkCornel: OkCornel: No, it is Paul’s letters that apply general solutions to generic issues not me. I take your point that Paul wrote letters to specific churches to address in some cases, specific issues, those letters, admonishments, exhortations e.t.c. now form the doctrinal basis of Ecclesia, I did not say the foundation for Christianity, I wrote “Ecclesiastical Christianity” that is to say the philosophical and ecumenical basis of Christianity, the body and volume of Pentecostal Christianity that the sparse words of Jesus did not convey, there is a difference. Therefore your shouting of no Jesus no Paul is wholly unnecessary. You ask why Paul did not write a single letter to all the churches, Why would he have to? Paul established a great many churches and those gatherings would have a uniform standard of behaviour grounded in Law as evidenced when he begins the verse in 1 Corinthians, It would have been those churches who derogated from acceptable standards of behaviour supposedly who would have been addressed. In any event I am only concerned with what Paul actually did write. |
Re: Is Sex In Marriage Carnal? by OkCornel(m): 2:03pm On Feb 28, 2018 |
Sarassin: Per the bolded...so having this knowledge, how did you conclude that Paul is totally against women speaking in the church (all the churches both then and now) whilst he was addressing Timothy and the Corinthians? |
Re: Is Sex In Marriage Carnal? by MuttleyLaff: 2:05pm On Feb 28, 2018 |
Sarassin:Glad to read this about how you in a positive light, personally see Paul. We live in a man's world, which from Jesus' time to date, increasingly is becoming a woman’s world Sarassin:It's no elephant in no room, when this in the past came up, I had posited that if not all, are Paul's authorship, nothing wrong in a ghost writer filling in for him Sarassin:I didn't miss the point you were trying to make I saw it but just over stepped it because it was a red herring. Compare 1 Timothy 2:12 with Priscilla whom you so gladly admitted you know. Was Priscilla told off for teaching Apollos? Also no one, not even Paul, not even in the remotest posited nor required that a man should to obtain the consent of his wife for sex. What the earlier verse 1 Corinthians 7:1 and the passage surrounding it, was talking about was the question put to Paul, whether it was good for a man, not to have sexual relations with a woman. It had nothing on or about free pass |
Re: Is Sex In Marriage Carnal? by Nobody: 2:07pm On Feb 28, 2018 |
OkCornel: By the very obvious fact that Paul did not ask men to refrain from speaking in church. |
Re: Is Sex In Marriage Carnal? by OkCornel(m): 2:10pm On Feb 28, 2018 |
Sarassin: In the Corinthian church yes...in his letter to Timothy yes... What of his other letters? 2 Likes |
Re: Is Sex In Marriage Carnal? by Nobody: 2:41pm On Feb 28, 2018 |
MuttleyLaff:Thanks and true. MuttleyLaff: Well then MuttleyLaff has spoken and that’s it sorted then! So pseudonymous writings attributed to Paul are now Paul’s authorship? I suppose I commend you for accepting the possibility of a ghost writer. You’ll get there in the end. MuttleyLaff: Clearly both accounts are contradictory in nature, and that is the conundrum of the Pastoral Epistles. I believe that those who wrote the Pastoral Epistles made a huge assumption about Paul's attitude towards women. I think Paul had a clear idea of how he saw the female laity and their role within the church but this did not preclude women of substance playing a leading role. I think that those who wrote the Pastorals failed to see this distinction. |
Re: Is Sex In Marriage Carnal? by Nobody: 2:43pm On Feb 28, 2018 |
OkCornel: I refer you to my previous posts. You either accept all the Pauline corpus as scripture or none at all, there are no distinctions to be made. |
Re: Is Sex In Marriage Carnal? by OkCornel(m): 2:53pm On Feb 28, 2018 |
Sarassin: Then you see things as black or white...with no grey in-between... Let's simplify this thing so we do not major on minor issues... 1) What was Jesus and the Holy Spirit's position on this matter? 2) I believe God does not discriminate...the Holy Spirit was poured out on all believers (male & female) during the Pentecost 3) If a woman is led by the Spirit of God to give a revelation in the church would Jesus or Paul shut her up or permit her to speak? 1 Like |
Re: Is Sex In Marriage Carnal? by Nobody: 3:08pm On Feb 28, 2018 |
OkCornel: You make the same mistake that many Christians make, you conflate the spiritual and the temporal. That women received the Holy Spirit is no determinant whatsoever. We are talking about temporal laws. |
Re: Is Sex In Marriage Carnal? by OkCornel(m): 3:16pm On Feb 28, 2018 |
Sarassin: Temporal laws that are no longer relevant today since the issues they were meant to resolve are no longer applicable? Is that what you meant here? Because I thought I hammered on the fact that Paul wrote those things on women to the Corinthian church and to Timothy for some reasons which does not apply to all the churches existing at that point in time or in the present times... 2 Likes |
Re: Is Sex In Marriage Carnal? by Nobody: 3:29pm On Feb 28, 2018 |
OkCornel: You wrote your own opinion. What Paul wrote carries universal applicability even though he addressed his comments to the Men and Women of the Corinthian church, by mere dint of the fact that all his other letters apply universally, then so does this one. If it is deemed no longer relevant then it is up to the church hierarchy to make the necessary amendments. Is it really true that temporal laws are no longer applicable? Contrast the behaviour of women (and men) in churches today and then tell me that issues are solved. Irreverently dressed women paying lip service and falling about themselves, nothing has changed in my humble opinion.... |
Re: Is Sex In Marriage Carnal? by OkCornel(m): 3:48pm On Feb 28, 2018 |
Sarassin: That's where you are getting it wrong in the understanding of the scriptures... Ask yourself this questions; Everything that Paul wrote 2000 years ago, does everything apply to the Church of today? 1 Like |
Re: Is Sex In Marriage Carnal? by Nobody: 4:02pm On Feb 28, 2018 |
OkCornel: I am always willing to learn, I am happy to accept that my understanding is wrong if you can clearly demonstrate why it is wrong. Why do you think Paul’s admonishments to womenfolk do not apply today? What is the yardstick or criteria and why do you think such criteria would not apply to any other aspect of doctrinal directives that any future generation does not agree with? |
Re: Is Sex In Marriage Carnal? by OkCornel(m): 4:29pm On Feb 28, 2018 |
Sarassin: The answer lies in this simple question, Are all women in the church today exactly like the Corinthian women Paul admonished? Do they have the same attitude? Are they causing controversies in the church like that of the Corinthian church? If no, then no need for a Law that does not apply to them... Were you thinking Paul wrote what he wrote to the Corinthian church to address all the issues prevalent in Nigerian churches or the global church in 2000 years' time? Cheers 1 Like |
Re: Is Sex In Marriage Carnal? by sonofluc1fer: 10:05pm On Mar 01, 2018 |
Emmanystone:Have no idea what Fasting prayers means... some sort of new Christian ritual? |
Re: Is Sex In Marriage Carnal? by Emmanystone: 10:10pm On Mar 01, 2018 |
sonofluc1fer:You guys don't fast in the kingdom of darkness? I thought satanists fast too. Ask Lucifer your Dad if he fasts. |
Re: Is Sex In Marriage Carnal? by budaatum: 6:41pm On Mar 03, 2018 |
OkCornel: Ask yourself these questions; Does anything written about 2000 years ago apply today? What is the criteria for determining which applies and that which doesn't? |
Re: Is Sex In Marriage Carnal? by OkCornel(m): 9:28pm On Mar 03, 2018 |
budaatum: A good example... Love your neighbor as yourself... 1 Like |
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