I don't know why y'all expect Chamakh to run on top of water and walk on thin air! He has been a very very useful addition to the team! You would think he was Ronaldo de Lima at Bordeaux with the demands being placed on him.
Can he do better? Absolutely! But for now its so far so good! Even Berbatov at 30million struggled to make an initial impact when he joined Utd! Same with Drogba at Chelsea

Fabianski had to be the MOTM on Sunday followed by Song. Djourou has also massively improved (I hope I am not speaking too soon)

I'd rather the problem be one of deciding which Striker is better than the problem of not having options. There is no pleasing some people despite a healthy scoring ratio of 2 goals per game. Even if we had a Messi, they'd still be clamouring for a Maradona.

Our next 6 fixtures critical o

v Tottenham (H) Nov 20
v Aston Villa (A) Nov 27
v Fulham (H) Dec 4
v Man United (A) Dec 13
v Stoke City (H) Dec 18
v Chelsea (H) Dec 27

Dr Kitaun:

Brilliant !

at least, I remember being the 1st to ask then what will happen when Nic comes back and the reason I do/did ask was cos: u and I know in the past what we have/had said about these players, Nic especially . . . .so can u pls advice these irritants masquerading as concerned voltrons of Chamakh to get off my case ?
being co-gunners doesnt mean we should be jumping into others' convos I believe, I remember not wanting to jump into your convo on monetary affairs and sustenability models with Duduface

Dr Kit,

Such it is on the present day gooner forum (and I don't think its really a bad thing)  , I remember my continuing travails with my criticism of Theo and some hard knocks I got on this forum. Other's are present to give us a hard knock when we go overboard with criticism I guess. A lot of people see your points about Chamakh's directness, he is not exactly a Torres or Drogba but he has instantly fitted well into the team and delivered, in addition, most fans usually have a soft spot for players who work their socks off (which is why most turned against Adebayor in the end), take Kuyt of Liverpool as an example.

I also totally accept your point about MC29 and Bendtner's presence in the same team being one too many of the same type of striker, I remember my review of him last season saying he was a Bendtner upgrade (and Debo saying we didn't need such a player) to be honest if NB52 had fully delivered last season, there wouldn't really have been a need to get MC29 which is why Arsene was not willing to pay that 12M Bordeaux demanded and waited for his availability on a free, maybe Bendtner himself senses this and that is why he is being vocal about his discontent (to attract suitors perhaps?).

IMO, if B52 wants to go, he can cos I think we have a player in the ranks who can get to or surpass his level in 2 - 3 seasons and needs playing time while RVP and MC29 fill the gap in the interim and you and I know who that player is, but we also have to consider our injury woes to which MC29 has seemed immune so far. Like Arsene says, fitness is also a sign of quality and that is one of the things to be considered when comparing the 2 players.

@Mystikal
Based on that run of games, if we are in the same position we are now on the 27th of December, then we can go all the way this season and win the PL.

i stumbled on a blog and here is a comment

When the squad lists were announced at the end of April I’d done a comparison noting the fact that Chelsea were taking a huge gamble with just 19 senior players and hardly any youngsters with experience at the highest level.

They were woefully exposed on Sunday as four injuries and a suspension meant they just had 14 senior players, three of whom were Keepers. In effect, apart from the starting eleven they only had Kalou on the bench along with some kids, who might be bright prospects but are certainly not ready for this level.

As I enjoyed their defeat I had a few observations that seemed interesting and worth discussing.

[b]Chelsea bought Ramires for 18M or so. Does he look any better than Denilson, who is arguably the least respected/appreciated current midfielder within the Gooner community? It left me wondering that if 18M gets you Ramires in today’s market, [/b]and add to it the fact that Yaya Toure seems like a massive flop, can people really criticize Arsene when he says it’s difficult to find players better than the ones we have at the club?

hmmmm. . . . .

The blogger is a Wenger apologist as far as I'm concerned. How much did VdV cost the southern scum? Ramires had one bad game so what? Wasn't it the same Ramires that helped Chelski destroy Arsenal at the bridge? Mereiles who I rate higher than Ramires was bought for 11.5m so there is definitely still a lot of value for money midfielders out there.

That is not to diss Denilson in any way - right now he is a squad player and is of sufficient quality to be one. I don't think he is good enough to be a first 11 player for Arsenal and that must be the context for judging the player.

I still worry that we don't have competent back up for Song, and that is still a clear weakness of the midfield, especially with Diaby spending his usual half a season on the injury table.

Dr Kitaun:

Brilliant !

at least, I remember being the 1st to ask then what will happen when Nic comes back and the reason I do/did ask was cos: u and I know in the past what we have/had said about these players, Nic especially . . . .so can u pls advice these irritants masquerading as concerned voltrons of Chamakh to get off my case ?

Most don't have the patience to look back at where the convos started. . . that's why I don't respond to every post - I understand their viewpoint.

being co-gunners doesnt mean we should be jumping into others' convos I believe, I remember not wanting to jump into your convo on monetary affairs and sustenability models with Duduface

Next time I will leave them to deal with you.

debosky:

The blogger is a Wenger apologist as far as I'm concerned. How much did VdV cost the southern scum? Ramires had one bad game so what? Wasn't it the same Ramires that helped Chelski destroy Arsenal at the bridge? Mereiles who I rate higher than Ramires was bought for 11.5m so there is definitely still a lot of value for money midfielders out there.

Even Harry himself was surprised that he was able to get VdV so cheaply (and he said so on Sky himself) and you and I know exactly why he did with the situation at RM, that is a kind of bargain that doesn't usually come along. If Meireles is so good, why are Liverpool where they are with a team that has Gerrard, Torres, Kuyt and Reina? Hate Arsene all you will, but give credit where it is due.

duduspace:

Even Harry himself was surprised that he was able to get VdV so cheaply (and he said so on Sky himself) and you and I know exactly why he did with the situation at RM, that is a kind of bargain that doesn't usually come along. If Meireles is so good, why are Liverpool where they are with a team that has Gerrard, Torres, Kuyt and Reina? Hate Arsene all you will, but give credit where it is due.

You can equally say Gerrard, Reina and Torres are not so good because Liverpool isn't doing well. Shocking comment from you - it just shows how little you know of Mereiles.

Hate on Arsene my foot. . . .when you add the wages Denilson has been paid for the four years since 2006 plus ther £3.4 million sign on fee, how much would he have cost Arsenal?

Rubbish talk - everyone including Wenger knows Denilson is nowhere near where he should be after 4 years at a club like Arsenal. . . .even Wilshere is above him in the pecking order now.

debosky:

You can equally say Gerrard, Reina and Torres are not so good because Liverpool isn't doing well. Shocking comment from you - it just shows how little you know of Mereiles.

All those players were there when they came second in the past so they are proven, all they've lost are Xabi Alonso and Mascherano if you ask me, the replacements just haven't been good enough whether they've been bought for 20m (Aquilani) or 11.5m (Meireles) it still validates Arsene's ideology that buying doesn't always solve the problems even though it may seem so to you.

debosky:

Hate on Arsene my foot. . . .when you add the wages Denilson has been paid for the four years since 2006 plus ther £3.4 million sign on fee, how much would he have cost Arsenal?

And whoever you had bought for an even higher value at that time would be playing for free? wouldn't be earning even more than Denilson was earning? what a ridiculous comparison Debo.
If we are to sell Denilson today, do you think we would sell him for 3.4m? 

debosky:

Rubbish talk - everyone including Wenger knows Denilson is nowhere near where he should be after 4 years at a club like Arsenal. . . .even Wilshere is above him in the pecking order now.

Credit due to a manager willing to give youth a chance and making his decisions based on performance above all things if you ask me or am I missing something?

duduspace:

All those players were there when they came second in the past so they are proven, all they've lost are Xabi Alonso and Mascherano if you ask me, the replacements just haven't been good enough whether they've been bought for 20m (Aquilani) or 11.5m (Meireles) it still validates Arsene's ideology that money doesn't always solve the problems even though it may seem so to you.

Stop talking nonsense - you cannot determine whether Mereiles is good enough based on what we've seen so far, with the entire side underperforming.

And whoever you had bought for an even higher value at that time would be playing for free? wouldn't be earning even more than Denilson was earning? what a ridiculous comparison Debo.

Think before responding - the person who was bought for higher would come in with a high level of performance immediately, not requiring 4 years to become a decent SQUAD player. Not everything is about cash alone - the playing output matters; but then again, you obviously don't care about that.

If we are to sell Denilson today, do you think we would sell him for 3.4m? 

You tell me. . . . if you think Nik could go for 8m, then Denilson would go for considerably les.

Credit due to a manager willing to give youth a chance and making his decisions based on performance above all things if you ask me or am I missing something?

Stop jumping around aimlessly - we are talking about finding players better than Denilson for a reasonable price. . . there is clear evidence that this is possible. Before you jumped in with your played out 'youth' argument, it would have done you good to look at the initial premise of the discussion.

There is bound to be one flop among many Big money signings. The kezmans,shevchenkos,hargreaves,berbatovs all come to memory. But winning trophies only come with quality players that may only come via major signings. while spending isnt a guarantee for trophies,it does improve the quality of the team. Arsenal's failure to engage in big spending is why we havent bn champions in years. Arsenal cant talk of a FLOP cos we arent into big money signings.

debosky:

Stop talking nonsense - you cannot determine whether Mereiles is good enough based on what we've seen so far, with the entire side underperforming.

You are now Meireles' advocate?  I don't care if Meireles is performing or not, the issue is that if the Gaffer says he hasn't been able to see players better than what we have for reasonable prices, you are in no position to call him a liar, pulling out a successful VdV transfer - when I can almost pull out a million Meireles, Ramires, Aquilani type signings that didnt go right -  isn't in any way conclusive that what yu're saying is true and the chap on that blog wasn't spot on.

debosky:

Think before responding - the person who was bought for higher would come in with a high level of performance immediately, not requiring 4 years to become a decent SQUAD player. Not everything is about cash alone - the playing output matters; but then again, you obviously don't care about that.

Denilson wasn't bought for the first team squad, he was bought to be developed and in no way was a first teamer when bought cos we still had Gilberto, Flamini and even Diarra ahead of him. Yes playing output matters and that is why Arsenal have always remained at the top end, being coached by a manager able to achieve a healthy balance in the face of massive odds when you compare the spending of others. Maybe you would have preferred we hit rock bottom first like Liverpool?  

debosky:

You tell me. . . . if you think Nik could go for 8m, then Denilson would go for considerably les.

If VdV can go for 8m then anything can happen but then there are mitigating circumstances that contribute to these things. I didn't in anyway suggest that Bendtner's value was 8m only that I would be comfortable with us selling him for that amount (plus the right clauses of cause). It depends on who is buying and how desperate we are to offload him (which at present we aren't at all). All I'm saying is when you start putting your buying pressure on Arsene, remember you are not in his shoes to have all the details, a case in example is Nik with Dr. Kit and myself already implying he is surplus to requirement, just for the simple fact that we bought Chamakh and we've even released Eduardo despite our sentimental attachment to him.
Right now, I would rate Denilson anywhere from 5m to 7m.

debosky:

Stop jumping around aimlessly - we are talking about finding players better than Denilson for a reasonable price. . . there is clear evidence that this is possible. Before you jumped in with your played out 'youth' argument, it would have done you good to look at the initial premise of the discussion.

All I pointed out was that you were not giving credit where it was due, Wilshere overtaking Denilson is not an indictment of Denilson's abilities or the wisdom of Arsene getting him as a youngster and trying to develop him into a first teamer, only that Wilshere is a better prospect and lest we forget English too.

You've started posting your epistles again, most of them off point so I won't be dragged in. . . but this I will certainly respond to:

duduspace:

All I pointed out was that you were not giving credit where it was due, Wilshere overtaking Denilson is not an indictment of Denilson's abilities or the wisdom of Arsene getting him as a youngster and trying to develop him into a first teamer, only that Wilshere is a better prospect and lest we forget English too.

What nonsense - if a player who has spend FOUR seasons at a club is being benched by an 18 year old, what greater indictment can there possibly be?

As for the BS that it's because Wilshere is English, why isn't Walcott benching Nasri? Why isn't JET benching Chamakh, Bendtner or RVP since they are English too?

You can so invent nonsense - if Denilson was good enough, he would be in the first team after spending four years at the club. This is more clearly highlighted when an 18 year old gets a berth ahead of him. End of!!

debosky:

You can so invent nonsense - if Denilson was good enough, he would be in the first team after spending four years at the club. This is more clearly highlighted when an 18 year old gets a berth ahead of him. End of!!

i have seen delusion of grandeur but duduspace takes the cake in chatting bunkum. denilson is shyt and will always be shyt.

debosky:

You've started posting your epistles again, most of them off point so I won't be dragged in. . . but this I will certainly respond to:
What nonsense - if a player who has spend FOUR seasons at a club is being benched by an 18 year old, what greater indictment can there possibly be?

So, it was an indictment of Rivaldo (a WPOY winner) that Kaka started benching him as a 20 year old and he had to leave the Milan? it is an indictment of Giuly that he was benched and ultimately replaced by Messi as a teenager? it is an indictment of any player replaced by a gifted precocious youngster? whatever happend to the notion that some players are just so much better than their peers?

debosky:

As for the BS that it's because Wilshere is English, why isn't Walcott benching Nasri? Why isn't JET benching Chamakh, Bendtner or RVP since they are English too?

If that was all you can take away from this statement? "only that Wilshere is a better prospect and lest we forget English too." then your signature needs changing 

debosky:

You can so invent nonsense - if Denilson was good enough, he would be in the first team after spending four years at the club. This is more clearly highlighted when an 18 year old gets a berth ahead of him. End of!!

That is not true, he was a first teamer and started 40+ games while younger as a 20/21 years old only 2 seasons back in which Arsenal came 4th in the league, for another club Denilson would be a sure starter, Wilshere is in the English National team as an 18 year old FFS and a sure starter for England U21s prior to his 18th birthday, how many players get into their national team as teenagers or even before 22 years? if that is not the definition of a prodigiously talented player, I wonder what is.
Denilson has nothing to be ashamed of in his performances or development, only that we are blessed with better that is all.

INJURIES!!!!!! - this is too Early!!!!!

JACKIEEEE. . . . .!!!!!!!

England manager Fabio Capello has confirmed that Andy Carroll, Jordan Henderson and Kieran Gibbs will start against France on Wednesday.

Carroll returned to training on Tuesday after missing a session on Monday due to a groin injury, but Capello has revealed that he has no concerns over the controversial Newcastle striker's fitness.

Sunderland midfielder Henderson will also make his first senior-team appearance from the start, while Arsenal's Gibbs is in line to kick-off against France.

Capello told a press conference shown live on Sky Sports News: "Carroll is fit and will play tomorrow. He will start in the first XI, like Henderson and Gibbs."

Wait

But midfielder Jack Wilshere will not make an England start because he is being sent back to Arsenal after sustaining an injury in Tuesday's training session at Wembley.

"Wilshere is going home because he will not be fit for tomorrow," said Capello.

http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,11670_6511135,00.html

http://www.arsenalinsider.com/arsenal-news/2030-wilshere-in-england-injury-blow

http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,11670_6511046,00.html

Anyone hating on Denilson needs to get his priorities straight and find new meaning to life.

I blame AW for selling Denilson to the general public as a DM.

Denilson is a continuity footballer, and a brilliant player.

Certain times when Fab4 is injured, Denilson controls the game single handedly.

The curse on Denilson is similar to the curse placed on Borja Valero when forced to play DM at West Brom. Borja Valero went back to Spain in a more attacking position and was the 2nd best CM in La Liga last season behind Xavi.

If Denilson is so shyte, why are Barca actively seeking his signature.

Ibime:

If Denilson is so shyte, why are Barca actively seeking his signature.

Barca have the hots for Arsenal players. . . they are even actively seeking Eboue's signature once Dani Alves leaves.

@Ibime

You know how it is with Sauron and his controversies, when he was blasting Denilson and co 2 seasons ago, he knew they were all in the 20/21 age range and never accept any excuses about their ages then but now that the shoe is on the other foot with Bebe, suddenly we are now hearing that Bebe is unrefined and needs refinement. If you listen too much to him, one would believe that Bebe has been stuck in a bush all this while and wearing loin cloths in some imaginary unknown part of Portugal, and only saw a football for the first time after arriving at Old toilet. 

Denny is just getting some heat from Debo because he doesn't want to give any credit to Arsene, he wouldn't say anywhere else outside of this discussion that Denilson is a failure.

back to Bendtner convo

I personally do not think NB52 should be sold unless we are ready to buy another striker. If NB52 is sold and Chamakh goes off injured (and considering RVP's peculiar case) do we revert back to Arshavin as CF like we did for some parts of last season?

If there's any player to be sold off its Carlos Vela. He's got promise but there seems to be no space for him in the team.

As for NB52's noise, that's normal. It just shows he is hungry for games, thats the state we should be keeping some of our players and whenever they have the opportunity to play, they should do the talking on the pitch.

Meanwhile, good to see Robert Pires back in the EPL

Aston Villa have landed 37 year-old midfielder Robert Pires on a free transfer.

There had been much speculation that the Frenchman would sign for the club and a deal is now in place to bring the former Arsenal star to Villa Park.

Reports were circulating that manager Gerard Houllier had been looking to add more experience to his young Aston Villa side and he will be glad to have got his man, who won five trophies during his six year stay at Arsenal, including two Premier League titles.

Assistant Manager Gary McAllister has hailed the signing and is looking forward to working with the 1998 World Cup winner, he told the clubs official website:

"Robert has been training at Arsenal.

“I know the boss and Arsene Wenger are very friendly and I believe he’s going to join us in the next two or three days.”

He added:

“It’s perfect. I am sure he will arrive at the training ground in good condition.

“He’s a player everyone can look up to because of what he has achieved.”

Pires had been a free agent after being released by the Spanish side Villarreal in the summer and will welcome a return to the Premier League while Villa will also be glad to add some valuable depth to the squad after struggling with injuries in midfield this season.

http://www.goal.com/en-gb/news/2896/premier-league/2010/11/16/2216913/breaking-news-former-arsenal-midfielder-robert-pires-agrees

Anybody who thinks Denilson is shyt must have a questionable knowledge of football.

And NB52 will sell for well above 8m.

I dey go studio to wax some album to be released next weekend.

I am looking for a thread to release the solo track next weekend Hope you can allow me to do that here.

Lemme give you some intro.

Papa no dey, (Heavy drum beats) Papa no dey, Papa Tosibe, Oga Police o, If you want to fire me, fire me make I die, I would never follow you to that station.

(repeats)
The track sweet die.

duduspace:

Denny is just getting some heat from Debo because he doesn't want to give any credit to Arsene, he wouldn't say anywhere else outside of this discussion that Denilson is a failure.

Did I say Denilson was a failure? All I said is that the way Wilshere has near seamlessly displaced him from the first team is not a reflection of a player that has fulfilled his full potential after 4 years at the club. You can debate that if you want, but except in the absence of Diaby/Song/Fabregas or in a game with less at stake, Denilson doesn't get a starting berth.

Yes he's a great possession player who can pass sideways better than anyone else in world football . But there are clear flaws in his game as well - loss of attention, sloppy positioning among others. All I said is that, even without Wilshere in the side, his current level is equivalent to a squad player and not a starter.

The wuruwuru examples you gave about Giuly and Rivaldo were way off point - those cats were past their peak when they got displaced, not 'young players'.

dayokanu:

I dey go studio to wax some album to be released next weekend.

I am looking for a thread to release the solo track next weekend Hope you can allow me to do that here.

Lemme give you some intro.

Papa no dey, (Heavy drum beats) Papa no dey, Papa Tosibe, Oga Police o, If you want to fire me, fire me make I die, I would never follow you to that station.

(repeats)
The track sweet die.

This venue is not free next weekend. . . .we will be featuring our newest in house artiste Britney Slimshay singing 'Oops we beat Spurs again'.

duduspace:

Even Harry himself was surprised that he was able to get VdV so cheaply (and he said so on Sky himself) and you and I know exactly why he did with the situation at RM, that is a kind of bargain that doesn't usually come along. If Meireles is so good, why are Liverpool where they are with a team that has Gerrard, Torres, Kuyt and Reina? Hate Arsene all you will, but give credit where it is due.

Thats a no brainer. Everyone knows Madrid does yearly sales.

Sneijder a favourite for Ballon d or was sold for 13milla, Robben 22m

Watch how they would fling Kaka after this season.

The best transfer startegy is to dig the trash can behind the Bernabeu

Debo you haff madt. Iyen emi nah.

Abeg has any totoham player done the required verbal diarrhea?

dayokanu:


Lemme give you some intro.

Papa no dey, (Heavy drum beats) Papa no dey, Papa Tosibe, Oga Police o, If you want to fire me, fire me make I die, I would never follow you to that station.

(repeats)
The track sweet die.

But Chei DK, thiz song na my guy own. .  .the track sweet die u no lie. .  .bt the tin be say, this thread go dey occupied from tmrw nite reach next weekend. .  .abeg upload am for manure /  chavs their thread make i go hear am there. . . .

@DK

Maybe you will release the album on the Munschit thread after one of those small clubs with jaw breaking names have messed you up yet again at the Allianz arena as they've been doing so far this season. Like Debo said, we will be dancing palongo or whatever stuff MC Slim is ready to drop come Saturday.

Ibime:

Anyone hating on Denilson needs to get his priorities straight and find new meaning to life.

I blame AW for selling Denilson to the general public as a DM.

Denilson is a continuity footballer, and a brilliant player.

Certain times when Fab4 is injured, Denilson controls the game single handedly.

The curse on Denilson is similar to the curse placed on Borja Valero when forced to play DM at West Brom. Borja Valero went back to Spain in a more attacking position and was the 2nd best CM in La Liga last season behind Xavi.

If Denilson is so shyte, why are Barca actively seeking his signature.

barca actively seeking his signature hardly proves anything. barca actively sought after chygrnysky or whatever he's called. they were after alexander hleb, etc. denilson adds nothing to arsenal. arsenal can do without him. i will even go as far as saying emmanuel eboue is a more important player to arsenal than denilson. yes, he makes 500,000 passes per season but how many of those are sideways and backward passes. how many of those passes are more than 5 yards? certain times when fab4 is injured, the role of the creator falls on nasri's feet when he plays centrally - not denilson. denilson has no creative bone in his brazilian body.

duduspace:

@DK

Maybe you will release the album on the Munschit thread after one of those small clubs with jaw breaking names have messed you up yet again at the Allianz arena as they've been doing so far this season. Like Debo said, we will be dancing palongo or whatever stuff MC Slim is ready to drop come Saturday.

Have you checked Bayerns position on the BL table?

Have you checked how we are faring in the CL with a 100% record?

Anyway what do you except from an average GAYYner

'How many of those are backward or sideways passes'. . .the argument of the simple mind. SMH!!!

slimshay:

'How many of those are backward or sideways passes'. . .the argument of the simple mind. SMH!!!

Saying Denilson is not important to us is like asking why Chelsea have Mikel.