franchasng:
without engineering and technology, medical profession is as good as a dead corpse; who made the tetescope, the test tubes, the thermometer, the BP apparatus, the equipments you use to carry out diagnosis and operations

Its just that Nigeria is a messed nation with zero engineering innovation and contribution, because in more advanced nations, some engineering courses get more respect and pay than medical practitioners like docs.

Have you heard of biomedical engineering Robotics, etc

With the new 5G internet network now, you can perform any medical operation from even another continent without being there physically, who made it possible Engineering and technology!!!

For your info, research is on going to bring new innovation into medical practice that will create artificial doctors using AI and other high tech engineering and technology innovations, and if this breaks through, lots of doctors will be rendered jobless by engineering and technology.

All these macho amd superior formings by doctors happen mostly in Nigeria and 3rd world nations.

What have you made?

How much is level 12 salary, if I may ask.

BiggyB242:


I have a a guy who studied vet medicine omon the guy is struggling.

I have a friend also who studied MBBS and was earning a mere 40k a month before leaving the country last year! Struggling is not the point of discussion here but his profession's level in the civil service bro.

BiggyB242:
How much is level 12 salary, if I may ask.

Plus or minus, 238k - 256k!

bryanyaouh581:


Guy..oil dey ur head bro....
u get sense...na the problem wey naija pipu dey face be that...
what of those that travel out for just medical check ups....they don't dare go to Nigerian doctors...
they themselves know was up even the politicians know... na people wey no know go they argue am here...outside nurses are more Important n paid more than doctors..cos they offer their time and care n energy more than doctors there....even a horticulturist gets cute money there and taken important abroad sef....but Nigeria here...they talk of doctors...shit

Nurses are paid more? Wawuu!
You must live in some alternate universe.

We are different from every graduate

themosthigh:
Lol. They are doctors are smarter, have more training and years of experience than most. Have no opportunity to steal and do chuwa chuwa like other people. Most of them start well but will remain poor while others get rich off corruption etc

This s the lowest comment I have seen on Naitaland this year

ornicus:


You started with doctors, now you are extending to other medical professionals?

FYI I am an engineer. instead of all this whining, find your way to the private sector, to a section where engineers are highly paid.

Will doctors be highly paid in the telecoms sector? Or energy? Or manufacturing?

Find your way to an industry where you are in demand.in federal and state govts, health is considered more important than public works.

Today ebola may be back. Those doctors you are whining about, those underpaid overworked fellows will be all that stands between you and a plague of religious proportions.show some respect.

Calm Oga engineer
We are talking about the wide gap between engineers and medical doctors (in extension medical practitioners and every other profession).
Every profession is very important. There's the classic debate between doctors and teachers who's more important in a society. In terms of playing vital role in our society do you think it is fair the way they are treated? Stop trying to put doctors above every one else because they render a service and get paid for it like everyone else. As a matter of fact majority Nigerian doctors are heartless greedy people who would go on strike on flimsy excuses and watch may people die, while referring you to their private hospital.
Forget matter bros!

Wages my dear are determined by the forces of demand and supply.

If doctors salaries probably started at level 08, there'll probably be a scarcity of doctors in the civil service. For engineering, they probably have like a thousand applicants for every job advertised.

babyfaceafrica:
links to the study?


and you forget for PhD
.you need:

B.A 4 yrs
M.A 2 yrs
PhD 4 yrs( may be more)

10 years..please how.many yrs is MBBS?

Lol

What you don't understand is that.....Medical students don't take any break while in medical school. All you just mentioned B. A, M. A whatever, there is usually some form of break or another. U cant tell me any course that run for complete 12month without any form of holiday. If you did ur mathematics and do your calculations again then you will know what I meant.

spencekat:
As if we don't have expatriate doctors?

I for one have never met any of those expatriate Doctors. But I see Chinese Engineers constructing culverts and gutters right here in my village

nextdoor84:


I have a friend also who studied MBBS and was earning a mere 40k a month before leaving the country last year! Struggling is the not the point of discussion here but his profession's level in the civil service bro.

No I was just surprise. Vet Med being the highest thought that profession was a waste of time.

Medical doctors are phd holders and the rest are not.....

Longluk:


Lol

What you don't understand is that.....Medical students don't take any break while in medical school. All you just mentioned B. A, M. A whatever, there is usually some form of break or another. U cant tell me any course that run for complete 12month without any form of holiday. If you did ur mathematics and do your calculations again then you will know what I meant.

na lie..make we. leave am

bryanyaouh581:


Nigeria makes things hard for themselves.. abroad. they make things easy for their citizens and their medicine is 3years and.....but Nigeria here is 8years..
what are they doing that the whites abroad haven't done and gone far..they spe and such years..still they don't know anything nor be good in deeper practicals...upon all...you wana do treatment...most people still fly abroad for treatment.. why didn't they treat themselves here in naija....come to think of that....

I have to say something about this.

1. In abroad, they only study what is prevalent. In Nigeria, we study almost everything.
2. In abroad, some don't know how to treat malaria, y? Because they've eradicated that

So on so forth.

Medicine in Nigeria is quite stressful

Ninethmare:
I was going through the Nigeria Prison Entry Level for graduate and I noticed that those with M.B.B.S or Doctors are automatically on Level 12 immediately they are recruited.

Other medical courses are giving more preference in Level than others

Considering the years it will take for someone on grade 08 to reach grade 12 in Federal Government Job you will know that it's quite not fair
Up
But what confused me was Almighty Engineering courses were placed on level 08

It's quite disheartening that we that studied Engineering for 5yrs, solved all those mathematics and spent so much are placed with other courses who studied 4yrs on the same entry level which is level 8 in Federal Jobs



Please I need your taking on this

Why is M.B.B.S placed so high and Engineering not given preference?

First of all OP, Is your grouse the fact that Doctors get to start at level 12 thereby earning more or it is that you, an "Engineer" gets to share the same level with "lowly" 4yr degree holders?


You are essentially asking for level playing Field with one hand and then putting down others with the other hand. Isn't that Condescending by you ?

By the way, put aside Engineering as a course compared to other 4yr courses, What have you Engineered yourself to warrant a special treatment by the society ? Should honour be bestowed on you by virtue of just graduating from Engineering school?
Before answering your question
I think you should come down from your high horses a bit. Or at least stoop to conquer. No one owes US anything.


Now to the question. I have said this before too. The primary reason why Medicine enjoys the privileges it does(I don't dispute its 'reputation' as a [Generally, back to this shortly] challenging course) is due to the extensive nature or regulations in the profession.

Essentially, these regulations among other things, tends to REGULATE SUPPLY and dictate employment relationships for most of its practitioners in the society.

When/if the Medical profession liberalizes its extensive regulations including, but not limited to the admission quota per session for institutions and other supply levers, the Medical profession in Nigeria would be much less prestigious as it is now.

A few other functional professions could achieve similar levels of prestige if they adopt similar regulatory/employment approach to their profession. A few are starting to.


Back to medicine being "generally" challenging. This is very true. The course content, housmanships/residency etc can be very gruelling. Many drop out.

However THERE are still Mediocre Medical doctors today in Nigeria. They are, I suppose, certified by Medical institutions. But they are nonetheless ineffective. Sadly due to prestige these ones are put at the same level with other Medical practitioners because they all posses the same common denominator — A certificate.


What's my point ?

Professions should liberalize the assessment of true value to society.
Allow society to guage on an individual level who brings value to the society and reward same. Not groups. Individuals.


If you always have to show what you graduated in (your certificate) to prove your value, I doubt if you're truly a professional.
A TRUE professional leaves people with little doubt about who they are WITHOUT recourse to showing certificates.


Again drop the Entitlement. You're no better. You're no less.
If your "Engineering" degree (which is great by the way) is the zenith of human achievement then how were people who themselves were not engineers able to design the Engineering degrees we have today. Or did an Engineer design the Engineering programme?

MRLANNISTER:


This s the lowest comment I have seen on Naitaland this year

Hehehehe I wanted to quote the guy, but I just weak and passed.

bryanyaouh581:


Nigeria makes things hard for themselves.. abroad. they make things easy for their citizens and their medicine is 3years and.....but Nigeria here is 8years..
what are they doing that the whites abroad haven't done and gone far..they spe and such years..still they don't know anything nor be good in deeper practicals...upon all...you wana do treatment...most people still fly abroad for treatment.. why didn't they treat themselves here in naija....come to think of that....

Medicine is not 3 years abroad sire. The perquisite for entering medicine in abroad is that you must have a degree first which is usually for about 4yrs. Then once u enter the clinical part, it's just for 3yrs. This is what Nigeria government wanted to do before and people kick against it.

Longluk:


Lol

What you don't understand is that.....Medical students don't take any break while in medical school. All you just mentioned B. A, M. A whatever, there is usually some form of break or another. U cant tell me any course that run for complete 12month without any form of holiday. If you did ur mathematics and do your calculations again then you will know what I meant.

Bro you there's no way it can be painted. You can't tell me the time spent in achieving mbbs (3years) equal the years spent achieving PhD(5+2+4 years) in Engineering Haba baba you see red you say Na black.

babyfaceafrica:
na lie..make we. leave am

Lol.... This is not far-fetched, you can make your research.

themosthigh:
Lol. They are doctors are smarter, have more training and years of experience than most. Have no opportunity to steal and do chuwa chuwa like other people. Most of them start well but will remain poor while others get rich off corruption etc

very correct

I am kind of rusty now. Somebody can please correct me.

Doctors used to be on level 10 with those that obtained advanced degree like PhD to start. I think master was level 9 or 10. But since doctors union have become aggressive comparing themselves to USA and Canada MDs, they have been elevated for peace sake.

Even then, they still waste their talents and training trying to pass exams overseas. Many of them leave.

Until engineers are respected and given their due respect, we will remain a developing country forever. All the experts brought into the country for infrastructure as in bridges and Eko Atlantic are engineers. Nigerian engineers are not exposed to local development just as doctors do not know a thing about tropical medicine where they live. All our graduates are trained according to western curriculum. (To be international).

Doctors (except the children of babalawo that are well versed in tropical medicine) can be easily replaced by physician assistant train in schools of medical technology. Saying doctors are ready to go on their first day on the job unlike engineer is nothing but bull. Even after ten years, a good doctor always consult and refer to specialist. Not Nigerian doctors.

Yet, doctors trained abroad drop big salaries and good life to come back here and work. It paid off during Ebola outbreak. Remember, junior doctors were on strike!

BTW, tell your children to study anything engineering. It is the future. I wish I did.

babyfaceafrica:
na lie..make we. leave am

You ever did a 13 month class, with no break?

Asour:



First of all OP, Is your grouse the fact that Doctors get to start at level 12 thereby earning more or it is that you, an "Engineer" gets to share the same level with "lowly" 4yr degree holders?


You are essentially asking for level playing Field with one hand and then putting down others with the other hand. Isn't that Condescending to you ?

By the way, put aside Engineering as a course compared to other 4yr courses, What have you Engineered yourself to warrant a special treatment by the society ? Should honour be bestowed on you by virtue of just graduating from Engineering school?
Before answering your question
I think you should come down from your high horse a bit. Or at least stoop to conquer. No one owes US anything.


Now to the question. I have said this before too. The primary reason why Medicine enjoys the privileges it does(I don't dispute its 'reputation' as a [Generally, back to this shortly] challenging course) is due to the extensive nature or regulations in the profession.

Essentially, these regulations among other things, then to REGULATE SUPPLY and dictate employment relationships for most of its practitioners in the society.

When/if the Medical profession liberalizes its extensive regulations including, but not limited to the admission quota per session for institutions and other supply levers, the Medical profession in Nigeria would be much less prestigious as it is now.

A few other functional professions could achieve similar levels of prestige if they adopt similar regulatory/employment approaches to their professions. A few are starting to.


Back to medicine being "generally" challenging. This is very true. The course content, housmanships/residency etc can be very gruelling. Many drop out. However THERE are Mediocre Medical doctors today in Nigeria. They are, I suppose, certified by Medical institutions. But they are nonetheless ineffective. Sadly due to prestige these ones are put at the same level with other Medical practitioners because they all posses the same common denominator — A certificate.


What's my point ?

Professions should liberalize the assessment of true value to society.
Allow society to guage on an individual level who brings value to the society and reward same. Not groups. Individuals.


If you always have to show what you graduated in (your certificate) to prove your value, I doubt if you're truly a professional. A professional leaves people with little doubt about who they are WITHOUT recourse to showing certificates.


Again drop the Entitlement. You're no better. You're no less.
If your "Engineering" (which is great by the way) is the zenith of human achievement then how were people who themselves were not engineers able to design the Engineering degrees we have today. Or did an Engineer design the Engineering programme?

All these are noise. Engineering is 5 years for next time sake

Masogemstones:
Because...they are demi-gods of all Careers.... Doctors are the most Selfish and egotic sect I have seen in the horizon Nigeria Career Hub. Very Selfish people.

You are likely an hospital worker who is not a doctor

BiggyB242:


Bro you there's no way it can be painted. You can't tell me the time spent in achieving mbbs (3years) equal the years spent achieving PhD(5+2+4 years) in Engineering Haba baba you see red you say Na black.

It is sir. U can calculate it oooooo. It's a written fact. It's well documented. Multiple the number of days we have in a year (No break at all for a whole year) and multiply by 6 and half or 7yrs used in medical school, then convert it to weeks. Then compared it with about 6 month spent in a standard school for a semester with the years you mentioned to have phD degree. Do you think the title "Dr" just come from nowhere? I leave the calculation to you. This is mathematics sir.

nextdoor84:


Plus or minus, 238k - 256k!

All these my doc friends that has being working since 2015.

Longluk:


It is sir. U can calculate it oooooo. It's a written fact. It's well documented. Multiple the number of days we have in a year (No break at all for a whole year) and multiply by 6 and half or 7yrs used in medical school, then convert it to weeks. Then compared it with about 6 month spent in a standard school for a semester with the years you mentioned to have phD degree. Do you think the title "Dr" just come from nowhere? I leave the calculation to you. This is mathematics sir.

Let me do the calculation.

bryanyaouh581:


Nigeria makes things hard for themselves.. abroad. they make things easy for their citizens and their medicine is 3years and.....but Nigeria here is 8years..
what are they doing that the whites abroad haven't done and gone far..they spe and such years..still they don't know anything nor be good in deeper practicals...upon all...you wana do treatment...most people still fly abroad for treatment.. why didn't they treat themselves here in naija....come to think of that....

No it is not 3 years but 6 months in abroad.

themosthigh:
Lol. [b]They are doctors are smarter, have more training and years of experience than most. Have no opportunity to steal and do chuwa chuwa like other people. Most of them start well but will remain poor while others get rich off corruption etc [/b]

Point of correction; doctors aren't smarter.

EazyMoh:
It generally has to do with how the 2 professional bodies tend to protect the interest for their members.
For example while doctors see themselves as having right to be above every worker (this is mainly in Nigeria) they feel it's their birthright to be ministers of health, commissioners of health in every state and even aspire to lead midwifery council of Nigeria.
They are aggressive in pushing boundaries of their rights many times even going too far.
Every doctor is fixed to a particular hospital for their housemanship and every practical training; all of which come with a good pay. So most of those previlleges were demanded by their union from the government and every other employer, and they got it.

On the other hand NSE and COREN don't make any concrete effort to better welfare of engineers in Nigeria.
Many talk of lack of competence, which is true, but how can you be competent when you are not given any opportunity to have first hand engineering experience right from undergrad days.
They could start making sure there are provisions to train engineers with practical knowledge, let every engineering student have two years mandatory on the job training in his field. Example as a Chemical Engineer you spend 2years at Dangote Cement Plant, you will never be a clueless engineer.
then NSE could be demanding better welfare for engineers in such fields.

I can see u have a very shallow reasoning ,so u expect nurses and others to be heading doctors?u are such a fool.When u go to the hospital ,who do u go to met for your health?a nurse or lab scientist.Mumu

[quote author=frowland post=79521455]

Point of correction; doctors aren't smarter.

[/quote

Who are smarter?Jealousy