jcross19:
even the word destroyed from the bible don't really mean to end too.

And what does it mean other than to destroy?

Ihedinobi3:

I'm sure my intent was not to make you sick, although your teaching was apt to do worse to believers.

Forgive my misunderstanding. It just seemed to me that you were saying that the Lake of Fire was Edom since you said, "Here is another interesting note: "The smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever", from Revelation 14:11 obviously comes from Isaiah 34:10. It is the description of the destruction and desolation of Edom. Most of the book of Revelation actually is connected with the Old Testament." If Revelation 14:11 comes from Isaiah 34:10, then it must be referring to Edom. That was how I understood what you said. If this was not what you meant, perhaps you could have made it clearer.

If you only meant that Revelation 14:11 should be taken the same way as Isaiah 34:10, the question is why. Are they the same? In my thinking, they're not. What is happening in Isaiah 34 is actually Armageddon. It's part of a complex of chapters describing how God will deliver Israel from the world's armies gathered against it by the Antichrist to destroy it. The deliverance will occur at the Second Advent when the Lord Jesus will destroy those armies and reclaim the Earth from Satan. You can compare Zechariah 14 and Revelation 19 for proof.

The use of "forever" in that passage then refers to the absolute perfection of the judgment so that it will not cease until the Lord renews the Earth for His Millennial Reign.

In my thinking, you do realize that Revelation 14 is not at all speaking about Isaiah 34. Both are different things. Revelation 14 speaks of a judgment that occurs forever and ever from a heavenly perspective, which is where the Lamb and His Angels are, not from an earthly perspective as in Isaiah 34, which is where the nations invading Israel are.

I have also explained in that second installment of my answer that you responded to and in the first one too that the Earth cannot be the Lake of Fire since the Lord Jesus rules it for a thousand years after casting the Antichrist and his prophet into the Lake of Fire. As I also said, we also don't have any biblical proof that the Earth becomes the Lake of Fire even afterwards since we are told that it is removed from existence with fire by the Lord Jesus before the Judgment of the Great White Throne. If it was, then it cannot be the Lake of Fire into which the unrighteous are cast together with Satan and his fellow rebel angels.

If I am wrong about this, you have not quite demonstrated it. Your use of those passages you quoted, just like your use of Isaiah 34, ignores what the Bible says as a whole. If Zephaniah 1:18 means that the Lord will turn the Earth into the Lake of Fire, then which other Lake of Fire were the Antichrist and his prophet cast into at Armageddon in Revelation 19? If Zephaniah 3:8 means that the Lord consumed the entire Earth with fire at His Second Advent, which is what He is speaking of here, then where does the Millennial Reign of Revelation 20 occur? If 2 Peter 3:7-12 says that the Earth will be turned into the Lake of Fire, then why are we told in Revelation 20 and 21 and elsewhere in the Bible that this universe will pass away and be replaced with a new one?

It seems to me that you are misapplying Scriptures, forcing them to contradict each other in your bid to teach a lie. I don't know if it is something that you are doing on purpose, or if you are only in error unwittingly. My answers have been to show you that the Bible does not agree with your position. I understand if you disagree. After all, it is the nature of this forum that everyone claims to be a teacher here even if they are not even believers in Jesus Christ. But, for what good it might do you and others who might read these discussions, I am making my responses here for correction.

The Bible is unequivocal that what God has done is forever, as in the first passages I shared with you in my first post. That is, everything He created is built to last eternally. Not one thing can be removed from existence, nor can anything at all be added to Creation. This is clearly what Ecclesiastes 3:14 teaches. It is not at all biblical to claim that the souls (that is, the spirits that exist in corporeal bodies: both man and beast, as Ecclesiastes 3:18-21 teaches) will ever go out of existence. They will not. Their bodies will return to the dust (except for believers who live to see the Lord Jesus return, whose bodies will only be changed into eternal ones), but their spirits will receive a new "sheath" or "clothing," that is, an interim body (2 Corinthians 5:3 in Greek) to exist in either in Sheol or in Heaven (Ecclesiastes 3:18-21; Luke 16:22-23; Ephesians 4:8; and a host of other Scriptures) until the Resurrection at which time they will receive eternal bodies that are suited to their eternal status either as redeemed or as condemned (Daniel 12:2; John 5:28-29; Revelation 20:11-15).

When the Scriptures talk about the death of the sinning soul, it speaks of the Second Death, yes, but the Second Death does not contradict Ecclesiastes 3:14. Those who sin will be punished eternally by being excluded from God's Glorious Presence for all eternity and put in a place of suffering for all their mad rebellion. As the Lord Jesus says concerning them, there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth (Matthew 13:40-42), that is, there shall be regret for their terrible choice, an impossibility if they are either unconscious or non-existent. The Second Death is called death because it is an exclusion from everything that is good from God. A state of existence where you have no access to any of God's gifts or to God Himself, that is already death, but if we add to such a place all that is God's curse and His Wrath, then we have an even worse state of existence than the human mind can begin to comprehend. It is better to not exist at all than to suffer such a punishment. That is why it is called a Death, not because there is any kind of cessation of existence.

To be clear, it is no kind of punishment at all for the wicked to simply go out of existence after spending their time here on Earth rebelling against the Lord and doing so much harm to His People. That they simply cease to exist is practically congratulations for being so smart. It is no justice at all. Consider that in Isaiah 66:24 (compare also Psalm 91:8 ), the Lord promises the righteous that they will be able to see His Justice upon those who have done so much wickedness to them. This is a comfort from the Lord. It has been said that Isaiah 66:24 proves that there is no eternal suffering for the wicked, but obviously that is not true. Why would the "dead bodies" of sinners last eternally, if the fires consumed them and wild animals can return after the smoke is gone, as it seems to me that you said? In fact, "corpses" or "dead bodies" is probably the best way to describe the state of existence of these rebels, since they lack anything that can rightly be called life. They have no light, no water, no food, no companionship, no joy, no peace, or anything good at all. Instead, they have the torment of the fire, the palpable darkness, the knowledge that they could never have defeated the Lord in their rebellion, the knowledge that they can never get out of that dreadful place, the consciousness that they are alone and without help or friends of any sort, the knowledge of all the good that they rejected in rejecting the Lord's Mercy, and so much more than all that. They are, for all intents and purposes, truly Dead, although they are very truly conscious and able to experience that Death consciously. The righteous will see this and rejoice in the Justice of their God.

This is what the Bible teaches. You may be unable to bear it, but it is the Truth nonetheless.

Please stop writting long meaningless articles be precise and straight to the point.

MuttleyLaff:
Ọgbẹni, if you have any regards for yourself my friend, you'll respect yourself, mind your language, your tone and watch that acid tongue of yours.

Now that you have been served and given an advanced warning, if you then still insist in continuing to toe the undisciplined line and your unbridled tongue with me, then I would have no choice than to expose you for what you are and from what I've noticed in all this.

And what will happen?

MuttleyLaff:
"He said, In solemn truth I tell you that unless you turn and become like little children,
you will in no case be admitted into the Kingdom of the Heavens."
- Matthew 18:3

Thank you very much blueAgent. May God bless you very much and real big good, as I take out the sting from that "don't be such a jerk, behaving like a jackass" venom. Amen.

Am already blessed.

jcross19:
yes because God never die we can't exist without God now I quoted revelation 20:10 says And the devil that deceived them was casted into the lake of fire and brimstone , where the beast and the false prophet are and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever. "for ever and ever " mean what there ? if they are not immortal why will they use for ever and ever for them in the fire.

Repeating myself on this subject of forever is like me talking to a wall, suit yourself.

blueAgent:




Clown.
It's obvious you have problem with compression.

Ezekiel 28:18 Thou hast defiled thy sanctuaries by the multitude of thine iniquities, by the iniquity of thy traffick; therefore will I bring forth a fire from the midst of thee, it shall devour thee, and I will bring thee to ashes upon the earth in the sight of all them that behold thee. 28:19 All they that know thee among the people shall be astonished at thee: thou shalt be a terror, and never shalt thou be any more.

That Bible verse above says that God will turn Satan to Ashes upon the Earth in the sight of all.

If you had sense you would have known by now that the word forever does not always mean something without end.

lol well I will not insult you, you have truly shown that you have nothing in your brain ! when a fool speaks or write try to hide under the pen of the wise , the hand writing and the sentence will surely show he has nothing to offer than confusion even confusing himself too.

blueAgent:
Am already blessed.

"...you already know me, that I dont venture into subjects I havent a watertight understanding of "
- Re: Must Women Wear Trouser/pants At All? by MuttleyLaff: 5:34am On Oct 26

The greatest blessing in the world is being a blessing, and being happy for others, when you see God's blessing in them, the way you see God's blessing in you. Blessed, are they who see wow factor things, in humble places, where other people see nothing.

blueAgent:
And what will happen?

A clear and innocent conscience, normally is worried of nothing and wouldnt ask, what will happen, so, lol, nothing will happen, if you have any regards for yourself my dear nwanne friend, you respect yourself, mind your language, your tone and watch that acid tongue of yours, but especially, since you have been served and given an advanced warning, if you do then "fariga, with axe put over head" still insist in continuing to toe the undisciplined line and not tame your unbridled tongue with me, then I would have no choice, than to, with a lack of courtesy, roughly and abruptly expose you for what you are and that from what I've seen in all this. You know that, nothing wey miguard, no dey see for gatehouse. Nothing wey vigilante, no dey see for midnight.

SHALOM!

Neither Satan nor Humans are intrinsically Immortal.

Immortality must be earned.

Satan has not earned Immortality, but has been able to prolong his life by stealing and scavenging Life Energy from Humans.

If he were Immortal, he would of need to do that.

[See: THE FIRE FROM WITHIN, by Carlos Castaneda.]

oaroloye:
SHALOM!

Same to you

oaroloye:
Neither Satan nor Humans are intrinsically Immortal.
Immortality must be earned.

I agree with this comment, meaning, agree without any objection

oaroloye:
Satan has not earned Immortality, but has been able to prolong his life by stealing and scavenging Life Energy from Humans.
If he were Immortal, he would of need to do that.

Without holding back, please explain how you mean that Satan has not earned Immortality, but has been able to prolong his life by stealing and scavenging Life Energy from Humans

oaroloye:
[See: THE FIRE FROM WITHIN, by Carlos Castaneda.]

There are at least 18 chapters in "The Fire from Within By Carlos Castaneda". Where in it, do you want us to "see" anything? What in the book do you want us to "see"?

PS: I like it when your posts are sweetly and/or pleasantly short, just like this one is, but not when its unnecessarily long winded, and needing to be doing shocking, insane, senseless and annoyingly scrolling downs, lol.

Spirituality is not a hobby: it is our life.

It involves the all of us, whether we like it or not.

The twelve books of Anthropologist Carlos Castaneda tell how a cynical, know-it-all academician attempted to debunk Spiritual Communication in the Native American Peyote Communion ritual.

He wanted to prove that it was all fake- however, he found that it wasn't, and ended up learning- or rather, being taught- everything that can be taught about the basics of Spiritual Function.

Everything in his account consists of things not taught in Oyinbo Education. Therefore, if one is going to read his books, one must expect to learn things which one never knew before.

LAFAYETTE RONALD HUBBARD, the founder of SCIENTOLOGY, found himself compelled to analyse EDUCATION, and find out why it was not working, such that he was unable to teach the average person who could read and write normally, his System, so that they could apply it properly.

He determined that the greatest hindrance to learning is the attitude that one already knows about the things being taught.

[See: THE STUDY TAPES, by L. Ron Hubbard.
THE STUDENT HAT, by L. Ron Hubbard.
BASIC STUDY MANUAL, by L. Ron Hubbard.]

Every subject must be learned from its elementary principles, not from its middle, nor its end.

If you want to understand how and why some Spirit Beings must steal Life Energy from other beings to survive, while others don't need to, you must learn all about Spirituality From The Beginning- not from the Wrong End.

Bible-Believing Christians should recognize these Truths from the Scriptures in general, and The Teachings of Lord Yeshua in particular.

It is disappointing, when people who think they are Christians, because they can sit through a Church Service, and sing along with the choir, turn out to be ignorant of the most important Spiritual Issue facing Humanity, and, when they hear of It, are like: "What the (*Bleep!*) is he talking about.

Very few of the people interrogating or judging me have done me the common courtesy of introducing themselves, and explaining what their fundamental Belief System is, and what they know and whom they learned it from.

I seem to be the only person here, who gives people the references they need, in order to know what I know, so that they can decide for themselves, whether or not they want to accept those Sources as authoritative.

I recently had to deduce that someone's propaganda was actually JEHOVAH'S WITLESS rhetoric. When I confronted him on it, he fled, as is expected of those hirelings.

. JOHN 10:11-13.

11. "I am The Good Shepherd:
The Good Shepherd
giveth his life
for the Sheep.
12. "But he that is an Hireling,
and not the Shepherd,
whose own the Sheep are not,
seeth the Wolf coming,
and leaveth the Sheep,
and fleeth:
and the Wolf catcheth them,
and scattereth the Sheep.
13. "The Hireling fleeth,
because he is an Hireling,
and careth not for the Sheep."

THE HIRELINGS OF SATAN DON'T CARE ABOUT THE SHEEP OF LORD YESHUA.

As soon as they don't hear what they want to hear, they are off. Not that The Kingdom of God is any different in that regard, but what they want to hear is affirmation of The Truth.

Scriptural Explanations are neither tedious nor boring to them. This is what they eat.

. DEUTERONOMY 8:1-6.

ALL The Commandments
Which I Command thee this day
shall ye observe to do,
that ye may live,
and multiply,
and go in and possess the land
which The LORD
Sware unto your fathers.
2. And thou shalt remember
all the Way which The LORD
thy God led thee these forty years
in the wilderness,
to humble thee,
and to prove thee,
to know what was in thine heart,
whether thou wouldest
keep His Commandments,
or no.
3. And He humbled thee,
and suffered thee to hunger,
and fed thee with Manna,
which thou knewest not,
neither did thy fathers know;
that He might
make thee know that

"MAN DOTH NOT
LIVE BY BREAD ONLY
BUT BY EVERY (WORD)
THAT PROCEEDETH
OUT OF THE MOUTH
OF THE LORD
DOTH MAN LIVE."

4. Thy raiment waxed not
old upon thee,
neither did thy foot swell,
these forty years.
5. Thou shalt also consider
in thine heart,

"THAT, AS A MAN
CHASTENETH HIS SON,
SO THE LORD THY GOD
CHASTENETH THEE."

6. Therefore thou shalt keep
The Commandments of
The LORD thy God,
to walk in His Ways,
and to fear Him.

THE WORD OF GOD IS NOT FOOD TO YOU.

You hate hearing It, when It is not buffered by the Propaganda Interpretations you have been taught.

You do not want your horizons broadened, you do not want your perspective changed, you do not want your viewpoint advanced.

. MATTHEW 13:1-23.

THE same day went Jesus out of the house,
and sat by the sea side.
2. And great multitudes
were gathered together
unto him,
so that he went into a ship,
and sat;
and the whole multitude
stood on the shore.
3. And he Spake many things
unto them in Parables,
Saying,

"Behold, a sower
went forth to sow;
4. "And when he sowed,
some seeds
fell by the way side,
and the fowls came
and devoured them up:
5. "Some fell
upon stony places,
where they had
not much earth:
and forthwith they sprung up,
because they had
no deepness of earth:
6. "And when
the Sun was up,
they were scorched;
and because they had
no root,
they withered away.
7. "And some fell
among thorns;
and the thorns sprung up,
and choked them:
8. "But other fell
into good ground,
and brought forth fruit,
some an hundredfold,
some sixtyfold,
some thirtyfold.
9. "Who hath ears to hear,
let him hear."

10. And the Disciples came,
and said unto him,

"Why speakest thou
unto them in Parables?"

11. He answered and Said
unto them,

"Because it is given unto you
to know The Mysteries
of The Kingdom of Heaven,
but to them it is not given.
12. "For whosoever hath,
to him shall be given,
and he shall have
more abundance:
but whosoever hath not,
from him shall be taken away
even that he hath.
13. "Therefore Speak I
to them in Parables:

'BECAUSE THEY SEEING
SEE NOT;
AND HEARING
THEY HEAR NOT,
NEITHER DO THEY
UNDERSTAND.'

14. "And in them is fulfilled
the Prophecy of Esaias,
which saith,

'BY HEARING YE SHALL HEAR,
AND SHALL NOT UNDERSTAND;
AND SEEING YE SHALL SEE,
AND SHALL NOT PERCEIVE:
15. 'FOR THIS PEOPLE'S HEART
IS WAXED GROSS,
AND THEIR EARS
ARE DULL OF HEARING,
AND THEIR EYES
THEY HAVE CLOSED;
LEST AT ANY TIME
THEY SHOULD SEE WITH THEIR EYES
AND HEAR WITH THEIR EARS,
AND SHOULD UNDERSTAND
WITH THEIR HEART,
AND SHOULD BE CONVERTED,
AND I SHOULD HEAL THEM.'

16. "But Blessed
are your eyes,
for they see:
and your ears,
for they hear.
17. "For verily I Say unto you,

'THAT MANY PROPHETS
AND RIGHTEOUS MEN
HAVE DESIRED TO SEE
THOSE THINGS
WHICH YE SEE,
AND HAVE NOT SEEN THEM;
AND TO HEAR THOSE THINGS
WHICH YE HEAR,
AND HAVE NOT HEARD THEM.'

18. "Hear ye therefore
The Parable of the Sower.

19. 'WHEN ANY ONE HEARETH
THE WORD OF THE KINGDOM,
AND UNDERSTANDETH IT NOT,
THEN COMETH
THE WICKED ONE,
AND CATCHETH AWAY
THAT WHICH WAS SOWN IN HIS HEART.
THIS IS HE WHICH
RECEIVED SEED
BY THE WAY SIDE.
20. 'BUT HE THAT
RECEIVED THE SEED
INTO STONY PLACES,
THE SAME IS HE
THAT HEARETH THE WORD,
AND ANON WITH JOY
RECEIVETH IT;
21. 'YET HATH HE NOT
ROOT IN HIMSELF,
BUT DURETH FOR A WHILE:
FOR WHEN TRIBULATION OR PERSECUTION
ARISETH BECAUSE OF THE WORD,
BY AND BY HE IS OFFENDED.
22. 'HE ALSO THAT RECEIVED
SEED AMONG THE THORNS
IS HE THAT HEARETH THE WORD;
AND THE CARE OF THIS WORLD,
AND THE DECEITFULNESS OF RICHES,
CHOKE THE WORD,
AND HE BECOMETH UNFRUITFUL.
23. 'BUT HE THAT RECEIVED SEED
INTO THE GOOD GROUND
IS HE THAT HEARETH THE WORD,
AND UNDERSTANDETH IT;
WHICH ALSO BEARETH FRUIT,
AND BRINGETH FORTH,
SOME AN HUNDREDFOLD,
SOME SIXTY, SOME THIRTY.' "

If this Knowledge is really of no interest to you, you really should not be dabbling in It.

THESE ARE THINGS YOU SHOULD HAVE LEARNED IN YOUR TEENS!

It is inappropriate for an Adult to be learning how the Universe really works, and why Life of Earth is the Way It is.

You cannot be taught anything, when you think you know all about it already, and can dictate to Teachers how they should teach you.

[quote author=MuttleyLaff post=84226230]"...you already know me, that I dont venture into subjects I havent a watertight understanding of "
- Re: Must Women Wear Trouser/pants At All? by MuttleyLaff: 5:34am On Oct 26

The greatest blessing in the world is being a blessing, and being happy for others, when you see God's blessing in them, the way you see God's blessing in you. Blessed, are they who see wow factor things, in humble places, where other people see nothing.

A clear and innocent conscience, normally is worried of nothing and wouldnt ask, what will happen, so, lol, nothing will happen, if you have any regards for yourself my dear nwanne friend, you respect yourself, mind your language, your tone and watch that acid tongue of yours, but especially, since you have been served and given an advanced warning, if you do then "fariga, with axe put over head" still insist in continuing to toe the undisciplined line and not tame your unbridled tongue with me, then I would have no choice, than to, with a lack of courtesy, roughly and abruptly expose you for what you are and that from what I've seen in all this. You know that, nothing wey miguard, no dey see for gatehouse. Nothing wey vigilante, no dey see for midnight.
[/quoa

You don't fail to amaze me.

You can go ahead with your threat to expose yourself because me I have nothing to hide.

jcross19:
lol well I will not insult you, you have truly shown that you have nothing in your brain ! when a fool speaks or write try to hide under the pen of the wise , the hand writing and the sentence will surely show he has nothing to offer than confusion even confusing himself too.

Is this your best shot at defending your claim that the devil cannot die after I exposed your naviety?

blueAgent:
You don't fail to amaze me.

Nothing new about that, because believe it or not, as it happens, sometimes I surprisingly amaze even myself too.

blueAgent:
You can go ahead with your threat to expose me because me I have nothing to hide.

I know you'll take to my cautionary advice, lol. So you have nothing to hide? Then you can pull your pants down or let me have your bank card PIN number, hmm? lol. A single naive misdemeanour discovered is enough to create doubt and loss of credibility, lol

Ihedinobi3

Please explain to me why Sodom and Gomorrah is still not burning since they were burnt with eternal fire.


Luke 17:29 But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all. 2 Peter 2:6 And turning the cities of Sodom and Gomorrha into ashes condemned them with an overthrow, making them an ensample unto those that after should live ungodly; Jude 1:7 Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.

Please explain to me what this Bible verse means. the wages of sin death.
Romans 6:23 For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

James 1:15 Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death. James 5:20 Let him know, that he which converteth the sinner from the error of his way shall save a soul from death, and shall hide a multitude of sins. 1 John 3:14 We know that we have passed from death unto life, because we love the brethren. He that loveth not his brother abideth in death. 1 John 5:17 All unrighteousness is sin: and there is a sin not unto death. Revelation 20:6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years. Revelation 21:8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.

MuttleyLaff:
Nothing new about that, because believe it or not, as it happens, sometimes I surprisingly amaze even myself too.

I know you'll take to my cautionary advice, lol. So you have nothing to hide? Then you can pull your pants down or let me have your bank card PIN number, hmm? lol. A single naive misdemeanour discovered is enough to create doubt and loss of credibility, lol

I never took any Cautionary advice. if you have nothing reasonable to contribute stop been a distraction to others.

blueAgent:



Is this your best shot at defending your claim that the devil cannot die after I exposed your naviety?

you are confused brother!

blueAgent:
I never took any Cautionary advice.

You are taking my cautionary advice and you're doing your damnest best to heed to my kind and brotherly warning too, which is good, is very good of you, lol

blueAgent:
if you have nothing reasonable to contribute stop been a distraction to others.

I have reasonable(s) to contribute, but then someone, might just again, make a hurtful remark, call what others like me, reasonable contribute, crap. C'est la vie. Such is life, that's life. lol. Fyi, certain distractions, protects others, from other distractions, besides that, a single distraction is much and far better than millions, lol.

jcross19:
you are confused brother!

So you cannot explain to me how Satan will be turned to ashes and still be burning forever?

I can see you are not just confused but naive.

MuttleyLaff:
You are taking my cautionary advice and you're doing your damnest best to heed to my kind and brotherly warning too, which is good, is very good of you, lol

I have reasonable(s) to contribute, but then someone, might just again, make a hurtful remark, call what others like me, reasonable contribute, crap. C'est la vie. Such is life, that's life. lol. Fyi, certain distractions, protects others, from other distractions, besides that, a single distraction is much and far better than millions, lol.

You have been defeated just accept the fact .

Ihedinobi3

Where in the Bible is it written that Samuel appeared to Saul?




1 Samuel 28:13 And the king said unto her, Be not afraid: for what sawest thou? And the woman said unto Saul, I saw gods ascending out of the earth. 28:14 And he said unto her, What form is he of? And she said, An old man cometh up; and he is covered with a mantle. And Saul perceived that it was Samuel, and he stooped with his face to the ground, and bowed himself.

Ihedinobi3

2 Corinthians 2:13 I had no rest in my spirit, because I found not Titus my brother: but taking my leave of them, I went from thence into Macedonia.

Genesis 41:8 And it came to pass in the morning that his spirit was troubled; and he sent and called for all the magicians of Egypt, and all the wise men thereof: and Pharaoh told them his dream; but there was none that could interpret them unto Pharaoh.

Isaiah 40:13 ...'Who has directed the Spirit of the LORD, or
being his counsellor has taught him?'
Romans 11:34 ...'For who has known the mind of the Lord? Or
who has been his counsellor?'


The Spirit can also mean capacity,zeal or will, thoughts, mind.

Exodus 31:3 And I have filled him with the spirit of God, in wisdom, and in understanding, and in knowledge, and in all manner of workmanship, 31:4 To devise cunning works, to work in gold, and in silver, and in brass,


1 Chronicles 5:26 And the God of Israel stirred up the spirit of Pul king of Assyria, and the spirit of Tilgathpilneser king of Assyria, and he carried them away, even the Reubenites, and the Gadites, and the half tribe of Manasseh, and brought them unto Halah, and Habor, and Hara, and to the river Gozan, unto this day.


Numbers 11:25 And the LORD came down in a cloud, and spake unto him, and took of the spirit that was upon him, and gave it unto the seventy elders: and it came to pass, that, when the spirit rested upon them, they prophesied, and did not cease.

Ihedinobi3


◄ Revelation 20:4
Holman Christian Standard Bible
Then I saw thrones, and people seated on them who were
given authority to judge. I also saw the people who had
been beheaded because of their testimony about Jesus
and because of God's word, who had not worshiped the
beast or his image, and who had not accepted the mark
on their foreheads or their hands. They came to life and
reigned with the Messiah for 1,000 years.


And I saw thrones, and they sat on them, and judgment
was committed to them. Then I saw the souls of those
who had been beheaded for their witness to Jesus and for
the word of God, who had not worshiped the beast or his
image, and had not received his mark on their foreheads or
on their hands. And they lived and reigned with Christ for
a thousand years.


2nd Example.

Genesis 46:18 These are the sons of Zilpah, whom Laban gave to Leah his daughter, and these she bare unto Jacob, even sixteen souls.
Genesis 46:22 These are the sons of Rachel, which were born to Jacob: all the souls were fourteen.
Genesis 46:26 All the souls that came with Jacob into Egypt, which came out of his loins, besides Jacob's sons' wives, all the souls were threescore and six;

Ihedinobi3.



I never said the word forever depends on whether it is a human being or not.

What u said is that the word forever can not be taken literally all less permitted by certain conditions.

Ihedinobi3.
Bible verses on the Soul. THE SOUL THAT SINS SHALL DIE Ezek 18:4 Behold, all souls are mine; as the soul of the father, so also the soul of the son is mine: the soul that sinneth, it shall die. Ezek 18:20 The soul that sinneth, it shall die. Ezek 33:11 Say unto them, As I live, saith the Lord GOD, I have no pleasure in the death of the wicked; but that the wicked turn from his way and live: turn ye, turn ye from your evil ways; for why will ye die, O house of Israel? Psa 22:29 All they that be fat upon earth shall eat and worship: all they that go down to the dust shall bow before him: and none can keep alive his own soul. Psa 33:18 Behold, the eye of the LORD is upon them that fear him, upon them that hope in his mercy; Psa 33:19 To deliver their soul from death, and to keep them alive in famine. Psa 56:13 For thou hast delivered my soul from death: wilt not thou deliver my feet from falling, that I may walk before God in the light of the living? Psa 89:48 What man is he that liveth, and shall not see death? shall he deliver his soul from the hand of the grave?

Ihedinobi3





The torment will happen at the end of the World when Christ returns to judge man.
It will happen here on Earth, the Hellfire talked about in the Bible is the Earth envloped in fire.


2 Peter 3:7 But the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men.

MuttleyLaff:
Nothing new about that, because believe it or not, as it happens, sometimes I surprisingly amaze even myself too.

I know you'll take to my cautionary advice, lol. So you have nothing to hide? Then you can pull your pants down or let me have your bank card PIN number, hmm? lol. A single naive misdemeanour discovered is enough to create doubt and loss of credibility, lol

Its obvious you don't know how to read and understand the Bible here are some tips.
No 1 rule is that you must consider every Bible verse concerning a subject before making conclusion.
Isaiah 28:12 To whom he said, This is the rest wherewith ye may cause the weary to rest; and this is the refreshing: yet they would not hear. 28:13 But the word of the LORD was unto them precept upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little; that they might go, and fall backward, and be broken, and snared, and taken.

No 2 rule.
All part of the scripture were given by God for our learning.

2 Timothy 3:16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
Romans 15:4 For whatsoever things were written aforetime were written for our learning, that we through patience and comfort of the scriptures might have hope.


No 3.

You cannot interpret the scripture to suit your preconcieved ideas or your individual beliefs.

2 Peter 1:20 Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation. 2 Peter 3:16 As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction.

No 4: The scripture cannot be broken, it means every part of the scripture must agree with each other.
John 10:35 If he called them gods, unto whom the word of God came, and the scripture cannot be broken;

No 5. Rule.
You must ask God for understanding.
Luke 24:45 Then opened he their understanding, that they might understand the scriptures,
John 5:39 Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me.

No 6. Rule.
You must prove all things using the scripture.

Romans 12:2 And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.

Ephesians 5:10 Proving what is acceptable unto the Lord.

1 Thessalonians 5:21 Prove all things; hold fast that which is good.

Ihedinobi3 Its obvious you don't know how to read and understand the Bible here are some tips. No 1 rule is that you must consider every Bible verse concerning a subject before making conclusion. Isaiah 28:12 To whom he said, This is the rest wherewith ye may cause the weary to rest; and this is the refreshing: yet they would not hear. 28:13 But the word of the LORD was unto them precept upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little; that they might go, and fall backward, and be broken, and snared, and taken. No 2 rule. All part of the scripture were given by God for our learning. 2 Timothy 3:16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: Romans 15:4 For whatsoever things were written aforetime were written for our learning, that we through patience and comfort of the scriptures might have hope. No 3. You cannot interpret the scripture to suit your preconcieved ideas or your individual beliefs. 2 Peter 1:20 Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation. 2 Peter 3:16 As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction. No 4: The scripture cannot be broken, it means every part of the scripture must agree with each other. John 10:35 If he called them gods, unto whom the word of God came, and the scripture cannot be broken; No 5. Rule. You must ask God for understanding. Luke 24:45 Then opened he their understanding, that they might understand the scriptures, John 5:39 Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me. No 6. Rule. You must prove all things using the scripture. Romans 12:2 And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God. Ephesians 5:10 Proving what is acceptable unto the Lord. 1 Thessalonians 5:21 Prove all things; hold fast that which is good.

blueAgent:
You have been defeated just accept the fact .

[img]https://s3/images/ObamaMuttley.gif[/img]
Defeated? Defeated how and/or defeated in what exactly please?
How I desperately wish I could say about you, that you know how to read and understand the Bible, but you dont. Those tips, rules 1-6 who've, in a conspicuously and even obviously offensive way, shown contempt for each and all of them, lol.

"First you need to understand that the word spirit when used in the Bible can mean 3 different things *Which are a living being like God, Angels,
*It can mean the mind, will, thought, zeal, imagination"
- Re: Do Man And Satan Have Immortality? by blueAgent(m): 7:38pm On Nov 17

"How does that explain or mean that the spirit taken by God are still existing?"
- Re: Do Man And Satan Have Immortality? by blueAgent(m): 11:15pm On Nov 19

Please sir, Mr "you have been defeated just accept the fact", here are a few simple, easy, direct and straightforward questions for you to "conqueringly" answer, lol:
1/ What, between the spirit and the soul, is going to be judged, lol?
2/ If as you claimed, that the spirit is the mind, will, thought, zeal, imagination, then give similar, what the soul is please, lol
3/ What is the distinction or set of distinctions marking the difference between our closely related soul and spirit, lol?
4/ 1 Corinthians 15:45? What to your understanding of that verse, is the glaring difference, in first man named Adam and last Adam's spirits, lol?

blueAgent:

So you cannot explain to me how Satan will be turned to ashes and still be burning forever?

I can see you are not just confused but naive.

it was not written that Mr Satan will turn to ashes maybe from your own Bible version. I asked you a simple question that the parable of rich man and Lazarus why did Jesus pinpointed the life of that rich man even after his death? if the spirit will not live forever!

blueAgent:
Ihedinobi3

Please explain to me why Sodom and Gomorrah is still not burning since they were burnt with eternal fire.


Luke 17:29 But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all. 2 Peter 2:6 And turning the cities of Sodom and Gomorrha into ashes condemned them with an overthrow, making them an ensample unto those that after should live ungodly; Jude 1:7 Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.

blueAgent:
Please explain to me what this Bible verse means. the wages of sin death.
Romans 6:23 For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

James 1:15 Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death. James 5:20 Let him know, that he which converteth the sinner from the error of his way shall save a soul from death, and shall hide a multitude of sins. 1 John 3:14 We know that we have passed from death unto life, because we love the brethren. He that loveth not his brother abideth in death. 1 John 5:17 All unrighteousness is sin: and there is a sin not unto death. Revelation 20:6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years. Revelation 21:8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.

I'm afraid I will not honor your requests above, since I made a comprehensive argument that you have to demonstrate an understanding of first in order to proffer any challenges that are clearly responding to it. That is to say that if I answer the above, I will only trigger a never-ending chain of excuses from you for refusing to accept what I say, and that is not even necessary, since I don't require you to accept anything I say. I have only argued that your teaching here is false. If you think that the above Scriptures disagree with my argument, feel free to demonstrate how they do. Then it will be up to me to show you how they don't, if I can.

blueAgent:
Ihedinobi3

Where in the Bible is it written that Samuel appeared to Saul?




1 Samuel 28:13 And the king said unto her, Be not afraid: for what sawest thou? And the woman said unto Saul, I saw gods ascending out of the earth. 28:14 And he said unto her, What form is he of? And she said, An old man cometh up; and he is covered with a mantle. And Saul perceived that it was Samuel, and he stooped with his face to the ground, and bowed himself.

Your quote already answered you, but I will offer you a more complete quote in response:

11Then the woman said, “Whom shall I bring up for you?” And he said, “Bring up Samuel for me.” 12When the woman saw Samuel, she cried out with a loud voice; and the woman spoke to Saul, saying, “Why have you deceived me? For you are Saul.” 13The king said to her, “Do not be afraid; but what do you see?” And the woman said to Saul, “I see a divine being coming up out of the earth.” 14He said to her, “What is his form?” And she said, “An old man is coming up, and he is wrapped with a robe.” And Saul knew that it was Samuel, and he bowed with his face to the ground and did homage.

15Then Samuel said to Saul, “Why have you disturbed me by bringing me up?” And Saul answered, “I am greatly distressed; for the Philistines are waging war against me, and God has departed from me and no longer answers me, either through prophets or by dreams; therefore I have called you, that you may make known to me what I should do.” 16 Samuel said, “Why then do you ask me, since the LORD has departed from you and has become your adversary? 17“The LORD has done accordingly as He spoke through me; for the LORD has torn the kingdom out of your hand and given it to your neighbor, to David. 18“As you did not obey the LORD and did not execute His fierce wrath on Amalek, so the LORD has done this thing to you this day. 19“Moreover the LORD will also give over Israel along with you into the hands of the Philistines, therefore tomorrow you and your sons will be with me. Indeed the LORD will give over the army of Israel into the hands of the Philistines!”

20Then Saul immediately fell full length upon the ground and was very afraid because of the words of Samuel; also there was no strength in him, for he had eaten no food all day and all night.
1 Samuel 28:11-20 NASB

That is, it is the Bible itself that says that this was Samuel who came to speak with Saul. It wasn't the witch that identified the el'ohim as Samuel, nor was it Saul who did. The Bible records only that Saul recognized the person described to him as Samuel and that the witch was frightened by what she saw, no doubt because she did not expect him. In other words, God overrode the medium's demonic con to bring Samuel to speak to Saul one last time.

blueAgent:
Ihedinobi3

2 Corinthians 2:13 I had no rest in my spirit, because I found not Titus my brother: but taking my leave of them, I went from thence into Macedonia.

Genesis 41:8 And it came to pass in the morning that his spirit was troubled; and he sent and called for all the magicians of Egypt, and all the wise men thereof: and Pharaoh told them his dream; but there was none that could interpret them unto Pharaoh.

Isaiah 40:13 ...'Who has directed the Spirit of the LORD, or
being his counsellor has taught him?'
Romans 11:34 ...'For who has known the mind of the Lord? Or
who has been his counsellor?'


The Spirit can also mean capacity,zeal or will, thoughts, mind.

Exodus 31:3 And I have filled him with the spirit of God, in wisdom, and in understanding, and in knowledge, and in all manner of workmanship, 31:4 To devise cunning works, to work in gold, and in silver, and in brass,


1 Chronicles 5:26 And the God of Israel stirred up the spirit of Pul king of Assyria, and the spirit of Tilgathpilneser king of Assyria, and he carried them away, even the Reubenites, and the Gadites, and the half tribe of Manasseh, and brought them unto Halah, and Habor, and Hara, and to the river Gozan, unto this day.


Numbers 11:25 And the LORD came down in a cloud, and spake unto him, and took of the spirit that was upon him, and gave it unto the seventy elders: and it came to pass, that, when the spirit rested upon them, they prophesied, and did not cease.

I'm afraid I don't see how these passages mean anything like what you interpret them to mean. Our spirits are the real "us," so our knowledge, our thoughts, our zeal, our imagination, our understanding, our emotions etc are actually functions of our spirits. Our bodies are merely vehicles for expressing these things. The idea that our spirits are merely our thoughts, emotions etc is what is in question. That is exactly the same as saying that our bodies are our hungers and appetites (whether for food or water, or for exercise, or for physical intimacy). That is obviously not true. Our bodies have these functions; they get hungry and thirsty and itch for movement and more, but our hunger and thirst etc are not our bodies.

blueAgent:
Ihedinobi3


◄ Revelation 20:4
Holman Christian Standard Bible
Then I saw thrones, and people seated on them who were
given authority to judge. I also saw the people who had
been beheaded because of their testimony about Jesus
and because of God's word, who had not worshiped the
beast or his image, and who had not accepted the mark
on their foreheads or their hands. They came to life and
reigned with the Messiah for 1,000 years.


And I saw thrones, and they sat on them, and judgment
was committed to them. Then I saw the souls of those
who had been beheaded for their witness to Jesus and for
the word of God, who had not worshiped the beast or his
image, and had not received his mark on their foreheads or
on their hands. And they lived and reigned with Christ for
a thousand years.


2nd Example.

Genesis 46:18 These are the sons of Zilpah, whom Laban gave to Leah his daughter, and these she bare unto Jacob, even sixteen souls.
Genesis 46:22 These are the sons of Rachel, which were born to Jacob: all the souls were fourteen.
Genesis 46:26 All the souls that came with Jacob into Egypt, which came out of his loins, besides Jacob's sons' wives, all the souls were threescore and six;

I'm not sure what you mean to say with the above, but I do know these passages, in case you are posting them on the assumption that I don't.

blueAgent:
Ihedinobi3.



I never said the word forever depends on whether it is a human being or not.

What u said is that the word forever can not be taken literally all less permitted by certain conditions.

I'm not sure what you are referring to here.

blueAgent:
Ihedinobi3.

Bible verses on the Soul.
THE SOUL THAT SINS SHALL DIE
Ezek 18:4 Behold, all souls are mine; as the soul of
the father, so also the soul of the son is mine: the
soul that sinneth, it shall die.
Ezek 18:20 The soul that sinneth, it shall die.
Ezek 33:11 Say unto them, As I live, saith the Lord
GOD, I have no pleasure in the death of the wicked;
but that the wicked turn from his way and live: turn
ye, turn ye from your evil ways; for why will ye die,
O house of Israel?
Psa 22:29 All they that be fat upon earth shall eat
and worship: all they that go down to the dust shall
bow before him: and none can keep alive his own
soul.
Psa 33:18 Behold, the eye of the LORD is upon
them that fear him, upon them that hope in his
mercy;
Psa 33:19 To deliver their soul from death, and to
keep them alive in famine.
Psa 56:13 For thou hast delivered my soul from
death: wilt not thou deliver my feet from falling, that
I may walk before God in the light of the living?
Psa 89:48 What man is he that liveth, and shall not
see death? shall he deliver his soul from the hand
of the grave?

I don't understand what you mean to say to me with the above. I'm aware of these verses already and took them into account in my responses to you.

blueAgent:
Ihedinobi3





The torment will happen at the end of the World when Christ returns to judge man.
It will happen here on Earth, the Hellfire talked about in the Bible is the Earth envloped in fire.


2 Peter 3:7 But the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men.

I've already answered this in my responses to you.

blueAgent:
Ihedinobi3
Its obvious you don't know how to read and understand the
Bible here are some tips.
No 1 rule is that you must consider every Bible verse
concerning a subject before making conclusion.
Isaiah 28:12 To whom he said, This is the rest wherewith ye
may cause the weary to rest; and this is the refreshing: yet
they would not hear. 28:13 But the word of the LORD was
unto them precept upon precept, precept upon precept; line
upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little; that
they might go, and fall backward, and be broken, and snared,
and taken.
No 2 rule.
All part of the scripture were given by God for our learning.
2 Timothy 3:16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God,
and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for
instruction in righteousness:
Romans 15:4 For whatsoever things were written aforetime
were written for our learning, that we through patience and
comfort of the scriptures might have hope.
No 3.
You cannot interpret the scripture to suit your preconcieved
ideas or your individual beliefs.
2 Peter 1:20 Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the
scripture is of any private interpretation. 2 Peter 3:16 As also
in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which
are some things hard to be understood, which they that are
unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other
scriptures, unto their own destruction.
No 4: The scripture cannot be broken, it means every part of
the scripture must agree with each other.
John 10:35 If he called them gods, unto whom the word of
God came, and the scripture cannot be broken;
No 5. Rule.
You must ask God for understanding.
Luke 24:45 Then opened he their understanding, that they
might understand the scriptures,
John 5:39 Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have
eternal life: and they are they which testify of me.
No 6. Rule.
You must prove all things using the scripture.
Romans 12:2 And be not conformed to this world: but be ye
transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove
what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.
Ephesians 5:10 Proving what is acceptable unto the Lord.
1 Thessalonians 5:21 Prove all things; hold fast that which is
good.

Although you've taken at least 2 Peter 1:20 to mean here something different from what it does, I agree completely with your comments here. I urge you to put them into practice in your own teaching. If you do, you will not produce the errors that you have produced here and in at least one other thread of yours that I have seen.

jcross19:
it was not written that Mr Satan will turn to ashes maybe from your own Bible version. I asked you a simple question that the parable of rich man and Lazarus why did Jesus pinpointed the life of that rich man even after his death? if the spirit will not live forever!

You called it a parable and you are still asking why Jesus pinpointed the life of the rich man.

Even if we take that story literally it still does not prove that Spirits live forever rather it proves that it is the body that is cast into Hell because Jesus taught his disciples that spirits don't have flesh,Bones and tongues..
Luke 24:39
Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle
me, and see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye
see me have.