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Winter In Kano: Food Scarcity May Hit The South - Politics (2) - Nairaland

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Re: Winter In Kano: Food Scarcity May Hit The South by ekubear1: 2:55am On Jan 14, 2011
@Akhenaten: I can believe that the middle belt is more suitable for growing crops than the SW (for logistic reasons, not fertility/rainfall reasons), but it is almost impossible for this to be true for the North (for obvious reasons.)

Certainly it is not true that the soil in the north is more fertile than that of the south. In any case, if you want high crop yields you should be using fertilizer anyway. Rainfall is probably the larger determining factor for crop fields; natural fertility of the land is sucked out pretty quickly anyways with industrial farming and needs to be replenished with artificial means (fertilizer.)

This Sahel/rainforest hypothesis of yours sounds strange, and not very credible. If you have some sort of research supporting it, please provide a link.
Re: Winter In Kano: Food Scarcity May Hit The South by jason123: 2:55am On Jan 14, 2011
Akhenaten:

You are wrong. All of Northern Nigeria has fertile soil. The Sahel region, which is a large grassland has the most fertile soil in Africa.

I will post a map of the entire Sahel region. Grasslands are the most productive regions in the world in terms of agriculture, when the soil is used properly.

Tropical rainforest are never good to grow food extensively, because they lack many nutrients required for a successful harvest.

Bro, that was what I was taught during my secondary school in Nigeria. All those unqualified teachers sad
Re: Winter In Kano: Food Scarcity May Hit The South by jason123: 2:57am On Jan 14, 2011
eku_bear:

@Akhenaten: I can believe that the middle belt is more suitable for growing crops than the SW (for logistic reasons, not fertility/rainfall reasons), but it is almost impossible for this to be true for the North (for obvious reasons.)

Certainly it is not true that the soil in the north is more fertile than that of the south. In any case, if you want high crop yields you should be using fertilizer anyway. Rainfall is probably the larger determining factor for crop fields; natural fertility of the land is sucked out pretty quickly anyways with industrial farming and needs to be replenished with artificial means (fertilizer.)

This Sahel/rainforest hypothesis of yours sounds strange, and not very credible. If you have some sort of research supporting it, please provide a link.
It has to be the middle belt not the north undecided
Re: Winter In Kano: Food Scarcity May Hit The South by aloyemeka1: 3:01am On Jan 14, 2011
jason123:

It has to be the middle belt not the north undecided

Do you know that the use of "middle belt" is considered offensive in Nigeria now?
Re: Winter In Kano: Food Scarcity May Hit The South by Akhenaten: 3:03am On Jan 14, 2011
Why rainforest soils are generally poor for agriculture

OILS and NUTRIENT CYCLING IN THE RAINFOREST

Understanding the basic composition of forest soils helps explain the concept of nutrient cycling in the rainforest; why there are problems with clearing rainforest lands for agriculture; and how soils are an important factor influencing forest complexity.

SOIL COMPOSITION


Eroded landscape in Madagascar
Over two-thirds of the world's rainforests -- including much of those in Madagascar -- can be considered "wet-deserts" in that they grow on extremely poor soils which are acidic and low in minerals and nutrients. The key to the luxuriant vegetation of these forests lies in the rapid nutrient cycling of the rainforest.

NUTRIENT CYCLING

In the rainforest, most of the carbon and essential nutrients are locked up in living vegetation, dead wood, and decaying leaves. As organic material decays, it is recycled so quickly that few nutrients ever reach the soil, leaving it nearly sterile.

Decaying matter (dead wood and leaf litter) is processed so efficiently because of the abundance of decomposers including bacteria, fungi, and termites. These organisms take up nutrients that are released as waste and when organisms die. Virtually all organic matter is rapidly processed, even fecal matter and perspiration. It is only a matter of minutes, in many rainforests, before dung is discovered and utilized by various insects. Excretement can be covered with brightly colored butterflies, beetles, and flies, while dung beetles feverishly roll portions of the waste into balls for use later as larval food. I

As vegetation dies, the nutrients are rapidly broken down and almost immediately returned to the system as they are taken up by living plants. Uptake of nutrients by plant roots is facilitated by a unique relationship between the roots and a fungi, mycorrhizae. The mycorrhizae attach to plant roots and are specialized to increase the efficiency of nutrient uptake nutrient from the soil. In return, plants provide the fungi with sugars and shelter among their roots. Studies have also shown that mycorrhizae can help a tree resist drought and disease.

Tropical rainforest trees are well-adapted to the poor soils of their environment. Since the first 6-8" (15-20 cm) of soil is a compost of decaying leaves, wood, and other organic matter, it is richest pool of nutrients on the ground. Canopy trees are generally shallow rooted to better tap this resource.

Being shallow rooted, compounded by the wet soils, has serious disadvantages for tall rainforest trees, especially with the strong winds of the upper canopy that can accompany periodic cyclones. To counter this inherent instability, some rainforest tree species have extensive root systems that run for over 325 feet (100 m). Other trees, especially tall emergent species, have buttress roots, which are large, thin extensions of the trunk that begin some twenty feet from the ground. These structures are thought to also aid in water uptake and storage, increase surface area for gas exchange, and collect leaf litter for additional nutrition. Some trees, expecially palms have developed stilt roots for further support.
Re: Winter In Kano: Food Scarcity May Hit The South by jason123: 3:04am On Jan 14, 2011
aloy/emeka:

Do you know that the use of "middle belt"  is considered offensive in Nigeria now?

shocked shocked shocked seriously? So what should I call that area of land, north?
Re: Winter In Kano: Food Scarcity May Hit The South by Akhenaten: 3:05am On Jan 14, 2011
Rainforest Soil

Soil in the tropical rainforests is very nutrient poor. The topsoil is only one to two inches (2.5 to 5 centimeters) deep. The only reason plant life is so lush is because the plants store the nutrients in themselves rather than getting them from the soil. When plants decay, other growing plants tap the nutrients from the dead matter and reuse nutrients left over from that plant. This is why farmers can only use the rainforest soil for one or two years after they clear cut it, before all nutrients are stripped from the soil.

The reason soils are so infertile is because they are more than 100 million years old, and have taken a beating from the elements. After time, rain washes minerals out of the soil, leaving them more acidic and nutrient poor. Soil exposed to the heat and condensed sunlight turns soil into red clay. Other soils just cannot deal with minerals, and turn them into compounds useless to plants. There are some fertile patches of soil in the rainforest, but they are scattered throughout the thick vegetation.

http://library.thinkquest.org/C0113340/main.php?section=biomes&topic=rainforest&subtopic=soil
Re: Winter In Kano: Food Scarcity May Hit The South by Nobody: 3:06am On Jan 14, 2011
aloy/emeka:

Do you know that the use of "middle belt"  is considered offensive in Nigeria now?
maybe you should go and ask why the placed was called middle belt in the first instance embarassed embarassed
Re: Winter In Kano: Food Scarcity May Hit The South by ekubear1: 3:06am On Jan 14, 2011
Re: Winter In Kano: Food Scarcity May Hit The South by Akhenaten: 3:08am On Jan 14, 2011
Northern Nigeria's Future in the Biofuels Market

[b]Northern Nigeria with its vast fertile agricultural land [/b]and manpower on the other hand can be a leading exporter of biofuels topping countries like Brazil. The raw materials are usually sugar cane, cassava, groundnut oil, castor bean, sweet potato, sweet sorghum, etc., all of which are being cultivated in Northern Nigeria and have proved to give high yields.

http://www.thebioenergysite.com/news/601/northern-nigerias-future-in-the-biofuels-market

The Northern Nigeria is predominantly savanna forest. The rainy season starts from May to October, while the dry season starts from October to April. The dry season is further sub-divided into two: the harmatan season that starts from November to February. This period is characterized with very cold and dry and cold weather. This is usually the time for harvesting farm produce.

The soil of this region is sandy loamy suitable for crops like groundnut, cotton, wheat, maize, cowpea, soya beans, sogium, guinecorn, millet etc. This soil is very easy to cultivate. There no trees to fall. Most of the trees there are shrubs. Tractors, animals and man can be to cultivate the soil. The grasses are tilled together with the so to act as manure to the crops. The soil is arable and very fertile which require small application of organic and inorganic manure.

These crops can be grown and processed for local, industrial and export uses. So investing in this region is relatively cheap as land and are available. Investment can be for industrial and export uses. This can double or triple your investment. There are irrigation facilities for all the year farming.

Finally, one can invest in agricultural machineries, hires, sales, and services.
Re: Winter In Kano: Food Scarcity May Hit The South by ekubear1: 3:21am On Jan 14, 2011
@Akhenaten: I would be more interested in a study discussing the relative yields of agriculture in the South vs Middle Belt and other areas. It isn't even clear to me that what currently exists in the SW of Nigeria fits the definition of a rainforest. Perhaps 100, 200 years ago, but things have changed.

Your hypothesis seems suspect, to me.
Re: Winter In Kano: Food Scarcity May Hit The South by Akhenaten1: 3:34am On Jan 14, 2011
eku_bear:

@Akhenaten: I would be more interested in a study discussing the relative yields of agriculture in the South vs Middle Belt and other areas. It isn't even clear to me that what currently exists in the SW of Nigeria fits the definition of a rainforest. Perhaps 100, 200 years ago, but things have changed.

Your hypothesis seems suspect, to me.

Agricultural yields are much higher up North than in the Southern region of Nigeria, which is mostly tropical. Ekiti and Kwara State are part of the Sahel region and the land is very fertile, but for the most part, Yorubaland is tropical.

And it is not a hypothesis, it is a fact. Tropical rainforest have poorer soil. Poor soil = lower agricultural yields.

It would seem that you have a hard time losing my brother. Just give up, I am very knowledgeable about this topic. I have traveled extensively in the Sahel region in West Africa. There would be much higher agricultural yields if the African farmers used modern techniques instead of subsistence farming.
Re: Winter In Kano: Food Scarcity May Hit The South by ekubear1: 4:03am On Jan 14, 2011
Akhenaten1:

Agricultural yields are much higher up North than in the Southern region of Nigeria, which is mostly tropical.
Justify this statement. Provide a study of crop yields, something that supports this.


Ekiti and Kwara State are part of the Sahel region and the land is very fertile, but for the most part, Yorubaland is tropical.
Ekiti is nearly indistinguishable from its neighbors and the rest of the SW as far as climate and composition of land goes. Yorubaland at this point in time is not tropical rainforest. Might be some other sort of forest, but certainly not an Amazon-style rainforest. That picture I showed you is fairly typical (anyone who has traveled extensively in Yorubaland would know this also.)


And it is not a hypothesis, it is a fact. Tropical rainforest have poorer soil. Poor soil = lower agricultural yields.
As I have repeatedly stated, no matter how fertile soil is, the crops eventually suck out the nutrients. So the fertility is IRRELEVANT, at some point it runs out and you'll need to use some sort of fertilizer to replenish the nitrogen and other things necessary for good crop yields.


It would seem that you have a hard time losing my brother. Just give up, I am very knowledgeable about this topic. I have traveled extensively in the Sahel region in West Africa.
You keep going on about rainforest this, sahel that rather than discussing concretely how productive each region is. For example, how much rice will I grow on one acre of farmland in Ondo State, versus one acre in Plateau, versus one acre in Sokoto? That is the sort of data that is worth talking about, not this other stuff you mention.


There would be much higher agricultural yields if the African farmers used modern techniques instead of subsistence farming.
Yes, everyone agrees on this, but this is irrelevant for the purposes of your point about rainforest vs sahel.
Re: Winter In Kano: Food Scarcity May Hit The South by Akhenaten1: 4:17am On Jan 14, 2011
Compiling the information for you would be a cumbersome task, and I do not have the time to find these sources. I provided you with some sources already, which discusses how the poor soil quality in rainforest deplete the soil of its nutrients. If you are from a farming community, you would know this. Once the precious topsoil is depleted, it would be pretty hard to grow crops and erosion occurs. This is a fact and this has been known for ages.

If you ever lived in Nigeria, most people know that the majority of food products come from the North and the Middle Belt. Why do you think the South-West is facing food shortages? The North basically feeds Nigeria. This is another fact.

I advise you not to argue about something you know nothing about. Rainforest soil is not suitable for grain crops. Sugar cane and palm oil is suitable for rainforest soil, but not other agricultural products.

I am done with this topic.
Re: Winter In Kano: Food Scarcity May Hit The South by ekubear1: 4:40am On Jan 14, 2011
Akhenaten1:

Compiling the information for you would be a cumbersome task, and I do not have the time to find these sources. I provided you with some sources already, which discusses how the poor soil quality in rainforest deplete the soil of its nutrients.
I have demonstrated quite thoroughly how this nutrient issue is irrelevant, have I not? Again, no matter how fertile the land is, eventually your crops will deplete it.


If you are from a farming community, you would know this. Once the precious topsoil is depleted, it would be pretty hard to grow crops and erosion occurs. This is a fact and this has been known for ages.
Erosion?? In Yorubaland?? Where? Topsoil? What on earth are you talking about? Erosion of land is not an issue in the SW and never has been. I've never been to Igboland before, but have read in the papers that it is an issue there. Perhaps you are working under the assumption that we have this same problem. In our region of Nigeria, no.


If you ever lived in Nigeria, most people know that the majority of food products come from the North and the Middle Belt. Why do you think the South-West is facing food shortages? The North basically feeds Nigeria. This is another fact.
Haba! If I have 1 billion acres of land and only 1 person per acre, another guy has 100 acres of land, but a density of 1K/acre, which direction do you think food will flow?
Does that say anything about the relative productivity, per acre yields of the two regions? Obviously it does not. Obviously one can make up for productivity by farming more acres of land. And land is something the middle belt has in abundance.
Dude, you can reason better than that!


I advise you not to argue about something you know nothing about. Rainforest soil is not suitable for grain crops. Sugar cane and palm oil is suitable for rainforest soil, but not other agricultural products.
I'm flabbergasted. Have you ever in your life been to the SW of Nigeria, outside of Lagos? For example, Ondo State? There is a type of rice that we grow in the SW these days called ofada rice that is popular in Lagos. It is one of the major crops of the farmers in my village. I have no clue what you are going on about with sugar cane and palm oil. . . I think you are imagining SW Nigeria from the 1800s or early 1900s, or something. Not what the climate is now.

With all due respect, you don't seem to know what you are talking about. I cannot imagine you saying that "rainforest soil is not suitable for grain crops" and thing that the statement can apply to the SW. It is almost as if you've never been there, don't read newspapers (http://www.newsstarng.com/index.php/component/content/article/44-agric-news/5870-ondo-pledges-to-assist-nerica-rice-farmers), or something.
Re: Winter In Kano: Food Scarcity May Hit The South by Becomrichn: 5:48am On Jan 14, 2011
Yorubaland has more than enough food to feed nigeria. more than half of the population are farmers.

The issue is, we had bad state governor from some years who never cared about agric. Only govt can make agric better. mechanized farm is where to go. dont give them money, give them equipment.

What awolowo did was form cooperative and they had equipment. And the people borrow the equipment to farm, since most people can afford it. The equipment come to clear thier farms. they pay the driver.

must important is preservation of agric product. You want to be able to do that. And the state should be ready to buy all product. You want to invest in supermarket too to sell. even in other state and outside nigeria.

From satellite pictures, Yorubas have alot of farming villages, more than 2000 farming villages. so we cant go wrong. It is the Igbos who have problem and Rivers, akwa ibom who have problem.
Re: Winter In Kano: Food Scarcity May Hit The South by Akhenaten1: 5:55am On Jan 14, 2011
Becomrichn:

From satellite pictures, Yorubas have alot of farming villages, more than 2000 farming villages. so we cant go wrong. It is the Igbos who have problem and Rivers, akwa ibom who have problem.

How come the East is never mentioned with food scarcity? Sorry we have more than enough of yam to provide for us. The East in good hands. Plus, we get a good amount of our food from Enugu, Ebonyi, Benue and Kogi State. We are ok my friend.
Re: Winter In Kano: Food Scarcity May Hit The South by ekubear1: 6:00am On Jan 14, 2011
Becomrichn:

Yorubaland has more than enough food to feed nigeria.  more than half of the population are farmers.
Indeed.


The issue is, we had bad state governor from some years who never cared about agric. Only govt can make agric better. mechanized farm is where to go. dont give them money, give them equipment.
Exactly! Tractors, fertilizer, import sound devices to scare away birds who feed on the rice and reduce crop yields. They don't need cash, they need technology and fertilizer.


What awolowo did was form cooperative and they had equipment.
Exactly! All of these small farms that everyone in the SW wants to do is useless. In my village, every man has a farm. A man might have several small plots unconnected to each other. Think of the time he wastes travelling to each.

And the people borrow the equipment to farm, since most people can afford it. The equipment come to clear thier farms. they pay the driver.
This is a great idea too. Government doesn't need to even give out the farm equipment. Perhaps some enterprising businessman should buy a tractor and lease it out to the farmers?


must important is preservation of agric product. You want to be able to do that.   And the state should be ready to buy all product.  You want to invest in supermarket too to sell. even in other state and outside nigeria.
With food prices as they are these days in Nigeria, you don't need the state to buy anything  grin People will come to the farm and buy it directly from you.

Uncle Becomerich, you seem to know quite a bit about this business, lol. Are you from the bush too, like me? grin
Re: Winter In Kano: Food Scarcity May Hit The South by ekubear1: 6:04am On Jan 14, 2011
Here is the bird repellent device I mentioned earlier:
http://www.pestproducts.com/birdx/BXxpellerSUPERPRO.htm

They probably use devices like this on some of the large commercial farms in the middle belt.

But of course, your typical smalltime farmer doesn't use this, probably because they aren't aware of the technology and don't have the capital. Buy a device like this and you'll boost your yield/acre significantly (birds are a huge problem for growing agriculture, at least in the SW.)
Re: Winter In Kano: Food Scarcity May Hit The South by Becomrichn: 6:20am On Jan 14, 2011
eku_bear name one thing the yoruba need from the north?


Yorubas dont eat dawadawa? it is one the food planted main in the north. it only thing, we may by from the north is onion because they grow it in larger quantity. We eat melon, we grow ourself.


It is the igbos that are going to suffer, and that was why the igbos had problem during biafra. The yorubas did not have problem during the war. with republic of benin, they are an agric producers. we cant have problem, what ever, we cant get from our side , we would get it from benin republic. every thing that grow in the north would grow in the northern part of Benin republic.
Re: Winter In Kano: Food Scarcity May Hit The South by aloyemeka1: 11:17am On Jan 14, 2011
Akhenaten1:

How come the East is never mentioned with food scarcity? Sorry we have more than enough of yam to provide for us. The East in good hands. Plus, we get a good amount of our food from Enugu, Ebonyi, Benue and Kogi State. We are ok my friend.

How okay?. What of yam and beans?
Re: Winter In Kano: Food Scarcity May Hit The South by oludashmi(f): 1:19pm On Jan 14, 2011
Akhenaten1:

How come the East is never mentioned with food scarcity? Sorry we have more than enough of yam to provide for us. The East in good hands. Plus, we get a good amount of our food from Enugu, Ebonyi, Benue and Kogi State. We are ok my friend.
You just finished implicating yourself. . .maybe you were not mentioned cos you are lower in terms of farming, you do more of business.
You mean all those tomatoes I see in the SE are grown in your land. . .sorry oo, they are [b]all [/b]from the north
What about the cattles
What about those yams
And then beans
You even mentioned benue and Kogi as if they are your states
Re: Winter In Kano: Food Scarcity May Hit The South by aloyemeka1: 11:02pm On Jan 14, 2011
oludashmi:

You just finished implicating yourself. . .maybe you were not mentioned cos you are lower in terms of farming, you do more of business.
You mean all those tomatoes I see in the SE are grown in your land. . .sorry oo, they are [b]all [/b]from the north
What about the cattles
What about those yams
And then beans
You even mentioned benue and Kogi as if they are your states


Rice and yams also come from Ebonyi, don't you know?. You haven't heard of Abakaliki rice before?. Abakaliki is the highest producer of rice in West Africa. Go and study your social sciences.
Re: Winter In Kano: Food Scarcity May Hit The South by aljharem(m): 11:15pm On Jan 14, 2011
aloy/emeka:

Rice and yams also come from Ebonyi, don't you know?. You haven't heard of Abakaliki rice before?. Abakaliki is the highest producer of rice in West Africa. Go and study your social sciences.

that is right abakaliki produces rice

but about highest producer in west afica, i really do not know much about that undecided
Re: Winter In Kano: Food Scarcity May Hit The South by aloyemeka1: 12:48am On Jan 15, 2011
alj harem:

that is right abakaliki produces rice

but about highest producer in west afica, i really do not know much about that undecided

I've read it many times. If you disagree tell us who produces rice most in West Africa.
Re: Winter In Kano: Food Scarcity May Hit The South by aljharem(m): 12:58am On Jan 15, 2011
aloy/emeka:

I've read it many times. If you disagree tell us who produces rice most in West Africa.

not too sure but i think it is in the middle-belt of nigeria sure as niger state, benue and i am also sure of kwara etc

but a good number is also grown in senegal and benin republic also ivory coast

i have not really done the research but i think rice in nigeria is done in the middle-belt state
Re: Winter In Kano: Food Scarcity May Hit The South by aloyemeka1: 2:03am On Jan 15, 2011
alj harem:

not too sure but i think it is in the middle-belt of nigeria sure as niger state, benue and i am also sure of kwara etc

but a good number is also grown in senegal and benin republic also ivory coast

i have not really done the research but i think rice in nigeria is done in the middle-belt state

At least you agreed that you are not sure. Middle belt states produce mainly legumes and not rice. Abakaliki is the largest producer of rice in West Africa. They should teach you that in primary school unless you are Tunmi who learns her own Naija social studies from oyibo.

Do you know the so called goro eaten by the hausas as stimulant is produced mainly in Yorubaland yet people call it Hausa kola?.
Re: Winter In Kano: Food Scarcity May Hit The South by aljharem(m): 2:08am On Jan 15, 2011
aloy/emeka:

At least you agreed that you are not sure. Middle belt states produce mainly legumes and not rice. Abakaliki is the largest producer of rice in West Africa. They should teach you that in primary school unless you are Tunmi who learns her own Naija social studies from oyibo.

Do you know the so called goro eaten by the hausas as stimulant is produced mainly in Yorubaland yet people call it Hausa kola?.


not too sure, but goro will not serve as food if there is shortage of food
Re: Winter In Kano: Food Scarcity May Hit The South by Akhenaten: 3:19am On Jan 15, 2011
Abakaliki Rice in Pictures  grin

Re: Winter In Kano: Food Scarcity May Hit The South by aloyemeka1: 4:47am On Jan 15, 2011
I also heard their rice mill has improved to the point of competing favorably with foreign rice. No more pellets and stones and all the yama yama synonymous with Abakaliki rice of the 80's. When Buhari banned importation of foreign rice, the nation survived on Abakaliki rice.
Re: Winter In Kano: Food Scarcity May Hit The South by bashr4: 11:24pm On Jan 16, 2011
enugu state has the biggest poultry farm in nigeria ,it is located in ngwo , also anambra and imo are know for fishing farming especially cat fish(point and kill fish) why do u think its most popular in igbo land . the whole southern states produces palm oil and groundnut oil, salt, beef(igbo goatee is genetically different from nothern goatee) and the earterners prefer the southern goat as the meat is more tasty , honestly the south can do without the north, turkey,garri, cassava,rice, tomatoe ,vegetables, i can go on and on, every region can survive on its own , biafran hunger did not affect everybody the war did not reach my village in aguata anambra and they wer just fine also parts of ogbaru,imo state were ok.
Re: Winter In Kano: Food Scarcity May Hit The South by aloyemeka1: 12:33am On Jan 17, 2011
bashr4:

enugu state has the biggest poultry farm in nigeria ,it is located in ngwo , also anambra and imo are know for fishing farming especially cat fish(point and kill fish) why do u think its most popular in igbo land . the whole southern states produces palm oil and groundnut oil, salt, beef(igbo goatee is genetically different from nothern goatee) and the earterners prefer the southern goat as the meat is more tasty , honestly the south can do without the north, turkey,garri, cassava,rice, tomatoe ,vegetables, i can go on and on, every region can survive on its own , biafran hunger did not affect everybody the war did not reach my village in aguata anambra and they wer just fine also parts of ogbaru,imo state were ok.

Nobody is saying that those things are not produced in the South but the quantity is what matters?.

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